NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER


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Post Post #2925 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:01 pm

Post by TierShift »

In post 2892, goodmorning wrote:
In post 2878, TierShift wrote:
In post 2876, Izariael wrote:VOTE: Boonskiies

His last four posts and Flubber's fakeclaim meta () are the tipping points for me. :igmeou:

I haven't caught up yet, but this shit needs lynching.
Flubber"s 2870 should NOT be a reason for you to vote boon. Boon's last 4 posts are not scummy to me. Please explain how they are.

VOTE: iza

Tier. Tier I can't. Tier no. Tier don't do this shit. Not now.

Read the actual fucking post and see iza's just trying to find reasons to justify him being on boon, instead of those reasons naturally causing him to be.

In post 2889, TierShift wrote:I'm warning you, thor. You're getting scarily close to.a townread!

tier ffs why

why

If this is a question:
1. I think you're scum
2. A boonskiies vote would have been so easy
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Post Post #2926 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:09 pm

Post by TierShift »

In post 2787, The Fonz wrote:Nero noticeably better today.

Why?
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Post Post #2927 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:10 pm

Post by TierShift »

Shiro's awfully fencesitty.
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Post Post #2928 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:22 pm

Post by TierShift »

Ok gm I'm not gonna act like my read on you is strong in any way so please can we talk a lot
In post 2800, goodmorning wrote:
In post 2655, TierShift wrote:
I've always seen being bullheaded as a town characteristic until recently a scum player used that to completely catch me off-guard. (GM knows!) It's an easy way to not contribute and I'll meta now.

I literally do not know anything about Tier anymore.

Bulba in walrus and the carpenter mafia.
In post 2660, Shiro wrote:I dunno I think I am way too noob for those big game.

Ahahahaha, me too.

You just accept shiro's fencesitting for what it is?
Do you think her play is similar to the scum newbie game she played or not?

Why did I drop down to 'may not be town' in your readslist?
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Post Post #2929 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 8:51 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 2924, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 2909, Thor665 wrote:Go to his iso, use Ctrl+F for 'Boon' find a post where he's talking about Boon and his claim and how he doesn't see it as a valid scum move.

Ok.
Looking prior to your post where you referred to it. ()
Spoiler: here is every post where Dave talks about Boon
In post 929, davesaz wrote:@Boonskiies: your Cho read is getting stale. What do you think now? Have you even considered questioning anyone or doing other scum hunting?

In post 648, davesaz wrote:
In post 646, Garmr wrote:
In post 562, Boonskiies wrote:Don't push me to claim, please.



In post 572, Boonskiies wrote:I'm almost positive it's multiball. My role basically implies it.

Kinda annoyed that someone would passively role claim day 1 with only one vote on them. If it is multiball all you had to do was wait one day and you could of keeped it hidden from scum. Unless your just saying that to get some town cred but that will sort itself out in time.

UNVOTE: boon

VOTE: Aneninen


Read . I don't think that anyone should claim as a result of this whole multiball thing. Though seeing this interaction it makes me want to consider going after everyone who mentioned it before the big conversation started to see if this whole mess is one big fishing expedition.

Spoiler: Every post where dave replies to someone who talked about Boon, but dave doesnt
In post 504, davesaz wrote:
In post 501, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 491, TobyLoby wrote:
@Pere
, What are your thoughts now that you've read the thread?

Varied and probably not very exciting, but here goes.

