Mini 892 - Mayor Mafia (GAME OVER)

[Hoopla]

i think i know who should be mayor, but i'm not ready to talk about it in confirmations, as i assume mafia have the ability to talk during this phase.

Also, boo at rule 8!

08. It is also not allowed to use coding, small or invisible text to hide information in your messages inside the thread. (note that coding includes simple codes such as hiding a word in the first letters of each paragraph of a post)

[Hoopla]

I will post in the thread (which can be found HERE) and send all players a pm when the game starts. The start of the game will be at least 72 hours after I have sent out the rolepms. If I need to replace people pre-game, the start of the game will be later.

I really think it isn't a brilliant idea to talk too much about mayor choices, set-up discussion, or anything that could be alignment telling until this 72 hour window is closed. Scum will most likely be able to talk during this period, and I don't want to give them three days worth of day-talking and planning if this game psuedo-begins now.

I encourage everyone to post sparingly or chat about non-game related things. But lets not talk about the game until we actually begin.

[Hoopla]

nhammen is a

very

good scumhunter. Hence my support for his mayoralness.
Though. I'm badass. So. Vote me.

hahahahahaaha anyone nominating themself is clearly the wrong choice

[Hoopla]

Take a photo of you kissing a baby and you might get my vote.

[Hoopla]

2 slow reck, i just saw sc doing it earlier. im starting to doubt your baby kissing abilities.

[Hoopla]

Vote: kyle99
Support: kyle99

[Hoopla]

Hi everyone, I've just moved apartments and am having trouble with my internet provider - they expect it to be set up and ready either on Friday or Monday, depending on when a technician can get out here.

I'm at the library now, and I'll try and make a post or two during my downtime, but consider me V/LA for now.

--

My reason for voting/supporting Kyle was that I think it's a good idea to lynch the mayor on Day 1 and treat it as a normal day. My reasoning is it's sometimes quite difficult to discern town players on Day 1. We have no mod-confirmed alignments to play with, so it seems frivolous to give someone extra power based on reputation or their early play.

Of the last 64 mini normals, only 13 times has scum been lynched Day 1. This is slightly worse than random, probably due to scum's ability to work together to avoid it. If a town lynch is likely, I think it will be very beneficial to have confirmed town choosing the mayor for Day 2. I can easily see this mechanic being exploited by scum, and think arbitrary power is unnecessary until we have viable town reads.

[Hoopla]

Some more thoughts while I'm still here:

The monkeyman wagon is good - he's at L-2 I believe. But I'm fine with putting him at L-1 considering we can't lynch until we've chosen a mayor. I don't think his blanket suspicion was bad, but the reaction to his own wagon was definitely off.

Re my support for mayor: I'd still prefer mayoring whoever we make our D1 lynch candidate, and don't intend to support mayoring anyone else until I hear sound reasoning behind why this would be a good idea on D1.

Vote: Monkeyman

[Hoopla]

23. At the beginning of the game, the players decide who gets this role. This decission works as a normal lynching decission, except that votes should read

Support: Player Name

and

Unsupport: Player Name

.

Day 1 can't end through a lynch before a mayor has been chosen

. If, at the end of the day, no player has received the support of the majority of players, the player with the most support will become mayor. If there is a tie, the first player to have reached the highest amount of support will become mayor. If noone has received any support, a random player will become mayor.

Maoi: This is how I interpretted the rule for lynching/mayoring. We can't lynch until a mayor has been chosen. Forced mayordom only comes if we reach the deadline without a majority on mayor supports.

SaintKerrigan: The purpose of lynching the mayor is so we have a confirmed alignment choosing the mayor for Day 2, as the mayor chooses his successor upon death. This is better than making an unsure choice on Day 1. We have little information to work with, and I can see this mechanic being more useful on

Day 1

to scum than town. Therefore we should treat this day normally, and not support a mayor until we decide who to lynch, so we can mayor them.

