NY 178: MASQUERADE -- GAME OVER


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Post Post #1025 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:34 am

Post by PeregrineV »

In post 1022, Thor665 wrote:
In post 1012, PeregrineV wrote:I therefore conclude that
part of your case on my is me calling you out for saying multiball is a safe assumption
.
Is this conclusion inccorect?

No, I would agree that you calling me out is part of my case on you - I have said so on numerous occasions.

In post 1012, PeregrineV wrote:I think I said, should there be 2 scumteams, I will be pushing strongly for a Thor lynch. Given that 25% of 21-player large games have 2 scumteams, it seems the single-scum reponse would be to ignore or say "good luck with that" and the town response would be to ignore or say "good luck with that."
What I did not expect was "Well they said it it too!" defense.
Axle done detailed it, there is a difference in how it was said in in the context and conviction.
Which takes me back to , "if there are 2 scumteams, I'llbe looking at Thor."

It's actually setting a future condition which may or may not come true, and was but a single read of 20 other players.

This fails, yet again, to actually justify the tell nor to justify how what I did qualifies it as a tell and is not an explanation of the tell.
Though I will admit you did expand somewhat into 'Thor reacting negatively to a unexplained and nonsensical case equates to him being scummier' which *is* something new, but is also nothing about the original tell.

In post 1012, PeregrineV wrote:Considering I have little idea on where you stand on the other 19 players, you could be not-lazy and tell us who is scum with me.


Aeronaut - lurksack
Boonskiies - lurksack, begrudingly shifting to town due to Dave, but still a useless slot.
Cho - Lurksack.
GrayFoxxxx - Lurksack.
Egg - Townish
hephaestus - burning newb - no real vibe yet, still trying to even get him to commit to opinions.
Scripten - I can remember having an opinion on him but can't recall what it is. If I was asked about him I'd ISO myself and repeat whatever I said last (townish?)
TobyLoby - Lurksack.

I want to talk about these.

Aeronaut- Yes. Not sure if alt or hydra or neither, but admittedly higher expectations
Boon- How does Dave make Boon more town?
Cho- what about early content as opposed to current lurking?
Grayfoxx- What did you think about Csar?
Egg- Is that more for in-thread play or the neighborhood posting?
hephaestus- to my memory he has like 5 posts. Why is he not a lurkersack?
Scripten- Yes, my Scripten vote caused the PeregrineV vote. You townread him because:
In post 376, Thor665 wrote:My read on him is more one of gut and 'I agree with that' but I like how he singled out Tier as looking town and didn't mention GM - which is where I'm at and feels a logical town place to be rather than a scum looking to toss out some easy town reads.
Considering the quality and content level of his other 26 posts, it really feels like your reaching to give a townread on him. Because it seems based on , which has not been repeated, reiterated, investigated, etc. since that post.
TobyLoby- had some posting before lurk/replace. Thoughts based on those posts?
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Post Post #1026 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:51 am

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1025, PeregrineV wrote:I want to talk about these.

Sure, why not, you don't want to explain your case, maybe you'll distract me.

In post 1025, PeregrineV wrote:1. Aeronaut- Yes. Not sure if alt or hydra or neither, but admittedly higher expectations
2. Boon- How does Dave make Boon more town?
3. Cho- what about early content as opposed to current lurking?
4. Grayfoxx- What did you think about Csar?
5. Egg- Is that more for in-thread play or the neighborhood posting?
6. hephaestus- to my memory he has like 5 posts. Why is he not a lurkersack?
7. Scripten- Yes, my Scripten vote caused the PeregrineV vote. You townread him because:
In post 376, Thor665 wrote:My read on him is more one of gut and 'I agree with that' but I like how he singled out Tier as looking town and didn't mention GM - which is where I'm at and feels a logical town place to be rather than a scum looking to toss out some easy town reads.
Considering the quality and content level of his other 26 posts, it really feels like your reaching to give a townread on him. Because it seems based on , which has not been repeated, reiterated, investigated, etc. since that post.
8. TobyLoby- had some posting before lurk/replace. Thoughts based on those posts?