Players:
1. Aeronaut*- In some twist of irony has fewer posts than me. We'll see what the catchup police have to say about him, I suppose.
2. Alina- replaced? being replaced?
3. Aneninen- early scumvibes. Later, saying and doing the right things, but taking the meticulous post-by-post approach with no analysis of the posts along with the stunningly empty conclusion of Pere is scum (418). This can easily be compared to Thor's with actual reasons (even if wrong).
4. Boonskiies- Probably scum
5. Cho- thought the mafia claim was good discussion starter. However, it never went anywhere after that, nor was it used to start discussion. For that, downgraded from town-rvs to null (I think psychologically that when scum claim scum it helps relieve their conscious about being scum. If others take it as fake/humor, so much the better. In any scumclaim cases, esp. RVS, ) Nothing has improved the null read, including the wagon on him.
6. GrayfoxxxxCsareo- I liked for town at the start. That diminshed somewhat by the TSO tunnel. Grayfoxx is still got some town sheen, and has not degraded it any since taking over. We'll see how it goes.
7. davesaz- Early scumvibes. Improved somewhat, but still hits me when I read some of his posts. There is scumhunting there, but it seems of the cautious type.
8. Egg- Liked his early push on me. His later self-doubt I read somewhat as town, but keeping your vote there after expressing that doubt takes away the town cred. This is one I'm be exploring more of later.
9. Garmr- probably town.
10. goodmorning- Another player I usually start reading with a town bias towards their posts. So when I read them and feel icky, not a good sign. Leaning scum.
11. Goofyd00d- Early scumvibes. Some of the things he says are contradictions in and of themselves. ( and are examples)
12. hephaestus*- skimmed and will catchup later
13. Izariael- Already discussed. early townlean, but high expectations expected.
14. Muffin- Torn here. Outing neighborhood protown, but votes Cho as scum same post. claims I scumposted without a definition of why it's scumposting (very similar to Aneninen).
15. Nero Cain- early townvibes. We'll see if these stay.
16. PeregrineV- So town! My God, so town!
17. Scripten- early scumvibes. Some wording makes me wonder.392- A vote on him for "town cred" can only be town cred if Scripten is scum. Stuff like that keeps me from calling you town.
18. T S O- I think he's town this game. Probably means he's scum. Not my issue, but not voting him right now.
19. Thor665- early townread, but then downhill (slowly) from there, as he votes opposite my opinion. Kind of used to that, so not a full on scumread for that at this point.
The worst Thor post was calling this game multiball ( and ) for pretty much no reason (because it's 21 players?!?). Should there turn out to be 2 scumteams, I'll probably strongly advocate for a Thor lynch. Until then, I'll go back and forth with and about him trying to figure out if he is town that I just don't get or scum trying to trick me. Always fun. :]
20. TierShift- very early scumvibe, went away slowly. I see peeks of town, but not enough. Null for now, looking for more.
21. TobyLoby- Early null. The styling of some of her posts I think is town, but their delivery and followup are not there. It's like a one-way questioning but I don't think I've seen responses to the responses to her questions. Slight null-scum, but waiting for a strong read to pop.

More on this multiball thing- When otherscum have otherscum to hunt for, it's easier for them to look town. If it does turn out to be 2 scumteams, that would explain why most of the active posters aren't looking too scummy- they are also scumhunting. But, not crossing that bridge until we get to it, if ever.


I have a feeling that there will be people you're reading that I would say I don't have enough information on, so still null to me. I don't think it is fair to call that caution though. I believe being honest about nulls is town while making up a read on little or no evidence is scummy. Not extremely scummy, so not enough to use that by itself as a read.

One of your observations about Thor reminds me of something I've seen at another site. I want to closely re-read the thread before commenting on this further, so this part of my post is largely a reminder to myself to come back to it. Can't spend that much time on it at work. [spoiler2=""]Check my profile age if you want to know why the reminder lol[/spoiler2]

Thor the post you claim exists does not exist in this thread.

So no Thor I cant find the post.

Dave does not say what you claim he said in this game thread.


Could you try searching in another thread where you and Dave can both post but I cant see it?


I remember
seeing
something here that says substantially the same thing that Thor said, but don't see anything I said that could have even been construed to mean the same thing. I think it was probably someone else and Thor got the attribution wrong. Whether he got the attribution wrong by mistake or design, I leave to the reader to discern.

If this point remains unresolved when I'm next available to look at it, I may try to find it myself.


As for what I actually think about Boon, I find Boon's claimed role to be pretty weird. Are there normally town bulletproof here? Anyone familiar with that being a role?
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Post Post #2930 (ISO) » Tue Nov 04, 2014 11:13 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 2929, davesaz wrote:I remember seeing something here that says substantially the same thing that Thor said, but don't see anything I said that could have even been construed to mean the same thing. I think it was probably someone else and Thor got the attribution wrong. Whether he got the attribution wrong by mistake or design, I leave to the reader to discern.


I maybe remember thinking (something like whatever it is), but don't remember reading it.
I want to read it to see if different view sheds more light or different aspect or adds to a town/scum read...