[Hoopla]

The purpose of a guarenteed alignment choosing the mayor means if it's town, we know motivations are pure. Yes, that player could still be wrong, but I'd favour one confirmed town player's choice, over a whole town suspectable to manipulation.

I quoted stats from the last 64 games for a reason. In all of these games, only 13 times has scum been lynched Day 1. This is easily worse than random, and illustrates how simple it is for scum to steer wagons on Day 1.

The mayor mechanic is opposite to this. It's about getting a majority on a town player. I think it will be easier for scum to steer these wagons, as there is less emphasis on cases. I expect the mayor to be selected mostly on reputation (on D1 anyway), and that could go to several players. It's a better than average chance we end up with a scum mayor because there is no expectation to explain reasoning beyond reputation or disagreeing with a few posts.

Even if we don't lynch the mayor, we definitely should not choose the mayor before we collectively decide on a lynch. That's about as far as I'm prepared to compromise for now.

[Hoopla]

Re: Hoopla's theory: I don't really see much of an issue with it. My only trepidation with it is that we are putting the decision in the hands of someone a majority of us would agree is very likely scum. That either means we are putting the decision to either scum or a player who isn't playing very well. I don't know.

One other problem: We lose all of those juicy connections we could go back and look at later in the game if we don't elect the old fashioned way. Right now we essentially have two lanes of people forming connections with each other (votes to lynch and votes to become mayor).

We don't lose that many connections - the only one we're eliminating is the mayor lane on D1. Regardless, I think quite a few players may find it difficult spotting scum influence on mayor wagons. It is many times more fraught with WIFOM and guess games (especially on D1), as there is less importance on the outcome of the wagon than a regular lynching wagon. The stances scum could take to the mayor wagons seem highly variable. I don't even know how I'd pick off scum from mayor wagons, as it's the opposite of a normal wagon which is where everyone has honed their radars.

But it is a double-edged sword - becoming mayor will come with heavy scrutiny. I can imagine some scum players may feel the extra power of a vote might not be worth the attention, especially early in the game.

[Hoopla]

By the way, I'm still relying on library internet until my connection at home is fixed. I'll be offering more than theory once that happens (I know I have a question or two waiting for me). Thanks!

[Hoopla]

Can we tone all this mayor theory stuff way down. It seriously is not a huge deal today. I'm quite uneasy about Hoopla, because that's all she's been doing lately, even though she recognizes this. Inundating everyone with mayor theory isn't helpful and is pretty much textbook scummy active lurking.

I understand. Please give me until tomorrow, and I will make some non-mayor theory game posts. I will have the opportunity then.

If you (or anyone) have any major issues you want me to address, let me know and I will get to them first before I type up some more thoughts.

[Hoopla]

Monkey's claim is fishy to me - it appeared to me to be a sign of desperation, not knowing how to escape the suspicion he's gathered. This could be interpreted either way, but his anxious nature around his wagon is something I would expect less from a town player.

I don't think we should lynch him though. Monkey is more likely to claim cop as cop, than claim cop as scum. I think the value of a potential investigation can be quite damaging for mafia, and if he is truthful, he will likely absorb the night kill (saving us a lynch).

If Monkey is mafia, we have him captured. There is not much difference between lynching him D1 than on D2. In both of these scenarios we have 2 other scum to hit out of everyone else. So if there is little difference in the scenarios if he is mafia, we might as well choose the option that benefits town more if he is town - which is an investigation or night kill. Unless mafia have a roleblocker they run a serious risk in leaving Monkey alive.

[Hoopla]

Okay, well I didn't know that. It doesn't specifically say that players can unvote and vote someone else. The situation was convoluted enough that I think a claim was warranted.

It had been brought up multiple times - it's not like it wasn't talked about.

[Hoopla]

@Hoopla: What do you feel about the fact that you got 4 support votes for mayor when the only game post you had was a reasonless vote on Kyle?

Because I'm awesome, or something. My guess is as good as yours.

[Hoopla]

Wait What?? How does the latest back and forth seal anything?

You mean the part where he said he thought he was going to be lynched where basically admitted to not reading the thread and then changing that to “L-1 always warrants a claim” which is also wrong.

