Mini 948 - Victorian Vampire - Game Over

[TheSkeward]

Oh, hey, zang. You're scum in that one game with the no-rules and all.

Vote Zang

[TheSkeward]

To confirm, you say we

can

quote private communication from the mod?

yes

And what's the spirits of the void / diary of the damned?

The dead/Links to lynches

Discuss. Can we break this?

[TheSkeward]

No grudges. As for pitchforks vs torches...

[TheSkeward]

Unvote; Vote: Cruelty

[TheSkeward]

Can someone unvote ooba. I believe he is at L-1 which gives scum a chance to hammer. You started the bandwagon to start discussion and I believe that was accomplished.

No one is going to hammer him now that it's been made clear that we'll all assume the hammer is scum.

Shouldn't that have been obvious in the first place?

Should have been, yes, but everyone declaring it outright took the chance of a overeager scum slip-up from "slim" to "none".

If you believe that town won't hammer ooba, why are you voting him? Your stated vote is for pressure. If you believe that town won't hammer ooba, how is he under any pressure?

Not finding a town motivation here.

[TheSkeward]

Can someone unvote ooba. I believe he is at L-1 which gives scum a chance to hammer. You started the bandwagon to start discussion and I believe that was accomplished.

No one is going to hammer him now that it's been made clear that we'll all assume the hammer is scum.

Shouldn't that have been obvious in the first place?

Should have been, yes, but everyone declaring it outright took the chance of a overeager scum slip-up from "slim" to "none".

If you believe that town won't hammer ooba, why are you voting him? Your stated vote is for pressure. If you believe that town won't hammer ooba, how is he under any pressure?

Not finding a town motivation here.

When he was at L-1 and before everyone talked about the hammer stuff, he was under pressure. Now, you're right, he isn't. My vote doesn't really need to be on him anymore.

However, I don't generally unvote unless I am moving my vote somewhere else, though, or unless I think that having it there is detrimental somehow. So until someone else pings my scumdar I'll leave my vote where it is.

So you're fine leaving him at l-1 even believing that those who would hammer are scum, and you're not scumhunting at all, just waiting for something to ping your scumdar.

Unvote: Vote: JoshTheStampede

HEY EVERYONE: this is a much better wagon than ooba.

[TheSkeward]

As for my vote, the three people on my wagon had totally valid reasons to be there, though of course I think the reasons are incorrect.

<snip>

I know I'm going to get accused of OMGUS here, but

unvote, vote cruelty

. Please note that I don't have any problem with the other people on my wagon, and so this is not an OMGUS vote.

This is kind of 'damned if you do, damned if you don't', but it's still a valid point: newbie town would be more likely to freak out and say "everyone who's voting me is scum" then to say "yeah, you're all reasonable people with valid points against me except this one."

[TheSkeward]

As for my vote, the three people on my wagon had totally valid reasons to be there, though of course I think the reasons are incorrect.

<snip>

I know I'm going to get accused of OMGUS here, but

unvote, vote cruelty

. Please note that I don't have any problem with the other people on my wagon, and so this is not an OMGUS vote.

This is kind of 'damned if you do, damned if you don't', but it's still a valid point: newbie town would be more likely to freak out and say "everyone who's voting me is scum" then to say "yeah, you're all reasonable people with valid points against me except this one."

I'm not really sure if you meant this to mean that I don't sound like a newbie, or that I don't sound like town. Can you elaborate?

You don't sound like newbie town. Meaning you are likely to be either someone's alt or (much more likely) scum.

[TheSkeward]

Hey CryMeARiver. Summary: vote Josh.

[TheSkeward]

Why is Josh still alive?

[TheSkeward]

Nope. I'm asking why you haven't been lynched yet.

[TheSkeward]

off*

[TheSkeward]

This is not the first time this has been mentioned but if you aren’t going to provide some actual content replace out will you?

No.

Is there anything in particular you'd like to know?

[TheSkeward]

Apologies for my absence. If you'll check, it was a sitewide absence, extending to my other games and to GD/MD. My computer died, which makes me very sad. I'm posting from a public computer right now, and am endeavouring to get a more permanent setup as soon as possible.

TheSkeward, if the town is unwilling to lynch Josh today, who would be next on your list.

mmm... cruelty, I think. Or one of the lurkers.

What are your thoughts on Ooba’s gambit? On Darox’s love of active lurking. On the fact that you, easjo and CryMe are just plain lurking.

I dislike lurkers, and I think they're a good early lynch. My own play has not been lurking. You could call it active-lurking. I haven't posted in the last couple of days; see above.

I don't think Darox is active-lurking. His posts are short and frequent, yes, but they almost always come with content. His "active-lurking is fun" post struck me as sarcasm then and still now.

Ooba's gambit was fine. WIFOM, but I think it's more likely to come from town than scum. That and the way he asks questions make me think he's town.

