New Designer Mafia (Victor(s) are crowned)

[ender241]

Alright time to confess, i am a town Post Bomber, my ability was to choose a post number and bomb it. I thought that really i wasn't going to be able to predict who is going to post on a certain number so i did it randomly thinking i'd get lucky but instead i killed 2 people with it sorry guys feel free to lynch me, rather me with absolutely 0 abilities available than Olinea or someone.

[Zajnet]

Did anyone submit the Post Bomber role?

[Furcolow]

oh, jeez, that changes everything

[Fashion Llama]

Amrun replaces Thingyman effective immediately

[Amrun]

Hi. I've read through the entire thread, but I'm still formulating my thoughts.

Immediately, though:

I'm not assuming ender is town. Why would a town want us to lynch a town member instead of continuing to scumhunt? Implies explicit knowledge that Olinea is town.

But, again, why would mafia do that? Maybe he's a mafia bomb or something like that.

Or maybe he's a jester.


Or just a bad player. Who knows.

[Tasky]

@Tasky: about your extra role related information on Oli - without fullclaiming, can you say roughly how good it is? If you have information that dramatically raises the likelihood of Oliscum above average, we'd be mad to lynch elsewhere.

there is no role-related information on Oli. it was a gambit I pulled to see his reactions. and it paid off.

I agree with your assessment of Oli's reaction.

why aren't you voting Oli then?

Would you rather I asked where you got the information so you could interpret that as a rolefish?

I think a townie would have started by voting me.

Your reason is not strong at ALL. You said you have reason to believe I am scum. Where is the strength in that? Where is the persuasion in it? If your information is based on an infallible PR which functioned at the beginning of the game, or during the day, then I'd take a look at it. But simply saying

PS: People, can we PLEASE lynch Olinea? I have a REALLY GOOD REASON to believe he is scum (which is completely unrelated to the Detonator stuff.)

Is not strong reasoning, and appears to be more of a gambit than anything else.

it was a gambit. and you reacted exactly the way I'd expect scum to react to something like that.
btw, why aren't you voting me now since you seem to be a LynchAllLiars-fan? Why didn't you vote me at first when you deduced it was a gambit (= a lie)?

I'm not assuming ender is town. Why would a town want us to lynch a town member instead of continuing to scumhunt? Implies explicit knowledge that Olinea is town.

could you please rephrase this? can't understand what you mean.

[Amrun]

Quick note as I'm doing further research:

DeathNote submitted a Jester role. Could Ender have received it? Is making up a role conceivable for him, in his meta? If he's jester, he's doing a good job so far (imho). Still, he could have pushed pressure when he got some votes earlier. Just throwing it out there.

DeathNote himself is giving me scumpings. Several times, he asks, "Is this scummy? Is that scummy?" in an open-ended form. It's strange to me and I honestly think he's asking for behaviors to avoid while passing it off as flippant.

The subtle insertion of "we" when he's referring to a group that suspects someone he did not suspect was something someone else pointed out and that didn't occur to me, but I might as well restate it.

Also, complete lack of scumhunting from DeathNote.

On to ISO someone else.

[Amrun]

@Tasky: Ender asks to be lynched because, according to him, his actions caused the death of two townies. He specifically said that a death of a townie that has no more abilities would be better than the death of someone with abilities, like Olinea. He does not mention alignment.

My point was that just because he's all, "I killed some townies. Sorry, guys," doesn't mean he actually IS town, since lynching a townie on purpose is actually detrimental to town.

I hope that helped to clarify.

[Amrun]

Base reads on some others, as I'm fading quickly and need to sleep:

Plum: Has basically claimed that she paired the Lovers. WHY would any town-motivated player pair cooldog and chesskid? I'm new here and even I know one or both of them is likely to get killed early.

dana: Only seems interested in posting about the detonator issue. I think she could actually be the detonator IF ender is not. Overall, null read because most of her posts are about a now-defunct issue.

Demon: Townread so far. Tunneling symptoms = bad, but did recognize when to back off.

InternetStranger: Townread so far, but aggressive town.

Fishy: Some strange conflictions about his/her thoughts on IS. Idk.

tajo and Olinea: I'm undecided, will read them in ISO tomorrow.

Xalxe: Beginning of the game play was scummy. Haven't been satisfied with scumhunting efforts thus far.

zora: Did seem a little overly concerned about defending against ender's ridiculous accusations. Null, so far, though.



Not mentioned are un-noteable null, unless I accidentally missed someone. I'm tired. I apologize.

[Sevei]

HI, sorry, some things came up that I had to tend to, but I'm back and catching up now. Will be ready to post soon.

[Xalxe]

I don't know why I haven't asked this earlier, but

Did anyone send in a role that functions as a Daykill when you PM it to the Mod?

I sent a role like this.

Also, @Amrun: I know. I need to make time to put together coherent thoughts.

[Internet Stranger]

I'm aware that you asked who submitted an explodey role. I'm just saying that no one is coming forward because even if they just submitted it and never used it we would be going after them regardless. So why would anyone make that confession?

[Internet Stranger]

oh hey, posted without reading a page. Damn. Now I need time to think about this.

[DeathNote]

So.... If someone comes forward with the post bomber role, it would be safe to assume Ender is not the jester role.

[Xalxe]

So.... If someone comes forward with the post bomber role, it would be safe to assume Ender is not the jester role.

As in, somebody made it?

[Fishythefish]

First, role related stuff:
- ender’s claim makes everything make more sense. Someone confirm they created Post Bomber?

