Mini 442 - Beast Wars Mafia Game Over

[Dusk]

Thanks and hi all! Escuse me while I get to that 19 page catch up and make notes.

[Dusk]

Christ! I've been reading for three hours and taking notes, and my attention span has finally weigned to the point that I keep sluggishly rereading over the same sentence like a soft tide.

Well, I have dropped in on this game several times before joining up, and I've been kicking myself for not getting in on it in the beginning, since I absolutely loved this show as a kid! As you all must know by now there's Transformers movie coming out next month. Beast Wars: transformers (1996) was the sequel to the first cartoon series this new movie is based on. I hope my knowledge doesn't make me target by the mafia, but I feel the need to come to Jordan's aid, since he has powers that could help we Townies.

So, my opinion on the recent development is that this one RC is genuine, and we shhould ease off of him. Skorponok could indeed be a RB. The character's cyber-bees were used for spying. But Skorponok was often gullible and notoriously incompetent, though furiously loyal to his commander, Megatron. This could mean he's an independable RB, much in the way you could have a Faith Healer, but for the sake of only 12 players I'm willing to bet he's 100% useful.

Skorponok is typically one of the villians on the show given he's allied with the Predacons, however in this game the Mafia seem to be outside agressors, aliens as the opening written by the mod says. Essentially, the Maximals and the Predacons formed a truce.

[Dusk]

I'm still trying to catch up. I had an interview out in the real world today, and didn't get a chance to read over more of this games because of it.

Fraggle, from what I read of his posts, doesn't strike me as Scum. He's just not a smart player. The first thing he alludes to is the interesing lyrics Albert posts, "If it is a certain restriction he has...then he probably has some sort of special role. I went back and read his posts/poems and they really hint at a possible vigilante or serial killer role. A lot of them are 'I'm all alone against the system' kind of writings....just a thought."
Then Sweeny rightly points out that no one would breadcrumb special roles especially if they're a SK. Opinions like these simply are far-fetched and don't help the Town, but I'm always more interested with finding Mafia than Lynching someone (forgive me) stupid.

Trust Gossip later mentions that Fraggle hasn't defended himself, establised "town-ness" despite early bandwagons. "I don't think having an urge to establish town-ness will help my image much in the long run anyway" is Fraggles answer. I find this ridiculous since this is a game where you are constantly matching wits and defending yourself, but does this say Scum? It sounds like bad stretegizing to me. But Scum esp. are working overtime to blend in, therefore they wouldn't say that. Then in the same post (post 227) Fraggle mentions that Primoris has been oddly quiet but negates himself by saying this isn't necessarily Scum tactic. Whether you're town or scum you should be arguing for hardcore evidence you believe is tell-tell. You can't hope to win this game by waiting for others to make something of random quotes from other poster.

Is everyone is just trying to get rid of Fraggle because these kind of moves won't help us out in the long run? I also realize he replaced a player that did much of the same kind of posting.

[Dusk]

When I first started reviewing this game, Lowell seemed most like a Scum to me. He's not totally in the clear, but I would need more time to go in depth with him. I saw the wagon. Then I saw where the votes started coming off him and I think it's just that he questioned the validity of the bandwagon, to do it given it was Jordan and Ryan who started it. If we already went there I don't think we have time to hope for an extention or start from square one with him. I don't have something everyone else already didn't mention right now.

So,

Vote: FraggleScum

I would of course unvote if he gave us some proof that we're dealing with a Townie of course. A RC or CC is the way to do this, but that may not be the only way. The lyrics must stop though. He and Mr. Rampage are making me uneasy.

[Dusk]

Dusk, I appreciate your thoughts, but one question I have is why the change from "Fraggle... doesn't strike me as scum" to a vote towards him?

Fraggle for the most part does simply seem like he's just not good at the game, but I can see everyone else's suspicions, too.

As I said before,

1) We don't have time to start from scratch.

2) I can't bring up anything that hasn't already been mentioned in the hunt for other scum yet

3) I can unvote if Fraggle says something that assuages suspicions.

Furthermore, call me callous, but if Fraggle is Townie I don't think he's a Role or a player we'll miss. What Doc, Cop, or RB says such things anyway?

To be more consistent and firm, Fraggle did say something that strikes me as desperate to shift attention from oneself. He mentions that Jordan claimed a villian for RB, but if Fraggle had read the opening post by the mod or really paid attention to Wikipedia, he'd understand the Maximals and Predacons are in a truce. He could have a Maximal Character, but he could also be an Alien Mafia member. Either way he has forgotten this detail.

[Dusk]

I know. I'm too impatient for this game. Time to go back to research...

But lets just see where this is going with Fraggle, hmm?

[Dusk]

Oh, Fraggle! I know you must be aching. How could you suggest that Jordan claimed a villian as reason for his Guilt, and forget that you are indeed a regualr villian on this show, too?

Well what does everyone think of this predicament?

[Dusk]

There's something I'm wondering, when the godfather dies, does another scum get promoted to godfather ?

Yes. It keeps going to the next in command until they're all dead. That's the way I've always played it. And the second in command is who Pm's in the Kill.

I read the wiki recently, and I don't really understand. Is the town the Maximal people, and the scum the other Peramoti-oties, or whatever? I am totally confused. Dusk, we need you!

Maximals and Predacons vs. Vok aliens and maybe other unknown baddies

So the Maximals are aligned with the Predacons? Or am I just getting confused?

I understand your confusion Aimee. The Maximals and Predacons are always have the main conflict int he show.

They are at a truce to deal with the greater threat.

We can trust the Predacons, not only because most of us are trusting Jordan right now but because I will come out and say this much also,

I am a Predacon, too

On the Maximals' and Predacons' home planet Cybertron these two factions have been in peacetime. But when Megatron, a Predacon criminal, steals a warcruiser and takes off for a major power source with a small band of other Predacons, it is Optimus Primal's crew of explorers that must follow. Optimus Primal and his crew are Maximals.

