Mini 1875: Pine's Death Trap Post Game - Town win!
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You're very self aware here. Sort of like, "This is what I'm supposed to be doing, right guys?"In post 114, Rautherdir wrote:I have no idea what is happening but I guess it's RVS so I'll just vote someone.
VOTE: Akarin
You should relax.
Is this your first game here since that newbie I played with you?
Oh cool!...In post 138, Keyser Söze wrote:Welcome Grendel. You're there aren't you? Come play with us.
VOTE: Grendel
what are we playing again?
hmm, Somebody sounds stressed.
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Because you were the leading wagon then you voted a potential counter wagon. It looked to me like you were trying to get some pressure off yourself.
How strong are you early game town hunting skills?In post 116, Transcend wrote:I find trs easier imo
Are they a strong immediate thing, or like a lean that grows over time?- Grendel
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Then you agree that he looked stressed from your pov?In post 159, Alisae wrote:
And that's bad because?In post 157, Grendel wrote:hmm, Somebody sounds stressed.- Grendel
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But if you can't even trust yourself then how am I supposed to trust you? D:In post 124, gerryoat wrote:TR no one. not even yourself
@Alisae
I responded to Matt directly. Please don't make me repeat the song and dance you we were putting me through in the other game where you kept skipping the things I said. Its really annoying.Grendel wrote: Because you were the leading wagon then you voted a potential counter wagon. It looked to me like you were trying to get some pressure off yourself.
B) I was asking if you agreed hence the "?"
C) It could be.
So what do you think of the ppl on your wagon?Rautherdir wrote:
Yup.- Grendel
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Hence why RVS is a largely ineffective way to start a game. Experienced players just don't react badly to RVS pressure.In post 165, mattblackguy wrote:
I guess I can see where you are coming from. I don't really get stressed when I'm at L-2 much less L-4(when I voted you) in RVS. From my POV, I just wanted to try to do something to get the game moving along.In post 161, Grendel wrote:Because you were the leading wagon then you voted a potential counter wagon. It looked to me like you were trying to get some pressure off yourself.
So, have you gotten any interesting observations yet, or are you still waiting for something to happen?
Pre-edit
ugh, pointy things violating my neck reign are like a phobia of mine.
I have a feeling that most these VC's are gonna make me cringe- Grendel
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Floating up in the air like an anvil waiting to humorously smash somebodies skull in.In post 171, Keyser Söze wrote:Happy with my vote on Grendel right now. Call it gut.
I feel like you are sharing highlights for the sake of posting. I don't believe they are genuine concerns / suspicions. Where's your vote right now?- Grendel
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Hey, it get your anti RVS shtick and all, but why did you wait until Matt was wagoned?
I seemed to recall you going off as soon as the votes start coming down in other games.
Why aren't you pushing more people more towards your explicitly-non RVS vote?- Grendel
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I don't understand the purpose of my wagon.
For instance I noticed a lack of "Grendel is scum comments".
That'd suggest that my wagon is supposed to be for pressure. Whats off though is that given that there are other players out that that have garnered actual suspicion my wagon just seems like... an excuse? The very same people on my wagon have proclaimed other players as scummy, but opted to pressure vote me instead. So, why are ppl so afraid to vote their scum reads?
I seem to recall Kiser being the only one actually suspicious of my slot. I don't recall the same for the rest. :/
Not to mention that there has been zero resistance to my wagon.- Grendel
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Gives piece meal statements about Gerry being a good wagon then votes Grendel b/c, " lol, Its my flavor"In post 412, Cooperative Sheep wrote:
Why do you not want to lynch Gerry? He seems a perfectly fine lynch option.In post 407, Vifam wrote:If I had to put money on it Id say RC is town, I dont wanna lynch Gerry or RC today tho
I don't really see the Keyser love, but neither do I have an issue with the play from that slot so...I kinda tend to expect him to be town and at least one of the fanboi's to be scum sheeping him.
