Open 671: Greater Idea - OVER

[Spade_Ace]

Hey!!!

Parrot role looked really interesting. Why would you discard that?

Am confident that if I reveal the role that I 'kept', the impact of that on the game would be zero.

[Spade_Ace]

Nope. My role isn't less powerful. The revelation has zero impact.

It's a single word. The first part has something to do with where cowboys are found in movies. The second part has something to do with my profile pic.

[Spade_Ace]

Hey Charloux. Nice to see you again.

@grey I don't think it was shitty. I like being surprised.

My choice was pretty Wild....
.
.
.
wait for it.
.
.
.
... card.
It was wildcard. The only role whose revealation has zero impact.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey go read wiki.

VOTE: Grey

For fake scumhunting.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey read Wikki.

Wild Card (No alignment. After discards are revealed, discard the Wild Card and draw one new role which you must keep)

Yeah two words. My bad.

[Spade_Ace]

I didn't understand. Can you explain. I discarded 'alien prober'. Kept 'wildcard'.

[Spade_Ace]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

[Spade_Ace]

Ohh for heaven's sake. Don't be so stupid. I said the role I 'kept'. Go read my msgs you dumbfucks. Where the hell did I say my current role is wildcard.

[Spade_Ace]

Hey!!!

Parrot role looked really interesting. Why would you discard that?

Am

confident that if I reveal the role that I 'kept',

the impact of that on the game would be zero.

[Spade_Ace]

Yeah I made a mistake with the word. True.

I'll explain again what happened. And hope you can comprehend it.
I discarded alien prober. Kept wildcard. Received new role once game starts. Where the hell is the confusion in this?

[Spade_Ace]

You nincompoop.

I don't get to choose the role. The new role is randomly to me. Ask the mod whether a player 'keeps' the wildcard or whether he "uses" then. The player KEEPS it and is later assigned the new role.

Aaaah. The game just started and am already pissed off.

[Spade_Ace]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

@grey and vaxkiller I dare you both to get me lynched today.

[Spade_Ace]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

Ignore the above quote.it was the wrong one. In a place with bad connectivity.
1. Yes I ' received'.
2. I never claimed wildcard. It was the role I 'kept' when asked by mod to choose either alien prober or wildcard.
3. I received a new role.

Again I dare you both to try and get me lynched today

[Spade_Ace]

There seems to be some issue with posting. I keep quoting the post . Please ignore it.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey if you are town by any chance. Please Ask the mod please clearly about how wildcard functions. I am tired of replying again and again. The new role I receive from the mod is not a role that is discarded by anyone. I have no say in this matter. Am just given a new role.

Also try to understand what am conveying when I say, 'i dare you to get me lynched today'.

If you still dont understand, you are a goddamn scum

[Spade_Ace]

I think i understand your confusion now. Sorry for lashing out. You can ask the mod to confirm whether what i said is true or not.

Wild Card (No alignment. After discards are revealed, discard the Wild Card and draw one new role which you must keep)

Here. Am not the one who discards. Am not the one who draws a new role. Am assigned a new role from the initial list. Not the discarded list. You can ask the mod to confirm this.

[Spade_Ace]

UNVOTE: Grey

[Spade_Ace]

Hey!!!

Parrot role looked really interesting. Why would you discard that?

Am confident that if I reveal the role that I 'kept', the impact of that on the game would be zero.

I don't like this post. You are repeating something someone said, and then you are revealing your role even without anyone asking about it. Why?

Ohh didnt know having the same opinion as someone else was a crime.

@alban the WHOLE point of it was that i WASN'T revealing my actual role. I was only revealing the choice I 'kept'.

Why? Cos it was fun that was why. But people have sucked the fun part out of it so much so that i regret it now.

[Spade_Ace]

Spade, why did you unvote?

Though i find him annoying as hell, he appears as the only player wants to improve the game state.

[Spade_Ace]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

@grey and vaxkiller I dare you both to get me lynched today.

This can easily happen. Though I understand your exasoeration.

That wasn't an actual dare. I was trying to convey that I have a role that can be easily verified as town.

But it appears that i was mistaken on the actual power of my role and cant be verified.

My role is weird. I win when town wins. But my power is anti-town. Dont know what to do with that.

[Spade_Ace]

Spade, why did you unvote?

Though i find him annoying as hell, he appears as the only player wants to improve the game state.

Why aren't you trying to improve the 'game state'?

Really??? Cos i just logged onto MS after i went to sleep last night. Man, this scumhunting of yours sounds so fake.

[Spade_Ace]

I thought so too, but now I think he is pretending.

Could very well be. But the game just started. And am giving him the benefit of the doubt.

[Spade_Ace]

No am not revealing my role. I know what am doing.