[TheSkeward]

Miller Vig made me smile. I wonder what a weak vigilante is. The only other reference I can find to it are some variants in the Best Role Ideas thread - http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 5fb93e9dc4 - but none of these seem particularly relevant.

We're off to a good start; let's lynch some more scum.

Vote: Nobody Special

[TheSkeward]

crulety, why the vote on magna?

[TheSkeward]

Why don't we all quit softclaiming? Fucking morons.

[TheSkeward]

i feel like this has stagnated.

how does everyone feel about a CMAR speedlynch to spice things up?

Unvote; Vote: CryMeARiver

I still think Nobody Special is scummier, but CMAR is a good lynch as well.

[TheSkeward]

ooba: I reevaluated my scumreads. I no longer find cruelty terribly scummy.

[TheSkeward]

CMAR: I would like your final reads, please. Tell us who you think is town and who you think is scum. Reasoning is optional and appreciated.

[TheSkeward]

Hey Darox. Could you be persuaded to switch to Nobody Special? I'm more sure he's scum.

[TheSkeward]

Got any reasons/post #'s/vague gut feelings to back that up?

I'm kind of neutral to NS right now.

Nobody Special
Doesn't like Darox's nameclaim.
"Very skeptical of Josh". No given reason. At this point Josh is obv the D1 lynch.
Says SpryeX is "less jovial, less outspoken" than usual.
Is way, way too ready to lynch Josh, for "purposely misinterpreting things" - his example is the slippery slope debate. Concludes with "Please, get lynched. Vote: Josh. Still on Page 7. Still reading. Still happy with a Josh lynch."
When SpryeX (not harshly at all, complete with a wink smiley face) responds to his comments, he says "Just observing, sheesh. Don't get your panties in a bunch. Have NONE of you on this whole fucking board EVER heard of '"hyperbole?'"
D2, he votes a lurker. Laughably, he also says "I also have some suspicions about Darox (admitted active lurking, distancing from Josh)"
When Darox pressures CMAR, he says to CMAR, "So, what you're

really

saying is that your target ceased to be a target, and, for whatever reason, you declined to even look for another target. Gotcha."

In essence: he seems to think everyone is scum. As soon as anyone is under any kind of pressure at all, he jumps onto them as though he's always been there. Furthermore, whenever he perceives any kind of pressure on himself (above, in the response to Darox, and also in the back-and-forths with CMAR), he responds with venomous ad-hom.

I'm definitely happy with a CMAR lynch. I'm fairly sure one is scum, and it's possible both are scum, and I don't see the other contributing positively to the game anyway. But I think NS is more likely to be scum, and CMAR's more likely to be just stupid.

[TheSkeward]

Why am I stupid again? Because I didn't post for a while, I spectated about the setup, and I provided cases on my suspects while defending myself from every argument?

The grownups are talking right now. Go to your room.

[TheSkeward]

Unvote; Vote: Nobody Special

[TheSkeward]

That's pretty convincing. Yeah, I could go for a NS lynch over CMAR.
Let's get the ball rolling.

Vote: Nobody Special

I am stunned. He virtually posted the same thing I posted.

*crawls off to his room*

[TheSkeward]

That's pretty convincing. Yeah, I could go for a NS lynch over CMAR.
Let's get the ball rolling.

Vote: Nobody Special

I am stunned. He virtually posted the same thing I posted.

*crawls off to his room*

Seriously though, you pretty much posted what I did.

You just don't have my animal magnetism.

[TheSkeward]

Hey Spry. Switch to NS please?

[TheSkeward]

Hey cruelty. CMAR lynch isn't happening today. NS is where it's at. Switch?

[TheSkeward]

testing, 1, 2, 3.

[TheSkeward]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 85#2249085

[TheSkeward]

See this post above me?

Yea, town post (although wrong about CMAR)

"NO U

Also, I agree this person that I am voting is town just being stupid."

If you think that's a town post, I am in favor of lynching everyone you think is town.

[TheSkeward]

Spry: I'd thought NS was voting CMAR. I was wrong, but I still think NS is scum.

Magna: Yeah, I'm used to posting as my other account, which has a strong personality and an established rep. You'll just have to deal with it.

[TheSkeward]

Maybe the new blood will interject some life. That'd be nice.

I'm now fairly confident that Darox and TheSkeward aren't scum together though - that whole "SpyreX, this is obviously what he meant." and then TS coming in and saying he was wrong sure doesn't click for a scum team.

TS: Thoughts on Darox answering for you?

I appreciate his support and I'm glad we appear to be thinking along the same wavelengths (I've gotten that feeling since the game began). At the same time, I'm unsure of his alignment and don't trust him more than anyone else (besides those I think are scum, namely CMAR and NS).

Unvote; Vote: CryMeARiver

Yeah, yeah, flipflopping, votehopping, wagonstopping. The reasons for this are twofold.