@ender:

why did you chose the moment you did to claim? Why not earlier, and why then?
- For people who haven’t (and particularly for those who have hardly posted), I’d still encourage claiming what you submitted. It narrows down the field of potential fakeclaims, which is a good thing. There may well be a point when scum can’t claim their real role because it’s been used scummily.
- To everyone: if there’s a detonator in the game, is there any reason to think they’re town or scum?

People who I have problems with:

Furc

Dislike his unwillingness to confirm Oli; rather like he wants continued pressure on Oli, when the protown thing to do is clearly verify the claim. Then, when a couple of people vote for him, he votes Oli. Feels like Furc always

knew

that was the protown thing to do, and once he was called on his inaction he wanted to appease the town. His explanation for this later is that confirming Oli’s claim was setting up for his wagon to be disbanded, which was counter to Furc’s goal, lynching the scummiest player. In other words, an outright admission that he cares about lynching Oli, not working out what is going on. This rather makes my point:

I am really confused as to what is going on with the Olinea/detonator/populartajo situation, but it is making me suspicious of them.

I don’t think that’s a natural townie reaction to the problem of being really confused about something. It seems that Furc can’t quite work out how to get from the facts to Oli/tajo scummy, but wants to give a scumread anyway. Furc seems content to throw out things that sound like they make Oli scum, while never presenting a coherent view of why he thinks that. He also sheeps the bad WIR vote on tajo. Overall, Furc’s play shows a massive lack of interest in working out who’s scum.

IS

Basically, I think IS is scummy for being so, so wrong about things. This isn’t usually a good scumtell, but here it looks like IS is really being argumentative for the sake of it – I feel he’s deliberately pushing an “I’m so townie I don’t care what you think” line, rather than actually thinking about things.

Olinea

A scummy reaction to Tasky’s gambit. As town, I’d want to address any claimed information saying I was likely scum. As scum, I’d want nobody to be talking about it. Thinks DH is tunneled town rather than scum.

WhenInRome

His 126 stinks. It doesn’t sound like he thinks Olinea detonated the bomb – more like he did something weird, and that that justifies the vote. His vote in 272 is based on a contradiction from tajo that doesn’t exist – what tajo is clearly asking for is whether any submitted roles

other than Yosarianite

that could explain the votecount anomaly.

Xalxe

I was going to say I don’t really support this, because I don’t think the early game IIoA is a good scumtell. But looking at Xalxe, he really hasn’t done much in the way of scumhunting in a lot of posts. It’s not just the massclaim count; his posts generally are pretty fluffy. Who is scum, Xalxe?

Deathnote

I dislike his reaction to Xalxe, when Xalxe’s wagon was building early on for IIoA. Votes Xalxe when other people are doing so for reasons, saying “little pressure needed here”. Firstly, it simply wasn’t – Xalxe had a very decent wagon going. More to the point, this distances DN from the actual reasons for voting Xalxe, and undermines the vote itself.

StrangerCoug

WIR’s vote on tajo is bad; sheeping and defending it is worse. Doesn't feel like he's really thinking about the point at all.

Style notes: I applaud the use of videos, and would be happy to see more. I’d encourage dana not to reply inside quotes; it’s hard to read and harder to quote.

UNVOTE: VOTE: Furc

[DeathNote]

Yeah, if someone made it. Ender would have no idea as a jester if that was an actual role so someone claiming to have created it would clear him from being jester.

[DeathNote]

Deathnote

I dislike his reaction to Xalxe, when Xalxe’s wagon was building early on for IIoA. Votes Xalxe when other people are doing so for reasons, saying “little pressure needed here”. Firstly, it simply wasn’t – Xalxe had a very decent wagon going. More to the point, this distances DN from the actual reasons for voting Xalxe, and undermines the vote itself.

Ehh... If what you say is true, then I would have unvoted Xalxe once I saw it wasn't going anywhere. As it stands, I am still voting him.

[Amrun]

Why are you still voting him? Your original vote was a pressure vote.

And my person did not send in a post bomber role, but he did send in a n0 lovers role.

[danakillsu]

Hey, what do you know? I was right! There's no scum detonator, and in fact no detonator at all. It was so easy to see, and the fact that IS pretended not to see it is great grounds for lynching. Wagon, ahoy!

[Amrun]

Dana, how do you know there was no detonator/scum detonator?

Ender was a bomb and we don't really know if he is town.

And there could still be a detonator out there.

[Fishythefish]

Oh, and Amrun:

Fishy: Some strange conflictions about his/

her

thoughts on IS. Idk.

What are these?

[Internet Stranger]

@Fishy. I already made it clear that I dont believe in this massclaiming nonsense and the focus on whos role is what. It clearly messes with my scumdar and I HATE it. No one is really going after scum, even after 15 pages everyone is just trying to make a sense of things still. I should have caught me a scum by now.

So now if Ender is a post bomber, Bunny is a vote nullifier, and Amrun is a loverer, which one is the scum now?

[Amrun]

I'm not a lover. I only said that because of the way they died.

Plum claimed it, anyway.

[Fishythefish]

Plum is the one who hinted at being a loverer.

I see all those roles as largely null. They are all usable as scum or town. Post bomber is more powerful as a scum role (your team can make sure it doesn't get blown up), but still works as town (random kills are good; if you are clever and lucky you could get into an argument at the right time). Nullifier looks powerful for either team in lylo (gambits for town, autowin for scum), and meh until then. Loverer has strong uses for either team. In fact, I'd say the use of it here looks a bit more townie; trying to eliminate two not so useful players, rather than linking lynchbait to a scary player.