Mini 851 - Bloodlust Mafia! - Game Over

[RayFrost]

/confirm

first, cuz I'm cool like that

[RayFrost]

/YARR

/AAAAAYEEEEE?

[RayFrost]

Yes, we are. Now get your ass into that QT :p

Well... I know who I'm voting for when the game begins.

[RayFrost]

Bob the Mob would be cooler

But then he'd be the scum godfather, and we don't need one of those in our midst.

[RayFrost]

haha, you should join our society of hammah!ing

Who all is included in the society, other than you and scope?

[RayFrost]

We had some back in the olden days, but theyre gone mostly.

Of course fritZler is KIND OF around, but not really.

CES is gone

ibby and babygurl are both gone too ={

That sucks.

I'd be willing to join the society of hammah!ing 'pending on the rules and regulations.

[RayFrost]

We had some back in the olden days, but theyre gone mostly.

Of course fritZler is KIND OF around, but not really.

CES is gone

ibby and babygurl are both gone too ={

That sucks.

I'd be willing to join the society of hammah!ing 'pending on the rules and regulations.

We will be holding rush in the upcoming weeks.

What is "rush"

[RayFrost]

We had some back in the olden days, but theyre gone mostly.

Of course fritZler is KIND OF around, but not really.

CES is gone

ibby and babygurl are both gone too ={

That sucks.

I'd be willing to join the society of hammah!ing 'pending on the rules and regulations.

We will be holding rush in the upcoming weeks.

What is "rush"

youll find out when you hit big kid school

So... college isn't big kid school?

Eh, you mean never then.

[RayFrost]

vote: Haylen

she admitted to being scum in pre-game chat. of course she gets the vote!

[RayFrost]

unvote, Vote: ChiboSempai

because potato peelers are deadly weapons, so only scum would be worried about losing them!

[RayFrost]

Haylen was the one worried about loosing it, I was merely making the same deduction as you are, just from a different point of view

you have convinced me!

unvote, vote: haylen

[RayFrost]

I didn't know looker had a sister...

Of course, it'd make sense that the Spammah Hammah would have handcuffs on the sister, though.

[RayFrost]

I'd HAMMAH! haylen for kicks and giggles

willing to buss your partner already?

[RayFrost]

oh, forgot about the other two pages after reading pg 3

unvote

What is the reasoning for the almaster & chibo wagons?

[RayFrost]

oh, forgot about the other two pages after reading pg 3

unvote

What is the reasoning for the almaster & chibo wagons?

The wagon on me is just intuitive.

From what I understand, both are.

Intuition still needs something to guide it, though.

[RayFrost]

hmmm...

Well, I'm not seeing discussion go anywhere...

gah, this is why I prefer replacing in >.<

vote: almasterGM

cuz a bandwagon starts discussion!

[RayFrost]

Yeah, Chibo's has reasoning behind it, can't really see any decent reasoning on Almaster though, apart from "It's a random bandwagon, lets just roll with it"

What is your reasoning for voting Chibo, then?

[RayFrost]

Do you intend to reply to his defense, or are you goign to pretend that it isn't there?

In my defense - well, there really isn't one. Think about it. The same could be said about anyone. If I were to target someone else, how would they be able to defend themselves.

[RayFrost]

soooo...

you intend to actually y'know, post some stuff, looker?

or do you intend to just selectively quote everything you want to say for the rest of the game?

[RayFrost]

You're growing on me. Don't listen to X, I know absolutely nothing about Mafia. What I was trying to point out, though, is that Rosso instructs us to put votes on almaster when he, himself is not voting at all. It could be that he's trying to lay low but I don't know. Like I said, my thoughts formulate, they're never really...there yet...

"growing" on you? Oh dear, I wouldn't want to be a fungus...

So your thoughts... move but never reach the destination?

Basically, you just said your thoughts are always unfinished, right?

[RayFrost]

Pretty much, now let's see how you can turn this against me. I'm curious.

Well, if I wanted to turn it against you, I could by saying the following:

You just admitted that you never actually complete your thoughts and thus can't ever get complete, or accurate, reads on people. In addition, you admitted that any of your opinions change from post to post, which thus gives you an out for any sudden shifts in view point, which is something only scum would need to do (wiggling out of a tight spot of thinking your partner, who is going to get lynched, is town to bussing them, for example). Not to mention that you also give yourself an out from any real pressure based upon your pinions because you can say "well that was my opinion,

then

, but it's changed now."

Would you like me to actually turn everything you say against you, or are you fine with me just pointing out the things I find scummy?

[RayFrost]

Strangely enough, I'd

love

it if you enlightened me as to all of my faults and faulty logic. It helps, playing this game. It helps to point out just how stupid I really am and what I can do to change that.

