Mini 1820 — Lazy Summer Mafia (Game Over)

[Naomi-Tan]

oh this is some dumb shit i'm not hammered yet fucks sake

Im hoping that 1168 and 1150 is enough for the mod to go ahead with a replacement >_<

[Raskolnikov]

KTS serious question. I've seen you be into scumhunting, being aggressive and dictating the game, from our games and all those silly MD threads too. Even though you screw around often it isn't 100% of what you do since you reach points where you actually get half-serious (almost impatient of no-one taking you seriously) and try to have some influence on the lynch.
Here you've just been completely passive and content doing nothing all game though and its not even like you haven't been here. When you came in, after you got some time as well (while still not under pressure), and now while under pressure, nothing.

Even if IPS slot was just naturally scummy-looking AND you genuinely came up with that catchup (absurd reads given the justifications) AND didn't feel the need to act/vote on those scumreads at the time...
The KTS I know 100% has enough of fucking around at SOME point and does something if the game is going to shit. Every single thing you've done is defensive though and on the passive side and even here you're pretty much giving up and rolling over to die. If you're town why are you so uncharacteristically a b-tch this game? If anything this is perfect situation for town!you to do stuff because in theory it still helps even if you get lynched.

[Killthestory]

Because I'm really tired right now, overgamed, completely busy with a bunch of shit, and stressed out.

I'm not stressin' over a single Mafia game.

[Killthestory]

Like I said, when I'm not as busy, I'll do some more shit, but right now, I really could care less if I'm lynched. If I'm lynched, less work on my plate.

[LicketyQuickety]

Like I said, when I'm not as busy, I'll do some more shit, but right now, I really could care less if I'm lynched. If I'm lynched, less work on my plate.

That can be taken as not playing to your win con, you know that right?

[Killthestory]

No, it can't.

[LicketyQuickety]

No, it can't.

If you are a PR who doesn't care if they are lynched? Yeah, pretty sure. You should never really just say "Oh, IDC go ahead and lynch me" that is a level of lack of effort where it borders on not playing to your win con.

[MariaR]

KTS if you're town you're being super inconsiderate about every other player in this game and really should get a pep in your step.

[Killthestory]

No, it can't.

If you are a PR who doesn't care if they are lynched? Yeah, pretty sure. You should never really just say "Oh, IDC go ahead and lynch me" that is a level of lack of effort where it borders on not playing to your win con.

Clearly you're not reading what I'm saying, then.

@Maria, Then give me fucking time to do shit instead of bitching at me. Focus on somebody else. You're not doing much except trying to make me contribute. I don't give a fuck.

[Raskolnikov]

Earlier. You read the game and had really confident scumreads but didn't feel like voting them or anything? How do you do a catchup and all that time reading the game but do nothing with it.

Even now it's like. If I'm in your position I still take 5-10 minutes to say something substantial because it should help even if I get lynched. IT ISN'T AN OBSCENE REQUEST you could have already done it with the time you spent bitching and earlier saying irrelevant shit. Holding out for a massive wallpost or something to save your ass is way more scum logic "if I don't save myself the effort is all wasted" and wanting it all-or-nothing instead of any compromise. The busy defence doesn't even work if you had time earlier but decided not to use it.

[Fire Assassin]

Fire, did you take into consideration the fact that there are probably more power roles than usual in this game, and the fact that JoaT isn't

that

much better than a different power role?

No and your scummy for suggesting this

[LicketyQuickety]

No, it can't.

If you are a PR who doesn't care if they are lynched? Yeah, pretty sure. You should never really just say "Oh, IDC go ahead and lynch me" that is a level of lack of effort where it borders on not playing to your win con.

Clearly you're not reading what I'm saying, then.

Yeah, I'll admit I'm lost on what you are trying to accomplish.

[Infinity 324]

Fire, did you take into consideration the fact that there are probably more power roles than usual in this game, and the fact that JoaT isn't

that

much better than a different power role?

No and your scummy for suggesting this

Notice my opinion on the subject.

I suggested it because I wanted to see your thought process, you're not giving me much...

[Naomi-Tan]

Apparently the mod believe getting yourself killed isn't against a win con for both scum and town. now ima just sulk as it is apparent we are stuck with a non-contributor actively trying to die.

[Naomi-Tan]

Fire, did you take into consideration the fact that there are probably more power roles than usual in this game, and the fact that JoaT isn't

that

much better than a different power role?

No and your scummy for suggesting this

I dont think it makes him more scummy its pretty logical. all roles are D2 so thats when all our possible information would come from so its likely to have a higher number of powerroles to conpensate for the infomation denial its pretty logical not sure how or why you feel that it would be scummy.

[Naomi-Tan]

Fire, did you take into consideration the fact that there are probably more power roles than usual in this game, and the fact that JoaT isn't

that

much better than a different power role?

No and your scummy for suggesting this

I dont think it makes him more scummy its pretty logical. all roles are D2 so thats when all our possible information would come from so its likely to have a higher number of powerroles to conpensate for the infomation denial its pretty logical not sure how or why you feel that it would be scummy.

"How dare you try to work out the games design!" like seriously.

[Raskolnikov]

Pushing the notion that unless you have hours to post you can't do anything of value so it's not even worth it.

Painting it as though it's our fault he's not contributing and as though we're actually not allowing him to do anything.

Along with literally the safest claim in this specific game (scum with any ability can "prove" joat) I'd just rope this.