These small bands of Maximals and Predacons start up a fresh war unbeknownst to the rest of the populus on Cybertron. Often times in the show the characters would happen upon strange ruins and landmasses that defy nature, such as a floating mountian or island. The aliens, later named the Vok, created these landmasses and ruin. It turns out this planet was prehistoric Earth and it was the Alien's project.

The Aliens were not on the planet, though. When their various landmasses and ruins across Earth were disturbed by the battles, a signal was dispatched to them off in space. The small group of Maximals and Predacons at the end of the first season were forced to call a truce in their own war to deal with the greater threat of the Vok returning to Earth. The Vok is bent on destroying the entire planet with the Transformers on it because their experiment was disturbed.

The first way the Aliens attempted to destroy Earth was from overheating a large concentration of the energy source that originally attracted Megatron called energon. Energon was everywhere!

You all awaken to a new day. However, the day isn't going to give you a happy welcome. In the Maximal base, Rhinox seems to have been scorched beyond repair. During a patrol, it seems that Dinobot has gone missing

So I think that the Vok is still somewhat Alive and active because they may not have blown up the planet as intended (Ep 24-26 Before the Storm and Other Voices pt 1 and 2) but Rhinox did get scorched in the process.

Also, in the show, the Vok is some kind of two headed floating being. http://www.bwtf.com/bw/tvshow/cc/vok/vok2.jpgMaybe the Vok is played by more than one Mafia member, and just because Fraggle is gone, doesn't mean the character is entirely.

Here's better site than Wikipedia for info on the characters and show: Ben Yee's Transformer website http://www.bwtf.com/bw/tvshow/

[Dusk]

Salutations, Confused!


(Wasn't Charolette a charismatic lil' spider?)

[Dusk]

Don't think Ryan killed HH, Dinobot's primary weapon was a sword, nothing to do with fire.

Unless we have a second vig, there is almost certainly a serial killer among us. One of the main reasons I'm posting normally is I'm the prime SK suspect right now. You might think that's kinda cool, but I don't wanna be lynched based on some of my music preference 8)

You know, Albert, I was about to vote you for seeming a little too much like Fraggle with those songs until you said this. Fraggle copied you anyway. It's good you recognize the resemblance points to you as a suspect. My suspicion is drifting elsewhere for now.

I also agree with Jordan on the idea that Dinobot didn't kill Rhinox. However, Dinobot was also known to shoot laserbeams from his eyes though, much like Scott "Cyclops" Summers, capable of leaving a transformer scortched. That said, to me, it doesn't fit Dinobot, the former Predacon that defected to the Maximal side. But I would've been remiss not to mention said powers.

Also if we are to believe the Vig (Dinobot) accidently killed the Doc (Rhinox) such a situation would have to say that only the vigilante acted last night or else only the vigilante powers went through. It doesn't make sense that the Mafia wouldn't seize the opportunity to take someone out when they knew they had lost their Godfather. So we can assume they tried last Night.

If we are still to believe the Vig kill went through on Rhinox (HackerHack the Doc), Perhaps Rhinox managed to Protect someone before he was killed, or the Skorponok (Jordan the RB?) got lucky. Either of those strokes of luck for the Town says to me we should have seen hint of it in the opening Day2 post. We didn't; it was just very clear cut who died.

Scortching definitely says Mafia Aliens to me. I'm going with the idea that the Mafia killed Rhinox (HackerHack our Doc). I think Dinobot was taken down by a SK.

Rampage, the character, could be an SK, as Jordan surmises (post544) but my money is on a different character, I'd rather not say yet for sake of later RC's. However, to your credit, Jordan, If Dinobot "dissapared" then that's in line with the character Rampage who was introduced much like a scary movie monster coming out of the darkness to attack people ("ep. 34 Bad Sparks"). Whoever the SK is I think that's what got ryan (Dinobot Vig).

[Dusk]

Just thought of this question for the Mod.

Mod, do all Night actions go through?

The answer might help us be certain of what happened last night.

Alright, no more flooding. Goodnight.

[Dusk]

These were copied and pasted from my notes. I'm so lazy. I'm sorry it took me so long... anyway as I've been saying Lowell is terribly suspicous to me

• Lowell retaliates with a vote for ryan who didn’t like the bandwagon on the newbie potential Townie
• Says screw this and votes someone who randomly voted him a while back
• Calls ryan’s strategy to Lynch quiet people “a dumb point,” “opportunism” Maybe a quiet person is in on it with him because lurkers can be detrimental, thus Ryan's strategy is not unfounded.
• Good Recap by Sweeny on 175, better one on 230 by Jordan
• Jordan Sweeny, and Ryan agree Lowell is scum. Over the Under, Ryan, JordanA24 all vote
• Got rid of bandwagon by questioning the validity of the bandwagon and not defending his scummy posts
o 1) "I wanted to get OTU's attention with that vote. Really, this bandwagon is so stupid it makes me crazy. One RANDOM vote (his only post so far this game), followed by ryan and jordan scumteam teaming up to get me to 3 votes. Ridiculous. I want OTU to OWN his vote on me or get lost. People won't realize just how scummy this bandwagon is until the random votes leave."
o 2) "I do find it strange that ryan and jordan would buddy up together so much if they were scum. But really, that's the ultimate in WIFOM (ooh, scum would NEVER be so obvious, so we're not scum). More importantly, I really think they thought I would be a quick, easy lynch and that everyone would rally around killing me, thus making their like-mindedness not so obvious in the midst of a mob. As it is, they can't get people to vote for me and they're becoming increasinly exposed." It's not terribly strange now that Ryan is a dead townie.

Now...