Yeah i did sleep the whole day. Am a bit sick.

[Spade_Ace]

Yeah. I did OMGUS. So?

Did grey day ever mention that he is not suspecting me anymore?

[Spade_Ace]

Bullshit. Your absence of suspicion was cos you had to swallow your pride and accept that i was right because of mods reply to your question.

[Spade_Ace]

Actually that wouldn't be a bad idea.

[Spade_Ace]

Alban, it is just part of the game. Don't take it seriously.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey, stop it. You are not going to achieve anything by pissing everyone off.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

Keep the change you filthy animal.

I almost think that NM is jester who thinks that if he pushes on me long enough I'll get pissy and lynch him.

@RC how does NM questioning you, lead you to think he is a jester. You know you can't lynch a person all by yourself ryt? If he was a jester he would be trolling everyone and not just you.

[Spade_Ace]

@RC can you explain your case on NM. I couldn't find anything exceptionally scummy in his play.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Not_Mafia

This slot can die regardless of its alignment.

Why??

[Spade_Ace]

Grey's bang push is shitty, bang is clearly just new. RC Grey = Scum

Where's your vote, sport?

On RC

@NM why is ur vote still on RC if you suspect grey

[Spade_Ace]

I'll forgive you if you put Grey to L-1 for me

You can help her in doing this by voting for grey.

[Spade_Ace]

Why aren't you pushing bangthemafia for an answer?

He's my top scumread.

Notice that nobody else seems to care about the answer, either? Maybe I'm wrong. *shrug*

If he is your top scum read, why is your vote on NM?

[Spade_Ace]

@vaxkiller yeah i need to learn to express things a little more clearly.

[Spade_Ace]

In my opinion, someone may discard a trivial town role if the 2nd role is a potent town PR or scum. But discarding a potent town PR might come from the fact that 2nd option is even a better PR or scum. So chances of finding scum is higher in 2nd case.

People might discard a potent town PR and choose a trivial town role just cos it is more fun to play with.

[Spade_Ace]

Why is it more fun to be a trivial town?

You are right. Not trivial town but trivial 3rd party roles like jester and lyncher, that don't threaten town wincon might be fun and challenging to play than having a potent town role.

[Spade_Ace]

Really? I would have loved to play as jester and try to get people to lynch me.

[Spade_Ace]

@vax what is your opinion on RC and NM. They seem to be so focused on each other. Could one of them probably be a lyncher?

[Spade_Ace]

Town is shit.

VOTE: RC

Lynch NM tomorrow. bye.

I doubt town!RC would vote herself so early in the game and that too with just 3 previous votes.
So. Bye

VOTE: RC

[Spade_Ace]

RC is at L-3

How come you didnt comment on the selfvote?

[Spade_Ace]

Null to scum lean- Culted, RC

Explain these, please.

^^This

[Spade_Ace]

@gamma i meant the role

[Spade_Ace]

Town is shit.

VOTE: RC

Lynch NM tomorrow. bye.

I doubt town!RC would vote herself so early in the game and that too with just 3 previous votes.
So. Bye

VOTE: RC

She could be frustrated as a town. We have all been in her shoes.
Your vote on her is very opportunistic.

Found her partner.

[Spade_Ace]

I am surprised you find her self-vote suspicious enough to vote for her when town!you has done it

so many times

out of frustration in our games. Bang can confirm a frustrated town!Spade's predisposition to self-vote.

Who knows what affiliation she is, but I find it suspicious that you won't give her that leeway and acknowledge that a town can be driven to self-vote.

You must he confusing me with someone else. I have never selfvoted ever. And if bang confirms that, he is scum along with you.

[Spade_Ace]

I have never played with RC. But I doubt whether a person with his level of experience in MS would resort to such 'frustrated' displays especially when i dont find anything for them to be frustrated about.

RC hasn't even made a proper case against NM other than day NM might be a lyncher.

[Spade_Ace]

*i have never selfvoted ever as TOWN

[Spade_Ace]

Ohhh i didn't know.
NM do you still suspect grey?? And what is it between you and RC?

[Spade_Ace]

UNVOTE:

Do you think he has done anything scummy so far in the game?

[Spade_Ace]

2. Why aren't you questioning Bang?:

Assuming that the motivation was to trap a scum (no Kop, it

wasn't a joke

. I thought that too, but Grey himself said much later that that post was meant to see who bites the bait), and you got someone (in Bang) who did, why are you letting him off easily? I have seen it happening so many times that the original thoughts and motivations of players get lost in the deluge of posts. Should I have worded it differently? Maybe. Maybe I should have asked him politely, and not asked him 'why' coz that questions his motivation. And I didn't doubt his motivation anyway (at least not then). What I meant was, time to deliver what you indirectly promised in the first post.

