Mini 579 - The Plagues of Egypt Mafia - Over

[Guardian]

vote: SlySly

[Guardian]

I find it interesting that no one has mentioned me or SlySly, and also that SlySly hasn't posted at all in the game.

mod:

prod?

[Guardian]

It seems longer.

[Guardian]

hasdgfas is scum. At the bottom of the thread, where it says 'display posts by previous', click hasdgfas, and view his posts in isolation:

Post 0 -- he random votes for HH because he doesn't want to get hacked. He is showing care for his own well being, even in his joke.

Post 1 -- he addresses a question posed to someone else (tvod, conveniently), and talks about how "we" shouldn't do "x" because that would help "them" -- the scum. This post is trying to be helpful but isn't, and interjects so tvod can't answer the question untainted.

Post 2 -- Similarly appears to be helpful but isn't really. 'Why not play mafia?'. ...

Post 3 -- hasdgfas is definitely directing tvod here; my most probable read is scum directing scum (partner, why do you act suspiciously? act better!) but I think that scum directing new town to look nice a pro-town is an almost as probable scenario.

Post 4 -- Casts minor suspicion and comments on how 'he doesn't like' something.

Cliff Notes

hasdgfas has posted a few times but hasn't really been helpful, though he has appeared to be so while talking about theory. imo scum love to do this. He is guilty of directing tvod and protecting him from a question, a connection a townie would not want to make. Lastly, his diction leads me to believe that he is scum; instances such as the 'I don't want to get hacked' and careful use of we to refer to town and they to refer to scum make me believe this.

SlySly is also probably scum.

tvod may or may not be scum; there is evidence of a hasdgfas connection, for sure. I am unsure how much faith I have in the direct case on tvod.

unvote: slysly ; vote: hasdgfas

fos: slysly, mfos: tvod

[Guardian]

I hope tvod is scum then, though as of yet I remain unconvinced; I love it when my posts are thought of as interesting... Stoofer thinking of my post as

very interesting indeed

would be almost the pinnacle of achievement.

I don't think my thoughts on cow solely amount to 'active lurker' or whatever you want to call it.

[Guardian]

'the

other

scum'? explain the use of the word other, please.

and you like the effort of my posts? I appreciate it, but which posts are you referring to? I only see like, two, at the max, that required effort.

[Guardian]

oic. but I could be wrong about cow, no?

and yeah, slysly is a hunch. or something.

[Guardian]

tvod, I hope you are scum because then my comment would be very interesting indeed. I'm not really getting why you're at lynch -2 with 2 fos's though. hopefully I'm just blind and you are indeed scum.

lord hur, cow has posted once since I made my case, so no my stance hasn't significantly changed.

SlySly, did you or someone in a group you are a part of kill kabemnon last night? Why or why not?

[Guardian]

Mr Stoofer: I see how it could be interpreted that way. (shrug).

[Guardian]

*sigh* my problem with these type of PBPAs is that you're not actually quoting the post or part of the post that you find suspicious.

why is this a problem? tabbed browsing for the win.

[Guardian]

Have you played a game with me before using a different name? You seem awfully fixated on me, from your very first post all the way up to your very recent, and very insistent that I am scum with absolutely no reason for such claim.

No, I haven't. I had a hunch, that was my reason.

Your Post 92 is among the most ridiculous posts I have ever read. You go so far as to actually try to build a serious case against someone for an obvious joke from the random stage. It was seriously entertaining but I hope you don't seriously think you have convinced anyone of such ridiculousness.

Don't use the same adjective (seriously, here, and almost ridiculous) in the same couple of sentences. It makes you look like you are just employing rhetoric, when you have legitimate concerns. Your concern aside, however, aside from your prodigious use of adjectives, you haven't really made anything nearing an objective, holistic, analysis of my case, instead isolating and twisting the admittedly weakest part of it.

Could you please point out the scummy behaviour of mine that lead to your FoS on me in Post 92?

No. I had a hunch.

I hope rubbing up to your scum buddy in Post 97 was all you had hoped it would be.

You later accuse Stoofer of buddying up to me. That means scum is trying to make friends with town -- not a scum-scum interaction.

Do you think he is buddying up to me, or me to him, or that we are scum buddies? If you want to avoid giving a definitive answer, rank them in probability, and explain why.

The only group I am a part of is the town.

That's a silly thing to say.

I had nothing to do with 007's death and I assume no one else in the town did either.