Other Thoughts:
I am not going to defend my vote for Fraggle further after this. I'm a little irritated that my catch on him is what got a couple of people to move off the fense. It turned out to be a good move for the Town and I look like Mafia for it. Okhams (sp?) Razor says the simplest explaination is normally the correct one. Can't it just be that I said what I meant and with my knowledge of the theme we got the Godfather Lynched on the first Day? It wasn't really a 180. I knew something was amiss with his posts. I thought it was just really bad playing. It turned out to be very bad Mafia slip-ups. I did realize a bit of desperation in Fraggles posts afterwards that I felt strongly enough about to leave my vote on. When Fraggle said he was Terrorsaur it was official. (I couldn't understand why he didnt just choose a Maximal. Too safe?)

Anyway, I think we could find more evidence on whom to Lynch next by looking to see if ryan and HackerHack were onto anyone. Maybe the Mafia felt most threatened by them. There's another point against Lowell.

Confused, thank you for that in depth analysis! I think Trust Gossip is looking incredibly suspicious, now. His/her posts were inconsistent in regards to teffc wh was replaced by Fraggle. Your thinking seems to be along the lines of mine in that looking at players in retrospect will give us new evidence with which to Lynch Scum. Still, I've been meaning to do this for a while--

VOTE: Lowell

[Dusk]

These were copied and pasted from my notes. I'm so lazy. I'm sorry it took me so long... anyway as I've been saying Lowell is terribly suspicous to me

• Lowell retaliates with a vote for ryan who didn’t like the bandwagon on the newbie potential Townie
• Says screw this and votes someone who randomly voted him a while back
• Calls ryan’s strategy to Lynch quiet people “a dumb point,” “opportunism” Maybe a quiet person is in on it with him because lurkers can be detrimental, thus Ryan's strategy is not unfounded.
• Good Recap by Sweeny on 175, better one on 230 by Jordan
• Jordan Sweeny, and Ryan agree Lowell is scum. Over the Under, Ryan, JordanA24 all vote
• Got rid of bandwagon by questioning the validity of the bandwagon and not defending his scummy posts
o 1) "I wanted to get OTU's attention with that vote. Really, this bandwagon is so stupid it makes me crazy. One RANDOM vote (his only post so far this game), followed by ryan and jordan scumteam teaming up to get me to 3 votes. Ridiculous. I want OTU to OWN his vote on me or get lost. People won't realize just how scummy this bandwagon is until the random votes leave."
o 2) "I do find it strange that ryan and jordan would buddy up together so much if they were scum. But really, that's the ultimate in WIFOM (ooh, scum would NEVER be so obvious, so we're not scum). More importantly, I really think they thought I would be a quick, easy lynch and that everyone would rally around killing me, thus making their like-mindedness not so obvious in the midst of a mob. As it is, they can't get people to vote for me and they're becoming increasinly exposed." It's not terribly strange now that Ryan is a dead townie.

Now...

Other Thoughts:
I am not going to defend my vote for Fraggle further after this. I'm a little irritated that my catch on him is what got a couple of people to move off the fense. It turned out to be a good move for the Town and I look like Mafia for it. Okhams (sp?) Razor says the simplest explaination is normally the correct one. Can't it just be that I said what I meant and with my knowledge of the theme we got the Godfather Lynched on the first Day? It wasn't really a 180. I knew something was amiss with his posts. I thought it was just really bad playing. It turned out to be very bad Mafia slip-ups. I did realize a bit of desperation in Fraggles posts afterwards that I felt strongly enough about to leave my vote on. When Fraggle said he was Terrorsaur it was official. (I couldn't understand why he didnt just choose a Maximal. Too safe?)

Anyway, I think we could find more evidence on whom to Lynch next by looking to see if ryan and HackerHack were onto anyone. Maybe the Mafia felt most threatened by them. There's another point against Lowell.

Confused, thank you for that in depth analysis! I think Trust Gossip is looking incredibly suspicious, now. His/her posts were inconsistent in regards to teffc wh was replaced by Fraggle. Your thinking seems to be along the lines of mine in that looking at players in retrospect will give us new evidence with which to Lynch Scum. Still, I've been meaning to do this for a while--

VOTE: Lowell

[Dusk]

My apologies, Sweeny. I'll do my best to never put words in another players mouth. I remember a game where I got Lynched because someone claimed I never voted for a Scum. By the time I got back to the game to point it out, it was too late.*grrrRR*

Maybe it was that you voted for Lowell once even though you resigned yourself to his innocence.

[Dusk]

I've been kind of busy with life. I'll be back really soon with a full summary on Sweeny, and more recent developments on Lowell to clear things up soon.

[Dusk]

And I'm suspicious of the way Aimee keeps bringing up my vote on Fraggle. It's not so much that's she's against me (because Confused is too), but more so that she hasn't adressed my explainations on the matter. I'd trust her more if she had picked apart my explainations for inconsistencies and lies. She seems to me as if she's using a Mafia tactic of having let me live through the Night only to ride the suspicions from the previous Day to get me Lynched. It's easier than wasting a Kill.


My next post will be a full ramble on Sweeny.

[Dusk]

My overall opinions of Sweeny is he is so pro-town, so not Scum in every post that it's unnerving! Can someone be this convincing if they are Mafia. It's got to be impossible. You can't fully trust anyone in this game so I won't say Sweeny is absolutely, positively Town, but I haven't seen a slip-up or anything suspicious yet. I wonder if I ever will.

Sweeny has given fair and thorough assesment of most players. When he interegates players he's not afraid to get cross-examined himself and answers well. He reserves judgement for a while before voting people but he's not afraid to put votes on people at crucial moments (post 181). And he's careful not to cast votes without gathering all possible opinions (Post 242). He’s good at catching obscurity and inconsistency like Ryan claiming that Hackerhack got degensive to a ranfdom bandwagon when he didn’t (post 264)

• Replaces Ripley who never posted
• In post 160 Sweeny does his first recap of the game; it’s very thorough, and intelligent
o He suggests ryan’s “freak-out” on suggesting to make a newbie crack is “odd”
o Gives true and good explanations on the good of bandwagonning
o And he responds well to Jordan that bandwagonning is a way to look at the responses not to actually get the lynch
• Post 162 shows that ryan was unhelpful in his scum-hunting ways. Ryan wanted quiet players so that we can vote them rather than vocal replacements thought this is a bad move. He suspected Lowell but not much else, protested bandwagons on the ground that they are bandwagons
• His suspicions are with ryan also because ryan...
o Buddies (Jordan)
o seems defensive and apologized for walking into a game and start throwing wild accusations, but Sweeny suppor som e of ryans suspicions
•

I think I misread Sweeny’s non existent suspicion on Lowell from this “Okay come on... This is obviously (I think, please feel free to mock me for being a moron and fooled by this scum tactic) a joke and a light=hearted way to hop on a bandwagon... Not scummy IMO....” (post175).