But, either way, you're wrong. You're horribly, atrociously wrong. Anyway, who do you think will get lynched today? Or should I say mislynched today?

Eh, you not being good at the game says nothing about your level of intelligence. It does say something about your level of adaptivity, but that's another issue...

Also, are you bringing stuff from other on-going games into our involvement in this game? That's a no-no, looker. *wags finger*

Also, I honestly don't know who will be lynched today. There has yet to be enough valuable conversation to get an accurate read on any of the players, and it's still barely getting out of RVS.

And saying "mislynched" implies that you know we won't be finding scum this day and lynching them. What leads you to that conclusion?

[RayFrost]

Adaptivity...?

On-going games? That's a negative.

Ray we never lynch scum on D1. We lynch assholes, outcasts, and idiots on D1, you know that.

yeah, adaptivity... the ability to adapt to a new environment.

okay, then.

wrong, wrong, and wrong.

It is possible to lynch scum D1, and it has happened in numerous games elsewhere in the site. We don't lynch assholes, cuz assholes can still help find scum. We don't lynch outcasts cuz outcasts can still find scum. We don't lynch idiots unless they make idiotic scum slip ups, in which case we have lynched scum anyway.

do try to display that you have

some

mafia experience, looker... you are acting like more of a newbie than I am, and I've barely joined MS.

[RayFrost]

I don't have experience, I merely do what they tell me to do. Post this and post that, they never notice the music of things, the rhythm, the harmony.

Okay, so basically, you admit to being an easily swayed individual that doesn't think for themself and follows orders without consideration of alignment, motives, or really anything. So, basically, you don't really make use of your admittedly only partially formed thoughts in a way that would help town...?

[RayFrost]

::shrug:: I try, but then people come behind me and accuse me of being scum for not posting PbPAs and sharing my thoughts, which they want to be just like theirs. Ring any bells, RayFrost?

1. not sharing your thoughts is scummy.

2. you are referencing an on-going game, which is against the rules, even if it is a vague reference.

3. if you are going to blame me for that stuff, do it in the game where it is happening. Each game is separate and should not affect reads elsewhere.

[RayFrost]

I think you're town this time around, btw.

"this time around" implies that you thought I was scum in some game we are in...?

Also, what makes you think I'm town so early in the game?

Also, the "calling somebody scummy for disagreeing" was something that happened

in an on-going game

, so you were referencing the events in a game that was on-going... but I digress.

[RayFrost]

I don't, I just feel like telling you that to let your guard down. What's the probability of one of the top four being scum?

Eh, stuff like that is just a nuisance, not shocking.

Also, probability this early in the game...

1/n

where n is the number of people alive in the game. nothing to change a read from neutral for any of them so far.

[RayFrost]

So you do this with math? It's all numbers to you? That's strange... Well, I guess that's the only way you

can

do it, though...but still.... Never mind. It's getting late, I have to get to bed. I start Kindergarten tomorrow.

バニラの町
(Good Night)

Nah, not all numbers to me. I'm just saying that I don't know, and I figured math would make it seem all mystical and stuff. seriously, though... I don't really use math, and that math was wrong anyway. It'd be v/n with n being the number of players alive and v being the number of scum if I was going down that route.

Anyway, -proper- Japanese good night is

oyasuminasai

except in kana.

[RayFrost]

hmmm...

Well, I'm not seeing discussion go anywhere...

gah, this is why I prefer replacing in >.<

vote: almasterGM

cuz a bandwagon starts discussion!

Sooo why didn't you just join a bandwagon that's already in place? Chibo looks like a great bandwagon right now.

1. I believe there is also an almaster wagon

2. both are just random wagons to get discussion going as far as I can tell

3. as zach said... why are you trying to direct my vote?

[RayFrost]

You can vote how you want, RayFrost.

Then why were you implying that I

should

be voting for Chibo?

Do explain why you said what you said and answer my question...

[RayFrost]

You can vote how you want, RayFrost.

Then why were you implying that I

should

be voting for Chibo?

Do explain why you said what you said and answer my question...

I wasn't implying anything, I just think that Chibo needs to have a bandwagon on him. Talk about nitpicking! I saw something in his posting style that I didn't particularly like, but I cannot make a case unless he posts more. Another way I can see the possible scumtell is getting a bandwagon on him. I don't intend to lynch.

Okay... why not expand upon what you don't like about his posting?

And if it is playstyle, then that's a poor case in of itself, unless you have meta to go off of.

[RayFrost]

Eh, if he was doing it, then it is something we can note in his previous posts. If his posting style changes as a result, that will be scummy on his part (avoiding it rather than trying to explain it).

