WWE Mafia - RAW (OFF TELEVISION)

[MathBlade]

Vote malpa

Malpa is town stop that.

[MathBlade]

I don't think the vifam shot had anything to do with his reads. We were treating him as confirmed town.

No, the flips didn't change anything for me. Lil was a PoE scum read at most for me. Him flipping town doesn't mean much. If anything, it means there was probably scum on the wagon, but malpa is there along with anyone else that could be scum (mathblade being the only one off the wagon who could be scum) so nothing really changes there either. And Vifam being town is something we pretty much all could have predicted. So, again, I don't have any new info today and can't really think of a reason to change what I'm doing which is voting malpa and thinking the other scum has to be in math/columbo because mcmenno is a stronger town read than them, you (almost) are a stronger town read than that, and pep is definitely town.

...Malpa is not getting lynched ever. I will die before Malpa.

[MathBlade]

Is Kmd the third scum and scum set up two wagons to just wait on a townie to vote?

[MathBlade]

So that means Pep not conf scum in that case

Only A50/Kmd/one of McMenno/Pep

Mal thoughts?

[Kmd4390]

So Almost and Pep are confirmed scum.
3 scum each team makes sense.
Probably LyLO and Almost50 had to likely discharge gladiator before LyLO.

The fact this game isn't over makes Pep scum.

Now to find the third.

So you're claiming two guilties?

Preview edit: lol wow

[MathBlade]

So Almost and Pep are confirmed scum.
3 scum each team makes sense.
Probably LyLO and Almost50 had to likely discharge gladiator before LyLO.

The fact this game isn't over makes Pep scum.

Now to find the third.

So you're claiming two guilties?

Preview edit: lol wow

No I am not claiming guilties.

I am saying the game isn't over yet so something fishy.

And with 4 scum there on the other side means three here why is anyone voting?!?!?!?!?!

[Kmd4390]

So nobody is confirmed. k.

It doesn't make sense for there to be 3 scum. What makes sense is that the other side started with three, recruited 1 from here making four, so we started at 3 and now have 2. Sure 3 is possible but very doubtful.

But I'll:

Unvote

If it makes you feel better.

[malpascp]

Balance-wise it makes no sense there's more than 2 scum here, but it's still possible we're in LyLo. I don't think so though.
I'm not voting Math or A50 today unless there's a guilty or something.
I'm stil trying to wrap my head around the fact people still TR McMenno.
Vifam's death was expected, but I think scum!Math wouldn't have done it for some reason. Still trying to figure out what Lil's flip might mean.

For now just don't throw around meaningless votes plz

[McMenno]

I'm stil trying to wrap my head around the fact people still TR McMenno.

yeah me too

getting some paranoia from AC after that luv townflip... gladiator that doesn't include yourself though? will have to think about it

[Kmd4390]

Balance-wise it makes no sense there's more than 2 scum here, but it's still possible we're in LyLo. I don't think so though.
I'm not voting Math or A50 today unless there's a guilty or something.
I'm stil trying to wrap my head around the fact people still TR McMenno.
Vifam's death was expected, but

I think scum!Math wouldn't have done it for some reason.

Still trying to figure out what Lil's flip might mean.

For now just don't throw around meaningless votes plz

The part that I bolded feels weird to me.

[MathBlade]

Balance-wise it makes no sense there's more than 2 scum here, but it's still possible we're in LyLo. I don't think so though.
I'm not voting Math or A50 today unless there's a guilty or something.
I'm stil trying to wrap my head around the fact people still TR McMenno.
Vifam's death was expected, but I think scum!Math wouldn't have done it for some reason. Still trying to figure out what Lil's flip might mean.

For now just don't throw around meaningless votes plz

Top scum and Town reads please and level of confidence.

[KuroiXHF]

Almost, Chara backed out so you're by yourself. Please use your main account and not the hydra.

[MathBlade]

@mod please fix the title. Thanks.

[malpascp]

gladiator that doesn't include yourself though? will have to think about it

According to massive's role PM it's a "Modified Gladiator".

@Math: You're a confirmed dayvig and keep throwing around nonsensical reads with absolute confidence in them. So you're my top townread.

I can't decide whether to lynch Pep or McMenno. Pep reeks of newbscum while McMenno managed to lurk his way into Day 4. Though I'm pretty sure they're not scumpartners.

I think at this point everyone should be stating who they intend to vote? Even though I'm pretty damn sure this isn't LyLo.

[Kmd4390]

Let's try a different approach then

Hey malpa, why wouldn't math have killed vifam?

[Almost50]

3 scum each team makes sense.
Probably LyLO and Almost50 had to likely discharge gladiator before LyLO.

1- Can't be LyLo if it IS 3 Scum per brand at the start of the game. Both my drafts flipped Town and Leon was drafted the other way.

2- You're still not reading.

The fact this game isn't over makes Pep scum.

3- Regardless of how PoE works for you, I can't comprehend this line of thought.

But let's keep it simple. Math thinks the Scum duo is in A50+Pep.

“Trying to make some sense, when there's no sense at all” – Ice House

@Kmd:

Thanks for the readlist. I was thinking if Vifam had bad reads and was given the leadership he might've been more beneficial to Scum alive.

Which reminds me:

Also I don't recall you being nominated "town leader" or whatever.

