Open 233: Ninja Mafia Boogaloo - Over!

[AGar]

VOTE: Sotty7VOTE:

For being the easiest name to type on my phone.

For the record, I will have limited posting for between 1 and 3 days. I'm in the hospital for some testing on my brainzzz. I was under the impression that a) I would have internet and b) I would not be allowed to have and use my phone. Both were lies. So I can post (woo blackberry!) but I'm limited (boo old blackberry curve!).

[AGar]

VOTE: Sotty7

[AGar]

Where is Troll o.O

I would've posted yesterday, but I forgot to add this to my bookmarks. D'oh!

1. Pepsi or Coke? Coke.
2. Favorite Setup? Haven't encountered a favorite yet.
3. How would you describe your meta? The slope of the line x=1
4. Win/loss record? Wiki says 9-7-0-1
5. Maximum number of games you'll play in at one time? I'm in 9 right now.

In other news, I'm the wagon leader. COOL!

And our marijuana can't be lit. BOO!

VOTE: gammagooey

For replacing. Obviously a ninja. So sneaky that PZ didn't see the original player pick up the role PM.

[AGar]

Fineee I'll answer... I was looking and couldn't find the game... though I could have sworn I played with beefster before... Maybe I'm losing my mind as beef didn't show any love to me in his posts.

1. Pepsi or Coke? Pepsi
2. Favorite Setup? Large games maybe?
3. How would you describe your meta? Unpredictable
4. Win/loss record? Below is accurate... I think
5. Maximum number of games you'll play in at one time? maybe 5 at the most... depending on the activity level of each game.

He replaced out of 965. That's where.

[AGar]

Oh and this:

@PaltryExcuse - No, but I'll play his game anyways.

Oh, and since we're in a setup with the actual creator...

SC, entertain my brain - what do you think about the balance of the setup? I've heard grumblings that we may be in a mafia-heavy setup.

Keeping my eye on you, SB.

In the meantime...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ShatteredViewpoint

I don't like the tone, or the background, of 45.

[AGar]

Off topic, Papa Zito, the flavor is kinda ironic because I just started watching Lost the other day whilst in the hospital.

[AGar]

Well,

late

happy birthday, Chronopie!

Edited and then QFTFT.

---

Shattered Viewpoint is making me more and more comfortable with being on this wagon.

And yes, I can handle Advanced Scumhunting 101. I just happen to think that you're a pretentious, self-egregious ass who can't. Setting a trap with an unvote... that's just retarded.

You seem to be flailing at this point, like "OMG GAIZZZZZZ I DIDN'T ACTUALLY FORGETZZZ MY VOTE!!!!1!1!1!!11!ELEVENTYONE!!! IT WAZ A TRAPZ0RZ!!!!!ONE!!!1!1!1!111!!!!!ELEVENTYONE!!!!!"

So in case you guys haven't heard...

---

SB, I didn't replace Beefster, Thor did. I was in that game from the start, nailing scum's asses to the wall (of course, after I policy lynched an idiot).

---

Everyone who is just focusing on meta right now deserves a pimp slap upside the head. Especially because half of you are meta-ing people wrong, or at least appearing to.

[AGar]

@AGar, I was otherwise occupied but it's nice to know you care I guess? Did you know that StrangerCoug suggested the setup when you asked his feeling about balance? I sort of think that if you did you'd know the answer to that question based on what he said in the Open Game suggestion thread.

I knew two things:

1) SC had designed the setup. He said he had in the thread, and I had asked a question in the queue which led to his getting paged.
2) Some people (including yourself) had mentioned in the thread that the setup looked as if it favored mafia.

That's all I knew. I was fishing for certain responses in his answer. I did not get them.

[AGar]

Oh god, games are blurring. I just searched through a thread desperately for 45 minutes while looking for a post I made to Troll... X.X

[AGar]

Hey guys, Assuming that I can count correctly, SV is at L-2. No OMG I DIDN'T KNOW THAT WAS THE HAMMER OH NOES please. Especially since some people haven't even made a serious/non-RQS post yet.

So true.

However, going over the votes, it seems like Zajnet has been voting opportunisticly. The first vote is to continue a wagon on AGar. He is the fourth vote on this, saying to wagon the lurker. He then votes Shattered Viewpoint, joining the now popular wagon.

This is true as well.

And given SV's new explanation and the speed of the wagon . . .

Unvote, Vote: Zajnet

(Yes, I know this is my second bandwagony vote.)

The irony is killing me...

An opportunist voting for another opportunist.

[AGar]

Ugh I keep thinking SC = Serial Clergyman, not StrangerCoug...

Anyways, I don't like SV's reactions thus far, but I'm with PE. Not meriting of a lynch.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ConfidAnon

I really don't like that vote for an opportunist by an opportunist. If Player X commits action A and is found scummy, Player Y committing action A as well should be found scummy as well.

[AGar]

@MOD: Votecount would be lovely. Thanks, Zeets.

[AGar]

@AGar, would you care to share what you were fishing for from StrangerCoug? I take it that his not giving it wasn't that much of a scum tell for you (if any) given that you're vote has stayed put.

I was looking for (for lack of a better term) bedside manner. I got logic and numbers, for the most part. I figured he might just slip into explaining a little too much why town is going to be alright and why the setup is balanced for X and Y reasons. I wasn't expecting too much, but I had just come out of the hospital and I was looking to gain anything to get my footing in the game.

[AGar]

I'm amazed at how many people haven't heard of the scum skimming tell... It was one of the first things I was introduced to, just decided it isn't worthwhile. I've finally decided to delve into it and really look at it since more people are focusing on it as the game progresses.

The theory is thus: scum tend to skim because they don't need to read everything because they're just out to pick at things that they can in turn poke and prod at to force more mistakes and slips out of people. They don't need to know every bit of information, just enough to cause problems and divert attention.

I feel the meta has shifted away from the tell, thus rendering it useless, as I feel more and more scum play a meticulous, planned out game, and the site's town meta is shifting towards pore over every claim or soft-claim, so scum need to read more in order to stay alert and make sure nothing is going to slip by and ruin their plans.