1. This isn't a conversation or a question.
2. Dave's point about theory scum Boon motivations. I agree with it.
3. If his earlier content was exciting or interesting I would have remembered it - I don't, therefore it wasn't to me.
4. Newb and confusing - If forced to state a read he would have been on the town side. But I wasn't really sold one way or the other.
5. Neighborhood - I explained this read already. In this thread he is a lurksack.
6. Because to my memory he just started posting and his lurking looks strategic more than blocking me from getting a read on him.
7. This is also not a question.
8. None, or I would have remembered something.
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Post Post #1027 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:34 pm

Post by Aneninen »

In post 1000, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 860, Aneninen wrote:Scripten – What's the story here? All I can see is a moderately-active townie who (maybe?) waits for more content and reads. Have I missed something? Also, I find it strange that Scripten is mentioned many more times than according to the amount of his content should have been. Lean town.

I would like more elaboration on this, as to why he leans town.


First of all, I checked Izariael's vote-post again and that case is pretty much nothing.
"Top scumread would be Scripten. I'm irked by everything in his ISO."
There was 6 posts from Scripten in that time. 4 were null. How could he be "irked"? After that, he started interacting with certain players. His reactions seemed to be normal town reactions for me. There are also town bits like this
"What is this in reference to? I've got to admit that this game moves way too fast for random statements with no direct context to stick in my mind."
in (responding to Boonskiies). Also, I believe that he was reading and thinking before joining your wagon.

PeregrineV wrote:Your scumread and vote of me came without you doing any of these things to me. Explain the hypocrisy.


You're wrong. Remember. We were talking about your readlist, for example. The whole multiball-topic has been an overdone shyt in my opinion, so I haven't talked a lot about that. That's true. Also, we haven't interacted too much, maybe we had other things to do. But, as you can see, if questions are asked, answers are given.
Right now, I still think you're scum but I have two stronger scumreads. A pity that noone would ever believe me.

_____

And I've started to focus on the things which were lost. Ignored. Forgotten. Come, little yarns, come to me, we'll dream together. Tell me the story just like Laura Palmer told me 3 years ago by sitting on my bed for weeks. And I understood in the end.

I'm not telling right now but here is something.

Thor posts a readlist like this: and no one bats an eye.
Aneninen posts a readlist like this: and and everyone loses their minds.
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Post Post #1028 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:39 pm

Post by Thor665 »

Well.

1. I don't think there has been enough time for anyone to actually particularly react to my list.
2. I only did it because I was asked.
3. Would you like some cheese?
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Post Post #1029 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 12:58 pm

Post by Muffin »

In post 1022, Thor665 wrote:Muffin - Not fond of hard Thor defense. Call it mildly mild on the scum side.

Don't misconstrue things please.

Attacking a really weak case on someone does not equate to "hard defending" that player.

You can consider yourself an ally of convenience if you like.
One's self-meta cannot be known without invalidating it.
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Post Post #1030 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 1:03 pm

Post by davesaz »

In post 998, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 856, davesaz wrote:haven't even developed a read on Egg yet.


Why not? You have 30 posts, they have 24. If you think all 24 Egg posts are null, then would like to hear that.


Because a read would require allocating more thought to that slot than I have up to this point. Unlike some people I could mention, I don't do a single read through and instantly pigeonhole all 20 players. That seems a lot more suspicious to me than having few reads.
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Post Post #1031 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 1:42 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 977, T S O wrote:From my one game of experience with him, I get the feeling he was.

I was scum and he was town, but he was logical enough for me to defend him.

I'll go back and check, but you can assume I'm right on that.



Ok so please, explain some specific examples that you were referring to with this.

In post 383, T S O wrote:I really don't agree with anything Aneninen is saying right now.


I agree the things he was saying may or may not be right (or greta town play/reads), but you have now I think stated they are so illogical that you cant see Aneninen posting them as town.
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Post Post #1032 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 3:29 pm

Post by goodmorning »

In post 1030, davesaz wrote:
In post 998, PeregrineV wrote:
In post 856, davesaz wrote:haven't even developed a read on Egg yet.

Why not? You have 30 posts, they have 24. If you think all 24 Egg posts are null, then would like to hear that.

