Mini 552: X-Men mafia (Game Over!)

[farside22]

Vote: thephantom.

With a name like phantom he must be sneaky.

[farside22]

Vote: farside

; mods do not allocate roles based on screennames, but randomly.
If phantom's sneaky, that represents a benefit to town if he is town, and a benefit to scum if he is scum. You should currently feel neutrally towards him.
Unless you

know

already that his alignment is different to yours, which you would most probably only know if you had an anti-town alignment.

Die Scum!!!

I did this because ever since one game were I guessed on a person's name they were scum and they turned out to be scum was a good moment for me. I feel if it works every so often don't break it.

[farside22]

May I make a request? Could those people who don't have avatars get some? I folloow what's going on by associating posts with pictures, rather than directly with names (plus I'll whizz down the page looking for a person's posts by keeping an eye out for his av). I count at least 3 avless here, and it'll hinder me significantly. I know that I'm asking for a favour here, but it'd really help.

I'm sure your signature say's it all for everyone here.

[farside22]

Unfortunatly most of the games start like this where everyone says or does some vote and has to figure out where to go from there. I'm seen a few games where there is a bandwagon going on to clue people in to some scum, but that doesn't happen often.

[farside22]

Unvote: Vote: Pug

Something needs to be said and bandwangons sometime promote discusion.

[farside22]

The worst part is when no one talks it is hard to pick up tells from anyone. Right now it's like shotting in the dark trying to figure anything out.

[farside22]

Claiming is not good and really should not be done unless you are close to being lynched. I learned claiming in a game early is bad and most people just vote for you for doing so in the first place.

[farside22]

#1 How many of you have been in a themed game? (I have been in one)
#2 With name claim? (Yupp, happened in that themed game)
#3 That worked out to the benefit of the town? (It was partly beneficial, the name claim didn't isolated lead to the scums - they had some safe fake claims - but it helped some, at the cost of a few townies).

#3 is a no. It helped scum more in one game i'm currently in so i can't discuss. Second day claim helped in one game that is over, but the person who claimed first day was killed. So I never recommend first day claim.

[farside22]

#1 How many of you have been in a themed game? (I have been in one)
#2 With name claim? (Yupp, happened in that themed game)
#3 That worked out to the benefit of the town? (It was partly beneficial, the name claim didn't isolated lead to the scums - they had some safe fake claims - but it helped some, at the cost of a few townies).

1: never. never again, if it's always this slow.
2: see 1.
3. see 2.

This is the second slowest themed mafia game I've been in. They are not all this bad. Some people just need a good swift kick sometime.

[farside22]

I agree with logicticus about Monkey not using that ability he just did when he did. I couldn't blame Korts for how he felt. I was a newbie once feeling the same way in another game. Now I feel we haven't gone any where and with everyone so quiet....well I really have nothing to go on at all.

[farside22]

I've got nothing new in respect to people. I think Adele and thephantom's comment saying murder instead of lynch was a weird thing. I will take weird over nothing any day just to get something going. Mostly I agree thephantom seems to be a follower behind Adele which I've always find scummie tell.

unvote
vote: thephantom

[farside22]

@thephantom: Okay fair enough. I just feel we are not getting anywhere. We have 4 pages and lots of slackers which makes this difficult at best. I am almost readiy to vote for lurkers just to see if it get them out of hiding.

unvote:

[farside22]

Seriously with all this lack of posting going on the only one person who looked scummie was Monkey for using his ability when he did. It made this day that was bad and slow to begin with worse and difficult to make any desicions at all.

Vote: Monkey

[farside22]

My suspicion is back to thephantom. He seemed to jump at Pug and Logo for the wrong reason's. He keeps making mistakes and then backing down when he is caught making those mistakes. They are obvious, but is he newb scum or newb town?

[farside22]

Yea I made a mistake, Im sorry that I am human. Is that a scummy thing to be?

As far as the Log thing am I not allowed to change my mind? Didn't you just change yours?

I see it more as jumping at someone trying to make a case that does not exsist more then a mistake.

[farside22]

@ooba: Are you saying people aren't slacking in this game? It is difficult to base anything on anyone and some people were suspicious of Korts. Due to Monkey's play now there is next to nothing to go on which makes scum happy when there is a no lynch.

