NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER

[Flubbernugget]

@tier

why is bear

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Fuck.

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Why is beast a better lynch than your other scum reads?

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I don't understand the issue with having a gut read on tone.

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And why are all these new wagons popping up right before deadline? Because Thor fakeclaimed/halfclaimed?

Lovely.

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@Teir do you have a town case for Thor?

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For flub and gm

@TSO: yadda yadda yadda

In 3504 I thought Thor was trying to shift suspicion onto garmr without explicitly stating it. That's why I asked why he asked. Then, in 3507 thor says where it's actually at: just as he is, I'm townreading garmr for the replace-out. However, I wasn't very open about it, basically because everyone was yelling at me it wasn't true. (wait I'm totally noting that I think there is scum in one of those nay-sayers).

3507 made no sense at all for a scum player. Not only was he stating a townread on the (only) counterwagon (which can be done for towncred), he was also actively trying to get other people (me) to townread garmr.

Then in 3613 I see him stating something that looks like final reads, without trying to take credit for doing so. Instead, he is encouraging people to join his wagon, if only to do something with their vote, to show where their intentions lie. Not trying to push counterwagons but trying t get other people to do somethong so he can read them.

Tl;dr: he's close to getting lynched and gives no shit about that, but DOES give a shit about why he's getting lynched. Scumhunting still in the face of getting the noose.

What do you think about his vote on shiro?

His interactions with Muffin?

Why did he jailkeep a useless player?

Also, a lot of your town case relies on town reading a replace out, which I'm not fond of.

[Flubbernugget]

Dave, you're the leading wagon with <1 day to DL. If you've got a big claim, better claim it now.

We're talking about Thor tomorrow.

This shit is pissing me off.

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I'm presuming we have a Vig because unless everyone here has a PR SK + multiball is bullshit. though I've played with it before and won convincingly.

Bro there's no vig if axle is alive.

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VOTE: thor

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VOTE: reinoe

L-1

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Wow boons you have me sold.

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Thor/Reinoe/Boons scumteam would be epic lulz

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a question he asked to everyone. Again you haven't refuted that point at all, you've just added a bunch of words.

It's a different question.

I asked thor who is scum. Remember? And guess what, I asked him a second time too in big bold letters. Again, why are you ignoring this? Oh yeah, I also asked nero and TSO questions about what Scripten talked about in the neighborhood in big bold letters. Do you think the significance is that I'd like answers or do you want to make up something out of thin air like you're doing now?

You asked Flubber a 3rd time.

Let's move to the conclusion though.

Flubber said 'anyone who isn't scum'

Why didn't you ask who he thinks is scum if you wanted an answer to your questions so badly you repeated it 3 times?

Not saying his "who is town" question is a good one but to challenge him about not asking for my scum reads when my pushes were fairly transparent is unfair.

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V/LA family illness

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What's the point in all the excess discussion when both are as good as dead?

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Like I really don't wanna read any of this.

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VOTE: thor

Muffin's flip.

GM's pr flip.

What more is it gonna take ffs.

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There's no way gm was tunneling that hard unless something was up with him. No way in hell.

GM was tunneling on me Day 1.
I claimed a jail on GM Day 2.

So what info do you think GM had exactly?

I'm also sorta v/la till Saturday, so this post functionally works as a prod dodge - but I'll manage some proactive thoughts then.

Also;

I am confirmed not Werewolf at this stage - discuss.

Regardless, Muffin aside,

That I can go with especially from you, as I asked Flub
who mentioned the flip as if the conclusion from it was self evident...

So I am still interested in why flub mentioned that flip.

Muffin had a strong case. His flip shows it was genuine.

GM had a weak case but flipped a pr. In other words, she crumbed a result on Thor.

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Also;

I am confirmed not Werewolf at this stage - discuss.

So you're mafia with axel. Cool.

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You're saying muffin's case was shit and that's about all I can see you saying about it. So what exactly do you want me to refute?

Calling out a gut read from a player as meticulous as Thor isn't making a shit case, and calling him out on the same word play bullshit he stalled D1 with isn't shit either.

GM got more aggressive about thor later in the game.

If GM had backed off her read on thor later in the game I would assume she got a result that cleared Thor.

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Also I don't see any evidence that Thor didn't fakeclaim.

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I think the nk's also point to boons being a sk.

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Why

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Well we've had 3 nks last night so

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Is it non normal to have an x shot sk or something

Meh maybe I'm just over paranoid about boons.

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I was thinking that 2 scumteams wouldn't wifom each other over who was making the investigative kills but I'm not very good with how cop/seer works in normals plus occam's razor kinda means it's not worth digging into.

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Yes, we've got two full scumteams and an x-shot SK! How fair!

Talk to me about boons then, cuz I don't know which is more discomforting: my paranoia about him, or the fact that nobody else seems to be concerned about boons.

[Flubbernugget]

Boons you need some examples to back your case up.

