Micro 440: Triplicate Mafia - Game Over

[Hopkirk]

VOTE: Good morning

In my country it is 7:40pm. That is not the morning.

[Hopkirk]

Do you deny my logic of lynching liars?

[Hopkirk]

Where is wisdom? That's the only name i recognize in this game.

[Hopkirk]

Do you deny my logic of lynching liars?

lol. Shall I explain why I am wary of BBmolla then?

I'm not sure how you can be wary of someone who hasn't posted?

Just thinking, should we actually vote in this setup or use pseudovotes? I haven't played it before and am not sure what the best way to do it is, hunt in your group or hunt among everyone like a normal game.

[Hopkirk]

hmm... so far I want to vote both my group mates...

And yet you don't vote either of us? Sounds pretty off.

VOTE: Lucky

[Hopkirk]

I just consulted my juju priest.

It says:

Scripten
Hopkirk
Zubullu

What the hell is a juju priest?


Witness does sound a bit off, even if you think you're the townblock you need to lynch the most scummy person in the block for obvious reasons.
@Witness: In what way would your vote/actions at the end of the day be influenced if you were (lets say 90% sure) you were part of the town group?

[Hopkirk]

I don't get what's scummy about zeb's post, could you elaborate?

[Hopkirk]

Don't have time to post atm. I will be able to tomorrow.

[Hopkirk]

I can't really tell what's going on at the moment, a bit confused. Need to read through more.

Goodmorning looking townish atm so staying on lucky.

[Hopkirk]

Well this will be rather easy for me today. GM seems town enough that I can just

VOTE: hopkirk

It's not that I feel strongly about Hopkirk, We could be the town block sure but I agree that discussion of that doesn't really gain us anything.

So could you answer my question about why you didn't vote either of us if we were both suspicous?

Is this molla's usual style? It feels rather blunt and decisive. I did notice someone saying he usually makes short posts so idk.

I don't particularly like scrifton or WP. I do like serra though. I doubt this is the scumless group.

[Hopkirk]

Sorry, i realized i'd put a f instead of a p by mistake after posting but didn't notice the o as well.

[Hopkirk]

@Zeb: Having trouble getting into the game due to lack of anything really catching my interest and being as confident as a can that i'm voting scum.

[Hopkirk]

What exactly do you want me to elaborate on?

Reasons for said reads? Though i'm one to talk...

If I had to lynch in Power I'd lynch Hopkirk. GM is town, and Lucky's scumhunting seems pretty genuine.

What scumhunting has lucky done?

[Hopkirk]

Going through lucky.
Lots of posts which don't say anything excluded.

hmm... so far I want to vote both my group mates...

Didn't like this post. He wants to vote us both yet doesn't follow up with any attempt to decide which? It seems like he was just waiting until one of us looked worse than the other.

Well this will be rather easy for me today. GM seems town enough that I can just

VOTE: hopkirk

It's not that I feel strongly about Hopkirk, We could be the town block sure but I agree that discussion of that doesn't really gain us anything.

Three problems i have with this post.
1.) Following on from the last post, it follows the scum motivation- just waiting to vote oppertunistly.
2.) Classic scum lylo crossvoting move.
3.) The last point is strange to raise. It seems like he wants to say what WP did but then, as he's worried about people voting WP for it, he makes a change to the end. Why raise it if he doesn't think it matters? I suppose it also accomplishes the goal of making it harder to argue against his vote on me- making it from lack of choice rather than specifics.

Power: Talk more

I am now, and good morning had been, so you must mean hopkirk.

I admit that my talking has been lacking but so had his. The redirect is interesting.

So could you answer my question about why you didn't vote either of us if we were both suspicous?

Partially because the comment was an exasperated sarcastic comment and partially because I can't vote two people at once. While I didn't mean to be gone for two days, sitting back did reveal GM to be pretty dang town, so now I don't have to choose!

Quoting this purely to have his response here. No real comment except i don't buy it. Seems to reinforce what i was saying earlier too.

@Zeb: Having trouble getting into the game due to lack of anything really catching my interest and being as confident as a can that i'm voting scum.

Even if nothing is catching your interest, you could ask some questions. It's probably a lock that it will be between you and me in our block, so how about we turn our attentions to the other blocks and input there.

