NY 164: Maniacal Street Mafia (Anticlimatically finished.)

[Om the Destroyer]

Alright I'm here

I'm okay with a massclaim, I haven't talked with Om yet but he'll probably agree.

I'm be reading up while waiting for dinner to be ready so I'll see what I come up with.

~

<<< Next time, wait for the official go-ahead, HD. Though I have no problems with your hydra, I wanted to make sure the other players also did not. Thus, you jumped the gun. I'm letting it slide because I'm a benevolent mod, but a message to all players:

confirm with me that you're okay; do not merely assume you are

. >>>

[Om the Destroyer]

on page 4

Thor is likely scum, or stupid aggro town.

VOTE: Red Ryu

"Oh hey this is either scummy or playstyle IDFK so I'm going to vote Thor anyway!"

Opportunistic as fuck right there

-

[Om the Destroyer]

page 6

rofl was towntowntown

Lots of buddying from B&B, they can be scum with Ryu. Thor is probably town. So is Cephrir I think?

~

[Om the Destroyer]

page 9

Oversoul wagon is meh and feels lazy, I much prefer Red Ryu

If you'd like to tell me the scum motivation for doing what's basically claiming you know there's another killing role in the game (implying another scumteam, vigilante, or SK, and I don't really know how you'd know anything except another scumteam as scum), please talk to me.

Nacho why are AD and RR town?

[Om the Destroyer]

^ ~

[Om the Destroyer]

This activity from HD makes me think he is town.

I agree with Nacho, activity is not a town tell?

This activity from HD makes me think he is town.

I think that is OM....

How do you get Om from ? Not to mention the fact I've referred to Om in the third person at least once.

page 6

rofl was towntowntown

Lots of buddying from B&B, they can be scum with Ryu. Thor is probably town. So is Cephrir I think?

~

who are we buddying exactly?

Thor

~

[Om the Destroyer]

How do you get Om from ? Not to mention the fact I've referred to Om in the third person at least once

Oops, I am not use to see you in hydra lot...

Well get used to it.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

CTD is also tentative town for the massclaim suggestion, especially if it goes through. I wouldn't go as far as confirmed town or a strong town read, but it's fairly townish I think.

Let's summarize reads (in no particular order):

TOWN:

Om the Destroyer
roflcopter-slot
Thor
Cephrir
CrashTextDummie (weak)
Oversoul (weak)

SCUM:

Red Ryu
BeautyAndTheBeast

P-Edit: Mastin, you're doing pretty well yourself considering how much stuff you put on those votecounts.

~

<<< Actually not as hard as you'd think. And would be better if I had the time for flavor. >>>

[Om the Destroyer]

Thor

~

as far as I have noticed, majiffy and thor are always like that in games. if it were just me, thor and I would probably be arguing right now

how is what we have done "buddying" when thor sheeped our vote? how did we "buddy" exactly?

eta: your list sucks

You must not think very highly of Thor to be saying this like this.

Obvious sucking up to Thor since this was a completely useless comment unrelated to rofl's that he was responding to.

Besides, if I was scum, I'd just kill him when it's opportune like I did last time I played scum against him. And I consider what you said an insult; you disputed his competency with that comment.

*snip*

If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.

More subtle, but still there, especially with that cute little white knight motivation of "Oh you insulted Thor how DARE you! RAWRGLEBARGLE"

And no, my list doesn't suck. It's a treasure.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Obvious sucking up to Thor since this was a completely useless comment unrelated to rofl's that he was responding to.

rofl said that he thought that thor was blindsighted by our beauty. majiffy responded with "you must not think much of thor then".

how is that useless and unrelated

because rofl makes a valid point in that it isn't necessarily competency that drives whether a person is blinded by buddying or not

Majiffy's "oh you must not think highly of him then!" is a somewhat-subtle "yes thor is awesome go fuck yourself"

More subtle, but still there, especially with that cute little white knight motivation of "Oh you insulted Thor how DARE you! RAWRGLEBARGLE"

I think it was a valid point.

there's no valid point made by it...the hell are you agreeing with?

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Town
{Bubla, Thor (weak), Slandaar, Oversoul, AA9}

Null
{The rest}

Scum
{CrashTextDummie, Cephir, Nacho (weak), DLG, Fuzzy (weak), Om (weak)}

reads with no basis are a GO!

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Well, that list sure is abysmal.

I agree.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

reads with no basis are a GO!

~

Which ones would you be interested in hearing more about?

Every.

Single.

One.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Papa don't roll that way. Don't want to be giving scumbutts like you legitimate reads to sheep reasons from.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: BeautyAndTheBeast

Well thanks for admitting it upfront that these reads have no real basis I guess?

And no, agreeing with you is not a basis and not necessarily town motivated, and I know you're a better player than that.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Wow, that's a ridiculously self-centered viewpoint. By that logic anyone who suspects you is scum.

Welcome to my scumlist.

Well don't just sit there like a lump on that boring old Oversoul wagon!
Help me push this! It'll be fun, fruitful, and lynch a scum!

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I don't like the idea of mass claiming. I rather not at least not on Day1.

Why not?

HD, Mollie is town, so you'll have to put up with Majiffy.

Majiffy is scum--they didn't get seperate Role PMs, so Mollie is scum by extension.

So no, she's not town.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

All of my reads have basis. Thanks for being an opportunistic little twit, scumbutt!

Town motivation comes before action, not the other way around. Your logic is flawed.

You're reads are based on the heavily flawed concept that town will agree with you and scum will agree with you. That's...not scumhunting.
What the fuck does that last statement have to do with anything? The action comes from town motivation, yes; agreeing with you is not necessarily something that comes from town motivation.
Your statement is not a refutation.

[Om the Destroyer]

Papa don't roll that way. Don't want to be giving scumbutts like you legitimate reads to sheep reasons from.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: BeautyAndTheBeast

Well thanks for admitting it upfront that these reads have no real basis I guess?

And no, agreeing with you is not a basis and not necessarily town motivated, and I know you're a better player than that.

~

Wow, that's a ridiculously self-centered viewpoint. By that logic anyone who suspects you is scum.

Welcome to my scumlist.

People on this site need to get the fuck over this mentality that everything all at once has to be shared with them because it doesn't.
Actions like this definitely do not paint towards "omg scum!"

I asked him to prove his reads had basis.
He said what basically amounts to "lolnope".
Do you expect me to draw a different conclusion from this statement?

[Om the Destroyer]

vote:B&TB:)

vote:OS:)

Nero this "only voting" thing is not befitting of you. Stop it.

Majiffy's "oh you must not think highly of him then!" is a somewhat-subtle "yes thor is awesome go fuck yourself"

Om's recent posts are hilarious, because they either mean that they are not familiar with Majiffy's meta at all, or that they are scum trying to push for an early mislynch on a player that tends to look anti-town. The buddying accusation is my favorite, as Majiffy doesn't buddy up to anyone, except for Majiffy. I suggest watching this wagon closely, as I can see scum pushing it hard.

So are you calling me scum or backhandedly discrediting me?

~ (as were my previous 2 posts)

[Om the Destroyer]

on page 4

Thor is likely scum, or stupid aggro town.

VOTE: Red Ryu

"Oh hey this is either scummy or playstyle IDFK so I'm going to vote Thor anyway!"

Opportunistic as fuck right there

-

It's like you didn't read anything in my interaction with Thor.

Bad post.

Oh trust me you're still a good vote, even after the Thor interaction.
You basically said Thor is being aggressive and this somehow makes him aggressive scum rather than aggressive town arbitrarily.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

You're

reads are based on the heavily flawed concept that town will agree with you

and scum will agree with you. That's...not scumhunting.
What the fuck does that last statement have to do with anything? The action comes from town motivation, yes; agreeing with you is not necessarily something that comes from town motivation.
Your statement is not a refutation.

That's not the be-all-end-all of my scumhunting. Or even a big part of it.

Stop strawmanning.

Your statement seemed to imply that I was looking for actions first and placing town motivation behind it. That's not what I'm doing at all.
Your posting is bad.

Oh yes I'm totally strawmanning something you

fucking said yourself

:

It's largely based on whether or not people agree with me, yes.

So tell me, where's the strawman?

And in a way, it

is

what you're doing; you're saying "Oh people that agree with me are more town than people that don't" based on...absolutely nothing.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Oh the last two posts were you, HD?

Ok yeah you're pretty much confscum then.

And yet,

you aren't voting me.

Too scummy to be scum isn't working again, Majiffy.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Oh yes I'm totally strawmanning something you

fucking said yourself

:

It's largely based on whether or not people agree with me, yes.

So tell me, where's the strawman?

You made the statement that all my reads were based off that. This is untrue and a strawman, as that statement is only about two reads.

Inconsistency ho!
Firstly, leaving out the word mostly is not a strawman of any sort and saying so is pretty contrived, so you can kindly shut the fuck up.
Secondly, one post says your reads are largely based on whether people agree with you or not, but now only 2 are based on that concept.
Which is it?

And in a way, it

is

what you're doing; you're saying "Oh people that agree with me are more town than people that don't" based on...absolutely nothing.

