Open 50: The New C9 - Abandoned!

[LaptopGun]

Hey yo! Looks like utter chaos. I love it. Wile I agree with sammich that perhaps serious discussion is a usually unwarrented on page one, I love we have a couple leads. If I had to guess, I'd say sk kill means the vig. I'm guessing the vig kill follows the same format of the mafia kill- of course maybe in the street is designation of a pro town role... Hell I dont know.

Random vote-random number generator on my calculator

vote: somestrangeflea

[LaptopGun]

Oh yeah full disclosure I was in a game previously with somestrangeflea. Ah maybe I shouldnt be voting for him. Damn calculator.

[LaptopGun]

I guess here's my first seemy serious post. Now with content!

I am gonna way in on the 2 major bandwagons we seem to be arranging. It seems to me one of the two was either started or stoked in order to protect a mafia who had come under scrutiny. Looking at the early game I was struck by how quickly Jordan got voted for after he called out Oman. LML, Tyler, Aimme, and White are possible. I am not saying any any of these guys are scummy. Indeed Tyler has been downright funny and the other two seem town. LML is the only one I think has given out any of these so-called scum tells. All things created equal I'd like to believe none of the three are mafia, What I am saying is Oman has not acted particuarly townie in his posts (I'd contend he's prickling my Scum-O-Meter). I think Jordan is getting railroaded. Oman then decided to pile on the Jordan vote, which was started by LML. Wouldn't it make sense LML tried to preempt a more serious vote on Oman, who has now come full circle to try to get it finished? That's my opinion.

On another note, SSF has gone ahead and offered a defense of two other players. Not scummy, but certainly interesting that we have 3 remaining mafia. Defensiveness of Jordan+Oman not really being scummy. Really crappy evidence (I think I am reading to much into it), I just think I should point that out. It's enough to make me keep my vote on SSF for a little while.

[LaptopGun]

Really crappy evidence (I think I am reading to much into it), I just think I should point that out. It's enough to make me keep my vote on SSF for a little while.

Explain this please, I'm not really sure what you're getting at. You think my reasons for defending Oman and LML were crappy?
quote]

No, no. I was saying I had some minor suspicons about you for crappy evidence. You seemed to defend 2 people in your post, one who was really suspicous and one who was pushing a vote. It struck me as odd, but hardly anything to build a case on. It did however make me keep my random vote where was.

I dont think your reasons for "defending" for particuarly bad. Ok, I think Oman really doesn't have a lot of "good about him, but you did offer reasons for your defense. I use defense here more or less in a general sense, not that you really like them. Sorry for the confusion. Oh, and I like the Kirby avatar.

[LaptopGun]

ABWOP
I don't think I explained my post well (again). I mean my suspicions are really not concrete, more of noting behavior.

[LaptopGun]

Well, I guess white isn't helping himself. I think the extrapolations are logical and it's not good. But suffice to say, everyone should post more and we'd know for sure who everyone was. Right . Chill guys. Speaking a lot does mean the mafia have more ammo to work with too. What's that proverb, let the gangster run out his own rope to hang themselves. It worls both ways. If it helps any, I dont put much stock in length of post analysts- unless of course someone has previous play experience with a particular player. If that player spoke a lot and was a townie, short posts maybe an indication of someone.

In the newbie games I've played the successful mafia players turned out to be the ones that got other players to talk about each other. If your experience is different, well hey, that's cool.

[LaptopGun]

Any one have a clue why this game is moving along so so fast. Is it just our motely crew of players, random game movies, or is (are) player(s) manipulating things? At the rate we are going, we're going to have power role claims starting on page 6 or 7.

[LaptopGun]

Oman I just read your signature and I agree with "ChronX the Whining Woman" to the utmost degree.

[LaptopGun]

Unvote

Any one have a clue why this game is moving along so so fast. Is it just our motely crew of players, random game movies, or is (are) player(s) manipulating things? At the rate we are going, we're going to have power role claims starting on page 6 or 7.

Fast moving game -> Players in a rush to post -> Scum more likely to screw up.

You seem to be wanting this game to slow down, care to explain why?
[/b].