My issue with Boons is that he came off as overwhelmed, and that was the only thing that made me think he was town. But with the numbers significantly thinned, his posting still has that "overwhelmed" feel, so my theory was wrong.

I've seen boons ride a game to the end as scum as a fakeclaimed tracker, and during the end he slipped really hard multiple times over. And I'm hesitant to peg boons as scum because I'm just not seeing slips like that in this game. The problem now is that you can't slip with a bp claim the way you can slip with a tracker claim.

Ohh and hanging out in the neighborhood while hiding in thread isn't really a town tell.

[Flubbernugget]

I ask everyone again why they are town reading thor.

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He thinks you may be scum

to be blunt, I'm playing with 9 crummy players and picking out which 4 are scum seems like a crapshot. When I get more time I can prob narrow things down but I do have a question: you seem to think contradictions are so scummy. Why then are you not jumping on TSO?

Because I still want a thor lynch.

Btw what's your town read on thor consist of?

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UNVOTE:

The only thing that got you through those slips was that you were playing with wake88 and some fool that got conftown endgamed. And you were pegged by the only competent player that made it to lylo with a passing glance.

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But it's a moot point since there's no way to slip as bp like you can as tracker.

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Also back your meta read up

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UNVOTE:

Why did your vote not move to Boons?

I want him to back his meta read up.

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Try reading again. You're a better lynch tomorrow depending on whether or not Nero is alive anyway.

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Also back your meta read up

which meta read?

How I push you really hard when I'm town.

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So you can't back your read up.

VOTE: boons

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So you can't back your read up.

VOTE: boons

@flub

you are voting for the wrong guy.
We are lynching Nero today.

So I've tunneled Thor the whole game and it really sucks to be wrong but this is just salting the wound.

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Also axle are you reading the game because you missed something important

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Are you sure axle is town

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Holy shit slandar is axel now

@mod you said this wasn't a bastard game

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So axle you tell us you've stated your reads implicitly but then complain when we interperet your reads wrong?

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TBF, he did. He was sheeping/shadowing IZ's "reasoning" that GM had night action information that you were scum. Not that that's anymore townie than not explaining but ya know, lets be factually correct here.

I asked him to explain how that worked - he dodged doing that.

Po-tay-to po-tah-to.

When a pr has an awkward read on someone it's usually a crumb or soft guilty. I've already said this and I don't understand why I even had to say it the first time.

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TBF, he did. He was sheeping/shadowing IZ's "reasoning" that GM had night action information that you were scum. Not that that's anymore townie than not explaining but ya know, lets be factually correct here.

I asked him to explain how that worked - he dodged doing that.

Po-tay-to po-tah-to.

When a pr has an awkward read on someone it's usually a crumb or soft guilty. I've already said this and I don't understand why I even had to say it the first time.

If GM had been a cop or if GM had not random tunnel derped me *Day 1* then I would understand your logic.
I do not understand your logic.
You have still failed to explain it here.

Had you have been cleared she would have dropped.

You're also convinently ignoring the fact that Muffin verbally ripped you a new asshole and then flipped town. Also you tried arguing with him using the same semantic bullshit you mislynched Pere with.

[Flubbernugget]

Had you have been cleared she would have dropped.

I will agree with that, but 'lack of clear' is VASTLY different than 'confirmation of suspicion'.
Also, she's a tracker, she could never clear me.

You're also convinently ignoring the fact that Muffin verbally ripped you a new Smurfhole and then flipped town.

I wasn't ignoring this, I was just unaware it was part of your case.
So you're saying Muffin's case on me held water? What did you like about his case on me?

Also you tried arguing with him using the same semantic bullSmurf you mislynched Pere with.

Which is also the same semantic stuff I used to correctly choose between Reinoe and Beast.
Giving me a, what, 50% accuracy with it? Which is actually above random chance, making it, apparently, a good technique.
And also ignores that Pere was playing so bad that he flat out admitted this and self-voted, so even if I was 'wrong' it wasn't like I was making stuff up, even by Pere's own admission.
This seems like just an empty attack tacked onto your post.

I'd mostly like to hear further thoughts on the GM and Muffin points - I feel like we're getting somewhere now.

What do you think gm's motivation was behind her tunnel on you?

I like that muffin wouldn't play lawyer with you and called you out on it.

And will you stop with these fucking numbers because you had a 1/2 chance of lynching scum between that cc so whatever tactics you want to say you're using to scumhunt don't hold water with that lynch.

[Flubbernugget]

@thor

The whole argument with Muffin was for you to not use wordplay as a case. That's a pretty good stance to argue. His flip confirms the motivation behind his stance.

I didn't listen to a single case between the cc's because they were both as good as dead so it didn't matter. As far as I'm concerned you got lucky and there's no way to prove otherwise.

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@Flub

So flub, hopefully I wasn't wasting your time.
Please read 5528 and tell what that means for your current push on Thor.

@mod: VC is all kinds of wrong, up to and including majority size.

You are wasting my time because you seem to not understand the concept of a gunsmith.

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What's the point in all the excess discussion when both are as good as dead?