Noted.

[Guardian]

I had a hunch SlySly was scum. I'm not going to continue voting him when I find other's actions scummy, though.

Except for the part attacking me and my case, I generally approve of SlySly's post.

I'm really tired. If this post doesn't make any sense, that's why.

[Guardian]

SlySly: scum generally don't buddy up to each other, intentionally. You say Stoofer and I were buddy buddy, and that means we're both scum...?

[Guardian]

Also, I want to put the following point on the record:

If we do not lynch thevampireofdussledorf today, we should lynch SlySly.

Why?

[Guardian]

Stoofer, I don't insist.

unvote; vote: Mr Stoofer

I actually agree with the overburdening. lord_hur seems honest to me. I'm also really not buying tvod suspicion atm, and no one likes my thoughts on cow..

[Guardian]

What do you mean that you're not following me? What about? How do you not follow? What do you not follow?

[Guardian]

A mixture of both, about 60/40 SlySly/overburdening, although I admittedly wasn't bearing in mind that you accepted you were wrong. Not sure that that changes anything though.

[Guardian]

I don't insist on Stoofer responding to what he quoted in 167/168.

[Guardian]

Let me be clear: the overburdening doesn't bother me as much (I am using the term because you used it), it is that it doesn't seem to be a reasonable interpretation that the guy knows or knew more about the setup than anyone else. it seemed like innocent speculation to me.

[Guardian]

Like I said, it's about that thing, and also about how he made a very reaching interpretation of lord_hur's setup speculation.

Side Note: Meh, I literally like... eh... really feel I'm playing badly this game. So um... I'll try to play better? Mmm. Nighty night.

[Guardian]

Like I said, I was not thinking that at the time I posted it, but I do now remember you saying you were wrong; however, how does that change anything?

[Guardian]

Like I said, I was not thinking that at the time I posted it, but I do now remember you saying you were wrong; however, how does that change anything?

stoofer, could you have a shot at answering this again? like, what are the differences in what I should be thinking if I did know vs. if I didn't? Why is it significant my analysis that I knew you took it bacK?

[Guardian]

Until school's out (Early May), expect my dedication to mafiascum to suffer, perhaps greatly. Then I'll have little access at all for a week. Then I'll be back in full swing. I'm posting this notice in all games I'm playing; sorry if my activity suffers.

[Guardian]

tvod, I want you to quote and respond to post 203.

Stoofer, that's nice and all, but between scenarios a) push crap logic on a townie and later retract it and b) push crap logic on a townie and keep pushing, the person is pushing crap logic in both cases.

Do you think that you were pushing crap logic? Do you think you fall under a), then? What, in your own words, made you retract it? Feel free to link me to a post where you explained this, if you have.

[Guardian]

Re-read post 200 :

- in part 2, I say I agree with his reasoning, NOT his conclusions (not now, not later, unless you go lurking for a long time or your posts' quality decrease in a substancial way).

- in part 1, I say this should only be used as a last resort. If Mr Stoofer tried to use it right now to get you lynched, I'd be on his back like a rabid dog. At the moment though, he's not trying to actively influence people, he is just answering questions.

respond.

Guardian I would like you to quote and respond to post 212?

Sorry I dont get what you are saying.

I'd like you to say why you thought what you thought in 201, and what you think about lord_hur's interpretation in 203, and if this changes your stance at all that you set forth in 201, and if so how.

Also, why did you initially think what you thought in 201, if your stance changes?

[Guardian]

tvod, thanks for um, at the very least, trying to respond to what I asked about.

tvod, is English your first language?

[Guardian]

I'm playing by sense of smell at this point. I feel like this is going to come back and bite me in the but later, and people are gonna be like "well if you were really town why weren't you trying so hard to be really townie and good and stuff?" and I don't have a good answer for that.

Nevertheless,

unvote; vote: hasdgfas

I just have a strong intuition he's scum, I still like my case I proposed (and if you don't you can just eat it), and I don't particularly want to lynch my previous top suspects.

maybe singing library deserves inquiry. hm.

I'm actually going to re-read and look into mister library, the next time I put effort into this game (thursday?) yeah.

[Guardian]

O SNAP!

[Guardian]

I re-read the Librarian.

He needs to post MORE. but he is not suspicious that much.

I still want the cOw to die, not really mR. Stoofer although he *could* be scum, but I don't think so.

I still don't understand why people want to kill TVOD, could someone summarize??