You seem to not get what grey is trying to say. He voted for bang in 18. Bang didn't join the game again until 228.

If a player isn't responding the only thing you can do is ask other people to join the wagon which he was did in 40 and 41. Then the wildcard stuff happened. He kept indirectly pushing bang even in 44 and 52. He didnt change his vote until 121.

So yes your question on why he wasn't questioning Bang

doesn't make sense

.

[Spade_Ace]

I am surprised you find her self-vote suspicious enough to vote for her when town!you has done it

so many times

out of frustration in our games. Bang can confirm a frustrated town!Spade's predisposition to self-vote.

Who knows what affiliation she is, but I find it suspicious that you won't give her that leeway and acknowledge that a town can be driven to self-vote.

You must he confusing me with someone else. I have never selfvoted ever. And if bang confirms that, he is scum along with you.

This is just not you! As town you hav always found reasons and possibilities that a certain behaviour from a player could be from a misguided townie mindset rather than scum one. Whereas here I see you jumping to "you are scum" comclusion very fast.

Now, sorry if you feel that my memory is bad, but I do remember you self voting and then removing it after persuasion. Just that I m not too sure whether it was as town or as scum.

Apart from this, you have many times also followed the stance that "ok, i m ready to be lynched. Coz if so many people suspect me, the town will be fixated on me next day too. So lynch me and move on"

*i have never selfvoted ever as TOWN

I doubt thst. But there is anothet side to it. U didnt know what i was going to say and still you are so sure in stating something which could hav been negated by me. So i will take that on face value.

But ur opportunistic voting to RC, unvoting it on countering, and jumping to scum reading people (RC, me, alban) worry me!

UNVOTE:

Do you think he has done anything scummy so far in the game?

ohhh puhleeezzz stop with the 'what a Town!spade would have done' argument. I fell for it once. Not planning to do that again. Come up with something better. And yes your memory is bad cos I have never selfvoted as Town.

Bang and Alban are both scum.

[Spade_Ace]

Motherfucker, I'll votepark you out of spite of you don't shut the fuck up.

Is this how they vent anger in where to come from?
Stop swearing. I am serious.
VOTE: Grey

So in your little worldview, scum tries to win by being assholes and pissing people off, right?

Voting me for any other excuse than thinking I am scum is basically admitting to playing to a scum wincon, so I'm sure you'll find some way to call me scum because I used a dirty word.

Let's hear it.

You have already heard it in 199 and 212. Your melodrama (considered effort and improvement by some) rings fake.
Much before I took objection to your language.

Thanks for conveniently leaving out the links.

I thought so too, but now I think he is pretending.

Oooooooooohhh game set match. He is correct, Grey.
I dunno why but i think the interaction between you two is totally staged.

So ur whole argument for why grey is scum is melodrama and acting?

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Aban
wish i could vote Bang as well.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Charloux
If he is scum why did Charloux choose RC as his kill? No faction has daychat right?

[Spade_Ace]

Hmm. Yes.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey is Dave more scummier than Bang? I prefer a bang or alban lynch?
@gamma NM had a good reason to vote for rc

[Spade_Ace]

Bye scum

He's not a cop

He's not a cop

What does he get out of lying about it?

It's not like he's trying to dodge a hammer.

Shot could be fake still, also trolling

Yes, what an unfakeable claim

[Spade_Ace]

No one kill dave tonight please. He's my guy for tomorrow.

Looks.like a good reason to build a wagon.
VOTE: Dave

[Spade_Ace]

Saw ur vote. So not even going to bother reading ur post.

[Spade_Ace]

Awesome.

[Spade_Ace]

I have been scumread on day1, 5/6 games i have played here on MS. My style is just scummy. I find it convenient that alban and bang, guys who know the way i play, using my playstyle as a reason to suspect me. They did the exact same thing in a previous game and tried to get me lynched.

The reason am sheeping you is cos ur reasoning for your reads are good. Charloux and Dave

[Spade_Ace]

@bang if you are town, then trust me, am not scum.

[Spade_Ace]

- He doesn't say anything for next 90 posts. Resurfaces in 485 in which he votes for Charl. No questions asked, no clarifications sought. Is it a coincidence that this is immediately after your vote on Charl in 484?

Stuff like this is why I changed my mind about Space, FTR.

Once you mentioned this, I checked Spades' history and noticed that he had in fact been active on the site between the two posts, which suggested that he was strategically not participating in the thread.

@grey if you had checked the 'place on the site' where i was active between the two posts, you will realise how much more imp it was that i participated there. At that point that was more imp to me than this game.

@alban and bang let me try to understand your case.

1.