I see RC as town.
I'd be happy to lynch Gerry.
I also am not overly fond of Alisae or Vifam and would consider them secondary scum reads at this stage.
I don't share the Rauth dislike, he's a clear newb so pointing out a newbtown or newbscum issue with him is a bit like telling me grass is green. IIoA ahoy!
In the spirit of the purpose of this alt;
Vote: Grendel
Has a null read on Keyser. Which means that Sheep is sheeping a null read, while ignoring a wagon started by a town read (RC) on a slot he thinks is a good lynch (Gerry).
Huh.- Grendel
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I take up the position that the game state needs.In post 443, gerryoat wrote:Key is town. Grendel is at like L-1 i think lol. I mean i think he's different rn compared to his town game, but give him time to respond at least we are only 18 pages in
In games with an unproductive roster I'm much more aggressive. In games with hyper posters I'm more laid back.
Plus I was too tired the other day to do one of my elaborate opening posts w/ reaction test.
My play here has been very different from 1830, and I'm honestly surprised you haven't been pushing that point harder if you were truly scum reading me.- Grendel
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Sheep's vote was the turning point for my wagon's pick up.In post 520, Vifam wrote:It is alarming how fast your wagon popped up, I didn't even realize you were at L1
Yay/Nay?- Grendel
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You felt like sheeping 17 pages into the game but didn't feel like it at that start.In post 518, Vifam wrote:Tbh I just voted for you cuz I felt like sheeping
Why?- Grendel
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I really dislike how they keep batting about their potential scum reads, meanwhile voting somebody who isn't even mentioned as a tertiary scum read.In post 502, Cooperative Sheep wrote:The above within the concept that Gerry is scum, naturally.
It doesn't make any sense.- Grendel
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In post 397, JarJarDrinks wrote:Grendel kinda hit on it in 157. It's very LAMIST. Like you're making sure the town knows that you're just doing what townies are supposed to do.fyi I hate it when ppl scratch my chin while still being perfectly happy to vote me.
Its a conflict of tone, and makes your original thoughts look like artificial attempts at buddying from my pov
Enlighten me behind the genius of Coopsheep's opening.In post 417, JarJarDrinks wrote:great opening post from coopsheep- Grendel
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Gee thanks,In post 526, gerryoat wrote:
Well, it's because RC has been acting like a manbaby. I did point out that your game was different, but how do you expect me to scumread you very hard. I wanted to give you more timeIn post 521, Grendel wrote:
I take up the position that the game state needs.In post 443, gerryoat wrote:Key is town. Grendel is at like L-1 i think lol. I mean i think he's different rn compared to his town game, but give him time to respond at least we are only 18 pages in
In games with an unproductive roster I'm much more aggressive. In games with hyper posters I'm more laid back.
Plus I was too tired the other day to do one of my elaborate opening posts w/ reaction test.
My play here has been very different from 1830, and I'm honestly surprised you haven't been pushing that point harder if you were truly scum reading me.
for being so uncharacteristically chivalrous towards your 2nd highest scum read.
Its probably a good idea to read the game before you vote. Seems somebody of your experience would know that.Vifam wrote:
I thought him and jarjar were the only ones voting youIn post 522, Grendel wrote:
Sheep's vote was the turning point for my wagon's pick up.In post 520, Vifam wrote:It is alarming how fast your wagon popped up, I didn't even realize you were at L1
Yay/Nay?
You think that jar jar is town yea? What did you think of sheep?
Was this a spoken read transition?Vifam wrote:
I figured Rau was town by then and just wanted to apply pressure somewhere elseIn post 523, Grendel wrote:
You felt like sheeping 17 pages into the game but didn't feel like it at that start.In post 518, Vifam wrote:Tbh I just voted for you cuz I felt like sheeping
Why?
If it was I don't recall it.
PRE-EDIT
Oh, This wasn't what I expected.