I didn't say L-1 always warrants a claim. Quoting(incorrectly) out of context is scummy. In this case, I felt it warranted a claim. It had nothing to do with the rules.

Stupid. You really didn't need to claim. I won't be completely upset if Monkey is lynched today, if only because the cop has a slim chance of ever actually being useful now he's outed, but I'd still prefer lynching elsewhere.

Kyle is a decent choice for that position.

[Hoopla]

I'd say lynch Kyle.

I'm also officially not a fan of Hoopla's plan and would prefer nhammen for Mayor. But if majority agrees on Hoop's plan, I'm on board.

You dislike the plan, but you'll be persuaded once a majority thinks it's a good idea. How would lots of people agreeing change your mind - can't think for yourself?

[Hoopla]

Hoopla, are you on full internaet access now?

No! But I am working on it, don't worry.

[Hoopla]

Also, remember those 4 support votes Hoopla got that I keep bringing up? I will go on record and say there is absolutely no chance that all 4 of those votes came from town. (ESPECIALLY if hoopla is scum) I want everyone to remember this for posterity when we get some alignment flips. Who would I pick as the worst support out of that bunch? You guessed it: Kyle.

I don't think this point is as relative and poignant as you'd like to think. These supports were based on reputation - they're the equivalent of voting to policy-lynch someone with anti-town meta before they've posted. They are not relevent to this game specifically - and I could see a make-up of 3/2/1 or even 0 scum on that wagon because they weren't comprised of any actual cases. But you're welcome to guess if you have better insight than me.

[Hoopla]

You know what's worse than parroting players? Not taking a side or commenting on it at all...

You know what's worse than that? Poverty and world hunger.

[Hoopla]

I was hoping you would dispute it, so I could tell you it's accurate.

[Hoopla]

No TRAP SPRUNG for hoopla.

Although if you're going to hang around enough to reply to posts and crack one liners, can you find a bit of time to comment on me vs DDD?

Yep. It felt like a very contrived argument - possibly scumbuddies going for some extreme distancing, although 1/1 is the most likely answer.

[Hoopla]

What does 1/1 mean? One scum one town?

Or one town, one scum.

[Hoopla]

Any clue on which one you think is which? How strong is your read? You don't consider town/town an option?

No.

Just kidding. I hadn't really read either of your arguments - and I doubt I'm skilled enough to guess who is who based on what I see now. I think your meta case is rubbish, the prickly thing is funny, but I agree with not lynching the cop (not as strongly as you, perhaps).

I think DDD is right -

you

should search the last twenty games with cops and provide good reason there likely won't be blockers etc. as you're the one trying to change

his

mind - at least this is how I read it.

[Hoopla]

I don't think this point is as relative and poignant as you'd like to think. These supports were based on reputation - they're the equivalent of voting to policy-lynch someone with anti-town meta before they've posted. They are not relevent to this game specifically - and I could see a make-up of 3/2/1 or even 0 scum on that wagon because they weren't comprised of any actual cases. But you're welcome to guess if you have better insight than me.

That fact that the entirety of the reasoning for the support was based on your reputation only makes me more confident of my opinion.

That I'm scum, and other scum are trying to elect me?

[Hoopla]

Am I scummy because I lied to you? And don't worry, a technician is fixing my internet tomorrow. I've been living at a friend's house so Michel doesn't replace me. He seems very anal about that sort of thing.

[Hoopla]

So, you don't think town would want to elect someone based on reputation?

[Hoopla]

Anti-humour is the best. I understand it's not everyone's cup of tea. If I was allowed I would have breadcrumbed I was joking in a post somewhere to signal my intentions.

[Hoopla]

Why am I being wagoned? Ps. I am at home and my internet is fixed. YAYYY

[Hoopla]

How many games have you got in your Hoopla town/Hoopla scum meta catalogue?

I don't know who should be wagoned yet.

[Hoopla]

2 and 2, Hoopla - 1 played, 1 read through properly, and 1 each skimmed.