• And this after Lowell’s FEEEAR me line

“This one actually made me LOL... = ) I mean you react defensively (hmm... I wonder if he was looking for reactions there....) and he hops over to you... HE didn't freak out he made (what I found to be quite funny) a joke....And was hunting scum while he did it...”

Where Sweeny takes this to be funny and a way of keeping things light-hearted in the pursuit of scum I found I all suspicious and eratic
• Then Sweeny votes ryan (post 181)
• I also misinterprated Sweeny's non-existent suspicion of Lowell for his fair assessment of Lowell's oddities.

Then Sweeny reminds Lowell that there should be responses to his questions from 175, to explain why Aimee’s in depth summaries make him suspicious, then in 215 he says he’ll vote for Lowell without explainations the “Wait Do I still have someone’s random vote on me I can OMGUS with the best of them”

• Sweeny uses polite prodding for 219
• Then in 224 he asks more opinions than Jordan’s “one sided crusade” on Lowell, who else in Jordan’s mind is scum, who else is next
•

He continues again on questioning Lowell (post 240)

•

Sweeny’s main vouche for Lowell come from the idea that the guy doesn’t mind putting himself in danger to find Scum, which is a pro-town move

• Sweeny is suspicious of Jordan’s sureness (416). Jordan doesn't look at other players besides Lowell.


These kind of re-caps take forever. Forgive me everyone if you don't see them for a while from me. Again, sorry about the earlier mix-up, Sweeny. I hope tis clears up where I thought you were suspicious of Lowell. You do indeed speend a few pages on his side. You were only giving him proper consideration, not suspicion.

[Dusk]

Right, Aimee, I don't blame anybody for being suspicious of my vote on Fraggle. But I think if someone really looks at the posts, there's good reaoning is there to consider.

Now to continue with Lowell, I didn't like how the votes came off of Lowell because he simply questioned the two people who voted him. The line about the OMGUS and the Wait-do-i-still-have-a-random-vote-on-me part was suspicious. So I voted for him on that. Sometimes you don't get a list of compelling arguments just a couple of incidents that don't sit well with you.

But then he started playing a little more seriously and began directing his attention to other player besides just one or two players- ryan and Jordan, as he should. (So should I) I think he was right and the Mafia were just spectating and running down the clock (post362). It helps for later when he criticizes Jordan for not "varying targets" (410). Lowell is right, of course. Also, him being an early voter on Fraggle gains a lot of points (454). So, with all these ood moves to counter-act the early bad ones, I'm willing to go for someone else.

Unvote: Lowell

But I still am wary about him.

[Dusk]

Alright, I want this game to move. And given Albert and Confused's run-down of Trust Gossip,

VOTE: Trust Gossip

It's esp. odd to me that Trust should automatically think teffc leaving the game to be replaced was for not being able to deal with a Scum role. Maybe I'm taking it too seriously, but also it surprising how commited one can be to teffc, but not to other players Trust raised suspicion on.

Also Albert, your last two quotes from Trust suggest it's something about the way he FoS Aimee hat makes him innocent. Am I undestanding correctly?

[Dusk]

I've sent your chicken noodle soup via PM. Feel better, Sweeny!

[Dusk]

I could get behind an Aimee badwagon, but only withh good reason, Lowell.

Aimee has done some fairly pro-town things. She was an early voter for teffc/ Fraggle, and she varies her suspicions. Yet I have my suspicions of her, too.

I'm goon now, everyone! And that's mostly due to this game.

[Dusk]

And I suppose that I should be the flagbearer for the case against teffc? It's in my best interest to oppose a possible quick lynch of ryan, only because I see teffc's behavior as a greater evil. And now she has free license to lurk because she is up for replacement.

Could we get a vote count and the status of the last replacement, mod?

The case against teffc is that the sum of her testimony is either; worthless (posting just for the sake of activity), vague (innumerable 'too' statements), or nonexistent (the long period of lurking until asking for a replacement).

But like I said earlier, her getting replaced is generally bad because now we have to wait for fraggle to post enough to analyse.

Unvote: teffc/Fragglescum

Fragglerock

: extended lurk period after replacing, no urge to establish town-ness even though his predecessor has/had a bandwagon on them. Why?

This is not really running away. He has been consistently attacking teffc and Fraggle; that's why I think he's town.

The only post that MAY be slowing down on teffc/Fraggle is here:

And Fraggle and aimee... ehhh. They're doing their "part". It's negligible, but it's not particularly scummy, yet it's not the most helpful either.

Obligatory

Minor FOS: Aimee

for doing exactly what FraggleScum had done, albeit in a less obvious manner.

But this is as close as it gets.

Albert I don't understand you lack of suspicion on TrusttGossip. Can you explain, esp. what these last two quotes mean? Is trustGossip on your innocent list because he's suspicious of Aimee here?

[Dusk]

What does "WIFOM" mean? I se it pop up a lot.

