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Post Post #775 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:20 pm

Post by -Grey- »

In post 770, TwoFace wrote:Ascetic isn't listed as a negative utility role but enabler is. That's weird.
Ascetic is by its very nature negative utility.

It prevents town from gaining information which wastes PR shots.

That's not something town wants to see happen, but it's valuable for scum.
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Post Post #776 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:20 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

In post 770, TwoFace wrote:Ascetic isn't listed as a negative utility role but enabler is. That's weird.
Where?
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My pronouns are she and it, please respect that. I don't mind the occasional slip.
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Post Post #777 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:21 pm

Post by TwoFace »

Well somebody needs to update the wiki
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Post Post #778 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:23 pm

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In post 776, Gamma Emerald wrote:
In post 770, TwoFace wrote:Ascetic isn't listed as a negative utility role but enabler is. That's weird.
Where?
The wiki
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Post Post #779 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:30 pm

Post by Rainbowdash »

In post 771, Gamma Emerald wrote: Miller
Nah.

You need to not only have a cop in the game but they also need to target you. Its far more of a risk, but by claiming miller you basically say to the scum "by the way there is a cop in this game". Even if you want to say both players survive two cycles, you are at about 80% chance not to be investigated. Especially in a large game, I think you can get away without a miller claim, even more if you leave some sort of a "Hey look at me, im a miller and this is a convenient breadcrumb" type post.

Less scum know about the setup the harder it is to play as scum. C9++ setup is the best example of how scum not knowing what they are up against makes the game FAR harder for them.

That's just theory though, I think site still tends to trend towards the conservative miller claim (likely due to lack of scum faking it) although not as much anymore, but I think there is plenty of justification against throwing that claim out as well.
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Post Post #780 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:31 pm

Post by Gamma Emerald »

Miller can exist without a cop
Just like a Deputy without a Cop
It's a Named Townie essentially
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Post Post #781 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:40 pm

Post by TheRealGin-N-Tonic »

The idea came to me to do a mini VA on Grey and report what I see.
In post 6, -Grey- wrote:I can dig it.

VOTE: Gamma Emerald
RVS: Sheepvote, beginning of the game, you can't expect much from anything really.
In post 84, -Grey- wrote:
In post 81, Ircher wrote:Anyway, would like to point everyone to my wiki page with an ~30% or so win rate.
VOTE: Ircher

Already making excuses for his poor decisions.
This is still early in the game but it starts a trend I've been following with his voting pattern. Ircher saying he has a low win rate and wanting him lynched sounds like he's pushing for a policy lynch and policy lynches are meant for townies, so to push for one instead of ignoring said townie raises a yellow flag.

In post 101, -Grey- wrote:
In post 98, Human Sequencer wrote:I'm not worried about a flash lynch.
I'm just a lot more interested in what Ircher has to say about a Gamma wagon than I am with the players reversed.
Request granted.

VOTE: Gamma
This vote was just a sheep vote, but what I find suspicious about it is that it only took him 15 minutes and one post from HS to say, "I'll go switch my vote because no reason." If Grey actually wanted to pursue a scum read on Ircher, he would have kept his vote on Ircher and pushed him. This vote shows he doesn't actually care who is voted, he just wants someone lynched in general and that's a scum mindset.

In post 137, -Grey- wrote:Back to my first choice, I've been on Gamma long enough.

VOTE: Ircher
1:22 to 2:39, just a little over an hour and a 40ish posts on the "gamma wagon." That's not "long enough," that's barely any time at all honestly. It didn't allow an actual discussion to form on Gamma. I see the motive as preventing town from actually trying to solve players by forcing the wheel around in circles.
In post 198, -Grey- wrote:I like 195 and am willing to lend it my vote.

VOTE: Asphodel
It's getting obvious the trend we see in Grey's vote patterns, he's following the wagons onto anyone that has small case being built onto them. He doesn't actually hold opinions of his own and, to funnily enough quote Alisae, is voting without conviction. The difference here is that he does this too many times for it to be a reaction test, he just fence sits and hops onto any opportunity to mislynch that he can get.
In post 303, -Grey- wrote:
In post 279, Alisae wrote:BTW Naomi do you think your weak scum read on TwoFace could come from him trying to be lynch bait or something?
What's with the lynchbait paranoia?

It's like you're afraid of getting on the wrong wagon.

VOTE: Alisae
This is actually hindsight talking but the personality traits and voting patterns I see with Alisae is that 1) She is extra careful with her vote and uses it as if it's a loaded gun instead of a tool in the fashion that say, I would use it in; and 2) She strongly believes in having a case built up before voting someone, ergo all that and you get an understandable reason that Alisae simply won't vote TF because instead, she is taking the time to figure out all the possibilities.

What I don't like about the vote is that i'm reading it as Grey is trying to rush Alisae into voting and get her flustered/manipulate her to vote anyone or just cause chaos instead of game solving.
In post 489, -Grey- wrote:
In post 488, Naomi-Tan wrote:
In post 483, -Grey- wrote:
In post 482, Naomi-Tan wrote:given that Reds have no day talk
How do you know this?
its not in the rules so Im assuming.
"given" is not an assumption, it's a statement of fact.