I tried for other posters, between when Thor held one point of view and then changed it...
No joy.

yeah lots of discerning
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Post Post #2931 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:13 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2919, goodmorning wrote:Do you remember the context in which you said that line? If not, there's no point to this.

Yes I do. I didn't see what you said in the hood qt where you initially brought it up thus I can't know exactly what you said and went off what Boon said. Not that it matters as I said.

Do you have a point to this?
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Post Post #2932 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:13 am

Post by Izariael »

Phone post here... will provide quotes when I have computer access.

Tier, maybe you haven't been reading my posts, but my vote isn't really some out-of-the-blue thing. I stated earlier thst I didn't trust Boon's softclaim (it seems even more dodgy given his fullclaim now). I've been subjected to a number of fabricated accusations from Boon, in which he has claimed that my night actions were to A) Kill Egg, B) Kill Aneninen and C) deliberately NOT kill Boonskiies to earn towncred.

HOW DOES C EVEN MAKE SENSE WITH HIS FULLCLAIM? 2-SHOT BULLETPROOF?

Then there's the fakeclaim meta from Flubber. It may not seem like much to you, but I think it's pretty damn parallel, especially given his neighborhood roleclaims, which my fellow neighbors can check out as well.

There's also the fact that the four posts of his referenced in my previous post had him completely retracting his townread on Thor after Shiro brought up a valid point. Rather than retract his bullshit case on me, he would rather retract the townread on Thor which has already influenced his actions in Day 1 and 2.

There's also the fact that he keeps saying "I did (insert action) to gauge so-and-so's reaction". BULLSHIT. His question in neighborhood was never directed at anyone. If I'd not replied, would he still be saying he did it to gauge my reaction? If someone else had replied instead of me, would he still be saying he did it to gauge my reaction? I doubt either scenario would have happened. I think he's using the convenience that I DID reply to act as though his action was a deliberate attempt at scumhunting.

Nevermind that he's doing scummy shit with his Thor vote and saying "he did it to gauge goodmorning's reaction" Like... wtf? That doesn't excuse the fact that it was scummy as fuck. Throwing away the read you've touted with the most conviction in favor of a flimsy scumread? What was the point of all his "Thor is town" nonsense then... Does no one remember that he hammered the vote on PeregrineV because "he trusts Thor"? Read his damn ISO from to the end of the day () and tell me that him throwing his Thor townread out the window the way he did isn't scummy as fuck.

Furthermore, he was asking "who is worth protecting tonight" - what was the point of saying this right after saying "guys, I have a protective role" if he's a "TOWN 2-SHOT BULLETPROOF NEIGHBOR"? If he was trying to scumhunt, then I think that's an inefficient way to go about it, certainly moreso since it's made him do nothing but bark up the wrong tree. I think it's just a flat-out fakeclaim and he couldn't keep his shit straight.
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Post Post #2933 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:19 am

Post by Izariael »

In post 2932, Izariael wrote:Furthermore, he was asking "who is worth protecting tonight" - what was the point of saying this right after saying "guys, I have a protective role" if he's a "TOWN 2-SHOT BULLETPROOF NEIGHBOR"? If he was trying to scumhunt, then I think that's an inefficient way to go about it, certainly moreso since it's made him do nothing but bark up the wrong tree. I think it's just a flat-out fakeclaim and he couldn't keep his shit straight.


This took place in neighborhood but has been covered previously. As I said, I can't quote easily on phone and it gets time-consuming, but I wanted it to be clear that these actions were part of night activity in the hood. Boonskiies' talks about it.
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Post Post #2934 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:21 am

Post by Shiro »

In post 2927, TierShift wrote:Shiro's awfully fencesitty.


Shiro was ill :/

@Slander where is the third point ?I was ill with my tv tuned but I think I missed it :/

@Boon So you town read Thor but you are curious about the slot and think u will gain information even though u admit u didn't read day 1 to know what is up with it ...
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Post Post #2935 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:22 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2852, goodmorning wrote:I'm not interested in anyone else's opinion on what may or may not have been a slip. I am interested in clarifying Izariael's possible slip with Izariael only.

IZ's stance is he did exactly what you accused him of he thinks it is bad to assume scum in the hoods but did in said instance. He made this obvious days ago. I assume you are saying it is a slip?

