Open 314: CSL Express [SCUM WINS]

[neil1113]

/confirm. And what???

[neil1113]

Choo choo!
We're boarding with 2 more players confirming!
2 More people in the CSL Express now before we head off and start the game!

This made me laugh.

[neil1113]

Neil.

Get an avatar.

Several people have told me to. To answer again, No. I will not. I have a sig, if you want to remember who I am, remember my sig. I do not need to get an Avatar.

[neil1113]

Comment on my vote.

Now.

*Comments*

P.S. I can't find an Avatar that accurately fits. :/

[neil1113]

@Neil, what would you like for an avatar?
Ill make you one.

Yes.

[neil1113]

@Neil, what would you like for an avatar?
Ill make you one.

Yes.

Yes?
You want a yes and a smiley face?
What do you want on the avatar?

Dwayne The Rock Johnson? But when he's the wrestler "The Rock" not as the actor.

[neil1113]

Neil.

You better be shitting me.

You can easily find an avatar of Dwayne Johnson on Google.

None that fit the "length and height" requirements?

[neil1113]

Note that "Exactly" option on Images?

What?

[neil1113]

I apologize for the time wasted on talking about my Avatar, I didn't really think it was that important to everyone. I'll go on Google right now and see if I can find one.

[neil1113]

As for scum hunting, I really don't like how fast Vifam's wagon formed. I'm making note now that one of jakesh97, SigmaEXE003, Hiraki, or don_johnson is scum.

Vifam, out of everyone on your wagon, why did you vote DJ? Even though he technically placed the vote to put you at L-2, all of them are obviously comfortable with your lynch for them to be wagoning you...

[neil1113]

all of them are obviously comfortable with your lynch for them to be wagoning you...

please don't assume things. you are making a blanket statement here that has no base in fact. i'm comfortable with him at L-2, not sure if i would have hammered him on page 4.

As for scum hunting, I really don't like how fast Vifam's wagon formed. I'm making note now that one of jakesh97, SigmaEXE003, Hiraki, or don_johnson is scum.

Vifam, out of everyone on your wagon, why did you vote DJ? Even though he technically placed the vote to put you at L-2, all of them are obviously comfortable with your lynch for them to be wagoning you...

I don't see it. None of us said or implied that we were fine with a lynch.

Unless you guys are ignorant and just plain stupid, you know placing a vote on someone is one vote closer to being lynched. Therefore if I place a vote on someone, while I may not directly want them lynched, indirectly I'm implying that I'm fine with a lynch on that person, because I've now lowered the count that would normally take them to get lynched. I'm "furthering" a lynch candidate by placing my vote on them, therefore I'm indirectly or directly pursuing that person to be lynched. So rather or not you're "meaning to imply" a lynch, you are in fact furthering that lynch. Don't play stupid.

[neil1113]

not playing stupid. just pointing out that you are assuming everyones intentions. some players vote for pressure. yes, every vote carries a certain inherent intent to lynch, but you seem to implying something much more devious. like some sort of quicklynch attempt was being made. lighten up. and don't call me stupid.

I apologize. I had no intent on insulting you as a person. Just the style of play, and the assumption. I was not implying anyone wanted a quicklynch, but to assume that because I have my vote on you, but I don't want you lynched, would be to be playing to a "defense plan." Which is scummy. It's allowing yourself an escape route incase the person you're voting does get lynched and flips town, then you can say "well see? I never wanted the person lynched! Just pressured." I see scum do it quite often on this site, so I wanted to call it out. I'm not saying all of you are scum, but I'm fairly certain at least one of your four are.

[neil1113]

While I think it's awfully stretching to make such a statement concerning me and another player posting about an avatar and then call us scumbuddies, and it awfully looks like a setup for later in the game (which by the way, I took note of), that's really the only scummy thing I've seen oversoul do. Why exactly is a wagon forming? I can understand Andrew's vote, but not yours Hiraki?

[neil1113]

Because Andrew is a VI. He no longer needs reasoning behind his posts, as there's no point in discussing it with him or fighting him over it. His vote is there, his reasonings always suck, so with that pattern, I understand he places his vote whereever he wants. Hiraki however, you don't seem like a VI, well not yet anyway, so I'd like you to explain your vote more in depth. Also noted how instead of answering my first plea to explain your vote, you pointed out how my sentence was flawed by stating Andrew's vote made sense but yours didn't, rather then actually answering the question. Avoiding the question is not usually town-motivated, so that's noted.

