Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!


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Post Post #1175 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 3:58 am

Post by JarJarDrinks »

Keyser
- Town. Even if I didn't have meta w/ him, I'd say he's playing an incredibly pro-town game. Meta seals it. This is his town play.

Cooperative Sheep
- Town. Doesn't have that many posts but the ones that do are full of good content. Makes alot of good points that I agree w/ and is solidly scumhunting.

mattblackguy
- townlean. He had a good explaination for what I thought was scummy and he's pushing RC.

Nancy
- townlean. Her posts so far have been good enough to negate my bad feelings about transcend.

Lil Uzi Vert
- Null. Need more content. I've had trouble reading Uzi in the past and he hasn't posted nearly enough for me to get any type of real read

Grendel
- null slightly scummy. Grendel doesn't seem to say or do much. There's nothing overtly scummy but I get the impression he's being extra carefull w/ his posts.

Akarin
- slight scumlean. I feel like alot of her questions directed @ me are designed to get me to scumread Matt and/or townread RC. Agree w/ her vif and rauth reads though.

Rautherdir
- scum. Just playing the noob card way too hard. So many LAMIST posts.

Vifam
- Scum. Have already posted about how he tried to imply that one of RC/Gerry was scum and then backtracked. The derphammer is self-explanatorily bad.

RadiantCowbells
- Obvious Scum. Reasons already posted.
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Post Post #1176 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:33 am

Post by Cooperative Sheep »

@Nancy - I feel I've actually been quite clear about my Transcend issues and am a little miffed you toss me in as an 'activity' person when I was the one person voting Transcend who explicitly stated otherwise.

I will agree that "activity" is a part of what I would call my "gut" read there - I can't really go into this due to being an alt/ongoings but will say that I am generally familiar with Transcend's play and there is a difference between him doing spit - and him not posting much. He does the latter as both alignments, I feel he only does the former as scum - he was assuredly doing the former in this game.

Also, as a point I brought up three times against Transcend (maybe more) I noted that I though the crux of the case on him was that he assigned the 2 scum on the Grendel non-flip wagon and one on the Gerry known town flip wagon and absolutely was ducking explaining why he had that as a working theory - the closest I could make up as his reason would be him saying "mah town reads are on the Gerry wagon!" but that then kind of requires him to be able to explain how they're town reads, which he never did. So basically he presented a false premise based on gut reads - and it was a false premise that specifically allowed him to target more people that were attacking him, and also to ignore his own shoddy behavior around the town wagon Day 1 - neither of which strike me as town motivated behaviors.

Do you understand my case now?

I also find you replacing in, looking at the game enough to assess a Vote Count but not looking at it enough to see all the unvotes and the mirror claim to just ring very fake and unlikely.
Which I am now adding to the overall case on your slot.
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Post Post #1177 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:35 am

Post by Cooperative Sheep »

Like, if your claim was "I confirm the VT claim" I'd have bought it more - I just don't believe you only looked at the Vote Count and decided to immediately claim with no further assessment of the game.
I don't buy it at all.
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Post Post #1178 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:40 am

Post by Keyser Söze »

@Jar Jar

I'm playing this RC scum-narrative through my head...

In post 990, Rautherdir wrote:RC is town PR.
Does this make Rauth, RC's scum partner?

I feel like Rauth is town-clearing RC (through an investigation?).
Rauth is talking "facts" not theories or blind opinion. Rauth's assured stance wanted me to stay away from both of them D2.
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Post Post #1179 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:45 am

Post by JarJarDrinks »

I would actually say that make Rauth very unlikely to be RCs partner. I feel like giving a scumbuddy a hard townread is advanced scum strategy which doesn't fit for Rauth. Noob-scum wants to distance/avoid teammates.
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Post Post #1180 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 4:50 am

Post by JarJarDrinks »

Coops point about the VT claim from Nancy is actually pretty good now that I think about it. She should have @ least seen if she even needed to claim @ that point.