Also untrue. Town motivation -> Town thinking -> Town actions.
If the actions and the thoughts are the same, there's a good chance the motivations are the same.

Scummy town are called scummy town for this reason.
It's also why I hate the concept. It's basically incorrect; people don't really play mafia the same way as everyone else, so objective tells that "apply to everyone"...don't.

Oh the last two posts were you, HD?

Ok yeah you're pretty much confscum then.

And yet,

you aren't voting me.

I only have one vote.

So...you're voteparking on someone that isn't the person you've called "confirmed scum"...why?
It isn't like you're doing much in the "convincing people to sheep you" department anyway.

[Om the Destroyer]

^ ~

[Om the Destroyer]

"confirmed scum"...why?

Because you're not confirmed scum. That was rhetoric.

Majiffy can answer for himself, Nacho.
That still doesn't explain his failure to push his apparently preferred Ceph wagon in any sort of productive way so yeah.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Om, Jiffy/Mollie

Quit tunneling.

Shit.

I'm pretty sure you're both town. So stop.

If someone could remind me of this quote if B&B flips scum, 'twould be appreciated.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

WHATS UP CHOOBIES BACDE IN DA HOUSE

Sheep me.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

om are you scum?

No I'm town.

Now vote B&B.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

bah i have to sleep

ill get back to this tomorrow

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Wow HD thanks for telling me I'm actually in this now :P
Haven't read anything because yeah, so idk if I even wanna read or if I should just go annoy HD about what has even happened.
I guess I might read a bit. Also I haven't spoken to HD yet :P

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Okay I only read from page 10-15 because everything kinda went over my head but I support HD's B&B vote but not for the reasons that I read (don't ask me what my reasons are either, it's mainly gut :P).
Also AA is pretty much town.
Everything else kinda went over my head. I'm probably just going to watch a bit from the sidelines as the game goes on before I really step in. Also HD is totes crampin mah style.

Urgh, smileys :facepalm:

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

I should really check my posts just to make sure there aren't any duplicate sentences in them next time :/
What is this OS wagon and why does it still exist (I just read him in ISO btw)?
So yeah I'm kinda bored of reading already also I should really start checking my posts to make sure there aren't any duplicate sentences in them next time :/

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Inconsistency ho!
Firstly, leaving out the word mostly is not a strawman of any sort and saying so is pretty contrived, so you can kindly shut the fuck up.
Secondly, one post says your reads are largely based on whether people agree with you or not, but now only 2 are based on that concept.
Which is it?

1) If mostly, then your argument holds no water. Argument only stands if only/all, not mostly.
2) Follow the quotes. It was only

ever

about only two reads. Slandaar and AA9.

1) ...no, it still applies. If your reads are even mostly based on who agrees with you or not, they still are horrible. It's like saying 1 or 2 good reads makes up for 10 bad reads, it makes no sense.
2) Provably incorrect:

I realize you didn't ask me but I for one would like to hear what Slandaar and AA9 have done that makes them such shining beacons of towniness that they don't even get (weak)'s.

As far as I can tell, it looks like your list is based entirely on whether or not people agree with you.

It's largely based on whether or not people agree with me, yes.

Because I am town. Ergo if you agree with me, you're likely town.

So yes, you saying your list was largely based on whether or not people agreed with you was in response to Cephrir saying the same. Only the second half of said post talked about Slandaar and AA9 specifically.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

on page 4

Thor is likely scum, or stupid aggro town.

VOTE: Red Ryu

"Oh hey this is either scummy or playstyle IDFK so I'm going to vote Thor anyway!"

Opportunistic as fuck right there

-

It's like you didn't read anything in my interaction with Thor.

Bad post.

Oh trust me you're still a good vote, even after the Thor interaction.
You basically said Thor is being aggressive and this somehow makes him aggressive scum rather than aggressive town arbitrarily.

~

This is how I know you didn't read it.

I never called aggressive scum.

I know--it's called "reading in between the lines". Ever heard of it?
You said Thor was scum or aggressive town. Ergo, he's being aggressive. Ergo, you're calling him aggressive scum.
The fact that you need to resort to semantics as a form of deflection is bad.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I'm catching up via phone but your saying informed townie can't exist? I've seen this role and been it, why can't he be one. You seem dead certain he can't without asking a single question about his role.

Informed townie where the piece of information given is "there are at least two killing roles" doesn't exist because it's completely fucking useless information. I seriously doubt that it would be involved in any information he was given, but am not sure.

If he is scummy for other reasons tell me why?

Later.

It can't exist because the info is useless?

Hey no. That info is relevant if he is telling the truth.

Vote:Nachomamma8

Let me know if who your mates are sometimee down the road.

Weakest reason for a vote this entire game.
It even beats Thor's Oversoul vote.
We're lynching this after B&B.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Nero, please stop pretending to have a PR in a normal game.

This is a normal game?!?

-snip-

So by my count, in this post, you've declared 3 scumreads, one of which is "scummy as hell", another of which deserves an FoS. Where's your vote?

Majiffy's "oh you must not think highly of him then!" is a somewhat-subtle "yes thor is awesome go fuck yourself"

Om's recent posts are hilarious, because they either mean that they are not familiar with Majiffy's meta at all, or that they are scum trying to push for an early mislynch on a player that tends to look anti-town. The buddying accusation is my favorite, as Majiffy doesn't buddy up to anyone, except for Majiffy. I suggest watching this wagon closely, as I can see scum pushing it hard.

So are you calling me scum or backhandedly discrediting me?

Leaning scum, because I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes because calling someone out on doing something scummy is definitely stupid and scummy.
Mmm hmm.

[Om the Destroyer]

^

[Om the Destroyer]

Wow HD thanks for telling me I'm actually in this now
Haven't read anything because yeah, so idk if I even wanna read or if I should just go annoy HD about what has even happened.
I guess I might read a bit. Also I haven't spoken to HD yet

~Pertayter

Check your Skype.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

omg HD my skype hasn't received your message :P
I'm probably not going to be completely on the same page as HD until we can get something going (hooray for planning ahead :D).
So it'll probably be fine tomorrow.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

omg HD my skype hasn't received your message :P
I'm probably not going to be completely on the same page as HD until we can get something going (hooray for planning ahead :D).
So it'll probably be fine tomorrow.

~Pertayter

Look. A useless post.

Is there any way you can actually make a decent attack on our slot at all this game?
I mean seriously if you want to attack a post like that you might as well attack anybody declaring V/LA in the future.
Also some of your posts are useless too bby ;)

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Majiffy's "oh you must not think highly of him then!" is a somewhat-subtle "yes thor is awesome go fuck yourself"

:lol:

Om's recent posts are hilarious, because they either mean that they are not familiar with Majiffy's meta at all, or that they are scum trying to push for an early mislynch on a player that tends to look anti-town. The buddying accusation is my favorite, as Majiffy doesn't buddy up to anyone, except for Majiffy. I suggest watching this wagon closely, as I can see scum pushing it hard.

omg fucking lol wth HD why didn't you even push this shit?
VOTE: Bulbazak

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

First, I was just noting it for future reference. If I was full on attacking you, you'd know it.

Cool, I'll note this for future reference too. Btw what future reference would that even be for?

Second, the difference between someone declaring V/LA and your post is that you essentially said "I can't talk to HD. Not going to say anything else.". There was no point in saying any of this, as you could just as easily have messaged HD via PM. This was posting for posting's sake.

I don't even know how you managed to get 'Not going to say anything' from 'We might not be on the same page for at least a day'. At least get your facts right.

Third, this is a deflection. I'm sure you can find several useless posts in pre-game, but once the game officially started, I've tried to keep my posts somewhat game related.

Right now is my pregame thanks. I hope you realise I've openly stated that I've barely read any of the game. However I don't particularly need to. Also :meta reasons: useless posts are a frequent pastime of mine.

I think Oversoul can wait. Om is definitely scum.

Unvote

Vote Om the Destroyer

P-edit: Looks like I made the right call...

Fucking lol. Please, tell me why we're even scum in the first place. Your arguments aren't even scumtells.
Useless posting isn't a scummy thing unless it's done repeatedly (and I've only been in this game for a day). Informing people about things like activity and potential dissonance isn't a scummy thing either, it's just being fucking informative. Attacking someone who is easily perceived as anti-town doesn't even say why the fuck we're scum. If someone is perceived as anti-town, you'd vote them, otherwise you won't get anywhere. Just because they have a history of looking anti-town doesn't mean they aren't scum. Your chainsaw defense of B&B is meta-related without any evidence to support your statements. Not to mention that you've tried to discredit us multiple times too....

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Also I'd kinda like to know why I'm definitely scum compared to OS when:
According to you, I'm scum because: Useless posting and attacking someone you think is town for meta reasons.
According to you, OS is scum because: Bad knee-jerk reaction to RVS vote, backpedaling, contradicting claims, suspicions on trying to use claim to gain townie status and he hasn't said very much at all.
(Note: I don't exactly support the OS wagon right now (nor do I entirely oppose it), this is just my interpretation of his reasons for suspecting either of us)

Like seriously wtf? If you're going to attack OS for a bad knee-jerk reaction to a vote then I'm pretty much going to do the same for you, only in your case there wasn't even a vote before you started reacting terribly (as evidenced by your P-EDIT).