[farside22]

ooba:

A no lynch has been proven to be more bennifical to scum then town. Confusion is a great tool.

[farside22]

ooba: A no lynch has been proven to be more bennifical to scum then town. Confusion is a great tool.

Could you explain this?

Also: Oh Crap. I need to do some research on my situation.

??

I was commenting to your post 142.

[farside22]

Bizarre night. The two most likely suspects (in my opinion) for a lynch today both killed...

Adele is now Phoenix probably from the comics, but alignment wise, who knows what that means.

And I think Adele definitely had some knowledge about Monkey as they are Cyclops and Jean Grey. Perhaps she knew if she was killed something would happen to him, but she didnt expect death.

I need to reread and find some suspects.

Why would she vote against Monkey if she had knowelegde about him as cyclops?

[farside22]

@ooba: Are you saying people aren't slacking in this game? It is difficult to base anything on anyone and some people were suspicious of Korts. Due to Monkey's play now there is next to nothing to go on which makes scum happy when there is a no lynch.

There is next to nothing to go on due to monkey's play?

Scum are even happier with a townie lynch..

This is what I was commenting about from yesterday. Yes Monkey was a townie in the end, but him causing chaos during the day was in some part due to a no lynch. Plus as stated scum like No lynch just as much as a townie lynch. It's been proven a no lynch does not help the town. Lack of discussion day one did not help us at all.

[farside22]

I've been trying to think of the best way to get this game started so that we do more then just stare at everyone blankly. Day 1 was a wash. I know people don't think a random vote day 2 is good (from what I read at mafia) so I was thinking on what Ooba said about non conversation and the fact that it bennifits scum. I agree hence I am thinking those who haven't really contributed much to the game in any realy way should be a focus just to get talks going again at this point. I noticed Pug and Johoohno as the worst offenders.

Vote: Johoohno

[farside22]

glad we agree.
so does this mean adel is no longer pro town??

No, I'm still pro-town. My main concern right now is trying to ensure that doesn't change.

Does anyone know an online source more in-depth and easy-to-read than wikipedia on the progression of Jean and Phoenix's light and dark sides?

Just occurred to me that I could already be a bomb or a supersaint without knowing it

I found this on wikipedia: Looks like there are two different versions of Phoenix

The Dark Phoenix Saga is an extended X-Men storyline in the fictional Marvel Comics Universe, focusing on Jean Grey and the Phoenix Force, ending in Grey’s apparent death. It was written by Chris Claremont with art by Dave Cockrum and John Byrne.

It is sometimes divided into two parts, with the Phoenix Saga (X-Men [Vol. 1] #101–108, 1976–1977) referring to Grey’s seeming assumption of the power and repair of the M’Kraan Crystal, and the Dark Phoenix Saga (X-Men Vol. 1 #129–138, 1980) to her corruption and fall. It is one of the most well-known and heavily referenced comic stories, and widely considered a classic.[citation needed]

It was adapted for the X-Men animated series, and alluded to in the movie X2: X-Men United. A third movie, X-Men: The Last Stand, released in 2006, contains further elements from the saga.

[farside22]

As much as I don't mind a discussion about what Phoenix could mean. I think some of this time should be used for scum hunting. Lots of the conversation has been more about powers then scum hunting.
@Ooba: You may not like my idea, but it's a start somewhere.

[farside22]

Okay my problem is there hasn't been much talk about scum and who we think they are so I went more with the lurkers/ hiders as my top two.

Johoohno: Although he states he was on V/LA his vote on lovo makes no sense. Did we go back to random votes? No imput and no scum hunting detected in any of his post.

Pug: He's quiet and applogizes for being quiet, but still doesn't really give any input to the scum talks.

Adele: This is more because of the Phoenix power. I think it's possible she could end up as a SK, but without proff I'm letting her slide. I never found her scummie on day one. I just question her new power and what it could mean if it has consequences to the town.

[farside22]

Okay my problem is there hasn't been much talk about scum and who we think they are so I went more with the lurkers/ hiders as my top two.

Johoohno: Although he states he was on V/LA his vote on lovo makes no sense. Did we go back to random votes? No imput and no scum hunting detected in any of his post.

Pug: He's quiet and applogizes for being quiet, but still doesn't really give any input to the scum talks.

