Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!

[RadiantCowbells]

akarin's tone is towny

what are quotes where her tone is towny and why

rc-jarjar reads like a tvt feud

why is this the case

grendel makes some good points and the d1 wagon on him was ew

which good points? why was the wagon ew?

matt feels like a lynchbait to me

why?

i think keyser has hada lot of faux rage

where?

rauth's tone feels kinda forced

Did he? where?

i don't think sheep's progression through the game is genunie

Give me examples of point sthat you think are not genuine.

[RadiantCowbells]

If you are town here do not join another game with me in it Transcend. This is not cool.

Someone hammer.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am voting a slot that is refusing to contribute anything to the game and encouraged a quickhammer on town cop.

[RadiantCowbells]

You could, y'know, explain one of your reads.

I made my decision a long time ago that I am not going to put up with informationless players like you (and not always you- just this game apparently) or Wisdom. You can call this a policy lynch if you need to.

[RadiantCowbells]

You call it a grudge lynch but I don't have a grudge against you. I have an issue with your playstyle this game and I am putting my foot down on it.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's not hard for Scum!Transcend to sit there and say that they're positive that I'm townreading them. Do something that scum can't fake.

People have told me that you're a good player but I frankly think people who can only play scum by refusing to provide information and hoping that the wagon never swings to them are poor players.

Go act powertown this game and lead someone like a collared sex slave in Rotterdam or smth.

[RadiantCowbells]

As in you hit the game where town can't coordinate and you lurk through or you miss and the town works together and you win? That's great, mafia playing on the roll of a dice.

I know perfectly well that you can actually do shit as town. Go actually do shit as town.

Tell you what: I gave you no less than 8 different reads to go into in detail. Pick one of them and flesh it out and I will give you a pass for today.

[RadiantCowbells]

Keyser what do you think?

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

Still going for this but I don't want a hammer before I"m ready to end the day.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Rautherdir

I'm town btw.

[RadiantCowbells]

Is this a joke because I can only omgus people?

If you think Rautherdir is town where is my energy better spent?

I'm ngl the replacement coming in and voting me just killed my motivation for this game. Like even being uncertain about the slot I just feel so ugh.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whether or not she's town or not doesn't make her right.

I'm not going to be helpful to the town if I'm forced to play defense all the time. If I can't get some space you might as well just lynch me today because I'm not going to get much done at this rate.

[RadiantCowbells]

Don't tell me how I'm supposed to react to your crap.

[RadiantCowbells]

scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am gonna pull a Yume and just lurk until people stop pushing on my slot.

Not doing anything more of note until there's no votes on me or I have already been hammered.

[RadiantCowbells]

Idk it's not just this game I just am having serious difficulties playing this game.

Transcend slot was prob town. You're town. Keyster is town. I'm town. I'm sorry that I fucked up the game with the cop lynch but I was not the one who actually quickhammered the town cop.

[RadiantCowbells]

Akarin is town too. So that leaves 3/6 of

JarJarDrinks
Cooperative Sheep
LUV
Rautheredir
Vifam
Mattblack

[RadiantCowbells]

Idk like I'm sure I come across as petty and vindictive but I genuinely am finding it impossible to bring myself to get shit done atm.

This isn't haha i'm going to lurk fuck you all this is I can't think what else to do.

[RadiantCowbells]

Grendel what are your reads in those 6 players?

[RadiantCowbells]

Because I was already deciding between Rauth and MattBlack and idk they felt somewhat genuine. I don't townread it or him but it made other lynches better

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok so if I wasn't in some sort of funk here's what I'd do, in order.

1) JJD has made a lot of content and is probably one of the easiest to read of the remainders. Hard read his slot and see if I can write him as town or scum.
2) Look at MBG/JJD associatives. There was that interesting situation around MBG's entry to the day which I also scumread. See if I can write that off as not SVS.
3) Sheep is doing something I believe to be a major scumtell for them but I can't tell if it's because of the alt thing. Reread their slot.
4) Force content out of Lil Uzi Vert. Hardread it.
5) Reread both Rautherdir and MBG and see if either of them specifically call to me as a better lynch.
6) Lynch whoever my top scumread after all of the above has been done.

[RadiantCowbells]

I actually dislike JJD more than I did prior to this reread. Idk. I don't want to describe his push on me as forced but it kind of is. And the way he keeps trying to get Keyser to join him feels kinda dirty.

Keyser, is this kind of thing the usual in games that you're both in? Because if this isn't like a normal thing then it feels really slimy and manipulative here.

[RadiantCowbells]

Not sure if I mentioned it but MBG just got rolled by RC!Scum last game. I lied about shit and blatantly so in that game. I have a feeling that if he were town he would have jumped on me harder? Idk.