It wasn't a democratic process per se, seeing as I was APPOINTED General Manager by Mr McMahon, and given the tools to have some control. My role coupled with the fact I was the one behind TWO mislynches made me think not only that I was the leader in this game, but a VERY BAD one too. I'm never going to assume leadership in my future games unless I do have INFOrather than reads and analysis.

getting some paranoia from AC after that luv townflip... gladiator that doesn't include yourself though? will have to think about it

I mean, I kind of KNOW my own alignment, but fair point none-the-less.

[Almost50]

Now that I've had another look at the flipped roles, I see the Masons had 2 Vigs, but I will say that this is as strong as the 1 Vig shot of Math and not more bc theirs was conditional.

SD also had a Hated modifier (Tywin) which was probably balanced by the Loved modifier on Creature. Tywin was also immune to the first submission.

Vifam was the only true VT starting in SD it seems, and KT could've been considered a self-negating role (Insane Doctor).

That leaves us with Gamma (who had a 1-shot ability of switching brands at will), and DS' "subtle move". That's how strong the Town team on SD was (and I'm leaving out massive for now).

Now what did WE have? Nero was a neighbourizer, while Penguinos, Narna, Dodge & LUV all flipped VTs.

This made me consider the possibility of us starting with only TWO scumsters not 3, but then I realized this might've been the reason why Gamma's role was included. He probably could have switched brands at will had he been given the time to do it, and that WOULD have balanced things up here against a starting 3-person Scum team, so I still think we have 2 Scums alive in here.

[Almost50]

Also, Scum had a Role Cop (Titus) starting in SD, while our flipped Scumster; Leon was a BODYGUARD!! (I fail to see what good a BG is for Scum anyway, and it add more to my confusion that all Town Vig abilities are DAY Vigs).

Now for my rads:

Let's set Math aside for now. I'm now 95% sure this is Town!Math. The 5% is reserved in case they've learned to copy their Town play as Scum, which is possible but not likely.

Kmd is now making the better arguments/case regardless of how convinced I am personally. His reasoning is fine, and he does strike me as a reasonable Scum-hunter.

Not as confident about McMenno, but it still looks like Town!Menno to me. Not that I have played with Scum!Menno before (please remind me if I did, mate).

Mal is a mixed read for me. He has some good points and then he has some that look bad to me. But I can understand how someone can think something but is unable to phrase it in a way that looks sound.

This leaves me with both Pep and Columbo and while I cannot actually make a solid case against either (nor am I willing to, seeing as how both my previous attempts lead to bad lynches); I also cannot Town case either of them.

I'll wait for them both to post before I make up my mind.

[McMenno]

wakegame

[Almost50]

wakegame

Really? I don't even remember you playing in that one.

OK, I'll have a look soon to try and better my read on you. Thanks for the tip.

[malpascp]

Let's try a different approach then

Hey malpa, why wouldn't math have killed vifam?

Because killing confirmed town actually makes sense as scum.

[MathBlade]

....1) My town and scum metas are very similar.
Look at Shadowrun and 1800.
Arguing that I cannot replicate my meta is meant to be a backhanded insult meaning
Math is so crazy there's no way they are scum is the point

This means that regardless of my alignment you think I am a player that should not be listened to.
Stop it. Improve.
Anyone could be right or wrong at any point.
Granted I am Town but the arguments as to why I am Town are not based on what I have done or said but "lack of sense".
In Shadowrun literally ran the only workable kill chain and did every night kill in a mafia game that was practically night less.

2) Almost50 makes sense for scum to have that power. If they can gladiate me or what I suspect is the other town PR out then it greatly hampers the ability of Town. Hell of Almost50 had bussed there I probably would have thought he was Town and Almost50 probably could have won. His "oops hasty" feels bad because he really wanted me lynched versus actually believing I am scum.

Yesterday was a big OMGUS.

[Kmd4390]

Except if scum if math?

Preview edit: that was to malpa

[malpascp]

Math wouldn't go for the obvious kill in his situation, that's what I feel. He would go for someone who had a stronger read on him than Vifam did, be it a town or a scum read.

@Math: don't take it as an insult, your playstyle might come handy sometimes but i think you think a bit *too much* outside-the-box.

[Almost50]

Almost50 makes sense for scum to have that power.

Yes, that's true. I thus suspect massive might be scum, so let's lynch him.

It also doesn't make sense the Masons have a Town Vig, so they must be scum. let's lynch them.

Also also, It must've been LyLo yesterday, and it still is LyLo today despite the fact we lost 2 Town players.

Also also also, It made sense to have started with 7-8 scum in total, yet it makes sense that we only had 3 here at the start, yet there are still 3 here despite the fact one was drafted out and none have been drafted in and they have all flipped already. Yes, 3-1=3 and 3+3=8.

And the most stunning logic of all is I want Math dead, yet I've been picking on players who have been Town reading me HARD. *Thumbs Up*

Keep it up. You're doing great already. Even I got convinced and am now contemplating on lynching myself because I suspect I could be scum.

@Everybody else:

Still not voting until we hear from Pep and Columbus. I think we really need to take a different approach here. I probably have a Scumster in my Town reads, so I need to step back and look at the greater picture, plus listen to all views and reevaluate.