[Guardian]

My nose is pretty sweet.

O SNAP!

:x

Oh yes, Guardian, could you develop this please ?

OOOOOOO SNAAAAAAAAAAP!

:x :x :x

?

[Guardian]

I'm not at all convinced that Guardian is right about very much in this game.....

you sir, have much learnings to achieve .

[Guardian]

lord-hur, what do you think of the expansion I did for you right there?

[Guardian]

slysly, who hasn't been answering questions?

[Guardian]

Mr. Stoofer for one and you for two. Do you really think "Oh Snap!" was a contributing answer post in response to my question to you?

I think it was the most concise post I could have made to accurately express my reaction to your post, so yes.

You say that not answering questions is suspicious -- if the questions are so important that they be answered, why not say "{Stoofer or Guardian} I had this question in {post #} that you didn't answer (to my satisfaction). Could you please do so (and focus on explaining X in your answer)?"



Why is it suspicious for us to not answer questions?

[Guardian]

pyro, I agree that going through your page by page thing is useful

for you

But in terms of what you share with us, the page by page stuff becomes tl;dr, at least for me.

Do all the page by page stuff, or however you want to take notes in reading the thread, and then tell us who you find most suspicious and why.

"Guardian made a really funny joke in post 123" and such aren't useful things to share. Nor is "lor_hur looks so suspicious early. but then later not so much. but then later, he does. oh but he makes up for that on page 6 when he explains himself."

I want conclusions, and your explaining how you got there. I'm not so much interested in an outpouring of thoughts as you read .

[Guardian]

It is not our duty to keep repeating questions for you to avoid. It shouldn't take 3 reminders to get you to answer something.

I beg to differ.

[Guardian]

It is not our duty to keep repeating questions for you to avoid.

If you really wanted an answer to a question you would repeat it, because it vastly increases the likelihood of getting an answer. If on the other hand you are simply trying to smear other players, then I could see why you would not do that... Your response makes me think you are in the latter category.

I agree... see 263.

[Guardian]

Let me be precise:

In an ideal world, all questions would be very clear, and met with equally clear answers. In the real world, people miss questions.

Granted, consistently missing questions can be indicative of ulterior motives, but on a case by case basis, missing a question the first time it is asked, especially in a larger post, is nothing to fuss about, and is solved by repeating the question.

If your question is missed once or twice, the onus is still on you to repeat it and get it answered.

Speaking of which, I'll get to answering the pending question for me from lord_hur soon; I keep getting distracted by other things and procrastinating it .

[Guardian]

Hm. Maybe I'm insane; I think I'm actually finally seeing the light on tvod.

Like,

unvote vote: TVOD

SlySly is my second choice.

[Guardian]

Why is it suspicious for us to not answer questions?

It gives the impression that you don't want to answer the question(s) to avoid incriminating yourself.

In the real world, people miss questions.

Also, in the real world, scum avoid answering questions.

Granted, consistently missing questions can be indicative of ulterior motives, but on a case by case basis, missing a question the first time it is asked, especially in a larger post, is nothing to fuss about, and is solved by repeating the question.

Selective quoting for the loss.

fos: SlySly

[Guardian]

can we all settle down, take a deep breath, and lynch tvod?

too many questions, too little time .

[Guardian]

>:-( this game is going so poorly. (no fault of undo's)

probably partially my fault. hmph.

[Guardian]

I feel like that's a fair categorization of my play.

[Guardian]

I feel like that's a fair categorization of my play.

Do you feel that it's good play?

Naw, of my most recent dozen games, this is definitely the "bad game", and for some reason I can't get out of the shtick.

[Guardian]

In addition, I think Stoofer thinks I'm something I'm not, because I'm silly.

I think even if I'm not about to be lynched, it might make sense for me to claim today. And it might well seem to be pro-town to lynch me today.

[Guardian]

>_>

[Guardian]

Stoofer, are you scum who tried to buddy with me and now you're pissed that I'm not? ^_^

I think that's it.

[Guardian]

Either that or you're annoyed that you defended me for no reason, and tvod is scum. those are my thoughts.

[Guardian]

I wanted to see what would happen if I alluded obviously to being cop, most optimally hoping for odd reactions for SlySly that pointed to my random choice being correct, us lynching SlySly, and me being nightkilled.