[RadiantCowbells]

Actually that point about JJD feels really out of place. Him dumbing down the game to 'OMG KEYSTER HE'S DOING THE SAME THING AS HE DID IN 192' feels really discordant from what I know about him as a player.
Like it feels like a scum talking point. 'YO HE DID THIS SAME THING 192!!!' It doesn't feel as much like a real thought process given that there's no depth to it nor comparison to the situation in the other game?
I'm getting the impression that the decision to push on me wasn't made based on evidence it's just a thing he has that he has to push as best as he can.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like... sure I'm doing the same thing. But I wasn't actually fakeclaiming cop in that game and do you really think I would do the exact same thing as I did in that one game a long time ago for some reason?

[RadiantCowbells]

Idk like scum talking point is the wrong word. It feels like when you've got like a guest star on a news show pushing an agenda being like HEY WHAT ABOUT HOW SIMILAR THIS IS TO 192?
And dumbing down my play to the claiming bulletproof at L-5. Sure, it was a shit move and I realize it was a shit move but I am known to make shit moves when I'm getting pushed on alot.
Maybe JJD doesn't know that but like I don't understand how the BP claim didn't at all put my actions into perspective for him or even get a comment besides LOL CLAIMED BP 1 VOTE

[RadiantCowbells]

So you think that you his making a purposely obtuse push?

I think the one think that stuck out to me about JarJar, was that he wasn't backing down. I actually thought that was town like.

Is he usually more open as town?

That's not a towntell. It's null at best. It's not that it's obtuse it's that it sort of feels like he's just pushing an agenda rather than legitimately reading me.
Like Nancy's case was shit but I can see how town would come to that. JJD feels more like he's just repeatedly saying BUT 192 and tugging at Keyser and it just doesn't feel right.

[RadiantCowbells]

Whether town or scum I think JJD has flat out decided that they are pushing me as scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

No it's nothing to do with that. It's not the fact that he's tunneling it's the fact that he's reducing my play to simple bullet points to scumread me for.

[RadiantCowbells]

Also with me now thinking that Transcend is town I don't like his jump over. No one as sure of RC!Scum as he claimed to be ever lets me go. MattBlack can attest to that.

[RadiantCowbells]

GTFO w/ that shit. Town aint fakeclaiming cop cause a real cop could counter and get him mislynched AND reveal the actual cop.

This is Mafia 101. Don't make things complicated.

Speaking of dumbing down the game to simple bullet points...

So like he found something that works and he is promoting it as much a possible. Sounds like something that wouldn't nesssesserly come with scum motives.

I think that you're missing my point. I think it's possible that he's just repeating the bullet points because he doesn't actually have a scumread on me.
I think that if he were town his scumread on me would be more elegant and thought out ala Nancy who has a more coherent but still wrong read of my slot.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uhh. This is going to sound weird to hear but the phrase 'cut of your jib' is a scumtell of an insane magnitude for some reason.

[RadiantCowbells]

And yeah the way JarJar was bashing and discrediting Transcend doesn't sit well with me.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: JarJarBinks

Your time is up, dark one.

[RadiantCowbells]

Further steps on my list are postponed until I see some sort of reaction from this clown.

[RadiantCowbells]

There's too much I don't like from JJD at this time. I'll see how he reacts and then if I want to push it I'll make a more coherent case.

[RadiantCowbells]

Don't say antyhing to him atm. Let's see his full/coherent case on me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Do you really think it makes more sense for scum to (fake) claim earlier then town?

Yes much. He had already been partially countered by the flip. The longer he rides the cop claim, the worse it looks for him when he eventually comes clean.

...And this doesn't apply as reasoning for town to do the same thing why?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like you can't argue that as town I would not claim as BP because it makes my slot more likely to get lynched then argue that as scum I would do so because it makes my slot less likely to get lynched.

Not wanting to have a lynch spent on my slot is in favour of my win con for both alignments.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uh in the case of having rolled bulletproof I think getting a fake cop claim out is a very pro-town action because it makes you likely to eat nightkills.
Also I have been known to claim cop, hider, and other amenities as town: and many people in this game can support that claim. Why are you deliberately obscuring that fact?

also this is obviously ATE bullshit. Evidence by the fact that soon after this post he started doing things of note.

Grendel reach out too strong.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like you are wifully ignoring the data that doesn't support your prescribed theory of RC!scum and this doesn't feel like a confbias thing. Does none of that even get past your filters?

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm waffling about MBG.

[RadiantCowbells]

Who are you cheering on?

WRT MBG like I am leaning him scum but there's a couple posts that feel really town motivated but when he was town last game he was like insanely obvtown and he's falling short of that.

I'd rather leave him and give him time to produce content and see if he does anything that gives me obvtown feels.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not done but I am so far suggesting that they are more likely than average to be scumpartners. MBG comes up with a hard scumread on JJD based on like 1 post and it doesn't really feel genuine.
Feels like it may be scum distancing. Then again it's possible that MBG's town and I'm reading too much into it or MBG's scum with a bad read on town and I misread it *shrug*

[RadiantCowbells]

me bed more tomorrow!