Because a read would require allocating more thought to that slot than I have up to this point. Unlike some people I could mention, I don't do a single read through and instantly pigeonhole all 20 players. That seems a lot more suspicious to me than having few reads.

It's not hard to have a vague idea on most people though.
EFFORT IS NOT INDICATIVE OF ALIGNMENT
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Post Post #1033 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:10 pm

Post by Thor665 »

In post 1029, Muffin wrote:
In post 1022, Thor665 wrote:Muffin - Not fond of hard Thor defense. Call it mildly mild on the scum side.

Don't misconstrue things please.

Attacking a really weak case on someone does not equate to "hard defending" that player.

You can consider yourself an ally of convenience if you like.

Nah. I'll agree Goodmorning's play is weaksauce, but you're attacking her logic here. There is nothing inherently scummy in having gut reads - town do it all the time, and you have not shown that Goodmorning wouldn't or doesn't do that.
You're thumping on her really aggressively for what is play that is easily either suck town or kinda weak scum, and it's your big push.

Now, maybe you're trying to read her, and that's your deal, but it does come off as weirdly defensive towards me, which makes me feel the potential of buddying and I think that leaves you deserving of a call out.
Heck, take me out of the equation and 'oddly aggressive attack on gut read' becomes your play and that's worth a narrowed set of eyes all by itself.
I do not disagree that Goodmorning is being bad - she assuredly is, and she's even playing it up like she has a plan (and well she might, but I bet it's pretty weaksauce once we see it and won't justify the lackluster play). That said - the level of your attack on it is not in proper relation to the level of her crime. So it's weird, and I find you scummy for it.
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Post Post #1034 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:34 pm

Post by Muffin »

ok
One's self-meta cannot be known without invalidating it.
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Post Post #1035 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:54 pm

Post by Egg »

Aneninen wrote:At this point I must tell you the following: If I got lynched Today you all should examine these votes. It's strongly possible that the scums are between these votes because they want to build a counter-wagon quickly.
In other words: compare the PeregrineV wagon and my one. On PeregrineV there were much content written. On me, almost nothing.


This actually reads both genuine and true? Is there actually a case on Aneninen. I don't remember reading it.

I mean, this is just lol:
TSO wrote:Aneninen, has there been any large wagon today you haven't supported? I don't think there has.

Aneninen wrote:You can ISO me to see: apart from my random vote I've only voted for PeregrineV so far


Gonna start my read from Page 30 within the next couple of days. I'm off work until Saturday night.
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Post Post #1036 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 5:55 pm

Post by Egg »

Not sure how the question mark and period got switched in my first line...
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Post Post #1037 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:10 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1035, Egg wrote:
Aneninen wrote:At this point I must tell you the following: If I got lynched Today you all should examine these votes. It's strongly possible that the scums are between these votes because they want to build a counter-wagon quickly.
In other words: compare the PeregrineV wagon and my one. On PeregrineV there were much content written. On me, almost nothing.


This actually reads both genuine and true? Is there actually a case on Aneninen. I don't remember reading it.

I mean, this is just lol:
TSO wrote:Aneninen, has there been any large wagon today you haven't supported? I don't think there has.

Aneninen wrote:You can ISO me to see: apart from my random vote I've only voted for PeregrineV so far


Gonna start my read from Page 30 within the next couple of days. I'm off work until Saturday night.


I made a case -_-.
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Post Post #1038 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:20 pm

Post by Egg »

Was it before Page 30? If not, I haven't made it that far yet? If so, quote?
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Post Post #1039 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:33 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1038, Egg wrote:Was it before Page 30? If not, I haven't made it that far yet? If so, quote?


In post 685, Garmr wrote:
In post 682, Aneninen wrote:TSO. Your last statement is wrong. You can ISO me to see: apart from my random vote I've only voted for PeregrineV so far. And I posted my reasons for doing so.
My scumread gets stronger because it seems that you're doing nothing but tunnelling me. Eg. out of your last 10 posts there were only 2 which weren't about me in some aspects.
"It's a nasty feeling when you get caught as scum, isn't it?"
– Well, if I were you I'd start to construct a very good excuse now. Your gameplay will look very awkward after my flip.
"If you don't like Aneninen, try using your vote. I hear all the cool kids are doing it these days."
– For sure, yeah. Day1 mislynches are very good.