I am playing unusually

: this is my 6th game on MS and am following other games too. Could that have influenced the way i play the game? Possible. Also, I am looking to change my playstyle. I love playing as scum, but being scumread on day1 in most games is no fun. As town, i dont care much about being scumread. So, am i looking to change my meta. Yes.

2.

Sheeping grey

: Why did i vote for charloux?. He was the obvious vote at that time. There was no town motivation in his actions. Why did i vote and then ask a question? I wasnt confused on whether he was a scum or not, i was confused on why he chose RC. The answer seemed obvious once Grey cleared it.

Why did i sheep grey's Dave vote?. I hadnt ISOed Lowell. I asked grey the reason for his vote. And the reason he gave was satisfactory enough to build a wagon.

Would i sheep again? I dont mind sheeping grey and gamma as they are my two townreads. But of course i wouldnt blindly do it.

3.

Reason for scumreading you both

: Could you blame me after our last game? I was defending you both totally even when you two ganged up against me. And in the end you both turned out to be the scum. This game resembles a lot from the last game. Esp the nonsensical questions like, 'would a town!spade do that?', 'would a scum!spade do this'. Truly fed up of that.

Also i end up thinking people who tunnel me when am town are scum. You could say it is omgus. But since am town, i feel people targeting me are trying to get an easy mislynch.

If there are any Content related reason for your scumread on me apart from the once i have explained, let me know. Would be willing to answer. But am not going to reply any more to meta related stuff. That sucks.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey am curious. What was it that alban said, that made you change your read on me, from top townread to top scumread. I dont think their case had much content for such a change.

Also i dont quite agree with some alban's and bang's opinion that buddying up is wrong. It is perfectly fine to try and make a townbloc, so that we can move our sum reads forward.

Anyway. These are my reads so far.

{Gamma, Grey}
{Vax}
{NM, Kop}
{Alban, bang}
{Dave}

And yes the people whom i townread, are the people with whom i have similar reads

[Spade_Ace]

Mention reasons for your top scum and townreads.

Scumread - Dave. He is either being setup or he is scum. There is a high chance for multiple scum factions in this game. That means the number of members in each faction is fewer. So if Charloux and Dave, belong to the same scum faction (mafia), then I can see Dave's motivation in killing Lowell to protect his wincon and then claiming that it was a setup.

Townreads- Grey, his reads reflect and change based on the game development. His aggressive scum hunting seems genuine to me and not forced. He is able to backup most of his reads logically.
Gamma: Mainly cos his reads were similar to mine. He is also actively involved in the game and his overall approach seems town motivated to me.

[Spade_Ace]

What was it that alban said, that made you change your read on me, from top townread to top scumread.

I'm convinced that one of you are scum.

Alban, as shit as his posts are, looks the townier of the two of you. Which I really dislike admitting, btw.

Do you feel he is townier cos he seems to be attacking and challenging you whereas am not? Cos that could also be a mental bias.

[Spade_Ace]

That is 4 votes. L-1. Time to claim.

I am a

Black Goo

. Anyone who targets me joins the Cult faction. I win when town wins.

[Spade_Ace]

I still didn't understand what your point is. I discarded alien prober, kept wildcard. Was given the new role when the game started.

You are saying your role is "Wild Card"

@grey and vaxkiller I dare you both to get me lynched today.

This can easily happen. Though I understand your exasoeration.

That wasn't an actual dare. I was trying to convey that I have a role that can be easily verified as town.

But it appears that i was mistaken on the actual power of my role and cant be verified.

My role is weird. I win when town wins. But my power is anti-town. Dont know what to do with that

.

[Spade_Ace]

@davesaz i didnt know whether to claim early or not. That is why i posted 198, where i mentioned my power is anti-town. If the majority thought it was best to claim, i would have. But i guess no one noticed it other than Gamma. And he didn't say anything more.

If i was a major suspect on day 1, i would have def claimed b4 the night started. There was also a chance that scum could target me. It would have screwed with their plans.

[Spade_Ace]

!

NM's only post today.

NM and Kop should contribute more.

[Spade_Ace]

Spade, as far as I'm concerned us lynching mafia yesterday bought you breathing room.

If we continue to lynch mafia, I'm fine with letting you live... but if we get one mislynch, we need to seriously consider lynching you due to the simple fact we can't actually verify your claim.

I understand that. Initially i thought this was something like a mason and that it could be easily verified. That was the reason for the 'Dare'. Then later realized, it wasn't.

Anyway, lynching mafia hasn't given us a breathing room btw. The mod said there was at least 50% town. I think we should assume the initial town number was just 6. So now it after the kills, it is 4.

[Spade_Ace]

Also grey, did you notice anyone's play being different from yesterday. Something that indicates a change in alignment?

