NY 164: Maniacal Street Mafia (Anticlimatically finished.)

ffullisade · Post Post #3300 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:21 am

also why in the world do you like haylen and arc for town

ffullisade · Post Post #3301 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:30 am

In post 3279, penguin_alien wrote:@Thor665, you asked about my take on the BatB-ffullisade slot a while ago. I'm pretty certain I haven't played a game where Majiffy or pirate mollie was scum, and from a meta POV they seem(ed) similar to their respective town play. In terms of the actual arguments, notably where you interact with the hydra, there seem to be some legit views there getting lost amid a burning desire to be right on all sides. Kind of what I'm getting out of a lot of you and Slandaar going back and forth, actually. Lots of focus on whose narrative to believe and less focus on whether the differences of interpretation or remembering facts is scummy or not. That's my overall impression, although I freely admit that I stopped reading the BatB hydra near the end of the day last day phase when things got hostile.

More specifically, looking back at fullisade's ISO, the sketchiest thing is fery coming in and talking about having read Red Ryu as scum off the first few pages of the game. The flip happened, it's not exactly going out on a limb to note a scum read there. The other player she mentions having a read on is Nachomamma8. If the evolution of events was that she read the beginning of the game over night phase and saw Red Ryu and Nacho as scummy, then saw one of them flip scum where (as far as I can tell) her reads on them aren't related, I'd expect to see a decent amount of confidence in the Nacho read. Instead there's not a lot of pushing there, with more recent posts looking to relate to Nachomamma8 as town if I'm reading right. That could be the pirate mollie head though.

Otherwise I don't have any reason to think ffullisade is scum right now.

WRT Bacde's case for thazmon221 being scum:

In post 3070, thezmon221 wrote:
Bacde wrote:
In post 3061, thezmon221 wrote:What kind of posts are you reading? I never implied you're scum. I think you're delusional and useless town.

YES!

Town, I saved you. Thank me later. LOL! this is great

He just literally lied because he can't keep track of his opinions that are displayed in his posts. Lets look at this gem right here:

In post 3044, thezmon221 wrote:1) You know who doesn't have reads that change after flips (especially two flips)? Scum. Scum doesn't need to change their reads. Your case on Nacho is exactly the same as it was D1: Crap.

This is Thezmon's argument:

1) Bacde does A
2) Scum do A

3 (assumption) Town is much less likely to do A

4) (inference/implication) Bacde is scum

Yet he denies it.

Sheep Bacde. Scumhunting made easy.
No, not really. I think you're town, though dumb and useless. I always have, and quite possibly will for a while. The fact that I presented an action to you and clearly stated that scum did it was to garner interest from you, as well as to see where your motivations lie since you're stubborn. You see, it's been debated, even here in this thread, that dumb/useless town can be synonymous with scum. It's a gray area, so I'm trying to discern between the two and make sure I am on the correct side of the spectrum.
Irrespective of thazmon221's claim, which I don't entirely swallow, Bacde, you're completely ruling out any type of reaction test being used there? Because it seems to me that if you want to get someone's attention, you're more likely to succeed if you suggest you think they're outright scum rather than anti-town.

thazmon221, on the other hand, why didn't you use your vote to pressure Bacde in that situation, since it seems like he was doing something you found scummy?

In post 3273, Cephrir wrote:There are ways to paint me as scum, but this isn't one of them. The point absolutely remains, the point being that if thez was actually a Universal Backup, one way or another, he should have been notified that he is now backing something up, which doesn't seem to have occurred. If you think I legitimately believe thez to be scum, what does it matter how I push him unless you want to argue that it's not genuine? (Which you're not)
Cephrir, why do you say that thazmon221 isn't activated as a back-up to a dead non-VT, specifically the first one killed?

^scum

scum scum scum scum

penguin person you made a post like this similar to the one you made in rach's game. I overlooked it cos frankly I was simply grateful that I was not the only girl in the game. I am not overlooking it this time.

ffullisade · Post Post #3302 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:42 am

In post 3281, Kublai Khan wrote: I'm feeling dismissed when I'm pretty sure I asked you a legit question. Explain the previous thing, then explain the "solidify the read" thing. Also, while you're at it, explain the "Thor665 said there will be 3 to 4nks" thing you said back in post 1887 that you never explained.

you probably did ask a legit question what was it again

I will push on my town reads in order to solidify my read on them as town. <-----why exactly did I have to explain that, it may help me in my communications with other players on this site cos I feel like it should be obvious and needs no explaining.

re thor: I told you I canna find what I was looking for so I wondered if he was the one who said it in the first place.