GErry on Viafam, and Viafam on JArjar- Grendel
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idk I just feel like you are tip toeing around me rn.In post 541, gerryoat wrote:
it's only ~20 pages in? I'm not gonna wanna quick lynch someone over first brush readsIn post 539, Grendel wrote:Gee thanks,
for being so uncharacteristically chivalrous towards your 2nd highest scum read.
I know you're capable of being agro as either alignment, and appeasing as either alignment, but something feels wrong here.- Grendel
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Is there a specific reason, or is it gut?In post 540, Vifam wrote:I think sheep is town- Grendel
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@Keyser
I don't see how the above points would be hard for scum to come to a conclusion too. I don't see the above points putting him in a position that would be sub optimal for scum.In post 429, Cooperative Sheep wrote:
For me the logic breaks down something like this;In post 428, Rautherdir wrote:That's the reason I'm reading over the game again. I don't know how to handle a claim like that, I'm trying to figure out if I should trust RC's claim or not.
1. RC is lying and plans to admit it - that makes the action a reaction test, and alignment neutral, I tend to analyze the claimed reaction scumhunting afterwards.
2. RC is lying and does not plan to admit it - that would make RC scum and a bad player, or just a bad player. I, personally, don't think RC is a bad player.
3. RC is telling the truth, or at least some variant of it - that would make RC town, or that would make RC a scum PR who is accepting on Day 1 that they are not really planning to make it till lylo with their team.
I see option 2 as highly unlikely.
Option 1 should be treated like option 3 until RC plans to reveal - so option 1 is meaningless.
Option 3 tends o suggest that the best move is to not lynch RC, and analyze again tomorrow with more info.
Until I get some other info, I'm going with Option 3 and presuming town.
What are your thoughts on my breakdown and does it differ from your thoughts?
The ability to form a logical argument doesn't equate to town.
What did you see here that standed out as, "Oh this sounds like something town would say", to you?- Grendel
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tbh there are a lot of players I might need to look at. LIke I haven't checked out most of my null reads.
Keyser Söze, RadiantCowbells,Alisae, mattblackguy,Rautherdir, Lil Uzi Vert, Akarin, JarJarDrinks, Transcend,Vifam, Cooperative Sheep,gerryoat
I can elaborate on most my reads per request.
Right now I'm feeling like calling it a night on my end.- Grendel
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I think he is saying that because if scum had a role cop who copped RC then they know that RC was a power role.In post 724, mattblackguy wrote:
why do you say scum might have a rolecop?In post 723, RadiantCowbells wrote:I think Transcend might be scum and that scum might have a role cop.
Which would make sense given that Trans is defending RC while simultaneously dismissing him.
@RC
That's what you're saying right?- Grendel
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@Keyser
I'd like to hear some of your conclusions.In post 661, Keyser Söze wrote:Even though I won't be joining the wagon I must admit it is the optimum info lynch based on the interactions so far this game.
No early hammer gentlemen.
You seemed to have some thoughts pending the flip.- Grendel
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...In post 766, Rautherdir wrote:Posting to say a few things:
I can't access a computer right now.
Gerry's reaction to RC's claim now makes sense.
I also now believe RC is town.
Transcend, Vifam, you didn't even let Akarin post. I mean seriously, you could have at least waited a day or so at L-1 to get a claim from Gerry.
I'm narrowing down my lynch pool to Transcend and Vifam today, barring an extremely good argument for lynching RC.
Would a Scum!Ruath be so ballzy as to utilize the strategy a scum Grendel employed in his last game with Ruath?- Grendel
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Why are you suspicious of Keyser?In post 753, Transcend wrote:Now taking out my townreads/leans
1 in:
Akarin
Rautherdir
2 in:
Cooperative Sheep
Keyser Soze
Vifam- Grendel
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This is old now but I still feel it merits a response.
