Mini 980 - Trader Mafia (Game Over)

[farside22]

Hey I'm back from my trip but a bit busy right now. I hope to have something tonight but most likely won't be able to concentrate till tomorrow.

[farside22]

I have one question. How the heck does anyone in this game make money. What I see is town makes $20. every game day but spends money to get abilities. You can get a loan but that just puts you in debt. When someone is about to be lynched you spend 100 minimum. From what I can tell crunching the numbers unless you spend absolutely nothing trying to make 1000 by the end of the game is close to impossible.

[farside22]

Since we can't unvote, is anyone against a FoS count to replace normal vote counts?

No objection. This will work well and I don't mind keeping a count of fos's if people want.

[farside22]

Looking at this game. those who are bidding on the NK should explain who they are and why they are bidding on the item.
The NK should be used by someone we think is town and who they shot should be talked about as well.
There will be someone who will try to get the body armor. I think that, the cop and any other ability should be avoided, but discussing the nk ability is more for the town side then allowing the scum to have it and control it.

[farside22]

This is an interesting idea in a similar vein to controlling a confirmed vigilante. My only qualms with it is that it relies pretty heavily on the honor system, and mafia isn't exactly known for that kind of thing. I am absolutely not against discussing it though, of course!

Yeah but if someone doesn't shoot who the town suggest then that player is scum or better have a good reason for shooting said player. (I assume scum first)
Town controlls the kill and the lynch = town win.

[farside22]

Mod: Does the mafia group come with their own kill ability? I assume all mafia has a kill ability unless otherwise informed.

[farside22]

The ONLY ability that Mafia have to start is the ability to daytalk with their partner. They do not start with the power to kill.

Reading is tech

God I'm brain dead. That's most helpful.
So yeah my idea to discuss who has the NK and how to use it = town win.

[farside22]

Interigued.
First I think wiring money to someone just because of a claim would be down right stupid for the town.
However anyone that counters the amount I would like an explination on why.
Zajent: How best would you use this ability if you gained it? Would you save it or use it night 1? Would you allow the town to reach a majority on who best to kill?

[farside22]

Zajent: How best would you use this ability if you gained it? Would you save it or use it night 1? Would you allow the town to reach a majority on who best to kill?

I would kill whoever the town wants me to. If I don't, then lynch me. Although, to avoid situations, I'd like if the town would give me a short-list of 2 to 4 people.

Actually this would work well and fail. Things we need to be concerned with.
1) I want to wait till the bidding is over but I can see where there could be one flaw with my view of making the vig chose a player.
Till the bidding is over I will except a list and views from you if you gain this ability on who you think is scum.
2) Body Armor at this point if bought buy anyone will be scum in my view.
With only one kill controlled by town the only people who have to worry about protection is scum.
I will wait till the bidding is over before more details of my plan on this but lets say Zajent is scum for the sake of argument. If he shoot anyone but who the town says he's lynched so the benifit for him as scum to shot anyone else will result in a loss for him.

[farside22]

@fishy: Don't forget someone is trying to buy that body armor right now. If (and I suspect it is at this poing) scum buying it and Zajent targets said play it's a waste. Same idea with the doc ability.
I didn't think about the scum not having a kill without buying it so there is an advantage to certain aspects in this game.

[farside22]

@farside: aiming for body armoured scum is always possible; the only disadvantage of us aiming a vig is if the scum know that they need to doc their partner.

Even then, they would probably do that anyway. So yeah, aiming a vig seems to have no drawbacks atm.

Actually.......let me wait till the bid is over but I have a thought and your right about the body armor. I think the scum with a doc could lead to WIFOM.
Lets just hope zajent gets the NK. If a player doesnt' say they bid on it we assume then (most likely correctly) that scum has the NK.
I do agree that having a cop is important and so far one person has bid on the immune thing. I suspect scum there as well.

[farside22]

Scum most likely are bidding on that NK and borrowing or wiring each other as much as possible. With 2 scum groups going on I hope they duke it out until they hit poverty.
hmmm I need to think about a few things more.

[farside22]

Investigation immunity could be someone trying to keep things like that away from scum; I know that before the idea of controlling the NKs was thrown around, I was thinking of similar strategies, buying scum-oriented powers to keep them away from scum.

I thought about this too. I just remember seeing it at 0 for the longest time. For it suddenly to have a bid just seemed scummy to me. Like someone knows they will be investigated or already is concerned.

##vote: SaintKerrigan

Where are you during this discussion and thought process?

[farside22]

I'm actually thinking farside is right about discussing these things - better to leave it until after the bidding.

I don't mind the discussion on the NK by the way and who is buying it. I think that is the most important thing. Also any cop worth their salt should be warned that someone did bid on the investigation immunity and just because you get an innocent on someone doesn't mean town.

[farside22]

God the timing on this sucks. My computer was down for half the day.
I'm going on the assumption scum has the NK with the amount of money spent and the pick pocket.
SK's vote on fishy makes no sense. In my view flashstorm had the worst idea out there. SK didn't even say he had an idea.

