Mini 1877: Spyro the Dragon (Game Over)

[RadiantCowbells]

Also wait what the fuck are you really going to try and tell everyone in this game that you have secret discussions about the lines I use as scum and that's the one that came up?
Like first off let's talk about this. Who are you saying that you talked to about what my scum game is like and when did this happen because this is a pretty ridiculous claim.
As for the phrase, lol. There's so many lines that are legitimately scum indicative for me and you picked one that I say in pretty much every single game.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am probably going to replace out if FA is done. I'll give a final answer tonight. I might be wrong on secondpick Infinity and he might just be an obtuse dumbfuck who legitimately thinks that he can read me.

I am not, however, wrong on Gin. N_M just counterclaimed Gin. I love who everyone is trying to sweep that fact under the rug.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am willing to be vigged if I am wrong about Gin. I am that convinced that he is scum. The fact that he just got CCed just makes me wonder how no one else is seeing it.

As to whether Infinity is scum? Truthfully I don't know: but I do know that he is scum's MVP up to this point in the game and would cry no tears if he flipped town.

[RadiantCowbells]

The dude is scum. Are you legitimately cliaming that me of all people simplifying arguments to push narratives to lynch scum is not something that I do?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I could post a massive wallpost of the actual tells I picked up on Gin just like I could have posted a wall of the actual tells I picked up on Wraith. It would not be taken seriously because people

wouldn't understand it.

My scumhunting style barely has any overlap with what people typically do on this site and to argue directly based off of what I usually go off of is pointless. I make do with other things.

[RadiantCowbells]

There's a reason that I have never followed through on a fake guilty and been wrong. My 'uberconfident' scumreads are never wrong.

I am admittedly not QUITE as sure that he's scum as like Wraith but he's only like a couple rungs down on a very, very long ladder. Lynch him, BoP vig me if I'm wrong. simple.

[RadiantCowbells]

Not to say that I can't make a case on him: there's a very stand-out reason that he is scum that I can directly cite other examples of people doing the exact same thing.

But my motivation in this game was killed when FA left and I'd really rather not go dig through a whole bunch of old games to cite shit.

[RadiantCowbells]

I can and I will.

[RadiantCowbells]

In return, I want Infinity vigged if Gin flips scum. We can all agree that based on his play today he has been a phenomenal asset to scum if he is town. He's single handedly killing my drive to play and made FA replace out. I want that shit dead.

[RadiantCowbells]

It does not take a genius to realize that in spite of Infinity paying lipservice to being doing so, that he is not reading my slot. He is not considering my slot along a dichotomy of town or scum.

He is either really bad town who has outright decided that I am scum with no chance of being town or he is scum trying to defend his buddy. Either way he should go after Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fuck you too mate. I am trying to lynch scum and you are shitting all over it. If you are town you are going to be a policy lynch for me in future games if you even bring up a scumread on me.

[RadiantCowbells]

No not because you misread me once. Because you're not even considering that I could be town. Because you think you can just come in here and say I'm scum without having any responsibility behind it.
Because you lied about talking to people about my tells (no one actually believes you randomly talk to people about my tells.) Because you are the single most valuable player for scum in this game.

I am not actually fed up with being pushed on. Do you know what I actually AM fed up with?

People who don't know fuck about me hard pushing on me because they want to prove themself or some dumb shit by lynching most cunning manipulator.
YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT ABOUT ME. EVERYONE IN THIS GAME KNOWS YOU DON'T KNOW SHIT ABOUT ME. YOU DON'T GET TO DECIDE WHAT'S MY SCUM PLAY.

[RadiantCowbells]

No, fuck you Lane. I don't trust you guys to dispatch Gin and Infinity after I am gone.

[RadiantCowbells]

Last time I made that deal Lane I was right on both scum and neither scum got lynched before endgame. I am not pulling that shit. Gin goes first, vig me if I'm wrong. simple.

[RadiantCowbells]

No because you can't read me you don't know what actual reasons are. Infinity you have

no context

for judging whether I am town or scum. Your read on me is MEANINGLESS. Since your read on me is meaningless, your default should be to townread me because I am town 10/13 times. Defaulting to scumreading me is what a lot of people do and it's fucking obnoxious and I am not going to get mislynched here because you're too dumb to consider that you should maybe not chainsaw the fuck out of scum.

I think that you

should

feel like shit if you're town because you pushing on me is fucking terrible. What if everyone who couldn't read me called me scum every game?
Because that's a situation that we had and I got mislynched like 12 games in a row before I doubled down on venomously pushing back on everyone who did and making the game as unpleasant as possible for them. Now its your turn. And no, what you are doing is picking out bullshit and saying 'YEP THATS A SCUM RC thing'. None of it is scum RC things. Bye.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think I am perfectly justified in reacting how I am to a bullshit push like yours.

[RadiantCowbells]

k boys.

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

Vig Gin, lynch Infinity tomorrow. This game isn't worth my time and I'm not putting a replace in to do my job for me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Eager you haven't been around long enough to know this but when I flip town with a scumread this strong, you follow it without hesitation. Do it.

[RadiantCowbells]

And seriously: lynch Infinity. I don't care if you townread him no one should get away with defending scum that hard or else scum will do it constantly.
I disagree with the people who townread him as well but I'm not going to get into that because lynching him just on policy should sell it to you guys.

[RadiantCowbells]

If you're scum whatever. If you're town don't join another of my games please.

[RadiantCowbells]

No sorry Eager I am not letting Gin go.

[RadiantCowbells]

MoI could be scum, Lane is very like town, Gin is today's lynch.