In post 586, Cooperative Sheep wrote:
I can see the Grendel wagon faltering, I tend to feel it's faltering due to his burst of activity, which doesn't fully appease me as I'd like to see him respond to some of my thoughts, and it really was just a quick burst of activity rather than a quick burst of town seeming activity. All he did was pretty much attack the people attacking him, which is alignment null in my opinion, so I'm quite content to leave my own vote there and see if/how he responds to my questions.Spoiler:
I’m not sure where a stand on you, currently. I can’t help but feel that you have been manipulative. That behind your woolly façade there is some real scum intent. But my biggest reason for suspecting you is defunct with Gerry flipping town. Right now I can’t find enough to substantiate my gut feeling. I don't know if that means you are town, or if there is something I’m missing.- Grendel
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Ill answer this too
My initial reasons were that he shut down the Mattblk wagon along with Viafam. He also discouraged people from developing early town reads, which is a scum tell on my home site.In post 591, JarJarDrinks wrote:
What do you mean by "already" ? Like you suspected him before RC started to push him? If so, what were u suspicious about?In post 514, Grendel wrote:I'm probably voting Gerry since I already had a mild suspicion on his slot.
I wanted to engage him and matt, before i voted, becuase i didn’t consider the above reasons to be enough for a serious vote.
Later i thought he was scum because of how he was handling my slot. I thought that he would be pushing me harder as town then he was, as well as how quickly he came to the conclusion i was town. It felt rushed and unnatural when i was a scum read of his for most the game.- Grendel
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@ALL
I forgot to mention this earlier, but my posting habits are sparser Mon/Thes/Weds/Thursday. I only have about two hours of time I can allot to mafia on those days.
I can post much more Friday, and Saturday. Sundays are iffy.
If a bunch of pages spawn in an 24 hour period during the week I won't be doing much outside of catch up duty.
PSA over
Pre EDIT
@Transend
Quote and elaborate on them plz- Grendel
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I think that if the wagon was started by a scum Keyser/MattBlk (they wouldn't both be scum) it wouldn't have taken off. Mianly because there was little evidence to be pitted against me, and town would have noticed that. Thus those two are more likely town then scum.In post 743, Transcend wrote:Grendel wagon yesterday sucked and it contained {Keyser, matt, Sheep, JarJar, Vifam}
I bet at least 2 scum were here.
Sheep's vote was what jump started the wagon. JarJar sheeped sheep. Viafam is easily the worst because they weren't paying attention/didn't really care.
Yours wasn't much better then theirs if I recall correctly.- Grendel
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If you're hesitant to lynch a scum read then maybe your subcounous is saying that they aren't scum yea?In post 777, Transcend wrote:I don't really want to, he's probably the person I'd run up last in that pool.- Grendel
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@RCIn post 804, Grendel wrote:Hmm,
you disagree with that point spefically, or is there something else you are looking at?- Grendel
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ehh, I decided to start off subtle this game with my interactions, in hopes of catching my suspects off guard. I had no idea that the next time I get the opportunity to talk it'd be like fifteen pages later with Gerry getting heavily scrutinized.In post 814, Cooperative Sheep wrote:
You didn't make those stances clear at the time, and the vote did look survivalistic to me. Clearly you'd disagree, but from someone splitting hairs about "how townie did Sheep really state Keyser" as a basis to suspect me - I'm curious why you wanted me to presume things you didn't even remotely imply. Double standard?In post 773, Grendel wrote:I was originally interested in Gerry before RC vs Gerry occurred. I generally like to have open reasoning out for critiques before voting. Saying that i voted my counter wagon, _just_ because it was my counter wagon is unfair. Also people had reservations about Gerry, and i probably could have done as well pushing Ruath instead.
I think now that I pointed it out it should be clear that I was suspecting Gerry early with my posts, You disagree?
I guess there isn't much else to say here other then I really think you were making it out to be more of a read then it was.