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

yuck. Other than myself all the town reads blow. AK with a town lean?

Holy fuck this so much.

I'm giving Nero a weak townread just for having this reaction.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Bulbazak, Red Ryu, B&TB, Syryana...

You four may proceed to bus each other now, kthx. If there's a fifth scum it might be Amethyst Kitty? IDK.

[Om the Destroyer]

^~

[Om the Destroyer]

Fourteenth Votecount

:

(

AKA, the "v, f, what's the difference?" votecount

)

Nachomamma8 - 4 (

Red Ryu

,

Bacde

,

Nero Cain

,

Amethyst Kitty

)

Oversoul

- 2 (Nachomamma8,

CrashTextDummie

)

BeautyAndTheBeast

- 2 (

Cephrir

, EddieFenix)

Red Ryu

- 2 (

Oversoul

,

Thor665

)

Cephrir

- 2 (fuzzybutternut,

BeautyAndTheBeast

)
ArcAngel9 - 1 (DLG)

Bulbazak

- 1 (

Om the Destroyer

)

Om the Destroyer

- 1 (

Bulbazak

)

Not Voting - 9 (Mac,

Syryana

, Desperado, Baby Spice, Slandaar, Seanald, ActionDan, Rondar, ArcAngel9)

orange is weak scum reads, blue is weak town reads, rest is obvious

HD, like to give a reason why we are possible scum? You too Nero.

Gut. Plus I hate your jump on the Nacho wagon, and if your vote is based on what the both of you think, and Mala hasn't mentioned a Nacho scumread except in obvious jest, you can't really use that an excuse for not actually voting earlier.

So it's like gut with bonus points.

[Om the Destroyer]

HD, like to give a reason why we are possible scum? You too Nero.

Well for one you are wondering why you are a possible scum

everyone is a possible scum

even me

and I'm confirmed town

I know you like fucking around Bacde but you need to do more

~ (as was the post above this)

[Om the Destroyer]

^most of that is a chainsaw defense of B&TB, basically

I'll get to a formal response after dinner, but tl;dr most of it cites things that either a) aren't true or b) aren't scummy as reasons to call us scum.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

(Spoilered because it's long, but

DEAR GOD, FUCKING READ IT

.

Spoiler: PLEASE READ

Ooh, I'm going to keep a misrep tally! (If you guys want to know what I'm referencing, go read the MMBN4-6 LP on the LP Archive. You'll get it the instant you read it.)

The Om Case:

page 6

rofl was towntowntown

Lots of buddying from B&B, they can be scum with Ryu. Thor is probably town. So is Cephrir I think?

~

I've already said why this is a bad point. First, I couldn't remember any sort of buddy type interaction between Majiffy and Thor, so I went back to page 6 to check it out. Wouldn't you know, they don't really interact with each other, AT ALL. Majiffy says one thing on this page, and it has nothing to do with Thor.

Misrep Tally: 1

I never said it was on Page 6; as can be evidenced from my other posts, this meant I had REACHED Page 6.

Second, Majiffy is one of those players that NEVER buddies, mostly because of the type of player he is. I would have expected HD, as a more prominent player, to be familiar enough with Majiffy's meta to know that the buddying accusation is absurd.

Misrep Tally: 2

If Majiffy never buddies, EVER, explain to me how I was able to point out buddying spots in Post 288.

But Bulba

, you might say.

What if HD has never played with Majiffy before, and therefore, is not...

And no, agreeing with you is not a basis and not necessarily town motivated, and

I know you're a better player than that.

Nevermind. Continue with your case...

Misrep Tally: 3

In order for this to even be valid, I'd have to be in games where Majiffy and Thor were in a game

together

. This happened twice, and in both of them Majiffy was scum. (Thor was town in both but got culted in one)

You must not think very highly of Thor to be saying this like this.

Obvious sucking up to Thor since this was a completely useless comment unrelated to rofl's that he was responding to.

Yeah, you might have a point. I mean if it's unrelated to Rofl's brilliant...

I don't disagree with that.

Why is Cephrir town, I don't see it. He appears to be playing up a concept that makes little sense, while accusing me of the same, combining hypocrisy and also skeevy apparent intent in vote placement.
I want him dead.
What am I missing?

you're already blinded by beautyandthebeast trying to make you their pet townie

Actually, nevermind.

That post is both insulting to Thor and B&B. No wonder they made that comment. Not buddying.

Misrep Tally: 4

There is no insult in said post. Roflcopter makes an observation that B&TB is buddying with Thor. This is Mafia 101, not Preschool.

Would you also like to explain why Thor never expressed that he was insulted by this statement,

but in fact said it was entirely possible that B&TB WAS buddying him

?

Besides, if I was scum, I'd just kill him when it's opportune like I did last time I played scum against him. And I consider what you said an insult; you disputed his competency with that comment.

*snip*

If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.

More subtle, but still there, especially with that cute little white knight motivation of "Oh you insulted Thor how DARE you! RAWRGLEBARGLE"

Wow. That looks really bad.

Let's go back and look at the original:

though I do admit that I can see the reason behind the Cephir vote what I don't get though, is the Thor wagon.

Thor wagon is probably just a half-assed attempt at a pressure wagon. I'm not sold on OS either. You should vote Cephrir. If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.

You mean the original point had nothing to do with Rofl or Thor? It was about B&B and Kitty's scumread on Cephrir? What can this mean?

Misrep Tally: 6

Yes, I'm counting that as two misreps.

Here's why; it completely ignores the first part of my post (the one that quotes "And I consider what you said an insult; you disputed his competency with that comment.") which is fairly obviously what I was referring to, and uses the OTHER part of the post ("If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.") which is unrelated to said point, to act as if I had misrepped B&TB.

Okay I only read from page 10-15 because everything kinda went over my head but I support HD's B&B vote but not for the reasons that I read (don't ask me what my reasons are either, it's mainly gut ).
Also AA is pretty much town.
Everything else kinda went over my head.

I'm probably just going to watch a bit from the sidelines as the game goes on before I really step in.

Also HD is totes crampin mah style.

Urgh, smileys

~Pertayter

Translation from the Om head: "I'll be lurking over here if you need me."

I'm not counting this as a misrep, but this isn't actually scummy considering I've been controlling the hydra this entire time and contributing, so to say we're scum for not contributing doesn't even apply.

Inconsistency ho!
Firstly, leaving out the word mostly is not a strawman of any sort and saying so is pretty contrived, so you can kindly shut the fuck up.
Secondly, one post says your reads are largely based on whether people agree with you or not, but now only 2 are based on that concept.
Which is it?

1) If mostly, then your argument holds no water. Argument only stands if only/all, not mostly.
2) Follow the quotes. It was only

ever

about only two reads. Slandaar and AA9.

1) ...no, it still applies. If your reads are even mostly based on who agrees with you or not, they still are horrible. It's like saying 1 or 2 good reads makes up for 10 bad reads, it makes no sense.
2) Provably incorrect:

I realize you didn't ask me but I for one would like to hear what Slandaar and AA9 have done that makes them such shining beacons of towniness that they don't even get (weak)'s.

As far as I can tell, it looks like your list is based entirely on whether or not people agree with you.

It's largely based on whether or not people agree with me, yes.

Because I am town. Ergo if you agree with me, you're likely town.

So yes, you saying your list was largely based on whether or not people agreed with you was in response to Cephrir saying the same. Only the second half of said post talked about Slandaar and AA9 specifically.

~

HD calls this an inconsistency and seeks to prove it with bolded phrase. Ignores the sentence before it asking about the 2 reads specifically.

Misrep Tally: 7 (Hey guys, we're up to 7 misreps IN ONE POST. If you aren't voting Bulbazak yet, you now have some 'splainin' to do.)

The word "it" fairly obviously refers to the list, so B&TB is

clearly responding to the sentence I bolded.

The second part of the post

clearly referred to the point made about his AA9 and Slandaar reads.

IMPORTANT: THE WORD "IT" IS SINGULAR AND CANNOT MEAN "2 SPECIFIC TOWN READS I HAVE".

This is 1st grade reading comprehension folks.

-snip-

So by my count, in this post, you've declared 3 scumreads, one of which is "scummy as hell", another of which deserves an FoS. Where's your vote?

Went back to look at Kitty's post. She doesn't outright declare ANY reads, instead only asking questions or clarifications from 3 people. She does call Cephrir scummy because of some recent posts, but she FoS's him for it. Where did you learn to read?

Misrep Tally: 10

Misreps Amethyst Kitty

2 times

AND myself. That counts as 3 misreps.

And just to prove it...

@Fenix:

So what did you learn after catching up? Because voting him without giving reasons or thoughts is quite -

well scummy as hell.

Then you call out Nero for doing the same thing. >.>

Scummy as hell.

@B&B:

Mollie answer my question or else I will have to go extreme measures. (You do not want this)

Strongly implied scumread.

I'm not liking this whole; "If I'm correct then Nero was silenced."

The whole PR or even fishing for information is scummy as hell.

So

FoS: Cephir.