1) Nobody Special actually wasn't voting CMAR. Part of the reason I find NS scum is his opportunism, but discovering that it goes as far as comments and not as far as votes makes him less scummy.

2) CMAR and I had an exchange after I convinced Darox to switch over, where he went from hostile to buddyish, as I made a couple of jokes (posted his avatar, and commented that he was missing my animal magnetism). Since then, he's stopped attacking me. Although I won't claim that judging his reaction was all part of my master plan, the way he changed behavior so quickly definitely rang my bells. It could be town gratitude, but I'm not convinced.

Neither of these on their own would get me to switch back, but both together will. Note that I'm still fine with a NS lynch.

[TheSkeward]

Vas: This is my opinion, and here is its evidence.
Scummy People: That is not the opinion of the town in general. This is the opinion of the town in general. We don't need evidence.
Vas: You're right, Scummy People. I was wrong and you are right. I will accept your opinion without evidence.

[TheSkeward]

CMAR flops like a fish.

Darox: I'm really on a knifepoint between NS and CMAR here. As soon as I settle on one, the other does something scummy. If CMAR gets to L-1, I will hammer him.

[TheSkeward]

VV: I'm talking about "your" parroting accusation. CMAR's case against Slaine/NS and my case against NS are two completely different animals. The only person who thinks they're the same thing is CMAR, and now, since he told you, you. CMAR attacks a bunch of different things that aren't scumtells, some that are, and some that would be except he had to twist words to get there. His case isn't particularly convincing. My case is focused on two specific points (NS seems to think everyone is scum, and NS reacts with vicious adhom when he feels threatened), one of which CMAR didn't even mention. We both have multiple quotes in our cases - we only quote the same post once.

That's why I was so dismissive when CMAR accused me of parroting the first time; because it's clearly untrue, and any townie with half a brain can see that. So why, other than CMAR told you to, did you call my case parroting when clearly it's not?

[TheSkeward]

I actually still wouldn't mind an NS lynch. I don't think he's 'proved his towniness'. But I'll settle for VV. Better than cruelty or Darox, certainly.

Vote: VasudeVa

[TheSkeward]

Interesting.

Vote: Darox

I'm in favor of a massclaim.

[TheSkeward]

Alright, that's six of us. That's plenty. We'll go popcorn style (each person who claims chooses the next person). Remember that scum lose an advantage if they have to claim before town, so try to pick the remaining person you think is most likely to be scum.

Rolling for who claims first.

1 = Zang
2 = cruelty
3 = TheSkeward
4 = SpyreX
5 = MagnaofIllusion
6 = Darox
7 = Ooba

Original Roll String: 1d7

1 7-Sided Dice: (1) = 1

[TheSkeward]

Alright, it's on ooba.

[TheSkeward]

Welcome to Victorian Vampire! I suggest you add the topic to your Watch list and read over the rules.

You are Russ the Executioner. Your reputation is too daunting for even the most wicked to trespass against you; at night you may block the path of someone else, preventing them from any action. You win with

town

.

Please reply to this message with the name of your role to confirm that you have read the rules. Good luck!

Russ the Executioneroleblocker. Going to go read the rules now.

To confirm, you say we

can

quote private communication from the mod?

yes

And what's the spirits of the void / diary of the damned?

The dead/Links to lynches

Just a day left to send in your night action

Block: Darox

Block: Darox

Confirmed, thank ya

Block: Darox

You succeeded with your action

Where's the game?

Edit: Never mind. Issue resolved. See the thread where people go to bitch about the site (not GD, I said the thread) to see what I meant.

I target Nobody Special.

Alrighty, thanks for letting me know!

I target Nobody Special.

Your attempt fails.

Just leaves SpryeX.

[TheSkeward]

I think that each weak vig should kill whoever he thinks is scum out of the pool of weak vigs, since I agree that four is unlikely. I'm against lynching any of them today.

To MoI, I'm voting Darox because my opinion of him depended largely on NS/CMAR flips. The post you pointed out where I said we were thinking on the same wavelength? Read it again. I said we appeared to be thinking on the same wavelength, and I appreciated that, but I didn't have a townread on him. That was all in the same sentence, explained quite concisely. I don't know how you possibly could have interpreted that in any other way.

Preview Edit: HOLD IT RIGHT FUCKING THERE. Cruelty got a guilty on Yosarian2. Yosarian2 was a weak vig/miller, and unless I'm mistaken, he didn't know he was a miller. That point is critical to this throught process, so point it out somewhere if there's information to the contrary.

AND YET, he got an INNOCENT on SpryeX, another claimed weak vig. I find it extremely likely that all the Angry Mob are millers.