[RadiantCowbells]

r u fucking kidding me

[RadiantCowbells]

holy shit I am gonna flip something rn

[RadiantCowbells]

Keyser why the fuck would you pry on that?

[RadiantCowbells]

LUV and JJD are my biggest scumreads atm.

[RadiantCowbells]

Don't tell me how I'm supposed to react to your crap.

This is scum flail.

You're just lashing out here in hopes that people will let up. I don't think any amount of pressure at this point is going to help discren your alignment.

VOTE: RC

This is a really sketchy way to push a narrative.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fuck you keyser you're terrible at this game.

I can confirm, with absolute certainty, that there are

3

scum in

the entire game

[RadiantCowbells]

Cooperative sheep being as irrelevant to the game as he has been makes me believe that he's very likely scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

Hey MBG. Why did you not immediately jump to the conclusino that I was scum on day start?

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean yes but you just saw me as scum in a game where I lied about things constantly. I feel like you would have jumped to the conclusion that I was scum for lying, no? Why is this different?

[RadiantCowbells]

Fair enough. I wasn't planning on pushing you today anyway.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think that if you are scum you are indeed playing super pro-town and avoiding certain wagons as part of it. Avoiding mine would in general just be a good decision as scum and you came out town on Rautherdir anyway.

I will figure out what my read is on you far later in this game when I know more about the alignments of the people you were actually pushing; because I presume if you were scum you were pushing the wagons onto weaker town.

[RadiantCowbells]

No. I think that if you're scum you're pushing the lynch onto weaker town. I think that if you're town you probably don't understand the context I have for townreading Nancy.

[RadiantCowbells]

He was mocking my certainty on Gerryoat flipping scum when I wasn't even certain they were scum I just wanted to play up the 'pissed PR that got outed' vibe on my slot to make sure I got shot.

[RadiantCowbells]

There's so many people in this game who are ridiculously pro-town and I'm finding it somewhat hard to believe that scum are just the leftover players.

[RadiantCowbells]

Ftr if scum is in

Cooperative Sheep (least so of the group but still)
Keyser
Grendel
Nancy
Akarin

you played amazing this game and if you end up losing it's because this town despite losing cop has been playing really well.

[RadiantCowbells]

Then you add Rautherdir soft cleared and it's basically just

JJD
LUV
Vifam
MBG

Like idk. I said earlier but there's a lot of ridiculously pro-town people and I wish more games were like this.

[RadiantCowbells]

Forget about the pro-town people for now. Let's kill someone who is anti-town.

MBG has been reasonably okay and I think he's the least scummy of that group.

JJD/Luv/Vifam lynchpool for today? Thoughts?

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: JJD

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: JJD

I'm really feeling nancy for town and even with what I learned, your play here just seems survivalistic.

THIS came out of nowhere.

I mean they're probs both scum but maybe we should lynch this first?

UNVOTE:

[RadiantCowbells]

no ur top 2 was me. i'm town. go away.

[RadiantCowbells]

having the audacity to scumread my obvscum self makes you the guaranteed lynch noob.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: LUV

Let's do this today?

[RadiantCowbells]

why me = fry me

[RadiantCowbells]

If we have a jailkeeper flip 3 coins. If all of them are heads target anyone besides Rautherdir. Otherwise, target Rautherdir.

[RadiantCowbells]

I would prefer LUV to JJD at this time so.

[RadiantCowbells]

So I reread and I am feeling a decent amount more confident that Cooperative Sheep is town.

[RadiantCowbells]

There's scum in the townblock though.

[RadiantCowbells]

@Sheep
Regardless of whether they are town or scum I think that they planned to back off if I reacted negatively to them and I am reasonably certain that it was intended when it was posted to be backed off of later. This does not outright make the slot town or scum but it does make the foundation of your push weak.
Whether they are making a show of attempting to get me invested in the game or legitimately wanted to get me back in the game remains to be seen.
I think that LUV is a better lynch today than JJD and feel quite good about it flipping scum. Do you disagree with a LUV lynch and if so, why?

[RadiantCowbells]

I do not want to lynch in the half of the game that is being active and pro-town. That means I'm not touching you or Nancy for a while yet.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uh... no? Rautherdir claimed because Keyser jumped his bones.

[RadiantCowbells]

...That was not the phrase I meant to use.

[RadiantCowbells]

....ok?

so what are you saying that you're being wagoned for being scummy which is the same reason that rauthrdir got wagoned and therefore we shouldn't wagon you or other scummy people because that's how rauth got outed?

[RadiantCowbells]

Take JJD off of L-1 for now, let's use the whole day.

JJD, thoughts?

[RadiantCowbells]

Seriously let's get some unvotes on JarJar. Play the game.