Like why just show up and claim if you're unaware of the current goin-ons?
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Post Post #1181 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 5:34 am

Post by Keyser Söze »

In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Cooperative Sheep
- Town. Doesn't have that many posts but the ones that do are full of good content. Makes alot of good points that I agree w/ and is solidly scumhunting.
Yes - Coop Sheep is one of the 'active' scum-hunters presenting his 'logical' breakdowns. I agree he's the classic 'towniest-looking player' in a game full of lynch-bait, null-reads, lurkers and anti-town culprits.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
mattblackguy
- townlean. He had a good explaination for what I thought was scummy and he's pushing RC.
Can't see town yet - my attack on him was admittedly OMGUS-fueled, so I'd like to re-read his D2 posts with a level head.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Nancy
- townlean. Her posts so far have been good enough to negate my bad feelings about transcend.
Transend, I was happy to null read/wait for him to contribute til D3 instead of policy lynching him (based on his D1 actions) - Nancy's focused and pointed opening has made me re-think my stance on RC's D1 play.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Lil Uzi Vert
- Null. Need more content. I've had trouble reading Uzi in the past and he hasn't posted nearly enough for me to get any type of real read
Yes, null-zone sounds about right. Best case: he's lurking town with real-life shit right now, unable to solve the game. Worst case: he's scum getting a free-ride, coasting through each day.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Grendel
- null slightly scummy. Grendel doesn't seem to say or do much. There's nothing overtly scummy but I get the impression he's being extra carefull w/ his posts.
Didn't like his start to D1, but everytime he makes an effort (in his catch-up posts), he seems to dispell those fears.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Akarin
- slight scumlean. I feel like alot of her questions directed @ me are designed to get me to scumread Matt and/or townread RC. Agree w/ her vif and rauth reads though.
Wasn't present D1, weirdly not gaining any lean from her D2 posts.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Rautherdir
- scum. Just playing the noob card way too hard. So many LAMIST posts
I suspected he was using the noob card too - but his laboured and late explanations to his reads always seem to clear up the fog he creates. He believes for a fact that RC is a town PR too.
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Vifam
- Scum. Have already posted about how he tried to imply that one of RC/Gerry was scum and then backtracked. The derphammer is self-explanatorily bad.
I WIFOM'd myself out of scum-reading his 'obv-scum' D1 play. I began D2 thinking he was a townie having a nightmare game.
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Post Post #1182 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:48 am

Post by Akarin »

In post 1167, Keyser Söze wrote:Why Rauth?

He called you town/town PR as a fact. Zero paranoia or doubt.
You never responded to RC's question, but where is this coming from?
In post 1038, Keyser Söze wrote:
In post 990, Rautherdir wrote:RC is town PR.
Is that a fact or your belief?

"I think gerryoat/RC is SvT or TvS"

"I think I said I was sure it was TvS/SvT."

"I failed to take into account that Gerry could be a power-role."


Again, why did you NOT like gerry's reaction to RC's roleclaim on D1?
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Post Post #1183 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:49 am

Post by Akarin »

RC, why did you decide to move your vote to Rautherdir when you did, rather than when you unvoted Transcend?
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Post Post #1184 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:53 am

Post by Keyser Söze »

What question?
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Post Post #1185 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:54 am

Post by Akarin »

In post 1170, JarJarDrinks wrote:
In post 1151, Keyser Söze wrote:
In post 1150, JarJarDrinks wrote:UNVOTE:
By way of summary what was the nature of your scum-read of Transcend?
Already kinda answered this
In post 1097, JarJarDrinks wrote:It's a little of both. It's policy cause he's stubbornly refusing to play. But I also think it's scummy because I know he's capable of playing a solid game. If he'd start giving us real content, I'd probably move my vote.
So considering his play was anti-town and I know he's capable of much better, I lean scum on him.

So basically my vote was mainly to attempt to motivate him to start posting real content and if he didn't, I would have been happy to lynch him.

Looks like the replacement is already redeeming the slot w/ a vote on RC.


VOTE: RC
You're not actually answering the question. You weren't policy voting him, but you know he's capable of more, so you have a scum read on him and are voting for him, but didn't really want to lynch him and were just voting him to motivate him and would have moved your vote if he posted more and the replacement is town because they're trying?