[neil1113]

I don't care if andrew was literally the smartest person on Earth or the dumbest, I'd still want an explanation. Same with shotty. To excuse him like that is just bad and, quite frankly, scummy.

I didn't excuse him, I said I can imagine why he put his vote down, thus I wasn't really looking for his reasoning behind his vote. Beside, he already said he based it off of Hiraki. So what was the point in asking him again? He obviously had no case of his own.

[quote-"TheLonging"]And then your otherpoint, on Raikiri, specifically this: "you pointed out how my sentence was flawed by stating Andrew's vote made sense but yours didn't, rather then actually answering the question. Avoiding the question is not usually town-motivated, so that's noted."

e_e

[/quote]

What is this? I find it funny you and your boyfriend called me crap town, when both of you have failed to scum hunt, failed to make any cases, and then you place a vote on me with nothing but "oh my gosh! you arent questioning him!" You're a hypocrite at best sir, and you aren't even worthy of my vote. But to call my play crap town, is a comedy when looking at your play.

Nah. This is just Neil crap town.

Especially this kid. When you do something, let me know. Then you can judge my play as town all you'd like.

[neil1113]

EBWOP:

And then your otherpoint, on Raikiri, specifically this: "you pointed out how my sentence was flawed by stating Andrew's vote made sense but yours didn't, rather then actually answering the question. Avoiding the question is not usually town-motivated, so that's noted."

e_e

What is this? I find it funny you and your boyfriend called me crap town, when both of you have failed to scum hunt, failed to make any cases, and then you place a vote on me with nothing but "oh my gosh! you arent questioning him!" You're a hypocrite at best sir, and you aren't even worthy of my vote. But to call my play crap town, is a comedy when looking at your play.

[neil1113]

That fact that you're voting me, means your wrong. And you're not playing to your win condition by making up cases, stretching them, and using them as motivation to vote a townie.

[neil1113]

Hiraki, I'm not so concerned with you. You can vote me as much as you'd like, I doubt anyone would honestly follow you with a clear conscience. Anyways I'm going to start ISOing around, and see if I can't start ACTUALLY scum hunting.

And Longing, I didn't say that Andrew was town, or that his vote was town motivated. That you just made up. Thus, you're making up a case. You proved my point just in this post. And my reactions aren't town? What is not town about them? The only thing I did, was respond to stupidity with anger. You're playing a game of Mafia, and neither of you have done anything even closely resembling what Mafia is.

[neil1113]

Neil.

Why don't you try to defend yourself?

Go ahead I dare you.

I'm done responding to you. I have nothing to defend myself from. You have no case. Instead I'm going to spend the time that would normally take trying to convince you that I'm town, and I'm going to use it to scum hunt. Anyone with eyes will read your posts and roll them, more then likely ignoring you.

[neil1113]

The fact that I'm a leading wagon, and nobody has a single case against me, shows just how pitiful and sad half this town really is. Go ahead, lynch me and lose. I'm cool with that. And now, shotty thinks I'm teaming with Hiraki. While nobody in the town weighs in on anything. Well except Vifam and his disbelief in my "tough guy" act. Great.

[neil1113]

Sorry Longing. I'm just kinda tired of playing with sorry players. I have no desire to actually play when people like them run the town (or at least, don't shut up and post more then anyone else). I'll respond accordingly.

VI usually implies town for the record, since you know, too stupid to be scum so must be town etc. It'd be the first time I've seen someone not town referred to that way.

Then you must not play Mafia much here. I'm sure I've seen it over and over again, when a game first starts, people refer to people as VI's because they can't play the game to save their lives. While the technicality of the term "

Village

Idiot" does indeed imply town, I use it the way I've seen it used my self, where not the first part, but the second part "Village

Idiot

" is emphasized.

Also it's not stupidity if I'm trying to make a case and add reasons to why I think you're scum. That is playing mafia. Hunting scum down. Which I am doing.