A lot of players in this game are generally more experienced players, and thus more likely to use advanced game tactics and strategies beyond the simple bussing and such, so I think that SV's intended application of the tell is an ill-advised move to try and garner reads off of players who are unlikely to succumb to such a strategy and I think SV is coming from a town angle at this point in time.

[AGar]

Agar, thanks for answering the question for SV.

I did no such thing. People have been talking about the tell for about 4 pages now. I had ignored it, feeling it was better reserved for MD. But people keep trying to nail SV for it, and honestly, most people haven't heard of it. I pointed out what I knew about it, why I felt it was null and why I felt that SV was coming from a town angle. He may have a completely different perspective, and he obviously does if he feels it's a legitimate tell. So he still has his own answer to the question.

@ConfidAnon - That's all you have to say? How about you start putting some effort into the game?

[AGar]

@ConfidAnon - That's all you have to say? How about you start putting some effort into the game?

I'm not that great at this game, I'm trying to get better. Walls of text and deep intellectual arguments - not my forte. What I noticed in the thread was summed up in Sotty7's post. So I agreed with it. How am I not putting "effort" into this game when my thoughts have been summed up by someone else's post?

Because you haven't posted a single thought of your own in this game yet, just opportunistically hopped on bandwagons (one of which, you hopped on because a player was himself being opportunistic) and posted "I agree with X."

[AGar]

Hmm.. LALurkers isn't my style.

Enigma is definitely leaning scummy. But I much prefer ConfidAnon's hypocrisy.

[AGar]

Because you haven't posted a single thought of your own in this game yet, just opportunistically hopped on bandwagons (one of which, you hopped on because a player was himself being opportunistic) and posted "I agree with X."

. . . you didn't read my post, did you?

Oh I'm sorry, you used a "reaction" (crud) and an "explanation and speed of the wagon" (also crud) to justify votes. So much better..

-_-

[AGar]

@AGar, how long is it reasonable to let people go in a game without contributing?

Define "without contributing."

I think Lynch-All-Lurkers is horrifically laughable, as it's null. I think players that are actively lurking and posting fluff are a good lynch as long as something less prevalent isn't occurring in terms of scumminess. I still would rather stick to voting players who have made greater tells (fencesitting, latching without any other additional thought, contradictions), than someone who is just lurking along, actively or not. Often times I can find some of them hand-in-hand with someone who's posting fluff, though.

[AGar]

@PE - I see where you're coming from with Enigma, but I'd like to see more of what he does to figure if he's scummy yet. ConfidAnon's given me plenty already.

[AGar]

@Troll - Ok, I'm seeing what you're saying here. I'm keeping an eye on Tumescense, although I do believe that that post was simply to avoid a mod-kill.

[AGar]

Oh I'm sorry, you used a "reaction" (crud) and an "explanation and speed of the wagon" (also crud) to justify votes. So much better..

-_-

Not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about where I said "I'm not that great at this game, I'm trying to get better. Walls of text and deep intellectual arguments - not my forte. What I noticed in the thread was summed up in Sotty7's post. So I agreed with it. "

I understand why you'd call me scummy, but there's no need to be a douche about it.

Playing the newbie card gets no sympathy points from me, as it seems that's what you're getting at.

Oh. And AGar, Confid's recent reaction to Enigma has gotten me thinking you may be right. I still feel Enigma is more likely scum though.

I don't get it.

If I don't say anything, I'm not contributing.

If I do say something, I'm suspicious.

What is there that I can do without getting voted? (Honest question.)

-_-

I'm not answering that, honest question or not.

[AGar]

I have a good gut read on people....spidey sense is saying there is scum there.

Links to games where this is true?

I don't trust "gut reads" unless someone has proof that they tend to have a good gut for reading people.

[AGar]

@CKD - I see your gut, it's ok. I can go with that.

I disagree that Day 1 is completely a gut vote, but that's playstyle differences I guess. I tend to stray from my gut on D1, I'd rather push at players for what I find to be common tells that I've seen (think I've outlined this in the thread already), and then I rely on gut later on in the game.

Sotty, your 218 strikes me as ironic. In your 209, you quote a post from Troll and ask who his biggest suspect of the active players is. In the same post you quoted, no more than two lines down, Troll outlines a list of people he'd be happy with lynching (generally means suspecting that person), one of whom has maintained a decent activity level throughout the game.

EBWONinjaPreview:

So, you've had some 56 hours to read 10? pages since you last posted, and that's all you've got...

[AGar]

First part of 237 is piquing my interest.... Hmmm.

[AGar]

@Enigma - I'm honestly not following the connection made by SC. By my wholly awful math (I'm a music major, after all), there are 16 possible combinations. Now some could overlap, I'm sure (but I don't want to do the math, my brain will shut down), but there's really no way to know what the setup is until all the PRs die or the end of the game, no?

---

Sotty's right - setup speculation isn't helping us right now, just distracting us.

There should be more CA wagonners, obv.

[AGar]

I need to re-read a past game of mine, but I may be ready to also endorse a Troll wagon if no steam gets behind a CA wagon. Also willing to highlight points of the CA wagon, if anyone needs (although his ISO should take all of 5 minutes).

[AGar]

Not much has changed. Still voting Enigma. Still waiting for everyone else to do the same.

ConfidAnon wagon is so much better, SV. You know it, too.

[AGar]

sb999's post looks pretty opportunistic to me. And it adds up with tumescence's post... more or less.

HoS: silverbullet999

Opportunistic? What?

I'm sorry, but opportunistic usually indicates hopping on a leading wagon and forwarding something that's already got a bit of steam. The ConfidAnon wagon currently consists of me, PaltryExcuse and now Silverbullet. He left a wagon tied for the lead to hop on it, and now the Zajnet wagon is leading, with ConfidAnon, Enigma and Shattered Viewpoint all jockeying behind with 3 votes apiece.