[Dusk]

These are some of my suspcions on Aimee.
o Some of her early doubter speak their suspicions because she doesn't post enough, but she's been picking up the slack recently. I never thought her lack of posting was suspicious because normally when people try to stay under the radar they don't make lengthy posts when they surface, just comment in depth enough on the current one or two issue or post frequently but briefly. Aimee, however, often has her own opinions and posts long summaries. Also in her favor, she was an early voter on teffc who was replaced by Fraggle (115), and points her suspicions consitently at the player. She varies her targets, but how cetain has she been about players?
o All that said, I only agree with about half of her points most of the time; For instance, in post 168 she criticizes ryan's arguments as week when I saw him as one of the few being agressive and thorough. She also felt his tactic of pushing non-voters was unecessary without a deadline, but I disagree. If you've exhausted the same opinions it's important to question if some players are sitting on information or lurking so that they contribute something new to the conversation.
o One option I was exploring is that

Aimee

was lurking and realized she was more suspcious this way, but her explainations on the matter are often that she's busy or that she was gone on holiday. That is one of several things for which I can give her the benefit of the doubt. Now however, I'm tired of long summaries from her sparatically and want to here an actual debate.
o Things that make me suspicious of her is that she was a huge advocate for suspicion against ryan (who turned out to be pro-town) and calls a lot of his argument's weak when I saw it as exactly the opposite. Also, In post 396 she reconsiders her suspicons on ryan thinking maybe "Jordan is trying to link to Ryan so that if Ryan gets lynched, he looks more like a townie. I think their whole defense is totally bizarre, as is the case against Lowell. However, I see Jordan as scummier than Ryan at the moment.” This starts the first bandwagon on Jordan and then he is forced to claim RB Skorponok. Then, in her favor, she is careful not to add her vote on him for a -1 (405), but against her I think she would have done better to be an early voter for him after she saw her FoS take off a little because she hasn't taken sides for man save teffc/ Fraggle.
o There are things against her. At one point she started posting a lot of questions to several players, but not posting what she makes of their answers. This could be a method of diverting attention from herself and appearing thoughtful, as opposed to actually searching out Scum.
o She shrank away rather quickly when I called her on the possible Scum tactic of hounding me on the business of voting Fraggle. I thought that was strang and anxious.

[Dusk]

Post 261 you ask ryan Why he would shift his attention to Primoris and Hackerhuck.

Post 301 You ask Fraggle why Jordan can't finger ryan
Also, Jordan Are you Rosso Carne in disguise (lol)

Then you went on holiday.

So okay maybe not a lot of questions, but the duration of time was fairly long. It's mainly what we've been talking about, particularly what Albert mentioned-- "In conclusion, you don't focus on attacking the players you find most suspicious, instead you seem to want to boost your reputation and re-assuring players that you're not after them. Usually you are more aggressive torwards your suspects, and this makes me think that your mafia trying to build up credibility with the town." You just post long summaries and point out behavior and seem a little less firm of late in your decisions on people. I'm seeing this as you trying to look helpful when in fact you haven't been someone to count on.

To answer your question, I really haven't made up my mind about you. I want to says whether I think you're scum or town one way or the other, but I'm simply not sure with you, yet. I also wanted to chime in my two cents on the matter, because I've basically been spectating.

I'm trying to review everyone else's opinion of you, Aimee, and see how it coincides with my current view, and my notes of you.

[Dusk]

Yes, your analysis of my vote on Fraggle is exactly what happened.

And you, Aimee, are not the only one who has said Lowell has a style. So I'm willing to buy it. As you can see my suspcions and my vote is now on TG. From the previous day I wasn't impressed with Lowell's early behavior. I'm still not, but he has made more redeeming moves since, And I'm willing to lay off. So, I have.

On the Ryan turning up dead part and Lowell being connected, what comes out in the night is all the new evidence we have at first, wouldn't you agree? When we start having these little chats the way people answer questions is also new evidence, but I think I will continue such speculation. So long as we come up with more thhan one scenario and don't deem deaths as the only means of evidence, it should be fine to draw connections. I am a newbie, but in the three other Mafia games I've played with newbie the deaths are normally the Town's best assests. I wouldn't say that it's hard core proof of anything because Mafia can WIFOM in order to throw the town off (See I'm

learn-ding

.)

Apology accepted, luv, but your questioning my "turn" is fine. This is the nature of the game, right?

[Dusk]

I really hope we're not

waiting

for the replacement. Yes, replacements give new opinions, but we've had several days and several summaries. Does anybody mean to vote soon? For anyone?

[Dusk]

I'm around, Confused. I don't need prod.

I still say get TG! Whose with me! My vote hasn't changed this Day.

Confused hasn't been around that long and Primoris didn't do much. I'd rather hold off on a vote on her. I haven't heard anything tell tell, and definite enough from me to lynch Aimee. So these other votes are not moving me.

[Dusk]

I feel so moronic. Sweeny was highest on my Townie list... I have to go back and rethink this.

I love it when the SK or the Mafia pick each other of early. I actually feel this is a storke of luck to make up for our no Lynch. There may not even be another Vok Mafioso.

If the Doc and two Mafiosos are dead, maybe it'd be a good idea for the Cop to help us out now, if we have one. IF there were for some reason 3 Mafiosos and a SK in this game that leave a 2/3 Town.

FoS: Jordan

You just didn't RB anyone? With a Doc gone, what were you afraid of? You also didn't RB who you said you would the night previously if I remember correctly. I'll have to do a thorough read through later.

Off to class!

[Dusk]

A few questions Jordan
Why didn't you block Lowell if you thought he was scum?
Why did you chose STD to block last night?

During the night, the more I thought about it, the more scummy StD seemed to me, he attacked me and called me "certain scum", which seemed to me like picking a convenient target. He also attacked Ryan but said he was town, and oddly enough, gave the same treatment to Lowell, who I thought at the time was scum, he even said, he was low on the pro-town list, but still thought he was town without explaining, I was thinking of a Lowell-StD scumteam there, and I was thinking that they'd send StD to do the kill because of how much I attacked Lowell during the day. Now of course, the block obviously didn't work, and I'm now confident Lowell isn't scum, so I've also lost one of the main reasons why StD was scum as well because of that, so StD has gone up the pro-town list too, though not as much as Lowell.

