Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!

[Vifam]

Feels like you rolled in the thread hopped on my wagon and threw on a scumread on Rauth so it didn't look like you weren't just trying to push my lynch along


What were your thoughts on the game before you read my hammer

[Vifam]

I was scumreading you before you hammered. The hammer just seals it.

why were you scumreading me

[Transcend]

VOTE: Akarin

[Akarin]

That's what I was talking about earlier. And I got prodded on Day 1 (after I'd posted saying I'd catch up and post, so that didn't prevent a prod) then I was reading the thread when you hammered it. I was already prodded and reading the thread at that point, why are you saying I just rolled in here now?

[Keyser Söze]

So you're forming a town bloc based on people you think are anti-town?

From my experiences on MS, anti-town does not equal scum.

Are you lazy town or lazy scum?

[Vifam]

why are you saying I just rolled in here now?

what do you mean

[Akarin]

I'm annoyed because I was frantically trying to catch up before you hammered and I was paying attention and trying to get reads. But I don't remember all of that now because I never had a chance to post it.

And if I were scum, why would I come in here now and just jump on some random wagon like you're saying I'm doing? Wouldn't I have had like 3 days to plan out some good way to enter the game and not immediately get suspected?

Your argument doesn't make any sense.

[Akarin]

So you're forming a town bloc based on people you think are anti-town?

From my experiences on MS, anti-town does not equal scum.

Are you lazy town or lazy scum?

My point isn't that anti-town = scum, it's that it seems weird to me that you're assuming anti-town = town.

Those are completely different things.

[Akarin]

And why are you calling me lazy over that?

I didn't mean to not post Day 1. I thought I had plenty of time.

[Vifam]

My wagon really isn't random

If you're scum you have every reason to push my wagon along based on the reasoning that I was so anti-town that I had to be scum, several other people already have

Im sure you can remember why you scumread me before my hammer, you're voting me now so I don't see why you shouldn't be able to atleast tell me how exactly you felt about me prior

[Akarin]

I don't see how I've been wishy washy about Gerry, never said I was interested in lynching him or thought he was scum

[Akarin]

Everyone else already left your wagon.

[Akarin]

Why are you making it out to be that the argument is that your hammer was anti-town. I mean it was, but I never said that's why I'm voting for you.

It was a scummy hammer, not just an anti-town hammer.

And you started by ignoring that and attacking my other read to discredit me, then moved on to saying I was just sheeping what everyone else is doing without having reasons for it.

[mattblackguy]

I may look at mattblackguy first actually:

The fact that Keyser didn't make a vote outside of RVS yet was still active is a little concerning.

Either you did not fully read Day 1 or you are scum.

VOTE: mattblackguy

You can start by deconstructing your read of JarJarDrinks from Day 1 through to Day 2 (from scum-read to town-read)

GO!

Yes I did read day 1 fully. What am I missing? You said you don't think Gerry is scum, and won't join the wagon, but you agree to the lynch for information purposes. Why didn't you instead propose a counterwagon to Gerry's wagon if you thought RC vs Gerry was TvT? I don't see why you think lynching someone you think is town for information purposes is better than lynching someone you think is scum.

Either way I'm not pushing for your lynch today. I stated that it was concerning to me, because it felt off. I'm more focused of Vifam or RC here. Also your townreads on RC, and Vifam are stupid as shit. You're basically saying they're too scummy to be scum. I don't townread people for acting scummy.

Oh and as far as JarJar goes his push on RC is towniest thing I've seen so far on day 2. The tone was genuine, and all his points so far toward RC are valid concerns yet everyone is ignoring him.

[Vifam]

Everyone else already left your wagon.

Yeah that's true, doesn't change the fact that if you're scum you'd have every reason to push on me, literally everyone aside from Uzi, Keysar, JJD and I think Rauth has voted me at some point. It's not like im widely townread by any means so it's not like you're risking anything with a vote on me.

But your reasoning on Rauth is pretty bad I don't really think not remembering your thoughts from D1 is an excuse for that

[Vifam]

You said you had a scumread on me before the hammer, what about my play before then was scummy to you?

[Cooperative Sheep]

I don't really do cases, just reasons:

That's cool, I consider them the same thing

I don't like how he opened today, feels like he should be voting for RC or Keyser.

How come this? (I can understand your other points)

As to why I didn't sheep you on to Transcend is because I don't really have a read on your slot and from what I remember of D1, Transcend didn't come off as scummy.

Do you feel Transcend is town or null?

Wouldn't that just make him a bad/illogical player as opposed to scum?

Exclusive of alignment, it was an illogical progression of opinion-meditation-action. I.e his actions did not complement his perspective.

Correct me if I'm wrong - you created a town read off Vifam due to the play being so terrible as to be unwise for scum to do (which it was).
I would think that getting a scum read off of it is an equally valid opinion (play so terrible it is unwise for town to do - which it was).
At that point, if his logic here is empty, isn't yours equally empty?

Also, could you expand on why you logic Transcend as town? I understood your reasoning on RC and Vifam, but you offered none on Transcend.

Oh and as far as JarJar goes his push on RC is towniest thing I've seen so far on day 2. The tone was genuine, and all his points so far toward RC are valid concerns yet everyone is ignoring him.

I don't think it's fair to say that people are ignoring him. Two of his points are;

1. RC fake claims cop as scum.
2. RC's "fake" claim is countered by the Gerry flip.

I know I and at least one other person addressed #2 noting that it wasn't a direct counter claim in any way.
I know at least one person addressed #1 noting it is within RC's town meta to fakeclaim cop just as much as within his scum meta - making the play maybe bad, but not a good alignment tell.

What other points of JarJar's do you find good that people are ignoring?
What about the above equates to ignoring?
I'll agree that people aren't agreeing with him - is that what you meant to say? If so, what about his concerns do you find valid in the face of the counter arguments offered against it?

[Rautherdir]

VOTE: Akarin

... You know, I'm getting the feeling that you're chainsawing. What does everyone else think about Transcend and Vifam both being scum?

VOTE: Transcend

[Cooperative Sheep]

I'd think it's too early to call teams. I don't have any reason to rule them out as a team - but that's true for a huge swathe of theory teams.

[Vifam]

VOTE: Akarin

... You know, I'm getting the feeling that you're chainsawing. What does everyone else think about Transcend and Vifam both being scum?

VOTE: Transcend

Life is never that simple :'(

[RadiantCowbells]

Mattblackguy was super obvious town in the newbie that I just finished. I quote from my scum PT

MattBlack is a way harder mislynch. Everything that he does pings me as town. When I was catching up before I realized my slot was scum he was my hardest townread.

He called me scum D2 and I had a hell of a time mislynching him for it.
This game he has been really bad. Just sort of flittering around from wagon to wagon addressing people on useless shit.

[RadiantCowbells]

Lol I almost posted in another ongoing game.

Under no circumstances am I going to let Vifam reach endgame but like I have time and I find this wagon more likely to flip scum than anything else at this point.

Transcend is still probably scum as well but I'm much less sure and I feel like if we keep pressure up on him and force him to engage me we'll eventually know for sure.

[mattblackguy]

I understand what you're saying RC. You're going for the mislynch on me, and night kill on JarJar, so you can easily coast to victory.

[RadiantCowbells]

Why would I nightkill JarJar? There's an obvious nightkill in this day phase for RC!Scum and it's not JarJar.

[mattblackguy]

Because JarJar is the only person that will strongly push a lynch on you later in the game.