Also, I find it interesting that you feel ConfidAnon is posting content... Can you outline this? I can look at his iso and find opportunistic voting on two wagons, no real content, a lot of "I agree with X" and attempting to play the newbie card when called out on that. Where is this content-producing that I'm missing?

[AGar]

Eh. Opportunistic isn't really the right word. I probably should have just gone with his post seeming odd to me, as well as seeing a possible connection with tumescence. I tend to get too caught up in providing good reasons.

But seriously, why hasn't anyone talked about tumescence?

I'm not big on the LALurker policy. Not really my thing. My best suggestion is that if it really becomes a problem, we take advantage of the BaM ruleset and if she doesn't post, we don't ask for a prod and let her get modkilled. Why waste a lynch?

[AGar]

@AGar: it's not the lurking that makes tumescence scummy. It's the town read that he pulled out of nowhere. It seems like something a noob would do, which is odd considering he's been around since 2008...

Ok, I see that then.

PE, I think you're overreacting to Zaj just a bit. He moved his vote to push a wagon forward, which is somewhat scummy, yes, but we do need the votes to move forward, and he'd be getting the same reaction, if not more negatively, if he self-voted.

SC is either misreading or misrepresenting here. And the iso shows me I'm suspicious of SC. Very cleverly masking most of his posts, but most of them have either been theory discussion or provoking players for scumtells that aren't really scumtells. Dodging questions isn't really as scummy as you made it out to be. It can be scummy in context, but in this case, the questions were all but useless and answering them or not really isn't indicative of alignment. Useless RQS questions and the responses are about as useful of a dice random vote and the follow up. Beefster received FoSes twice, once for "modkill fishing" (no sense of humor, obviously) and once for "fallacious behavior" because Beefster didn't believe that a scumtell was a scumtell and had never seen it and he said thus.

His mentioning of there being a ninja and a roleblocker really struck me as odd, because I didn't see the connection between the posts he was quoting and the result, and he has yet to elaborate on this. He is making suspicions based on a certain part of the setup existing, and openly admits to thus.

I'm confident in my vote on ConfidAnon, and plan on sticking it there, but SC is getting major looks right now.

[AGar]

@SC - Ok, understood. And the misinterpreting/misrepresenting thing was about Zaj asking why he's scummy for his random vote on me, then you mentioning his vote on SV. The claiming thing makes sense now. I was really fucking confused, to be honest.

[AGar]

I can't say I'm completely displeased with Zajnet. I just hope that people don't completely forget Confid.

Sotty - you've seen the behavior before you say. I'm assuming you mean with Confid as Town. Have you seen Confid play as scum before? Is his behavior different, the same? Radically changing?

[AGar]

I would prefer a 48 hour deadline for the scum quicktopic discussion falling on weekdays over weekends also.

The fuck?

I'm not sure what to make of this other than head-scratching and not feeling confident about it...

[AGar]

I'm also very much in favor of an Enigma lynch right now.

That whole post reeks of scum to me. "He announced V/LA, so obviously it's ok to hammer."

[AGar]

EBWOTP: And by right now, I mean for tomorrow.

[AGar]

What the crap? Why would they kill someone who everyone said they would vote for for hammering?

HOW HAS EVERYONE MISSED THIS!?!?!? WTF!!?!?!?!? FU!%(#@%()@#%*()@#

Seriously. Get votes on ConfidAnon. Right. Now.

If there is one scum group who is vulnerable to make a tell like thus, it is new players.

I endorsed the wagon for reasons outlined yesterday.
Today he comes in, makes this post, and then hops on ANOTHER opportunistic bandwagon with no information (same play as D1).

DON'T BUY THE DAMN NEWB CARD.

VOTE: ConfidAnon

[AGar]

Oh and 359 is gold.

Someone accuses a wagon of having scum on it, and he turns around and calls that person scum.

Fail scum is fail.

[AGar]

Agar, what is scummy about Confid's post? I was wondering the same thing.

It's a stem-off of the "Well that sucks" tell. Alone, it's useless. But with CA's behavior and the post, it seems to be just one more scumtell.

also, please quit stealing votes wit your use of big lettering from the Chrono wagon...(you have been noted)

Huh?

@Confid, I think AGar was referring to your vote on Chrono, not your vote on me.

I know, but he ignored my vote on you in his defense.

Did you read post 351? No, didn't think so.

AGar, who are my scumpartners? You are very dead-set on me being scum, try looking outside the tunnel for answers and post some more reads.

I don't like to get ahead of myself. I've got other suspicions, but I like to play with my hand very close to my chest if I can. I can right now. I'm not tunneling, trust me.

[AGar]

I guess he does have a point about AGar- I wouldn't consider a 2009er to be a newb at this point and AGar may have been using that as an excuse.

So.. have you read the thread? The part where he asks what to do to not look scummy and the frustration? THE THINGS THAT NEWBS DO?

[AGar]

^ Newb =/= Scum

You're proving to be an idiot.

Newb != Scum

Newb + Newb Scumtell = Potential Scum

Read the thread before you make asinine posts. FFS, I said that it is a tell

likely to be used by new players

. -_-

[AGar]

@CA: You're failing at following a conversation, so don't tell me how to follow one. I'll outline it for you.

I said "This scumtell is only conditional to players who are newbs"
He said "People with 09 joindates aren't newbs."
I said "He is behaving similar to a newb - asking how to appear townie, asking what to do"
He said "Newb != scum"
I said "I know. I never said Newb = scum. I said Newb + Newb scumtell = potential scum"

So there you have the ENTIRE line of thought. Read it and quit trying to misrep my statements, both of you.

I've not ignored your defense, I'm simply not going to reply to it because your defense is an OMGUS driven counter-argument. No sense in trying to debunk it.

I've not ignored your vote on KageLord, I gave my response it's own post.

[AGar]

369 is your defense, I presume. In which you accuse me of tunneling, molding a tell and argument to fit my needs, ignoring things and try and call me out on having no other suspicions. Sure, you don't say "I'm suspicious of you!" or "Vote: AGar" but you imply it with every word.

And I have commented about the reasoning - it's shitty, laughable and scummy. Read 361. And then read it again. And again and again until you get it through your thick skull that I was addressing your vote you dolt.