By the same token that the scum screw up, the townies can screw up and mislynch. The games I've played have taught me that. In one Newbie Game, one of the mafia players (who was very slick) deliberately sped the game up to forced us into lylo (full disclosure- this got me lynched day 1 as the doc and then a night liynch of our COP). The townies won despite the odds as the remaining "head" townie guy dragged his feet about everything and the mafia made a mistake trying to lynch someone else. Not enough bandwagon. Granted in a bigger game such as this that's not as massive as an issue. I thought I'd point it point it out. I'd be more concerned if we didn't have more than one running bandwagon. Less chance of a quick hammer sort of deal. Whatever, whatever the case maybe this game is fun .

[LaptopGun]

Sorry SSF I interpreted it as more the later and not the former.

White, I've tried to explain myself. I dont like fast games that quickly get townies accidently killed. I do like them when the Mafia slip up. I know it is "glass is half full/empty deal." Take it how you will. I think we have slowed down becsause the Jordan bandwagon has stalled. It seems debate about me is keeping things trucking...

Tyler I really don't have a lot to change it one way or another, so I am standing pat.

[LaptopGun]

Oman if you are sincere I thank you for your selflessness. However I have a hard time believing it's sincere. I really can see one of the mafia or that wonderful serial killer we've talked about saying this in a selfrightous manner. You say you just want to help catch scum, I just have not seen this in your behavior. I'll play devil's advocate and say "Well you could be getting the mafia to talk more. If I <Oman> get lynched, the town can see who led the bandwagon." The problem is you "kinda" have been bandwagoing yourself. <Yes that's understatement>

[LaptopGun]

Yeah Im sitting around with my intally random vote. I could be voting for you Oman, however I feel SFF has done some stuff that's left me unsettled. I said it before, I like it right where it is right now.

[LaptopGun]

I have been dealing with midterms. To post I set aside a certain amount from studying. Sorry I have not been on enough, then. If you consider that lurking, I am sorry and I am still commited to this game.

I stated my argument earlier but I'll rehash it for you. SSF picked 2 other players to defend out of the blue early in the game before we had a firm grasp how some of these people acted. It's not a lot to go on, but I felt it was worthwhile enough to keep for a little bit. SSF also did a OMGUS vote on me earlier that I didnt call him on. He tried to justify it by saying "Yeah this is gonna look OMGUS but..." and I really didnt care because at the time I firmly expected to vote for Oman in the very near future. But you know what, I keep thinking SSF is being disingenuous. He keeps like trying to grease the wheels of the Oman bandwagon. So I am staying with my vote right now. Also I can't exactly switch now anyway as wouldn't that look scummy? Thanks.

FYI this whole thing stems from Post 49. SSF defends Jordan and says he doesn’t considers Oman ok. That struck me as covering his bases or possibly a team member or 2.

[LaptopGun]

ABWOP I should say Oman vacilates between deflecting attention from Oman or trying to "grease the wheels." I am not really sure what to make of that.

[LaptopGun]

I never said I had amazing reasons for voting for SSF. They are pretty stupid, but I am nervous that SSF is mafia. If I cant say it any clearer. I really think you guys are doing a good job getting people to talk in this thread, which is something that has been lacking in my other games. I appreciate you getting me to think more about what I believe. It is frustrating that I can't really be as active as I like to be so I am keeping up as best I can.

[LaptopGun]

I am not really sure how to bring in more people who have been silent or lurking. I suspect more people would get involved depending on how the Day 1 vote goes. There may be other ways to find fuel for the fire. Say for example LML, if and when he decides to return. I'd really like to hear from him right about now.

skitzer, who else has been particuarly scummy for you?

[LaptopGun]

Finally, LML returns with content. Yeah Aimee is still a blackout for me. My wavering suspicions of SSF are what they are: something I am nevrous about. I am starting to see how retarded my fears about SSF have been, but whatever. However I agree aimee was out of nowhere, unless Aimee really puts stock in my curious notes. Oman is right, it maybe a stretch, but it is so very strange I gotta pay attention to it.

Im gonna unvote now just to try to make up my mind about somethings.

unvote SSF

.