[RadiantCowbells]

No, I am literally just reiterating my reads on the people that you listed.

[RadiantCowbells]

No. I am not distracting from Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

I fucked up guess I am confirmed scum then. Dude do you know how fucking obnoxious you are?

[RadiantCowbells]

I will get you a read on MoI if you vote Gin with me. How does that sound?

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean it's pretty clear that my mentality today is that we either lynch Gin or lynch me to conftown me so that I can get Gin lynched.

I think it's highly suspect that you're not willing to give me a single lynch when you've heard so much about how good of a player I am knowing that if scum I get vigged anyway.

[RadiantCowbells]

Well then I can't do it. No distractions from me and Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I said. If you commit your vote to Gin or commit to vigging him tonight I will work with you as much as possible.

[RadiantCowbells]

We are not allowed to make in game bets. I like the show of bravado though.

[RadiantCowbells]

Yes

I don't believe you, but ok. Does he throw up his hands and selfvote and then act like he's still trying? Think about that. If he's resigned to his own lynch, how can he possibly believe gin will get lynched? It shows the selfvote was never meant to go through in the first place.

THE ANSWER IS YES YOU STUPID FUCK WHY DO YOU THINK NO ONE CARES ABOUT IT

[RadiantCowbells]

Shit my last game with them they did this same shit to a claimed masonry, only calling one of the masons scum, and saying the other was gambiting town, and they were all town

Umm no are you fucking serious THE MASON THAT I SAID WAS SCUM WAS SCUM AND EP WAS LYING JESUS FUCK

[RadiantCowbells]

Uhh. I have never played in a game with both of those people so you are mixing me up with someone.

[RadiantCowbells]

Gin knows that I am flipping town and is trying to defuse the 1v1 because he knows he won't survive after my flip.

[RadiantCowbells]

I claim 1-shot daycop with a guilty on Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's a joke because people mix us up.

[RadiantCowbells]

So Eagersnake you are going to shoot Gin. If you fail to do so you are exclusively responsible for this loss.

[RadiantCowbells]

If Eager dies during the night and Gin doesn't flip you all are going to powerlynch Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

Bye. Infinity if you're town you're a sack of worthless shit. Make sure he does not live to endgame.

[RadiantCowbells]

{Gin -> Infinity}

Vig Gin. If they somehow survive the night lynch them the next day. Then lynch Infinity.

[RadiantCowbells]

As for why I am so sure that Gin is scum?

read this game

http://forum.mafiascum.net/viewtopic.php?f=53&t=61419

Gin is doing the exact same thing here. Taunting me for being unable to lynch him, accusing me of being egotistical (I explain in this game why it's a scumclaim and it's never been wrong), and posturing all over the place.

[RadiantCowbells]

Don't fall for his bullshit. Just vig him tonight.

[RadiantCowbells]

Stop posturing at me. If town isn't a sack of worthless shits you will be dead by night 2. If they are I don't have a say.

You don't get to be cheeky scum when both of us know that every single person who voted me is a stupid clownfuck.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean I hate when people self vote as town

That's like taking your ball and going home because things didn't go your way

Good for you. I tried to get Gin lynched but people wouldn't go for it. Gin will make it to endgame if you don't hardclaim that you are vigging him. do it.

[RadiantCowbells]

If I have to unvote you to get your shot onto Gin I'll do it but we both know it isn't changing anything.

[RadiantCowbells]

If I am alive in this game at some point when Gin is dead you will find out.

[RadiantCowbells]

Because I don't want to keep fighting this entire day phase and the day needs to end while the current events are fresh in everyone's head to ensure that Gin and Infinity end up dead.

[RadiantCowbells]

You can't have your cake and eat it too sweetheart. You have to participate if you want people to side with you.

Like it doesn't take a genius to figure out that town would never make this post in this situation.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Gin

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm pretty sure no one will forget your incessant whining.

P-Edit: No you're sitting here going "Lynch Gin" people ask you why, you go "because I say so," that's fucking it.

You play the game by going "this post is blah, he is really doing this and this and it's bad blah blah"

You're just whining and that's all you're doing.

'
Read the game I quoted where BBT said 'Make arguments to back up your points.'
This is the exact same thing from that game and the posturing all over the place only makes sense from the viewpoint that he knows that I'm town.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's not a question of meta it's a question of the fact that your current play

only

comes from a scum mentality and I brought up a game where I called someone confscum for doing the exact same thing.

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't believe in comparing meta in that sense. If you were town being incorrectly scumread your response would not be what it is. Simple plain as day fact.

[RadiantCowbells]

RC you gotta stop being so dramatic no matter what your alignment is it's just a role playing game like you really don't have to call people idiots my guy

Okay here's the thing: I don't like to do it. But the alternative is to get lynched every game because it's the only defense that I have.
I believe I mentioned 1769, first game where I started playing again? Day 1 I was nice to everyone and people got paranoid as fuck and 2 PRs outed to try to get me lynched.
I don't have the luxury of being nice because when I am nice I just get autolynched. I play the way that I am required to by circumstance.

[RadiantCowbells]

I didn't ask for your meta. Your play is clearly scum mentality and the fact that it's different from another game that you've played doesn't change the way I feel about your slot.
If I linked a random scum game and asked you to meta me it would probably be different because I am different every game. That does't make me town tho.