[RadiantCowbells]

Frogger can you give me an explicit read on LUV?

[RadiantCowbells]

Let's make a deal. If I lynch JJD and he flips town I'm autolynching you and LUV.

[RadiantCowbells]

Cuz your hard push on replace in is fake as fuck and I feel like you're scum trying to hard push the lynch away from your partners.

[RadiantCowbells]

You still read as so, so fake.

[RadiantCowbells]

I can believe that JJD is scum. What I have trouble believing is that either you or LUV are town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I get a really dark feeling that LuV is scum and that Frogger and Nancy are the buddies trying to hard push a lynch on JJD and cry for a reassess when he flips town.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Fro99er

[RadiantCowbells]

that ladies and gentlemen is what you call an obvious bus.

[RadiantCowbells]

oh: and that's why I outed as BP.

because no one would believe me when I outed as BP.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think so!

[RadiantCowbells]

Maybe. But there's absolutely no way I can reconcile Fro99er's play yesterday with him being town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm town but whatever. If JJD flips town, then once I flip town after I get lynched tomorrow lynch Matt, Sheep, Nancy

uzi is forever town.

VOTE: JarJarDrinks

I said you'd be PLed if you did this. you did it. I think you're scum but even if you didn't I said I'd lynch you for this and I'm going to.

[RadiantCowbells]

We're lynching Fro99er or LUV.

[RadiantCowbells]

If you try to lynch MBG today I will lynch you and then prevent MBG from being lynched the rest of the day.

Everyone stop voting things.

[RadiantCowbells]

Bluntly I don't like you this game. I don't trust at all how you took the wagon that was my brainchild and went ballistic pushing it and and trying to act like it was your own.
It feels like an attempt to jack towncred from the legwork that I and others pulled and I don't at all understand how you were so certain in your scumread on the slot to the point that you basically said PL me if this is town.
It feels ridiculously exaggerated, it feels like a bus, it feels like you're scum, and I don't fucking like your predecessor's associatives with flipped scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

So here are your choices. You stop trying to be town leader and pushing wagons like a chicken with your head cut off or I lynch you today and ignore your reads tomorrow.

I'm not telling you to not push your reads but when you're literally bitching about games dragging to deadline and rushing day phases you need to shut the fuck up.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am not trying to make things personal and I don't understand how you are pushing that reasoning LUV.
I don't like Fro99er in this game for alignment indicative reasons. I think that he's scum who brazenly bussed his buddy and trying to push quicklynches to get away with it.
I need time and space to think and I am not going to get that when he's either deciding that he's solved the game or scum trying to act like that to pile on a bunch of mislynches and shrug his shoulders at it.

I don't have an issue or beef with Fro99er in general I just don't like what his slots doing and I want it to stop so I can get stuff done.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like, I don't dislike the MBG case. I seem to recall that I pushed it. But I don't want anyone, Fro99er included, pushing town to end today in the first 24 hours. That's how towns that are doing well end up throwing.

So if someone is going to act like the game's over and try to push an instant game end then yes I will be lynching them but that's not personal that's purely game related reasons.

[RadiantCowbells]

If you interpret 'I don't like you this game' as I don't like him as a person then sure I see how it's personal. But I am referring to strictly game related stuff.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like LUV/Fro99er is one of the big scumteam possibilities that I've been looking into and LUV crying foul at me for making things personal for something not at all personal gives me googly eyes.

[RadiantCowbells]

LUV kept calling JJD scummy in the early game but never followed up on it.
When JJD wagon got traction LUV kept trying to get an Nancy to give him an in on the Grendel wagon but then ended up waffling till the lynch was inevitable then bus voting.
And yes I have seen the PR softing. I just don't actually believe it.

VOTE: JJD

I'm really feeling nancy for town and even with what I learned, your play here just seems survivalistic.

That felt like a scum vote regardless of the way that JJD flipped. JJD wasn't doing anything particularly survivalistic at the time.

Don't tell me how I'm supposed to react to your crap.

This is scum flail.

You're just lashing out here in hopes that people will let up. I don't think any amount of pressure at this point is going to help discren your alignment.

VOTE: RC

This is possibly the worst vote in the game as well.

[RadiantCowbells]

The worst part to me is that JJD really never responds to any of the interactions. The associatives are totally 1 way.

[RadiantCowbells]

The other interpretation of JJD's opener on Day 2 is that he's trying to defend the Nancy slot.

[RadiantCowbells]

RC, do you believe Nancy's D2 s/read of you and her t/read of JarJar was a genuine reaction test? It nearly made you give in and quit the game.

(I share the same doubt as Sheep regarding this).

Moreover, is her lying about it NIA?

Do I believe that she intended to be able to bail from it if she had to? yes. Do I believe that it was a reaction test that never intended to get me lynched? I don't know.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm 100% positive Uzi is town.