FoS is just another way of saying "Wah, I want to bandwagon him but don't want to take a stand and make the first vote."

Die scum, die.

[AGar]

Hmm.

Hypocrisy from CA is great.

"Why aren't you reading my defense? Why aren't you addressing my reason for voting!"

I do. It's nothing he can poke a hole in. He stops talking about it. Completely.

In other news, if CA flips scum, Beefster is likely scum too.

There's even a scumbuddy for you CA. Go back to your guys' QT and freak out like little girls right now, I think PZ will be ok with the daytalking in this scenario.

[AGar]

Ignoring AGar for right now because it's not going to go anywhere.

Because I'm right?

You asked why I was ignoring your defense. I said it was OMGUS loaded. You claimed it wasn't. I pointed out the reasons it was.

You asked why I ignored your reason for voting. I pointed out that I hadn't, and re-iterated how I felt about it.

Why are you now choosing to ignore me?

[AGar]

mass iso?

why not just read the thread?

also, im pissed the chrono wagon died down, lets just reward lurking.

no one wants to comment on the fact that Chrono has posted 13 times since his "I dont have internet" post here......

ok, lets not call it lurking anymore, when can we call it lying?

Because we have a 2-for-1 in front of us.

I agree it's not exactly cool that Chrono is saying he's got V/LA and posting elsewhere, but I haven't been lurking the rest of the forum, so I've not seen it.

I don't think his lurking is telling though, it's pretty much found that lurking is null of alignment.

[AGar]

Oh and CA - it's not a back-and-forth unless you keep trying to make it one. You failed to address two answers to questions you asked when the response came back wasn't one you wanted to see. It seems very scummy to me.

[AGar]

ok, STOP THE WAGON NOW.

jesus christ....guess you guys want to let scum dictate your lynches.

CLAIMING BITCHES

I AM A COP

last night I got a hit on Chrono, he IS SCUM

thats right, so all you asses who blatantly ignored my case AND tried to start another wagon, have been noted...today has provided a ton of information me thinks.

and again I am right..anyone who pushes a lynch bases on "over reaction" is scum...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Chronopie

Don't agree at all with his thought process, but you know what, fuck it. What's done is done.

[AGar]

I get you're frustrated that the lynch on who you know to be scum is frustrating, but I would've personally held my lips tight and worked on gathering potentially more information with more investigations.

It's mostly a playstyle difference, nothing scummy.

[AGar]

ckd - Not sure. But odds aren't stacked in your favor. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that much out.

[AGar]

Indeed.

beefster - that's L-(-1)

[AGar]

Pretty sure the lynch happened, guys.

[AGar]

VOTE: Silverbullet999

Bells are ringing. And not in the christmas carol kind of way.

[AGar]

Hrmmm...

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Beefster

Chrono's iso showed a bit of distancing from SV, and a weak "hey, I'm going to FoS Beefster while I vote no one," and not much else.

Beefster + Confid + SV?

[AGar]

SV and drmy could be swapped in positions.

[AGar]

At this point, I'm willing to get behind a drmy, Confid or Beefster lynch. My strongest reads are on Confid and Beefster, but drmy is acting really suspect right now.

Claiming self-VI is not going to earn you townie brownies, drmy. Start playing the game and getting involved and you might.

[AGar]

SC - mine have already been stated, but Beefster and Confid. The reasons I have outlined previously, and re-hashing them yet again is going to really frustrate me. Time is money friends.

[AGar]

I just lol'd hard at the last part of Gammagooey's most recent post.

[AGar]

AGar- he seemed like he was all about pushing a wagon on CA. There can only be ONE cop, and the cop is dead. This can't really be justified as a town behavior. He's not playing as calmly and logically as I've seen him as town.

Really? You must've read the wrong games. Like, you didn't read the ones where I nail scum's ass to the wall and hound them until they're hanging from the highest branch of the tallest tree.

Don't worry, you'll see soon.

Confid is next.

Be afraid, go back to your QT and quiver in fear.

[AGar]

Equi, we're having tacos, not barbeque.

Beefster should claim, he is going to be a pancake soon. (Chopped steak?)

[AGar]

I don't like drmy throwing out "IIoA" specifically. Main reason being, I've never seen him act in a way that appears to be coherent scumhunting. Need more reading about the taco man, but for now:

VOTE: drmyshottyizsik

[AGar]

Since ~post #575, Silverbullet has gotten scummier and scummier.

Failing to see why it's important to see that he has reads, not who his reads are is obstinately anti-town.

This is not the pro-town play I've seen from him.

This is not pro-town play I've seen from anyone.

Still like my Confid suspicion, and I still like my drmy suspicions, but I'm definitely moving SB up and Equi off the list (SV slot) near completely for now.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: Silverbullet999

[AGar]

The feigned AtE and thinly veiled threats are impressive, SB.

Uh... what? I wasn't aware you had scum meta on me.

Wow put more words and/or make assumptions once again! It's typical for scum... such as yourself... to be overconfident... which is typical and nothing special. Nowhere or place have i mentioned a meta of you.

What scum meta do you have of scum being overconfident. And it did read like you had a past meta on him.

Nice misrep in 591.

Confid, baaaaaah.

Last EBWOP for the moment

This is just me playing like an SE.

Using your title as a defense is quite low...

Where was this done?

Where have i ever said, you'll be sorry for killing me!?

here

Oooh a Confid wagon! Yaaaaay. Bout time you suckers livened up.

UNVOTE:
VOTE: ConfidAnon

[AGar]

Let's see:

- Him using an SE wasn't a defense of his theories... it was about why he was telling you to buck up and scumhunt.
- Yes. The AtE does not feel genuine at all, more of a "Oh shit, I have no defense, so I'll AtE and try and scare them out of lynching me."
- You chopped the quote down to your liking to get out of scumhunting.

Here is 591. Note how you cut it off at "water" and then asked why bother scumhunting.