Adele: This is more because of the Phoenix power. I think it's possible she could end up as a SK, but without proff I'm letting her slide. I never found her scummie on day one. I just question her new power and what it could mean if it has consequences to the town.

yer agreed though someone said we should drop the adel power issue. in terms of balancing, it would make more sense if she did go 3rd party. watever that looks like i have no idea.

and why the vote on me Johoohno...no explanation....

You see my quote. No imput. No attempt at anything. Just looking to post, to post. Even with his I was on V/LA he puts a post with no explaination. At this point we are past the random vote phase.

[farside22]

for the noob V/LA is??
its well beyond random voting
FOS johoohno....though its fair obvious ey.
apart from that i duno

V/LA mean vacation/ leave of absence. Basically you are away from the computer with no access for a bit of time.
Will read up on Johoohno comment a bit later.

[farside22]

4. Avoids voting day 1, but says Monkey is a good lynch (post 114 and (126). It also appears that he would vote closer to the deadline but wanted to avoid someone sneaking in and hammer Monkey (post 161) and then tries to move on to the "safe" topic of the day talking about Jean Grey turning Phoenix.

This bothered be some too and if Monkey had turned up scum I would probably be voting for him too, but since Monkey turned up town and was so close to lynch I'm inclined to think lovo14, and Johoohno as well, is town. He could have easily placed the hammer vote on monkey and not drawn much suspicion, at least from me, since he had previously stated his intent to vote for him and the town largely was against a NL. Of course it's possible that he is scum who intended to place the hammer vote on Monkey and didn't have access to the site before deadline like he said when I asked him about it.

This is why I think it is likely that at least one scum was on Monkey's wagon. Of the 5 people who voted for Monkey, I know I'm town and I think Adele is town as well for the balancing reasons discussed previously, which assumes Adele was town previously, but it seems likely given her role. I will likely be voting for one of the remaining three (farside22, Lloyd, and logicticus) but I need to take a closer look before making my decision.

I like your point about the vote against Monkey, but we can't assume because someone didn't hammer that doesn't mean anything. However good point about at least one scum on the Monkey train.
I will look and do an analysis this week of each person. Hopefully in the next couple of days. Sorry thing got hectic this week on me and I will have more free time next week if anything.

[farside22]

I'm sorry I got behind with a few games I'm in. I swear tomorrow to have more info and do a reread.

[farside22]

Okay I have 48 hours and hope Pug comes in and answers the following:

First you state this comment:

4. Avoids voting day 1, but says Monkey is a good lynch (post 114 and (126). It also appears that he would vote closer to the deadline but wanted to avoid someone sneaking in and hammer Monkey (post 161) and then tries to move on to the "safe" topic of the day talking about Jean Grey turning Phoenix.

This bothered be some too and if Monkey had turned up scum I would probably be voting for him too, but since Monkey turned up town and was so close to lynch I'm inclined to think lovo14, and Johoohno as well, is town. He could have easily placed the hammer vote on monkey and not drawn much suspicion, at least from me, since he had previously stated his intent to vote for him and the town largely was against a NL. Of course it's possible that he is scum who intended to place the hammer vote on Monkey and didn't have access to the site before deadline like he said when I asked him about it.

This is why I think it is likely that at least one scum was on Monkey's wagon. Of the 5 people who voted for Monkey, I know I'm town and I think Adele is town as well for the balancing reasons discussed previously, which assumes Adele was town previously, but it seems likely given her role. I will likely be voting for one of the remaining three (farside22, Lloyd, and logicticus) but I need to take a closer look before making my decision.

Which I agreed with and meant to do an analysis, but RL got in the way. Now we have your vote here based on inconsistancies:

vote: lovo14
He has too many inconsistancies and he became way to defensive over the whole hammer issue.

You know I had thought you would take your own advice and look into the day one vote, but you didn't and now you went from thinking lovo was town to calling him inconsistance. I am calling you a hypocrite.
I think lovo is inconsitant in his comments as well, but I don't like pugs comment and vote and would like an explanation.

unvote: vote: Pug89

[farside22]

You know I had thought you would take your own advice and look into the day one vote, but you didn't and now you went from thinking lovo was town to calling him inconsistance. I am calling you a hypocrite.
I think lovo is inconsitant in his comments as well, but I don't like pugs comment and vote and would like an explanation.

