Mini 554 - Mafia in Vollville - Over!!


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Post Post #1075 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:02 am

Post by Xylthixlm »

Guardian, the blatant attempt to get anyone but yourself lynched isn't helping your case.


======================================================
Votecount #43

Guardian - 2 (Erg0, Matt_S)

Matt_S - 2 (Guardian, Adel)
Oman - 1 (Incognito)
Adel - 1 (Xylthixlm)
Xylthixlm - 1 (Oman)

Not voting - 2 (Patrick, Jitsu, )

With 9 alive, it's 5 to lynch.
Deadline for D2: Friday April 5, 11:30AM GMT+10
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Post Post #1076 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:10 am

Post by Guardian »

Xyl, let's be clear: I want Matt_S lynched. Failing that, I want Adel or Oman lynched. That's been my stance since I re-read. I think I've succeeded to a large extent in controlling the discussion to focus on those three players and me, and I hope that leads to one of them, my top three suspects, being lynched.

However, if a fourth opportunity presented itself, sure I'd go for it. I know I am town. I don't know anyone else's alignment. Not wanting to be lynched should not hurt my case,
especially because I am a cop
. No shit, I want someone other than me lynched.

Why would blatantly attempting to get anyone but me lynched "not help my case"? Wouldn't it... help it? If I were scum, wouldn't I care about my buddies not being lynched over me, since presumably they'd look much more town like and be more likely to survive until endgame?
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Post Post #1077 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:16 am

Post by Adel »

me being right about guardian being a cop is probably going to get me lynched tomorrow. damn it.
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Post Post #1078 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 5:28 am

Post by Guardian »

I find it not unlikely that Adel is actually an SK who decided that claiming at this juncture would be advantageous to her. That being said, if she is an SK, do we lynch her?

Adel, you still never responded to my post/question.
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Post Post #1079 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:09 am

Post by Adel »

I am not a sk, Xylthixlm is an idiot, so I decided to play a fool for a fool.
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Post Post #1080 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:10 am

Post by Adel »

unvote, vote: Guardian
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Post Post #1081 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:12 am

Post by Adel »

unvote
indecisive.
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Post Post #1082 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 6:34 am

Post by Guardian »

So you're mafia, not an SK?

unvote vote: Adel


Like I said, I don't see Matt_S being lynched as a high possibility. Despite the difference in obviousness between Adel vs. Matt_S, I still think Matt_S is better and would be happy to shift back if we have the votes.

However, Adel's play has been obviously inexcusable. She's lied like, 10 times, now. I was just waiting to see when this whole "play nice with Guardian because I believe him now that he replaced in" thing would show up to be a lie. And here it is. Adel's play has been capricious in terms of who she wants to lynch, and full of deceit. Adel's seriously messed, but even if you don't agree with me on Matt_S's apparent scummy motivations, I'm sure you can see how Adel being a townie is incompatible with her actions. To give further credence to my theory -- look at the appeal of a Matt_S // Adel pairing. Adel says 'Matt_S is conditionally scummy day 1... ooops, opie is town... Matt_S can't be scum... can't remember why though'.

C_O's play was very bad, and I understand the suspicion, really. But worse than Adel? More likely to be scum than Matt_S, or Adel, or Oman? Come now.

FWIW: I'm pretty sure if I get one more vote Adel will definitely hammer. So if you vote me, know that you are, in effect, hammering.
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Post Post #1083 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 7:04 am

Post by Jitsu »

Adel wrote:me being right about guardian being a cop is probably going to get me lynched tomorrow. damn it.
How do you figure this?
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Post Post #1084 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 9:49 am

Post by Adel »

knowing that a scummy person isn't scum is often considered to be scummy.
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Post Post #1085 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:21 pm

Post by Erg0 »

I seem to recall you using this exact argument against me towards the end of day 1.
"You were doing well until everyone died."
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Post Post #1086 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:24 pm

Post by Adel »

I tend to believe in it.
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Post Post #1087 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:44 pm

Post by Incognito »

Guardian^2, you haven't done a bad job at defending yourself and presenting your suspicions but it's simply very difficult to ignore the play that came from Chaos_Omega. The guy lurked through D1, he claimed a role that seems unlikely to exist in this set-up (including claiming in an extremely shady kind of way), he presented a guilty investigation on Guardian^1 which seems to have been done to make the claim more believable, and then lurked during the beginning of Day 2 while picking up his prod but choosing to never post again. If you really are the cop, then obviously Chaos_Omega owes the town a huge apology for acting and playing the way he did. Barring some
really
strange turn of events, you are today's lynch, period. There's really no way around it.

I've been evaluating your Adel suspicions and should be able to put something together about her soon.
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Post Post #1088 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:54 pm

Post by Adel »

vote: Incognito
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Post Post #1089 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 12:57 pm

Post by Incognito »

Adel wrote:
vote: Incognito
lolz.
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Post Post #1090 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:01 pm

Post by Adel »

The only people I would consider lynching today are Oman and Guardian^2. Adel's a possibility also because of this: This thread.

It's really messing with my mind.
he case against Adel has intrigued me, and I've certainly been thinking about the possibility of her being scum more closely. I don't think she's today's lynch though.
3) Something else bothers me about Xylthixlm. I'm actually shocked that nobody called me out about this apparent contradiction. Previously I mentioned the following:
Incognito, in post 977, wrote: The case against Adel has intrigued me, and I've certainly been thinking about the possibility of her being scum more closely. I don't think she's today's lynch though.