[RayFrost]

-snip-

The big problem I'm seeing here is that multiple people are being targeted with no real reason.

So, what do you intend to do to alleviate this problem, hmmm?

Peabody, you really should post your evidence on Chibo, considering that there is not much to go off of so far. It might help with discussion.

[RayFrost]

I say we focus on determining whether scum lies amongst Konowa, Chibo, Haylen, and Almaster.

Can you please tell us why? (Why you think it's one of us four, anyway.

Also, isn't that some sort of tunneling? Which we want to avoid doing? Yeah, sure, putting pressure on the four people you mentioned is fine, but focusing on them is just silly.

vote looker

Hi Haylen!!!!

Have anything to say about the other players and interactions so far in the thread?

[RayFrost]

sniped/ninjaed by almaster

alma, same question

[RayFrost]

I believe you mean page 6 >.>

Also, I am kinda wary of a looker lynch at this stage of the game because of an... experience with looker-town.

So far, looker's played close to looker-town meta (meta is gained from an on-going, so I can't link, sorry).

A looker-town is pretty incompetent and has no real leads and is pretty much a baby in ability.

I don't have any experience with looker-scum, so this might be the same either way.

I'd like to hold off on voting for a bit until I get a better read on looker.

pre-edit:

looker sniped me

[RayFrost]

HA HA HA!!! You're priceless. So, is Chibo scum? Is Rosso scum? IS LOOKER SCUM?!?! I am SOOOOO high right now it doesn't even make any sense...

Ever thought about being high actually causing mental damage?

Anyway... I don't know who the scum are. It'll take some time for that to happen... in the meantime:

oi, non-posters, such as canadianbovine and rosso!!! post dammit!!!![/b]

[RayFrost]

Hey, what did you mean by "Looker sniped me"?

posted while I was in the process of making my own post.

[RayFrost]

Have anything to say about the other players and interactions so far in the thread?

The former, actually.

So you only have something to say about the players, nothing about the interactions so far?

SCUM

canadianbovine

- hasn't done ANYTHING except confirm and random vote. Literally, he has two posts.

Haylen

- switcher her vote twice (outside of RVS) to jump on random bandwagons. Hardly gives any analysis in her posts. What few posts she does have are beefed up with pointless questions.

Looker

- plays the n00b card multiple times, but has been registered since February. Huh?

Rosso Carne

- hasn't said anything relevant to the game AT ALL.

Zachrulez

- Lurky

Pomegranate

- V/LA

Konowa

- V/LA

RayFrost

Peabody

J-Fox

ChiboSempai

TOWN

I like the fact you gave reasoning for the top four, but what is your reasoning for puttine me, peabody, J-Fox, and chibo in our respective spots?

[RayFrost]

Looker

- plays the n00b card multiple times, but has been registered since February. Huh?

Registered because I was bored, didn't like it, posted random BS and then stopped.

Once I moved to Japan

, I started up again because I was bored, am currently posting random BS, and should probably stop...

Are you stalking me?

[RayFrost]

So you only have something to say about the players, nothing about the interactions so far?

I read the thread and it just confused me, so, no.

I like the fact you gave reasoning for the top four, but what is your reasoning for puttine me, peabody, J-Fox, and chibo in our respective spots?

There isn't much reasoning behind it, it's more of just a feel. If I had to say something, it'd be that you've actually contributed content to the thread. I dislike giving "evidence" for someone being town because it infers the person is safe.

Eh, you can give reasons, and they can do something scummy that alters your read of them. Stating your reasons gives other people a greater insight into your viewpoints

as well as

giving people a chance to disagree/agree/expand with/upon your reasoning.

[RayFrost]

Looker

- plays the n00b card multiple times, but has been registered since February. Huh?

Registered because I was bored, didn't like it, posted random BS and then stopped.

Once I moved to Japan

, I started up again because I was bored, am currently posting random BS, and should probably stop...

Are you stalking me?

We've already gone over this. I was here first.

We actually haven't.

I've been here for about three years (in Japan).

Anyway, this s non-game related, so yeah... don't respond to this.

How about you post your own reaction to Almaster's post, Looker?

[RayFrost]

I find the fact rosso and canadianbovine have only replied after their absence was pointed out to be suspicious. If they were going to be away, they should have said so. Not providing this information is, at minimum, very annoying and makes discussion more difficult.

unvote, vote: rosso

He didn't provide much of a reason for being gone, and that makes it seem like he was active lurking, which is the scummiest thing so far that can't be attributed to playstyle.

[RayFrost]

what happened in that four minute time slot that made you decide to vote for Rosso?

