Mini 1014 - Ghostbusters Mafia - Game Over

[Coach Travis]

Vote:Starbuck

because we need to get as many people into this RVS as possible. I don't like Tazaro's constant OMGUS voting and unvotes, however.

[Coach Travis]

I mean he's done it twice already and were still in the RVS, so it just seemed odd.

[Coach Travis]

Yeah the "constant" thing was just me using bad wording, I do that often in these games. Repeated would have indeed been more accurate. Anyway, the point is I use RVS to get reads off of reactions, and I was not liking his reactions at all, using OMGUS whenever people voted him like that. Makes him look bad, I think. I also don't really like RVS bandwagons all that much, which is why I never voted him. I get that it's still early and he could just be excited, but it's something I'll look into as the game continues.

[Coach Travis]

I've never been a fan of RVS bandwagons, because I don't like people getting put into danger when there's no real reasoning. I actually said the same thing in my last game and I was town, so I don't see how that could be interpreted as scummy.

[Coach Travis]

I didn't like Scott's vote on me too much, but I don't think he's scummy. I know my stance on the one issue isn't particularly common. However, the way xRECKONERx twisted my one post around like that, doesn't sit too well with me. He's getting a scummier read right now, Taz is predictably calming down a bit and I don't find him scummy at the moment.

[Coach Travis]

Don't like that latest vote on me at all, I've already explained it's a general opinion I have that carries over no matter what my role is, so if that's all you have on me, it's a crappy reason to vote. Okay, I get it's wrong, but I'm generally a cautious guy, you could read my latest game as town where I played exactly the same.

@d3X:I didn't like how Scott was making a bandwagon vote on me, that was the main thing, and especially over something like that. I still don't think he's scum. because it seems most people disagreed with me, and he's done nothing else to make me suspicious, especially now that BC has just done the exact same thing. I currently like BC less than Scott, just because his vote came after I already explained myself.(Seriously, go find newbie 958, and you'll see how similar I was at the start)

[Coach Travis]

About this "newbie card" thing:How did you even come up with that? When did I specifically try to get out of anything by saying I'm a newb? Once again, twisting my words around. I only mentioned that game because it was my best one(I've played two and the first was an epic fail), and because it would show that to be a general opinion I have. It honestly has nothing to do with strategy, it's just how I am.

Anyway, right now BC is annoying me more than xRECKONERx, because the way he's twisting my posts is just driving me crazy.

Unvote

,

Vote:BC

[Coach Travis]

I never got the point of using FoS to be honest, it just seems another way of saying you're suspicious of someone but don't feel like voting, which isn't good for a townie, I think. If there's someone you clearly find more suspicious than anyone else, you may as well just vote them, it's not like one vote automatically leads to a lynch, or anything.

[Coach Travis]

I'm not. That was my random vote, and I've since changed it to BC, because his vote on me seemed like lies, saying I pulled the newb card when I never even pretended to be a newb.

[Coach Travis]

Taz's calming down was predictable, because you have to think after getting some early votes, and people suspicious of him early for his behavior, that he'd realize this and cool down a bit. Also, I know some people are particularly hyper during the RVS, but calm down a bit afterward, so seeing how Taz started out I figured he was like that.

[Coach Travis]

Oh, and about the wishy-washy thing:I did eventually make a serious vote, and including that plus what I said about xRECKONERx, which still holds true for now, I do have two scum reads, and there's still plenty of other players I'm not sure on yet, mostly because they haven;t posted enough for me to get a read.

[Coach Travis]

Nice to see Starbuck around, interested to hear from him. But now the real interesting thing will be seeing how Taz's replacement acts, because Taz was acting suspicious, I personally wrote it off as just him being overly hyper, didn't really find him scummy, but I'm interested to see how the replacement will act, with the situation as it is.

Also, while I still disagree with Scott, I don't find him scummy, because he at least has a good enough explanation, and isn't accusing me of something I never did. Still think he's town. His case against me is totally fair, no matter how much I disagree with it.