I can WIFOM this response easily by going on about how "I'm not scum, so that's not what you're doing!", but I'm going to try to avoid that. I'm not calling you stupid now, and if I did, I apologize. I'm not usually insulting, and rude. I understand you're trying to make a case and add onto it as to why I'm scum. However, we have barely any content to go on. I've not scum hunted, or posted barely anything so you have nothing to go by as to why I'm town. And while everyone is focused on me, the scum are either jumping on board the wagon, or they are sliding off doing their own thing and lurking. This is what upsets me.

You know what is not playing mafia? Saying I'm gay with Raikiri and insulting us. That's just insulting because you're mad. That's a scummy reaction, that's AtE.

That's anger. Anger isn't scummy, because both town and scum get angry. I can show you plenty of games, in fact I'm sure you can look up almost half of the games around Mafiascum and see someone Town get angry like that. Anger is an emotion that is shown by Humans. Not by Alignment. So this isn't a case you have, it's your opinion of style. You don't know my Meta, you don't know me. So to call Anger a scummy reaction, is to call any emotion a scummy reaction. Then I must ask, what "emotions" are town allowed to have?

[neil1113]

The fact that I'm a leading wagon, and nobody has a single case against me, shows just how pitiful and sad half this town really is. Go ahead, lynch me and lose. I'm cool with that. And now, shotty thinks I'm teaming with Hiraki. While nobody in the town weighs in on anything. Well except Vifam and his disbelief in my "tough guy" act. Great.

You're acting as if you're being a dominating town when you've had



-No FOS
-No RVS
-No real attempt to find scum


You've spent more of the game defending yourself rather than really looking for scum, and to top it off, you seem to have an FOS, but you're not voting it? Seems like an act to me.

I've already admitted, I've not attempted to scum hunt once this game in all reality. I did some ISO's and read over the game again, but I've not posted any of my reads or cases. For a reason. And me "acting" like anything, is an opinionated word. One that carries no substance or value. So how about we stick to what I'm actually saying, not what you think I'm saying? Okay? Cool? Good.

And how does it seem like I have a FoS? Have I said I have an FoS or is this another one of your "I think..." statements that carry no substance and value? Come to think of it, the majority of your posts really have no value...

[neil1113]

Neil's new post is lmffo. I don't really want to say where, because it's pretty obv. he's scum now.

I'm not sure why you think this, or why you think my post is laughable? But it seems apparent you don't want to share where, because it's "obvious I'm scum." If it takes my flip to show you why tunneling on me is bad, so be it. But do everyone a favor, and don't tunnel. Look at others, not just myself. That way if by some weird turn of events I do get lynched, after I flip town you'll at least have direction where to go because you'll have other reads.

[neil1113]

There is no town reason to with-hold content. I hope you realize this.

he says as he witholds content.

unvote, vote: hiraki

anfrew, come join the shotty/dj voting block. neil too.

Short posts and withholding your thoughts are entirely different. Hiraki posts his suspicions when they come up. Neil admitted he has reads but just doesn't make them known. Not the same thing. While on this subject...

Unvote
Vote: Neil

Until you stop withholding your thoughts and/or give us your reason. Because I don't see any reason townies would hesitate to post their thoughts.

Thank you. I was waiting for someone to make this point and call me out on it. To be fair though, the point I wanted to make, is that Anti-Town does not equal scum. Scum does not equal Anti=Town. I gave an open door for scum to try and push this easy lynch on me, and you took the bait. Townies have no reason to try and pursue "easy mislynches" the way you are with me. I admit, (and have admitted), some of my actions have been anti-town. However, a townie wants to lynch scum, not anti-town townies. You cannot possibly claim I'm scum, as there is no case to be made against me because I'm town, and all my posts have come from town motivation. Others have seen that, the only people who don't are... well, yeah. One of them is tunneling me obviously, one of them is just glad to have gotten the wagon off his back, and the other... well I'm not sure about him. He seems smart, so I'm still curious why his vote lays on me still. You however, I'm pretty sure are scum. You took the bait, took the trap, and now you're attempting to push the easy lynch by putting me at

L-2

due to "lack of content" and not due to "you're scum." I was waiting for someone to take it, and now that someone has I'm confident with where I place my vote.