[Spade_Ace]

If he got culted, then he wouldn't say 598 cos he has a new wincon now. To win as a cult.

I think by last night, he meant in real life.

[Spade_Ace]

Also a culted person wouldn't want me lynched. They would want more people to target me at night.

[Spade_Ace]

Please make sure you have checked your PMs as your alignment may have changed overnight.

There is at least one player whose alignment might have changed overnight.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey how do we know that you are not a jester pretending to be Saulus?

[Spade_Ace]

Your alignment could have changed overnight.

[Spade_Ace]

@MOD if there is a Saulus in the game, does the other mafia member know about it? If they know that role exists, do they know the identity of that player?

[Spade_Ace]

4. Your alignment can easily change at the turn of a dime. You will receive a private message should your alignment change.

Please make sure you have checked your PMs as your alignment may have changed overnight.

Am not talking about an alignment change caused due to you targeting me. Am talking about one that is caused by the MOD.

Your role could have very well been converted to a jester by the mod at night.

[Spade_Ace]

@MOD if there is a Saulus in the game, does the other mafia member know about it? If they know that role exists, do they know the identity of that player?

What is this question designed to accomplish?

Do you think mafia is going to speak up and confirm my claim of they are aware of my role?

No. It will help in finding out the people who were NOT targeting you.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey are you pretending to not understand this or am i understanding it wrong?

What does post 707 say? It says that the MOD has the power to change a persons alignment. THE MOD. NOT THE PLAYER.

[Spade_Ace]

Why are you being so defensive? I intuitively feel your claim is true. but i need to check all possibilities, just as you did for my claim.

[Spade_Ace]

Is there any reason the Mod can't turn aplayer into a Jester mid-game??? The MOD specifically says after last night ended that our alignments could have changed. What is wrong with you?

[Spade_Ace]

Day 2 begins! There was one death last night.

Lowell has been killed at night. He was a(n)

Spoiler:

Bloodhound

Please make sure you have checked your PMs as your alignment may have changed overnight.

[Spade_Ace]

Is there any reason the Mod can't turn aplayer into a Jester mid-game??? The MOD specifically says after last night ended that our alignments could have changed. What is wrong with you?

After roles are initially determined, alignment changes only happen as a function of existing roles.

Ohhh i didn't know that's how it worked.

@MOD do alignment changes only happen as a function of existing roles? Or is it possible for people to have their wincons be changed in the middle of the game?

[Spade_Ace]

Spade_Ace is scum.

I'd he was really a Black Goo, his assumption over the mod message that there may have been an alignment change would be that someone targeted him. Not that the mod got a bug up their ass and went full on bastard.

If I was the person targeting a Black Goo. What you said is understandable. But am playing as a Black Goo and this is my first time in a role madness game.

[Spade_Ace]

Actually what you said makes sense now.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey, I had asked you this alignment question even before your claim in 678. Do understand that ignorance is not a scumtell.

[Spade_Ace]

Regarding other mafia members knowing about who the Saulus is.

Suppose Charloux and his partners knew you are the Saulus. They will make sure to not target you. They prevent you from getting lynched. So if there was any one defending you early on, it is a scumtell.

[Spade_Ace]

Give me time to construct an answer for heavens sake.

[Spade_Ace]

If there is a werewolf faction and he/they win then we are the ones who made a shitty choice Grey.

This suggests mafia knew my role.

I think he was referring the fact that you both discarded the werewolf roles.

[Spade_Ace]

Is NM playing this way to try and get lynched? I mean all he did was vote and then leave.

[Spade_Ace]

Also we need to be careful now. Coz if anyone wants to be a cult, they would target u. These would be players who wanted to be scum but got both town roles. So those with town discards.

I don't think anyone will want to be a cult in between the game. Getting a wincon as a cult is quite difficult. So I doubt anyone would willing target me at night.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey, does the day end along with the failed lynch? It should probably, but just making sure.

[Spade_Ace]

I meant if we try and lynch you, does the day end?

[Spade_Ace]

Btw unrelated, i did make a poor targeting choice. Antitown to say more at this time.

You probably targeted Lowell, huh?...

[Spade_Ace]

Antitown cos he might have to end up revealing his role.

Poor choice as his target was someone who ended up dead.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey there is a good chance you might end up getting killed tonight.

So is there any other thought that you want to add before we lynch you?

[Spade_Ace]

The claim on page 1, it's a joke and should be taken as that. I don't think anyone in a town frame of mind, especially with partners would out themselves in that manner. Unless it was pre-organized before hand, which I very highly doubt anyone would do. Even if that role exist (I was unaware of such a role) it has to be taken not gospel.

Anyone jumping on that claim and berating it, is more likely to come from scum rather than town, as scum always look for a easy route to push without hindering much resistance. Especially when the 2 names mentioned in that claim, didn't back it up, gives scum more impetus to push further into it.