100%? You are in no position to state this.
Please confirm.

I am in every way in position to state this.

He was the counterwagon to JarJar. Yourself, MBG, and RC voted him. From your perspective he's either caught scum or MBG is scum. Unless you really believe it was an all town wagon on town, despite town lynching scum yesterday.

(In that case, you should be heavily suspecting Sheep, because Nancy was also a counterwagon with JarJar and Sheep voting her).

In short, you should be suspecting either sheep or MBG today.

He was the counterwagon to JJD pushed by someone who is confirmed clear. Why can't the duelling wagons have been SvS?

[RadiantCowbells]

If MBG is scum you might have a case here but so far I'm unsure.

[RadiantCowbells]

Spoiler:

Alright so here's where we're at with the final 2 scum.

Rauth,RC,Keyser,Grendel,Akarin are all town. Don't need to worry here.

There has to be 1 or 2 scum that bussed Jar, because only people that didnt vote him was me(town), Rc(town), Kesyer(town), and Sheep(???)

[LYNCH ACHIEVED] JarJarDrinks - Akarin(town), Grendel(town), Lil Uzi Vert(???), nancy(???), Rautherdir(town), Fro99er(???)

This leaves Lil Uzi Vert, nancy, and Frogger as the possible bussers.



Possible scumteams(in no particular order):

(1){JarJar,LUV,Frogger}
(2){JarJar,Nancy,Frogger}
(3){Jarjar,Sheep,Frogger}
(4){Jarjar,Sheep,LUV}
(5){Jarjar,Sheep,Nancy}
(6){Jarjar,LUV,Nancy}

(1) - I think is the most likely team
(2) - It's possible that Nancy bussed JarJar, and flipped on her reads after Rauth cleared RC, but I don't think that's too likely with how the Transcend wagon shaped out. It would mean both Vifam, and Jar were bussing Transcend for barely anything more than policy reasons. Transcend's lynch was easily avoidable given how little of a case was given on him, so I don't think they'd go with it that easily. Probably least likely team.
(3) - Someone else can go until more detail about this as a possibility. Probably second most likely team
(4) - Idk what to say about this one. Maybe someone else can give some input if they think this is likely.
(5) - For the same reason I think (2) is unlikely I think this one is unlikely.
(6) - This one would be a weird team. Idk the liklihood of this being the team.

Actually now that I think about it more it doesn't look like Nancy would fit well in any team. She's probably not scum.

Why Frogger is scum, and should be lynched today:

1. His entrance of the game reads like a super hard bus on JarJar to try and gain towncred
2. He scumread on ne was super weak and nongenuine but tried to push it off as truth. Seriously look at his reasons for scumreading me yesterday. Said I was scum for scumreading Jar for a weak reason, and then townreading him day 2, but Vifam(his slot) did the same exact thing. Says I'm scum because I didn't want to policy lynch transcend and announced he was at L-1. Then misrepresented my reason for not hammering Transcend (he said it was only because my scumreads were on the wagon, but ignorned the fact that I didn't want to policy lynch). Says I'm confirmed scum because he doesn't like my reads post.
3. After his back and forth with Jar he backed off of Jar, and started pushing me even though there was nothing that Jar said that warranted him to back off of him. He then pushed me, and tried to get others to push me because he knew it would be better to get a mislynch on me first before lynching Jar day 3.

VOTE: Frog

Good shit RC. Keep pushing me Frog. I wanna see how it's going to work out for you.

Oh I was going to say: wtf is this?
Don't hide behind me. fight your own battles.

[RadiantCowbells]

He was the counterwagon to JJD pushed by someone who is confirmed clear. Why can't the duelling wagons have been SvS?

I guess they could have been, which would make uzi scum and MBG probably town.

I really really believe Uzi is town though. I've stated several times why. If you chose to disagree that's fine. I'm sticking with my read.

And in fairness, if Uzi is scum it should mean I'm his scum partner given the way he backed off of my slot D1. So I can see from your POV why you think Uzi and I are a team...especially with my defense of him.

That's why a frog flip does so many good things for this game. I'm dead serious.

What do you think about Uzi/Nancy?

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm catching up, now. Anyone want to go for the hattrick and just hammer somebody in the next half hour?

I am gonna lock you in a laundry hamper.

[RadiantCowbells]

I get the read from nancy at least that if she was committed to a bus she would finish the bus and see people trying to get the votes off that wagon as free towncred for her.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uhh. When do scum ever eliminate their partners from even being in their lynchpool?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I think that having buddy in scumpool but never voting or fosing them is classic scumbuddy-scumbuddy interactions personally.

[RadiantCowbells]

Maybe he thought it would clear her when he flipped scum. WHO KNOWS THO.

[RadiantCowbells]

Especially with daytalk I can see some sort of 'hey I'm gonna bus you ok so you should push back on me so it seems legit'.