VOTE: SigmaEXE003

ALSO OF IMPORTANCE:

Sigma jumped on Vifam's wagon when Vifam was at L-2, with little to no case as well. It looks like over=enthusiastic scum really wanting a mislynch. Considering I have a town read right now on Vifam, I'm confident that Sigma knows both of us is town, and is looking to push an easy lynch, to end the day. Coincidence that the two main wagons he was on, were the only two main wagons in the game? I think not.

[neil1113]

So you're saying we shouldn't get rid of people that are anti-town?

HMM.

I'm saying Town's desire is to find scum, not anti-town people. Anti-town can be both town or scum motivated. It's a playing style sometimes, or a specific gaming style for that game. It's not always pointing one way or another, so being Anti-Town is, in and of itself, null.

Hey chucklefuck, I placed the second vote, not the L-2 vote.

I love you too. Love the defense as well. Good point.

Anyway, you saying you're town won't make people believe you're town. And you do that a lot.

The only ones who need to make such a huge point that they're townie or pro-town are scum.

Yes, Townies say they are town, Scum say they are town. Null point?

Bolded Point: Opinion stated like a fact. I like it. You're sneaky. The "fact" is, scum do say they are town a lot, but so does a townie about to get lynched? Another, might I say, NULL point. So drink coke, and play again scum!

[neil1113]

I'm saying Town's desire is to find scum, not anti-town people. Anti-town can be both town or scum motivated. It's a playing style sometimes, or a specific gaming style for that game. It's not always pointing one way or another, so being Anti-Town is, in and of itself, null.

Sure, our ultimate goal is to lynch scum, but having anti-town people around makes that harder. You know, anti means against, so against the town. If you're working against the town, we may as well get rid of you to make our job easier.

Yes, Townies say they are town, Scum say they are town. Null point?

Bolded Point: Opinion stated like a fact. I like it. You're sneaky. The "fact" is, scum do say they are town a lot, but so does a townie about to get lynched? Another, might I say, NULL point. So drink coke, and play again scum!

The point I was trying to make is not solely that you say you're town a lot, but that you don't defend yourself along with it. You just say "There is no case to be made against me since I'm town." But we don't know if you're town. So that won't change our opinion of you. Not only are defenses of that sort a scumtell (from personal experience), they won't even work if you're town.

Those who made a case, I defended against the points they made. Or more specifically, he made. Since only one person was willing to make a case against me. If you'd like to make a case against me, I'll gladly defend against your points as well.

[neil1113]

Sorry Trag, I'll be more active. I'm confused as to what just went down this last page though? I'm not sure what Shotty was getting at.

Also as far as Masons, the roles in this game are as followed: (based on Page 1)

Citizen (Vanilla Town)
2x Mafia Members (Mafia Goon)
Mafia 2-Shot Daykill Member (Self Explanatory)

Which now that I think about it, this is great because Mafia can't kill except for the Day Kill person. But by the time he/she day kills the first time, we'd be able to lynch them right? So the only deaths in the town (until he/she day kills) is our own mislynches. Without us mislynching, the Mafia can't gain any advantages or kills over us. Questions:

Hiraki, and Sigma: Have you guys played together before? A lot, or just once or twice?

@Mod - Is Jake getting replaced?

Longing, Vifam: Are you both still confident with my lynch? Why, or why not? Any other reads (scum, not town.)

Andrew, and Noggin are both on V/LA but we should not give them a free pass to do whatever they'd like. When they return, let's make sure and give them some pressure. It's easy to come back from a V/LA and not post much, and nobody question you because you weren't posting at all when you were on your V/LA.

Oversoul, who are you most comfortable pressuring? (I know your vote is on Sigma, does that still stand?)

Shotty, you said you want to start scum hunting now. Any direction you'd like to pursue? (Any person you'd like to pressure specifically?)