I might be grasping at straws here. This was Kop's first comment. He was defending your fake claim. Maybe cos he doesn't want you lynched as he knows you are a Salaus??

[Spade_Ace]

@grey as long as you belong to the mafia faction, the scum won't probably night kill you, ryt?

So can't we lynch you later on in the game?

[Spade_Ace]

Well there is not much diff. If we convert you, mafia takes you out. If we don't werewolf/SK takes you out. Either way you are dead.

Lynching you today will at least prevent any PRs from accidentally having to claim.

VOTE: Grey

[Spade_Ace]

I think I'm in the minority when I say NM is probably town.

He doesn't seem likely to be mafia as he was the first person to vote for you. He could very well be werewolf / SK.

[Spade_Ace]

@bang are you even listening to yourself. If a protective role protects me they get converted to a cult faction. If scum kill me they get converted to cult faction. Anyone who targets me get converted to cult faction.

Did you check out how tough it is to win as cult. It is nearly impossible. So what you are saying is "a person who wanted to play as scum but who ended up as town might target me even at the cost of their wincon???''

If scum target me, it is AGAINST their wincon. They will not night kill me.

You sound like a scum who has realised that the only way to get me out of the game is to mislynch me.

[Spade_Ace]

Grey is going to be killed either way. If we convert him, mafia will kill him as he is a confirmed townie. If we don't kill him other factions will kill him cos he is still a 'mafia' and hence is a threat to their wincon.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey do you find any logic in what bang has said regarding people purposely targeting black goo.?

PEDIT: Yes assuming there are other factions with kills. One night kill yesterday could indicate that factions with kill powers might not have used their kill. For ex: alien with just one allowed kill.

Can werewolf faction make a kill?. Nothing about kills is mentioned over there.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey I don't mind being lynched if it is for the the town's benefit. But I want to be convinced that it is beneficial first. Not arguments like a person who wanted to play scum might target me at night sort of.

Assuming I am not lynched, there are 8 alive. I am assuming there won't be more than two scum in each faction right now. Excluding me, they have 5 players to choose from. It is not like there are just 1or 2 players left and my existence is hurting their survival chances. Even if am lynched, scum could still end up killing a power role. So you end up losing one confimed Townie and a PR.

[Spade_Ace]

That is true. It is an excellent scum fake claim. There is nothing that I can do to help verify this role. It is not like a culted player is going to support me. Well if ppl are that suspicious and if my role could still be in doubt during the final stages, town should lynch me today.

[Spade_Ace]

If a kill is attempted on a Black Goo, the killer will not change alignment.

If any other action is performed, the player's alignment will change and they will lose access to their Factional PTs should they have any.

Well that means the role isn't immune. So it is basically useless.

[Spade_Ace]

@vax I chose wildcard not 'black goo'. This was assigned to me after all the discards.

@bang I thought the word 'target' was self-evident to include kills as well. Though I did ask the mod something else.

@NM black goo is a town role.

[Spade_Ace]

@grey at this point town is probably going to lose two members

[Spade_Ace]

Wikki: A Saulus is originally an anti-town role, but when it should die (either by lynch or other kill), it stays alive and converts to the Town's side instead.

@grey that means you don't need to be immediately lynched. Ur role for now has immunity

[Spade_Ace]

Wikki: A Saulus is originally an anti-town role, but when it should die

(either by lynch or other kill)

, it stays alive and converts to the Town's side instead.

@grey that means you don't need to be immediately lynched. Ur role for now has immunity

[Spade_Ace]

Also grey, as you are still mafia, isn't what you are doing right now technically against your current wincon

[Spade_Ace]

I am Survivor

Gamma, are there any variations to your role. Like, you just need to survive till day 3 kind?

A quick wikki read suggests that survivor role is essentially anti-town as scum now needs to focus on one less person to win their game. Your role could also be a liability to town at Lylo. If all you care is your wincon you could vote town and wait for scum to hammer.

We are sure there are 4 town members alive. Excluding the Saulus and the survivor, we could still have a maximum of 3 scum alive.

If you are indeed a survivor, the game now reduces to 8 players fighting for their wincons. I dont think scum will nk you.

Also, gamma what was the reason for your claim?

[Spade_Ace]

@grey scum is not going to nk you. We should lynch you tomorrow and check out who are resisting your lynch. I might get killed tonight.

A bang lynch sounds good today.

I

[Spade_Ace]

But if bang is a town and i end up getting killed at night. Town could end up with just 2 members.

[Spade_Ace]

NM is playing is just trying to avoid Prods. I think you are right, he could have been culted.