Dude I've never been lynched before and I've never had to call someone an idiot or anything like that

I don't know what you're doing wrong

You don't have a most cunning manipulator banner and have half the site have a memory of them having you as lock town when you endgamed them.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean you obviously don't care about being lynched

I do care about getting lynched, a lot actually. But I think that with a lockscum on the table the only evil here is for Gin to stay alive. I will trade 1 for 1 with him.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm not asking anyone to take my word for my being town. I'm asking people to give me one lynch and even if you think that I'm bussing later that's fine.

I am positive that if Gin were town at least one scum would be trying to white knight me here to get towncred and enable a Gin push tomorrow. No one is doing that. That is not coincidence.

[RadiantCowbells]

It is 'textbook scum manipulation' in the sense that I am making no secret that my goal here is to manipulate people. There's no part of it that's scum though and everyone has told you that over and over.

[RadiantCowbells]

N_M has a reasonable amount of experience with me and knows that your points hold no water. Anyone who has actually played with me can tell you that my play here is not too overdone to be town.
I think it's frankly ignorant to jump to conclusions about what your correct info on me holds without asking anyone in the game who has actually played with me whether it means anything.

1) No I don't think that I was. My point isn't that your only arguments were what I said, it's that your arguments come on a fundamental underpinning of you think that you know what Scum!RC does and does not do. You don't. And 2) No, I think that I'm a perfectly reasonable person. I agree that I have to do unreasonable things to win mafia games on the forum; but that's because of how everyone else deals with me. See 1769. I don't enjoy this. I would love to stay calm and collected and play mafia over some tea but if I attempt to do so I would get lynched. Hence the appeal to me of making secret alts.

[RadiantCowbells]

But then people bitch me out and say that it's unfair that I play on secret alts and that I'm just trying to make it easier to win as scum ??? when it's actually because I want to have a relaxing game as town.
There's an immense amount of context to the reason that I play like I do and you don't know it and should know you don't know it. You pretending makes me think you're scum.

I once fought tooth and nail until I was lynched and got 4/6 scum on my wagon, that was Large 200 :p

Never give up the good fight

Your lynch was shit. You were obvtown in that game ftr.

[RadiantCowbells]

I believe that I am playing against my wincon by talking to you in a normal voice and I don't like to talk to scum anyway so I can't do either of those things.

[RadiantCowbells]

Maybe I've learned that being a dick is the only thing that keeps me from getting mislynched in stupid situations like this one?
Like if I get the impression that I am genuinely hurting someone then I will always back down because that's not what I want to do.
You replaced in, hard chainsawed my top scumread, and claimed a scumread on me for reasons that I know are shit. There's no 'reasonable' response to that tbh.

And yes you can- but you shouldn't because you should be aware that you are going to hold me to unreasonably high standards that Town!RC will never hold up to.
I am not lying that this is a super town game for me. If you don't townread me in this game and you are town then I promise you there will never be a game that you think that I am town, ever.
Under that situation, I think it is best that we don't play in the same games because I don't want to be forced into a 1v1 with you every single game.

[RadiantCowbells]

So yes I said it angrily for manipulation purposes but the thought process was more of a calculated if this guy is town we are never going to get along in a game together.

[RadiantCowbells]

He defended you, who are my top scumread, by saying that I am hardscum and not really taking a stance on my alignment. That's called chainsawing.
Eager I play like I do out of necessity. If everyone stops being so quick to wagon me for bullshit I can stop hair trigger responding to everyone that votes or foses or threatens to vig me.
But seriously though why would you ever vig a slot this early on that is a guaranteed scum nightkill?

[RadiantCowbells]

I was being nice at the start and I got threatened to be vigged for it so I ramped up the aggression. If everyone stops making my life impossible I can start being nice again.

[RadiantCowbells]

That's lying about the gamestate. I had you as prob!town then you made a post I didn't like and then I reread your posting and decided that I was very likely wrong about you then your reaction proved it.

Yes this is why I do my best to avoid playing with you. Frankly I debated replacing out when you joined with FA but I love the Theme way too much and decided to stick it out. Because you thinking that your play is Super Town is a mystery wrapped in an enigma surrounded by a puzzle.

I was not aware that you were intentionally avoiding playing with me and I would have made different decisions had I known that.

[RadiantCowbells]

When did I say that you were prob!town jesus I am positive that my read progression is obvious.

INFINITY REPLACES INTO A SLOT I AM SLIGHTLY SCUMREADING. AT THIS TIME I TOWNREAD GIN.
INFINITY STARTS PUSHING ON ME IN A WAY I DON'T LIKE.
GIN SITS AT THE SIDELINES THROWING POTSHTOS IN.
I FOS GIN AND VOTE HIM.
INFINITY RAMPS UP THE AGGRESSION DRASTICALLY.
TADA CHAINSAW.

@RC Ok first of all gin was not your top scumread when I replaced in. Second of all, if someone claims a scumread on you for shit reasons, why not ignore them or explain why they're wrong?

If I'm wrong about you, I'll learn from that and try to read you better next time. Promise. But if you're going to make it a huge out-of-game issue whenever I misread you, then yeah we can't play together.

If I gave everyone free license to mislynch me a few times I would never make it past day 1 in a game as town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I can't explain to you why you're wrong because your case on me is literally entirely null and anyone could point that out. Unless you want me to say 'nope that's not a scum rc thing' to everything, which is what I did.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like there's nothing that I do that's a thing that you can say is a town or scum RC thing because if it works as one alignment I'll start doing it as the other.

WRT FA and fake lines: again the only thing I can do is say nope you're wrong. I fully understand why FA was the way she was this game and I'm not going to make it public knowledge so all I can do is shrug my shoulders at it. I don't think anything that I did was a fake line and I know that I'm town so again all I can do is shrug my shoulders at it.