[Coach Travis]

Yeah, I have to agree with the case against Mallow:He's been totally unhelpful, lurking like crazy, and then to return and make a vote against someone who's being replaced, and who I feel could easily be an over excited townie, is very suspicious. I think for now I'll

Unvote

,

Vote:Mallowgeno

, since the BC thing was really just personal, and while I still don't particularly like him, Mallow seems worse right now.

This means Mallow, BC and xRECKONERx are currently at the top of my suspicions list, while right now I feel Scott, Jason, and Taz are town. There's still some people I'm not totally sure of yet, I'll go through some more later and see if I can get more reads.

[Coach Travis]

Just a warning:I'm going to be out tomorrow, so I won't be posting again until sometime on Saturday.

[Coach Travis]

Backtracing from the "constant" word, when called out on it. Why was using the word constant bad? Why do you feel the need to change your wording based on xReck's question?
CT +1 scum point for backtracking under little pressure.

I realized constant was the wrong word there, because it only happened twice, not several times, which that word would suggest. Basically, it was an exaggeration, which could be a scum tactic to make other players look bad.

Just because you said that in your last game and you were town, doesn't mean you saying it this time makes you town. In fact, it reads scummy to me.
CT +1 scum point for whatever the hell you call this (I guess gut read by me).

See, I think it's more scummy if you switch your views on an issue from game to game, just to suit a specific role. My point was that it's an opinion I always have, and I only used meta gaming to show it does in fact carry over from game to game. Basically, I think it's a null tell, because it's a personal opinion, and has nothing to do with strategy. I don't see how having a personal opinion could be viewed as scummy.

You don't like Scott's vote, but it doesn't make him scummy? That's fence-sitting/wishy-washy.
CT +1 scum point for fence-sitting.

Just because someone's voting for you, it doesn't mean you have to find them scummy, or find their methods questionable. Basically, I had seen nothing overly suspicious from Scott up to that point, and still haven't, and voting me isn't scummy, even though I obviously disagree with it. Voting is not scummy, unless you're past the RVS stage, and not giving reasons.

So even though you thought what he did was scummy, you don't think he's scum because no one else does? This looks like trying to blend with the town.
CT +1 scum point for appeasing/blending.

I never said it was scummy, I said I didn't like it. There's a big difference. I never once said I found anything Scott did scummy, because I never did. His argument against me was perfectly reasonable, even though I obviously felt differently about it.

This reads like a bit of AtE to me. And "annoying me"? What is that?
CT +1 scum point for AtE.

Sorry, could you explain what AtE is? I've never heard of that before. And the annoying me thing was just because he was going after a clear personal opinion, and trying to make it seem like I was playing the newbie card when I wasn't:This is my first game outside of Road to Rome, so that was the only example I had. I never once said I was a newb, he made it seem like I did say so, and that was annoying me.

In your last post (232) you said Taz was acting suspicious. Then everyone starts unvoting Taz because he's being replaced, in then in this post, with no comments on your change in opinion, you call Taz town. Nice scumslip.
CT +2 scum points.

Aside from my one post on him early on, (you know, the now infamous "constant" one), I never really went after Taz at all, and my post you're referring to was mostly saying that people found him suspicious, but I personally did not. In fact, I was saying others should give you a chance to come in and say something before voting you, because I was never convinced he was scum. I always thought he was over excited town, so my previous post was not a sudden change like you make it out to be.

I still like the case on Mallow, because if he is indeed a third party player it's a good idea to have him out of the game, and either way if he's going to keep playing like this, he's not really going to help us if we keep him anyway. And obviously, that type of play comes off as scummy. My vote stands.

And I think LMP is obvtown with that post, clearly scumhunting the whole time. Makes my read on Taz seem even more accurate now.

[Coach Travis]

EBWOP:I just realized I said something wrong there:I never actually said the thing about giving LMP a chance to come in and make a post, but I was thinking it. Either way, you can see where I mentioned finding Taz overexcited and not scummy.