I realized guys, the only way for us to win this game is if we come together and pressure as a unit, and become a real threat. Not just a spread out, inactive town. You don't have to trust me, and if you want me lynched to prove my motives, fair enough. But when/if I'm taken out of the way, don't ignore what I'm saying. Also something to take note of: the "best" role right now is the two-shot daykill Mafia Member. Since it's such a power role (the only one in the game), I'd expect the person behind it to be active, really active. The people that first spark my mind when I think about who's been "running the day" is Hiraki, Longing, and Sigma. But paranoa sits in when I look at my lynch wagon and realize all three are on it. I have to wonder, would all three scum be willing to jump on the same wagon Day 1? It's highly unlikely, but it's WIFOM at the core to think about.

[neil1113]

No, and absolutely not to your end paragraph.

Let the big boys hold these reigns.

Are you going to be helpful at all and play the game? If not, you know you could just replace out?

[neil1113]

I'm very helpful to the success of this game.

Okay so I'll try to have an actual conversation with you. You obviously don't agree with my last paragraph? As far as the town is concerned, you believe we're better off not trusting anyone and not working together as a unit, being separate out and inactive? Rather then working together as a town and capitalizing as a unit to be an actual force to the scum team?

@Sigma, do you relate a lot to Hiraki's playing style? Like, are you similar to him in any sense? I'm trying to figure out why after a quick glimpse at your ISO's, you two seemed to be "connecting" and partnering with each other a lot? It could be because you're scum partners, but in a non-biased view, it could also be because you just have similar playing styles (or it could be explained away in a million and one other ways...) I just want to hear your explanation.

@Shotty, thanks I appreciate your posts. Care to be helpful now? Or would you rather stick to calling me useless, and being a jerk through this game?

[neil1113]

No, and absolutely not to your end paragraph.

Let the big boys hold these reigns.

Are you going to be helpful at all and play the game? If not, you know you could just replace out?

Neil you are the most useless player here.

This is a jerk statement. I'm trying to stop being anti-town and actually start playing to my win condition, despite my attitude towards some of the people that are in this game, and while I'm trying to get everyone active and talking, you'd turn around and call me the most useless player? Does that not seem like a jerk move to you?

[neil1113]

Oh my god you are starting to sound like YamiChan!

Am I supposed to know who that is? Listen, if you're town and you'd like to help the town, feel free to contribute. If you're scum, continue to play to your win condition. If you're town and you don't want to contribute, feel free to replace out. Either way, there's no point in us having a useless conversation that has no benefits one way or the other.

[neil1113]

How does being useless and making myself an easy lynch play toward a mafia win con?

While I made the point earlier that Anti-Town is not a specific tell for scum, it is helping scum. So if you're scum, and you're playing Anti-Town, it'd be playing to your win condition. If you're town, playing Anti-Town, you're not playing to your win condition. Why are you wanting to be an easy lynch though? I never used those words or said anything about lynching you, so I'm curious as to why you used that phrasing?

[neil1113]

I don't want to be. But I usually seem to be when I'm town.

So change your ways here. Modify yourself to be beneficial to the town this game, instead of whatever you usually do that makes you an easy lynch target?

[neil1113]

Where have I been a jerk?

When you made that signature...

Anyway, Neil, I don't really think we have similar playing styles. Maybe in this game, but not overall. I think he knows what he's doing, though. When I believe someone's right, I'll side with them. Simple as that.

Anyway, as for the rest of it, I don't believe town can trust anyone. Especially not in a nightless game. I believe since the mafia doesn't have the power of a night kill, they'd make a better effort to lead the town into mislynches and look pro-town. You never know who you're trusting. It's better just to form reads on your own.

I agree to a degree. Town can't fully trust anyone until proven innocent. Which unfortunately doesn't happen until you're lynched or killed. However if the town works together as a whole to be a force to reckon with, when people start forming wagons and start questioning others, with the town behind them, the suspected takes it seriously and we could get places. Instead of 11 different cases on 7 different people, and after 2 weeks we're no closer to finding a lynch suspect then when we first began.

[neil1113]

Lol seriously Shotty? That's your way of being productive? I'm Vanilla. I have no powers. And I'm the only person so far that's now trying to get the town together, and you would have me lynched? Hiraki by the way is not being intimidating. He's just got some issues going on I'm guessing and is taking it out on those in the thread. If it takes my flip to show you Hiraki that you're wrong, and you yourself will cost the town with your tunneling, so be it. Look for yourself. Vanilla, Townie.

VOTE: Neil_1113