This is 589, which you quoted. Note that the statement you quoted continues to go on saying "until you actually call out AGar's, Equinox's and StrangerCoug's behaviors as pro-scum.

He was instigating you to scumhunt, and you turned around and twisted his quote to get out of it.

[AGar]

Here is 591. Note how you cut it off at "water" and then asked why bother scumhunting.

This is 589, which you quoted. Note that the statement you quoted continues to go on saying "until you actually call out AGar's, Equinox's and StrangerCoug's behaviors as pro-scum.

Hey I have an idea... Let's completely ignore my post before that where I address that I already called out Agar and SC behaviors...

That doesn't matter, the point is - he said one thing, you shortened it and twisted it to mean another.

Yes. The AtE does not feel genuine at all, more of a "Oh shit, I have no defense, so I'll AtE and try and scare them out of lynching me."

So me saying when I die I demand Equiscum dead... really translates to the above?

No, but you saying "When I flip town..." is not the best AtE I've seen from scum or town. You've staunchly fallen into defensive mode, but your defense has been "This person on my wagon and this person on my wagon is scummy. I don't have real reasons, so I will make them up." That's called OMGUS.

Him using an SE wasn't a defense of his theories... it was about why he was telling you to buck up and scumhunt.

Bullshit he himself said that my words are useless Even when I flip. Which he laters says nooo I meant your persuasiveness.
Or are you one to also believe that the word of a confirmed townie is worth less than one that is not?

STOP MISREPRESENTING THINGS DAMMIT.

A townie just saying "X is scum and Y is scum," means NOTHING post-flip.
A townie saying "X is scum for actions 1 and 2 and Y is scum for actions 3 and 4" gives the town something to work with.

He never said that "because I am an SE, your words are useless when you flip." He said "If you are scum, do this. If you are town, do not do this. This is me playing like an SE." Meaning, as an SE, he tries to help people avoid falling into the town trap of shutting down.

The fact that you aren't seeing this is really shocking me. I've seen you play a ridiculously pro-town game before, I don't know how you can't be grasping all of this. It's basic man. C'mon.

[AGar]

And hey, only one more scum to go, right?

Also, hey AGar, I promise this won't be a repeat of 974. <3

Two. And I hope not, from both of our perspectives, eh?

Re-reading, because I've been way off target this game.

[AGar]

Alright, I really don't have much to go on, but this game has thrown me for a complete loop so far, so my reads are wholly untrusted in my eyes.

I'm willing to give singer a shot to prove me wrong, but the slot has been very... off, and is gaining my top suspicion atm.

PE seemed like he was scumhunting at the time, but I think that was because he agreed with my Confid read. A reflection doesn't show him doing much at all. He pushed hard on SV, but for what? The unvote tell? That was essentially the backbone of his case...

Prox was utterly useless. Avoided any stances, etc etc.

The big pointer for me though, is Chrono's attitude towards PE in his big catchup post. He quickly clears PE as town, and even tries to dissuade a possible pairing of PE with someone. It doesn't add up. Then Prox parked his vote on SV while Chrono got lynched.

[AGar]

Also, I just realized we went from a tropical paradise (yay!) to Antarctica (boo!).

[AGar]

WRT Drmyshottyizsik. I don't recall seeing a claim, and unless I missed it in iso, I really don't get why that post was there.

I can definitely get behind that wagon, I had been suspicious of him in earlier days.

VOTE: drmyshottyizsik

@SS: I'm just saying the slot itself gives me a bad vibe. You could completely change that, we'll see.

[AGar]

Ok, I like what I'm seeing so far from SS. Very good start. I'll pore through it more when I have time later tonight.

Also, it's D5. I think it warrants some VC analysis, which I will also be doing tonight.

[AGar]

I have a headache from another game.

Like legit headache. VC analysis will come when I get to it.

[AGar]

For the record, the D1 VC analysis was showing me a TON.

Then the site crashed on me and I lost it.

Starting from scratch again.

[AGar]

Day 1 Votecount Analysis

Note: All VC #s exclude the first votecount of each day, as no votes are cast. So Votecount D1.1 is actually the 2nd votecount of Day 1.

D1.1 - 1d 9h 25m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(1): smashbro_of_the_SSS
2. KageLord (1):

Beefster

3.

Chronopie

(0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Austin Newman (Gammagooey) (0):
6.

AGar

(4): silverbullet999,

Enigma

,

Zorblag

,

Zajnet

7.

Zajnet

(1): PaltryExcuse (singersigner)
8.

Zorblag

(2):

curiouskarmadog

,

Sotty7

9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (0):
10.

Enigma

(1):

Chronopie

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(1): StrangerCoug
15.

Sotty7

(1):

AGar

16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(1):

ConfidAnon

18. silverbullet999 (1):

Col.Cathart

Players not voting: KageLord, Austin Newman (Gammagooey), tumescence (drmyshottyizsik),

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

RVS shenanigans, nothing to take from this that I can see.

D1.2 - 1d 42m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(1): smashbro_of_the_SSS
2. KageLord (1):

Beefster

3.

Chronopie

(0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(4): silverbullet999,

Enigma

,

Zorblag

,

Zajnet

7.

Zajnet

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(1):

curiouskarmadog

9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (0):
10.

Enigma

(1):

Chronopie

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(2): PaltryExcuse (singersigner),

Sotty7

15.

Sotty7

(2):

AGar

, Gammagooey
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (1): StrangerCoug
17.

curiouskarmadog

(1):

ConfidAnon

18. silverbullet999 (2):

Col.Cathart

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

Players not voting: KageLord, tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

Still RVS, still nothing gained that I can see.

D1.3 - 2d 20h 46m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (1):

Zorblag

3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(1):

AGar

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(1):

Enigma

7.

Zajnet

(4): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Beefster

,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (0):
10.

Enigma

(1): PaltryExcuse (singersigner)
11. StrangerCoug (1): Gammagooey
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (1):

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(5):

Sotty7

,

Col.Cathart

, silverbullet999,

Zajnet

,

Chronopie

15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: KageLord, tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

Oh hey look, something worth noting. Here we see the wagon on SV gain 4 votes in under 3 days. One is definitely scum (Chrono), but a wagon usually doesn't grow that fast mostly off of townies, at least not that I've seen.

