Mini 1304: Mastin's Mafia--Game Over

[MagnaofIllusion]

Your point? It's clearly misdirection to keep scum (aka you) from killing him while Doc hunting.

DERP.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Pine

- you keep failing to answer as to why No Lynching today and lynching me tomorrow is harmful to Town if I'm lying.

No Lynching means -

If I'm lying scum and Haylen does not survive the Night I get lynched tomorrow.
If I'm Town then Haylen survives and has yet another scan result.

Both scenarios mean Town is guaranteed another Day.

Lynching Today means -

If I'm lying scum and we lynch me Haylen still dies tonight and gets no results.
If I'm lying scum and we lynch you today the game is over tonight.
If I'm Town and we lynch me then the game is over tonight.
If I'm Town and we lynch you today then Haylen gets another scan.

I'm waiting for your answer as to why lynching today is preferable to lynching tomorrow from a Pro-Town standpoint.

Of course we know the answer - you are scum desperate to end the game with a win today instead of taking getting lynched tomorrow and pinning your hopes on the last scum member to get the win.

[mastin2]

You guys are due for another votecount.

<<< Immediately,

Pine

blasts off, rushing into the day with a clear intent of killing a man he had been quite vocal about his displeasure in regards to said individual.

Counterintuitive as it may seem, the man Pine was antagonizing,

MagnaofIllusion

, makes no move to counter said intention, and instead starts the day off trying to convince people that at least one more TOWN member would need to die before they could finish off the MAFIA, and that they should in fact not try to rush through a lynch today, when they had only just begun to work on remembering what they had lost.

Both present their strong arguments, taking into account what they knew and what others were thinking of, but neither seemed to be gaining ground. Their opposition to each other was even stronger than it was the day before, as now they saw everything as being on the line. And in a desperate move to gain ground, MagnaofIllusion does his best to duplicate the move pulled by the deceased hero Bub Bidderskins, by claiming that he, too, can interfere with the MAFIA kills, but in a different way--that he is a trained physician, and inherited his predecessor's dybeck's equipment, and therefore knew what to do.

Now assured she wouldn't die,

Haylen

is swayed to his side, and Pine angrily rants back at him--their exchange becomes even more heated than it was before. Things were even more ugly than ever before. >>>

First Votecount of Day Five

:

(Fifth New Votecount,

AKA, the "Progress?" votecount

)

MagnaofIllusion (1) - Pine
No Lynch (2) - MagnaofIllusion, Haylen

Not Voting (2) - toxictaipan, Oversoul.

With

6

players alive, it's

4

votes to (no-)lynch.

Deadline is on Sunday, April 29th, 4/29/12, @ 8:00 PM PST, which is in (expired on 2012-04-29 19:59:59).

Spoiler: Chages from last votecount

MagnaofIllusion - 1 (Pine)
No Lynch - 2 (MagnaofIllusion, Haylen)


Not Voting - 2 (

Pine

,

Haylen

,

MagnaofIllusion

, toxictaipan, Oversoul)

Spoiler: Player Vote History

Pine: MagnaofIllusion
Haylen: No Lynch
MagnaofIllusion: No Lynch
toxictaipan:
Yuchai:
Oversoul:

Spoiler: Voting History

On Mon, Apr 4/09/12 @09:19p,

Pine

votes

MagnaofIllusion

in new post 77.
On Tue, Apr 4/10/12 @06:30a,

MagnaofIllusion

votes to

No Lynch

in new post 80.
On Tue, Apr 4/10/12 @09:56a,

Haylen

votes to

No Lynch

in new post 93.

[Pine]

Okay, so it's your position that there is both a Godfather and a Miller, that dybeck more-or-less asked for protection just to pretend he wasn't the role you just claimed, that dybeck protected Bub instead of one of the claimed Cops, and that Bub roleblocking known scum on the night of the no-kill doesn't matter?

Right. Got it. I have to admit, you actually had me doubting myself, and wondering whether both Toxic and Oversoul might be scum. But nope. The fumbled Doc claim killed you.

PE: No lynching or not is irrelevant. She scans me, she gets an innocent and you parade around labeling me a Godfather. She scans you, she gets a guilty, you die anyway. And you're exactly the kind of fucko that would no-kill just to support a fakeclaim.

PE2: Scratch that, you wouldn't no-kill. You'd just kill Yuchai. We'd be in the same position, minus a Townie and with no wiggle room. Fuck you, scum.