@Garrmr
"finally I don't like the way Aneninen handled the way I pushed on boonskies by trying to disprove my points yet being unable to, ending up saying I don't agree with you. It just felt like a failed chainsaw attempt for boon."

I didn't find that part, sorry. "I don't agree with you" = "I see your points, even if I have a different opinion". Thats'why I didn't answer anything else. My goal is to examine the players' motivations whether they're coming from a town or a scum. That's all: I moved on, I found more interested things in the thread. I'd have tried harder to push you if I had performed a Chainsaw. Especially because you had been voting for Boonskiies before you voted for me.


It's not the fact you didn't agree with me. It's the fact you tried to discredit my points. Which you weren't able to then you just brushed it off passively by saying oh well we don't agree. It really cut any progress on boonskies short as he hasn't provided much content. You basically just tried wked him.

and no you were pushing on tso at the time and I wasn't voting you and as tso says your interest increases in a player once they are voting you.


a small summary case here but most of my views can be seen between my debate through i have an updated view on him and it's still scum I just been playing to much smash bros to be bothered typing it out. I also remember tso making a case earlier. There were also comments from other players who aren't on the wagon why he is scummy as well.
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Post Post #1040 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:49 pm

Post by Egg »

Oh, that whole thing. Yeah, I didn't agree with you there.

Basically, I understand why you'd go after Boon, but I think Boon is town and his softclaiming is poor town play, not scum play. Aneninen seems to think you are scum for pushing a potential power role. I can understand that too. But I don't think it makes as much sense for scum to do that as people seem to think. The whole issue seems like a chain reaction of misunderstandings more than anything and I actually have Boon, you, and Aneninen all as town.
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Post Post #1041 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 6:59 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1040, Egg wrote:Oh, that whole thing. Yeah, I didn't agree with you there.

Basically, I understand why you'd go after Boon, but I think Boon is town and his softclaiming is poor town play, not scum play. Aneninen seems to think you are scum for pushing a potential power role. I can understand that too. But I don't think it makes as much sense for scum to do that as people seem to think. The whole issue seems like a chain reaction of misunderstandings more than anything and I actually have Boon, you, and Aneninen all as town.


At the time boon didn't claim a power role.
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Post Post #1042 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 7:14 pm

Post by Garmr »

I should rephrase that, at the time Aneninen did his thing with boon. Boon didn't even hint at a power role this comes after Annienens chainsaw defense of him. Also he admits he doesn't even think Boon is town he just wants to discredit my points which he didn't. To me that's a scum that doesn't want to make his read look bad but backfires.
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Post Post #1043 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 8:34 pm

Post by Aneninen »

In post 1028, Thor665 wrote:Well.
1. I don't think there has been enough time for anyone to actually particularly react to my list.
2. I only did it because I was asked.
3. Would you like some cheese?


1. Maybe. That fact have not give a read on you. Time passes. It is giving a read on certain players.
2. Does that make a difference?
3. Yes, please. I'm going to coock lecho today. Do you want some? (Sausage excluded, sorry. I'm a vegetarian.)


@Garmrmrhh. I can see that you had drawn a lot of "Regardless Of" cards before the game started. You needn't play all of them at me. You'll need them later.

______

Through the darkness of future past, the magician longs to see, one chance out between two worlds. Fire Walk With Me!
One of my scumreads confirmed himself.
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Post Post #1044 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 8:38 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1043, Aneninen wrote:

@Garmrmrhh. I can see that you had drawn a lot of "Regardless Of" cards before the game started. You needn't play all of them at me. You'll need them later.


I don't understand this. Please explain.
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Post Post #1045 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 8:52 pm

Post by Aneninen »

I explained my posts about Boonskiies and about my problems with your case against him. Our conversation was ended because you assumed that I'd been unable to understand your posts. Basicly, you're discarding everything I post unless you can add it to your case. Hadn't you do so, you'd know what a "Regardless of Card" is.
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Post Post #1046 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:00 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1045, Aneninen wrote:I explained my posts about Boonskiies and about my problems with your case against him. Our conversation was ended because you assumed that I'd been unable to understand your posts. Basicly, you're discarding everything I post unless you can add it to your case. Hadn't you do so, you'd know what a "Regardless of Card" is.