SCUMREAD THAT DESERVED AN FOS.

So that's three scumreads, dawg.

Leaning scum, because I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes because calling someone out on doing something scummy is definitely stupid and scummy.
Mmm hmm.

Nice strawman. I called you scum, because I don't believe you to be stupid. The 2 were never connected.

Misrep Tally: 12

Calls on word semantics to call this a strawman; counting this as 2.

You called the action scummy or stupid. This therefore implies I am scummy or stupid. You saying that calling it scummy or stupid isn't a connection is fucking ridiculous.

omg HD my skype hasn't received your message
I'm probably not going to be completely on the same page as HD until we can get something going (hooray for planning ahead ).
So it'll probably be fine tomorrow.

~Pertayter

Already stated how useless this post was and that it gave you a reason to lurk later.

Except the hydra isn't lurking.

Look. A useless post.

Is there any way you can actually make a decent attack on our slot at all this game?
I mean seriously if you want to attack a post like that you might as well attack anybody declaring V/LA in the future.
Also some of your posts are useless too bby

Deflection.

Misrep Tally: 13

Om points out something legitimately scummy about Bulbazak, Bulb deflects it by calling it a deflection. (Ironic, right?)

Second, the difference between someone declaring V/LA and your post is that you essentially said "I can't talk to HD. Not going to say anything else.". There was no point in saying any of this, as you could just as easily have messaged HD via PM. This was posting for posting's sake.

I don't even know how you managed to get 'Not going to say anything' from 'We might not be on the same page for at least a day'. At least get your facts right.

More deflection via semantics.

Misrep Tally: 14

Even more fucking ironic considering

Bulbazak is the one resorting to semantics here.

Right now is my pregame thanks. I hope you realise I've openly stated that I've barely read any of the game. However I don't particularly need to. Also :meta reasons: useless posts are a frequent pastime of mine.

Giving himself another excuse to active lurk.

And yet again, I point out this hydra is not active lurking and that one head not posting doesn't make a hydra scum.

Fucking lol. Please, tell me why we're even scum in the first place. Your arguments aren't even scumtells.
Useless posting isn't a scummy thing unless it's done repeatedly (and I've only been in this game for a day). Informing people about things like activity and potential dissonance isn't a scummy thing either, it's just being fucking informative. Attacking someone who is easily perceived as anti-town doesn't even say why the fuck we're scum. If someone is perceived as anti-town, you'd vote them, otherwise you won't get anywhere. Just because they have a history of looking anti-town doesn't mean they aren't scum. Your chainsaw defense of B&B is meta-related without any evidence to support your statements. Not to mention that you've tried to discredit us multiple times too....

~Pertayter

Flailing.

Misrep Tally: 15

Another deflection of his scumminess being called out.

Also I'd kinda like to know why I'm definitely scum compared to OS when:
According to you, I'm scum because: Useless posting and attacking someone you think is town for meta reasons.
According to you, OS is scum because: Bad knee-jerk reaction to RVS vote, backpedaling, contradicting claims, suspicions on trying to use claim to gain townie status and he hasn't said very much at all.
(Note: I don't exactly support the OS wagon right now (nor do I entirely oppose it), this is just my interpretation of his reasons for suspecting either of us)

Like seriously wtf? If you're going to attack OS for a bad knee-jerk reaction to a vote then I'm pretty much going to do the same for you, only in your case there wasn't even a vote before you started reacting terribly (as evidenced by your P-EDIT).

~Pertayter

Explained why this was bad. Tries to deflect attention off them and onto OS, who they have repeatedly called town.

Misrep Tally: 16

Calls this a deflection of attention to OS when Om

specifically says

he isn't particularly interested in the OS wagon. He's also calling this a deflection when Om is clearly using OS as an example of Bulbazak being hypocritical and NOT as wanting to wagon OS.

In conclusion: Misrepping,

Misrep Tally: 17

deflecting,

Misrep Tally: 18

setting up reasons to active lurk,

Not a misrep, but not scummy and only coming from one head

and outright lying.

Misrep Tally: 20

This deserves special mention.

Nowhere in Bulbazak's case does he state that we are outright lying about anything.

This counts as two since he misrepped us AND his own case.

tl;dr?

There are

exactly 20 misreps

on Bulbazak's part in his case on us.

Lynch this fucking now.

[Om the Destroyer]

@ om - do you mean to tell me you really think we are scum.

No, I was only voting you for 10 pages for absolutely no reason.

~ (Applies to big wall post too)

[Om the Destroyer]

@ om - do you mean to tell me you really think we are scum.

No, I was only voting you for 10 pages for absolutely no reason.

~ (Applies to big wall post too)

well you didn't have a reason that is kinda my point.

the buddying crap is baseless I mean it is right there in majiffy's sig that he tries to work with thor in every game they are in.

also do you know what chainsaw defense means cos I am not sure.

I still think it has basis, I see obvious scum motivation behind it.

And yes, that is a chainsaw defense and I know what it means. Half of Bulbazak's wall basically attacks my B&TB scumread.

[Om the Destroyer]

and HD, just because Mala didn't express a Nacho scum read in the game, doesn't mean she doesn't have it. I would show you proof if I was allowed to

and what I don't get is why you got on her case for not voting whilst voicing suspicion on people. You know my Meta when it comes to voting, as does she, and I am part of this Hydra so I think it could have been fair to assume that she wanted to see if I was ok with w/e vote was being placed.

What's bad with my jump on Nacho? What about it don't you like?

The timing of the jump.

It seemed opportunistic to me and you're "oh she was just withholding it she actually had a nacho scumread the whole time!" is a fairly basic and weak excuse that's impossible to prove.

My other point was that you were going for the whole "Oh we're waiting for the other head's consent to vote" but then you voted with what seemed to be a lack of consent from Mala. This is a disconnect.

~ (I keep forgetting to sign these things, sorry)

[Om the Destroyer]

so you are chick huh

Nah, dude. Just wanted to have some fun with you.

why are you hardcore buddying us? cos that is what you are doing and while majiffy will be flattered, I am not impressed. you seem to "have meta" on majiffy when you have stated that you have never played with him before.

When I was preparing for my first Mafia game, I read many games, several of which happened to have Majiffy in them. Your hydra's actions during pre-game gave me a very strong townread of you. Om was presenting an argument that was so stupid that I felt I had to address it. I tend to defend my townreads, especially when it's over something as dumb as what Om presented. However, when he actually had a decent point, I didn't say anything.

P-edit: I'll get to Om's wall later. Right now I'm going to eat.

I don't remember anybody asking you to defend your town read on us what you are doing is wking which something totally different and is an typical objective scumtell although I know some town do it too but usually only with players you know pretty well. you don't know us so why are you doing it

what did you see in our early posting that made you put us as town

Wait so you aren't scum with Bulbazak?
Shit.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I'll tell you what I don't like. You're vote was the 4th vote on Nacho. Now of course you can easily saw "oh well we were behind and didn't know there was a nacho wagon." but its incredibly convenient me thinks.

Please vote Bulbazak.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

but I want to kill scum Nacho or atleast utility lynch the horrible OS and B&TB slots.

If Bulbazak is scum (which he probably is) I'm starting to realize B&TB would actually be town.
Read my wall post on the last page. Hell, just look at the tl;dr.
This should end with you voting him.

OS I really don't give a fuck about right now. We can sort him out later.

Also Nacho isn't as bad as you're saying he is and some of the people on that wagon (Red Ryu, Amethyst) aren't town at all.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

@ om - do you mean to tell me you really think we are scum.

No, I was only voting you for 10 pages for absolutely no reason.

~ (Applies to big wall post too)

well you didn't have a reason that is kinda my point.

the buddying crap is baseless I mean it is right there in majiffy's sig that he tries to work with thor in every game they are in.

also do you know what chainsaw defense means cos I am not sure.

I still think it has basis, I see obvious scum motivation behind it.

And yes, that is a chainsaw defense and I know what it means. Half of Bulbazak's wall basically attacks my B&TB scumread.

it is only a chainsaw defense if you have a flip on scum. otherwise it is just a word salad tossed with hot air in order to firm up a weakass case

How can you possibly call the case weak?

He misrepped our hydra, Amethyst Kitty, and himself 20 times, all in one post!

And I'm realizing now this chainsaw defense is probably part of a WK, so please vote Bulbazak.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

You also don't answer why you questioned Mala's not voting when you know that my Meta demands that I don't vote anyone unless I am certain that said person is scum and when I am a part of this Hydra

we could just as easily Vote another scum read we share but I like Nacho's wagon better

1) You aren't the same person.
2) Again, there's literally no indication except your own word (which we don't know is trustworthy) that Mala had and still has a scumread on Nacho.

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Bulb
Sheeping. Etc.

If Om jumped off a cliff, would you follow him?

Did you even read the post or did you just decide to make a weak jab at Fuzzy out of nowhere?

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Misrep Tally: 1

I never said it was on Page 6; as can be evidenced from my other posts, this meant I had REACHED Page 6.

Then that would make it a misunderstanding instead of a misrep. Misrep's are purposeful. Misunderstandings are not. Besides, it being on page 6 was not the main focus of that point, which would make this a strawman.