[Spade_Ace]

NM is just trying to avoid Prods. I think you are right, he could have been a town who ended up being culted.

[Spade_Ace]

I prefer lynching Spade or anyone from the lurkers. I just hate lurkers. They help aggressive scum get into town leader roles.

@bang who are the lurkers according to you? And if you hate them why havent you directed any questions at them throughout the game?

[Spade_Ace]

Your 839 is nothing but a prejudiced view from tainted glass.

Unlike what you have been doing all game?

[Spade_Ace]

Unvote: Spade

Unvotes have to be bolded or tagged.

@bang why didn't you properly unvote me even after grey explicitly mentioned that. You do realise your vote is still on me, ryt?

[Spade_Ace]

If NM was a town player who targeted me at night and got his alignment converted, then we have one less town player. His 'why havent we killed 'the black goo' statement makes sense then.

[Spade_Ace]

True. Then he could be a jester ??? I dont get his style of play today.

[Spade_Ace]

Hahahah

Congrats gamma.

[Spade_Ace]

Howz it that everyone who has claimed so far has come up with fantastic roles that are impossible to verify? Gamma, Spade and Grey are all lying imo.

Especially, Spade's claim. The melodrama in the beginning makes sense now. You wanted to post something that everyone will remember you by and which you could also revisit in future in case your roleclaim needed to be verified. You could just say, 'I had told you so long back'. Which you actually did cite, when someone asked you why didn't you claim in the beginning.

Are you saying, you still suspect me or you that you dont? Kinda ambiguous.

[Spade_Ace]

@nm please replace out, if you are only going to prod dodge.

[Spade_Ace]

But if bang is a town and i end up getting killed at night. Town could end up with just 2 members.

I don't see how you think you could end up being nightkilled, considering your role.

Do you seriously see scum shooting you?

If a kill is attempted on a Black Goo, the killer will not change alignment.

If any other action is performed, the player's alignment will change and they will lose access to their Factional PTs should they have any.

Well that means the role isn't immune. So it is basically useless.

[Spade_Ace]

Spade made the choice to be negative utility town

I didnt choose it. I chose wildcard. Black goo was randomly assigned to me.

And tbh I don't 100% believe the claim, why did he not claim immediately?

I did hint at the beginning about it being anti-town. Thought the role had some positive aspect to it; by screwing with scums wincon if they killed me. Didn't realize it was an entirely negative utility.

[Spade_Ace]

I think bang is just new, I'd lynch you before a scumread anyway, we don't know how many scum there are so it's best to make you town earlier rather than later

Bang is not new to mafia. He has played lots of games outside MS. And this is his third game here.

We know there are at least 4 town members alive. We know there could be a maximum of 5 scum alive including grey. We know all 5 cant belong to the same faction else we would have lost the game already. If all scum belong to the same faction that means there are more than 4 alive town members.

If we make grey town. Then he is going to get killed at night unless there is a protective town role. Day3 could start with 4v4 or 3v4 depending upon the number of factions with kill powers. Not sure whether that gives us much advantage.

Also lynching grey doesn't give us any flip info that we could use.

I think it is best we lynch our top scumreads.

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Bang

[Spade_Ace]

He was the scummiest player to me. Reasons given earlier- go ISO me.

Have already answered yours and albans questions. ISO me.

And tbh I don't 100% believe the claim, why did he not claim immediately?

Agree. A negative utility townie shud hav immediately claimed on day 1 to prevent night 1 culting.

Have already mentioned the reason. ISO me.

@Mod, please explicitly clarify-
If there were a black goo, what was their role PM? Do they convert everyone targetting them or only town PRs? This is what wiki page on Goo says-

Black Goo: Whenever a player targets you with an action, they will join your cult as another black goo regardless of their original team.

Mod has already clarified this. Any person scum/town targeting the black goo will get converted. Any person scum/town killing black goo won't get converted.

[Spade_Ace]

To account for that chance, I now feel it's better to lynch Grey before Spade.

How exactly does lynching grey help? I have my reservations on this. Especially since a 'grey nightkill' can also convert him to town. Lynching grey doesn't give us any flip info.

[Spade_Ace]

I think scum's agenda is this.
Push for a lynch on grey on the pretext of it being favourable for town. Get him converted to town. Kill him at nighy. Push for a mislynch on spade the next day. This should be easier the next day with grey dead.

@bang if you can clearly explain how exactly a grey lynch is beneficial for town, am willing to support it.

Else i think it is best one of us gets lynched today. Thw flips would help town.

[Spade_Ace]

@mod request a prod on Vax

[Spade_Ace]

Any and all PT's will be open throughout the course of day.

[Spade_Ace]

Let's check out the worst case scenario for town.