I don't discard everything you post and I have been communicating to you as well like in post 942,967,969 for example were I try to explain my mindset and was trying to figure out how you were thinking as well with mindset thing. You didn't understand what i was trying to convoy and i gave up and dropped it.

Now you mention it, It's a great time to bring out more things I find scummy about you.


In post 420, Aneninen wrote:
Garrmrrmr wrote:Boonskies was the fact he needed to clarify that those were rvs votes.1 No one really asked him for it and it seems odd as town why you feel the need to say hey this is a rvs vote. He really hasn't done anything to strike me as town either.2 Also he dodged the csereo subject and didn't give his thoughts on it which made me feel uncomfortable.3


(1) Boonskiies was just being Boonskiies. I can tell you I've seen that. Even if you haven't come across with him, why is it a scumtell?
(2) So? Hasn't done anything to strike me as town either? This description fits quite a lot of people here.
(3) He has dodged almost every subject so far.

I'm not saying that he's town. He may be scum. But, NOT because of your reasons
, Gammrnmhrm.

In post 765, Aneninen wrote:Garmrmr. I see that you thought I was trying to protect Boonskiies. It's my fault but I forgot to tell you something. I've known him from Mini #1585. In that game he had the same Day1 gameplay before he replaced out and he was town.
That's why I thought he was town.
(As for my reads now I need to follow the recent events.)


This is a major contradiction. At the time you keeped your thoughts open and when you thought he might come off as town you say you defended him becuase you thought he was town. This is a major slip up because as town you would remember your read at the time.



In post 668, Aneninen wrote:Garmmrn, 646 – I'll ignore your vote until you provide any reasons for it. I don't think you're surprised now.

ignoring someones vote and admitting outloud is not what i would consider a town move. I would assume a player with your mindset would question it if you were town. To me it sounds like you didn't want to get dragged out in the open.

I'll put this in a spoiler as this post 1003 is full of information.


Spoiler:
In post 1003, Aneninen wrote:Okay.
It seems that many of the active players are doing the following:
(1) calling me scum regardless of my posts
(2) trying to discredit me in every possible way (the most "popular" amongst these way are the "he's unable to understand our posts" and the "he's unable to make rational arguments")
(3) talking AT me instead of talking TO me.

It's clear that some of the players have a GREAT interest in the things above, so as to reach a situation where the possible answers for EVERYTHING which comes from me are
(1) I don't care because he's scum
(2) I don't care because he's an idiot.

I DO have ideas about the emergence of this situation and I do have about the players who have interest in it but, it seems that someone else will have to discover these facts because these would be discredited pieces of information if they were coming from my slot.

Mind these:

If you WERE interested in my answers you could have asked questions. It didn't happen.
If you NEEDED information for getting a read on me you could have maintained a real communication instead of asking OTHERS about me. It didn't happen.
If you WERE really thinking that I didn't understand your posts or I was unable to express myself, you could have pointed out the concerning bits of information so as to resolve all the possible misunderstandings. It didn't happen.

Therefore, from now on, I refuse to communicate with the players mentioned above because it's pointless. Should you change your attitude, I'd change my attitude too.

Feel free to lynch me. It's not true that I don't care. In this particular game I strongly think that my lynch would be LITERALLY an informational lynch. After my flip my alignment will be cleared and there will be plenty of time for reading this Day again to get plenty of information – despite the fact that many of the players WILL be saying "he was lynched because he was stupid".

Remember one fact. I'm not the best player on this forum but, I'm not an idiot.
Never underestimate anyone. (Especially a player who has been tried to be killed IN REAL LIFE before.)

_____

post-edit. PeregrineV, your question about Scripten is noted.
This
is unseful kind of communication, I'll answer it but it's possible that the answer will come tomorrow.

WTF is this post. It's you just playing the victim card. The motive I see for this post is you looking to survive.