Oman or Guardian^2 is today's lynch.

but about two posts later I placed a vote on Adel over something that was actually rather trivial. I did this for a few reasons:

a) A number of people seemed to criticize Adel for her actions (particularly Xylthixlm during Day 2) but prior to my vote, Adel had yet to receive a serious vote for the whole game.

b) I wanted to gauge reactions. The reactions I received were interesting: Matt_S followed suit out of nowhere with a vote on Adel and then probably more importantly Xylthixlm (a person who was giving Adel flak for most of Day 2) finally decided to place a vote on Adel as well! Why did he wait so long? Why did he have to wait until after two people voted to finally place a vote on a person he had such strong feelings against?



In short, I think Oman and Guardian^2 are scum. The scum partner of one of these two is a little less obvious but judging from some of Xylthixlm's reactions, I could see him being a possibility. And tbh, Matt_S's vote on Adel taints him a bit too. I might need to do another reread of him to see if I still receive the same feelings about him.
I've been evaluating your Adel suspicions and should be able to put something together about her soon.
what is the scumtell here?

there are two:
1. making the bed. Scum players pretending to be scum hunting often broadcast their move before they make it. No sudden moves. the idea is to be consistent and to have a prior reason for placing a vote. Predictable voting behavior is the goal.
2. Pushing the Guardian and Oman wagons, but not hard enough to stand out. Scum like to fit in with the majority opinion.
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Post Post #1091 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:20 pm

Post by Incognito »

Adel wrote:1. making the bed. Scum players pretending to be scum hunting often broadcast their move before they make it. No sudden moves. the idea is to be consistent and to have a prior reason for placing a vote. Predictable voting behavior is the goal.
Ah but you don't even know what my opinion will be of you. What makes you think that I will suddenly lean in favor of believing you are scum? I mentioned that I've been evaluating your play through this game and will provide my thoughts when I get a chance to. I didn't state that I would lean towards the scummy end of the scale after I was done with my analysis. I still strongly believe that Guardian and Oman are scum.
Adel wrote:2. Pushing the Guardian and Oman wagons, but not hard enough to stand out. Scum like to fit in with the majority opinion.
Good try, really. I presented my case on Oman awhile back when it was far from the majority opinion and have adamantly supported a lynch of either player. I wanted to lynch Chaos_Omega at the end of Day 1 until the point that he cop claimed, and my vote was on him at the start of Day 2 until I noticed the wagon progressing a bit too quickly for my tastes. I felt like more discussion was necessary before moving into Day 3.

Try again.
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Post Post #1092 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:24 pm

Post by Adel »

guarded, careful play.

There has been nothing adamant about your promotion of the Oman and Guardian wagons. You state that you find them scummy, and you state that you support their lynch, but you don't do anything to bring their lynch closer. You have not pushed for their lynch, you have not tried to get them lynched. You have been more interested in fitting in with the masses and I'm calling you out on it.
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Post Post #1093 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:36 pm

Post by Incognito »

orly? I'd like for you to go back through the thread and cite specific instances where I have not pushed for either one of their lynches. Look over my case on Oman and tell me how that exactly fits in with the masses. My vote was on Chaos_Omega at the start of Day 2 but the wagon obviously progressed too quickly. I felt more was meant to be discussed before progressing into Day 3. You should really stop making shit up.
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Post Post #1094 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 1:40 pm

Post by Erg0 »

Adel wrote:I tend to believe in it.
Except when you do it? What does that tell you?
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Post Post #1095 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 2:05 pm

Post by Adel »

I did something that looks scummy to my eyes.
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Post Post #1096 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:04 pm

Post by Guardian »

I now want to lynch Adel more than Matt_S.

C_O, was suspicious, and I grant that.
But Adel is in her own league, and (possibly unlike Matt_S and Oman) it is completely obvious, and uncontroversially true. I can't see her having pro-town motivations anymore. I just can't.

Incognito asked for a *really* strange turn of events. If Adel's recent actions don't qualify, I'm not sure what would.

You've all acknowledged that I've not been scummy independently, and have done my best to undo the damage C_O has done to this role. I would be very sad if I were lynched today, with all the great options available, Adel at the forefront.
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Post Post #1097 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:13 pm

Post by Adel »

have you seen scum implode this way before? Do my actions in this game remind you of any previous game where I was scum?
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Post Post #1098 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:18 pm

Post by Guardian »

I can no longer see you as both being a rational human being, which I know to be true, and a player of town alignment, which I do not know to be true.

Faced with two mutually exclusive options, one of which I know to be true and one of which I am unsure about, I conclude that the one I am unsure about is false, and that you are not a player of town alignment.

You've lied, tricked, misled, tried to lynch townies, etc. too many times and too frequently to possibly think you are helping the town with your actions. You're trying to get town to believe in the too scummy to be scum logical fallacy, and this game is your little playground to see if your idea will work. It should not.
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Post Post #1099 (ISO) » Mon Mar 17, 2008 4:41 pm

Post by Xylthixlm »

Guardian^2 is mafia and Adel is a serial killer.
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