[Coach Travis]

I meant "suspicious" in that I knew his behavior was clearly something other people found suspicious. Did I myself find him suspicious? No, aside from the one time I mentioned. I saw his actions more as him being overly hyper, and I did mention this multiple times. Nothing changed between that time, I just finally mentioned having a town read on him, which had been the case for a while, and I was interested to see what you would do so my read could be confirmed or proven wrong. Not only was it confirmed, I got a stronger town read from you, because you removed anything that possibly be interpreted as suspicious, and were more active as a scumhunting. Basically, I had been off of the case on him long before then, I just finally decided to mention my town read, because I figured if the replacement was a better player, his innocence would be more obvious. And I was right.

[Coach Travis]

Or another way to put it:I figured Taz was town early on, but I didn't think he was a very good player, with some of his actions coming off as suspicious, but overall it was clear enough to me that he was town, and I never really suspected him of being scum.

[Coach Travis]

Reading through Taz in ISO, I can't really find any specific examples, because he wasn't a very good player, but just the way he was acting seemed town to me. First off, he was saying way too much to be scum, way too much, and it all seemed genuine as well, not trying to hide anything. His main problem was being overly hyper, so his explanations weren't that good, and his behavior led to things that some may interpret as scummy, but I could tell he was genuinely trying to help the town, which is why when some were voting him, I wasn't. I just don't think a scum would be that open and that overly talkative. That, and I can't see any way in which he would have been manipulating anyone, which is what scum are supposed to do.

[Coach Travis]

I never said he was "too scummy to be scum". This whole game feels like people putting words in my mouth, and it's getting frustrating. All I said was he was really talkative, like excessively so, and I don't see scum doing that, because it's an obvious way to slip. Never once did I call him scummy. Nor did I ever once describe myself as a newb. Those two things keep pissing me off, because people are putting words in my mouth that I never even said. And to call my one post AtE is wrong, because all i was doing was pointing out how what BC said wasn't even true, so yet another occurrence of me being misunderstood.

As is the whole Taz thing: I simply feel the way he was playing leads seemed more like overexcited town than scum, it's just a read I have, and I always feel the same about that type of player.

[Coach Travis]

Alright,, I realize I've spent way too much time on the defensive, so now I'll give my thoughts on some players, and recent stuff.

First off, I like sottyrulez:His latest post was really good, exactly the type of thing I like to see, as he shares thoughts on several players, giving good ideas of who he finds suspicious and why, and who isn't so suspicious. Plus he ended with a vote, and I liked that one as well, trying to start something on a player who's been relatively unnoticed so far. Town read for him so far. Also, nice to see someone else got the same vibe out of Taz.

Also good to see GhostWriter with a much better post after being called out. I'm really not sure of him so far though, as he hasn't really done enough for me to get a read, but it was good to see him attempt scumhunting in his last post. Though I don't really agree with the case on Xscorpion, he doesn't seem tremendously scummy to me.

I agree that Starbuck is getting a bit ridiculous. I realize she's away, but if she has the time to make as many silly posts as has, she has time for content. Only reason she wouldn't want to contribute is if she's scum. I'll give her time to see if she picks it up when her vacation's over, but so far she seems scummy.

[Coach Travis]

@D3XI'm getting scum vibes from Reck. First off, he was clearly buddying with Taz, it was obvious the way he was interacting with him. And since Taz was replaced, he's been fairly quiet, not doing much anything, because he knows LMP can't be played that easily. Otherwise, I need to go through some posts and see what I think. Can't do that until Friday though, I won't be online again until then.

[Coach Travis]

Lol at BC requesting replacement right when people are starting to vote him. Just looked at him in ISO, and it turns out I was right to suspect him earlier, but for different reasons now. First off, he goes through one long stretch barely giving any content, and then when he does he keeps switching his vote, first he votes Mallow, then Taz, then eventually me, but the way he did it each time didn't seem quite right, like he was just putting no effort into the game at all. I get there could be stuff happening in real life to prevent him from being as active, but just the way he was acting doesn't look good to me, and his anger at Reck being voted seems strange. After thinking for a while, I agree it may be in our best interest to save the Mallow lynch for now, since we're fairly certain he's a third party so it's not like we can't lynch him whenever we want.