[LaptopGun]

Yeah SSF was pretty accurate. Sorry I should have cleared that up for you Jordan and sorry SSF for having to do it. If you find me scummy for tha backtrack, there really isnt much I can do about that. I said I didn't want to unvote and was called for "What you are worried? Townies shouldnt be. Some things are scummy to some and not for others: For example I find Oman and to a lesser extent OOba scummy while I dont really understand the Sammich one.

Then again, I also think at least one of the bandwagons was fanned by a mafia member. Intially I though LML against Jordan was too so I dont known.

[LaptopGun]

TylerJ

Goes along with voting Jordan with the tone in the early stages in the game. Casts suspicous on Oman for being to careless in bandwagons and sees him trying to throw attention off him. Gets a null tell on White's statement about "short post=townies" and says that if such discussion on things like this were to continue then people would become too focused and miss lynching scum. Counter-reacts to Oman accusing him of past actions such as stating "He's trying to get people to ignore him" Several inrevelant posts later he posts "We should wait until more evidence for or on Oman comes up." It seems like he really wants to push suspision on Oman or want people to make a strong case on him when the evidence arrives. Then he proclaims SSF as scum after evidence is given and after SSF makes a defense he says in that defense he scumhunted and takes back the statement of SSF being scum back and says he's just trying to be humurous. Vote:TylerJ Getting a strong scummy vibe from him.

I see Tyler J as either the sterotypical leader by default or completely anti-town. He really does want to further the discussion, but then when it comes to actaully delivering, he remains aloof or beligerent himself. I think you rightly proclaim some of his behavior as scummy, but he may just be so forceful he does that naturally. I dont know as of yet. What I do know is that a lot of my suspicions of Oman, besides what I percieved as insincerity on Oman's part, were originally pointed out by Tyler. I suspect that several others agreed with him (whether directly or as a concurrent opinion). So you have a single player having a profound impact on a bandwagon.

Ooba-

Would like to see more from this person. Not active in discussion in throwing in some of his opinions or thoughts but instead asks questions refering to what he quotes. Does a short Analysis on people who were involved with the Oman bandwagon and gives little sentiments on the topics with two "No Comment" I don't see the reason in quoting something when you have nothing to say. A theory of my could be he didn't want to press suspicous on certain people but I can't say this is true but it's possible. Netural feeling on him.

I'd like to know why Ooba did the quoting without the analysis. Was his point suposed to have been so self-evident he didnt' feel obligated to point them out? Or does he want to lay the ground work (collect and show the evidence) of a case but does not want to be responsible for the subsequent lynch of a townie. This is counter-town.

Right now Tyler seems more of a suspect than Ooba.

[LaptopGun]

FOS: Sammich

I find hiis whole post has a derth of real analysis. This is not enough for a vote but Sammich's analysis seems so off based I could almost see it as a poorly coded messaae to mafia brothers. He named his vague suspicions about who he thinks could be a town power role and the serial killer. Interesting. I think the biggest strike against this idea is that the mafia could just say this at night free of charge. Also there is the possibility that Sammich could just be terribly inept at articulating his suspicions. Still I find that he is not particuarly aiding the town with his post.

[LaptopGun]

No content whatso ever, I just want to wish Jordan a Happy Birthday!

[LaptopGun]

I unvoted SSF two pages back.

I am not voting anyone at this time as I have a lot to think about. Shteven is going through some interesting machinations to really hammer home Sammich is scum. I find Sammich's behavior scummy while I think Shteven is trying to really help town. The problem is the mafia would want to be this nice and hammer home how an innocent townie is scum. Whatever the case I got scum vibes from Sammich. Im gonna do a reread and see if I get more of them.

[LaptopGun]

I am glad to see we all made it out of kindergarten :rolleyes:

Well here we go. Either Sammich is scum or he's innocent getting railroaded. I will say I feel bad for him that his hardworn analysis has left the people who are still responding to the thread unsatisfied. I just dont know at this point. I will maintain that I feel the mafia have been fanning the bandwagons... or perhaps starting new ones to divert attention from their cohorts. In this game the mafia have been active (more active than in my previous experience). Or that's my theory...

