NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER

[goodmorning]

@GM I know you claim not to be reading my posts, but if you (

actually are

<OMG maybe he lied too>) are there are questions I would like to ask you.

You can ask them. I may or may not answer depending on what they are.

I will say that, expanding/slightly altering your point

If beast is WW, and WW consensus last night was that Reinoe was in the mafia team, then if under pressure, WW faking red check on guessed scum Reinoe, would be ... cleverish? (not crack?)

If beast is Rolecop, and got an "Even-Night Cop" result on reinoe, it would be very smart play for him to claim first, especially given that he was/is about to be lynched.
Fake guilty on reinoe would be clever regardless given that reinoe has been fairly townread but this game is full of strange people whose opinions will turn on dimes.

You'll all be happy to know that I got a not-mafia result on boonskies. Because that's how cops in multi-ball get results. Not in the forM of "guilty" "not guilty".

This post can literally only come from scum. Multiball can't be confirmed until a flip of mafia is seen. They know they are mafia so they know it is multiball.

COPS GET GUILTIES ON MAFIA. THERE IS A WEREWOLF FLIP.

WHAT THE FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

@Izariael: That's true, but in multiball games you 99.9999999999% of the time will get Mafia/Not Mafia, especially in a Normal.

[Slandaar]

What do you think about his "point" now Slandaar?

It's genius.

I don't think he even knows how good it is.

He asked 'who is town and who is scum?' to everyone. That is fine, no problem, he is in effect asking for a reads list from people.

You asked Flubber specifically;
Who is town?

Why you asked Flubber specifically doesn't matter but what are you asking him who is town for? what is the point to it? Why not ask him his scumreads? You then later made this a big deal when Flubber didn't respond by bolding it as if this was some super important question which has huge relevance. Guess what?

This is the response you got:

Anyone that isn't a scum read of mine and isn't a lurker gets to be town for my sanity.

That was it. Question answered. That one line.

Guess you should have asked him who is scum if you actually wanted an answer to this very important question, hm?

Also, I just found this;

@Flubber
Who's town

Nero, teir, and maaaaaybe gm. everyone else that isn't scum is null.

Egg is hard town for keeping up with the game, and for overall strong scumhunting.

Muffin is town for his scumhunting.

2 of his strongest Townreads (he only had 3 the other being GM who is now a maybe) vanish over the 800 posts it's possible but... It is some serious read changing. The whole thing of answering Reinoe twice in different ways as he did is bad though. Town generally just say they already answered etc.

[Slandaar]

COPS GET GUILTIES ON MAFIA. THERE IS A WEREWOLF FLIP.

WHAT THE FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

@Izariael: That's true, but in multiball games you 99.9999999999% of the time will get Mafia/Not Mafia, especially in a Normal.

You greatly exaggerate.

Cops can get guilties on wolves provided the pm is worded to accommodate all anti town factions turning up guilty.

Lets assume it's multiball as it most likely is. If we have a cop who only finds Mafia then he is a lot weaker than a cop who can find all anti-town factions the limited versions are very swingy as you can investigate a WW and get a 'Not Mafia' which just is terrible. It is much better to have a catch-all at least in my opinion - an even night one so he isn't too powerful? seems really good to me.

[Slandaar]

Even night is also good in this sense because it gives the scum a couple chances to kill them.

A couple chances to kill an even night cop who only finds mafia? what? make him a 1-shot or odd night etc. Even night just makes the PR so weak.

[Slandaar]

Because technically a Mafia/Not Mafia cop is half the strength of one which can find both Wolves and Mafia.

The role is already limited to a fair degree with the even night thing and having to avoid 3 night kills and 2 lynches to actually have a result. You cripple the role if you make it mafia/not mafia the Cop is rewarded for playing well. The scum are rewarded for finding the cop. It's good, it makes sense. Imagine the cop who only gets Mafia/Not and investigates a wolf after avoiding 6 nk's and 2 lynches/not claiming for 2 days.

Lynch Reinoe.

[reinoe]

What do you think about his "point" now Slandaar?

It's genius.

I don't think he even knows how good it is.

He asked 'who is town and who is scum?' to everyone. That is fine, no problem, he is in effect asking for a reads list from people.

And I have found that asking a generic question like that to the entire town is less likely to get answered. Secondly, his whole point about the question was that the question was asked. He makes that very clear that it's the question he has a problem with...a question he asked to everyone. Again you haven't refuted that point at all, you've just added a bunch of words.

You asked Flubber specifically;
Who is town?

Why you asked Flubber specifically doesn't matter but what are you asking him who is town for? what is the point to it? Why not ask him his scumreads? You then later made this a big deal when Flubber didn't respond by bolding it as if this was some super important question which has huge relevance. Guess what?

Yeah so? I didn't see his answer and I bolded it because I asked him a question. Why are you ignoring the fact that I did the same to BOONKIIES AND THOR? Because it had to do with the fact that the question wasn't answered. Again, I also put my questions to Boonskiies and Thor in big bold letters as well. Also that question to Nero and TSO is in big bold letter too...