This is part of my problem with you.

If you're going to use meta cases on Day 1, I suggest generating a larger sample size than this - unless you believe you've found an empirical scumtell I commit without knowing, in which case you should share it now so I can be lynched.

Protip: meta cases on day 1 are ridiculous.

[Hoopla]

To try and undermine Serial's vote on you by contesting just one point is not going to work.

YAY for internets.

1) Lack of hunting
2) Lack of content
3) Scummy joking/lying yesterday.
4) No fire for finding scum.
5)

All

Most of the above fitting scum meta and not town meta.

1) Away
2) Away
3) I like to joke
4) Away
5) Meta cases are rubbish on D1

[Hoopla]

So the case isn't about meta, it's about your lack of contribution and lack of desire to catch scum. It's just also worth noting that in my experienceo f your play, this is both unusualish for town and usualish for scum.

Why say it's a meta case then? It's just a cheap excuse to throw suspicion without having to explain anything.

You must also think I am exceedingly dim to not be aware of how I look as scum. To enrich your meta of me, here is a good game - it's the only other game where I've been on V/LA and risked replacement. My play was poor, and eventually lost the town the game.

This is because I like to spend a lot of time on my posts reading and analysing, and I cannot do this with 60 minutes a day available.

[Hoopla]

So far, my town reads are Moai and possibly Socrates, however I don't want him to be mayor, mostly because he is pushing it himself and I still want to lynch the mayor.

I have a scum gut feeling about nhammen, SC and possibly charter - I think this is where I'm going to vote, as I disagree with lynching Monkey today. I'll try and explain my gut as I know I'll be berated for not doing so, otherwise.

nhammen's play feels fishy in regards to his play around Monkey - it's like he was tiptoeing around with his meta searches, finding something to incriminate him.

SC is the hardest to explain, but the general vibe I get from his posts is confidence and a willingness to spread suspicion on easy targets - his case on DDD was overreaching, and I dislike how he is setting me up without giving me much chance to reason. I don't think SC would normally be so hasty.

Charter tunnels too much and deserves to die - his recent line of questioning is useless and boring, and isn't doing a good job of creating links, which I can see as its only benefit. But this linking only becomes valid once we have confirmed alignments - and because these questions barely scrape beyond the surface they won't be revisited once alignments do flip.

[Hoopla]

My vote isn't very strong, but it's who I'd like to lynch today;

Vote: charter

[Hoopla]

Haha, I'm sorry I'm not finding it as easy as you to delude myself into believing my reads are better than random on Day 1. My reads aren't badly formulated, they're just weak, and I acknowledge that.

You seem hung up that I'm not firey (wtf, seriously?), that has nothing to do with my town game or my ability to scumhunt. I've NEVER been able to catch scum on day one, and the burden of proficiency you have me under is ridiculous. Why are you expecting so much more from my reads compared to everyone else? You're holding me to unfair standards.

[Hoopla]

I have a general theory question for anyone that wants to answer. What goes into your decision making when choosing your Day 1 lynch? Is it purely whoever you assess to be most scummy?

[Hoopla]

You're holding me to unfair standards.

Well, two things. Firstly - I do hold everyone in the game to different standards. Because you're different players. If you performed at an empking level for the first day, I'd be suspicious, whereas if empking did, I wouldn't be. Such is life. Secondly, I never asked you to be successful, just to try. When I say fire, I mean desire to catch scum, and I don't see any.

You are! I seriously think you're overvaluing my ability as town. I have no idea which games you're basing my town meta on.

For what it's worth, I don't think my gut is worthless - but I think I am the only sane one with a realistic outlook on what to expect from day 1. I have shared my opinion and you know where I stand on most issues, but I

absolutely

refuse to pretend my opinions are worth anything substancial on Day 1. It may look like a weak excuse, but it's the only truthful way I can accurately summarise how I feel.

I don't understand where the aggressive = Hooplatown thing surfaced from, but I'd suggest that attribute is mostly based on how I feel, and how active the rest of the town is.

