Open 664 - Tit for Tat (Mafia Wins)


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Post Post #850 (ISO) » Sun Jan 01, 2017 11:06 am

Post by KainTepes »

In post 847, Alisae wrote:
In post 846, KainTepes wrote:i want ALISAE lynched today not AELIN
Then shoot me tonight
In post 848, Alisae wrote:oh wait, I'm town, don't do that.
..............
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Post Post #851 (ISO) » Sun Jan 01, 2017 1:05 pm

Post by Hawk »

VOTE: Alisae I'm fine with this. I still lean on Spade and Aelin being scum but lynching Alisae is okay here to me.
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Post Post #852 (ISO) » Sun Jan 01, 2017 4:48 pm

Post by KainTepes »

they can ALL be scum,, we just have to lynch one today
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Post Post #853 (ISO) » Sun Jan 01, 2017 6:11 pm

Post by Alisae »

Don't ywall get it I'm lynch bait ;~;
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Post Post #854 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:15 am

Post by Kop »

I'm not a fan of self voting, spells far too much AtE and doesn't give me the impression that it's a town reaction, even if you are lynchbait. You make yourself lynch bait by reacting in such a manner that you have done throughout this game.
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Post Post #855 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:40 am

Post by Kop »

In post 736, Aelin wrote:What is the reason for the scumread? I'm usually pretty tame on MS compared to MU.
But the reason for you acting differently adds up to you being a PR this game not you being scum instead I realised Kain.
There is something in this post that just doesn't agree with me, I can't quite put my finger on it. I think Aelin here is trying to distance herself from this whole suspicion that is on KT, and trying to justify that she 'knew' something.
In post 753, Aelin wrote:
In post 739, bangthemafia wrote:I dont know why, but i hav startes getting a feeling that Alisae cud be a town.

I also thought all along that Mala had soft claimed. But if not, she cud be a townie too.

In that case, maybe we can lynch Aelin.

Pedit: KT, I dont find anything scummy. Please remember your crumbs were not picked up by many. And you did act very jumpy in last few pages

Also, i hav seen thia happen many times- when someone is a conftown due to being investigated or due to claiming, they start guiding the town against those eho suspected them- in my opinion its NAI. If someone is scummy, even townies will suspect them right?

And duw to the burden oof some extra knowledge, sometimes PRs do tend to behave in a way thats similar to acum.

I m signing out. Its 3.30 am here. But please dont wagon anyone beyond L-2.
Post is very reasonable and I feel like scum hypothetically who wanted to make it look like Mala was softclaiming would not back down and could secure a lynch on Mala as lynchbait for "softclaiming vig".
This whole justification sucks. This reeks of trying to buddy up to someone who is possibly calling for her lynch.
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Post Post #856 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 2:43 am

Post by The MM »

The day is nearing its end, town.


Votecount N°8
Not Voting (1):
Aelin, Kop
Alisae (3):
Aubrey, Malakittens, KainTepes
innocentvillager (1):
Crystalline Dagger
Spade_Ace (1):
innocentvillager,
Crystalline Dagger (0):

Aelin (5):
Hawk, Alisae, Lil Uzi Vert, bangthemafia, Spade_Ace


With 12 alive, it takes 7 to lynch.

Deadline in: (expired on 2017-01-04 12:00:00)
Waiting for the day I can come back and mod games.
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Post Post #857 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:11 am

Post by Hawk »

@mod my current vote is on Alisae.

Okay we got a day guys let's figure this shit out. I'm guessing we are lynching either Alisae or Aelin with the current VC being 4 votes for each.
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Post Post #858 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:26 am

Post by Kop »

VOTE: Alisae
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Post Post #859 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:31 am

Post by Hawk »

That's 5 on Alisae L-2.
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Post Post #860 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 3:39 am

Post by bangthemafia »

In post 854, Kop wrote:I'm not a fan of self voting, spells far too much AtE and doesn't give me the impression that it's a town reaction, even if you are lynchbait. You make yourself lynch bait by reacting in such a manner that you have done throughout this game.
In post 857, Hawk wrote:@mod my current vote is on Alisae.