>implying this could be anything but purposeful

You did this for

the entire fucking case.

There is

no conceivable way

it could be an accident. And yes,

this was your entire point.

You literally said "Oh, Majiffy had no interactions with Thor on Page 6, HD must be lying!"

Second, Majiffy is one of those players that NEVER buddies, mostly because of the type of player he is. I would have expected HD, as a more prominent player, to be familiar enough with Majiffy's meta to know that the buddying accusation is absurd.

Misrep Tally: 2

If Majiffy never buddies, EVER, explain to me how I was able to point out buddying spots in Post 288.

I addressed post #288 further in my case. Your reasoning is crappy and fictitious.

It isn't, though. I addressed your reasons.

But Bulba

, you might say.

What if HD has never played with Majiffy before, and therefore, is not...

And no, agreeing with you is not a basis and not necessarily town motivated, and

I know you're a better player than that.

Nevermind. Continue with your case...

Misrep Tally: 3

In order for this to even be valid, I'd have to be in games where Majiffy and Thor were in a game

together

. This happened twice, and in both of them Majiffy was scum. (Thor was town in both but got culted in one)

This section belongs with the previous quote, as they are part of the same point. I was silencing the notion that you were not familiar with Majiffy's play, which you have admitted that you are. Again, from reading what I have of Majiffy's meta, I find the whole concept of him buddying patently absurd, especially when there is no evidence of it. Now if you had provided evidence and said that it reminds you of the time you played with Majiffy-scum and Thor-town, then you might have a point. Instead you just threw out the idea that Majiffy was buddying Thor, and then sat back and hoped people would latch onto it.

EXCEPT THERE IS EVIDENCE OF HIM BUDDYING

IN THIS VERY THREAD

"HD/Om threw it out there and sat back and hoped people would latch onto it." is a load of bullshit meant to paint us as scummy.

You must not think very highly of Thor to be saying this like this.

Obvious sucking up to Thor since this was a completely useless comment unrelated to rofl's that he was responding to.

Yeah, you might have a point. I mean if it's unrelated to Rofl's brilliant...

I don't disagree with that.

Why is Cephrir town, I don't see it. He appears to be playing up a concept that makes little sense, while accusing me of the same, combining hypocrisy and also skeevy apparent intent in vote placement.
I want him dead.
What am I missing?

you're already blinded by beautyandthebeast trying to make you their pet townie

Actually, nevermind.

That post is both insulting to Thor and B&B. No wonder they made that comment. Not buddying.

Misrep Tally: 4

There is no insult in said post. Roflcopter makes an observation that B&TB is buddying with Thor. This is Mafia 101, not Preschool.

Would you also like to explain why Thor never expressed that he was insulted by this statement,

but in fact said it was entirely possible that B&TB WAS buddying him

?

First, that post is more about Thor being blindly led around by Majiffy, not about Majiffy buddying. This, in turn, makes Thor look inept, which he is not. Second, Thor didn't pay it any attention whatsoever, and in fact, continued to pressure Rofl and ask him why he was ignoring Thor's question.

You're attributing meanings to rofl's post that don't exist.

And yes, he DID ignore it, that's my point. If Thor didn't find it insulting, why should anyone else think it to be insulting and interfere? There's no real reason to do so!

Besides, if I was scum, I'd just kill him when it's opportune like I did last time I played scum against him. And I consider what you said an insult; you disputed his competency with that comment.

*snip*

If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.

More subtle, but still there, especially with that cute little white knight motivation of "Oh you insulted Thor how DARE you! RAWRGLEBARGLE"

Wow. That looks really bad.

Let's go back and look at the original:

though I do admit that I can see the reason behind the Cephir vote what I don't get though, is the Thor wagon.

Thor wagon is probably just a half-assed attempt at a pressure wagon. I'm not sold on OS either. You should vote Cephrir. If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.

You mean the original point had nothing to do with Rofl or Thor? It was about B&B and Kitty's scumread on Cephrir? What can this mean?

Misrep Tally: 6

Yes, I'm counting that as two misreps.

Here's why; it completely ignores the first part of my post (the one that quotes "And I consider what you said an insult; you disputed his competency with that comment.") which is fairly obviously what I was referring to, and uses the OTHER part of the post ("If both parties of the Flowchart are voting it, you know it's probably scum.") which is unrelated to said point, to act as if I had misrepped B&TB.

First, Rofl DID insult Thor's competency. Therefore, it is not buddying or white knighting. Second, you show great ability to trim off the parts of a quote you don't need. Therefore, if you were not using the end of that quote to imply what you were saying, you would have gotten rid of it.

Yet you didn't, which tells me that you were trying to draw a connection between the 2 ends of the post, one which does not exist btw.

Yes it is white knighting, it's B&TB hard defending Thor from a supposed "attack".

@Bolded: Except I clearly wasn't? Like seriously, nothing about that quote suggests they are connected except they are both buddying.

You're trying to use semantics to misrep me, and that's really fucking annoying.

Inconsistency ho!

1

Firstly, leaving out the word mostly is not a strawman of any sort and saying so is pretty contrived, so you can kindly shut the fuck up.
Secondly, one post says your reads are largely based on whether people agree with you or not, but now only 2 are based on that concept.
Which is it?

1) If mostly, then your argument holds no water. Argument only stands if only/all, not mostly.
2) Follow the quotes. It was only

ever

about only two reads. Slandaar and AA9.

2

1) ...no, it still applies. If your reads are even mostly based on who agrees with you or not, they still are horrible. It's like saying 1 or 2 good reads makes up for 10 bad reads, it makes no sense.
2) Provably incorrect

3

:

I realize you didn't ask me but I for one would like to hear what Slandaar and AA9 have done that makes them such shining beacons of towniness that they don't even get (weak)'s

5

.

As far as I can tell, it looks like your list is based entirely on whether or not people agree with you.

4

It's largely based on whether or not people agree with me, yes.

Because I am town. Ergo if you agree with me, you're likely town.

So yes, you saying your list was largely based on whether or not people agreed with you was in response to Cephrir saying the same. Only the second half of said post talked about Slandaar and AA9 specifically.

~

HD calls this an inconsistency and seeks to prove it with bolded phrase. Ignores the sentence before it asking about the 2 reads specifically.

Misrep Tally: 7 (Hey guys, we're up to 7 misreps IN ONE POST. If you aren't voting Bulbazak yet, you now have some 'splainin' to do.)

The word "it" fairly obviously refers to the list, so B&TB is

clearly responding to the sentence I bolded.

The second part of the post

clearly referred to the point made about his AA9 and Slandaar reads.

IMPORTANT: THE WORD "IT" IS SINGULAR AND CANNOT MEAN "2 SPECIFIC TOWN READS I HAVE".

This is 1st grade reading comprehension folks.

Okay, I was hoping that people could read, but I'm going to have to spell it out for you:
[

1

] Om calls Majiffy saying #322 was referring only to 2 reads an inconsistancy.
[

2

] Majiffy reaffirms this.
[

3

] Om says "provably incorrect", which means he's going to disprove it without a shadow of a doubt.
[

4

] He bolds a line from the text to prove that Majiffy's statement was universal.
[

5

] He ignores the line before it, where Cephrir is specifically asking about AA9 and Slandaar.

Argumentum ad nausem doesn't change the fact that you're completely fucking wrong and that

I disproved your point by showing you exactly what Majiffy said

.

You completely ignored my response to this point in a continued effort to white knight Majiffy.

-snip-

So by my count, in this post, you've declared 3 scumreads, one of which is "scummy as hell", another of which deserves an FoS. Where's your vote?

Went back to look at Kitty's post. She doesn't outright declare ANY reads, instead only asking questions or clarifications from 3 people. She does call Cephrir scummy because of some recent posts, but she FoS's him for it. Where did you learn to read?

Misrep Tally: 10

Misreps Amethyst Kitty

2 times

AND myself. That counts as 3 misreps.

And just to prove it...

@Fenix:

So what did you learn after catching up? Because voting him without giving reasons or thoughts is quite -

well scummy as hell.

Then you call out Nero for doing the same thing. >.>

Scummy as hell.

Kitty asked Eddie what he had learned, and said that voting someone without reasonings is scummy. She never called Eddie scum.

Oh, well if you can play semantics...so can I.

She said "Because voting him without

giving

reasons or thoughts is quite - well scummy as hell."

Guess what he did? 3 guesses, first 2 don't count.

@B&B:

Mollie answer my question or else I will have to go extreme measures. (You do not want this)

Strongly implied scumread.

Actually, Kitty had B&B as a townread. She was just very angry that they had not answered her yet.

"Mollie/Majiffy

might

be town" is not a townread, hate to break it to you. Post 334 is also a clear expression of something Mala (?) finds suspicious.

I'm not liking this whole; "If I'm correct then Nero was silenced."

The whole PR or even fishing for information is scummy as hell.

So

FoS: Cephir.

SCUMREAD THAT DESERVED AN FOS.

So that's three scumreads, dawg.

She does call Cephrir scummy because of some recent posts, but she FoS's him for it.

Where did I ever say that I disagreed with you.