[Hoopla]

@ Hoopla: So, if you are still advocating the "lynch the mayor" strategy, why aren't you supporting Charter?

I don't think anyone likes it. And if they did, they definitely don't now. I feel gross for morphing myself into an easy day 1 lynch, and I don't know how to fix it.

[Hoopla]

And since noone has noticed it, and I know you're the queen of hidden meanings, what's with the indigo post, hoopla?

Why did you comment on the colour, and not my question? The post has no meaning beyond me wanting to post in a colour - that's the rules.

I'm going to attempt to make some better posts soon.

[Hoopla]

Hi Socrates.

Hoopla, I would love to hear your thoughts on Kyle, RECKONER, and Col. Cathart. Also, what is, in your opinion, the single scummiest post in this game?

I don't have a problem with kyle - I think SC made the point earlier, it's not a bad thing having these sort of players alive beyond day 1 as they're easy to read. But it's a double-edged sword too, as it's almost one less pair of eyes (if town) able to analyse play and catch scum. I'd like kyle to make a bit more effort, but I can't honestly suggest this without people violently spewing whatever they're drinking from their mouthes.

I think Reckoner is town - he has a sort of nonchalant, naive air about the way he posts. I've seen him do it as town. The one thing that irked me was him jumping on Socrates. But I agree with Moai's point earlier that putting yourself forward for mayor early doesn't seem like a smart scum play. It feels wifomy, but taking a less apathetic view, it makes more sense as town.

I haven't noted Cathart much, but flicking through his posts, I can't find anything that stands out at all. He's perhaps a bit too quiet.

--

I know I'm facing an uphill battle to receive any credibility whatsoever in my play, but I REALLY don't like how hard SC is pounding me. I know I've dug myself a hole, but it feels like he's down here with me digging. The main issue is how much he overexaggerated about my joking around, and then building me up so my next post becomes heavily scrutinised. I feel like whatever I posted could have been contorted to be scummy based purely on my then credibility.

Admittedly my first attempt was bad, and I think I have no right to have my vote on charter. I was just frustrated and don't like his tunneling.

Unvote

Vote: SerialClergyman

[Hoopla]

Ugh. Pushing too hard? Zzz.

I wasn't sure - the rules say no codes, a purple post isn't a code. But then meh, it's a bit bizarre, even for a hoopla post.

Yes. I'd imagine you'd be a bit more forgiving considering you're working with no confirmed alignments - but it isn't even that. It's your tone too - when you were onto me in Commie mafia you did it nicely. You feel very bullish.

I post in colours in some of my other games when the mood is right.

[Hoopla]

If you could put it into percentages or whatever, how confident are you?

[Hoopla]

This day is becoming stagnant.

I'm prepared to compromise out of self-preservation and switch to monkey, because I doubt anyone will want to lynch SerialClergyman.

[Hoopla]

Sorry mate, you are quite correct. My apologies.

Saint Kerrigan, why monkey over hoopla?

May I ask what the harm in allowing monkey one night to try to grab a result?

The argument I think is that if he is scum, he can just claim a guilty first thing tomorrow, and yay, we've mislynched back to back, and we're on Day 3 (with a not very informative Day 2).

[Hoopla]

A cop is a signifigantly weaker role when it's been outed - especially Day 1. The benefit in keeping him alive is if he is the cop, he will likely draw a nightkill (meaning we get a different lynch today).

Lynching him tomorrow is the worse choice out of everything suggested. If Monkey gets an innocent tonight, we get one confirmable result in exchange for a mislynch. I don't see this as a good scenario.

[Hoopla]

A cop's power to confirm innocents and find scum is almost completely removed when he is outed. As he is either scum, lying, or will be night killed/blocked. The nightkill scenario is good - but is dependant on him being truthful. If this is the best result we can hope for if he is town, isn't it more worthwhile to take the gamble he's scum?

What percentage do you put Monkey as scum? More than me?

[Hoopla]

Do you think he's scum? Do you think in an ideal world he shoudl be lynched or are you essentially playing devil's advocate for self-preservation?