Sadly, I am not a cop, SlySly's reactions to my suspicion of him in and of itself are not terribly incriminating, and frankly I've played piss poor this game. I think I'm best leaving Adel's playstyle to Adel, and not trying to emulate it.

I'm not annoyed that I might be lynched; I'm annoyed that I've played badly to an extent that when I am lynched, the people who push for it are gonna be like "well, he was so scummy, why the hell would he do that cop stuff, no one can be blamed, etc.". I'm trying to get my act together in this game but it just isn't working.

Maybe it is because I subconsciously feel like scum, but I'm not, because best I can tell,

I am a miller

. My role PM says I am a townie, but it is not an exact copy of the townie role PM. I am a secretly practicing Jew who managed to become the head of some group, and my role PM is like 'gosh, you're so screwed'. Egyptians hate you, Jews hate you, you gotta help stop the insurgency because if the Egyptians find you are among those nasty Jew you'll be hung, etc.

I breadcrumbed this somewhere, but a miller breadcrumb shouldn't really convince anyone of anything. So um. Yeah.

Whatever happens, if you don't lynch me, don't investigate me tonight. Unless you want to confirm your sanity night one, which would be dumb.

[Guardian]

I think my claiming is good *because* I've been playing so badly, and think I'd be highly, highly likely to draw a cop inspect.

Miller implies cop to me, so even if you do lynch me, me being lynched today would be better than a cop wasting an investigation *AND* me being lynched tomorrow.

Like I said, it's about that thing, and also about how he made a very reaching interpretation of lord_hur's setup speculation.

Side Note:

M

eh,

I l

iterally

l

ike...

e

h...

r

eally feel I'm playing badly this game. So um... I'll try to play better? Mmm. Nighty night.

Side note = claim, first letters = miller. Put that together -->
Claim: Miller.

[Guardian]

Not if SlySly was a scummy scumbag and died .

Why are millers bad news, Huck? Why do you think specifically my poor play is indicative of me being scum?

[Guardian]

I am annoyed that you virtually claimed Cop at the start of this game and you are now backing off from that.

I didn't pick up on G's virtual Cop claim. Maybe I am just dense or maybe my late entry to the game kind of helped me forget about night 0 somewhat. The possibility of G hinting that he was a Cop never entered my mind.

Stoofer's also... a better player/more experienced.

Guardian usually starts off the game messing about a bit,

posting in haikus

.

Funny that Stoofer mentions this just before Guardian points out his scumcrumbing earlier in the game...

First off, I never said: that's not accurate. I start off with haikus like... 3 times ever. Varying play style. Second off... that's it.

Like I said, it's about that thing, and also about how he made a very reaching interpretation of lord_hur's setup speculation.

Side Note:

M

eh,

I l

iterally

l

ike...

e

h...

r

eally feel I'm playing badly this game. So um... I'll try to play better? Mmm. Nighty night.

Side note = claim, first letters = miller. Put that together -->
Claim: Miller.

Stoofer also implies that the other person that has recently been acting suspicious, HackerHuck, also picked up on the claim. Maybe HH was part of a 3 way scum discussion with G and Stoof.

Wow, paranoia.

HackerHuck obviously noticed that something was up because he asked Guardian how why he thought SlySLy was probably the other scum in [100] and [102].

I didn't know what a miller was before G's claim. I'm sure Mr. Stoofer does with all his mafia experience, both playing and modding.

Here's what the wiki has to say about it...

A Miller (sometimes called an Outsider) is typified as a member of the town with an air of corruption and/or suspicion surrounding him. Thus a Miller acts like a normal Townie in every way except for one important feature: whenever a Cop investigates a Miller, the Moderator returns a guilty result, even though the Miller is pro-Town.

Sometimes an important part of a Miller role is that the player is not told this aspect of their role. Rather the Moderator assigns one person to be the Miller, but only tells him/her that the role is a vanilla townie. Thus, the Miller cannot simply claim their role Day 1 as a prevention against lynching.

Guardian tries to cover the holes of his fake claim just like a good little minion of Mr. Stoofer should. He even admits that his role doesn't specify that he is a miller, but he full claimed it anyway.

Um. My role says I'm

JEWISH

. I think that it is pretty reasonable to infer that a JEWISH player in this game who isn't scum is a miller.

Maybe it is because I subconsciously feel like scum, but I'm not, because best I can tell, I am a miller. My role PM says I am a townie, but it is not an exact copy of the townie role PM.