That post was just not about giving scumreads, it was about obtaining clarification. You tried to turn it into the opposite in an effort to paint Kitty as scummy.

It's not painting them as scummy, it IS scummy.

@Bolded: I'm going to ignore this on the account that you'd have to be chronically stupid to actually believe that we couldn't be disagreeing on this post.

Leaning scum, because I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes because calling someone out on doing something scummy is definitely stupid and scummy.
Mmm hmm.

Nice strawman. I called you scum, because I don't believe you to be stupid. The 2 were never connected.

Misrep Tally: 12

Calls on word semantics to call this a strawman; counting this as 2.

You called the action scummy or stupid. This therefore implies I am scummy or stupid. You saying that calling it scummy or stupid isn't a connection is fucking ridiculous.

Yes, I originally said that you were either scummy or stupid. You turned that around to be me calling you scummy AND stupid, which was not what I said at all. I called you out on it, and you say I'm misrepping you, saying you said "scummy or stupid", which is not the case.

I didn't say I said scummy or stupid.
My point was that you're resorting to semantics by saying I said "and" instead of "or" to call me scummy as if I'm making some sort of false connection.

Look. A useless post.

Is there any way you can actually make a decent attack on our slot at all this game?
I mean seriously if you want to attack a post like that you might as well attack anybody declaring V/LA in the future.
Also some of your posts are useless too bby

Deflection.

Misrep Tally: 13

Om points out something legitimately scummy about Bulbazak, Bulb deflects it by calling it a deflection. (Ironic, right?)

I already covered this post here.

There's no deflection in the post, you just call it a deflection. He points out something actually scummy in that you've soft-pushed our slot without any real basis to push it on and you just say "LOLNOPE IT'S A DEFLECTION VOTE OM".

Second, the difference between someone declaring V/LA and your post is that you essentially said "I can't talk to HD. Not going to say anything else.". There was no point in saying any of this, as you could just as easily have messaged HD via PM. This was posting for posting's sake.

I don't even know how you managed to get 'Not going to say anything' from 'We might not be on the same page for at least a day'. At least get your facts right.

More deflection via semantics.

Misrep Tally: 14

Even more fucking ironic considering

Bulbazak is the one resorting to semantics here.

Covered this post here.

Your major point is that "Oh he's setting himself up to active lurk" and he's saying "Once I get in touch with HD tomorrow I'm going to start contributing".

He's refuting your point and you're calling it semantics.

Seriously, do I need to say anything more on that? Because it's pretty fucking obvious you're scum.

Fucking lol. Please, tell me why we're even scum in the first place. Your arguments aren't even scumtells.
Useless posting isn't a scummy thing unless it's done repeatedly (and I've only been in this game for a day). Informing people about things like activity and potential dissonance isn't a scummy thing either, it's just being fucking informative. Attacking someone who is easily perceived as anti-town doesn't even say why the fuck we're scum. If someone is perceived as anti-town, you'd vote them, otherwise you won't get anywhere. Just because they have a history of looking anti-town doesn't mean they aren't scum. Your chainsaw defense of B&B is meta-related without any evidence to support your statements. Not to mention that you've tried to discredit us multiple times too....

~Pertayter

Flailing.

Misrep Tally: 15

Another deflection of his scumminess being called out.

*Sigh* I was hoping this one would be obvious enough that I wouldn't have to break it up piece by piece and spoon feed it to you, but I guess not. I'll cover this one in its own post after this, as this response is long enough already.

Um, it isn't a flail; he's saying your attack has no base (it doesn't), your meta-related defense of B&TB is shit (it is), and backhanded discredits do exist in your posts, despite your denial of them.

Also I'd kinda like to know why I'm definitely scum compared to OS when:

According to you, I'm scum because: Useless posting and attacking someone you think is town for meta reasons.
According to you, OS is scum because: Bad knee-jerk reaction to RVS vote, backpedaling, contradicting claims, suspicions on trying to use claim to gain townie status and he hasn't said very much at all.
(Note: I don't exactly support the OS wagon right now (nor do I entirely oppose it), this is just my interpretation of his reasons for suspecting either of us)

Like seriously wtf? If you're going to attack OS for a bad knee-jerk reaction to a vote then I'm pretty much going to do the same for you, only in your case there wasn't even a vote before you started reacting terribly (as evidenced by your P-EDIT).

~Pertayter

Explained why this was bad. Tries to deflect attention off them and onto OS, who they have repeatedly called town.

Misrep Tally: 16

Calls this a deflection of attention to OS when Om

specifically says

he isn't particularly interested in the OS wagon. He's also calling this a deflection when Om is clearly using OS as an example of Bulbazak being hypocritical and NOT as wanting to wagon OS.

You (or your partner in this case) were trying to deflect attention away from your hydra by saying that I have no reason to attack you over OS, who I had already built a case on. This is essentially saying that I should look at the more scummy slot rather than your slot, which I pointed out at the time. It's essentially, "I'm not scummy. They're scummier than I am!".

The italicized (and parts after it) says "Your case on us sucks, why the hell are you voting us over Oversoul, the person you've been pushing on a stronger case?" Which actually makes sense,

considering your case on us sucks.

(Although I personally think OS is a bad example since the case on him is bad too)

The bolded says

he's basically attacking you for the same reasons you're attacking OS

. You still haven't even made a note of that, instead focusing on painting the first part as scummy.

and outright lying.

Misrep Tally: 20

This deserves special mention.

Nowhere in Bulbazak's case does he state that we are outright lying about anything.

This counts as two since he misrepped us AND his own case.[/spoiler]

I never outright stated it, but I did imply it. You completely mangling quotes to get them to say what you wanted is not a simple misrep, as it is not seeking to simply twist what is being said, but instead it is a complete fabrication. What you did with #288 was especially noteworthy and could not have come from town. You then further lied in your response,

the most noteworthy example being your play on semantics over the phrase "scum or stupid" in which you originally said the opposite as an attempt to strawman.

See? You're making up shit as you go.

"#288 cannot come from town" is a complete fabrication because a) you know it can because you're scum and I'm town and b) there isn't anything actually scummy about it!

The bolded is hilarious considering YOU ARE THE ONE USING SEMANTICS TO CALL ME SCUM WITH THIS POINT.

[Om the Destroyer]

Fucking lol. Please, tell me why we're even scum in the first place. Your arguments aren't even scumtells.

Trying to deflect attention away from him. Also tries to discredit me, even though I had already caught him deflecting and posting complete fluff.

What?
He literally just said what you're pointing out isn't scummy, Because it isn't. I'm completely amazed you can even call this a deflection, because this is a solid observation.

Useless posting isn't a scummy thing unless it's done repeatedly (and I've only been in this game for a day).

Falling back on the excuse he previously set up. Also, saying that you've been playing for only a game is not a good excuse when the game is still in its infancy.

See, you're making shit up as you go! You're acting like any of this is a scumtell and blowing it way out of proportion!

Informing people about things like activity and potential dissonance isn't a scummy thing either, it's just being fucking informative.

But your post could have been addressed in other ways, as I pointed out. It was essentially a way to look active without being active.

HE LITERALLY JUST SAID HE WAS GOING TO BE INACTIVE

HOW CAN YOU INTERPRET THAT AS AN EFFORT TO LOOK ACTIVE

Attacking someone who is easily perceived as anti-town doesn't even say why the fuck we're scum. If someone is perceived as anti-town, you'd vote them, otherwise you won't get anywhere.

Because scum like easy mislynches, and players with playstyles that are perceived as anti-town are easy lynches.

Yeah but you haven't even been able to explain your supposed townread on B&TB, so calling it an easy mislynch is ridiculous.

This is fucking white knighting at it's finest folks.

Just because they have a history of looking anti-town doesn't mean they aren't scum.

I believe this is Appeal to Probability.

What?

Words cannot express how bad this statement is. They can't.

Nothing about this appeals to the probability of getting a scum Role PM.

None if it.

It says that, just like everyone else, anti-town playstyle players have a chance of getting scum Role PMs.

This is a horrid misrep.

Your chainsaw defense of B&B is meta-related without any evidence to support your statements.

I had plenty of evidence to support my statement. This is an Argument from Repetition, hoping that if he says that I have nothing enough times, people may actually believe it.

Um, no, yours was the Argumentum Ad Nauseum. We refuted all your misreps, but you kept on screaming "OM IS SCUM B&TB IS TOWN RAWRGH".

Not to mention that you've tried to discredit us multiple times too....

And then deflecting attention off of him to me. Essentially the equivalent of flinging poo.

MAKING AN OBSERVATION ABOUT HOW YOU ARE SCUMMY IS NOT A DEFLECTION

Deflection is like your buzzword man

~

[Om the Destroyer]

{Amethyst Kitty, Bacde, BeautyAndTheBeast, Cephrir, Nero Cain, Om the Destroyer} --> Players I have no interest in lynching.
{ArcAngel9, Bulbazak} --> Players I would instantly lynch given the chance.
{Desperado, Nachomamma8, Slandaar} --> Players I'm uncertain about.

This townlist is great, Bulbazak scumread is great, Amethyst Kitty townread is meh, the rest is all decent.