Why are you not interested in anyone else's opinion on the subject? Did you not find my input useful into your decision making?
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Post Post #2936 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:22 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2934, Shiro wrote:@Slander where is the third point ?I was ill with my tv tuned but I think I missed it :/

The day is young.
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Post Post #2937 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 12:23 am

Post by Izariael »

In post 2932, Izariael wrote:Read his damn ISO from to the end of the day


EBWOP.
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Post Post #2938 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 1:54 am

Post by TierShift »

In post 2934, Shiro wrote:
In post 2927, TierShift wrote:Shiro's awfully fencesitty.


Shiro was ill :/

Shiro has been fencesitty all along.
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Post Post #2939 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 2:40 am

Post by Flubbernugget »

In post 2917, Boonskiies wrote:I'm a village idiot on town and a crazy mad genius on scum.

In post 2913, Flubbernugget wrote:
In post 2911, Boonskiies wrote:I'm just not into this game enough to think things through. I got to the point where I wasn't going to get NK'd anyways, so me being bullet proof doesn't mean anything anymore. There was a reason for me trying to pointlessly claim a PR. I've never been NK'd before though.


It must suck that you don't have a game full of vi's to hide behind right now.
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Post Post #2940 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 2:49 am

Post by Flubbernugget »

I genuinely hope you're scum because. of how dangerous a special snowflake mentality like that can be in real life.
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Post Post #2941 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 2:50 am

Post by Garmr »

Seriously not happy with your latest replies. Your overreaction with the iz so called slip, how the hell you got multiball out a bullet proof role and your reasoning for voting thor (A thor lynch will tell you why egg was killed how?) and admitting to not reading day 1 that well.

UNVOTE: Axle
VOTE: Boonskies
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Post Post #2942 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:03 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2852, goodmorning wrote:To me that reads like a newb in over his head as either alignment. What makes you read it as Scum specifically?

He showed reluctance to vote PV while also showing a willingness to do so. It's very scum 'I don't want responsibility for voting town'
In post 2852, goodmorning wrote:
You were not this aggravating to play with last time we encountered each other.

I have no idea how you can remember my play from a game so long ago.

I annoy people all the time as town. Whether I annoyed you specifically in that game, I don't know, not sure what it has to do with anything though?
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Post Post #2943 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:06 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2867, T S O wrote:I don't know if me "always acting" is a good thing or a bad thing.

It's just a thing.
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Post Post #2944 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:11 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2886, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 2862, Slandaar wrote:I think TSO always acts. But ignoring that; I don't think the act he is using makes him scum.


The act is why, his reads were based as they were and your tell less relevant than it sometimes is.
The act was to slam at perceived weaker players, never state actually why they were scummy, (as opposed to bad (ergo weaker players)) and never look back.
Lots of bravado
In post 1113, T S O wrote:hardball


No substance. (especially none that can be refuted as it fails to reference specific examples.)

Safe.

TSO does put on fake bravado as town. He also does the old 'I ain't posting no reasons lol!'.

It's bad, yes, but he does. I have literally chased him down for this exact thing in a previous game.
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Post Post #2945 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:17 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2907, Boonskiies wrote:Town two shot bulletproof neighbor.

:]

I thought you were VT but that makes sense also.
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Post Post #2946 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:18 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2919, goodmorning wrote:HOW MUCH MORE ATTENTION-GRABBING DO I HAVE TO MAKE THIS: IS ANYONE AT ALL TOWNREADING THOR RIGHT NOW? FUCKING EXPLAIN IT.

Yes I think he is.

Tone.

:cool:
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Post Post #2947 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:21 am

Post by Slandaar »

OK last post for a while... Boon is town, he is actually trying to scumhunt with some quite wild theories which have some interesting levels of thought behind them even if the scumhunting is sub-par.
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Post Post #2948 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:23 am

Post by goodmorning »

In post 2925, TierShift wrote:
In post 2892, goodmorning wrote:Tier. Tier I can't. Tier no. Tier don't do this shit. Not now.

Read the actual fucking post and see iza's just trying to find reasons to justify him being on boon, instead of those reasons naturally causing him to be.

This is less about Izariael and more about you.
Besides which I think he was explaining in a way which is non-indicative. If you feel it's ass-covery that's fine, but I don't. Boon's posts were also somewhat scummy but that's not really where I'm going either.