[MagnaofIllusion]

PE: No lynching or not is irrelevant. She scans me, she gets an innocent and you parade around labeling me a Godfather. She scans you, she gets a guilty, you die anyway. And you're exactly the kind of fucko that would no-kill just to support a fakeclaim.

PE2: Scratch that, you wouldn't no-kill. You'd just kill Yuchai. We'd be in the same position, minus a Townie and with no wiggle room. Fuck you, scum.

Lulz just read this - he's postulating I'm scum who WOULDN'T kill the Cop despite the fact that an Innocent on him PoE's me instantly. And uses that as justification that we should lynch today. And he says an Innocent result on him is 'irrelevant'.

Scum afraid to be scanned is scum!

So Pine is either a DERP moron of the highest order or scum.

Vote No Lynch and let's get this wrapped up.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Anyway at this point I'm just going to let Pine flail about trying to justify lynching today when clearly the best circumstance is to No Lynch.

No Lynching today guarantees a scum lynch tomorrow regardless of how Night occurs and guarantees Town another Day.

Lynching today offers no such guarantees.

[Pine]

So...how did MN, the Goon, know to claim roleblock? The only possible way he could know is if he made the kill attempt.

There goes the unexplained no kill, and the "But I'm a Doc!" defense takes a body blow to it's credibility.

[Oversoul]

I think both Magna and Pine are scum trying to set themselves up for Lylo tickets by distance bussing.

However, Magna as doctor would make sense if the scum had a godfather. Between my role and a godfather, as well as a town roleblocker, follow the cop may not necessarily prevail.

However, I am willing to let this go to nolynch to see what the scum do now that there is another power role in the equation.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Then vote No Lynch Oversoul.

[Oversoul]

Has everyone commented yet?

[Yuchai]

incoming post soon. Toxic is probably still V/LA. Would like to make this the first day where we don't end the day before I return to thread k?

[Yuchai]

Hmm.
Somewhere this morning I figured it had to be something like Pine's 77.
Originally it looked to me like Dybeck was looking scummy on purpose, which made me think he was the PR who made that save n2.
However Bub claimed that he was responsible for that, so I decided MoI was instead the godfather trying to get investigated.
Following that Toxic would be town and Oversoul fakeclaiming miller based on the knowledge that there would be a cop because of the GF.
That would then also explain the lack of a Haylen kill that I was expecting ever since day 2 or something, because the rest of the scumteam was cop immune.

Then MoI claimed doctor, which was a PR after all and fitted with my original thoughts about dybeck.
So assuming MoI was our doc then to counter the town cop-doc-RB the miller claim had to be true.
With Oversoul town, scum are Toxic and Pine with either of them GF leaning Toxic by playstyle.

Then

Oversoul suggested a Pine/MoI scumteam.
However I think their fight looks pretty legit so I'm not really buying that.


While I have zero experience with setup speculation I believe the first situation is the most likely.
A Role blocker, doctor and a cop seems like too much even with Miller and GF to balance it out.
Most importantly I would say MoI/Oversoul would make the most sense with respect to previous days.
Pretty sure Pine has been after both MN and Toxic all game, will check to see wheter that looks like bussing though.

Regarding the nolynch I'm a bit hesitant because I feel like we are just going to lose someone from the town pool.
Also don't necessarily like how MoI is the one to promote it.
However I suppose it could help with differentiating between different scumteams so I will run through all outcomes to see wheter it makes sense to do.

[Pine]

You're actually the only kill that makes sense, Yuchai.

If they kill me, MoI is screwed.
If they kill Haylen, MoI is screwed.
If Oversoul is Town and they kill him, scum-Toxic is screwed.
If Toxic is Town and they kill him, scum-Oversoul is screwed.
If they kill you, nothing is lost except a confirmed Townie.

[toxictaipan]

Catching up now, post probably coming tomorrow. Quick question, though. I haven't gotten a chance to download the archive and read it yet. Is there any evidence of a breadcrumb from dybeck/MoI?

[MagnaofIllusion]

You're actually the only kill that makes sense, Yuchai.If they kill me, MoI is screwed.

If they kill Haylen, MoI is screwed.

If Oversoul is Town and they kill him, scum-Toxic is screwed.If Toxic is Town and they kill him, scum-Oversoul is screwed.If they kill you, nothing is lost except a confirmed Townie.