Request can we get another vote count?

[LaptopGun]

I try to add my thoughts on what is going on and people either ignore what I say or say I am not contributing anything of value. I am trying to help. When I say I think someone like SSF is scummy, I am accused of having tunnel vision (this seems to be a popular title to toss around the thread). I am certainly not as vocal as some of the other players here, but I am trying to offer stuff to this debate. I just wish we had more stuff to talk about.

[LaptopGun]

^^^I think there are 5 or 6 people who would more likely be replaced than you.

[LaptopGun]

I actually think the bumping is doing us a favor; moreover I think people's reactions to its scuminess or normalcy. A few of you are jumpy, aren't you?

[LaptopGun]

Ok. I think one of the bandwagons we dealt with was either started by or faned by the mafia, perhaps in an attempt to protect one of their own from getting lynched. Oman was clearly the trendy pick, and indeed his behavior certainly didn't help things. I amit I wnet along with that as I stil dont know if he's townie. Samich may or may not be clean cut but people do seem to be exaggerating how bad his post was. Yeah it was bad and devoid of new content. Im just getting kind of sick of this anti-Sammich vibe.

If I had to take a guess, TylerJ, Sammich and Oman are my top suspects. Oman ihas been talked about ad nauseum. Yes the mafia could have been exaggerating how bad Oman has been, but I have not been getting one of those so-called "warm and fuzzy" feelings about Oman. Tyler has been jumping around to try to get people to vote for someone. I think I said this before, but I just keep getting a "here's the evidence no you make the case so you are responsible for He was particuarly vocal when it came to Oman and has never seemed to be courteous. By the same token, I have issues with Sammich. I keep changving my mind on this one, but Tyle has a consitent string of this thinking.

FOS TylerJ

Oh and an update to my previous tunnel vision, SSF has been acting just fine in the past couple pages. I get a town vibe out of him.

[LaptopGun]

Just a clarification. I find Sammich suspicious. I just have issues with just the tidal wave of hatred for the guy- granted this could ahve something to do with teh fact we really havent had much else to talk about and/or his biggest detractors have been the only ones who have stuck around for this game.

[LaptopGun]

I didn't find the post scummy. I thought it was a mildly curious point that didn't get addressed perhaps as much as it should have been (like a lot of things in this game) but I dont see it as a bit of concern. Tyler has done some other things which are more noteworthy. He has also taken pains to address my concerns and I find they are reasonable. Let me say I still stand by what I said, but Tyler is trying to help keep this game going. That does say something to me and it's generally good. His exact motive of course isn't clear but thats why the game is divided into sides (town, mafia, other antitown). We all get carried away some times and say things we regret. Sometimes they are simple "heat of the moment" we regret afterwards. Of course by the same token these could be scumtells. I still think Tyler is suspicious, but I also feel he is trying to be sincere. Again whether that's in the town's best interests remain to be seen.

That's how I see Tyler. Someone acting to keep the game going (probably good) for unknown motive (good? bad? ugly?).

[LaptopGun]

yeah you do, now back on topic. What was the topic again

That's a very good question Previous serious subjects have included yourself, scumtells vs non tells, misunderstandings, some guy who sounds like he's from Sanford and Son, and abandonment issues. Take your pick.

Seriously now, I am as confused as everyone else why the game broke apart like it has.

[LaptopGun]

Oman, that's just stupid to say. It's a bad idea for the town to do randomly- granted, we may not know a lot about some of these people anyway. I also think at least one of the lurkers is a mafia whos gone MIA. Still I dont like the odds. If we're all hard up to lynch, lets vote for the suspicious characters we have gone after. I realize some people would include me in that, and I understand that some people are concerned about me (though I hope I can alleviate things), that as long as we do something intelligent.

[LaptopGun]

Unless Oman is MeMe's alt or something.

Haha. So if the Russian roulett theory ends up killing the mod, who takes over? So kidding...

[LaptopGun]

Scum are more likely to lurk when a deadline is around though.

I agree. I've seen it in the other games I've been in. It's by no means a ironclad trend, but for once I think Oman said something that actually helps the town.

[LaptopGun]

Where's SSF?