4 town vs 5 scum: what does this imply. There are two scum factions in the game. Again the worst possible case for town is one faction having a large majority and both factions having a nightkill.

Lets's suppose Scum A has 4 members and Scum B has just 1 and Grey belongs to A.

1) We lynch grey. Grey gets converted to town.
Night starts as 5v3v1 now. Suppose both factions use their kill on town. Next day starts as 3v3v1. Day3 could be a potential LYLO.

2) We do not lynch Grey. We mislynch. Night starts with 3v4v1. Suppose both factions use their kill on town. 1v4v1 and game is over.

@Bang you are right. It is best to lynch Grey. At least town is still in the game.
UNVOTE:

@MOD What happens to the Saulus when the rest of the mafia are dead? Does he inherit the ability to nighkill?

[Spade_Ace]

Alban stop.with the tunnelling. Am not scum/ 3rd party. Also looking at the worst case scenarios, lynching grey is the best play for town.

[Spade_Ace]

Any and all PT's will be open throughout the course of day.

Btw do keep in mind that scum have daychat.

[Spade_Ace]

Maybe not to trust associatives too much.

In situations like lylo, scum can coordinate a mass lynch.

[Spade_Ace]

Btw didn't like Kop's catchups. He had been just reiterating what has been already said.

Dave, kop, and nm really need to contribute more.

[Spade_Ace]

@alban gamma didnt claim yet.

[Spade_Ace]

@gamma we cant take the risk of mislynching. There is a chance that the game could get over if we do so. The only safe option is to lynch grey.

[Spade_Ace]

@alban gamma didnt claim yet.

Didn't he say he is a survivor?

No. He meant he achieved a 'survivor' status on MafiaScum. He wasnt talking about this game.

[Spade_Ace]

@vax check post 937

[Spade_Ace]

@bang cant take the risk of mislynching you. Game might end. Check the worst case scenario analysis.

[Spade_Ace]

No we are lynching grey. That is the only safe option. Dont know what you are saying.

[Spade_Ace]

@vax check post 937

[Spade_Ace]

VOTE: Grey

He is at l-1 now.

Grey what are your final thoughts and reads, in case you dont survive the night?

[Spade_Ace]

Wait.

Are there any one shot unlynchable roles in any of the factions that can just lead to a similar failed lynch and pass off as saulus thereby becoming conf!town for the remaining game in everyone's eyes?

@bang For a person who says he has no experience with Greater Idea mafia, how were you able to use this exact phrase 'one shot unlynchable' without even having read the wikki.

I feek there is something off about you asking about this role.

[Spade_Ace]

If others also find Spade suspicious, why cant someone of us who has a night action (I dont have any, else I would hav definitely done this) target Spade. If they turn cult, they can reveal this to town since they were originally townie, i assume their loyalty will be with town. If nothing happens to them, we know Spade is a fakeclaiming scum. What do you guys say, please opine.

ARE YOU CRAZY?????

[Spade_Ace]

I went and checked wiki, simple. Stop throwing shade for no rhyme and reason, ok? Since Grey will not flip, I was thinking whether i shud believe he is 100% conf town

If you had gone and checked wikki then you wouldnt have asked it as a question.

[Spade_Ace]

Wait.

Are there any one shot unlynchable roles in any of the factions that can just lead to a similar failed lynch and pass off as saulus thereby becoming conf!town for the remaining game in everyone's eyes?

I dont think a.town you would have phrased the question in this way.

[Spade_Ace]

I didnt mean a town!bang. I meant any town memeber. A town member would have asked, 'is there any other role that could be unlynchable like the saulus' and not 'is there any one shot unlynchable'.

[Spade_Ace]

@bang there is a difference between a saulus's wincon ambiguity and a cult players wincon

[Spade_Ace]

@bang what is your case on alban?

[Spade_Ace]

@bang if you are town, for the last time trust me am.not scum. Lynch me tmrw by dont ask a PR to target me. That is just stupid

@grey hmm could be true. I did townread him before for convincing me that your lynch was the best town play. I guess am a being a bit paranoid that he is being coached by his scumteam to say 'one shot unlynchable'

[Spade_Ace]

Lynch me tmrw. But dont waste a PR town by targeting me. My role is anyway useless to town and am not keen on staying till lylo.

[Spade_Ace]

Needless to be said but if there is any town protective role protect grey.

If there is a town vigilante, shoot me. It will reduce confusion for tmrw.

[Spade_Ace]

Uggghhh....grey, you judas....nice play...

@aristodog i understand you had to go for judgment calls regarding blackgoo. But, next time i think it would be better to convert anyone who targets/kills goo. Else that role becomes completely negative for town. Town didnt stand a chance this game having Judas with them too.

Alban, your tunnelling on me was same as the last time u were scum. Should have put more pressure on you.