@shiro

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Gosh I dunno flubb maybe getting the mafia so we dont waste a lynch and force a specific kill from scum ?

You do realise had we lynched beaast we would waste this day lynching rei and mafia would have had an extra kill because they wouldn't have been forced to kill beast.

For all we know both scum team could have shot beast and Gm is vig thus averting 2 deaths by getting it right.

Does this answer your question flub?

Yes. But why did you answer this now and not when it would have been useful?

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The only reason the boons wagon died is because of his activity. Why did everyone lose interest?

Nero is there a reason you keep screaming that axle is town but like the iz wagon more?

Also garmr wagon is terrible

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[

Also garmr wagon is terrible

Want to explain what bit you don't like about it?

preemptive guess. Even, If scummy people are voting it, they can be on the other team...
Indeed under number of scenarios (depending on how exposed or not a scum team thinks they are) driving to lynch the other team then shoot he last one tonight, may be a good MB play.

Garmr and josh were the same slot right?

Recent complete games show garmr as playing to his town meta here. Josh didn't get the opportunity to come up with some insane lynchworthy theory and he's too easy to scumpaint. Pine idk.

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Can nero and axle just kiss already because I can't read this anymore

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Also thor's questoning of the replacements is awful.

"Hey guys how dare you be human beings here for entertainment purposes only"

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Recent complete games show garmr as playing to his town meta here.

Expand on this please?

@Flubber - Still hoping for expansion on this.

I think he's town based on his meta and you can do a metadive yourself if you disagree

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Guys maybe I'm missing something but why is it okay to push on a claimed gunsmith right now

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Guys maybe I'm missing something but why is it okay to push on a claimed gunsmith right now

Gunsmith is something that I would expect werewolves to have, no? Who's the claimed gunsmith?

Nero has claimed that thor has no gun. So he's fucked his whole scumteam by your theory unless you want to argue me as a fourth wolf.

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ARE YOU FUCKING KIDDING ME

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VOTE: nero

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Are you? I think you are literally the only person (besides DGB who hadn't been here and hadn't read it) who was taking the claim seriously - and that only late in the day.
Why in the universe did you never ask him for his other results if you thought it was legit?

So mafia can know how many shots he is?

Why didn't you comment on my unvote right after he said it?

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So mafia can know how many shots he is?

Why didn't you comment on my unvote right after he said it?

1. So you presumed he was limited shot?

2. Didn't even register to me.

Why would a Gunsmith clear on me make any difference - even when you voted me a blind man could see that if I was anyone's scumbuddy it would be Scripten, not Reinoe - so...if I was a wolf I wouldn't have a gun. So...?

1) Infinity is also a number
2) That's probably something that should have registered if you wanted my lynch.

As to whether or not you're a wolf or a maf, I have no idea where your associatives are coming from but if it's from yesterday then kindly fuck off.

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So why exactly are you voting me?

Becacuse your inability to vote axle after all the bitching you've done with him is fucking atrocious and your vote on me is also atrocious. And again, if I unvote right after you make a post implying you cleared someone and actually didn't, a town mindset would have wanted an answer. A scum mindset would have seen that as an excellent coasting opportunity off of someone else's ignorance.

Considering you have no town reads what exactly is your case on me anyway?

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And again, if I unvote right after you make a post implying you cleared someone and actually didn't, a town mindset would have wanted an answer.

So you bought into the fact that you thought I was a GS and you unvoted Thor thinking he was clear but I should have asked you? holy fuck man. No way you are town and that dense.

It's not being dense. Considering how you "caught" me as scum d2 and are still pushing me from that without having the balls to actually admit it shows you have no right to call anyone dense.

For why I'm voting you. Its mostly POE and gut. I remember hating your song and dance about me and muffin having different reads on Boons and other than that I can't remember anything you've done (which is a red flag in itself!) But to me POE really makes me think TSO, Thor, Shiro and Pine are town. I know I'm town so I'm left with you, Axle, DGB, Slan and Boon. I'm a little less sure on Boon (and reasoning will be given later) and Slan. So lynching from you three makes sense and I can't for the life of me get Axle lynched (even though he's blatant mafia) So you and DGB are my options today.

So when did you change from having no town reads to having 4? Oh wait it really doesn't matter because you're making no fucking sense. How do you have town reads from poe that lead to poe scum reads, and somehow manage to fill up the roster with reads that way?

This also in no way explains why you don't have the resources to push the wagon you say you want.

Yep I'm dense here

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I honestly do not get why Flub is not doing anything we are in a kind of serious point in the game and honestly I would expect a townie to do his best to defend himself right now, not vanish and go w/e

This is not alignment indicative so try again

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Also vt

No wait I mean 1 shot jk because that makes more sense somehow

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Also vt

No wait I mean 1 shot jk because that makes more sense somehow

No fair - that's my fakeclaim!

Okay - any last scum reads prior to your death?

your mom

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Ffs just end it bbt

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gg TSO

Thanks for hosting mod