RayFrost voted Rosso. I believe the bandwagon is good. I want more out of him. Also my opinion did not change from post 204 to 206.

I'm so tempted to just vote rosso for the lack of posts relating to the game. No offense, they are hilarious though.

So the only reason you decided to vote was the fact somebody else voted?

If you found him scummy, you obviously should have done so regardless of who other people voted for.

@ Pom: there are about 4 or 5 votes on rosso.

[RayFrost]

mod sniped me with the vote count >.<

Sha-

ZAM

!

[RayFrost]

Well, we can start by him calling for suspicion on both you and almaster (votes and stuff) with no real reasoning and not even voting for both of you, which is a sign taht he wishes to direct the town to his own preferences with basically a "because I said so" mindset, though he may have reasons (he isn't saying them, so yeah).

[RayFrost]

Rosso, you completely misread his list.

consider it a scale

closer to this end is scum
people
people
people
people
people
closer to this end is town

[RayFrost]

wtf is this hammah bullshit, hes just annoying me at this point

tsk, tsk, tsk.

An emotional reply to his playstyle and saying it is bs is rude and insulting. Not to mention that it detracts from actual town conversation and scumhunting and possibly leads to a large argument over nothing worthwhile. If you have such a problem with his playstyle, you have some options:

ask him to change it

replace out

continue playing and suck it up

a combination of the above

[RayFrost]

Rosso:

care to explain how the wagon on you is scummy?

[RayFrost]

Rosso:

care to explain how the wagon on you is scummy?

its a lurker wagon

except im not lurking.

one person says im lurking and then some bs about how i havent voted.

its convenient for the people who have gotten on towards the end, but no one has any actual reasons for being on me. Pressure votes are pretty feeble, I have my playstyle and I stick to it, like i said, because i want to win.

Via your playstyle, how do you promote discussion without bandwagons and the like?

[RayFrost]

And what methods are in the "correctly" category?

questions?

calling other people scum without support?

claiming scum?

[RayFrost]

unvote

It's not going to be all that helpful.

[RayFrost]

unvote

It's not going to be all that helpful.

noted

It was a pressure vote on you. =/ you are obviously ignoring pressure on you, so it's not going to be helpful on you.

[RayFrost]

Trying to spark some different activity since the only way people have been trying to get tells at the moment are from bandwagon votes. I also want to justify my current vote, or find a reason to change it if needed.

Questions for Looker:
(interested in the responses)

1. Who are you currently suspecting, or considering voting for D1?

2. Who have you been suspicious of the whole game so far, and explain any of the changes if this list differs from the answer for Q1.

3. How many games of mafia have you played before? Were they on mafiascum or somewhere else?

4. Why should I or we not vote for you?

5. If you were in a mafia game on Day 1 and there was someone you absolutely knew was independent that had a small chance of being a Jester or a Lyncher and someone who many people had a scumtell on from some suspicious replies - which one would you vote for?

6. What is the best way to play mafia as a townie? Do you follow this mindset?

He wanted you to answer these questions as well as looker, though he said that in a different post.

[RayFrost]

I am uncertain about Chibo's vote... it seems more "you aren't helping town" than "you are probably scum" reasoning. getting rid of the most detrimental to town when you have no scum reads is great, but...

[RayFrost]

Wait, missed the second post. What relation?

How is it that you've missed every tie to every other player within this thread? You can't simply acknowledge one to your convenience, that's not fair or right at all. If anything, it'd look more like I had a relationship with you because my vote was on you originally...wouldn't it? Heck, I don't know, I'm just a n000000000b.

your skirting around a detrimental observation is noted.

way to protect your scum buddy.

I understand that everyone is connected, were in a game. But your play sucks, and yet chibo comes to your side right away.

theres your scum pair people.

We have three scum.

Who do you think the third is?

[RayFrost]

re J-fox:

If I remember correctly what post you are referencing, you are asking about the question I put to Rosso saying there are three scum, and asking who the third is from his point of view...

In this case, Rosso had stated the two he found to be scum, but not the third or the SK players. Because of this, I was curious if he had any scum reads from other players. It helps to know the opinion of the other players and their reasoning in one's own scum hunting.

FoS: Almaster

cuz fencesitting on its own isn't scummy enough to vote for.

Pome, Konowa, and everybody else catching up:

what are your reads/feelings about the number of interactions so far in the game?

[RayFrost]

She probably fell asleep.

[RayFrost]

And could everyone please try to spell my name correctly?

Would you prefer I type Pomegranate over Pome/Pom?