Anyone reading this? The bolded outright says that he knows if I were fake-claiming that I would be insuring my death by killing Haylen overnight if we no-lynch. Take that in for a second. He's arguing that I pushing a plan that insures my own demise when pushing a lynch today and succeeding (which for the record is what Pine is flailing at) would win the game for Hypo-scum me.

So one of us is 100% content with a plan that assures Town gets two more Days and guarantees a scum lynch Day 5 meaning Town gets to go to LYLO. A plan that would be suicide for me if I were actually scum, which I'm not.

The other of us wants desperately to lynch today when there are no-Town advantages to do so but there are clear scum advantages (a mislynch ends the game since Pine's theory is that Town has no protective roles to prevent a Nightkill if he gets his mislynch through).

I can't put it more plainly than that.

[Pine]

Are you kidding, or do you just have a hard time reading? If you kill Haylen, you're screwed because you will have broken your word, proven you aren't a Doc, and set yourself up for auto-lynch. That's like, the only possible interpretation of that statement that doesn't require contortionist-like bending of the truth. Actually killing Haylen would be moronic at this point, but inclusion of the scenario was necessary for completeness.

[Pine]

You have failed to respond to my point regarding the dual existence of Millers and Godfathers. You have failed to respond to the point I made in 106, which shoots a giant fucking hole in your Doctor claim. You have failed to accept that there IS a Town downside to No-lynching, namely that we'd guaranteed lose Yuchai.

Respond to all of these points in your next post or claim scum and self-vote.

[MagnaofIllusion]

Pine

- You keep failing to respond to the fact that No Lynching is the only course of action that GUARANTEES Town multiple Days and Scum lynched Day 5. Why aren't you responding to that? Oh that's right ... you are scum desperate to end the game today as opposed to being scanned and hung tomorrow.

[MagnaofIllusion]

I get it Pine ... No Lynching means you have a very tough choice to make at Night.

Do you kill me, confirm Oversoul makes sense as a Miller in the setup and take the rope yourself Day 5?
Do you kill Oversoul, confirm that my role makes sense in setup and get lynched as either I come up Town to Haylen or you come up Scum?
Do you kill the scanned Non-Godfather and pray that you don't get scanned and pray you can pass off a Oversoul / MoI team?

[Pine]

Are you drunk? I've said repeatedly that the only sensible choice for scum is Yuchai.

I have repeatedly responded to your point about additional investigations. I am increasingly confident that you're a godfather hoping to bait the investigation, and if it lands on me, you'll insist I'm a Godfather. You're already asserting it. Come to think of it, your repeated accusations that I'm a Godfather and your criticism about me not wanting an extra day DO NOT work together. If I

were

a Godfather, I'd welcome the no-lynch and investigation. Volunteer for it, even.

And I notice you still dodged all of my points.

[Oversoul]

You're actually the only kill that makes sense, Yuchai.

If they kill me, MoI is screwed.
If they kill Haylen, MoI is screwed.
If Oversoul is Town and they kill him, scum-Toxic is screwed.
If Toxic is Town and they kill him, scum-Oversoul is screwed.
If they kill you, nothing is lost except a confirmed Townie.

I think you forgot the rather obvious "If they kill MoI ... " situation.

[Pine]

There's no possible way MoI is Town. It is debateable between you and Toxic, but MoI is irredeemable

[toxictaipan]

So... dybeck/MoI didn't leave any kind of breadcrumb before role revealing?

I have no idea what to do here. Assuming Oversoul is just scum, I can't figure out whether he's partners with Pine or Moi. I can't make out anything from their back and forth. No Lynching seems optimal here.

VOTE: No Lynch

[MagnaofIllusion]

I think you forgot the rather obvious "If they kill MoI ... " situation.

He 'forgot' because he's scum desperate to sell his mislynch to win the game now as opposed to having to take the rope tomorrow and hope his partner makes it through LYLO.

Go ahead and throw the No Lynch hammer.

--

Reminders for Night

-

Haylen is not dying. Haylen please be sure to get your scan in.

If I die and Haylen chose to scan me then turbo lynch Pine tomorrow. Don't let him song and dance around trying to mislynch Oversoul. My flip will pretty conclusively prove that a Miller is more or less required in a set-up where scum don't have role-blocker.

[mastin2]

So as a small warning, I'm AFLT (Away From Laptop) for most of today. I should still be able to check in throughout the day, of course, but you won't be getting the fancy votecounts you're used to.