Why did you chose to revel this information now? If STD is scum maybe you could have caught him in a lie.

I actually never thought of this, I'll remember for next time.

No I'm talking about that, Albert. He claimed to block StD, and if this is true it didn't stop a kill. But he had said his suspicions were Lowell.

The discrepensies, however convincing the defenses in response by Jordan, are starting to add up. Yet, I'd like to hear about his play last night to be sure.

[Dusk]

I have been trying to keep up and would like to post more in depthh, however classes just started for me. Aside from studying I've been fighting wih the moving company to get ALL my items back to the apartment, and trying to find research opportunities. Yes all is busy out in the world.

Hopefully I'll have time Friday. Til' then... let me just say I still have doubts on TG and I was one of the few commital people on the bandwagon, not someone just jumping on. I did mention the things that made me most suspcious of him and I weighed Albert and Confused's rundown of TG. Albert, after some questioning, didn't convince me. Confused's post did.

Furthermore, I was indeed the most pro-Sweeny, but also very clear on my reasons, which were all my own. I can't remember Sweeny giving a very specific and in-depth rundown of me, but if you feel we were buddying and this is the "relationship" you don't like, well vote me. But you've been so hesitant about voting me before, Aimee, I really wonder why this is the proverbial straw.

[Dusk]

Jordan, do you perceive a difference between your win condition and the Maximal win condition? If so what do you make of it?

[Dusk]

Address my post 703 please, Jordan.

[Dusk]

Aimee, worry not, I won't name claim.

Which will be easy, because I have absolutely no recollection of what it is.

All I know is that STD was my BOY, and now he's gone. So very very sad.

Oh so does this mean you're claiming to be the mason, Lowell? Are you going to give us a CC with your RC?

[Dusk]

Also, I feel analysis slow down the game, and if Skruff just wants to go off of what he sees immediatly then let him. I it comes back to bit e him in the ass it's ironic because of his avatar, but it's also just as well. He has given reasons.

Furthermore, we can't decide if the Cop is trustworthy until he or she comes out. Yes he or she could be naive, but when exactly are we going to be the judge of that? Once they're offed in the Night in a one out of six shot in the dark. It could happen. But it's still up to the player and it's risk we don't

have

to take. Just a suggestion

[Dusk]

Dusk, I'm confused. What's going to bite me on the ass? And what does that have to do with my avatar? :sulk: I like cookies.

The jitterbug is going to bite you on the ass. jk. You avatar is a dog. Dogs can bite on the ass. *rimshot*. Alright. moving on...

[Dusk]

Okie Dokey.

VOTE: Skruff

[Dusk]

I'm not going to post a long summary of why I'm trying to lynch Skruff. Basically, I've been on the bandwagon to lynch TG since page 25 or so. It keep not happening, but amost happening. Confused's run-down convinced me, Albert's counter was weak. TG was too fixated on teffc maybe because he knew teffc was scum and then couldn't be as comittal with anyone else through the entire game. Skruff is the same character with a different name, and at first I felt his supsicions on Jordan were valid, but as he explains them the more it seem that he's making a little thing into a bigger thing. (By the way, my win condition doesn't read like either Skruff's or Jordan's discription.)

So I'm tired of the slow pace here. I feel that some poeple are bored also, therefore, I say we start voting! And if anyone (Lowell or Aimee esp.) want to to go a few rounds with me, lets rumble, but dammit! Take a few swings! Get bloody already. I want to see some bandwagons and arguments.

[Dusk]

Uh Aimee, Albert did give reason for his suspicions but even he admits just now they were poor.

How is he so clearly mafia the first day but you just now realize it?

Is this only OMGUS. "However, is Day 2 behaviour is completely scummy. I've already explained his bizarre relationship with Sweeny. But he also accuses me, straight after saying I was town-like, same with TrustGossip."

[Dusk]

(By the way, my win condition doesn't read like either Skruff's or Jordan's discription.)

That's awesome. How do you know what my win condition reads like?
Fos: Dusk

I'm gathering from this...

Jordan, obviously you are unable to quote your PM, but seeing as your role is a Predacon, does it indicate that you will win alongside the Maximals?

It says I win when all anti-town players are eliminated.

This is odd, and his win condition is not in the same format as my own is.
Maybe it's because he's a claimed power role.. or a predacon? Hmm.

And this...

I was originally going to say that you yourself do not have a protown win condition, by your own admission, but then I realized that you COULD just be saying that you don't assume I have a protown win condition. But you have REALLY got to learn to phrase yourself better.

There is no "Vanilla Townie" PM on the first page, which is something I'm surprised hasn't been exploited yet. OR has it been? I don't know.
I do know that jordan claims his win condition involves players - mine doesn't. I won't get any further into it than that, but I think this is either a mistake on the mod's aprt or a bad claim by Jordan.

Albert, go suck on a doughnut. I don't respond well to blatant, baseless threats. What do you want me to analyze? I think I caught scum with my second post - why all the hostility?

Lastly...

Also, how do you know that lynching Jordan is a mistake?

I never said that lynching Jordan was a mistake. Don't put words in my text! A couple of days back Jordan's claim to be RB Skorponok seemed to be likely. ToDay his claims to have RB'd certain people and not have done any good are questionable. So I FoS Jordan, if you will recall. But now it seems you're little eager to get him on a small discrepency of what supposedly your win-condition reads like. And my suspicions have fallen to you, esp sense I didn't much trust TG either towards the end.

[Dusk]

I also didn't say lynching Jordan is going to come back to bite you in the ass. It was something about the way you fixatred on someone without analysis if my memory serves me correct.

For all this hoopla about win-conditions can you state very clearly what you win-condition is, and the exact difference that makes you uneasy about Jordan. Because every single post of yours has been about Jordan's suspicious, supposed win-condition, and I'm not even sure anymore why this bothers you so much.

The fact that you are bothered so much earned you my vote.

