Mini Normal 1854: Game Over

[Joshz]

wouldnt claiming to be an expert (note - 7 years of experience) when being accused further prove village

idiot

? no competent player is going to tell people town reading him for being new that hes actually not new.

[Aj The Epic]

No, simply because in most cases, it's rather demoralizing to be called a VI.

[Aristophanes]

Aristo, Hiraki, mind voting AJ with me? As far as catchups go, that one was particularly pitiful.

the one he didn't make yet?

i can't atm tbh

What do you think about the reasons I brought up against Deer?

It's also not like he hasn't had time to catch up and yet the only thing he's able to provide is his ridiculous reasons for reading Eric as scum - do you believe a town player here with any measure of competence should be reading Eric as scum for the reasons AJ is?

I know you're better than this.

I'm almost positive you know that I'm finishing up finals. I've stated that in multiple places. That's what's delayed this. It's not me being less here, that's everywhere. I finished them yesterday morning and had assignments for my job (university resident assistant) that required me to do administrative work until this morning at 2am. Meaning now I'm free.

The the is, I haven't really provided anything on josh other than 1.) Don't pull the noob card, 2.) new town are bleeding heart town and 3.) I didn't like eric's early posting.

Guess what? My slot predecessor agreed with this third point. While people called Eric the VI/newbtown, he contradicted that second point himself.

24 hours and the game's completely caught up on.

AtE, Something akin to an ahmished tell, lack if actual content while emplasizing a weaker point. Admitted cell of a lack of case.

Yep, I like this.

VOTE: AJ

[Aj The Epic]

ROFL an Ahished tell? I was AGREEING with my predecessor.

The lack of content is simply due to how can I have 100% conviction without having completed a read? That's just taking priority right now.

[Dierfire]

VOTE COUNT 2.08

Hiraki (5): Joshz, Lil Uzi Vert, FrankJaeger, Gamma Emerald, TwoFace
Aj The Epic (3): Nachomamma8, xSoniaNevermindx, Aristophanes
xSoniaNevermindx (1): Vedith
Gamma Emerald (1): Hiraki

No Vote (1): Aj The Epic

With 11 players living, 6 votes are required to lynch.

TIMER

(expired on 2016-12-20 16:30:00)

NOTES

Vedith V/LA until 18 December
Prodding FrankJaeger

[Hiraki]

Ari that's a bad vote

[Gamma Emerald]

@Aj: so you really think Eric is such a mastermind that he can fake a statement like "newbies aren't scum"? Look at his other statements. Sonia's post addresses it best.

[Aj The Epic]

Eric's statement wasn't what made me scumread him in the first place. I don't believe being stupid warrants a town read, especially since it's fairly common knowledge that new people to mafia go through R2R first. Certainly I don't think that's enough to take away from the fact that everything I had read when I made the statement was him paying attention only to himself, working hard to have the appearance of shrugging off votes and doing absolutely nothing for the town.

[Gamma Emerald]

TwoFace I'm p sure this is scum so join me on this.
VOTE: Aj the Epic
Your SR on Joshz is horrendous and needs to get fixed, read Eric until you see that there's no way he's scum.

[Joshz]

its ok if he scumreads me for now, doesnt matter. i want to hear the rest of his thoughts after his catchup is done. if it isnt done by the final 24 hours i am down to lynch him though, thats more than enough time.

[TwoFace]

TwoFace I'm p sure this is scum so join me on this.
VOTE: Aj the Epic
Your SR on Joshz is horrendous and needs to get fixed, read Eric until you see that there's no way he's scum.

If people want me to stop tunneling they need to provide me with a better alternative with

good reasoning

[Aj The Epic]

Hey don't bother people trying to slip onto wagons for an easy lynch.

[Aj The Epic]

Twoface is considered conftown, right?

[Gamma Emerald]

Twoface is considered conftown, right?

Pardon? Why do you ask?

[Joshz]

i dont consider him conftown. i understand people typically say bussing an ally that hard is stupid, but its happened. id give him about 95% chance of being town though and not worth pursuing unless you like found a slip in his interactions with fitz or some insane shit like that.

very likely town, not conf.

[Aj The Epic]

I don't use modconfirmed and conftown interchangeably, so that's mostly on me.

Yeah there was 0 reason for him to go after fitz like he did if they were on the same team.

[Lil Uzi Vert]

Disagree with your read on the Eric slot, AJ. At no point in time did his tone indicate that he was trying to be someone he's not and I think you're confusing one defending themselves with being self absorbed here.

[Hiraki]

The votes on AJ have the same consistency in my annoyance with the votes on me.

Disagreement on a situation is

not

scummy. Disagreements on the mindset are more likely to have town/scum influence. (I feel like I wrote this poorly but I'm not sure how to phrase it - if this needs explaining, I will be happy to clarify)

[Hiraki]

I also think that voting AJ before he has a chance to actually summarize the game and give his actual full-on opinion of a situation is not great on either side. No disagreement on the idea that one or two votes don't hurt - moreso that I really really don't like Ari or Gamma's votes.

[xSoniaNevermindx]

Aj's issue is the way he's playing given what's been pointed out to me and the little convo I had seems to be screaming opportunistic on jumping on the eric slot it's not disagreeing that's the sr it's the way he went at it.

The reason you're sr isn't about disagreeing either it's just extremely strange you promise to vote scum and never do.

correct me if I'm wrong but where do you see anything that looks like voting cause of a disagreement

[Hiraki]

I didn't say anything was bad with your vote - I thought yours was pretty fair

[xSoniaNevermindx]

But your logic is that most of the people shouldn't vote him based on a disagreement yeah?

That's what I'm trying to disprove.