The alternative is what even? With how this setup essentially reduces all power roles to 1-shot I don't even think this could be verified or misproven by counterclaim or such (unless via town Joat) so I don't see the point of waiting.
Odds are if he is town and has a cop/gs he gets roleblocked anyways or his inno killed next night and we still have no way of trusting him at any point. Way more likely he's just plain scum though especially with this roleclaim.

Spoiler:

Upside in the unlikely scenario he's town
a) he gets nightkilled which is somewhat better than ml
b) he doesn't get messed with n2, andgets an inno which we can't trust unless he dies (scum would then kill that inno though)
c) he doesn't get messed with, gets a guilty/track/killblock (this is in general unlikely), but even if we lynch we still don't know if its a creative bus
Alternatively he gets messed with and we don't have anything to judge but wifom vs the chance he's scum and claimed to be roleblocked

Basically there's no situation where he's confirmed town even if he was town and the max benefits are all small... if the setup was different cc/no-cc with role and setup speculation could essentially confirm or deny the slot but that's not the case here.

As scum there's icky situations down the line
a) uses a minor scum role (tracker or neap or something) correctly and we don't know how to judge it
b) claims guilty on someone and trades 1 for 1 with town which is REALLY BAD... or unlikely, decides to bus in mad WIFOM style
c) claims inno on someone, kills them and we have mad wifom
[or claims to get roleblocked or just completely lie about role if he's goon]

I think him claiming the role plus the specifics of this setup mean even if he was town the role has already essentially lost utility. Therefore it doesn't make sense backing off using the traditional logic of always backing off PRs d1 for normal setups.

Lack of CC means nothing in this game for Joat so it's not like standard games where you want to wait before doing it; in this case unless town JOAT specifically exists it shouldn't even happen. If this setup was similar but with all n1 instead of n2 I would see some merit of not lynching him today because big deal. But it being n2 means taking the lynch off the table until at least d3 which is really damaging when he's 95% scum.

[MariaR]

I feel so confused because I was SRing Ras but I agree with everything they just said...

[Raskolnikov]

All that said DGB lynch is almost as likely scum so eh. I'd still rather get rid of this ASAP so we don't get stupid WIFOM taking up all of town discussion latergame.

[LicketyQuickety]

Pushing the notion that unless you have hours to post you can't do anything of value so it's not even worth it.

Painting it as though it's our fault he's not contributing and as though we're actually not allowing him to do anything.

Along with literally the safest claim in this specific game (scum with any ability can "prove" joat) I'd just rope this.

The alternative is what even? With how this setup essentially reduces all power roles to 1-shot I don't even think this could be verified or misproven by counterclaim or such (unless via town Joat) so I don't see the point of waiting.
Odds are if he is town and has a cop/gs he gets roleblocked anyways or his inno killed next night and we still have no way of trusting him at any point. Way more likely he's just plain scum though especially with this roleclaim.

Spoiler:

Upside in the unlikely scenario he's town
a) he gets nightkilled which is somewhat better than ml
b) he doesn't get messed with n2, andgets an inno which we can't trust unless he dies (scum would then kill that inno though)
c) he doesn't get messed with, gets a guilty/track/killblock (this is in general unlikely), but even if we lynch we still don't know if its a creative bus
Alternatively he gets messed with and we don't have anything to judge but wifom vs the chance he's scum and claimed to be roleblocked

Basically there's no situation where he's confirmed town even if he was town and the max benefits are all small... if the setup was different cc/no-cc with role and setup speculation could essentially confirm or deny the slot but that's not the case here.

As scum there's icky situations down the line
a) uses a minor scum role (tracker or neap or something) correctly and we don't know how to judge it
b) claims guilty on someone and trades 1 for 1 with town which is REALLY BAD... or unlikely, decides to bus in mad WIFOM style
c) claims inno on someone, kills them and we have mad wifom
[or claims to get roleblocked or just completely lie about role if he's goon]

I think him claiming the role plus the specifics of this setup mean even if he was town the role has already essentially lost utility. Therefore it doesn't make sense backing off using the traditional logic of always backing off PRs d1 for normal setups.

Lack of CC means nothing in this game for Joat so it's not like standard games where you want to wait before doing it; in this case unless town JOAT specifically exists it shouldn't even happen. If this setup was similar but with all n1 instead of n2 I would see some merit of not lynching him today because big deal. But it being n2 means taking the lynch off the table until at least d3 which is really damaging when he's 95% scum.

I have a question regarding this, but besides that it looks really solid. What was that about Scum Tracker? I've never seen a Scum Tracker in a game, so its a little "huh?"

But you've convinced me:

VOTE: KTS

[MariaR]

what the fk...

[Raskolnikov]

Huh. Since you mentioned it I just looked back if I ever played with it since I wasn't sure how it came to mind. Thing was actually scum JOAT with a 1-shot track in that game which I remember seeing and thinking scum tracker would actually be cool in that it's like neapolitan-esque but stronger in function. Either that stuck with me or I subconsciously remembered with the joat thinking... which is weird and actually kind of cool.

[LicketyQuickety]

Huh. Since you mentioned it I just looked back if I ever played with it since I wasn't sure how it came to mind. Thing was actually scum JOAT with a 1-shot track in that game which I remember seeing and thinking scum tracker would actually be cool in that it's like neapolitan-esque but stronger in function. Either that stuck with me or I subconsciously remembered with the joat thinking... which is weird and actually kind of cool.

Your points are good, its hard to track (heh... ahem) them sometimes.

[Infinity 324]

Your points make sense rask, but I'm still not getting why you're so confident he's trolling scum and not trolling town.

I'd wait to see what he says first, and if it's not super towny, we can lynch him then.

[Killthestory]

Okay, I'm done working, time to make a post.