[Dusk]

I fell asleep and now I have a research paper to revise. I'll be back tomorrow, all.

And it really isn't looking too good Mr. Skruffs Imaboutaget Snuffed. Do you have a RC or something for us.

Aimee, I'll adress your claims soon.

[Dusk]

My top suspects now as Albert and Confused.

Well, to be fair, if we are to believe that Aimee is the Cop, the only players off the hook for now are Skruff and Jordan. Even Aimee has admitted that Investigation Immunity might clear the SK. If Skruff is th SK we won’t know until we go against her verdit and lynch him. But, I’m willing to work with a smaller pool. To also be fair, that leaves me, Confused, Albert, and Lowell.

No one seems to be questioning Lowell’s breadcrumbs for Mason to Megatron, nor do we believe his playing style is reason for suspicion. Other than his heated arguments with Ryan and Jordan in the beginning, no one seems to have brought up and real suspicions on him. He's therefore very pro-town in my updated proverbial book.

So next would be Confused who is not going to be active for a while. It’s a bit unfair, but I wouldn’t want to lynch a player unable to defend oneself.

Resultantly, my greatest suspicions fall to Albert. To his benefit, he has actually defended Trust Gossip (578) despite Aimee’s claim that he does nothing but yell lynch TG. He claimed that Aimee and TG are the most pro-town due to spot on anlysis. Aimee had in the beginning been suspicious of Albert’s poetry” so it is notable that he did not claim to have suspicions in on her in and OMGUS (Did I use it right?). Then he says that because TG consistently attacked teffc, who was replaced by Fraggle, that this makes TG high on the list not to be lynched.

Then Aimee and Albert start turning on each other but not in a way that they started to do so in OMGUS. They're opinions just gradually changed.

Some ALbert anti-town playing seemed to show some degree of buddying between Sweeny and Albert to me. THEN in 651, Albert start yelling about TG the scum. His one full analysis TG is long and claims TG is pro-town for his "consitent" call to lynch teffc. So this is what is so suspicious to me. TG may have been ready to lynch teffc but TG wasn't comital to anyone else. Going with the theory that TG./ Skruff is innocent and Scum-Albert would have hidden behind this potential safety net of an Townie-TG being so wrong.

My greatest suspicon come from the fact that Albert never explains his new suspicons of TG, but was defending TG so whole heartedly at first.

FoS: ALbert B Rampage.

[Dusk]

Unvote: Skruff

[Dusk]

Uh Aimee, Albert did give reason for his suspicions but even he admits just now they were poor.

I unequivocally disagree with this. Please check back on all of Albert's posts before simply jumping to his defence like that. You will see a significant change in opinion - from "I don't think TG is scum/he isn't a priority right now" to "WILL AIMEE PLEASE POST HER ANALYSIS OF TRUSTGOSSIP SCUM?"

Yeah, that's what has swayed me on Albert jjust now. I hadn't noticed this.

How is he so clearly mafia the first day but you just now realize it?

No.

People were ruling Albert out as Mafia because of his Day 1 antics. I don't see why this at all rules him out.

However, I'm more sure that he's an SK - on Day 1, he basically got away with making any proper opinion, and his wobbling around yesterday strikes me as quite opportunistic.

I didn't exactly rule him out on day one personally, I just was terribly annoyed by his fake restriction. Also to keep in mind he definitely hinted to being a SK in his "poetry." It seemed like WIFOM. Now I'm more inclined to turst that this is him slipping up

Is this only OMGUS. "However, is Day 2 behaviour is completely scummy. I've already explained his bizarre relationship with Sweeny. But he also accuses me, straight after saying I was town-like, same with TrustGossip."

Er, no.

I'm not quite sure what your definition of OMGUS actually is. But it certainly isn't the above.

Try again?

Okay, miss. Well played.

[Dusk]

I could claim. Is there any reason I shouldn't?

Albert were you joking with that "Rampage" claim?

[Dusk]

Does anyone feel like he's baiting us?

[Dusk]

Or we could lynch the known SK and see if all the Mafia isn't already dead rather than go in blind and lynch a potentially innocent Townie.

[Dusk]

A jester, eh? Maybe Albert's weak analysis and fake post restriction was a way of baiting us to lynch him. I don't think he's just given up. I don't think the character of Rampage makes since as an SK or a jester. I think he's still lying to us.

If we weren't to lynch Albert, well folk, I don't want to get lynched either. But I guess begging isn't an argument. What could I do to convince you all of my guiltlessness? Dusk no want to die. Dusk have planzzzzzzz.

[Dusk]

I'm Waspinator. The lovable, Predacon stooge that manages to get blown up all the time.

Waspinator speak in third person. Waspinator a Townie. Waspinator say lynch Albert.

[Dusk]

Does anybody want to tell me I'm guilty, again?

[Dusk]

If not I'm going to get this ball rolling and

Vote: Albert

Our RB can block whoever he feels is guilty in the Night. There is probably just one Mafia member left. By process of elimination (trusting Aimee and Jordan to be power pro-town roles, Skruff being cleared, knowing I'm innocent, going with Albert's confession) the last Vok must be Confused. I liked Confused though. It was Primoris who was so suspicious with his bandwagoning of ryan despite saying he liked Ryan and thought ryan was innocent prior to the bandwagon (84). Thus, there being no one else to vote for, I really have no argument for lynching her. So I'd rather go with the obvious choice toDay, lynch Confused once she comes back the next Day, and we block a kill toNight hopefully.

[Dusk]

I'm sorry. Albert has recently been yelling that it's so obvious that I'm scum.

But Albert you claimed SK to draw out the real SK? I find this hard to believe. The real SK wouldn't come forward because you claim it. IF you weren't the Sk and you did such a thing the town would mistakenly lynch you and the Sk would be safe another day.

Are you being purposely stupid?

[Dusk]

I would say block confused, investigate dusk. Dusk seems less likely scum, to me. If the cop dies, lynch dusk, and if dusk is town, block the mason?