This has some scummy motivation. If this block is between me and him why should we not pay attention to it? Seems like he wants to just get an easy lynch on an inactive while saying something (lets scumhunt more) that appeals to the town. Note he doesn't actually do much about finding other block scum despite saying we all should.

[Hopkirk]

Last block i have no idea. Second block i'm leaning towards scripten but i need to read them again.

[Hopkirk]

Scripten.

Several posts on meta that i'm not quoting due to length.
I don't particularly understand why he didn't mention WP's meta or, if meta of RVS doesn't tell him anything, why he bothers with RVS meta.

I think I'd probably rather lynch scripten between him and WP.

Fine.

Then fucking lynch me then lynch WP. You seriously think that bull was town-motivated?

@GM: Prove me wrong instead of being condescending, maybe?

Completely out-of-game, your dismissive, short-sighted tunneling seriously makes me not want to play mafia. Seriously.

Well this is firstly a bit on an ATE (the whole "lynch me i don't care) but the thing i'm more concerned with is why he only says this about WP. As i brought up in my last post, lucky basically does the same thing. Yet scripten has ignored lucky completely.

I agree that we should be scumhunting throughout the game. I'm noticing that there's an amount of consensus on that fact. Serra's FoS-vote equivalence suggestion is a good one.

I would propose we open the question of whom to lynch in each group to all of us, deciding by majority in each case if possible, runoff if not.

As is, we have the following issues with our voting system:

- members of the all-town group can't actually vote for scum today

- while randomly lynching in a 3p LyLo has a 1/3 town EV, in reality only takes 1 of the 2 town to vote wrongly for scum to win, giving a real EV somewhere closer to 1/4

- scum interactions will be much harder to gauge, since some people will not necessarily focus on all groups. leading on from that, mislynches in a group could easily be used D2 by out-of-group scum to push a mislynch of someone in the group.

I don't think us talking about all groups really compensates for the concrete opinions that should underpin voting.

Do you think we should all just list the other players in order of scumminess, separated by groups? I feel like this is what you're suggesting, but I'm not sure.

P-Edit: Oh, I was prodded. Didn't realize my activity was so bad. And WP is being replaced. Interesting. Going to unvote until I can get a read on the replacement.

UNVOTE: Witness Protection

Why did you unvote someone you have a cement scumread on?

[Hopkirk]

On witness protection nothing jumps out at me except post 17. Of Beastcharizard i have nothing to say so far.

Last time I played this set up, gm killed me off for the win.

@ PN I know how this game works, I just wanted to hear their voices before I decide if one of them is scum.

We

might be the Town bloc.

pedits @ Hopkirk We can vote/unvote until all three groups reach a lynch,

at the same time

. Then Tomorrow, things go back to being, uh, normal. When I have a feeling on who should be the lynch Today, I'll vote.

more pedits gm can be a tricksy one.

This is the same (almost) as what i said i dislike about lucky. This could be a scumtell but then he goes on to actually look at scripten, though a lack of looking at serra is mildly suspicious, and gives a few reasons.


Serra and goodmorning: I read through their posts and both sound like they're genuinely scum hunting. Townreads on both for now.
Conclusions so far: Lucky very likely scum in my block, Scripten most likely scum in block two but i could be mistaken. Less likely than lucky as scum. Block 3: I have had trouble following what's going on. I will need to read this more carefully later on.

[Hopkirk]

Several posts on meta that i'm not quoting due to length.
I don't particularly understand why he didn't mention WP's meta or, if meta of RVS doesn't tell him anything, why he bothers with RVS meta.

It's just a start-of-game habit. It helps me form early game reads.

Well this is firstly a bit on an ATE (the whole "lynch me i don't care) but the thing i'm more concerned with is why he only says this about WP. As i brought up in my last post, lucky basically does the same thing. Yet scripten has ignored lucky completely.

Huh? What did they both do?

I was rather pissed off in general because WP's vote on me was basically nothing but OMGUS and people were responding to it like he had destroyed this big case of mine, when I had voted him for something mildly scummy, then kept my vote on him because his reaction to my vote was scummy. It's as if nobody was actually reading my posts.

Why did you unvote someone you have a cement scumread on?

Because my scumread could have been wrong. I wanted to get a feel for BC's play this game before I laid my vote down and made a hammer possible.

1.) So is it usually helpful and this game is just an outlier?
2.) They both said about themselves being in a townblock.
3.) How are you reading the third member of your block?

[Hopkirk]

One page at a time.