Your previous issue with me was that I didn't sheep a town read but sheeped someone I didn't town read.In post 773, Grendel wrote:Prefacing it with “I Don’t get the strong town reads”, along with the usage of both “Kinda tend”, made me think the “town read” was weak enough to assume that he was null. You hamming it up to be a strong town read looks like an exaggeration. Did you go on to reference Seyser as more then kinda sorta town read before I made the above posts?
Now that you're aware I at least stated Keyser as my second strongest town read - your issue is that I didn't sheep a potentially stronger town read. You also made up that I called it a strong town read, i just said I town read him - which my words support.
Goal posts, they be a movin'.
But in fairness I can't really attack you for it, as he was a town read for you in some facet.
I'm saying that Your vote came at a pivotal moment where Gerry was under pressure, and it looked like you were directing pressure onto me. Granted this point doesn't apply since Gerry it flipped now.
Why do you think scum would hop onto the wagon opportunistically *before* it hit a tipping point? To be opportunistic doesn't the hop have to be after the tipping point?In post 773, Grendel wrote:Well you were in my scum reads weren’t you?
I feel like you're trying to do more to prove me dumb rather then prove me scum. If that makes sense.
Why?In post 773, Grendel wrote:I’m not sure where a stand on you, currently. I can’t help but feel that you have been manipulative.
I have literally not acheived any of my stated lynch goals yet in this game - what am I manipulating? Unless I manipulated you into voting Gerry somehow...?- Grendel
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In post 806, Vifam wrote:When did I make an emotional appealIn post 786, Vifam wrote:
Honestly I think my reads are just probably shit and I fucked up tbhIn post 739, Cooperative Sheep wrote:Fear of Doc or a status quo kill would be my working theory.
What's yours?
These looked like emotional appeals while I was reading. I couldn't tell if the frusteration was town or not though.In post 787, Vifam wrote:This is the first time I genuinely feel like I fucked things up in a game Im actually kind of annoyed with myself now that Im actually dealing with this in D2- Grendel
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The second point is just straight bad, b/c to acknowledge that you would do "x", or "y" as scum rather then "z" means that you are self aware enough to do just that to subvert what you'd do as scum.In post 856, Akarin wrote:I'm annoyed because I was frantically trying to catch up before you hammered and I was paying attention and trying to get reads. But I don't remember all of that now because I never had a chance to post it.
And if I were scum, why would I come in here now and just jump on some random wagon like you're saying I'm doing? Wouldn't I have had like 3 days to plan out some good way to enter the game and not immediately get suspected?
Your argument doesn't make any sense.
The only instance I'd buy that is if what a player did really _would_ hurt their chances to win as scum, or if somebody else came to that conclusion.
Posting earlier then you'd perceive scum!you doing is not that.- Grendel
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What were your thoughts on a Scum!Viafam before the hammer?In post 849, Akarin wrote:I was scumreading you before you hammered. The hammer just seals it.- Grendel
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Weren't you town reading RC earlier?In post 872, mattblackguy wrote:I understand what you're saying RC. You're going for the mislynch on me, and night kill on JarJar, so you can easily coast to victory.
It seems like you went into D2 town reading him.
When did that change?- Grendel
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In post 559, mattblackguy wrote:
{Alisae,Grendel}
{RC,Keyser,Sheep}
{Vifam}
{Gerry,JarJar}
I'm fine with a Gerry lynch today, but I don't think 464 should ever come from any non-newbie town player.
VOTE: JarJar
Why were you town reading me?In post 578, mattblackguy wrote:Which is why I'm more confident on my read of you and Grendel than a few others.
I usually remember when someone town reads me, but for some reason seeing this surprised me.
Also your Jar jar read. You seemed sure he was scum yesterday, but now its like he is the shining hero who is defeating evil RC for you. Like you reads coming into today seem to have flipped completely.
Like why is RC scum instead of town but wrong?- Grendel
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Explain this beyond, "He still had his RVS vote out"In post 793, mattblackguy wrote:Why is Keyser a strong townread? I can see him as scum.