I love this plan.

[Dusk]

It won't matter because I'm not. If we lynch you, that will put that suspicion to rest, SK Scum! When that happens, Jordan will block the only other killer and then we can have the Cop investigate me or Confused and see the truth. This plan is a little more fool proof than lynching me first. You've done more scummy things in the recent Day.

But of course we can't take my word for it. I know what Aimee thinks of me. Would Lowell, Jordan, or Skruff like to say why I'm more or less innocent than Albert? I'm a big girl. I can take it.

[Dusk]

Next, I've been reviewing Lowell and StD's posts to see if they really have been dropping mason breadcrumbs. My verdict: Looks like it, though I didn't doubt Lowell's claim, to begin with.

In post 392 StD finally makes up for lost time posting a ridiculously long run down of all the active players. However, he's fair with Lowell not just taking his side. In fact StD outright negates Lowell then top suspects Ryan and Albert as potential lynch victims.

I'm more interested n post 568 much later where StD outright says Lowell is not scum, but ask to have a moment to find out who is. Period. Later in 584 StD replies to Albert's inquiry as to why Lowell is just in the clear. Of course, it's because they're masoned,and StD just wanted to litter the idea early that either of them know the other is clear. Still he with good reason says the same thing Aimee has been saying, that Lowell has a playing style, and just because Lowell weird of sporatic does not mean he's scum. Look for lies, look for actions StD says. It was fine enough for me to lay off then and remove my vote on Lowell.

Also, to my interest Lowell and StD follow with votes on Confused with no explanation within three posts of each other. I look at this as a brief tell-tell that they were mason.

Does anyone doubt the mason claim?

[Dusk]

Hey Jordan, are you still waiting on Confused to claim?

I would change my vote from Albert to Confused and be the one to push it over the edge if need be. We need four to lynch toDay.

[Dusk]

Looks like Albert is at -1 and Confused is at -2.

[Dusk]

I agree with Jordan's scenarios as I;m convinced I'm innocent. Unless there is a way for the Mafia or SK to frame me, all these scenarios should work out.

We could interrogate Skruff a little right now if we are worried about the event that he is investigative immune. I'm more for hammering Albert.

[Dusk]

I am insulted! How am I confusing everyone, Aimee? It was suggested by Albert that if Skruff is Investigation Immune and is indeed the real SK (which I highly doubt) then the original plan of lynching either Confused or Albert and investigating me as either Confused or Albert is blocked becomes a faulty plan. I said we can verify Skruff is indeed clear if we question him some, but it seems to only be Albert's worry since Albert is the one facing the noose. I'm just trying to be fair so no one can say I wasn't pro-town when the truth comes out. If the town felt like questioning Skruff along with the verdict then it would have been on everyone's agreement, not just on Albert being an agitator.

Let's talk instead about how Skruff has made up entirely too many contingency plans with the last few posts (865 and such). That's confusing! We can't control for Lowell not being clear and all that, Skruff. Keep it simple. We have to narrow down the subjects as best we can to me (so INNOCENT), ABR, and Confused. Lowell has a mason claim to a known townie that nobody contested with evidence.

Keep in mind that Albert CC Rampage, and I CC Waspinator. Of the two I think Rampage fits a SK better.

I think Jordan and Aimee should agree right now who they will block and investigate in case Confused shows up and suddenly hammers without warning and the game gets locked.

[Dusk]

Dusk...
I'm cleared. I'm not mafia because I have a cop investigation on me, and I'm not SK because I was roleblocked on a night that the SK killed.

I'm town. Irrefutably.

I wasn't suggesting that you're not clear, just that you are trying to plan for too many things we can't control. As of now I truly believe you must be Town through process of elimination. Also, given there were two kills last Night and you were Blocked it doesn't make since that you are Mafia or the SK. You're right.

Contingency plans in a game about robot warriors, that's pro-town. Logic circuits ftw.

Lol. Finally someone in character. Still let's just stick to the most likely options right now, even if we brainstorm other ways things could go wrong.

[Dusk]

I suppose it won't matter. We all assume our Cop and RB are trustworthy, that Lowell is in fact Masoned, and Skruff was both blocked and investiated so he's in the clear. Going with this we can all agree the last scum is between me and Confused.

You all will either wrongly lynch me the next Day or it'll come out in the Night that I am in fact Waspinator when I'm killed. Either way Confused would still be the next obvious suspect in time to gain the Town a win. So long as Aimee gets a verdict we all trust the next Day. Even if it's not me that Confused Kills, Aimee should get verdict... Unless Confused kills Aimee. If Confused kills Aimee then it should be apparent that Confused is guilty because I was the one blocked and everyone else is clear. Things still work out.

[Dusk]

I bet Aimee was Sane. Rattrap is an impeccable spy for the Maximals.

Let's see... If we still believe that Jordan is indeed the RB, then we must believe I am cleared because he blocked me and sombody still died.

If we lynch ryan/ Confused and for some reason the game does not end, then we need to assume that our Mason, RB, or one cleared townie is lying (me or Skruff).

Right now Confused is the best choice going off of the events of last night.

This may get dangerous if we're worng again because then that leaves Lowell, Skruff, Jordan, and Me. The last Mafioso can still only kill one of us, therefore, we can still have a majority vote the next day. For that reason I feel good about hammering Confused/ Ryan here.

VOTE: Ryan

[Dusk]

For a while I was worried when Aimee got extra fixated on me. I knew she'd be one of my biggest critics since that whole incident with Fraggle. When she had the extra clout of claiming Cop I thought my days might be numbered, but I didn't have to lie once to even the score!

Good game everyone.

See elsewhere on the site.

[Dusk]

I want to know if I correctly guessed characters:

Lowell are you Optimus Primal masoned to Megatron for the truce?

Skruff are you Cheetor, the only Maximal left?

At this understanding major original characters not in the game seem to be Tarantulas and Terrorsaur.