Going through lucky.
Lots of posts which don't say anything excluded.

hmm... so far I want to vote both my group mates...

Didn't like this post. He wants to vote us both yet doesn't follow up with any attempt to decide which? It seems like he was just waiting until one of us looked worse than the other.

Well this will be rather easy for me today. GM seems town enough that I can just

VOTE: hopkirk

It's not that I feel strongly about Hopkirk, We could be the town block sure but I agree that discussion of that doesn't really gain us anything.

Three problems i have with this post.
1.) Following on from the last post, it follows the scum motivation- just waiting to vote oppertunistly.
2.) Classic scum lylo crossvoting move.
3.) The last point is strange to raise. It seems like he wants to say what WP did but then, as he's worried about people voting WP for it, he makes a change to the end. Why raise it if he doesn't think it matters? I suppose it also accomplishes the goal of making it harder to argue against his vote on me- making it from lack of choice rather than specifics.

Addressing your comment on the first quote and point 1 in your list. As I said, I didn't plan to be absent, it wasn't me being oppurtunistic, it was just me coming back and having enough info to make a decision.

Point 2, this is LyLo? I haven't played this setup before but the "Classic scum crossvoting move" is a last day effort based on the fact that there is NO tomorrow. Therefor, the scum can make wild accusations that don't hold up with multiple days left. As that is NOT the case here, you can't accuse me of that, your point is invalid.

Point 3, how does it make it harder for you to argue my vote against you? If your argument is that I am scum, then nothing I say is relevent because I am lying.

So could you answer my question about why you didn't vote either of us if we were both suspicous?

Partially because the comment was an exasperated sarcastic comment and partially because I can't vote two people at once. While I didn't mean to be gone for two days, sitting back did reveal GM to be pretty dang town, so now I don't have to choose!

Quoting this purely to have his response here. No real comment except i don't buy it. Seems to reinforce what i was saying earlier too.

What seems to reinforce what here? It doesn't really relate to anything you said.

1.) That's your defense, the same as given in part 4. I don't think it sounds town and don't buy it.
2.) The situation votewise is the same as lylo. If i scumread you and you "scumread" me then the third person is deciding on the lynch.
3.) This is an awful line of argument. I'm pretty confident you are scum but i need to convince GM of it. This is evidence for my read.
4.) The same thing as 1 again. Scummy defense of it, not one i buy.

Also note the selective quoting.

This is the same (almost) as what i said i dislike about lucky

As i brought up in my last post, lucky basically does the same thing.

These comments were made in relation to Scipten and Witness. I don't know what it means that you would make these side comments relating your reads on them to me, but I don't like it.

Mainly it's strange for scripten to be suspicious of Witness but not you as you both did the suspicious thing.

1.) So is it usually helpful and this game is just an outlier?
2.) They both said about themselves being in a townblock.
3.) How are you reading the third member of your block?

1.) Ok.
2.) In 99, the main post i take issue with.
3.) Do you mean town by actions or town by default?

1) I can take or leave it. It usually only takes a minute or so. I just tab up what I can find of a player's games and cross reference behaviors.
2) I didn't see this. Can you link to that post?
3) Serra is null-town. He is quiet and sort of avoiding the limelight, but the way in which he's acted feels more like town than scum.

I was liking Hopkirk til 172, now I think maybe not so Town?

As for me not really being around: I'm taking six 3000-level classes. My professors are mostly ridiculous.

What were you liking before 172? 90% of what i was doing before was dodging prods.

[Hopkirk]

I was liking Hopkirk til 172, now I think maybe not so Town?

As for me not really being around: I'm taking six 3000-level classes. My professors are mostly ridiculous.

Can you go into a bit of detail about what you don't like about 172? I have my own issues with the post, but I'm surprised it would make you do a 180.

Also, totally understand. Last semester of my senior year right now. All upper division classes.

My main problem is the enumerated responses to Lucky's 99. There's a marked propensity there for staring fixedly at one possibility and ignoring the rest.

They seem to get further from the real world every semester.

I'm enjoying seeing PN actually posting. I'll have to do a reread at some point.

I raised points on around half of his non fluff posts. Lucky has/had few posts and 99 was the most problematic one. I don't see what the problem is here?

[Hopkirk]

Lucky, Scripten, Zeb.

[Hopkirk]

Nothing has changed in regard to my opinions.