D1.4 - 18h 8m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (1):

Zorblag

3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(1):

AGar

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(1):

Enigma

7.

Zajnet

(4): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Beefster

,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (0):
10.

Enigma

(2): PaltryExcuse (singersigner), Gammagooey
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (1):

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(5):

Sotty7

,

Col.Cathart

, silverbullet999,

Zajnet

,

Chronopie

15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: KageLord, tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

This is where the gettings are good. The votecount almost completely freezes, the only change being Gamma getting onto Enigma and off of SC. However, in this 18 hour period, all but Troll (scum), Chrono (scum), Col.Cathart (town), Supersmash and SC posted. I have a town read on SC, so if there was oblivious scum it would be Supersmash, but I don't see that as highly likely right now. Tume posted, but that post was another empty promise post - I could see Tume scum missing the opportunity to push the wagon further. Also, I think that just points more to SBscum on the wagon. Also, Gamma gets townpoints, switching to a different wagon. Gamma-scum could also easily have tried to hop on the wagon to push it further without much harm.

D1.5 - 1d 5h 40m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (0):
3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(1):

AGar

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(1):

Enigma

7.

Zajnet

(4): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Beefster

,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (1):

Zorblag

10.

Enigma

(5): PaltryExcuse (singersigner), Gammagooey,

Col.Cathart

, silverbullet999,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(3):

Sotty7

,

Zajnet

,

Chronopie

15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: KageLord, tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

More juicy goodness! SV wagon collapses. Enigma wagon starts rolling. Common denominator? SB. Wagon gains 3 votes in a little over a day. Two are confirmed town. I don't see three townies pushing that wagon forward from it's current spot.

D1.6 - 2d 7m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (0):
3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(2):

AGar

, PaltryExcuse (singersigner)
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
7.

Zajnet

(4): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug, KageLord
8.

Zorblag

(1):

Enigma

9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (2):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

10.

Enigma

(4): Gammagooey,

Col.Cathart

, silverbullet999,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(3):

Sotty7

,

Zajnet

,

Chronopie

15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

PE follows me to Confid, Beefster moves to Tume and not much else happens. I'd like to note that Troll could have been looking for an easy bus in Tume, using his target the lurker meta to further it. In the 2 day span, Troll, Chrono and SSS were the only 3 to not post. Again, I think it's unlikely that

3

scum were lurking away here.

D1.7 - 2d 14h 4m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (0):
3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(5):

AGar

, PaltryExcuse (singersigner), silverbullet999,

Zajnet

,

Enigma

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
7.

Zajnet

(5): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug, KageLord,

Sotty7

8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (2):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

10.

Enigma

(4): Gammagooey,

Col.Cathart

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

,

Chronopie

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: tumescence (drmyshottyizsik)

Again, a wagon gets 3 votes in 2 1/2 days. Again, 2 townies + SB hop on. I'm starting to see a pattern here.

D1.8 - 9h 28m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (0):
3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(5):

AGar

, PaltryExcuse (singersigner), silverbullet999,

Zajnet

,

Enigma

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
7.

Zajnet

(9): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug, KageLord,

Sotty7

,

Zorblag

,

Beefster

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

, drmyshottyizsik
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. tumescence (drmyshottyizsik) (0):
10.

Enigma

(2): Gammagooey,

Col.Cathart

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting:

Chronopie

Alright, here's more good stuff. The Zaj wagon takes off, gaining 4 votes in 9 1/2 hours. Troll comes in and hops on, while Beef and SV pile on, and drmy is the last. Drmy's timing looks like him trying to get on while the wagon is still growing steam but spaced a good distance from Troll-scum.

D1.F - 1d 1h 44m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (0):
3.

Chronopie

(1):

curiouskarmadog

4.

ConfidAnon

(5):

AGar

, PaltryExcuse (singersigner), silverbullet999,

Zajnet

, Gammagooey
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
7.

Zajnet

(10): smashbro_of_the_SSS,

ConfidAnon

, StrangerCoug, KageLord,

Sotty7

,

Zorblag

,

Beefster

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

, drmyshottyizsik,

Enigma

8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (0):
10.

Enigma

(1):

Col.Cathart

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting:

Chronopie

Final VC of Day 1 - Gamma gets onto Confid. Enigma gets off Confid and hammers.

We all know what happens N1 - Enigma dies.

[AGar]

After Day 1 VC analysis, I'm leaning towards a SB/drmy duo.

Moving on to Day 2.

[AGar]

D2.1 - 4d 3h 58m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (1):

ConfidAnon

3.

Chronopie

(4):

curiouskarmadog

, Gammagooey, StrangerCoug,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

4.

ConfidAnon

(1):

AGar

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (1):

Beefster

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(3):

Sotty7

, PaltryExcuse (singersigner), smashbro_of_the_SSS
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. PaltryExcuse (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting:

Col.Cathart

, KageLord,

Chronopie

,

Zorblag

, drmyshottyizsik, silverbullet999

A very telling first VC. The first wagon that builds is on Chrono. Troll (scum), Chrono (scum), SB and drmy all hang back. Watch what happens in the next VC.

D2.2 - 1d 19h 9m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (1):

ConfidAnon

3.

Chronopie

(2):

curiouskarmadog

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

4.

ConfidAnon

(4):

AGar

, StrangerCoug, Gammagooey, silverbullet999
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (1):

Beefster

11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(3):

Sotty7

, Prox (singersigner), smashbro_of_the_SSS
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting:

Col.Cathart

, KageLord,

Chronopie

,

Zorblag

, drmyshottyizsik

Oh look, a counter-wagon on Confid (town) gets some steam and SB is right there following. Chrono, Troll and drmy still hang back.

D2.F - 3d 4h 52m elapsed since prior VC

1.

Col.Cathart

(0):
2. KageLord (1):

ConfidAnon

3.