I could be crazy with this thinking but if only Hacker and Stoofer picked up on this virtual Cop claim of Guardian's, I could be on to something. There is definitely evidence there. I will be convinced if either Hacker or Stoofer change their Guardian vote if he gets nearer to being lynched.

Wow.

If we let him through how do we know he isnt scum and the cop shouldnt investigate him, sounds like an i am scum don't investigate me post.

QFT

Why's it sound more like that than a "im miller dont investigate me post".

Guardian, millers are bad news for the town because investigations of them return guilty even though they are town, of course you already know that since Stoofer told you in night 0.

Why does that make them bad news? I don't see where the bad news is coming from. If I never get investigated, how's it bad news? PS: any trackers, watchers, whatever, feel free to investigate me ;).

ROFL at me needing to be told what a Miller is by Stoofer. I think I've mod'd about 5 games on this site, and have played over 20. :P

SlySly's post is even more odd to me cuz it doesn't have him voting for me, despite him agreeing on all t his stuff. Not sure if thats odd in a good or bad way.

[Guardian]

No, that's an odd stance to take though.

[Guardian]

If I am lynched, when I'm dead consider:

Stoofer is acting too confident that I'm scum. He's reversing far too much, for too confidently, and giving up on tvod really easily.

I played like an idiot, but my thoughts now:

unvote vote: Stoofer

I bet you'll think I'm just babbling more. Whatever. I think I'm right and it is gratifying.

[Guardian]

:\

I can't say much more than what I have.

I've played really bad in this game, and I apologize for that.

My only respite is that lynching millers day one isn't that bad, so if you can't see my bad play as just that, bad play, and not scum motivated play, then at least you lynched the non-scum best role to lynch in the game.

A few questions to think about:
were I scum, why unclaim? railroading a case on a townie and getting lynched day 2 would be better than getting lynched day 1.
were I scum, why so obviously breadcrumb a guilty day 1, that I knew to be false?

meh. I really meant what I said about stoofer. If I'm lynched he'll try and tell you tomorrow I'm a rambling lunatic, but really, look hard into him, look at SlySly's case, and consider lynching him deeply. I'd support considering lynching him today !

[Guardian]

If there's anything specific you'd like me to reply to, let me know.

I realize it seems very tempting and good to lynch me right now, but that won't result in dead scum.

[Guardian]

slysly, him refers to stoofer, not to you.

[Guardian]

Wait up.

In games with no investigative roles, townies aren't confirmable.

That doesn't mean that they should be lynched.

Me not being confirmable is a horrible reason to lynch me.

Me being scummy, sure. Me being not confirmable, that's scum-talk.

FOS: Huck

[Guardian]

I'm fairly sure I'm at lynch -2.

I also urge no one to vote me, but not for fear I'm a jester.

Whatever you may fear, I'm not a jester.

[Guardian]

unvote vote: Guardian

[b/]

[Guardian]

ffs. I'm not a jester.

I just thought I'd been enough of a distraction to the town that I should be lynched.

There goes my ending the harm I've done to this game.

unvote vote: Guardian

I'm really not a jester. I'm just a miller. Which, ironically, could be proved if someone cop investigated me... Which shouldn't happen, since the whole point of my claiming was to prevent such an eventuality.

[Guardian]

I am not suspicious of you for bringing up the possibility of Guardian as a Jester.

However, I am positive that Guardian is not a Jester, because Jester's cannot self-vote (that would be contrary to the whole point of a Jester).

We just lynched ourselves some scum people!

that's retarded, and wrong.

please lynch stoofer tomorrow.

sorry for my play.

but stoofer is scum. gl gents.

[Guardian]

note how stoofer didn't consider that I was just playing badly.

he just pushed and pushed for my lynch.

he thought he was buddying with a cop all day, but really was buddying with a miller.

he saw an easy lynch and took it, abandoning everything else he'd done all day.

tvod super likely town.
hakcer huck super likely town
cow probably town.

stoofer probably scum.

I'm 85% confident stoofer is scum.

if you lynch tvod or hacker, or don't lynch stoofer, don't blame me if we lose.

peace.

[Guardian]

So Stoofer was scum?

Yeah. Yeah he was.

Guys, sorry for getting lynched but... well, it was very obvious Stoofer was scum. Huck had me fooled until day 4 or so.

Well done scum.

[Guardian]

PS

The art was really good, but I make no judgment about the setup because I hate every single setup that has any no reveal. Peace.