Wait, why are you voting thezmon221?

this is where you start to feel really weird to me. <-----if you are town then the paranoia starts here

thezmon221 made it a point to not vote Bacde and is drawing the distinction between useless town and scum. If you truly believe that scum love useless town lynches, then shouldn't you be thinking thezmon221 is town because he is not trying to push a Bacde = scum argument?

honestly I have no idea what you are saying here cos it doesn't make sense. it has to do with that whole correlation doesn't necessarily imply causation thing I suppose. like I really don't get your thought processes here

ffullisade · Post Post #3303 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 6:49 am

also I have strong meta reasons to think ak might actually be town.

I waffle on them

hard

but if I close my eyes I cannot feel them being anything other than town and that is taking everything in.

okay I am done with my catch-up posts now. we can go back to lynching thez now cos his claim is super duper funny but I wanna give some time for people to respond, namely thor cos the way that other peeps are chiming in our spat makes squirrelly.

wait, @ bc

I had something I wanted to say to you but I forget. say something, it might make me remember

mastin2 · Post Post #3304 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:25 am

Sixty-Fourth Votecount

:

(Twelvth Votecount Day Two,

AKA, the "Oversoul, being Nacho's twin, is also celebrating today!" votecount.

)

thezmon221 is at L-2!

thezmon221 - 9 (Bacde, Desperado, Kublai Khan, Nero Cain, EddieFenix, Nachomamma8, Cephrir, ThAdmiral, Slandaar)

Cephrir - 2 (Seanald, CrashTextDummie)

Haylen - 2 (Om the Destroyer, penguin_alien)
Amethyst Kitty - 1 (Thor665)
Desperado - 1 (ArcAngel9)
Bacde - 1 (Haylen)

Not Voting - 5 (thezmon221, PeregrineV, Bulbazak, Amethyst Kitty, ffullisade)

With

21

alive, it's

11

to lynch.

Day Two's deadline is Thursday, June 20th, @ 12:30 PM PST, which is in (expired on 2013-06-20 12:30:00).

If deadline hit now, thezmon221 would be lynched.

Bulbazak is V/LA over weekends indefinitely.
PeregrineV is V/LA until Friday, Jun 7th.

Spoiler: Changes from last votecount

Last votecount was page 132, post 3289.

Spoiler: Player Votecount History D2

Spoiler: Votecount History D2

ffullisade · Post Post #3305 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:30 am

In post 3294, Bacde wrote:
In post 3292, ffullisade wrote:Mollie and I are both a little conflicted about Nacho. One of my goals today is to figure him out, and the way I manage that is by direct interaction.

My other goal is to help establish a town core, whether we are part of it or not. And figuring out Nacho and the Nacho/Bacde thing is key to that IMO.
Nacho refuses to interact with me directly this game (except when he demands I sheep his reads even though he admits his reads are bad)

its one of the reasons that I'm over 9000% sure that he's scum

I refuse to be a part of any town core that has nacho in it

I get this. His reads are bad according to Mollie, too. But...you know that nacho being town doesn't guarantee his reads are 100% good as well as I do. Probably better than I do.

The not interacting directly is more of an issue IMO.

- fferyllt

ISO · Post Post #3306 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:36 am

Yeah okay you can be off my scumlist again. I'm changing my mind a lot today.

ffullisade · Post Post #3307 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 7:41 am

Who are you talking to, Cephrir?

- fferyllt

thezmon221 · Post Post #3308 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:20 am

In post 3279, penguin_alien wrote:thazmon221, on the other hand, why didn't you use your vote to pressure Bacde in that situation, since it seems like he was doing something you found scummy?

Because this method worked. No need to put my vote in a spot for pressure when pressure is already applied.

In post 3276, Nachomamma8 wrote:The fact you aren't raises eyebrows. What will it take for you to gain a power?

I received no explanation on which roles specifically. The only thing he really did mention was what the wiki said, and Cephrir quoted. All I know is that I have yet to get a new role to my knowledge.