This is the response you got:

Anyone that isn't a scum read of mine and isn't a lurker gets to be town for my sanity.

That was it. Question answered. That one line.

Guess you should have asked him who is scum if you actually wanted an answer to this very important question, hm?

I asked thor who is scum. Remember? And guess what, I asked him a second time too in big bold letters. Again, why are you ignoring this? Oh yeah, I also asked nero and TSO questions about what Scripten talked about in the neighborhood in big bold letters. Do you think the significance is that I'd like answers or do you want to make up something out of thin air like you're doing now?

Also, I just found this;

@Flubber
Who's town

Nero, teir, and maaaaaybe gm. everyone else that isn't scum is null.

Egg is hard town for keeping up with the game, and for overall strong scumhunting.

Muffin is town for his scumhunting.

2 of his strongest Townreads (he only had 3 the other being GM who is now a maybe) vanish over the 800 posts it's possible but... It is some serious read changing. The whole thing of answering Reinoe twice in different ways as he did is bad though. Town generally just say they already answered etc.

Are you not paying attention? His EGG read is a joke because Egg was dead at the time and confirmed town. His Muffin stance is an addition to the previous read. Herp a derp are you even reading? Instead of conjuring up fantasy explanations why don't you just re-read everything.

[reinoe]

Even night is also good in this sense because it gives the scum a couple chances to kill them.

A couple chances to kill an even night cop who only finds mafia? what? make him a 1-shot or odd night etc. Even night just makes the PR so weak.

Or there's a similar odd-night role like...a seer or another cop or a gunsmith or jailkeeper...I could go on but some people don't need PR to win in a game of wits.

[reinoe]

Could someone voting me explain how beast's play this game is town

--->without the PR<---

Like if Beast didn't have a PR was anyone townreading him?

[Slandaar]

a question he asked to everyone. Again you haven't refuted that point at all, you've just added a bunch of words.

It's a different question.

I asked thor who is scum. Remember? And guess what, I asked him a second time too in big bold letters. Again, why are you ignoring this? Oh yeah, I also asked nero and TSO questions about what Scripten talked about in the neighborhood in big bold letters. Do you think the significance is that I'd like answers or do you want to make up something out of thin air like you're doing now?

You asked Flubber a 3rd time.

Let's move to the conclusion though.

Flubber said 'anyone who isn't scum'

Why didn't you ask who he thinks is scum if you wanted an answer to your questions so badly you repeated it 3 times?

[Slandaar]

Are you not paying attention? His EGG read is a joke because Egg was dead at the time and confirmed town. His Muffin stance is an addition to the previous read. Herp a derp are you even reading? Instead of conjuring up fantasy explanations why don't you just re-read everything.

Well that was off the cuff, maybe it was a joke, I was just getting the response to you from his ISO and noticed it.

It doesn't matter too much I can check it later the main point was the interaction with you obviously

[reinoe]

Are you not paying attention? His EGG read is a joke because Egg was dead at the time and confirmed town. His Muffin stance is an addition to the previous read. Herp a derp are you even reading? Instead of conjuring up fantasy explanations why don't you just re-read everything.

Well that was off the cuff, maybe it was a joke, I was just getting the response to you from his ISO and noticed it.

It doesn't matter too much I can check it later the main point was the interaction with you obviously

I was being too harsh because in retrospect I misread your question.

[Slandaar]

Or there's a similar odd-night role like...a seer or

another cop

or a gunsmith or jailkeeper...I could go on but some people don't need PR to win in a game of wits.

Yes, OK.

So, is an odd night seer balanced with an even night cop? nope odd>>>even. Gunsmith doesn't work as wolves don't use guns, right? jailkeeper is... Thor.

Enlarged text:

Wasn't your argument cops can only find mafia?

[reinoe]

Or there's a similar odd-night role like...a seer or

another cop

or a gunsmith or jailkeeper...I could go on but some people don't need PR to win in a game of wits.

Yes, OK.

So, is an odd night seer balanced with an even night cop? nope odd>>>even. Gunsmith doesn't work as wolves don't use guns, right? jailkeeper is... Thor.

Enlarged text:

Wasn't your argument cops can only find mafia?

In an earlier post yes. In post 4881 my point is that there could be an odd night role similar to cops. It's a short list of roles that could be used for investigation.

[Slandaar]

An odd night cop to find mafia? You then need an odd and even night seer...

That is a lot of power.

Multiball generally doesn't have much from my experience (it's generally incredibly low power levels for town considering the numbers of scum)

[Slandaar]

The reason that is so powerful btw is the 4 can confirm each other as town.

[Slandaar]

So, you have 4 guys who can get results while also confirming each other as town. Way too much especially with Tier's role and then we have Thor and a vig presumably and that isn't even everyone claimed...