I'm not allowed to change my mind? At the time of the post you quote I didn't see much to go on in terms of whom to vote. I'm still keeping that in mind but lovo's actions after that post have lead me to vote for him. The main reason I thought he was probably town was because he could have easily hammered when he didn't, but if he didn't have access to the internet at the time it's a moot point. Lovo14 has continually changed his story of whether he was around or not at the time of lynch. He originally said he was away from his computer and changed his story several times; as if he is trying to change is story to appear more town.

I just felt that you were taking the easy approach to the lynch. It seems convient to say all this now that Johonono found and highlighted the points. I've changed my mind on people in games, but usually I find the evidence. Like I said I have an issue with lovo's comments as well, but to put him at L-1 so quickly makes me question you.

Lovo:

Claim please

[farside22]

also i go away til monday now. so 4 days. back on 24th.
oh and im happy to share results with town about night actions obviously

ugh this couldn't be the worst time to leave. I really don't want to go another day without a lynch because it doesn't help the town. Your contradictions are hard to ignore. From one statement to another.
We have a couple of hours left of discussion. I want to see everyone weigh in on this.

[farside22]

I am waiting on Pug to answer my question. By the way I apologize for the no lynch I was not paying attention to the time of the deadline, but with the late claim and non answers I was getting from Pug I didn't feel Lovo was the right lynch.

[farside22]

I am waiting on Pug to answer my question. By the way I apologize for the no lynch I was not paying attention to the time of the deadline, but with the late claim and non answers I was getting from Pug I didn't feel Lovo was the right lynch.

I already responded to your question (in post 209) unless there was something after that I missed, but to restate my reasoning: My main reason for thinking lovo is protown was invalidated by the fact the he didn't purposly choose not to hammer but was simply not around (at least according to him) and his inconsistancy was a far more concrete reason to vote for someone than my suspicions (which I still have) about the voting on day 1.

but to put him at L-1 so quickly makes me question you.

This is from Day 2 but I wanted to adress it. I don't think I put him at L-1. Lovo had ample opportunity to explain himself and there were only 2 days till deadline; I think he was the best lynch for yesterday given what we knew.

Yes your vote put lovo at L-1. I found it a quick vote because it didn't really say anything but a vote and I had to ask you about it.
My vote stands because all I saw was a rush to vote without reason and felt your vote with your earlier comments don't match.

[farside22]

bump

[farside22]

In fact, I suggest a role name claim only. This might at least trigger some discussion and ideas because we stagnant really really bad.

I think this is a good idea because we need to move pretty quickly, deadline is in about a week and a half.

Farside, what do you think about logicticus's idea?

I have no issue with a claim, but with the lack of input coming through will we have time?

[farside22]

A name claim woudl generate discussion and possibly move a lynch along, if this town is capable of it.

vote lovo

this is mostly a carry over from yesterday, but todays actions dont look good.

seriously guys, take a look at lovos posts, at the very least and make a decision, but dont just blow it off.

I'm not blowing it off. Johnoo made a really good point. I'm just wary of some people and they way they are playing. (cough pug). I just have this instinct that is kicking in. Look forward to hearing from WLC with a fresh perspective that this game really needs.

[farside22]

Well WLC most find lovo scummie at this point. I have a vote on Pug. I found his desire to want to talk and then says nothing to back up his comments. To placing a L-1 vote on lovo scummie. I feel the lovo votes are scum driven.

[farside22]

I really dont think much of your thoughts. I dont see any scummy in what I wrote.

I wanted to lynch thephantom D1, but when that clearly wasnt going to happen, I switched to monkey who i felt was scummy as well and said the next day my vote was going back to my #1 suspect (Just as its on lovo now).

And then thephantom ended up dead and my top 2 suspects were both not scum, so I was perplexed. I just dont see your case.

Anyway, go town for another no lynch on day 3. We are certainly making the scum work for this one!