Surly there is more to this read then that alone.- Grendel
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@Keyser
I think one of the things that concerns me about Viafam that keeps me coming back is that anti town behavior has been slowly creeping into site meta. At least from other games I've played in.
I don't feel comfortable dismissing somebody as town for blatant anti-town behavior anymore.
At the moment I think that their self oriented frustration was town looking...
I do think most this points have ground. Especially the ones I bolded.In post 810, Keyser Söze wrote:Vifam
Vifam's scummy/anti-town actions made me sick to the core. I wanted Lucille to kiss his skull with her barbed-wire teeth.
Scum do not play like that. I bet the majority of players right now would consider a Vifam policy-lynch as a pro-town move.
As scum you must set yourself up for the long game. If you're going to bury yourself you at least make sure your scum partner is the one who drives the dagger into your back.
In this scenario, everyone has justifiable reason to lynch Vifam.
There is no scum-gain.
No one can win any town-points from his lynch.
Was his purpose only to kill 1 townie for 1 scum?
He wasn't even a mass-scum read so he could have just continued his low-key trajectory and stayed off the grid.
Now he's put a target on his head (inviting both day and night attention).
I didn't like the move on Vifam by mattblk.
What else... I guess that's all.
preedit
Hello RC, and Viafam.
It was weird having the thread to myself almost the whole evening.- Grendel
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I'm not very sure. I played with him once as town!Ruath and he seemed much more engaged, and invested in interacting with others.In post 916, Vifam wrote:Nah I think Rauth is town still
THis game he comes across as much more guarded, and self centered.
Are you one of those ppl that form all their reads based off personal tells.Transcend wrote:Because i think he's town
I don't articulate myself very well
Sorry
Its hard working with ppl like that you kno?- Grendel
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Personal tell= a tell you made upIn post 930, Transcend wrote:I don't know what personal tells are but basically i read people's thought processes and attempt to decide if it's genuine or fake.
I meant like when a player has a read that they don't explain because they fear explaining it will make it less effective in future.
You seemed like that kind of player tbh
Personally I didn't like the shift of his reads going into today, and the short unexplained piecemeal reads. They seemed arbitrary due to the lack of follow up on his part, and how defensive he was when getting called out. Namely Matts view on Kesyer comes to mind.Transcend wrote:Sorta
What's the case on matt tho
I also didn't see a reason to town read him beyond where he sat on my wagon D1.
I had some pending thoughts, but wanted to engage him a bit first.- Grendel
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I got overloaded with illustration/graphic design projects for school this week.In post 1014, Pine wrote:Four people are coming up on prods in the next eight hour. Let's not slack our activity, folks!
I'm gonna beV/la until the 9th of February.
V/LA noted- Grendel
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I suspected Gerry, and Mattblk that was all.In post 982, Cooperative Sheep wrote:
Yeah, I do. You offered some general stabs at him in a soft/jokey manner. You did the same to many other people - if you suspected him at best I would be able to create a list of about five or six names you suspected equally. The vote did feel out of nowhere and without support.In post 883, Grendel wrote:I think now that I pointed it out it should be clear that I was suspecting Gerry early with my posts, You disagree?
I questioned Transcend to know how seriously to take his early town reads. Because he was dropping a lot of town reads. If he is a player that takes those reads seriously then I'd have that down in my notes for future ref.
I engaged Ruath, and Alisae due to both of them having presence in other recent games I was in. I also responded to Keyser with a snarky comment b/c I didn't appreciate his assertion that I wasn't raising legit points.
[/quote]
No, I'm not with you on that - I just asked why you think I'm manipulative. Do you feel I'm trying to manipulate you/make you look dumb by asking why you think I'm manipulative? I think when you make the accusation you ought to be able to talk about it to some degree - or at least tell me it's just a gut vibe or something.In post 883, Grendel wrote:
I feel like you're trying to do more to prove me dumb rather then prove me scum. If that makes sense.