Unvote

,

Vote:BC's player slot

[Coach Travis]

@Fur:Please explain how I'm buddying, I can't see it all. I've done nothing even close to how Reck was trying to manipulate Taz, and every time I've defended people it's been based on reads and nothing more. And I'm not a wagon jumper. I only voted on two wagons, was suspicious of Mallow and still think he needs to go at some point, and am even more suspicious of BC, so it's not like waiting to jump between wagons like you say. And interesting how you connect me to both sotty and Reck, but for opposite reasons. I doubt a scum would do two obvious tactics like that, maybe one if they suck.

Interesting role claim, but I don't believe it. I still see him as scum.

[Coach Travis]

I know I've liked Sotty so far, but I don't know I if believe the claim. I have no reason not to trust him, the biggest problem I have is that day two is way too early to give yourself away, unless the town makes the mistake of wagoning on you and you get to L-1. The start of a day is not the right time, unless it's near the end of the game. With that being said, I'm interested to see what happens from here.

[Coach Travis]

Yeah, I'm also not liking shotty so far, and considering my thoughts on Reck, he may be the best lynch option. Of course, I'm interested to see the investigation results, since at this point I agree sotty has no reason to claim if they aren't actually the cop.

[Coach Travis]

Good catch on D3x, I never really said much about him to this point, simply because his lurky playstyle was challenging to read, and I never really got much from reading his posts, he wasn't really saying much nobody else was saying, like he was trying his best to not stand out:a clear scum tactic. So yeah, I'll trust that investigation, and

Vote:D3x

Finally looked into the whole thing with shotty and GW, and I agree that one of those, likely shotty, should be our next lynch.

[Coach Travis]

I don't buy the claim at all, the whole thing sounds forced to me, and just a bit ridiculous, plus the whole thing of claiming a role that would hurt the town upon lynch really does just seem like self preservation. I still think he's the best lynch option.

[Coach Travis]

Yeah, that really is a weak claim, much worse than D3's. Makes our next move after today even more obvious, with his switching of roleclaims like that, it makes him obvscum.

[Coach Travis]

Mod:I am also voting d3x, I think you missed that one twice

[Coach Travis]

Sucks to lose Scott, but catching scum is always a good thing, and we even still have our cop, unbelievably. Anyway, I think our best course of action is obvious, considering how scummy shotty has been acting, his obvious ignoring of d3x, plus actually claiming scum, he's clearly the best lynch option.

Vote:drmyshottyizsik

[Coach Travis]

LOL, didn't think he'd be lynched by the time I was online again. Fastest day I've ever been a part of.

[Coach Travis]

Crap, knew my day 1 actions would come up again sooner or later. I really just wasn't impressed with d3x on day one, and couldn't get a read on him because he was lurking so much, and the case on me did seem forced. I did interected with Reck however, and was suspicious of that role the entire game, you can't say I wasn't.

Well, with so many players confirmed, plus my town read on LMP and having no reason to doubt GW, my only possible option is to

Vote:Mallow

[Coach Travis]

I'm Janine Melnitz, a townie, and I do not have any special powers, I'm just vanilla. I've played a sloppy game so far, but that doesn't make me scum.

[Coach Travis]

Oh wow, lynched already. Well, for now I'll just say my alignment is painfully obvious, and anyone unsure of it fails at mafia. That was even more embarrassing than my first game, because at least then I had the excuse of inexperience. This time there's nothing to defend how I played.

[Coach Travis]

Yeah, when sotty was protected it completely threw us off, because as you'll see from our night actions after that, we were so afraid he'd be protected again that we targeted other people, so we could at least get our kills off. It also didn't help that I failed with my framing each time, totally didn't realize ghostwriter was cleared, I guess I got lazy.

Either way, I think the setup itself was balanced enough, as my power was potentially game changing, I just think it all came down to poor execution on our part. I think it's obvious how frustrated I was getting early on, because I knew as soon as I made a couple mistakes early in day 1, I was going to be targeted the rest of the game, and at first I was taking it a bit personally, which only made things even worse. By the time I finally calmed down, it was too late, because I had already so many things to incriminate myself, so combine that with the bad luck of having d3x investigated, the game was basically over before it ever begun.

Anyway, congrats to the town. I'm more upset with myself than anything else, though I think part of it was I'd never played as scum before, so to have things go that badly right at the start, was just not a situation I could recover from.