Thespival Mafia (Denouement)

[MeMe]

So, you prefer that the mafia decide its own kill rather than the town deciding together who it should be? This is getting

extremely

interesting.

[Beep! Beep!]

So, you prefer that the mafia decide its own kill.

THEY WILL.

[MeMe]

Bah @ top of the page posts -- here's the one to which I was responding, for reference sake.

So, you have no problem with the plan? Just with the fact that it's being proposed by me at this time?

It is a HUGE problem though. Besides, I'm sure the scum and the vig are on the lookout for Jester behavior, and don't need to be directed. I don't think it's useful, and as you point out, "roleblocker."

Concerning the case you've made against me, I'll leave it to the other players to decide whether or not it's worthwhile. I trust their judgment.

Let the others weigh in on the value of its content, your timing and choice of target, your change in behavior when one player begins to cast doubt on your townieness, and your sudden urge to coordinate night choices.

Also, another quick note because it made me laugh...according to your vote, you're pretending to believe I'm

already

coordinating the mafia kill, so you calling it a "sudden urge" doesn't even make sense.

It's an idea, pure and simple -- and one that I believe can work. Disparaging me doesn't disparage

it

. Is there anyone other than me who thinks it's got a decent shot of working? Can it possibly hurt us to

try

it?

[MeMe]

Oh good -- I see MoS is in the forum.

MoS

, Could you please tell me what's broken about the plan if that's the rationale you have for voting me?

[hasdgfas]

possible: probability

[MeMe]

I don't understand that. Possible that it will work, but not probable?

[hasdgfas]

exactly, MeMe

[MeMe]

A possibility seems kind of worth it to me, but I'm willing to be talked out of it if there's some way that it could be exploited -- but I haven't yet heard what's wrong with it.

It's possible I'm contracting tunnel-vision, but since we currently have a common goal with the mafia (kill jester overnight), why not force their hand? If they don't do it, they run the risk of us lynching that person (possible jester, according to majority) and losing the game, so it seems likely to me if scum don't kill him/her, the person has a better-than-average chance of BEING scum.

Amen.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Vote: MeMe

OK....

If you're saying there's a problem with my plan, please point it out because I'm starting to fall in love with it.

telling the roleblocker to not block, depending on the scum to follow our plan, this really sounds like a plan coming from scum herself.

[MeMe]

Again, accusing me isn't the same thing as showing a flaw in the plan. What about it won't

work

??

--I realized that, if this plan goes into action, the blocker can't block or it'd taint the results (if the MAJORITY-APPROVED target doesn't die, it could be because the blocker prevented it from happening, duh)
--And we're depending on the scum wanting to win as much as town does, that's all.

Right now, I can't see any pro-town role having a problem with trying this. Jester won't like it. Scum won't like if one of their own has been

playing

jester. Can someone troubleshoot it rather than simply saying that only scum would suggest this?

pj or Pooky maybe?

[Beep! Beep!]

Note to self:

pj or Pooky maybe?

You are asking a player whom I think is your buddy (PJ), and one player whom I think is a townie (Pooky).

[MeMe]

I'm asking two players I know both 1) play to win and 2) are intelligent enough to actually parse an idea and give feedback. Anyone else wanting to gain the high opinion I afford these two, regardless of their alignment, is welcome to respond as well -- I'm even willing to consider

you

, if you wanna give it a shot, B!B!

Note: explain concept of "to self" to B!B! after the game.

[Beep! Beep!]

Note: explain concept of "to self" to B!B! after the game.

LOL

[Iammars]

MeMe: You're plan would be better except for the fact that we don't know who the Jester is. The scum's not going to listen to a town consensus. That'd just be the town directing the mafia kill. I have a strong feeling we have a vig though, and that'd be a good person to try to direct.

[hasdgfas]

Vig directing

[MeMe]

MeMe: You're plan would be better except for the fact that we don't know who the Jester is. The scum's not going to listen to a town consensus. That'd just be the town directing the mafia kill. I have a strong feeling we have a vig though, and that'd be a good person to try to direct.

It's

because

we don't know who the jester is that I'm proposing the plan in the first place. Everyone except the jester would be giving honest opinions during a daytime discussion about who they think is likely jester -- mafia would be involved in this discussion and, therefore, should be willing to kill the resulting nominee.

I don't

think

this is naive; mafia want jester killed at night too.

[RossWilliam]

Meme's plan makes sense to me. I dunno if I can do it any more justice than she does. Correct me if i'm mistaken, Meme, but are you saying we should

1. Isolate someone that we believe could the most likely jester candidate.
2. Tell scum to night kill them.
3. If they're still alive next morning, we lynch risk it, and lynch the possible jester?

Tell me if I've got it right before I add feedback

[Ameliaslay]

Sorry guys.. I forgot how busy the week before spring break could get.