In post 2889, TierShift wrote:I'm warning you, thor. You're getting scarily close to.a townread!

tier ffs why

why

If this is a question:
1. I think you're scum
2. A boonskiies vote would have been so easy[/quote]
It wasn't. That said, why would Scum-Thor make an easy vote, or at least a vote you perceive as easy?

In post 2928, TierShift wrote:Ok gm I'm not gonna act like my read on you is strong in any way so please can we talk a lot

Sure, I think that would be a grand idea. Anything in particular you'd like to discuss?
In post 2800, goodmorning wrote:
In post 2655, TierShift wrote:
I've always seen being bullheaded as a town characteristic until recently a scum player used that to completely catch me off-guard. (GM knows!) It's an easy way to not contribute and I'll meta now.

I literally do not know anything about Tier anymore.

Bulba in walrus and the carpenter mafia.

What does this even mean?

In post 2660, Shiro wrote:I dunno I think I am way too noob for those big game.

Ahahahaha, me too.
[/quote]
You just accept shiro's fencesitting for what it is?
Do you think her play is similar to the scum newbie game she played or not?

Why did I drop down to 'may not be town' in your readslist?[/quote]
Like I said, I read this as 'lost newb' which is not particularly indicative. I do have a townlean on the slot based on Cho though.
Not really, but again, there's a huge size difference here.

Because the way you're engaging with the game today feels really really off. Also I'm not really seeing any of your thought process, which is really weird for you.

In post 2929, davesaz wrote:Are there normally town bulletproof here? Anyone familiar with that being a role?

Sometimes. It's surged a little in popularity since the Newbie setup changed to Matrix6. 2-Shot would be about the right number of shots for a Large.

I'm pretty sure it counts as Normal but am too lazy to look it up at present.

In post 2931, Slandaar wrote:
In post 2919, goodmorning wrote:Do you remember the context in which you said that line? If not, there's no point to this.

Yes I do. I didn't see what you said in the hood qt where you initially brought it up thus I can't know exactly what you said and went off what Boon said. Not that it matters as I said.

Do you have a point to this?

You felt fine judging that Izariael's statement was not a scumslip without seeing it. When I took issue with you, you used "I didn't see your post" as an excuse. These things are mildly contradictory.

In post 2932, Izariael wrote:There's also the fact that he keeps saying "I did (insert action) to gauge so-and-so's reaction". BULLSHIT. His question in neighborhood was never directed at anyone. If I'd not replied, would he still be saying he did it to gauge my reaction? If someone else had replied instead of me, would he still be saying he did it to gauge my reaction? I doubt either scenario would have happened. I think he's using the convenience that I DID reply to act as though his action was a deliberate attempt at scumhunting.

I replied as well, and indeed with a similar answer iirc. I wonder about that.

In post 2935, Slandaar wrote:
In post 2852, goodmorning wrote:I'm not interested in anyone else's opinion on what may or may not have been a slip. I am interested in clarifying Izariael's possible slip with Izariael only.

IZ's stance is he did exactly what you accused him of he thinks it is bad to assume scum in the hoods but did in said instance. He made this obvious days ago. I assume you are saying it is a slip?

I'm not saying anything about it at present.

Why are you not interested in anyone else's opinion on the subject? Did you not find my input useful into your decision making?

Because YOU WERE NOT THERE.
No, and I really wish you'd input your opinion somewhere else. Like on Thor. Do you townread him?

P-Edit: Lovely. LOVELY. Look, I am now scumreading him based on him posting nothing but easy posts yesterday. Care to comment, or shall I ignore you the rest of the Day?
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Slandaar
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Post Post #2949 (ISO) » Wed Nov 05, 2014 4:51 am

Post by Slandaar »

In post 2948, goodmorning wrote:You felt fine judging that Izariael's statement was not a scumslip without seeing it. When I took issue with you, you used "I didn't see your post" as an excuse. These things are mildly contradictory.

OK let's just recap

I say you accused him of the slip.
You say: No I didn't you are misrepping me I wanted a discussion!!!
I say: Well maybe but I didn't see what you said in your hood qt so whatever it's chinese whispers.

Call it an excuse if you like but it's obviously true as I can't see your qt.

Your point then is this mildly contradicts me saying IZ didn't slip when the 'slip' had been explained very nicely in the thread? was it not explained correctly? (you probably should have said something) :]
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