[LaptopGun]

Hi guys. Should re-read tonight.

Long time no see, Fonz.

[LaptopGun]

Hmmm So let me get this straight... we're stuck in at least three seperate catch-22's?

[LaptopGun]

The way I see it, and I could be wrong with any or all of them:
1. We want more people to post so we have more stuff to talk about, but we need more stuff to talk about to get people to post.
2. Oman could be scum or the mafia are pushing for a mislynch, but to find out we may have to lynch him.
3. The suspicious characters (LMF, for instance) who aren't posting need some prodding to get them to talk again, but such prodding may just alienate them even more.

[LaptopGun]

I wasn't saying to have you lynched Oman. I'm saying, because you act so erratic and inflamatory, you look suspicous. However it seems a lot of people keeping digging their claws into to you for pretty crappy reasons. It's one thing if you dont like my observations, but dont take them out of context and claim I want you lynched. Hell I'd rather try to figure out who you are through talking. What I have learned is I find you highly suspicious, sure, and I find your twisting my words here, but right now I'd rather not have you lynch as I find the experiences around your bandwagon suspious. Hence a catch22- damned if we do and damned if we dont.

1. So you like my first point?
2. I think I've addressed this
3. Umm so you want to drive people away? It's a ctahc 22 because all that happens is we drive peopel to leave the game (or it seems to me). Yeah we get a bunch of replacements to play... and probably leave anyway because you keep attacking them. Great plan. Great protown thing to do. I'd like to retain as many of the players we have who we know stuff about (and yes there are somepeople who we know very little about).

[LaptopGun]

Well he did say he was trying to find a replacement for himself... But yeah very good idea taking this to the Queue.

[LaptopGun]

Actually, that's WIFOM...

Has Gatorguy been active anywhere?

Not since the 12th.

Haha, too very nice pieces of info.

[LaptopGun]

I will will not have internet acess for the next couple days. Sorry. Home for Thanksgiving and our broadband is having issues.

[LaptopGun]

Whatever. I am still here.

[LaptopGun]

.

Conclusion

: Seems very scummy to me upon reread. I wouldn't mind seeing more pressure on this guy, well, actually his replacement, since LML seems to have dissapeared off this face of the Earth.

I hate to nitpick in your otherwise clear analyisis, but I am curious what you meant by "pressure". Are you saying we need to talk about him more? Or do you want to try a vote to push idea? I certainly agree we have a lot to talk about in this thread, a good part of that about people who have gone AWOL or MIA. For that reason, I dont think votes on LML would work towards such an end. He's been scummy and a vote would not be wasted on him- I just dont see it as a good stradegy for LML and some of the MIA's.

Then again I am thinking you meant more the former.

Ok fine yeah we need to do a lot of talking. I need to do a lot more talking.

[LaptopGun]

Vote Tyler J

for going with whoever Jordan's PBPA told him too.

To be fair, Jordan didn't finish the posting. Either he's just trying to keep game going (as he says) or hes "just" playing along to put the mafia in a good situation. Or Jordan and Tyler are working together. Naaaaaah. That's just ridiculous. Curious move by Tyler, but maybe this game needs a shot in the arm.

[LaptopGun]

Welcome Justin. Like the analysis. I have t to say that yeah its pretty odd Tyler has been a bit cavalier with his actions. Oh, I think if I wasnt sick or stuck in finals hell I may be able to do better, but here goes. Do you think he is hiding something to prevent us from following his logic or do you think he's hiding that he is a non-pro town guy?

Let me play devil's advocate for a sec here. One thing that scares me about recaps is the danger that the writer, the one analysing someone, misunderstands what was going on. The poster, the one being analyised, really doesn't remember what they were trying to do. This coud be misconstrued. I am not criticisng you at all, but as a result that the poster could look suspicious. The poster would have a bit of an argument.

[LaptopGun]

Excuse me if I take awhile to decide my vote. And it takes a while to change my mind about a vote. I’m slow. Sorry. I was about to make up my mind about Oman when the game started to petter out and things haven’t been the same since.