That being said: let me get down to tacks. I don't like your plan at all, MeMe. At this point in the game we are short a third of our players, all of whom were town. If we switch focus to discovering who the jester is, the mafia can easily take advantage by naming players whom they know or think to be town as the jester-- Since they're all alive, they have the numbers to give this some weight. If they neglect or refuse to nightkill our choice, following the plan we must lynch the "jester" the following day. If the former holds true, there's a good chance the nominee is in fact town. There are too many ifs here. Even with the small chance of your plan succeeding in finding the jester, it detracts too much from us finding scum, which is terrible when we haven't yet managed to lynch scum with a third of us dead!

Furthermore, you would have to convince the town to risk lynching the "jester" to to be in accordance with your plan, and some players might follow, but I think the majority will be too afraid of the possibilty of lynching the jester, because that's precisely who they'll expect to be lynching. It seems it's easier for the mafia to exploit this plan than it would be to gain a consensus.

At this point in the game, we need to focus on scumhunting, not fishing for the jester. If you are willing to risk lynching the jester for your plan, you should be willing to risk lynching the jester trying to find mafia.

vote: Meme

[curiouskarmadog]

Sorry guys.. I forgot how busy the week before spring break could get.

That being said: let me get down to tacks. I don't like your plan at all, MeMe. At this point in the game we are short a third of our players, all of whom were town. If we switch focus to discovering who the jester is, the mafia can easily take advantage by naming players whom they know or think to be town as the jester-- Since they're all alive, they have the numbers to give this some weight. If they neglect or refuse to nightkill our choice, following the plan we must lynch the "jester" the following day. If the former holds true, there's a good chance the nominee is in fact town. There are too many ifs here. Even with the small chance of your plan succeeding in finding the jester, it detracts too much from us finding scum, which is terrible when we haven't yet managed to lynch scum with a third of us dead!

Furthermore, you would have to convince the town to risk lynching the "jester" to to be in accordance with your plan, and some players might follow, but I think the majority will be too afraid of the possibilty of lynching the jester, because that's precisely who they'll expect to be lynching. It seems it's easier for the mafia to exploit this plan than it would be to gain a consensus.

At this point in the game, we need to focus on scumhunting, not fishing for the jester. If you are willing to risk lynching the jester for your plan, you should be willing to risk lynching the jester trying to find mafia.

vote: Meme

I understand your point, but why the vote? Did you suggest that she was scummy in that post somewhere and I miss it? All I got out of that post is that you didnt like the plan. If I missed it, please bold the parts where you thought she was scummy.

The Jester is a problem for everyone...us(vig), the mafia, the SK...I think that all groups should start popping off who they think is the jester (at night) if they havent all ready. I dont like directing them (but I must admit there are some people here that make me wish I was the vig) or other roles to do it. The Jester is the primary threat at the moment but we still have the SK and Mafia to worry about. SOmething about telling the RB to not RB seems wrong. I see where MeMe might be coming from, but I dont think it is up to us to force(maybe direct is a better word) anyone to follow. .it is up to the RB to decide if it is wise.

[MeMe]

Ross -- that is exactly what I'm saying.

Amelia -- that's almost the opposite of what I'm trying to do. Obviously every lynch is a "risk" that we'll hit the jester. My plan is an attempt to make it

less

of one. If we all agree someone looks scummy/nutty, isn't that someone less likely to be town?

I smell opportunism in the "plan bad = MeMe scum" votes, possibly even an attempt to save farside (for tomorrow? because she's a partner?). It's hard to imagine that anyone could actually believe that trying to bring all factions together to find the jester is a BAD thing. I'm actually surprised that's no one's tried to fix what they think is broken in it -- even a counter of "well, I don't think the plan works, but it would be worthwhile to make sure everyone posts

jester: thisPlayer

so nightkillers have a majority view." Why throw everything out?

That said, if it's only RW and myself who will publicly admit to seeing value in it, I may as well drop it (though I'd still

love

to hear from those who've either avoided commenting on it/not been in the thread for the last 36 hours or so). I wonder if more people would be willing to try it if they weren't scared of being accused for daring to agree!

[Battle Mage]

Meme's plan makes sense to me. I dunno if I can do it any more justice than she does. Correct me if i'm mistaken, Meme, but are you saying we should

1. Isolate someone that we believe could the most likely jester candidate.
2. Tell scum to night kill them.
3. If they're still alive next morning, we lynch risk it, and lynch the possible jester?

Tell me if I've got it right before I add feedback

Stupid. You really think scum arent going to risk seeing a jester lynch, if it means ensuring their own victory. Odds on they will love seeing us draw conclusions from their kills, as it allows them to dominate the game during the day aswell.

Thus far suspects of being Jester have just been killed anyway. Running our lynches by them is mucho silly.

BM

[Mastermind of Sin]

It's simple. Mafia suggest certain protown people to be the jester, don't kill them, and then lynch them the next day. If the town sticks to the plan, the mafia can keep the jester alive once they figure out who it is, nightkilling them after they get a lot closer to winning by lynching a bunch of protown people.

[hasdgfas]

Amen MoS

[Mastermind of Sin]

Amen!

[hasdgfas]

Thank you.