Chronopie

(9):

curiouskarmadog

,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

, drmyshottyizsik, StrangerCoug,

Sotty7

, Gammagooey, silverbullet999,

AGar

,

Zorblag

4.

ConfidAnon

(3): KageLord,

Chronopie

,

Beefster

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (0):
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(0):
14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(2): Prox (singersigner), smashbro_of_the_SSS
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
17.

curiouskarmadog

(0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting:

Col.Cathart

Final VC of Day 2. Zorblag hammers away his partner. Prox, Smash and Kage all absent from when CKD claims until hammer. Null on them, although I think that scum all got on. Drmy made a complete contradiction to his earlier stance in the day by just hopping on the Chrono wagon and not posting afterwords once CKD claimed. Looks like scum trying to get the early bus in. SB also hops on as soon as possible with little to no discussion about the claim, just a vote and some fluff.

N2 CKD perished, no surprise with his claim.

D2 was short. Still leaning towards SB/drmy. Prox/PE slot gets a few minor scumlooks for picking SV wagon over Chrono at beginning of the day, but they were 2nd on, so it wasn't really an established counterwagon needing fuel, and the slot stayed off of Confid when it gained steam.

[AGar]

-Agar

I like what your doing, keep it up as it's quite good.
However I'm going to have to retort your point about the SV wagon.
You may have forgotten buy SV started his attack on me claiming a supposed meta that I was not following.
He essentially dug himself a small hole with his attack on me.

The speed of the wagon looked scum driven. The other 3 votes are confirmed alignment, and 2 of them are town. The scum vote is the last on. Explain the discrepancy. Note I'm not completely looking in context here, mostly just patterns.

[AGar]

Also maybe it's just me

A very telling first VC. The first wagon that builds is on Chrono. Troll (scum), Chrono (scum), SB and drmy all hang back. Watch what happens in the next VC.

but it seems that you... for the most part are somewhat tunneling bud. Your completely ignoring that kage is also sitting back here and

Oh look, a counter-wagon on Confid (town) gets some steam and SB is right there following. Chrono, Troll and drmy still hang back.

here

Kage didn't have a pattern of hopping on building wagons. You did. Drmy proved scummy with his actions in D1 and there was justification in the patterns for him.

[AGar]

D3/D4 will come tomorrow. I'm shot right now.

[AGar]

@AGar-I really like your VC analysis so far but I'm most interested in what you think of the day 3 Troll/drmyshotty votes. If it weren't for that I'd agree with you on the drmyshotty/silver scumteam but your analysis points a lot to silver/Kage if you take drmyshotty out of the picture- at the end of the day one on one big wagon of d1 one on the other, with both not voting Chrono until the cop claim d2 and both getting on the Confid wagon before that happened.

Hmmm.... That's a good point. Kage and SB never end up on the same votee, and Kage actually completely avoids the Chrono vote. I know he didn't post, but he could've come in and seen the wagon building and decided to not post. I dunno, a bunch of dangerous thinking there, but still worth noting.

We'll see what D3/D4 turns up tomorrow.

[AGar]

[offtopic]You playing SC2?[/offtopic]

[AGar]

Day 3

For the confirmation bias/tunneling discussion - I look for the scum motivation behind a vote, nothing else. So I either see something as scummy or I don't see anything at all. Capiche?

D3.1 - 2d 23h 22m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (3):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

, StrangerCoug
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(4): Gammagooey,

AGar

, drmyshottyizsik,

ConfidAnon

14.

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: KageLord, smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Shattered Viewpoint (Equinox)

,

Sotty7

, Prox (singersigner), silverbullet999

Alright, D3 kickoff! Woo! Let's go! Two wagons emerge rather quickly. At this point, it was 7 to lynch. A Zorblag-driven wagon on drmy emerges. Note that troll has been pushing at this wagon the entire time. The other wagon is on Beefster. drmy getting a head-start in the day makes sense - Trollscum pushing it. Beefster looks a little off, but it got weird support. Again, I still don't see Gammascum, so if anything, drmyscum is on it, but his vote wasn't a self-saving vote.

D3.2 - 1d 21h 47m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (3):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

, StrangerCoug
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(5): Gammagooey,

AGar

, drmyshottyizsik,

ConfidAnon

, KageLord
14.

Equinox

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Equinox

,

Sotty7

, Prox (singersigner), silverbullet999

Yay only one more vote being cast. Beefster wagon grows by one. SB sits back, oddly enough. Prox doesn't post. Smash doesn't give a full post. There's scum logic on the SB sitting back, letting the town wagon roll without getting on it and not pushing to bus drmy. Kage's furthering vote could definitely be of a drmy/Kage scumpair though - giving a safety net of keeping 2 votes ahead on drmy. Augh.

D3.3 - 1d 15h 13m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (3):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

, StrangerCoug
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(6): Gammagooey,

AGar

, drmyshottyizsik,

ConfidAnon

, KageLord,

Equinox

14.

Equinox

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: smashbro_of_the_SSS,

Sotty7

, Prox (singersigner), silverbullet999

Wagon gains a town vote when Equi finishes reads. I reallly dislike the SB not voting though posting multiple times and being on the up and up of the game. It really really looks like scum trying to let a wagon roll while staying off of it.

D3.F - 3h 19m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(0):
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (3):

Zorblag

,

Beefster

, StrangerCoug
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
13.

Beefster

(7): Gammagooey,

AGar

, drmyshottyizsik,

ConfidAnon

, KageLord,

Equinox

,

Sotty7

14.

Equinox

(0):
15.

Sotty7

(0):
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
18. silverbullet999 (0):

Players not voting: smashbro_of_the_SSS, Prox (singersigner), silverbullet999

Sotty lays the hammer, SSS expresses intent. SB doesn't post. Didn't realize Prox posted at all during said gameday. D3 opens up more looking into Kage-scum though.

[AGar]

Day 4

D4.1 - 2d 10h 38m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (1): drmyshottyizsik
4.

ConfidAnon

(2):

Equinox

,

AGar

5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (0):
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
14.