[reinoe]

So, you have 4 guys who can get results while also confirming each other as town. Way too much especially with Tier's role and then we have Thor and a vig presumably and that isn't even everyone claimed...

Uhmm no, I was just going over possibilities. I think it's likely there's a role similar to cop on the odd night. Nothing more nothing less.

[reinoe]

I believe beast.

Why?

@JOSH

[Flubbernugget]

a question he asked to everyone. Again you haven't refuted that point at all, you've just added a bunch of words.

It's a different question.

I asked thor who is scum. Remember? And guess what, I asked him a second time too in big bold letters. Again, why are you ignoring this? Oh yeah, I also asked nero and TSO questions about what Scripten talked about in the neighborhood in big bold letters. Do you think the significance is that I'd like answers or do you want to make up something out of thin air like you're doing now?

You asked Flubber a 3rd time.

Let's move to the conclusion though.

Flubber said 'anyone who isn't scum'

Why didn't you ask who he thinks is scum if you wanted an answer to your questions so badly you repeated it 3 times?

Not saying his "who is town" question is a good one but to challenge him about not asking for my scum reads when my pushes were fairly transparent is unfair.

[Nero Cain]

Oh, and also dave was obvtown so everyone really really needs to stop being in thor's cult of personality or joindate awe or hero worship or whatever the fuck it is.

this seems like a strange thing to say about your scumread.

If

the host generates the scum and the hoods randomly then, the number of people you have seen flipped in the hood has absolutely no impact on whether the next one is scum too.

people do actually alignment indicative things like claim roles

how are claiming roles "alignment indicative"?

Did Scripten discuss anyone a lot or refuse to discuss anyone in the game?

I don't think so...

says he has a moderate scum read on Axle
thinks there are two scum on the PV wagon and was starting to read muffin as scum
I ask him about Iz, Fonz and Garmr. His response is that IZ hasn't done a whole lot but he's not scum reading Iz. Says that Fonz is fluffy but not scum motivated. Has a scumread on Garmr.
thats p much all.

[Nero Cain]

You'll all be happy to know that I got a not-mafia result on boonskies. Because that's how cops in multi-ball get results. Not in the forM of "guilty" "not guilty".

I really do not think this is true.

I'll look around later to see if this is true but I think its more about a mods personal choice in language.

Three kills in one night and Beast is pretending we don't all know it's multiball +vig.

3 kill=//=mutliball. Other than Boons claiming to know its MB....what makes you think its multiball? Or are you counting sk+ww as multiball?

@Boons-can you explain how your role confirms MB?

Well, the reason I voted Iz is 'cause I'm pretty sure there is scum in that hood. I remember not liking that Beast wagon at all yesterday and hating everyone on it. In my hood last night I had said that I wanted to kill Tier, IZ, and Scripton. Would scum have shot Tier to discredit/discourage me?

But maybe I'm wrong and scum are GM+Shiro.

[goodmorning]

COPS GET GUILTIES ON MAFIA. THERE IS A WEREWOLF FLIP.

WHAT THE FUCKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKKK

@Izariael: That's true, but in multiball games you 99.9999999999% of the time will get Mafia/Not Mafia, especially in a Normal.

You greatly exaggerate.

Cops can get guilties on wolves provided the pm is worded to accommodate all anti town factions turning up guilty.

Lets assume it's multiball as it most likely is. If we have a cop who only finds Mafia then he is a lot weaker than a cop who can find all anti-town factions the limited versions are very swingy as you can investigate a WW and get a 'Not Mafia' which just is terrible. It is much better to have a catch-all at least in my opinion - an even night one so he isn't too powerful? seems really good to me.

Typically even-night implies odd-night in site meta though not always.
As I've said, Cop implies Mafia-detecting-only in current site meta almost 100% of the time.
There are games that specifically use limited-investigative mechanics like this - Jungle Republic, for instance.

As I've said, I don't believe either of them.

Oh, and also dave was obvtown so everyone really really needs to stop being in thor's cult of personality or joindate awe or hero worship or whatever the fuck it is.

this seems like a strange thing to say about your scumread.

It probably would be, if I'd been scumreading him.

Oh, you meant Thor? I don't know what else can explain people voting for the wagons he wants them to vote for and ignoring how 20000% scummy he is.

[beastcharizard]

As I've said, I don't believe either of them.

Then you have to believe both of us are scum in some fashion. Why would town lie in this situation?

[AxleGreaser]

@BEAST

Also, lynch me first. IDGAF. I found scum and I got the town rolling.

egads that is a tempting thought.

especially seeing as you already assessed your own contribution to the game as

Since I have no credibility I should just claim.

AKA if you are as you claim town then primarily useful as an outed PR scum need to shoot soonish.

@

town!beast

:

Please answer

4866 4860 4858
4866 may clarify part of 4858 which you may feel you have answered but I have specific questions about.

[T S O]

I'm conflicted about this, even though I normally just go with the first claim and really want to do so here as well.