That is a defeatist attitude. Aren't we looking for scum or trying to lynch scum? Sure no lynch is bad because we are not getting any answers. I see as Pug says no one agrees with me and at this point I don't want to see another no lynch myself.
Lovo the conflicting answers you gave were scummie. You can't just chalk that up to whoops my bad. Too many conflicting comments equal scum. I hope by doing this that we can get some answers and more talks

unvote:
vote: love

vote count:

lovo14: (3) - Lloyd, logicticus, farside22
logicticus: (1) - WeyounsLastClone

7 alive, 4 to lynch

Note: The voting in this post is counted in this count.

[farside22]

so no lynch right?

we have another day. I'm starting to agree with WLC about logicticus. His defeatist attitude and now this comment. It looks scummie. Sigh I don't know if we have time for this with the amount of lurking going on this game.

FOS: logicticus

[farside22]

I'm asking for an extension of deadline. I have doctor's appointment today and won't have time to weigh in on questions right now.

Deadline extended by one week. New deadline is 13th May 2008

[farside22]

yeah. I'd really like for lovo to give some input. And farside, why ask for an extension if you don't use it? Not saying it's necessarily scummy, but it might be a good thing to get some discussion going.

Sorry I'm a bit behind in some games. I will try to get on this tomorrow or sunday.

[farside22]

Hi all. Just when I get to reading and making notes my little one interupted and I lost my notes.
Some things I remember off hand.
Some people weren't up for a claim due to the fact that name claims didn't mean anything. Why have people changed their minds on this at this point?
Hopefully I will have more thoughts today for you.

[farside22]

The better question is do we have time for claims with this lack of posting from people.

[farside22]

Well I guess there is one scum left. 11 people I could see that, but I guess we have a SK after all. I can't imagine 2 vigs in one game at this point.
The only person cleared as scum is WLC.
I still have my eyes on Pug as lack of contribution. I haven't see him offer much of anything. I will read through to see if Johoono looked to buddy with anyone.

[farside22]

Mod:

Can we have a prod on Llyod and Pug who have not post for this day at all.
Thank you

[farside22]

Actually I don't think there is a SK. I know this is completely unsolicited but at this point I think it's best we have as much information as possible and I think this might be important. I'm Rouge, I don't have any active powers but if I am targeted at night that player will be killed (I think Darla/Prof X is the exception). I don't have any way of knowing for sure but I think one of last nights deaths (Johoohno's) was a result of this.

darla was killed last night how do you figure Johoohno targeted you with only one town person killed and one scum?

[farside22]

Well, Johoohno was Storm which, from the fog description of lovo when he was blocked, could be a mafia roleblocker, so that'd could have him target Pug.

Good point.
Will be on v/la till Tuesday

[farside22]

So, we're just sitting by until the deadline, where we'll have to rush with a high chance of another bad lynch?

Farside, what do you think of the claims of Lloyd and Pug? Could you please claim yourself?

I'm not to sure of Pug at the moment. However the idea of a town RB and a mafia RB seems a bit powerful. Not impossible however. I have a game were a mod likes to have both town and mafia RB.
My character is Shadowcat. Basically it is a hider.
First night I hid behind Lloyd because no one else really stood out to me.
Night 2 I forgot to send in a choice
Night 3 hid behind WLC

[farside22]

@WLC: I know you to be the only pro town person left in this game (due to the fact that you were targeted night 1) I would like to here your thoughts between the two that obviously are looking at one another.
I have been suspicious of Pug for a couple of days do to his votes and lack of real scum hunting this game.

[farside22]

@WLC: I know you to be the only pro town person left in this game (due to the fact that you were targeted night 1) I would like to here your thoughts between the two that obviously are looking at one another.
I have been suspicious of Pug for a couple of days do to his votes and lack of real scum hunting this game.

What exactly do you mean? Aren't you protown yourself? And do you think Lloyd and Pug are scum together, or do they have separate affiliation?

I meant the only player left in the game beside myself. I thought that was pretty evident. I don't believe there is 2 scum left unless there is a SK because the game would be over if there were two scum at this point.
If you want me to be honest if there was a SK I would think it was you, but this is based on your character more then anything you have done game wise. Phoenix did turn on people and I can imagine that once killed as Jean Phoenix would turn to the dark side and become a SK. Since we have no clue about a SK I am looking only for scum.
My reasons for Pug is his quick vote on lovo. He joins the log wagon with nothing to really offer.
As roles are being discussed however. I'm leaning towards Lloyd on this one just because I find 2 RB's difficult. I do know a Mod who likes to put a pro town RB and scum RB, but not on this site. Lovo said he looked at Lloyd, but didn't see anything. Lloyd says he targeted someone that night. The stories contradict themselves. Sure lovo could have been RB that night, but it didn't sound like that from what he said. He was RB the following night if you read what he said.
So as you can see I have my reason's for both people as scum. I just wanted input from the one person who was came back from the dead who I believe was targeted by scum and don't believe you are scum.