You have given me nothing whatsoever that I can respond to besides saying nope that's not alignment indicative because your entire case is that demonstrably NAI things are.
Do you want to make a list of the things that you think are scummy so I can find examples of me doing them as town?

[RadiantCowbells]

MoI if I completely disrespected you I wouldn't give you the time of day or bother to harass you and I think that's the only good answer I can give to you right now.

[RadiantCowbells]

@RC Just because you can't respond to them doesn't mean they're not valid reasons.

And sure, tomorrow I'll make a list.

I want to say that at least for me, working things out and explaining your side is a lot more convincing than emotional shit, discrediting, etc.

You are saying this to someone who as scum is amazing at working things out, explaining my side, coming up with great cases but weak on the emotional side.

[RadiantCowbells]

Uhh I don't think that him replacing in and voting me was a chainsaw but up until I switched votes he seemed pretty reasonable then he totally doubled down on it.

[RadiantCowbells]

I intend at some point to compile a coherent case on why you are scum. I am not going to answer you every time you ask until I have done so.

[RadiantCowbells]

Oh right I actually forgot about that. At the time I thought he was distracting from RagingSpammers but I don't think that's the case anymore.

[RadiantCowbells]

MoI has played one game where I was scum. Why don't you ask someone with actual experience with my scum meta, such as Lane who has actually correctly read me as scum every game I've been scum and townread me 'most' of the time where I was town, Sircakez who has extensive play experience with both alignments, or Flubber who was town in the game where I won functional autoloss as scum?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like wrt MoI if I thought that you were utter shit I would just ignore you. I understand that you might not see it that way but I am being playful.
I don't think that you're like amazing but I've seen some really solid games from you, I just haven't bothered to post in them

[RadiantCowbells]

No, I think that all of your points in some way relied on the assumption that the things that you thought were scummy were scum indicative for me and I disagreed with all of them.

[RadiantCowbells]

They are not scum indicative because I do them as town and can demonstrate that.

[RadiantCowbells]

Basically RC says that the things you say are scummy/scum tells are not inherently scum tells as they can prove they've done them as town

The only argument you can make against that is that they intentionally did it as town to obfuscate and improve their scum game which is impossible to prove and RC will never agree with or admit to

No, it works the other way. I fight my hardest as both alignments to get townread and that means using every tool in my arsenal for both alignments.
I understand that people love to say that I intentionally handicap my town play to improve my scum play but I try hard as fuck as town and that claim is absolute bull.

[RadiantCowbells]

You've seen me as town several times but never as scum. I don't think you could tell the difference at this point.

[RadiantCowbells]

No I think meta is literally the only way you will ever catch me considering that when I play on secret alts I am virtually untouchable as scum.

This is just poor use of meta.

[RadiantCowbells]

I say that the meta used in THIS GAME was bad. Certain people have effective meta on me such as Firebringer, Postie, and Titus but none of them are present in the game.

[RadiantCowbells]

An actual phrase that is alignment indicative but not alignment confirming (I have used it occasionally as town but it generally indicates scum) is when I do

'BLABLABLABLA THIS IS SOMETHING THAT A PLAYER DID'? Like what?

[RadiantCowbells]

I don't use it as any alignment anymore since Postie pointed it out to me but it was an effective meta read on me at one point.

[RadiantCowbells]

No, not all meta reads on me are phrasing. That one is though. Like FA as scum would always say 'GET OUT OF HERE' regular as clockwork when pushed on and never as town.

[RadiantCowbells]

No. I think you are scum for saying that becuase you wouldn't say it as town. You were saying I had an ego problem for thinking that I could lynch you, not for anything else.
Which is the BBT tell because if you were town you'd not have reacted like that. Your emphasis would be on holy shit RC you're a fucking doorknob for thinking I'm scum, not for thinking I could lynch you.
And again all you did is argue that I couldn't lynch you. You didn't argue that you were town you sat an spammed phrases like EVERYONE ELSE THINKS I'M TOWN, YOU CAN'T LYNCH ME TODAY, MAKE CASE, etc.
Also your panic role cop claim is hilariously scummy. You are caught scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am not saying SIrcakez is town but his current play reads as more dumb than scummy atm. Let's give him a moment to catch up and complete his thoughts.

[RadiantCowbells]

And I don't like this wagon distracting from Gin either so.

[RadiantCowbells]

Let's give him a moment to catch up and complete his thoughts.

Obviously we aren't going to ql him rn

But this reads lamist you know

All I can do is shrug at that. I am not a player that frequently does LAMIST things as either alignment. I just think the quick votes on Sircakez for thinking there are 3 vigs are dumb.

[RadiantCowbells]

Actually I can tell you why I probably sound like that. 1770 just ended and I am giving postgame thoughts to people so I wouldn't be surprised if my tone is very LAMIST atm.

[RadiantCowbells]

RC I want to know your thoughts on my unvote and gin's seeming attempts to read you

I'm still going to find those quotes tomorrow (one of which had to do with your flip on gin which felt fake to me at first)

And FA played

exactly

like hydra blitz

But somewhere behind all the bullshit I can feel I'm talking to a real guy. In hydra blitz you exaggerated that real guy and I bought it. But now you're just...being normal

PEdit: well he claimed before you pushed him or at least very strongly softed by saying he'd vig n_m on page 11, did you not notice?

RC, response to this?

Later.