Okay we got a day guys let's figure this shit out. I'm guessing we are lynching either Alisae or Aelin with the current VC being 4 votes for each.
In post 850, KainTepes wrote:
In post 847, Alisae wrote:
In post 846, KainTepes wrote:i want ALISAE lynched today not AELIN
Then shoot me tonight
In post 848, Alisae wrote:oh wait, I'm town, don't do that.
..............
In post 853, Alisae wrote:Don't ywall get it I'm lynch bait ;~;
Alissae was my top scumread till few pages back. And I know its not good to second guess oneself in such situation. But strangely the more Alissae posts, the more doubtful and shaky I am getting. On one side, I start feeling that her frustration comes from a town mindset. But on the other hand, I also realize that this feeling of mine is very recent, and so I wonder if Alissae could be a desperate scum who has now given up on rational arguements and is trying to now play emotional card.

Because of this unsurety, I am voting Aelin for now. But if Alissae reaches L-1, I am ready to hammer her!!!
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Post Post #861 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:04 am

Post by Hawk »

In post 844, Spade_Ace wrote:@Hawk confirmation bias much?? Did you check out the very first sentence on my Mala read?
In post 573, Spade_Ace wrote:Mala - Scum Lean (keeping aside )
I didn't know what to make of the breadcrumb issue, didn't clearly understand Mala's response to it and everyone seemed to think it was a bad idea. So I 'kept that aside' from my read. I gave a scumlean way before Kain claimed Vig. How is this being opportunistic? Also unlike everyone else I dont believe exposing breadcrumbs is anti-town.

Also explain to me how I am distancing myself from Aelin? She is clearly dragging me down with her. I have been calling her out on her convenient scumread from the start.

Hawk I am starting to really not like you. You simply used Alisae's argument, against me. Your breadcrumb issue was already explained in detail by Kop and bang. Do you not have any original thoughts or arguments??

Also, what is the deal with everyone about my reads.
Scum - Aelin, Mala
Scum leaning - Alisae, hawk
NULL -IV, CD, bang, Lil
Town - Aubrey, Kop, Kain
Expected CD to be defensive against my accusations. He simply didn't care. Quite indifferent throughout the game.
VOTE: Aelin
Maybe a little bit of tunneling here yes. My fault. Taking a second to look over stuff again I'm leaning more towards that one of you and Aelin are scum. You guys don't seem to be distancing more so as just opposing. Not ruling out distancing tho.

Also I did... it's exactly why I hate that read. You even say that everyone else things revealing the breadcrumb is a bad idea. Because it's hard to justify Town!Spade revealing Mala's crumb helping town. Then afterwords you scumread Mala. Can you understand my frustration here with that now? You do something clearly Anti-town in my eyes because it potentially could out a Town PR (it doesn't) and then vote against the person who crumb'd? Whether Mala is town or not is irrelevant to your play being bad and then your subsequent read feel very bad. Like I get that you didn't understand Mala's reaction and from that decided you should omit it. But you just can't do that man. You potentially revealed PR at that point and forced a soft claim (me and a few others thought so) so you gotta own up to it. Even if you don't understand or have a good read on Mala from her response at least a knowledge the crumb and null read her after her response. Ignoring it and Scum reading her despite a possible soft Vigi claim looks scummy...

I'll post a seperate response to Aelin shortly.

Also people who think Alisae is scum we have L-2 and Bang has shown intent to hammer if we get to l-1.
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Post Post #862 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 5:07 am

Post by Hawk »

Edit of above post "You do something clearly Anti-town in my eyes because it potentially could reveal a Town PR (it doesn't) and then scumread the person who crumb'd?"
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Post Post #863 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:03 am

Post by Spade_Ace »

http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Breadcrumb

"scum have been known to breadcrumb roles as well; if the role they breadcrumbed became inconvenient to claim, they simply do not point them out later. Last, an obvious breadcrumb will draw the scum's attention and place that player at the top of the list of players they have an interest in killing overNight."


hope that answers your question
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Post Post #864 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:29 am