[RadiantCowbells]

You yourself pointed out that it's very googly eyes of nancy to jump from you being in her top townread pile to voting you. You don't possibly think that there's scum motivation there?

[RadiantCowbells]

VCA is not useful. It's near guaranteed that someone bussed the slot at this point so it's now just a questino of who you think it is.

[RadiantCowbells]

YOu have little faith in the town.

Okay, let's say that 1 of 'em is scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean this is clearly a scumteam that likes to bus. If they saw the Transcend wagon as inevitable, why wouldn't they?

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah the main reason I think that Fro99er is scum is that I think he's been deliberately aiming to shut down my play in this game.

[RadiantCowbells]

People have said that about my slot before when I was chain bussing and then I've endgamed them Keyser.

[RadiantCowbells]

So mean.

Anyway, I'm not going to catch up until tomorrow.

Also, who died and made you RC?

[RadiantCowbells]

Frugal is the right word there? O>o

[RadiantCowbells]

Hi Nancy!

[RadiantCowbells]

I am good! Tell me your thoughts and feelings about this game?

I'm kind of stuck between a bunch of different things. I think Fro99er is the most likely scum for starters but I also don't like a lot of MBG's play
I'm also getting a lot more paranoid of your slot given that it looks like JJD freaked out about the lack of votes on me when the Transcend wagon was picking up and I never super townread you.
Your vote hop over to Fro99er felt a little weird. It's not like I can't see it from town you though so *shrug*
LUV is still to me the worst of all the slots currently in game; don't like how they soft FOSed JJD but were happy to swap to other wagons when presented the opportunity.
Basically I'm hoping that you're town and can pocket me so I can have a starting ground outside of Rautherdir.

I'm considering the possibility that Rautherdir is actually scum but that's a bridge that we can cross when we get to it.

Oh sorry. It's a habit

[RadiantCowbells]

That reaction makes me feel worse and not better about you and it makes me the sads.

[RadiantCowbells]

Honestly it kinda baffles me how anyone is paranoid about this slot considering what I did D1 but it's whatever.

What you did D1? O.o

[RadiantCowbells]

You played solid defensive play but I think that Fro99er was the one most responsible for getting JJD lynched that day; not that I think JJD was ever reaching endgame after that trashcan push on me.

[RadiantCowbells]

LUV is still to me the worst of all the slots currently in game;

I'm actually glad you are voting me over Uzi

idg your hard townread there any more than i got your hard scumread on JJD. walk me through why those reads are/were so strong?

[RadiantCowbells]

I am really scared to answer that without knowing what alignment you are. Mostly you just replaced in super confidently though and started doing shit which is easy to townread.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean I get that. I saw it too. Part of the problem is I'm just so fucking used to being deathtunneled by town over nothing that it's really hard for me to confidently call shit pushes on me scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

ah ok

i was being like extremely offensive i thought?

pedit eh don't let me interrupt

You were on offense against a town slot. That's bad offense
Offense in my terms is how well you have caused scum to get lynched. Defense is how well you manage to avoid getting yourself lynched.

[RadiantCowbells]

I never said that. I said that I can't confidently pinpoint someone as scum for having a shit push on me because of how many shit pushes I am constantly on the receiving end of.

[RadiantCowbells]

Also when the fuck did I say that? I am having serious trouble understanding how you parsed anything I've said into "well others do this to me as town so Jar must be town". I was the first to propose JJD scum ftr.

[RadiantCowbells]

Actually nevermind scratch that. I understand what you're saying but it still comes as a result of you misunderstanding my previous posting

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm just trying to find a way to get you or Fro99er or Sheep or just generally any one of my scumreads out of the lynchpool so that this game becomes lock.

Also, Fro99er, more on Uzi pls.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not like.. hard scumreading you? I am just not able to push you out of 'potential scum' territory and there are some weird things wrt your reads, like the Fro99er vote.

[RadiantCowbells]

JJD flip is going to be extremely telling about how on-point our reads are right now. If it flips green we'll have to seriously reassess.

Also this post still really bugs me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Frog vote was weird because you were hard townreading them. I can understand the thought process where it comes from town though so it's not like decisive.
It bugs me because it feels like you're drawing attention and LAMISTing like 'HEY GUYS I DONT KNOW WHAT THIS FLIP IS GONNA BE LEL IM GONNA TALK ABOUT GREEN FLIP INFO SO I GET TOWNREAD'- but again could be town.

[RadiantCowbells]

Bedtimes. gnites!

[RadiantCowbells]

I guess I want a MBG lynch today I think?

[RadiantCowbells]

If MBG's scum then I am going to seriously reconsider the possibility of Keyser being scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

I may look at mattblackguy first actually:

The fact that Keyser didn't make a vote outside of RVS yet was still active is a little concerning.

Either you did not fully read Day 1 or you are scum.