[RadiantCowbells]

I fakeclaim guilties relatively often as a reaction test. The only time I have fakeclaimed a guilty in the last year with the intent of having it go off was when I was scum (and targetting opposing faction scum)

I've fakeclaimed like 6 guilties in my life on this site and all 6 have been on scum. It's not something I do quickly, it's a last resort for desperate games.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I am so, so certain that you are scum this game but you are still not at the level that I would fakeclaim a guilty on you.

[RadiantCowbells]

Lol I'm not a daycop and I don't think my guilty would have been taken at all seriously if they weren't actually scum.

[RadiantCowbells]

Okay I will do things.

[RadiantCowbells]

So I'm not quite sure what you want me to respond to. FA played like the Hydra blitz in the sense that the most notable characteristic was her anger frustration and AtE.
If you think that the presence or absence of anger frustration and AtE is alignment indicative then you don't know her well enough to get a read on her.
I get that my flip feels fake; when I am scum I almost never flip my reads that drastically cuz it garners scumreads. But in newbie 1770 which just ended I massively 180ed on my Nydus read and even called a post that I had called like 3 pages before a reason to confirm them as town a scummy post. They called me out and said I was scum for that 180 and they got lynched and flipped scum.

Omg stop your tone feels like you're trying to appease me in a not-alignment-indicative way. I will get over being scumread. If you want to make it up to me vote Gin

[RadiantCowbells]

I actually am leaning towards him being town at the moment. I am not really interested in a lane wagon. I will not be willing in pursuing anything besides Gin.

I would rather not fan the fires of other lynches either until Gin is dead or I have a locked vig shot on him.

[RadiantCowbells]

Because I have a lockscum and I don't want to spend my time in the game doing anything but getting that lockscum removed from the game.

[RadiantCowbells]

The chances of that given the extent of the scumminess of Gin's play and the many different scumtells that they performed are exceedingly low.
That said, if I am wrong I guess I will move on to tomorrow and try to do better, assuming that I am not nightkilled or vigged.

[RadiantCowbells]

Today's lynch needs to be Gin, sorry.

[RadiantCowbells]

Hold on wait a minute

@Lane you are supposed to be able to read me. What's with that lynch me then lynch Gin crap?

[RadiantCowbells]

Elsa and Anna [1] - Flubbernugget

VOTE: E&A

VOTE: Radiant

VOTE: RadiantCowbells

VOTE: RC

VOTE: RC

Yeah L-1

How many town do you think are in this and how many scum?

[RadiantCowbells]

And ending RVS too early is bad and an excellent way to stall a game as scum

Did it look like he was trying to stall the game? What was your point?

This could be seen as a chainsaw of Gin!

[RadiantCowbells]

pep, why aren't you voting?

Does this matter to you this early in the game?

Two guesses as to what alignment Pep and Nydus were.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean at this point FMPOV Gin is flipped scum. Lane makes a lot of sense as a scumpartner atm so I am going to look in that direction when I am done lynching Gin.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's not.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've never been wrong on a scumread of that level. I strongly believe that you are scum trying to keep him alive. You're not really going to get anywhere negotiating with me here.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've never been wrong on a scumread of that level. I strongly believe that you are scum trying to keep him alive. You're not really going to get anywhere negotiating with me here.

[RadiantCowbells]

Gin may not be fakeclaim guilty level scum but if he managed to flip town he would be the hardest scumread that I have ever been wrong on by a long shot.

[RadiantCowbells]

A few people townread him. They will fall in line.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean: you claim to believe that you think that he's town. Why aren't scum supporting me in that case to get two free mislynches? Think about it.

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[RadiantCowbells]

I think that you are either scum or beyond convincing on Gin being scum even though I personally believe that he's pretty obviously scum. I don't see the point of having this conversation.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've given reasons several times. I have not contructed a coherent case on him. I don't expect it to change your mind when I do though.

[RadiantCowbells]

I told everyone to lynch Fitz first for a reason.

I was nowhere near 99.6% sure that you were scum, I just had you as my third biggest scumread and really didn't want to see you make it to endgame.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean given the context of the game it shouldn't be a difficult claim for you to believe

[RadiantCowbells]

Scum errantly claimed that her last game was townsided so I suspect that this game is scumsided.

[RadiantCowbells]

Not on day 1

[RadiantCowbells]

Let's hurry up the gradual realization that Gin is a scumfuck and let's see some votes amirite.

[RadiantCowbells]

To try and look town by looking like they were trying to scumhunt. Duh.

[RadiantCowbells]

Gin is obviously highly confident in his scumplay and it shows this game. I don't think he fully understood how big of a threat that me and FA were. Slightly less threatening as town without FA but I'll do my best.

[RadiantCowbells]

No, I don't think he backed down because of that, I think he backed down because he knew it was futile and potentially dangerous.

[RadiantCowbells]

if he flips scum then i could blast RC to remove that WIFOM of bussing or not
plus their anonymous message role is pretty much useless

really dude?

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: Infinity

we should lynch this first.

[RadiantCowbells]

they are but at this point they are going to get lynched eventually. I don't like how much influence you have over the vig and town in general and I still don't think that you're town.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: gin

[RadiantCowbells]

I am fine with dying if Gin and Infinity both follow.

[RadiantCowbells]

Also I really want to point out that 'you're an enigma' really doesn't sound like something that town say to a scumread there. It makes perfect sense for scum to say to town though.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: RC

Yeah I'm not playing on this account anymore. bg.

[RadiantCowbells]

Infinity has to follow, regardless of Gin's flip btw.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm in the place where when you saids that you were going to vig me I had a replace request written but then unwrote it because you said that you were joking.