Equinox

(1): silverbullet999
16. Prox (singersigner) (1): Gammagooey
18. silverbullet999 (3): KageLord, StrangerCoug,

ConfidAnon

Players not voting:

Zorblag

, smashbro_of_the_SSS, Prox (singersigner)

Ok, so here goes.. SB wagon takes off, with Kage hopping on, followed by SC and Confid. SB starts off on Equi, in what I can only assume to be OMGUS-fueled fits of rage. Smash lurks without a vote or post. Prox has requested replacement. We all know what happens to Troll. Two scum lurking around. Drmy bussing Kage? Se possible.

D4.F - 1d 12m elapsed since prior VC

2. KageLord (0):
4.

ConfidAnon

(6):

Equinox

,

AGar

, Gammagooey, smashbro_of_the_SSS, drmyshottyizsik, StrangerCoug
5. Gammagooey (0):
6.

AGar

(0):
8.

Zorblag

(0):
9. drmyshottyizsik (0):
11. StrangerCoug (0):
12. smashbro_of_the_SSS (0):
14.

Equinox

(1): silverbullet999
16. Prox (singersigner) (0):
18. silverbullet999 (2): KageLord,

ConfidAnon

Players not voting:

Zorblag

, Prox (singersigner)

Let's see. SB plants on Equi, Kage plants on SB. Drmy gets on Confid at the last possible minute without hammering. So does Smash.

D4 is done.

Top 3 are Kage, drmy and SB. Smash drew a few pings with that last VC. SB looked really bad in D1/D2, but has looked a bit better D3/D4. Kage looked null in D1/D2, but really thrusted himself into the scumlight on D3 and followed up with a strong performance D4. Drmy's slot lurked for like 3 game days, he came in and was instantly just playing bad. Not sure where to stand fully on it, but it doesn't look good. Kage/Drmy trying hard to cross bus at times?

Iso's for the 4. Other three players are prob-town. Also NK analysis is useful at this time.

Also, I think it's time for a mass-claim, we've had 10 flips. 8 of us are alive, and we can narrow the setup down to 4 possibilities. I'm volunteering to start if the majority approves. It forces scum to either gamble on a false-claim without any real communication with their partner beforehand, and it will set everyone into a position from here on out. I have a list of what we should see without any false-claims in each scenario, I can guess pretty well if we see anything, and it could theoretically weed out some people from the mislynch pool. Any objections?

[AGar]

/off topic...should be studying...

It forces scum to either gamble on a false-claim without any real communication with their partner beforehand, and it will set everyone into a position from here on out. I have a list of what we should see without any false-claims in each scenario, I can guess pretty well if we see anything, and it could theoretically weed out some people from the mislynch pool. Any objections?

The only flaw I can see in this is that if the last two are in two separate factions, forcing them to false-claim wouldn't really throw them off that much. Oh, and if by chance you're mafia, you're really just setting yourself up to not fail.

And don't count my opinion. It's not much of one anyway, lol. Like I said in our last game together, I think you're smart, so I would trust your analysis of what happens if we mass-claim (assuming you're not mafia).

One faction this game, so we're at 6:2 right now.

We'll do popcorn, not alphabetically. Anyone have an opposition to me starting then popcorning out?

[AGar]

Precisely what singersigner said. It avoids having everyone just claim at random. (Cold hands... typing is difficult and semi-painful atm).

[AGar]

If we're starting a mass-claim...

UNVOTE:

Also, I'll be on sometime this afternoon. If no one objects by then, I'll start with my claim.

[AGar]

OH Fuck, nevermind.

Guys. uh.

DEADLINE IS TONIGHT.

I'll begin.

I'm a Vanilla Townie. Drmy, go next. LET'S BE FUCKING QUICK PEOPLE.

[AGar]

At work, movile vote. With this info scum have 2 goons. I was hoping for tracker and watcher to hopefully clear some players, or catch scum with only a watcher or a tracker claim . Oh well.

VOTE: silverbulltet

Hope a lynch is reached.

[AGar]

Well there's the lynch. Let's see what tomorrow brings.

[AGar]

... Why did you self-hammer? If you're town, you do realize that by self-hammering you put us in mylo tomorrow, right? If today had been a no-lynch, at least tomorrow wouldn't be mylo (though the hopefully 2 days after would be).

Woo mobile twilight posting!

This post is terribad.

This is one of very few situations where a town self-hammer is a good thing, ensuring a lynch happens. The information we gain is much greater than not being in mylo tomorrow.

Don't worry scum, we'll get to you in due time.

[AGar]

This is one of very few situations where a town self-hammer is a good thing, ensuring a lynch happens. The information we gain is much greater than not being in mylo tomorrow.

Could you explain this in fuller detail if you're still alive when you get this?

The info we gain from the lynch is valuable in voting patterns and who pushed for lynches, the same as it always is.

If we weren't to lynch, scum would have a kill, we'd have no info, and we'd be in LYLO at the same time. MYLO is a waste, in my opinion, and if we had not lynched today, it would've been as if we were in MYLO today. Only this time we control one more death rather than scum. We don't let the scum dictate the direction we take tomorrow, we dictate how they go tonight.

[AGar]

Zito can confirm, but we were playing 2s one night after I died on SC2 and he told me Gamma was scum, and I pretty much shit a brick.

WP Gamma.

I didn't suspect Smash because he really just lurked mostly. I tend to ignore lurkers, which is probably a flaw, but outside of BaM it gets fixed by replacements.

Town was generally lost this game, I noted. CP lynch came by way of cop investigation and Troll got MKed. Not really successful at picking out scum.

[AGar]

I dunno how I feel about the setup.

I think large setups with just one killing party benefit scum inherently, as the odds of hitting scum don't increase by leaps and bounds each day, but at the same time, it gives scum more time to slip. Mathematically it's a scum-favored setup, I think, but theoretically it should be balanced with baseline play.

I still disagree with CKD's play as a cop, but I think that's simply a difference in play style.

[AGar]

Papa you already know I love you right?

Yar.

Glad everyone had fun. Also yeah I don't think this setup really works.

Terran OP.