Nachomamma8 · Post Post #3309 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 8:57 am

In post 3282, Nachomamma8 wrote:
In post 3257, thezmon221 wrote:
In post 3256, Cephrir wrote:
Wiki page for Universal Backup wrote:At start, this role is effectively an ordinary Townie. However, whenever the first power role dies (i.e. Doctor, Cop, Vigilante, etc.), the Universal back-up inherits that power role and can use it themselves.
If thezmon was town he would be a Friendly Neighbor. Die scum die.
mastin never told me I was a Friendly Neighbor after Syry's death.

Besides, wouldn't it have made more sense for me to be a 2-shot BP instead?
Let's do this one more time.
Thez claimed to be universal backup who hasn't received a role despite TWO town power roles being dead thus far.

In post 3259, thezmon221 wrote:Pretty sure that Universal Backups can't become Mason Recruiters either, and Friendly Neighbor is basically a weaker version of it. Only difference is the talk out of chat and guarantee that the target is pro-town.
This is his response. "Pretty sure they can't be mason recruiters either and friendly neighbor is basically a weaker version"
FUCK NO

In post 3294, Bacde wrote:
In post 3292, ffullisade wrote:Mollie and I are both a little conflicted about Nacho. One of my goals today is to figure him out, and the way I manage that is by direct interaction.

My other goal is to help establish a town core, whether we are part of it or not. And figuring out Nacho and the Nacho/Bacde thing is key to that IMO.
Nacho refuses to interact with me directly this game (except when he demands I sheep his reads even though he admits his reads are bad)

its one of the reasons that I'm over 9000% sure that he's scum

I refuse to be a part of any town core that has nacho in it

Spoiler: interactions between Nacho and Bacde that don't exist

I can keep going, but it isn't worth it. Ever since you got your scumread started, you've been continually hammering on me. NACHO IS SCUM NACHO IS SCUM NACHO IS SCUM. When you flopped and called me town, we didn't work too much together after that, why? Because you're paranoid as fuck and you're not going to let a strong read like that go. You will not read me as town this game no matter what I do, no matter what I say, no matter how much ass I haul in this game. You might read me as town when I'm dead and gone, but that isn't happening, so I'll work on that instead of working on you. Do you want to know why? It's easier for me to make myself that I'm a threat to scum than it is to rip myself away from your paranoia because I have no idea how it works, how it ticks. I have been ignoring your posts on me because you've gone onto the dark side of the abyss and you're not coming back. I haven't ignored your posts elsewhere.

EddieFenix · Post Post #3310 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:02 am

In post 3299, ffullisade wrote:
In post 3277, Nachomamma8 wrote:
In post 3221, ffullisade wrote:CTD should be totally in it. Who else?
om the hydra, but that was mostly for day 1
cephrir
bulba
haylen
KK
AA x10
no to bulba

no to arc

see this is why I get suspicious of you. that list is terrible for a town core. there would be no cohesion at all and more than anything else in a multi-ball game town would need cohesion.

cephrir and khan yes, but bulba should not be a town read of yours his suck-ups are pretty freaking obvious so I read him as scum unless he is just a natural born sycophant which may very well be the case and if it is then he defo should not be in a core group since he will approach the game in a confirmation bias kind of way. but I am going to give him credit and just call him scum

I'm going to bust your chops on this one to give you a little insight on how Bulbazak ticks.

Bulba is NOT a sycophant first of all. He couldn't be farther FROM this sort of attitude with his personality. Granting, I've noticed he's gotten a little cocky behind the ears when PLAYING this game, but who isn't from time to time? Secondly, he is ALWAYS using a person's meta against them in any game that he participates in. I've tried breaking him of it because a person's meta can change from game to game, but he's quite adamant about using it as his "book to play by". Thirdly, he attacks against someone by pointing out their logical fallacies.

You can suspect him all you want. Hell, I've played with him in a few games and even now I keep flip flopping with him on where I stand. He's more Town/Null for me than anything at the moment. But the one thing I can say, is that he isn't sucking up to anyone. And seeing as how you're saying he is, I want some evidence that shows it.

p-edit: @Nacho

How are you a threat to scum?

Bulbazak · Post Post #3311 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:07 am

127-130:

In post 3160, ArcAngel9 wrote:Nacho dies when the time comes...