He's likelier than random to be scum - I'm genuinely on the fence when it comes to lynching a claimed cop on Day 1. Everytime I make a definitive stance, I persuade myself out of it with other logic.

Self preservation comes into it a bit this time too. I know I am town, so if it came down to me vs. Monkey, then obviously it is the right call. If I was looking pro-town it's possible I would try and organise a lynch elsewhere, but I can't say without bias.

[Hoopla]

Nhammen - say we don't lynch Monkey today, and we lynch a town player. Monkey doesn't get nightkilled and claims a guilty at the start of Day 2 - what do you do?

[Hoopla]

I say, Yay! We have a 1 for 1! Then I look at who Monkey claimed a guilty on, and compare with Monkey. Player more likely to be scum bites the dust.

Yeah, but there's a decent chance you don't get to cash in your scum lynch until Day 3. Is it really worth waiting that long for a confirmed scum?

[Hoopla]

Why is Hoopla voting for Serial?

Hoopla has pulled a giant 360, from initially thinking Monkeyman is more likely to claim cop as cop than scum, to disagreeing with lynching him day one, then self preservation voting him, to now arguing about how his role is useless and we should lynch him anyway.

I already outlined my reasons for voting SC. I had two posts about it.

I don't think it's a 360 - to be honest I'm still unsure what the correct play is with this. I can see valid arguments both ways. I'm siding with lynching him now to prevent my own.

[Hoopla]

No, I mean, what is the purpose behind voting for Serial? No one else seems to be suspicious of him, and your reasons are weak and you're not trying to convince anyone else he's scum.

Serial, I'm pretty sure that Monkey will be just as scummy, regardless of who we lynch today and what they flip. I can't picture anyone flipping scum that would somehow clear Monkeyman. If he gets NK'ed, then that's about the only benefit other than him being sane and getting a guilty. I don't think it's worth chancing it, but if that's what we have to do, then that's what we have to do.

Good point. There is no point voting someone who is not going to be lynched.

Unvote, vote: Monkeyman

[Hoopla]

I am very happy with the choice for mayor. And I would have liked Hoopla to have commented on him before Monkey got so close to lynch. Too bad. Too late. I wanted to see if Hoopla was willing to choose Kyle as his life saving wagon rather than Monkey.

What difference does it make to you when you should not know either alignment?

[Hoopla]

If you must know, I had thought of the possibility of a kyle Hoopla pair, and wanted to see if you had any reason not to switch.

He isn't a bad lynch - I'd support it over my own.

[Hoopla]

If you must know, I had thought of the possibility of a kyle Hoopla pair, and wanted to see if you had any reason not to switch.

He isn't a bad lynch - I'd support it over my own.

Is there any lynch you wouldn't support over your own? This is an incredibly scummy post. That being said, Kyle is in my top 3 scum prospects still. I would switch if that's what the majority decided.

No, there isn't. I am confirmed town to myself and do not know the alignment of anyone else in the game, so I should support anyone elses lynch over mine. This is essentially the same logic that Socrates got elected for.

[Hoopla]

Stop trying to link yourself with me.

[Hoopla]

Have you ever fake-claimed as scum before, Monkey?

[Hoopla]

Have you ever fake-claimed as scum before, Monkey?

Sure...have you?

Nope.

Can you link me to some of those games?

[Hoopla]

Monkey, did you purposely choose to leave out Mafia 89 which is perhaps the one scum game most closely relating to your play here. You claimed a town watcher there.

Interestingly the two games you have actually played as cop, you were lynched on Day 1. Mini 795 you did not get to claim due to an impending deadline, but in Mini 838 I noticed you were a lot more reluctant to claiming your role, and only did so after a prolonged period of pressure. It seems in this game you used a claim as a means of deflating your wagon similar to the Mafia 89 fakeclaim.

[Hoopla]

You're in denial.

[Hoopla]

You claimed light years early, didn't try very hard to defend yourself, and are scum.