This is complete aids. If I am going to play in a playerlist where everyone is advocating policy lynches and vigs on me simply because of my name and avatar I'd rather get lynched day 1 tbh.

[RadiantCowbells]

Look around in this game. Do you really think you're the only person who would reconsider my slot every single night phase that I survived because why did no one kill RC yet?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like everyone is so abhorrently terrified that I might be scum that endgames them but literally no one gives a shit at the prospect of me being mislynched and wasting a lynch. That should be a problem considering I'm 10/13 times town.

[RadiantCowbells]

And how, Eagersnake, do you think that's fair to me when I'm basically just policy vig bait in spite of being a really strong town player?

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I'm not going to sit here and tell anyone what their win condition should be but this game has been incredibly not fun for me since FA left and I just want out at this point.

[RadiantCowbells]

So what if I was having an off game? Is my scum game so terrifying that in order to survive as town I have to be absolutely on point every game or I just have to be gotten rid of because of my scum game?

Okay fine but you are one player among a game of 13.

[RadiantCowbells]

You mean the Nightless Vengeful where I literally got to actually post in the game for less than 24H before I was immediately dayvigged?
And yeah sure I was wrong about you: but I had considered that I could be wrong about you. I had considered that I could be wrong about Superhans too.
I did my best to win us the game and I was super, super clear that Fitz went first. That was entirely outside of my control. If we had done things the way I wanted; if I had been alive; it would have been a diff game.
The moment you flipped town I would have had Revan as hardtown and I would have known that I had to shake up my townblock.

No, I don't think that was strategic though I do think it was a scum ragequit.

This is bullshit, no one is advocating a policy lynch on you

I think you're scum

Lane's vote on me essentially boils down to policy since he has outright said he has no strong reason to scumread me. Magna hard advocated that I be lynched if I live to LyLo. So no.

[RadiantCowbells]

That was one small part of my read. The big thing was Fitz throwing shade at MoI literally nonstop and never getting pushed by him for it.

This is sidelining the point - you said in the Dead QT that the main reason you included me as "99.6% sure Scum" is that you didn't want to see me make endgame.

You can't turn around and whine that I advocate you get lynched if you make it to MYLO / LYLO.

Sorry if you can dish it out but can't take it ...

Because I thought you were scum, yes. I exaggerated my read on you but I still thought you were scum. That wasn't a policy lynch?

[RadiantCowbells]

Correction: I exaggerated my read on you to make sure that you weren't able to brush off the read on you and survive on scum. Not because of some policy shit about not wanting you in LyLo.

[RadiantCowbells]

And here I was thinking someone actually townread me

[RadiantCowbells]

There's thinking that I'm scum and there's not really thinking that I'm scum and lynching me anyways because of my username. One of them I can handle, the other is uncool.

[RadiantCowbells]

OK, maybe I can't handle it. Maybe there's a reason that I took a break from mafia for 6 months. Maybe I will quit again. Who knows.

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean I would just relish in the fact that the people making or believing those arguments are total shit if they're town and really believe that because you're alive you must be scum

that's like the worst argument ever

I thought it was funny and/or flattering at one point. Eventually you get wagoned or mislynched so much that you get fed up with it. Same goes for getting nightkills.

I got nightkilled N1 as claimed VT in a PR heavy setup when literally every single read I had was wrong because scum were afraid that I'd come around and lynch them.

[RadiantCowbells]

I explicitly said that it does bug me in general and this game has actually been an assload of it whereas in that game there was only one situation it actually happened and then a bunch of us claiming that it was policy.
And no I actually don't get lynched much since my return to the game with no lynches as of yet in any completed games- but the constant wagons still wear me down.

[RadiantCowbells]

I really don't feel like Infinity is town. He feels like he's just grasping at straws to push on me for. I would actually consider lynching him before Gin at this point.
My townish half of the game is as follows. I need to think through a good way to order my scumreads because I'm not quite sure how that works at this point.

[Lane????] < contingent on being confirmed.
[Eager, MoI]
[Leon, Aella]
[Not_Mafia]

[RadiantCowbells]

He replaced out of a slot as serial killer when he felt like he was about to get lynched in Grand Idea that I replaced to and won with. That argument for townfirming him is absolute batshit.

[RadiantCowbells]

UHhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh awks.

[RadiantCowbells]

Yeah you don't have any evidence. I hereby claim that ThinkBig and Gin are the same player. Now fight me you fuck.

[RadiantCowbells]

I honestly just don't want to post anymore I'm so fatigued from being sat on this whole game.

[RadiantCowbells]

This burden of proficiency argument is getting old quick mind you. It holds no water.

RC himself said to vig him if gin flips town...

I said that he could not that he should. I would much rather he just vig you becomes I feel like I've been town enough this game to be given some space.

[RadiantCowbells]

Fmpov of you you are either scum or just fully incapable of understanding the extent to which you don't understand my play and are assuming similarities that are simply RC tells are scumtells.

There's a point where when you in this game are interfering with my ability to play mafia in general you really just need to go.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like what I can't understand is that you have all these people who have played with me who are unable to give you a confident answer.

And you, after playing with one game with me and apparently reading something about my play in the aftermath of a blitz game, are able to confidently determine RC!scum at the drop of a hat.

I would like to believe that that is a scumclaim. I really would. I am acting on that principle.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I think that Gin is scum. If I have no other recourse to get him lynched I will absolutely trade his lynch for a vig shot on my slot.
I shouldn't have to though. no one else is being required to submit to automatic vigilante killing if they're wrong about a read.
And that doesn't deter me as scum at all. If I am scum I don't have to go hard to get scum lynched. If I'm so worried about gin I can just NK him. Or I'll find a way to talk my way out of it.
All that this kind of bullcrap does is limit my ability as town to make the kind of difference that I used to be able to when I was given the space to do so.