Post by KainTepes »

so why are you interested in SCUMREADING mala for a claim,, why are you not SCUMREADING me for claiming vig?
I AM KAIN TEPES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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"why be a better mafia player, when you can be a better KAIN TEPES???" - Vi
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Post Post #865 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:31 am

Post by Hawk »

In post 863, Spade_Ace wrote:http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=Breadcrumb

"scum have been known to breadcrumb roles as well; if the role they breadcrumbed became inconvenient to claim, they simply do not point them out later. Last, an obvious breadcrumb will draw the scum's attention and place that player at the top of the list of players they have an interest in killing overNight."


hope that answers your question
You left this part out

"Many times, they cannot be reliably read unless the crumbing player points them out,"

if you're using that as a reference point for explaining your read then you might want to reconsider your stance on revealing breadcrumbs as being not anti-town...

Like seriously I understand where your coming from. Just tell me if I'm wrong.

You thought revealing the crumb and getting some response from Mala was acceptable. After Mala's response not knowing what to do with it you make a Scum Read on Mala. Because you firmly believe that Mala is laying fake crumbs? If this the case you shouldn't have revealed the crumb. It makes more sense to wait and see. If Mala is legit town she may want that to sit and be useful later. It wasn't a super obvious crumb. If Mala is scum she probably wouldn't find a time to reveal it. (in hindsight if you had waited till D2 and KT had shot someone proving his Vigi claim and crumb we would have good pressure for Mala) But that's all moot because you revealed it.

So for me I'm struggling trying to judge what you did as an Error made by a townie or scum trying to accomplish something that I haven't quite put exact reasoning on. It just reads scummy to me.
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Post Post #866 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:37 am

Post by KainTepes »

hawk,, can ALISAE, AELIN and SPADE all be the mafia together??
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Post Post #867 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 7:45 am

Post by Hawk »

Not sure KT honestly not sure. Let me see if there's anything that clearly puts them in opposing camps. Right now I'm starting to think Aelin might not be in that camp cause both Alisae and Spade have been willing to vote Aelin so she maybe town and just not having a ood town game. It might also be a distancing attempt gone wrong and they can't let up or they possibly give her away.... But I'm leaning towards I don't think all three are scum but I'm not sure.

If someone sees anything important that hints at them one way or another let us know.
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Post Post #868 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:01 am

Post by KainTepes »

then we lynch alisae today,, that is the feeling i felt that AELIN and ALISAE aren't scum together,, if they are then they are DISTANCING HARDCORE...........

so lynching ALISAE would net us a lot of information
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Post Post #869 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:13 am

Post by Spade_Ace »

Enough with this. Do i need to spell it out for you.

1) I DIDNT scumlean mala based on the breadcrumb. It was due to her nature of play which greatly resembled the scum!IC in my newbie game. Mala's response had NOTHING to do with my scumlean. I specifically kept aside the breadcrumb issue while making a read.
2) Spot a breadcrumb, immediately announce it. This was kinda imbibed in my mind based on my previous open game, check Game Link 1.
3) If you are phone posting, it was super obvious. I initially thought, Vig!Mala had made a super dumb breadcrumb and it was imp for JK to know that. Or else she was directing the vig or she was scum laying out a defense plan. Either way, at that moment, I thought it was imp town knew about that.
4) In hindsight, yes, it was better I left it out.

Now just let it go.
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Post Post #870 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:16 am

Post by KainTepes »

@SPADE will you vote Alisae?
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Post Post #871 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:25 am

Post by Alisae »

In post 868, KainTepes wrote:so lynching ALISAE would net us a lot of information
Like what?
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Post Post #872 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:25 am

Post by Spade_Ace »

Yes, I have no issues with lynching Alisae. She is scumleaning for me. And i hate how she has been tunneling me throughout the game even after I provided my reasons. It's just that I find Aelin and Mala scummier.
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Post Post #873 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:26 am

Post by Alisae »

D
on't worry me
S
ure, you might get lynched, but it's not the end of the world.
J
ust keep your cool.
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Post Post #874 (ISO) » Mon Jan 02, 2017 8:33 am

Post by Spade_Ace »

:facepalm: :facepalm:
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