Unvote

Any one have a clue why this game is moving along so so fast. Is it just our motely crew of players, random game movies, or is (are) player(s) manipulating things? At the rate we are going, we're going to have power role claims starting on page 6 or 7.

Fast moving game -> Players in a rush to post -> Scum more likely to screw up.

You seem to be wanting this game to slow down, care to explain why?

Whilst running the risk of being accused of OMGUS,

Vote: LaptopGun

.

=o

You do realize he snuck a OMGUS vote in and didn’t even try to explain, right? I didn’t really call him on it then, and I got crucified for that later when I brought it up later. I didn't then because I was changing my mind, and about to vote someone else. People apparently find this scummy.

I felt people would accuse me of being a flipflop if I cnaged my mind from SSF quickly. It seems a few of you even did while others feel what was called tunnel vision was scummy.

I still see the fast moving game leads to scum screwing up argument as a cover for fast moving game scum gets town to screw up. That’s my opinion and my logic, if you guys care to call it crap, be my guest. I didn’t see a lot of particularly good logic coming in this game at the time. Clearly this has changed.
I even posted :

Sorry SSF I interpreted it as more the later and not the former.

White, I've tried to explain myself. I dont like fast games that quickly get townies accidently killed. I do like them when the Mafia slip up. I know it is "glass is half full/empty deal." Take it how you will. I think we have slowed down becsause the Jordan bandwagon has stalled. It seems debate about me is keeping things trucking...

Tyler I really don't have a lot to change it one way or another, so I am standing pat.

Exasperation drove me to sarcasm and say that “At this rate we’ll have roll claims in a couple pages <6?>” If I can’t be sarcastic, then how can any of your other stuff be non-scummy? I find we have some sarcastic people there. I do find we have quite a few sarcastic people. Sorry, next time I’ll load my sarcastic posts up with have a dozen smilies. I’ll say it until I’m blue in the face, I felt the fast moving game was dangerous. Clearly I will admit the stage we were in of a slow death wasn't much better.

On Ooba- I was more worried about someone who posts very often. Ooba hasn’t done a hell of a lot besides this. So in your eyes I should have made a bigger deal of Ooba or focused on Tyler?

[LaptopGun]

Shteven- Am I missing something? I hate to jump in on this but: Are you saying you never bother checking up on meta-defenses for other people and just go with a "what have you done for me now" ? If that's true, why didn't you just say so? Did I miss read you? Tell me I'm wrong, cause I have no real way to evaluate it.

[LaptopGun]

I would have expected you to have said it a bit more convincingly early. That nugget of wisdom is helping with my analysis of your "defense" in light of justin's "attack" on you. (not in a literal sense, just logically here). If it's any consolation, this is my third game.

[LaptopGun]

By my count it's 4 MIA's (not counting Timmers, who apparently was already replaced) who need to be replaced or modkilled.

Ok Justin sorry I haven't been around. If you want my scum list here it is buddy: 1. TylerJ for all sorts of reasons w'eve discussed.
2. Shteven Attempted to get Sammich lynched. I guess he'd be the one attempting to flame the wagon. I believed Sammich's behavior was simply reprehensible. Shteven was the one calling out. I bought it, with some reservations. Now I think that in the situation the mafia would try to jump on him in such a "nice" manner. I bought it and went with it for a while, but I got to say I am just not comfortable with how myself and others went with that discussion.
3. ooba ,aka the partner. Unless Im mistakened, adds his two cents and votes how the other potentail mafia go. I haven' checked, but he's agreed with Tyler. I'm really unsure about this one, perhaps I am being too paranoid.

I'd add Oman to that list for his behavior, but it is my belief that the wagon against him was flammed by one or more mafia. It would seem this is TylerJ, who has basically waged a one man vendetta against him. If you believe there has been a partner in all of this, ooba would be there too.

[LaptopGun]

I think we'll hear back on that by the end of the week, he's been pretty good answering/doing things. All hail the new mod! I'll continue my check ins for the next couple days.