[Hiraki]

But your logic is that most of the people shouldn't vote him based on a disagreement yeah?

That's what I'm trying to disprove.

Disagreement on what occurred based on the facts rather than the opinions.

It's abnormal to ever say this without mod confirmation but there is a 0% chance that AJ is correct on his view of the facts. Therefore, I don't think it's very good move to vote him for being incorrect on a situation.

Do you think there is even a small possibility that AJ can get the Eric slot lynched based on Eric's actions? He already has 3 votes on him for insinuating it.

[Aj The Epic]

Nacho, I'd like to debate your read on Ari. My accusations come from his voting patterns, more retroactively viewed.

Who's up for a Fitz lynch today?
His arguments against people are horrendous, and I know he's better than that. I mean like "You voted a Mason before they claimed! You must be scum!" doesn't even make any fucking sense!

VOTE: Fitz

So checking in here. Context: Fitz has started his wall posts by this post, and I think the four-call scum post (with the bad line endings that made it look like a poem) had already come through. There's reason to vote him. To this point, Ari addresses Fitz on a vote for Io(deer)(my) slot's vote on an inactive, voting for Fitz in RVS. Once more later basically on sarcasm which was basically NAI all around. Anyways, there's reason for a Fitz lynch.

I'm dead serious: if we end up not having a decent lynch at deadline I suggest we PL Creeps because his play will get in the way of the town.

I'd be down

Exchange goes together. Gamma advocates the PL on Creeps, Ari shows interest and in fact subsequently votes for creeps on the admitted PL. Both bad by Gamma and Creeps. Major issue is there's two posts between this and his fitz vote. First, one complaining about Creeps posting a huge wall for nothing more than a line response. The second correcting a grammatical mistake in his post brought up by another player.

Nah it's been inactive for a while.

Has it? Huh.

We are going to end up with a no-lynch at this rate. Not good. At all

We should all consolidate on a wagon to avoid this.

VOTE: Creeps

But when push comes to shove, he consolidates on a PL instead of going with what seems to be his scum read. But my problem is, here's the vote count:

havingfitz (3): TwoFace, Gamma Emerald, Aristophanes
Hiraki (3): Lil Uzi Vert, MisaTange, Eric Rasputin
Creeps20 (2): ScumDeersAreVeryTasty, Hiraki
Lil Uzi Vert (1): TheseViolentDelights
TwoFace (1): havingfitz
ScumDeersAreVeryTasty (1): Creeps20

No Vote (2): FrankJaeger, Vedith

He's changing to a creeps vote from his scum read when his vote change just changes the top wagon, not pushes it farther. Which is this awkward action that shouldn't exist given the lynch between a suspected scum and a policy lynch.

Alright, so I've Iso'd Creeps and he hasn't done a single town thing yet. He needs to die. If you disagree, please let me know why, because if you can read this Iso and say "Sure, that could be town" then you've played with some pretty useless townies.

I could also be happy with an Eric lynch, but I'd rather see what his replacement can do I guess.

Gamma is meh. I hate his outing of the partners, but otherwise I guess he's aight. Not a today thing for sure.

Fitz I know I scumread and I can't remember why, nor can I be bothered to check atm. I'll vote there if I have to.

Like honestly, can we just get to the night phase? I'm getting antsy.

Jeeeesus. Can't remember why he scum reads Fitz but knows Creeps is bad, who he moved initially onto a policy lynch. Nothing in Creep's iso is town, but no reference of a specific point. The only saving grace is he thinks Eric is scum. Before you start this shit of "oh but he's VI/Conf town", foot in mouth and continue reading.

Eric's actions actually are consistent with Creeps' own actions this game. Specifically the segment about how Creeps doesn't use an avatar. It's a completely stupid notion and a newb move. Who are you actually trying to get to skip your post? Yet it was blown up to be anti-town in THIS INSTANCE where it's a site wide philosophy held by creeps (as instanced by the fact that you can't change avatars for specific threads). In the fact that he's reading his self-admitted PL and Eric the same way, there is consistency here.

The concerning part that remains is that "Nothing town" doesn't mean "scum" and as short as that bridge is between the two, Ari does nothing to build it. There's no conviction to this wagon that is now entering a range that was about to guarantee creeps' lynch.

And really, looking back we can almost assume that Creep's wagon was a COUNTERWAGON to Fitz, a scum lynch. The one who perpetuates the force of this counterwagon is actually Ari, who basically swung the top two wagons by switching from a scum read to a Gamma-admitted (and not Ari-argued) PL.

but you make the most sense as the scum partner, I called that shit ages ago

fitz/tvd (you)/hiraki

> Calls Fitz Scum
> Refuses to lynch Fitz
>> Refuses to lynch Scum.

Guys, TwoFace is scum :O

This was weird, because it came AFTER fitz was lynched, but before the flip. This is basically targeting out Twoface, who did get a serious case of cold feet vs Fitz but did argue it the majority of the way into existence to begin with. Ari really hadn't been this loose since far earlier in the game, too, and was late to the Fitz wagon. But ODDLY ENOUGH he's got this assuredness that fitz is scum now, after saying he can't remember why fitz was scum earlier.

I'll understand if you want to avoid this, nacho, but I don't want to hear an excuse of meta.

Ari, Gamma.
Hiraki/Frank need to be better seen.

Nacho, Sonia, josh, Vedith are town. If you're going to put Josh as town for Eric, I see no reason Sonia doesn't get the same pass. Hesistant on Uzi.

Given my current wagons, and how Hiraki's wagon has seemed to be the 'easy second' all day yesterday and today, I'd like to point out that Gamma/Frank are all over that wagon.

[FrankJaeger]

All over it