VOTE: mattblackguy

You can start by deconstructing your read of JarJarDrinks from Day 1 through to Day 2 (from scum-read to town-read)

GO!

Last time Keyser was scum in the Large he was townread early but I ended up catching him (last remaining scum) in endgame because of how 'too perfect' his scumreads are.
This game reminds me a lot of that game. Super pro-town play, only has ever helped town, made this little gem which focuses on associatives that may in fact have been SvS.
Idk. If we lynch MBG and he flips scum then Keyser is not brought to LyLo.

[RadiantCowbells]

Tbh I have been thinking this for a while but only got around to saying it because I figured if he was scum he'd be a major asset in getting rid of the other scum and I'm not going anywhere so.

[RadiantCowbells]

Alright I'll jump on this. He's not posting anymore and feels like surrendered scum.

VOTE: MBG

[RadiantCowbells]

Role cop is the obvious selection assuming all the PR claims are legit.

[RadiantCowbells]

Why are we discussing the possibility of a scum roleblocker when the roleblock is accounted for?

[RadiantCowbells]

Uhh you're badly overestimating how powerful town is in this game.

No, I don't. Only limited shot bps ever do.

[RadiantCowbells]

I did claim as such, yes.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fro99er right now feels like scum who is crying because they feel the setup is town sided or smth.

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

*thinking*

what if its just scum jailkeeper?

[RadiantCowbells]

I've been saying since the start of the day that I am positive that I was shot.

I think scum didn't believe my claim.

[RadiantCowbells]

ffs

[RadiantCowbells]

I hate this game so much right now

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't think we lynch MBG. can we just lynch LUV or something

[RadiantCowbells]

knlsjl;kas

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm on the fence.

[RadiantCowbells]

I almost want to gamble and say that he is the scum rb. Since role blocking Ruath as scum makes sense. And the over all distribution of town power also makes the jk claim tough to shallow.

Unless the remaining two scum are buff.

How strong is a full BP considered to be in mini normal?

Not particularly.

[RadiantCowbells]

BP is an unprovable usually scum claim. And unless it goes to someone dangerous it is usually not a huge deal for scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

My 1 little thing here is that jailkeeper makes an asston of sense in this setup. BP and Jailkeeper together make failed nightkills wifomy. Cop to investigate. I would actually expect this game to be 1-shot strongman, goon, goon, but unless they blew the strongman day 1 then I'm confused.

[RadiantCowbells]

I almost want to gamble and say that he is the scum rb. Since role blocking Ruath as scum makes sense. And the over all distribution of town power also makes the jk claim tough to shallow.

Unless the remaining two scum are buff.

How strong is a full BP considered to be in mini normal?

Not particularly.

The NRG thinks a full BP is pretty overpowered

https://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Bulletproof

That's in theme games. This is obviously not a theme game.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean, yes. But scum could have a blocker and a role cop or a 1-shot strongman or something. I don't know what's up with the current setup.

[RadiantCowbells]

I kinda want to just lynch someone I know I'm not bringing to LyLo as an information lynch.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Nancy

I believe this is the right lynch today.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's a very meh role in a closed game. Fro99er doesn't really understand what he's talking about. Some NRG reviewers would block it on policy because of the edge case where it goes to someone who lynches 3 scum in a row while eating 3 nightkills but it's overall not considered very powerful. In a jailkeeper set up I'd even say that it's meant to be negative utility; make it unclear whether the JK blocked anyone.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't want your slot in LyLo. JJD may have set it up but the way he was only pushing back against you makes me feel like you're his scumbuddy hard bussing him.

[RadiantCowbells]

Basically anyone could be.

[RadiantCowbells]

Anyway I don't have any site meta to back this up but I don't bus. I don't like bussing I think it's a shitty gimmick people use when they don't have the skill to play scum properly and the current bus-heavy meta is something I could really do without.

I am offended at that suggestion.

[RadiantCowbells]

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=55&t=61784

Not skilled play / coordination? Bussing is hard to do well, y'know.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not going to take you at your word when you say someone is town and you shouldn't expect me to.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fair enough. I usually get scared as scum when day phases go long.

Fork needs to do more though.

[RadiantCowbells]

Oops wrong game. For this game we do need more content from a few people though. Cooperative Sheep needs to post more, Nancy needs to do more in depth stuff, and I'd like to see more from Akarin and Grendel.

[RadiantCowbells]

Nancy already claimed VT

Then she should have no trouble confirming that claim and popcorning.

I won't help lynch Frogg, that is dumb.

Why is lynching me dumb?

Your concept that your lynch clears anyone is nonsensical in a world where people believe you bussed, if that was a bus, then who is going to legit claim that your other interactions are anything but scum theatre? Hence - it is dumb if you're town, because it clears nothing. If you claim scum I'll agree your lynch is a good idea.

Uhh doesn't that assume that he's scum?