I never said this. That is why I reconsidered, but ultimately I decided you're more likely scum than not.

You aren't qualified to make this decision. No one in this game thinks that you are qualified to make this decision.
The people who are qualified to make this decision would say that I'm either obviously or heavily leaning town because I'm sorta obviously town here.

Again, the tells I noticed are a small part of the reason I'm voting you right now.

Okay, whatever then. Hopefully you get vigged and if you are town, when or if we have a next game you play it differently.
I do lean that you are scum but I don't need a scumread to be willing to have you lynched or vigged here.

[RadiantCowbells]

Like I think that Gin is scum. If I have no other recourse to get him lynched I will absolutely trade his lynch for a vig shot on my slot.
I shouldn't have to though. no one else is being required to submit to automatic vigilante killing if they're wrong about a read.
And that doesn't deter me as scum at all. If I am scum I don't have to go hard to get scum lynched. If I'm so worried about gin I can just NK him. Or I'll find a way to talk my way out of it.
All that this kind of bullcrap does is limit my ability as town to make the kind of difference that I used to be able to when I was given the space to do so.

I never said this. That is why I reconsidered, but ultimately I decided you're more likely scum than not.

You aren't qualified to make this decision. No one in this game thinks that you are qualified to make this decision.
The people who are qualified to make this decision would say that I'm either obviously or heavily leaning town because I'm sorta obviously town here.

Again, the tells I noticed are a small part of the reason I'm voting you right now.

Okay, whatever then. Hopefully you get vigged and if you are town, when or if we have a next game you play it differently.
I do lean that you are scum but I don't need a scumread to be willing to have you lynched or vigged here.

[RadiantCowbells]

Postie once designed a spreadsheet to determine my alignment. that was over 95% accurate for my games in 2015. I can still usually beat her in actual games though.
There's a relatively small sample size but Nahdia has only misread me once so far.
Frozen Angel and Firebringer can reasonably but not perfectly accurately determine my alignment. Firebringer goes purely off gut, I'm not quite sure how FA reads me.
Creature may be able to read me but I'd need to play more games with him where I was town to know.

I think that all of the above minus Creature who I'm not certain of would townread me here. Obviously FA already knows I'm town but.

Lane does have a successful record so far but his information on me is heavily outdated and I think that just because of how much my frustration with being pushed on has coloured this game he's not going to get a strong read either way. He's saying that I'm scum as confirmed town but obviously if he says that I'm scum he can't read me. Not much else to say.

Hey massive I have had no impression of your slot besides someone trying to stay on the down low. Remedy that.

Like I am just getting more and more agitated with this game when I try to talk to you but I'm not the kind of person who is just going to let you trying to call me scum stand.
I am reading MoI as town at this point and if this is just going to be a thing forever I am probably going to join him on lynching you.

[RadiantCowbells]

Hey Infinity let's say that you're town. Let's say that I'm town. How are you going to feel if I get mislynched or vig shot because of your play and you get mislynched to follow it because you pushed for it?

[RadiantCowbells]

Because if you do get me lynched or vigged that's absolutely what's going to happen. Does whatever confidence your read on me has justify risking two mislynches onto town?
My logic is not invalid; you're repeatedly dodging that point. Yours is; you're repeatedly dodging that point. I will ensure that your death follows mine if I end up dead to town at some point.
Your burden of voting me here shouldn't be more likely scum than not. You better be really damn sure that I am scum before you start pulling these triggers.

RC, I don't want to play these games. I vote who I think is scum, and that's the end of that. If you don't like it, too bad. If that scenario happens, oh well it's part of the game.

This is ducking responsibility.
No, it's perfectly part of the game. Actions have consequences. All actions have consequences. Your actions have consequences. Are the potential consequences worth it?

[RadiantCowbells]

I really don't see that being a town response here. I'm not going to consider switching wagons because I think it's unlikely that Infinity WKs to this extent but yeah I guess every time I talk to Infinity I think they're scummier and walk away more frustrated so.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: gin

[RadiantCowbells]

This is sad and kind of pathetic.

Just vig me. gl

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm semi townreading N_M. that's a bad shot.

[RadiantCowbells]

just vig me and disregard any reads lane gives for the remainder of the game.

[RadiantCowbells]

I said if I had to. Apparently I do.

[RadiantCowbells]

ok then.

[RadiantCowbells]

I want to lynch Infinity because I feel like he was scum and MoI agreed with me because of the way he was dealing with the Gin-n-Tonic wagon
But at the same time if he was town and right I'd feel so stupid pushing two mislynches on town and someone who hard defended town

I was hoping to not be alive today tbh.

[RadiantCowbells]

I never said that. There's a reason I said that I wanted you dead regardless of flip. Also like to point out the MoI nightkill when I was pretty much the only person townreading him.

[RadiantCowbells]

His scumreads were Aella and you so?

[RadiantCowbells]

....?

[RadiantCowbells]

I didn't even realize that he had expressed interest in voting me *shrug*

I thought that when he made the comment about scummy curse that he'd realized that I was town. Oh well.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'll follow my heart. VOTE: Infinity

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: RC

Lynch me and then ignore lane the rest of the game. nm is town.

[RadiantCowbells]

I really don't care how confident you are. If I'm getting lynched anyway I want N_M to either get nightkilled by scum or brought to endgame. non negotiable.