That sounds exactly like a policy vote that you don't want to admit is a policy vote.
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Post Post #1186 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 8:56 am

Post by Akarin »

In post 1184, Keyser Söze wrote:What question?
In post 1168, RadiantCowbells wrote:Is this a joke because I can only omgus people?
I know that isn't a serious question but you didn't address what RC was getting at, which is why are you asking that/what do you mean?
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Post Post #1187 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:00 am

Post by Akarin »

In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Akarin
- slight scumlean. I feel like a lot of her questions directed @ me are designed to get me to scumread Matt and/or townread RC. Agree w/ her vif and rauth reads though.
I wasn't trying to get you to scumread Matt. I was pointing out that your reasoning doesn't make sense. You basically logic yourself into having a scumread on Matt, but then don't actually have one, and now are scumreading me for "trying to get you to have a scumread on Matt."

I'm pointing out that by your logic, you already
should
have a scumread on Matt, but you don't, you think Matt is town and RC is scum. And regardless of Matt, who honestly I'm not sure how I feel about,
that
is scummy.

It's not real logic, it's convenient reads and then logic made up to support them.
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Post Post #1188 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:04 am

Post by Akarin »

That said, Nancy's big post on RC is persuasive and she's almost definitely town, so I should probably go back and ISO RC. I'll try to get to that tomorrow I guess, although weekends can be weird for me.
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Post Post #1189 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:06 am

Post by Akarin »

In the meantime
VOTE: JarJarDrinks

I'm still happy with a Vifam or Rautherdir lynch, but I think I'm feeling this more right now.
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Post Post #1190 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:08 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

Whether or not she's town or not doesn't make her right.

I'm not going to be helpful to the town if I'm forced to play defense all the time. If I can't get some space you might as well just lynch me today because I'm not going to get much done at this rate.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #1191 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 9:25 am

Post by Keyser Söze »

In post 1186, Akarin wrote:
In post 1184, Keyser Söze wrote:What question?
In post 1168, RadiantCowbells wrote:Is this a joke because I can only omgus people?
I know that isn't a serious question but you didn't address what RC was getting at, which is why are you asking that/what do you mean?
Yes, it was a joke question because RC can only OMGUS people :lol:


No, it was a serious question. I didn't expect his next vote to be Rauth (perhaps I was naively transferring my own read of Rauth onto RC, and second guessing his read/reaction on Nancy's big post).

RC has now remarked: "Whether or not she's town or not doesn't make her right." (thus, he thinks that slot could be town now: if she's town, it doesn't mean she's right though).

I'd take another angle... playing the Devil's Advocate, the problem is: RC's actions could fit the scum-narrative that Nancy has painted like a glove,
but RC could still be town who did all those anti-town/scummy things!
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Post Post #1192 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:27 am

Post by nancy »

In post 1176, Cooperative Sheep wrote:Do you understand my case now?

I also find you replacing in, looking at the game enough to assess a Vote Count but not looking at it enough to see all the unvotes and the mirror claim to just ring very fake and unlikely.
Which I am now adding to the overall case on your slot.
Much better, thanks. I actually wasn't piling you in with the activity crowd, I just didn't care to hear that side of your arguments, so feel free to feel unmiffed. As for your second point, when you're your fone at your girlfriend's trying to help her get out the door and find a PM from Pine saying you're in deep doodie, you go to the thread and find the latest VC via the activity overview because you're sure as shit not trawling through pages looking for it, then post to confirm and that includes a claim because your slot is at L-1. Didn't read anything, noticed the unvotes after posting. This is such a dumb and cheap thing to fake.

In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Rautherdir
- scum. Just playing the noob card way too hard. So many LAMIST posts.
The slot could newb!scum, but newb!town makes more sense to me because I think scum!Rautherdir would attempt to manufacture more scumreads than he has. The rest could swing either way.

In post 1190, RadiantCowbells wrote:Whether or not she's town or not doesn't make her right.