[RadiantCowbells]

Hugs for all parties that require them.

Nancy, if MBG is confirmed town, what do your reads look like?

[RadiantCowbells]

Hold up like there's actually serious associative reasons to lynch nancy. The main reason that I'm not is the game is far more enjoyable with her alive.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think Nancy is probably just scum tbh.

[RadiantCowbells]

Nancy pls talk to me

[RadiantCowbells]

idk make me believe you're town. pls.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am trying to gamesolve. you are capable of pocketing me to the point that I'd rather selfvote than lynch you. get me to that point this game if you're town.

[RadiantCowbells]

like just trust me. I am really good at having really fucking strong townreads on town and you play a lot like someone who I almost never fail to read.

I don't want to be a doublevoter, I want you to explain your shit better and help me underestand you.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not sure what you want here. convince me you're town and you can be my doublevote the rest of the game. but right now I want to lynch you and you need to change that read.

[RadiantCowbells]

I can't give you an answer besides everything and unfortunately most of that comes from before you were in the slot. Why are you so certain of MBG/Sheep? What associatives?

[RadiantCowbells]

Okay, then let's change this up. you're the doublevoter. where are we voting and why?

[RadiantCowbells]

I want to see you scumhunt aggressively and I'm sure that I will be able to read you when you do that but I haven't seen enough of that from you. Help me with it.

[RadiantCowbells]

Okay then I need a doublevote here. lmk when you're ready to do shit again

VOTE: LUV

[RadiantCowbells]

Sheep, what do you think about the Jailkeeper claim?

[RadiantCowbells]

@RC - I think what I already said about it, that we should massclaim, and until I get another PR claim i have no interest in lynching Matt today. He is the least towny of the claims, but that still leaves me a lot of preferable lynches before getting near him.

As someone who says they can read her, what do you think of Nancy's flailing around, reversing of reads, and hard wall response to the massclaim? It looks like scum who feels PR walls tightening in around her and her team to me, do you see that at all? Does the play otherwise fit into potential town Nancy play?

Mmm, not quite what I meant. I'm thinking more setup spec wise: how do you think that a jailkeeper fits into the setup as run?
As for nancy, yes I could believe that she could be scum. I'm certainly not townreading her and there's a lot of weirdness in her play. But I still feel like if she's town I will come around on her.
IE, I'm going to postpone her lynch until I am more certain one way or the other. Unfortunately I think there are things you could be seeing that would make her feel 'insincere' but that specifically is NAI.

[RadiantCowbells]

I agree with Keyser here although I had that established a long time ago

[RadiantCowbells]

So this might be something that is only a me-personally thing but I think BP is a weird thing to put into a setup.

To me this whole situation makes MORE sense if there's a jailkeeper because then my role exists to give false results to said bulletproof. negative utility in that sense.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am definitely a Ravenclaw.

[RadiantCowbells]

I lied about going to sleep. Hi everyones!

[RadiantCowbells]

I want to think MBG is town.
I want to think Keyser is town.
I wnat to think Fro99er is town.
I want to think Rautherdir is town.

Nancy's in the middle I guess.
Grendel is also in the middle

Cooperative sheep I was townreading but idk.
Akarin slot I was townreading but I guess it could honestly go either way

LuV is a hard scumread.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uzi is still town

From VCA, I believe he could be town. He was the counter wagon to jar jar, who flipped scum. Scum may have tried to derail JarJar's lynch by moving it to LUV

3 votes.

Myself, Keyser, and MattBlack. JJD himself was not even on LUV.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uzi is still town

From VCA, I believe he could be town. He was the counter wagon to jar jar, who flipped scum. Scum may have tried to derail JarJar's lynch by moving it to LUV

3 votes.

Myself, Keyser, and MattBlack. JJD himself was not even on LUV.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uzi is still town

From VCA, I believe he could be town. He was the counter wagon to jar jar, who flipped scum. Scum may have tried to derail JarJar's lynch by moving it to LUV

3 votes.

Myself, Keyser, and MattBlack. JJD himself was not even on LUV.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like the only person who could really have been pushing a counterwagon is Cooperative Sheep. It stands to reason that at least one scum is bussing, possibly two.

[RadiantCowbells]

Thing is though this is a daytalk game. We know that at least 1 scum is probably bussing; it doesn't seem at all strange to me to suggest that if one scum was gonna bus they'd both want to hop on.

[RadiantCowbells]

Sheep, I note that there's 0 mentions of LuV in your ISO or close to it. Flesh out your read on that slot?

[RadiantCowbells]

Probs someone in {Grendel/Akarin/LUV}

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

I want more time so let's use even more of the day. I'm looking at scumteam possibillities and there's actually a lot we can scratch off.

[RadiantCowbells]

Nancy were you planning on claiming something?

[RadiantCowbells]

why would it matter nancy :T