[RadiantCowbells]

So far your scum!NM case is as good as your scum!RC case.

I am good not because of my scumreads but because of my townreads.

[RadiantCowbells]

Lane I get you are confirmed town but I am not going to let you drive town off a cliff. I am not invested and will get lynched at some point this game anyway and that's fine but you're not MLing NM as well.

[RadiantCowbells]

You power lynched the most Townie player we had. Self voted 3 (4?) times. Continuously give no case for anything. Beg to be lynched, and you think you have some sort of authority here? Lol

Who did you send a message to? I'm 90% sure massive is town. And if NM is saying their scum, I want to know why you think nm is town

I didn't send a message because I thought that I was getting vig killed.
Man I get that you don't like it but you know full well that I

do

have authority here. Get used to the idea. I was wrong on Gin but I'm still, y'know, RC. Or something.

[RadiantCowbells]

Lane I am giving you a free lynch on me on the condition that you leave my townreads the fuck alone. Calm down.

[RadiantCowbells]

@Leon he's not wrong that I've done similar shit as scum. I'm town but I don't expect that anything that I do this game will ever change his mind at this point and it's better that I die now than later.

[RadiantCowbells]

RC deathtunneled Gin with a strongman vig in the game and brought endless attention to himself in the process, either he was

really

confident that people wouldn't vig/lynch him despite a Gin town flip, or he's town. Gin 1v1 would not have been in scum's favor.

Trust me. Rc complains about always being lynched and shit, but he knows how not to get vigged/nk'd. He wasn't really confident. He faked it. He just claimed he's good cause he to finds town. He power lynched the towniest player. That's what scum rc does. And somehow talks how easy out of all the scummy shit he does

What do you think he did this game to stop himself from getting vigged? I don't remember him going out of his way to placate Snake.

Lane I am giving you a free lynch on me on the condition that you leave my townreads the fuck alone. Calm down.

Who are your townreads now, besides NM?

@Leon he's not wrong that I've done similar shit as scum. I'm town but I don't expect that anything that I do this game will ever change his mind at this point and it's better that I die now than later.

Gah, your deathwish just makes me think you're town. Unless you do this as scum as well.

1) nothing.
2) you.
3) I don't think I've ever just given up on a game like this before as either alignment.

[RadiantCowbells]

Raise your hand if you tried and possibly succeeded in saving someone last night

lol no one tried to kill you

[RadiantCowbells]

You are going to feel really, really dumb at some point Lane.

[RadiantCowbells]

I've never seen a scum player be so loud, attention-seeking and death-defying before.

This is so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so, so not why I am town this game and Lane will probably blow up at you for this post by the way.

[RadiantCowbells]

I wonder who is going to be the first person to accuse me of coaching you today.

[RadiantCowbells]

Infinity unvote me because you're hammering me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Infinity unvote me because you're hammering me.

[RadiantCowbells]

I am leashing your vig shot Eager. kill RagingSpammers tonight.

[RadiantCowbells]

kk infinity vote me. infinity does not make it to endgame tho promise me that.

RS hammers.

[RadiantCowbells]

It's okay you're scum. you are unvoting until someoen else places a vote.

[RadiantCowbells]

How about you stop thinking that you know how to play and stop interfering?

[RadiantCowbells]

UNVOTE:

to prevent shenanigans.

I want RS to hammer me but I am content with Infinity hammering me. no one else is to hammer me.

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok you want to be a total moron? I will vote myself to L-1 for you.

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok so which part of that is convincing you that it's a good idea to gamethrow by hammering the supersaint?

[RadiantCowbells]

I mean it's directly against your wincon to be literally too stupid to exist but you don't see me complaining about that.

No Lane you can go fuck yourself. If you're going to be an obnoxious shit then I am going to get RS lynched myself.

I'm sorry do you think that your confirmed town status somehow impresses me and bestows upon me the will to serve your every whim?

[RadiantCowbells]

Ok let's play a game.

VOTE: RagingSpammers

I am going to vote RS here. No one here is to be a moron and hammer this. If Lane really wants to hammer then he can rid town of his stupidity.
Either we are going to lynch RS today or we are going to force them to hammer me.

[RadiantCowbells]

VOTE: RC

[RadiantCowbells]

RS what were you?

[RadiantCowbells]

That's because you are dumb and you have no imagination. Don't blame me for that.

[RadiantCowbells]

At any rate

If RS flips town I would strongly advise you vig Infinity.
If RS flips scum you're free to do what you want though Infinity is still a good vig.

I am serious when I say to ignore lane. If he can't prove Massive is town then ignore that read. Anything else he says just don't even bother responding to.
Certain kinds of players draw ICs and Masons and similar roles and they go so far off their rocker on an egotrip that they become incredibly bad for town. Lane is one of those players. Mute him.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm 99% sure this is a scum flip ftr so we should be fine here. I highly recommend that any protective roles that we have be on EagerSnake as oppsoed to Lane.

[RadiantCowbells]

I'm 99% sure this is a scum flip ftr so we should be fine here. I highly recommend that any protective roles that we have be on EagerSnake as oppsoed to Lane.

[RadiantCowbells]

^just ignore that guy. I am hammered and no longer have any motivation to lie if I were scum. You are just a really shit player who has gotten away with saying you can read me because I'm always scum in your games.

[RadiantCowbells]

You've read me successfully in the past but you've never seen me as town. Please do town a favour and don't try to influence the lynch tomorrow. Don't post except to vote whoever Snake votes.