Not true, not true and not true. I've defended myself very appropriately, it's just that most of the attacks against me have been entirely baseless.

True, true and true. Your defenses have been inappropriate and the attacks have had an abundant supply of bases.

[Hoopla]

You claimed light years early, didn't try very hard to defend yourself, and are scum.

Not true, not true and not true. I've defended myself very appropriately, it's just that most of the attacks against me have been entirely baseless.

True, true and true. Your defenses have been inappropriate and the attacks have had an abundant supply of bases.

Wow, that was a convincing rebuttal.

Funnily enough, it was equally as convincing as your initial quote!

[Hoopla]

You claimed light years early, didn't try very hard to defend yourself, and are scum.

Not true, not true and not true. I've defended myself very appropriately, it's just that most of the attacks against me have been entirely baseless.

True, true and true. Your defenses have been inappropriate and the attacks have had an abundant supply of bases.

Wow, that was a convincing rebuttal.

Funnily enough, it was equally as convincing as your initial quote!

But, funnily enough, I haven't lied about my meta.

Although, funnily enough, I wasn't accusing you of lying about your meta.

[Hoopla]

HOOPLA, EXPLANATION

For what?

[Hoopla]

You claimed light years early, didn't try very hard to defend yourself, and are scum.

Not true, not true and not true. I've defended myself very appropriately, it's just that most of the attacks against me have been entirely baseless.

True, true and true. Your defenses have been inappropriate and the attacks have had an abundant supply of bases.

Monkeyman, my original comment (see above) was designed to illustrate the pointlessness of your defense - how they're just words that directly contradict the previous statement without any reason. Here's a classic sketch that parodies this much better than me.

--

See, you keep doing it;

Although, funnily enough, I wasn't accusing you of lying about your meta.

However, you have been, funnily enough. I think the fact that you have no explanation for your lie is proof enough that you are scum.

~~

[Hoopla]

That you have never fakeclaimed as scum.

[Hoopla]

Socrates gets it.

[Hoopla]

Umm, I was serious. You just fakeclaimed JOAT in that game.

Did she get away with it?

Kind of.

[Hoopla]

HOOPLA INTERROGATION TIME. @Hoopla, if not for self-preservation (say you were the mayor), who would you want to lynch and why? Also, how convinced are you of Monkey's scumminess (and why)?

That's a difficult hypothetical to place myself into. For one, I'd need to be considered pro-town enough by the majority to be elected mayor, which would nullify my suspicions of SC, as they have come solely from the negative reactions I've received from my play.

Monkeyman is scummy to me - like I've said in other posts, I'm still unsure what the correct play is regarding Day 1 cop claims, but I'm inclined to think they need to be lynched if they're scummy enough, as their value diminishes a lot being outed. The timing of his claim, and the limited knowledge I have of Monkeyman's scum/powerrole play is good enough reason to support his lynch.

If I had more influence in the town, I'd probably still lynch Monkeyman, or even someone like kyle.

[Hoopla]

Unvote: MonkeyMan576. Vote: Hoopla.

Who said we were?

I also just realized how heavily Hoopla is appealing to emotion, what with saying she screwed it up for the town and such things.

Why are you only now catching/commenting on dated material? It looks as if you're trying to find an excuse to get on my wagon and/or get off Monkeyman's.

[Hoopla]

I'm town, duh! Way to fool them, Hoopla.

[Hoopla]

I don't understand why Reck is suspicious. Can someone give me a simple summary of this, please?

I think SaintKerrigan is suspicious based on his timely unvote of Monkeyman on page 26, when it looked as if he could get away with possibly lynching me instead.

[Hoopla]

I think SaintKerrigan is suspicious based on his timely unvote of Monkeyman on page 26, when it looked as if he could get away with possibly lynching me instead.

Well this really doesn't look good given Kerrigan's mason claim just a few hours before. How do you overlook that?

Oops, I wasn't really paying attention!

I take back my suspicion of SaintKerrigan, carry on.