Welcome to townville. Please vote Bulbazak. Thanks.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

CTD you're not reading enough of the game, you're basing too many of your reads on how people reacted to massclaim and not their actual motivations for doing so; you're also not reading the game closely enough because Bulbazak is fairly obvious scum.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

The Om-HD hydra vs. Cephrir: I have played with HD before and have heard of Om. Their experience on the site conflicts with their lack of meta-knowledge on Majiffy, another prominent member on the site, who HD has mentioned being familiar with. Cephrir has been on the site since around 2006. He is also not familiar with Majiffy meta-wise, and he isn't playing in a way I'd expect a seasoned player to. However, unlike HD, Om, Majiffy, and others, I'm not familiar with his name. Therefore I decided to check him out via his wiki, where I came across his game statistics. This keeps him from going into the main "scum" pile, meaning he is still a null/scum read. Did I stutter that time?

Now that I'm back home, I'm going to get that Om case ready. Be prepared, it might take awhile to sort all of the quotes.

If you're going to argue the meta point (the fact that people not being familiar with meta being a scumtell anyway is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever heard of btw) then maybe I should give

my

opinion on the meta tells from B&B.
Majiffy is playing just like Majiffy plays. mollie is the one I'm feeling bad about. If you think the slot's all Majiffy, and you're basing your reads off that, you're playing this game all wrong.

~Pertayter

PEDIT: lemme get to that after I finish reading up. also post in your hydra goddamit

[Om the Destroyer]

om thoughts on ctd

I have him as leaning town for the massclaim suggestion but his analysis seems weak to me and makes me less sure of that read.

IDK what Om thinks about him though.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

CTD you're not reading enough of the game, you're basing too many of your reads on how people reacted to massclaim and not their actual motivations for doing so; you're also not reading the game closely enough because Bulbazak is fairly obvious scum.

I disagree.

I have provided links that prove the strength of this kind of analysis. It's strong

because

it ignores all the behavioral bullshit and focuses on an aspect of play that scum typically don't expect to be scrutinized that happens to be very telling.

I invite you to provide a pro-town reason for ignoring a main point of discussion in massclaim, particularly in this game where support for it actually seemed potentially strong enough to make it happen. The tell applies most strongly to the group that is guilty of this.

I agree that I need to read the game more closely to solidify these reads, but as a general assessment of everyone's alignment, I feel very confident in this method.

I meant more the townreads you were deriving from it, not really the scumreads as much.
The "behavioral bullshit" is what really catches scum (and town!) though.

~ :town:

[Om the Destroyer]

I wrote :town: instead of

[Om the Destroyer]

Leaning scum, because I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes because calling someone out on doing something scummy is definitely stupid and scummy.
Mmm hmm.

Nice strawman. I called you scum, because I don't believe you to be stupid. The 2 were never connected.

Can we please go on more about how this is a false dilemma?
~Pertayter
HD get back on skype so we can real-time talk. Or check the QT, whichever floats your boat.

[Om the Destroyer]

{Amethyst Kitty, Bacde, BeautyAndTheBeast, Cephrir, Nero Cain, Om the Destroyer} --> Players I have no interest in lynching.
{ArcAngel9, Bulbazak} --> Players I would instantly lynch given the chance.
{Desperado, Nachomamma8, Slandaar} --> Players I'm uncertain about.

This townlist is great, Bulbazak scumread is great, Amethyst Kitty townread is meh, the rest is all decent.

Welcome to townville. Please vote Bulbazak. Thanks.

~

Is this a joke that's going over my head, or are you seriously saying DLG is town because you agree with his reads after arguing with B&TB and Bulba for 10 pages about B&TB doing the same?!

Om I think you missed this at the end of the last page.

yes I did

sort of but not in the way you're thinking

there's a difference between "This guy has sensical and good reads, town" and "This guy agrees with me about some stuff, town".

[Om the Destroyer]

Leaning scum, because I don't think you're that stupid.

Yes because calling someone out on doing something scummy is definitely stupid and scummy.
Mmm hmm.

Nice strawman. I called you scum, because I don't believe you to be stupid. The 2 were never connected.

Can we please go on more about how this is a false dilemma?
~Pertayter
HD get back on skype so we can real-time talk. Or check the QT, whichever floats your boat.

I'll be on QT for ~20 mins

~

[Om the Destroyer]

But the reads are only good and sensical because they align with your own, right?

some of them don't, some of them do

like if there are reasons I can see for reading some of my townreads as scum or scumreads as town I'll consider those sensical too

if the reads are all radically different something's wrong

[Om the Destroyer]

It's kinda funny when you look at Bulb's case and so many of the points are "OMG DEFLECTION SCUM LYNCH NOW PLZ PLZ PLZ."
I seriously couldn't even get halfway through that case because I was laughing too hard. Please, learn the definition of deflection before you use it. Right now you sound like a more aggressive version of my very first scumgame.
/inb4hetriestocallusscumfordiscreditinghim yeah, nice try, you can only cry wolf so many times before no one listens.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

OK

So DLG has good reads, but what about his actual play? What do you think of my post about it?

from what I've read it's him saying people aren't scumhunting while he himself is townhunting

ehhhhhhh

I don't really think that's strong since I probably call people out on that too and I tend to townhunt

[Om the Destroyer]

so what do you think of nacho's list again, om?

Right now I agree with all the ones I actually have a read on (first two and last two). Yes, that means that I now have your slot as a townread too. I feel better about you after seeing the last 5 pages.
CTD looks pretty town right now, I can see a clear town motivation in the way he's analysing the players. However I'd still like to see how he fares at analysing the parts that aren't about the massclaim, and until then my complete judgement is reserved.
Also I did a few ISO's because HD wanted me to, and I can see Nacho as scum too (but not super strongly right now).
AA is quite obviously town though, but the reason I can see the merit in her being a scumread is that the last game I played with her when she played like this she got run up to L-1 very early on because she was so scummy too.

I'm kinda bored of this right now, I'll come back to it later.
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

all the posts that weren't signed just then were HD

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Do I really need to say more? You are contradicting yourself like crazy here

You act like contradictions are a scumtell.
Really the only purpose contradictions serve in this game is to get nitpicked on by people struggling to find things to attack.
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Also don't worry, I'm working on controlling HD when it comes to the argument.
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

It's kinda funny when you look at Bulb's case and so many of the points are "OMG DEFLECTION SCUM LYNCH NOW PLZ PLZ PLZ."
I seriously couldn't even get halfway through that case because I was laughing too hard. Please, learn the definition of deflection before you use it. Right now you sound like a more aggressive version of my very first scumgame.
/inb4hetriestocallusscumfordiscreditinghim yeah, nice try, you can only cry wolf so many times before no one listens.

~Pertayter

Discrediting future claims of being discredited. Interesting.

Can you seriously be any more predictable?

Do I really need to say more? You are contradicting yourself like crazy here

You act like contradictions are a scumtell.

Contradictions come from town too, just in case you haven't heard. It's so easy to forget things in the heat of the moment. Maybe if you look at the context you'd understand.
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

You have no idea how much I would have loved to be an SK :P

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

I promised Om I wouldn't wallfight with Bulbazak anymore, so I won't.

I'm still talking with Om about Nacho, I don't find myself as willing to vote him as he is.

Om says Amethyst Kitty is probably town so I'm going with his read because he has Mala experience.

Bulbazak, Syryana, and now Mac are all pretty much scum though, so I'll pass on the Red Ryu wagon too.

Oh when the fuck did this get to 23 pages .-.

Tomorrow's gonna be a long night.

Was it a long night for something else? Cause you still haven't done shit here.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Right now I'm honestly not as sure on Nacho-scum as I was yesterday. I don't know what changed my mind but whatever it is it's causing my gut to go weird.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

AK shouldn't even sniff a town read unless you're going for the too dumb to be scum tell. Her and B&TB and Ed...just get rid of that whole very very likely town group and stick em in the "prob town group"

Om refuses to let me scumread AK. He keeps saying Mala's town based on meta.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Town:
Bacde
AK
ArcAngel
Nero
CTD
Om/HD

Very Very Likely town:
B&tB
Eddie
Ryu
Mac

Probably town
Sean
Syry

Scum to varying degrees:
Nacho/Thor/Fuzzy/Ceph/Bulba

Switch Thor and Ryu, switch Ceph and Syry, knock Fuzzy off the entire list, and then we're getting somewhere.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

So from my POV this Nacho wagon consists of only townreads and it's on someone who isn't exactly a scumread from my.
Something is afoot here :/

Also I'm kinda lurk-a-derpin' and nobody cares wow this game is easy.
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Bacde
~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Bulbazak

Om no we aren't lynching Bacde his slot is obvious town

~

[Om the Destroyer]

So from my POV this Nacho wagon consists of only townreads and it's on someone who isn't exactly a scumread from my.
Something is afoot here :/

Yeah, probably your "Nacho ... isn't exactly a scumread". Herp derp Occam's Razor.

Except I found the scum on the wagon.

I mean, this game has basically become whether or not Nacho should be a good lynch. The focus is completely on Nacho (who is probably town, actually) and nobody is really focusing on his attackers, or anyone else for that matter.