[farside22]

What exactly do you mean? Aren't you protown yourself? And do you think Lloyd and Pug are scum together, or do they have separate affiliation?

I meant the only player left in the game beside myself. I thought that was pretty evident.

Sorry, I guess I'm just a bit paranoia and looking into things too much. But if there's no serial killer, wouldn't there be 3 town and 1 scum as you point out? That means I'm not the only townie left, and (if you are actually town) either Pug or Lloyd is still town as well.

At the moment I'm leaning towards Lloyd as scum. In the game he came across more as someone who knows things, than as a townie looking for scum and being unsure at times. More that he's following along sometimes. Call it a gut-feeling, but I think he was buddies with Johoohno and he adapted Johoohno's role and nightchoices (they probably discussed all their nightchoices I guess). But before I place my vote on him, I'd like to reread the thread. Don't have much time next few days, but hope to get something up end of the week.[/quote]

Yes that does mean 3 town and 1 scum if we are correct, but I'm flipped between Pug and Lloyd. As I stated both have rung my scumdar in one way or another. Mostly I'm asking for your input due to the fact you died and came back which would seem you not scum. (going on the assumption there is no SK).
I'm leaning Lloyd. Lovo's comments and his comments don't interact. There is definitely something missing and knowing Lovo came up town I'm more then certain Lloyd is lying somewhere in there.

[farside22]

farside, it's not a contradiction. I already explained that I blocked unnoticed, just like lovo targeted me unnoticed.

OK, lets try following your line of logic: Hypothetically...Suppose I only sat around (and didn't block at all) as lovo said, then either you or Pug are probably lying. How in the world did we have 3 kills (Phantom, Adele, Monkey) on night 1?

I thought reading what the Mod wrote. Scum killed Adele. In a rage Monkey kills random person and then dies in a fit of rage.
So no one notices you? Then explain how Lovo said you did nothing one night and then got a no info the next day?

[farside22]

This is from lovo and what he said when he tracked you.

yer im professor x
i have the ability to either track or watch each night (choice)
ialso because of telepathy i do this unnoticed ie in mafia terms pretty sure i can be blocked or tracked if there is another tracker
last night i tracked llyod
he went no where

You said you RB someone that night. Wouldn't you be going somewhere if you RB someone?

[farside22]

bump
I would like to hear more from Pug and WLC on this please

[farside22]

My role is Morpheus. I am not scum, but this role was weird to me and I thought for sure by telling everyone about it that I would either be lynched or killed.
Once per game I can target a player and addapt their role. (Basically I could use there role and target someone with their ability). I haven't used it yet.

[farside22]

Yeah I can finally get out of this slow game.
I had no idea where the mod got the name from. I knew it wasn't X-man and the name claim would get me lynched. Alas the game is not over yet.

unvote:

vote: farside22

[farside22]

Wow. farside lynched herself?

free at last, free at last. Thank god I am free at last.
No offense Mod. The game looked good on paper, but the lurkers and lack of posting really hurt this game.

[farside22]

Lloyd did you target WLC or not. I knew he was the SK.

[farside22]

Lloyd did you target WLC or not. I knew he was the SK.

I blocked & targeted WLC. WLC must have had 2 night kill protections (night 1 + night 4).

I tried, but I couldn't convince Pug to vote the other way.

I believe Pug was telling the truth, due to ThePhantom's slip about not going out on night 1. In re-reading that + Pug's claim, I was convinced that Pug was telling the truth, and anyone targeting Pug would probably die.

I let your slip up being Shadowcat go unnoticed, but WLC found it anyway. As for not self lynching, I suppose the game would could drag on for another day. It's unclear how many night protections WLC had (he has at least 2, maybe more?)

Yeah I screwed up there big time. The game had dragged so long I forgot about shadowcat even being in the game.