[Hoopla]

Hoopla, have you joined any other games besides this one since Commie Mafia and is so links plz

.

Hi DDD, here is a link to 863 and 865. I've also been in 869, but that isn't finished yet, but you can look there too if you want.[/url]

[Hoopla]

Hoopla, who are you suspicious of?

I think I'm suspicious of you, and kyle, mostly because I don't think Reck, Socrates, Saint or Cathart are suspicious.

Actually, I think I am suspicious of Maoi too.

[Hoopla]

- Why are you not paying attention to things in this game (I.E. the fact that I claimed mason)?
- Was your claim that you never fakeclaimed as scum a joke or not?
- Why have you declined to try and scumhunt at the beginning of Day 2 (besides your feeble attempt to put suspicion on me)?

1) I don't know. I'm sorry, I just haven't been interested in playing. It's more a me thing than anything else I'd say.
2) Yes. I thought that was pretty obvious, considering half the players here were in Commie Mafia.
3) I haven't declined. I never said 'HEY NOT GONNA BOTHER DOING ANYTHING TODAY'. I understand it looks this way though.

Do you have other questions for me?

[Hoopla]

If there was a vigilante, why am I (and to a lesser extent kyle) still alive after Night 1. I don't remember anyone really being that suspicious of nhammen.

[Hoopla]

If there was a vigilante, why am I (and to a lesser extent kyle) still alive after Night 1. I don't remember anyone really being that suspicious of nhammen.

Charter, is this a scum slip or am I just crazy?

I don't understand. Explain to me.

Also, Charter wouldn't be that stupid to shoot nhammen if he was town aligned.

[Hoopla]

Now that I think about it, I really think this set-up only works with a Vig. This gives town the opportunity to off a scum-mayor at night. It's a ridiculous mechanic if you've got three different factions in the game. What's the point of adding in a fancy mechanic if you've already got a set-up with a mish-mish of roles. I think we're likely to be playing in mostly vanilla set-up with 3 scum, vig, 2 masons. Maybe one other role. Anything more and you overcomplicate a game with a retarded mechanic.

[Hoopla]

You seem to know that SerialClergyman was the mafia kill. I see no reason to assume that.

Who other than me would shoot SC?

[Hoopla]

Oh okay, I see your point now. I assumed SC would be more threatening than nhammen to the scum team.

[Hoopla]

At least me dying will provide some information to the town. Sorry for being rubbish.

[Hoopla]

Hoopla, have you joined any other games besides this one since Commie Mafia and is so links plz

.

Hi DDD, here is a link to 863 and 865. I've also been in 869, but that isn't finished yet, but you can look there too if you want.

Thanks, unfortunately for you, your play here looks a lot more like it did in the scum game you listed than the town game.

I assumed you'd come to that conclusion, and maybe others would too.

About meta cases; I very rarely see an effective one. Mostly because they are so heavily dependant on the player not knowing they're committing the same action for that alignment. Many players miss that point. Any player that is self-aware of specific parts of their play is capable of manipulating it. This doesn't even bring into account the ridiculously small sample size most players use to form their town/scum meta on a player.

For me personally, I'm sure there are things I do more on either alignment, but this is only effective for other players to use against/for me if it is something I'm unaware of. To assume I'm scum based on my activity/glib posts is to assume I'm unaware I've played like this before as scum, which in turn is to assume I'm awfully dim or forgetful. I can assure you my (poor) play this game relates directly to time/interest, of which I had little.

My hope is that meta cases become less important in games, because most people don't do it right or don't collect enough data. It is the easiest way to trick your mind with misinformation, and an even easier way to just find what you're looking for without considering other motivations/possibilities. Stick to the game you're playing in, and keep meta in the background.

(this isn't a rant at you DDD, just my feelings in general)

[Hoopla]

For what it's worth, my guesses are that Reck is town, and that charter is scum. These are the two major vibes I'm getting right now.

[Hoopla]

Yes.

[Hoopla]

So your feeling is that Charter came out of the gate and bussed his partner from post 1 and never let up?

I don't know.