Option 1) Cruelty's scum. He claimed cop with innocent on a player who'd not yet claimed. This would have been a pretty dumb move, and anyway I have a townread on cruelty. Also, (modWIFOMspeculationyaddayaddayadda) why bother including millers with no cop? Unlikely.

Option 2) SpryeX is scum. He claimed Angry Mob at the last minute because it felt like a good fakeclaim. The innocent on him means he's a Godfather. Likely.

Option 3) Neither are scum, but cruelty lied about his results or EB made at least one of the Angry Mob a miller and at least one not a miller. Unlikely.

Option 4) Both are scum. This again means that there are millers with the only (possible) investigative role a mafia. That would be interesting with the traitor - they could be looking for their traitor and have four weak vig/millers to fuck them up. Makes the mafia pretty powerful, though. It means that there wasn't sufficient cooperation between scum when making claims, since cruelty declared an innocent on his scumbuddy who went on to claim a role that's almost certainly a miller. Possible.

Unvote; Vote SpryeX

[TheSkeward]

Zang, I don't think you understand the concept of a preview edit. You see, there's a preview button. When you're previewing, you can still edit. So if you say Preview Edit: whatever, it means you hit preview, then added 'whatever' to your post.[/teach]

I left the earlier point in rather than rewriting my post because I had to go get my student ID card and my friend was bitching at me to hurry up. It also allows you to see my train of thoughts.

To me, this is completely obvious. I'm pretty sure "Preview Edit: HOLD UP A FUCKING MINUTE" pretty clearly explains that this part of the post is in disagreement with the previous because I've changed my mind after just realizing something. Zang's just stupid. SpryeX is attacking it because he's scum and hoping someone will jump on it.

So SpryeX, out of the four options, which do you think is true and why?

[TheSkeward]

And what's really funny is that the answer is in the block of text you just quoted.

[TheSkeward]

It appears that SpryeX hasn't even read the post he's attacking. He just takes a few points and attempts to scream loud enough to drown it out. We'll deal with this bit by bit.

1) All the options I present require one of cruelty/SpryeX to be scum or cruelty to be lying as town.

False. I clearly present one of the options as "neither is scum. either cruelty is lying as town or not all of the weak vigs are millers."

2) I changed my mind within the course of a post.

True. SpryeX has yet to show how changing my mind based on a new realization is scummy.

3) It is unlikely that there is both a godfather and three millers.

Opinion. SpryeX has yet to show why my belief is scummy.

In conclusion, SpryeX' accusation of me seems to be complete OMGUS. I noticed this behavior with Josh, but Josh was scum. I was fairly sure of it D1, which meant (I thought at the time) SpryeX must be town. Day 2 I gave him a pass because the lynch was going to be one of the VIs. Day 3 Darox was scummier (until SpryeX started OMGUSsing me), but I'd be a fool to lynch based on my reads instead of role information as relevant as the results of a cop investigation, and SpryeX' reaction was hostile and accusatory despite having no real points against me (unless you count "I disagree").

[TheSkeward]

Hey cruelty. Can you explain to me which of SpryeX' points against me you like? Or even, y'know, point one out? Make sure to explain why it's scummy.

[TheSkeward]

Goddamn, cruelty, did *you* read it?

Preview Edit: HOLD IT RIGHT FUCKING THERE. Cruelty got a guilty on Yosarian2. Yosarian2 was a weak vig/miller, and unless I'm mistaken, he didn't know he was a miller.

More importantly, can you explain to me why it's scummy to change your mind over the course of a post because you had a sudden realization?

[TheSkeward]

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

[TheSkeward]

I have a better idea. Let's do this exact same plan but lynch Darox instead.

Unvote; Vote: Darox

[TheSkeward]

With the exception of SpryeX, everyone on my wagon seems to think a Skewlynch is interchangeable with a Daroxlynch and that I'm no scummier than him. So let's do this plan, but lynch Darox instead.

[TheSkeward]

That's a hammer. Go town. Zang, shoot SpryeX. If SpryeX is still alive tomorrow, lynch him. If not, lynch Darox.

[TheSkeward]

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

It looks like town is determined to mislynch today. You guys had better fucking lynch SpryeX tomorrow. Don't let him slip out of it.

ARARADGAGHHGHA;LEJFI;OAJFOSD;VIJAEJNFI;NEZ;ISFNIO;AENF INCOHERENT RAGE HE WAS SO OBVIOUS ZANG MAGNA DAROX WHAT IS WRONG WITH YOU

[TheSkeward]

VV, you and me need to have a "I got mislynched by a stupid town" drink. Or alternatively, play another game together. Even when I thought you were the best lynch I liked the way your thought processes worked.

[TheSkeward]

At the end of the day, I also have to congratulate SpryeX. You were just so audacious with the bullshit you spewed that Zang accepted it. Confidence > Logic. Some of my best scum wins have been according to that same principle, even if it is

ridiculously infuriating

to watch.