PEDIT: No fuck you Bulb is town omg I'll tell you why Bacde is scum in the QT.
VOTE: bacde

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

So from my POV this Nacho wagon consists of only townreads and it's on someone who isn't exactly a scumread from my.
Something is afoot here :/

Yeah, probably your "Nacho ... isn't exactly a scumread". Herp derp Occam's Razor.

Except I found the scum on the wagon.

I mean, this game has basically become whether or not Nacho should be a good lynch. The focus is completely on Nacho (who is probably town, actually) and nobody is really focusing on his attackers, or anyone else for that matter.

PEDIT: No fuck you Bulb is town omg I'll tell you why Bacde is scum in the QT.
VOTE: bacde

~Pertayter

why aren't you asking me questions or even pushing my wagon?

its looks like you just dropped your vote and are chilling on it

if nacho flips town you are suspect #1

Why did it take you like 4 pages to finally question my vote?

[Om the Destroyer]

why aren't you asking me questions or even pushing my wagon?

Because you're town and Om needs a tongue lashing.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

So from my POV this Nacho wagon consists of only townreads and it's on someone who isn't exactly a scumread from my.
Something is afoot here :/

Yeah, probably your "Nacho ... isn't exactly a scumread". Herp derp Occam's Razor.

Except I found the scum on the wagon.

I mean, this game has basically become whether or not Nacho should be a good lynch. The focus is completely on Nacho (who is probably town, actually) and nobody is really focusing on his attackers, or anyone else for that matter.

PEDIT: No fuck you Bulb is town omg I'll tell you why Bacde is scum in the QT.
VOTE: bacde

~Pertayter

why aren't you asking me questions or even pushing my wagon?

its looks like you just dropped your vote and are chilling on it

if nacho flips town you are suspect #1

like seriously this is the first indication of a read on our slot that you've made since the

16th page

and it's literally an attack on me because I voted you.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

@Om: What is your Bacde case? I want to see if we're on the same page here.

His case is basically propaganda, focusing more on persuasion than trying to convince us of why he's scum. He seems to be trying to cherry pick from nacho's iso to find the best quotes he can use to prove his point further. Among that, his points aren't exactly solid either, they're either based on meta or just provide a quote with an implied questionable motive that just tries to influence our judgement further without him really having to give much effort (good example are his posts where he quotes a chain of nacho posts and goes "Does this look like nacho scumhunting to you?" without quoting any of his other posts where he does do that stuff. Really it's not hard to quote posts that don't fit a scumhunting agenda, you could do that for literally anyone this game). When his case is not that, it's basically just pushing a burden of proficiency argument (nacho is not this bad as town so he must be scum). Not to mention that half of his iso is basically just "nacho is scum plz everyone lynch him".
His main focus this game has been on nacho, so it provides a good excuse to distract from proper scumhunting, most of his other reads don't really have much explanation to them, and he's not pushing them anywhere near as hard as he is with nacho. The rest of his iso consists basically of fluff.
Also I'm not super strong on this one but he's also joking about him being scum too much, which in my experience comes from scum more often than not (I've done it before and I've seen others do it too).

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

I still want Bacde lynched even if Nacho flips scum because Bacde being scum is still a thing.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Have you EVER pressured someone to follow reads that you aren't happy with?

I do it all the time.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

it's rare for me to be completely happy with my reads
if you think everyone is always 100% confident on all their reads all the time then you're horribly mistaken

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

I seriously doubt you've read anything if your only two reads are as horribly wrong as that.

But please, enlighten me with your reasons, for both.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Nacho
Both HD and I agree that this is a good move regardless of our different intentions.
I want Bacde lynched and if he's going to be willing to be lynched after this then so be it. HD still thinks Bacde is town but he thinks Nacho is scum. I still think Bacde could be scum regardless of Nacho's alignment though.
We also both agree that either fuzzy's scum or he's horrible town, regardless he shouldn't make it to endgame.
Hanzo is scum by virtue of Dan being scum, I've come from the same site as Dan and I'm almost 100% sure that it's not his town play. Also Dan lurking into being replaced is terrible when you consider that he regularly plays games with 72 hour deadlines without being replaced.
We both agree on AA9 being town.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Desperado

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Desperado

~Pertayter

Desperado,
why don't you come to your senses.
You've been sitting on fences
for so long now

Seriously thought, you've hardly mentioned him nor what you find scummy about him.

I've hardly mentioned a lot of people, actually.

I feel like Desp writes a lot of words and doesn't end up accomplishing much. I don't really feel like I've actually gained any information from reading his posts. He's pretty much a non-entity in this game and that doesn't sit well.
Also gut and I'm not sure I want to be on the Nacho wagon right now, need to discuss with HD first so this is a good vote in the meantime.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

So if we look at wagon composition between Nacho and Desp, we find that the Nacho wagon has 2 likely scum on it (Baby Spice and Desp) and 3 questionable players (Bacde, Red Ryu and Seanald).
If we look at the Desp wagon, it's pretty much all townreads to varying degrees.

I wonder which wagon is scum driven?

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: Thor

Lynch him today.

no

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

VOTE: penguin_alien

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Good, I look forward to both of you leaving and being replaced by players that actually

want to play the game

.

No you're pretty much just being insufferable. You called me a fucking dolt because I misinterpreted something that you said. What's more likely...that you're being such a dick that multiple people have replaced out/have threatened to do so solely because of your attitude, or you're right and they're just pussies?

I am trying to diffuse the situ can you plz not throw gasoline on it tia

Quoting this just in case people still aren't realizing that Desperado is scum.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Desperado

Oversoul wagon doesn't appeal to me, the wagon composition makes me cringe.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Why do you want to kill BatB? I think they are town. They are playing to theier aggrressive meta.

Majiffy and Mollie being aggressive is definitely a null tell.

Thor is pushing a good wagon in Desperado though, this is a really good time to follow the flowchart in that direction.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

No, you were trying to perpetuate a useless argument in the hopes of creating a shit-ton of noise centered around B&TB so that the subject of your wagon would sneak away unnoticed.

Everything about that question is purposely inflammatory and doesn't do anything at all to actually...how did you put it...calm Jiffy down?

Yeah, no, I call bullshit on this one.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I am a badass

That is all

VOTE: Haylen

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Um...Syryana flipped Friendly Neighbor, not Neighbor.

There's a difference.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

The question remains: What do you think of CTD's claim and its implications?

The only thing it really means is that CTD is likely town for having such a strong kneejerk reaction.

It really doesn't mean anything about Slandaar.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

Um...Syryana flipped Friendly Neighbor, not Neighbor.

There's a difference.

~

What?

This is what Syryana flipped, not this.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

@Om: What is your personal read of Slaandar?

Both of us think he's town.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I feel that I should go smoke a cigarette and/or bang my head against the wall.

You should vote Haylen whether or not you do these things.

~

[Om the Destroyer]

I feel that I should go smoke a cigarette and/or bang my head against the wall.

You should vote Haylen whether or not you do these things.

~

hi HD. what's your reasoning on Haylen?

- fery

fuzzy was generally useless. haylen hasn't really done that much to make us think the other way about it. also what ceph pointed out about interactions with red ryu look like total scum buddy posts

The following is a brief summary of each slot's interactions with Ryu.

HD also had a scumread on Red Ryu but because I wasn't so strong on Red Ryu being scum it never really saw the light of day in the thread.

~Puetarter

[Om the Destroyer]

i'm starting to come around on AA9 being scum because she's so much more useless than when I played with her town game

someone give me something to do relating to this game because i lack the initiative to find something to do myself

also hd is so lazy omg

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

At start, this role is effectively an ordinary Townie. However, whenever the first power role dies (i.e. Doctor, Cop, Vigilante, etc.), the Universal back-up inherits that power role and can use it themselves.

If thezmon was town he would be a Friendly Neighbor. Die scum die.

mastin never told me I was a Friendly Neighbor after Syry's death.

Besides, wouldn't it have made more sense for me to be a 2-shot BP instead?

Let's do this one more time.
Thez claimed to be universal backup who hasn't received a role despite TWO town power roles being dead thus far.

Pretty sure that Universal Backups can't become Mason Recruiters either, and Friendly Neighbor is basically a weaker version of it. Only difference is the talk out of chat and guarantee that the target is pro-town.

This is his response. "Pretty sure they can't be mason recruiters either and friendly neighbor is basically a weaker version"
FUCK NO

If he's scum he's shooting himself in the foot by claiming that he doesn't have any powers yet, and it's dumb to claim universal backup as scum when pr's (and confirmable ones at that) have already died. I really don't think he's scum doing some fakeclaiming here. I think shenanigans are afoot in the setup.

Lynching Thez right now isn't a good idea whether he's scum or not. Someone vig him tonight. If he's lying scum, then he dies. If he's town then it means we're not wasting a lynch on a townie. If he got the BP role unknowingly, then he survives. If he actually did get the Friendly Neighbour role then we'll have someone able to confirm him as town tomorrow.

~Pertayter

[Om the Destroyer]

Yeah, I'm staying in. I'll switch back to my normal account when I get the green light.

VOTE: Haylen/Rena

~