VOTE: Naomi

You slipped hard.
This is arguing semantics and honestly it's an opportunistic vote. What Grey doesn't do here is look at Naomi at a whole, doesn't look at any possible scum motives or any of that to back up a possible lead. He just found something small he can pick up on and try to build a case but it's a hallow case at best because it's not actually a slip.
In post 588, -Grey- wrote:So, Gamma is voting me for voting Naomi over a slip, but completely ignoring 2F who is not only sheeping my push but advancing with it after Gamma stated in thread that he doesn't believe it's a slip.

Town Gamma would have picked up on 2F continuing to push what he considers a non-slip and voted him.

Possible Gamma/2F team. (I read 2F as possible scum for other reasons)

VOTE: Gamma
I'm trying to dissect this post and what it's saying:
He says Gamma votes him because Gamma believes it's a non-slip but in reality, he should be voting Gamma should vote TF because TF agreed.

My interpretation is that Grey isn't actually fighting Gamma's response to him, he's attacking the player and not the argument which I find to be a scum tell. Another factor is that Grey is trying to push the blame for the slip onto TF and have Gamma focus on someone else that's not him but it backfired.
In post 748, -Grey- wrote:Since Gamma claimed Ascetic Enabler, any "no results" results should be insta-lynched because the ascetic(s) is/are scum hiding behind the role.

I'm happy returning to my previous vote.

VOTE: Naomi
The last vote is simple, he is caught with his pants down so he'll continue to push this "scum slip" instead of actually providing a case onto how Naomi is actually scum. I don't see any actual work by Grey trying to actually determine if a player is scum, I'm seeing him go after each opportunity and voting based on the trends on who is wagonable at the time.


I'd vote Grey but I'm going to sleep in an an hour or two so it'd be a waste but expect it when I wake up.
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Post Post #782 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:42 pm

Post by -Grey- »

In post 781, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:I'd vote Grey but I'm going to sleep in an an hour or two so it'd be a waste but expect it when I wake up.
Be a fucking man and vote me. This shit doesn't make you look town.
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Post Post #783 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:43 pm

Post by Alisae »

In post 782, -Grey- wrote:
In post 781, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:I'd vote Grey but I'm going to sleep in an an hour or two so it'd be a waste but expect it when I wake up.
Be a fucking man and vote me. This shit doesn't make you look town.
A. I agree.
B. He's new.
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Post Post #784 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:44 pm

Post by -Grey- »

Gin is worried that I might obvtown while he's asleep and make his vote on me look bad, lol.
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Post Post #785 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:46 pm

Post by -Grey- »

This is the last time I'll ask... anyone that is actually trying to sort me should examine my play in 1762. There is a direct correlation to my play in that game and this one.

Time will tell what that correlation is.
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Post Post #786 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:47 pm

Post by Ircher »

VOTE: Grey
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Post Post #787 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:47 pm

Post by -Grey- »

Newbie* 1762
“Trust is an orchid, beautiful but delicate, requiring ideal conditions in order to thrive. Without them, it dies.” - Dahrk (Arrow, Season 4)
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Post Post #788 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:48 pm

Post by -Grey- »

In post 786, Ircher wrote:VOTE: Grey
Atta boy.
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"-grey- would hardclaim an inno on his obv-scum partner D2 in a micro if he could" - gigabyteTroubadour
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Post Post #789 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:49 pm

Post by krylea »

In post 784, -Grey- wrote:Gin is worried that I might obvtown while he's asleep and make his vote on me look bad, lol.
He has some stupid voting quirk when he unvotes before he goes to sleep iirc. It's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of and incredibly anti-town. I'd vote him for it, except that it's probably not even alignment indicative, just stupid.
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Post Post #790 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:49 pm

Post by Ircher »

@Kry

Vote Grey please.
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Post Post #791 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:50 pm

Post by -Grey- »

In post 789, krylea wrote:
In post 784, -Grey- wrote:Gin is worried that I might obvtown while he's asleep and make his vote on me look bad, lol.
He has some stupid voting quirk when he unvotes before he goes to sleep iirc. It's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of and incredibly anti-town. I'd vote him for it, except that it's probably not even alignment indicative, just stupid.
Why do you feel the need to be his apologist?
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Post Post #792 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:51 pm

Post by krylea »

In post 790, Ircher wrote:@Kry

Vote Grey please.
I am.
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Post Post #793 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:51 pm

Post by TheRealGin-N-Tonic »

Grey is at L- what?
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Post Post #794 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:52 pm

Post by krylea »

In post 791, -Grey- wrote:
In post 789, krylea wrote:
In post 784, -Grey- wrote:Gin is worried that I might obvtown while he's asleep and make his vote on me look bad, lol.
He has some stupid voting quirk when he unvotes before he goes to sleep iirc. It's the dumbest thing I've ever heard of and incredibly anti-town. I'd vote him for it, except that it's probably not even alignment indicative, just stupid.
Why do you feel the need to be his apologist?
Because while I think it's stupid, I don't think it's alignment indicative.
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Post Post #795 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:52 pm

Post by -Grey- »

In post 793, TheRealGin-N-Tonic wrote:Grey is at L- what?
Shut up or vote.
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Post Post #796 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:55 pm

Post by TheRealGin-N-Tonic »

VOTE: Grey That's L-2

I'll quit the not voting at night thing, realizing that it screws with VCAs near end game
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Post Post #797 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:55 pm

Post by -Grey- »

I
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Post Post #798 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:55 pm

Post by -Grey- »

Claim
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Post Post #799 (ISO) » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:55 pm

Post by -Grey- »

Cop
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