Okay, I know that AA9 is the queen of horribad posting, but this looks scummy when even compared to her standards.

In post 3226, Amethyst Kitty wrote: You said at some point that, you expected me to engage you directly if
I thought I was scum
and I did.

Scumslip.

In post 3248, Nero Cain wrote:Shouldn't you have another power?

In post 3249, thezmon221 wrote:No, why would I?

Somebody just lynch the obv. scum already. You should have a 2-shot bulletproof power because of Oversoul.

On to page 131

ffullisade · Post Post #3312 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:10 am

interesting

Slandaar · Post Post #3313 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 9:42 am

In post 3310, EddieFenix wrote:But the one thing I can say, is that he isn't sucking up to anyone. And seeing as how you're saying he is, I want some evidence that shows it.

He was hardcore buddying up to Majiffy who he previously had said he always read as scum.

In post 3311, Bulbazak wrote:
In post 3226, Amethyst Kitty wrote: You said at some point that, you expected me to engage you directly if
I thought I was scum
and I did.
Scumslip.

Good spot.

I shall reward you with a promotion to definite scum. Congratulations Bulbazak!

Seanald · Post Post #3314 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:01 am

I agree sland, can't stand people that think scum slips exist, or try to create them or insist something is there when it's not. Kinda like neros blatant lie about the hammer that didn't happen, seemed like he was trying o stir shit up.
That clearly wasn't a slip it's just the wording of his sentence.

Nero Cain · Post Post #3315 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:05 am

ppft. I thought that Kitty hammered

ISO · Post Post #3316 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:05 am

In post 3307, ffullisade wrote:Who are you talking to, Cephrir?

- fferyllt

You.

That's not a scumslip. They exist, but the idea gets townies lynched more often than not.

ArcAngel9 · Post Post #3317 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:06 am

In post 3311, Bulbazak wrote:Okay, I know that AA9 is the queen of horribad posting, but this looks scummy when even compared to her standards.

Hello, where is this coming from? Are you high on madness? I was only against Nacho's day 1 wagon becuz i didn't believe he is scum, and what i mean Nacho dies when time comes means when he is proven to be scum, he will be lynched accordingly not on day 1 when there was no reasonble case to vote him.

Which is exactly that I said about Oversould and nobody believed me. I said Red Ryu is scum which was pretty much ignored by everyone.
And who are you calling Horribad?? Get a life you punk!!! Huh!!

Nachomamma8 · Post Post #3318 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 10:41 am

In post 3310, EddieFenix wrote:p-edit: @Nacho

How are you a threat to scum?

because i have found and lynched many in my day
did you notice that thez fucked up his claim?

EddieFenix · Post Post #3319 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 12:08 pm

In post 3318, Nachomamma8 wrote:
In post 3310, EddieFenix wrote:p-edit: @Nacho

How are you a threat to scum?
because i have found and lynched many in my day
did you notice that thez fucked up his claim?

I noticed. Hence my vote.

ThAdmiral · Post Post #3320 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 12:43 pm

In post 3284, Om the Destroyer wrote:Lynching Thez right now isn't a good idea whether he's scum or not. Someone vig him tonight. If he's lying scum, then he dies. If he's town then it means we're not wasting a lynch on a townie. If he got the BP role unknowingly, then he survives. If he actually did get the Friendly Neighbour role then we'll have someone able to confirm him as town tomorrow.

There's rather a few flaws in this plan, so I'll just say "no".

Nachomamma8 · Post Post #3321 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:06 pm

In post 3300, ffullisade wrote:also why in the world do you like haylen and arc for town

meta
you can take those reads to the bank and back
haylen's less so, but Arc is completely and totally town

Bacde · Post Post #3322 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:17 pm

Hey nacho

hows it going

Nachomamma8 · Post Post #3323 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:24 pm

good.
how are you?

Seanald · Post Post #3324 (ISO) » Wed Jun 05, 2013 1:26 pm

In post 3317, ArcAngel9 wrote:Which is exactly that I said about Oversould and nobody believed me. I said Red Ryu is scum which was pretty much ignored by everyone.
And who are you calling Horribad?? Get a life you punk!!! Huh!!

Still awarded no town points, and I find it's more likely scum who says these types of things in some hope to gain easy town points somehow.

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