Why?In post 773, Grendel wrote:I’m not sure where a stand on you, currently. I can’t help but feel that you have been manipulative.
I have literally not acheived any of my stated lynch goals yet in this game - what am I manipulating? Unless I manipulated you into voting Gerry somehow...?
Still owe 38+
Manipulative wasn't the correct word. I was trying to nail down what was bugging me, and I think it is that you are more interested in proving me wrong then proving I'm scum. The later is a reassessment of the first.
I'd sum it up as a gut feeling. I could be wrong, as is the risk of listening to the heart. Eventually when I have time I'll look for examples in our past exchanges. Maybe I can better explain it then.
What is 38+?- Grendel
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Idk, you don't have to be expressly active to be open with your reads, and thought processes.In post 967, Rautherdir wrote:
And Grendel, last game I ended up basically being confirmed town day 2. I was also making a complex move to try and catch scum off guard which required me to keep active.
reads like these for example:
You were releasing reads on every slot on the roster in the last game throughout D1.In post 990, Rautherdir wrote:Reads!
Transcend is scum.
Vifam is null/scum.
LUV is null/slight scum.
Akarin is null.
Keyser is null.
Matt is null.
I(Rautherdir) am not reading myself.
JJD is null.
Grendel is null/slight town.
CoopSheep is null/town.
RC is town PR.
Night Kill Analysis
I don't know about everyone else, but I personally thought Alisae was scum when Night 1 started. The only conclusion I can draw is that scum were trying to find and kill other town PRs.
Matt's wagon. I never really understood how it happened, but after a lookover I came to the conclusion that its possible that he is scum, but I don't see it as likely.
I'm pretty sure that this is the first time you've done it this game. As short as yesterday was... you didn't seem that into sorting the rest of the roster.- Grendel
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Well, do you plan out things that well in advance as scum? Why not plan things out in advance as town too?In post 998, Akarin wrote:
That's not at all what I said. I wasn't saying I posted earlier than I would have as scum, I'm saying that if my reasoning is so poorly thought out that it's going to immediately get a wagon on me, why wouldn't I have run that by my scumbuddies during the night instead of coming in with what Vifam is claiming is both poor, lazy reasoning and a plot to get her lynched.In post 885, Grendel wrote:
The second point is just straight bad, b/c to acknowledge that you would do "x", or "y" as scum rather then "z" means that you are self aware enough to do just that to subvert what you'd do as scum.In post 856, Akarin wrote:I'm annoyed because I was frantically trying to catch up before you hammered and I was paying attention and trying to get reads. But I don't remember all of that now because I never had a chance to post it.
And if I were scum, why would I come in here now and just jump on some random wagon like you're saying I'm doing? Wouldn't I have had like 3 days to plan out some good way to enter the game and not immediately get suspected?
Your argument doesn't make any sense.
The only instance I'd buy that is if what a player did really _would_ hurt their chances to win as scum, or if somebody else came to that conclusion.
Posting earlier then you'd perceive scum!you doing is not that.
"You'd have known that as town you would come in here and vote for Vifam in such a way that people would want to vote for you, so you did that as scum," isn't very good reasoning. Especially considering the only person I've played with before in this game is Alisae and they're dead.
You're basically throwing shade on your own argument here. Saying that what you said/pushed is too ill-informed, not planed, for scum to do it seems to fall exactly into what I was originally saying. In that you seem perfectly aware that it isn't a great play for scum, therefore you could do it with that intention. So I don't really see pushing Viafam when scum wouldn't push thembecause planningas a convincing argument.
Um, pretty sure this wasn't what I was saying. I'm refer more to the idea that you wouldn't enter that day x or y way as scum, rends the assertion null. It doesn't mean that you were doing something that you knew would blow up, you might not have expected the reaction you got at all."You'd have known that as town you would come in here and vote for Vifam in such a way that people would want to vote for you, so you did that as scum," isn't very good reasoning. - Grendel
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