1.First you say calling you scum regardless of your posts are you a dumb ass we are calling you scum BECAUSE OF YOUR GOD DAMN POSTS.

2.One your using those out of context. The your not understanding what I'm posting was the mind set thing this was not incriminating you in anyway and
you didn't understand it but refused to try.
and the rational argument thing is a comparison between your older games and this one and I described in detail why your argument wouldn't make sense from a town perspective you just fucking got caught out son.

3 pfff player are talking to you and you discarded them this is pretty much you trying to play the pity card.

In post 1003, Aneninen wrote:If you WERE interested in my answers you could have asked questions. It didn't happen.
In post 419, Garmr wrote:@anenien
What's wrong with my reasoning?


In post 1003, Aneninen wrote:If you NEEDED information for getting a read on me you could have maintained a real communication instead of asking OTHERS about me. It didn't happen.

That's why people have been talking to you arguing with you.

In post 1003, Aneninen wrote:If you WERE really thinking that I didn't understand your posts or I was unable to express myself, you could have pointed out the concerning bits of information so as to resolve all the possible misunderstandings. It didn't happen.

No it's because you don't want to listen and when you tried you say shit like this
In post 668, Aneninen wrote:Garmmrn, 646 – I'll ignore your vote until you provide any reasons for it. I don't think you're surprised now.

In post 920, Aneninen wrote:@TSO. From now on, I'm ignoring your posts about calling me scum. You call me scum regardless of my posts and I still remember that you've been doing this since I called you scum for the first time.


You can't just ignore shit and then cry when people aren't resolving stuff with you. I Didn't say my reasons and converse with you you'd probally wouldn't of said much about me at all or interacted much.


In post 1003, Aneninen wrote:Feel free to lynch me. It's not true that I don't care. In this particular game I strongly think that my lynch would be LITERALLY an informational lynch. After my flip my alignment will be cleared and there will be plenty of time for reading this Day again to get plenty of information – despite the fact that many of the players WILL be saying "he was lynched because he was stupid".

Remember one fact. I'm not the best player on this forum but, I'm not an idiot.
Never underestimate anyone. (Especially a player who has been tried to be killed IN REAL LIFE before.)


What does this sop story accomplish your trying to gain empathy it does nothing as town. Your lynch would provide a lot of information as well.

post 1003 (assuming you read spoiler)
Is a desperate flail it shows your survival mentality it's only aimed at the people who are actually actively pushing your wagon. It shows you are more concerned with stopping the people pushing and than actually finding out the reasoning for the people who aren't pushing. This is designed to try and get people to town read you and feel guilty and throw mud on the people actually pushing cases. It screams scum motive as I can not see how town would post such a worthless piece of shit.
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Post Post #1047 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:33 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

To avoid any difficulties with things that cant be said (or mentioned in this thread)
I expect I will be VLA this coming weekend.
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Post Post #1048 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 10:41 pm

Post by AxleGreaser »

In post 1031, AxleGreaser wrote:
In post 977, T S O wrote:From my one game of experience with him, I get the feeling he was.

I was scum and he was town, but he was logical enough for me to defend him.

I'll go back and check, but you can assume I'm right on that.



Ok so please, explain some specific examples that you were referring to with this.

In post 383, T S O wrote:I really don't agree with anything Aneninen is saying right now.


I agree the things he was saying may or may not be right (or greta town play/reads), but you have now I think stated they are so illogical that you cant see Aneninen posting them as town.


on reading this I am not sure I was clear enough.

You said didnt agree with
anything
Aneninen was saying.
(I wont hold you to everything, but will expect rather lot, large majority or something...)

I will expect you to show me the stuff that you saw back then that is so bad(disgreed with) (not just that it is unarguably bad) but that you conclude for it to be that bad Aneninen must be or is quite likely to be scum, because as town he would not be that bad.
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Post Post #1049 (ISO) » Tue Oct 07, 2014 11:33 pm

Post by Garmr »

In post 1046, Garmr wrote:
I
Didn't say my reasons and converse with you you'd probally wouldn't of said much about me at all or interacted much.



If I*
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