I'm not going to be helpful to the town if I'm forced to play defense all the time. If I can't get some space you might as well just lynch me today because I'm not going to get much done at this rate.
Enough with the victim card. No one is forcing you to play defense. Town actually tends to perform really well under pressure because they have less and less to lose as they get nearer to being lynched unless they have a juicy role PM. If you want to prove to me that you are Town I want you to find and catch the scumteam. I don't want just one scum, I want the whole fucking team, and we will powerlynch them together if you do. Otherwise, I will continue to consider you an enormous scumlord and I will consider it my honored duty to powerlynch the fuck out of you and leave you dead and burning in the wreckage of your own ego. How's that for motivation?


Gonna browse through Grendel's stuff nao.
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hi meet my mafiascum gravestone, the flowers were probably left by camn or schadd or Prism, blow them kisses for me would you?
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Post Post #1193 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:32 am

Post by Grendel »

Idk why but this game has been weird.

I think that most the players on the roster have dropped a town tell or two at some point. :/

VOTE: Ruath

He really doesn't look like the Ruath of 1765, not very satisfied with any of his responses to me either.
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Post Post #1194 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:36 am

Post by Grendel »

In post 1192, nancy wrote:
In post 1175, JarJarDrinks wrote:
Rautherdir
- scum. Just playing the noob card way too hard. So many LAMIST posts.
The slot could newb!scum, but newb!town makes more sense to me because I think scum!Rautherdir would attempt to manufacture more scumreads than he has. The rest could swing either way.
Are you speaking from experience?

I've always found newbie scum more likely to
not
saturate the thread with lots of scum reads. Or well, demonstrate a hesitancy to generate reads on other players in general.
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Post Post #1195 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 10:38 am

Post by Grendel »

Can anyone with previous experience with Transcend tell me which alignment he prefers playing as?

I promise this is relevant.
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Post Post #1196 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:01 am

Post by Grendel »

In post 896, Grendel wrote:I want to town read Luv. He's kind of reflected some of my unspoken thoughts on the game state thus far this game, and I think that is more likely to come from town then scum.

Hopefully.
Although I like several points LUV has brought up so far this game, I just noticed how little he has actually posted this game. That is bothersome.

I was expecting/hoping for more from him since the above post, but he really has done much. :/
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Post Post #1197 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:08 am

Post by nancy »

In post 1194, Grendel wrote:Are you speaking from experience?

I've always found newbie scum more likely to
not
saturate the thread with lots of scum reads. Or well, demonstrate a hesitancy to generate reads on other players in general.
Indirect experience and the word of experience players, yeah. The idea is that they feel nervous about not having scumreads because it might seem like they aren't scumhunting and therefore aren't Town. Hesitancy to generate reads is for sure a part of it, albeit potentially more just a newbie thing than a newb!scum thing?
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Post Post #1198 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:12 am

Post by RadiantCowbells »

Don't tell me how I'm supposed to react to your crap.
2019 stats: Town WR 76.7%, overall WR 81.667%, 1 scum defeat involving a major mod error in lylo vs 8 scum wins.
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Post Post #1199 (ISO) » Fri Feb 10, 2017 11:16 am

Post by Grendel »

In post 1167, Keyser Söze wrote:Why Rauth?

He called you town/town PR as a fact. Zero paranoia or doubt.
Scum would have less reason to doubt a town power role claiming then town would.

The sureness that Ruath sees RC as a bullet proof town looks scummy to me.
nancy wrote:
In post 1194, Grendel wrote:Are you speaking from experience?

I've always found newbie scum more likely to
not
saturate the thread with lots of scum reads. Or well, demonstrate a hesitancy to generate reads on other players in general.
Indirect experience and the word of experience players, yeah. The idea is that they feel nervous about not having scumreads because it might seem like they aren't scumhunting and therefore aren't Town. Hesitancy to generate reads is for sure a part of it, albeit potentially more just a newbie thing than a newb!scum thing?
Depends, I've played with many newb town that aren't hesitant to display their reads, And fewer newb scum can do the same as newb town there.
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