[LaptopGun]

Wow, I forgot how retarded LML was acting. I remebered his early game "Look I found the power role guys." The subsequent stuff Justin brings up about LML vs Oman is also fasinating. If I may add something- he tried to identify the vigilante. I will assume for the sake of argument we have a vig and a sk in our game. Unless I'm seriously mistaken (and I'm not), the vig is a pro-town power role. Why would a townie call out an ally? Also his more concrete assertions about who the serial killer is benefit the mafia as much as the town. If anything he looked more pro-mafia than pro town.

Sadly I think this is analysis is moot. He's an MIA and it looks like the hammer is going to fall on all of them- if not (miraculously) and he was replaced, I'd feel bad for the replacement. That's an awful lot of scumminess that needs to be explained away,. It's possible, but that person would still be dogged by it. That's my opinion.

[LaptopGun]

Damn, that's a lot of hilarity. I'll be back tomorrow for fallout analysis.

[LaptopGun]

1. I can't believe I have to say this, but I am NOT the serial killer. I suspect I will be nightkilled as why would the mafia let a confirmed townie runabout. SSF, it's ok.

2. Actually, come to think of it the scum probably would want to discredit me. Let's see, get the innocent player mis-lynched so they don't need to "waste" a night kill on me. Oh joy. Luckily I don't think SSF was trying to do that. SSF appears to have just misread things, and that's totally understandable.

3. Ithink Khel is doing the best he could. Yeah he screwed up with the miss mod kill of Fonz. It however does not mean the death knell of the the mafia. I think I just showed one hypothetical way they could use the mod's revelation against the town.

4. Fonz, you were not nearly as active as in the game I was with you previous as. At some point I was going to play the "previous experience card" and question whether you were a townie. Sadly we'll never know how you would have did against it. Yes that is a shame, but I don't think And by previous experience, I mean you picking someone remotely scummy and claiming they were mafia until they were blue in the face.

5. Perhaps Khel didn't want to mod kill the other MIA's because there are more mafia members or power roles represented in that group.

6. If you want to question my bias, yes I benefited from the mod revelation more so than other players. I realize that. The town benefited by having the innocence of one of it's member's confirmed. The mafia lost a member and apparently will have a clear bias to nightkill me. The town just lost a powerful role too (granted there maybe another cop- I don't know, but it's a possibility). I still think the mafia can win this game- get a mislynch of a townie or get the S/K lynched then nightkill me. Suddenly the mafia are in good shape again. Oh and let's not forget we apparently have 2 power roles who can nightkill. Yes you could lose another mafia member or 2. That's called risk. Another townie or 2 could get nightkilled by those roles- and your position is even better.

7.Hence I don't like abandonment and I vote for continuing game.

vote: continue game

[LaptopGun]

Great I missed Oman's cop claim. Great. For the record I don't like mass claims.

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Guess Oman got hung out to dry. Sorry dude.

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I'd like to rejoin the restarted game if I can.

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If the role claims are true, I find that hilarious that most of my suspicions were focused on a cop and a doc.

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I posted this in the queue. "/in for the reboot of Open 50 or /in for next, depending what comes first. I'd prefer to stick with the restart, but if it's just going to be completely new players I'd take a new game too. Thanks, Thesp"

I had fun with you guys, no matter how frustrating this thing turned into.

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The Mafia weren't screwed, but they had a difficult battle had we continued.

Yeah Jordan as mafia or sk, even if I kept second guessing myself. Jordan you played pretty well, but the screaming divided mass that was the townies just weren't going to lynch Oman. You may have gotten us to turn on Shteven, but I think Justin wasn't going to allow that to happen. If Fonz was gonna try anything of that nature, I was gonna question him. The Mafia were actually much more active than I thought, Jordan included. Question- did the mafia make a concerted effort against me or was I doing a pretty good job of that myself. I really only remember fielding questions from Jordan... and our power roles.

I can't believe LML was town. Such "misguided behavaior," I guess. If I had to guess who was the serial killer, I'd say Tyler. If he was one of the MIA's I really don't have a clue. Tyler seemed to be an equal opertunity offender. Mind you I suspected 2 of our power roles as mafia, so my judgement isn't exactly perfect.

Justin, if you ever play a game as a mafia and act as well as you did, I feel for the townies. You're just too good.

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*A very very very difficult battle