[farside22]

Sorry I see now he did say flashstorm.
Still people who didn't discuss the set up and were "not around" to talk about it are on my top scum list

[farside22]

andrius>my big idea failed thanks to computer issues.
Since a player is not claiming to have bought the NK I assume scum.
Fishy why would you assume scum would buy the double vote ability. That is strong but I think scum was focas on those that sold for much higher.
Zang: Why is fishy worthy of a vote?

[farside22]

Andrius: I not going to WIFOM all the roles that were bought. Some where bought relatively cheap.
I don't want to see a cop or doc outted at this point.

[farside22]

Last time VV was that back and forth in responses he flipped scum. I may join that wagon. I'm still waiting to see anything town from SK who is posting nothing at all this game. Actively lurking is a big flag I'm not letting go of.

[farside22]

Zang why did you vote on Jack?

I think several abilities here are scumtells. Most obviously investigation immunity and the unclaimed NK, but also double vote. The reason for my focus on that is that we can find out who they are.

This doesn't explain why only someone scum would buy a double vote.

[farside22]

VV: Why do you find Jack scummy? Sum it up for me here.
SPS: Be more useful or be voted on by me.

Mod: Prod SK with a big stick please

SK is on V/LA until Sunday morning

[farside22]

Seriously? (this is at VV) You think scum would buy the DV and then vote themselves?

unvote
##vote: VasudeVa

fos fishy and SK

[farside22]

@farside: I really think that scum are more likely to bid for a double vote than town - is that what you are Fossing me over?

I think your reasoning for thinking it is flawed. With the game as it's going and the NK and pick pocket being what sold the highest saying anyone who purchase the DV as being more likely scum is just dumb. I think the DV and who bought it is a null tell. I bid on it myself to keep it from scum hands and no one was thinking about it at the time.
Jack either bought it to help his scum team or had the same thought of trying to keep it from the scum.

[farside22]

Why do you think both Fish and Vas could be scum? From the way they've butt heads I think it's one or the other; even with two scum teams, I just doubt we would get that lucky.

Maybe because of this:

The set-up will be 8 town, 2 Mafia A, 2 members of the "Anarcho-Syndicalist Mafia" (Mafia B

Why I'm voting for you:
Before your 228: I thought you were twisting my words.
But then 231 came. Read first partition.

Also humor me: Let's say I'm scum, who do you think is my scumbuddy?

This sound really familiar to me. oh that's because this was almost the same defense you used on me in another game.
*buzz*
And yes VV was scum in that game.

(And if you're worried about getting NKed and giving the ability right back to the scum, consider this: scum are very likely low on cash/in debt due to attempts to grab other items. If they haven't already borrowed their limit, they'll have to borrow more money to take the II ability, which will hinder them in paying off their other debts, and will most likely result in the scum going bankrupt, forcing a sale of II and giving us a very clear idea as to one of the scum. If you're just afraid of dying period, then that's being anti-town.)

Someone bought the NK thanks for playing scum.
Seriously outting the power role of a cop for what purpose exactly?

Also reading post 234 from SK who is voting for andrius but I never saw a case. Yeah I call SK scum at this point.

[farside22]

Sorry SK I thought you were asking for a cop claim. I suspect already that the immunity was bought by scum.
As for the V/LA meh I missed it mostly because I saw you posting in the game your modding.

[farside22]

SPS: I have no clue about the relevants for naming one mafia group and not the other. Last time I modded a game I gave a name to both groups. I have seen a game where one group had a name and the other didn't. Game is still ongoing but I don't see the relevance in that game.

[farside22]

Wow most people know that I can't talk as much lately and look a wagon happens.
I even had valid reason's for both my votes and my wagon is based on meta.
VV you want to supply those meta reads?
Jack: Yes more set up talks then scum hunting but as soon as the MS was taken from my computer at work I'm doing the best I can with only 1 or 2 times I can post. I would also say I did scum hunt looking at SK and explaining why I find VV scum.
This is the game I'm basing my scum read of VV percy game

oh and for those missing it and basing my lack of discussion in the game so far there is my comment in General Discussion that explains that work took MS and blocked it at work. So please use a better excuse.

[farside22]

Oh wow well here is a few ways to make more money. I have no clue who is even in the world cup. I fail.
God that mugger ability is so hot

[farside22]

Is no one else noting the wagon hopping from this guy ^^

First me now Andrius. Please lynch obv scum.

[farside22]

AlMaster's post is nice and all. Can't say OMG town but better then flashstorm.
I need more then 10 minutes to come up with a more then half way case on a few people that I had a feel as scum besides VV.
I hope to have some time late tonight or early tomorrow.
God my life without MS at work is really hectic. Sorry I am trying.

[farside22]

I want to vote SPS just for that last comment and vote alone. Voting for SK for what exactly? Just because you disagree with a case? How is that scummy exactly?