[RayFrost]

unvote

Rosso's Post 280 - I call your bluff. You have nothing scummy on me, and way to call "scum" everyime someone disagrees with you. On top of that, I don't see how my play sucks and, on top of THAT, I don't see how Chibo has extended any extra courtesies to me than any other player. I think you're reaching, bud.

Rosso's Post 286 -

"Lynching someone becasue they dont play the game how you think it should be played is just detrimental to the game."

You're exactly right.

Konowa's Post 300 - How am I apathetic?

@ Peabody & Rayfrost: How you feelin' about Rosso Carne? Scumminess or playing style?

Playstyle for now.

Like Pomegranate said, it's probably better to let him live for now. If he's town, he'll be a huge asset. If he's not, we can deal with him a little bit later. Why gamble at high stakes when one can gamble with less to lose?

[RayFrost]

Okay, Mr. RayFrost, I have another question for you. Do you believe that either of you and Peabody are scum? If so, who? If not, ok.

I know I'm not scum.

I have a neutral, leaning town read on peabody so far, so I don't think either of us are scum.

My view on myself won't change, but my view on peabody will depending upon his future actions.

Do you believe that either of you and rosso are scum/third party? If so, who and why? If not, okay.

[RayFrost]

Just like yours, my thoughts have yet to cement themselves. Knowing myself to be rather town, I guess I'll just have to wait for Rosso's vote before answering your question.

(That wasn't

that

blatant of a deflection, was it?)

wasn't a deflection at all.

It was stalling instead.

[RayFrost]

type up a summary or something.

[RayFrost]

mmhm. would HAMMAH! looker

I'm guessing you'd HAMMAH! anyone right now to get out of the hotseat, am I right?

Looker, you know that Rosso will only HAMMAH! people, so saying you'll wait until he votes is saying "during D2/Twilight." I expect that post you promised within the next couple of days, rl time. Stalling isn't helpful for town.

[RayFrost]

Unvote: Vote: Peabody

Do you often misrepresent people so blatently?

Do you often vote people for one instance of misrepresentation without waiting for an explanation?

[RayFrost]

Unvote: Vote: Peabody

Do you often misrepresent people so blatently?

Do you often vote people for one instance of misrepresentation without waiting for an explanation?

Any thoughts on that misrep by the way?

It's really bad, especially because he responded to the person who actually typed the quote he tried to use against Looker. Are you liable to believe that it was really some kind of mistake on Peabody's part?

I find it to be worth looking into, but not something to arbitrarily vote over.

I think it

is

a possibility that he did. I want to wait for his response before hounding him.

[RayFrost]

Well it's a reason, on day 1, early in the game.

What makes it any more arbitrary than the wagon that formed on Rosso?

Rosso's was pressure. This one has a reason.

I'd rather see if the reason is valid before, y'know, voting. I won't be voting for pressure if I do vote, so yeah.

[RayFrost]

Woops! I'm sorry dude, I must have misread the name. My bad. Thanks for pointing that out.

...

that's your response?

you misread the name?

so you misread AlmasterGM to read Looker...

not buying it.

unvote, vote peabody

[RayFrost]

He responded.

I didn't like his response.

I thus am hounding him.

[RayFrost]

My post was surely an accident. It wouldn't make sense for me as mafia to blatantly misrepresent somebody. I'm sorry, I just got Alamaster and Looker confused.

I truly am trying to scumhunt. I apologize to the town, for if you lynch me, I just hurt the town. Sorry!!

WIFOM in front...

AtE in back.

Vote stays.

[RayFrost]

He responded.

I didn't like his response.

I thus am hounding him.

I'm not complaining. I'm glad your vote is on him. I'm just somewhat amused because of the exchange we had prior to your vote.

You are amused that I kept my word on it? fun.

[RayFrost]

mmhm. would HAMMAH! looker

I'm guessing you'd HAMMAH! anyone right now to get out of the hotseat, am I right?

Looker, you know that Rosso will only HAMMAH! people, so saying you'll wait until he votes is saying "during D2/Twilight." I expect that post you promised within the next couple of days, rl time. Stalling isn't helpful for town.

I

promised? I thought Haylen promised a post but she lost it. You sure it was me?

And then you say this...

Unvote: Vote: Peabody

Do you often misrepresent people so blatently?

Do you often vote people for one instance of misrepresentation without waiting for an explanation?

Any thoughts on that misrep by the way?

It's really bad, especially because he responded to the person who actually typed the quote he tried to use against Looker. Are you liable to believe that it was really some kind of mistake on Peabody's part?

I find it to be worth looking into, but not something to arbitrarily vote over.

I think it

is

a possibility that he did. I want to wait for his response before hounding him.

Is this some kind of trick? Are you and Mr. Peabody on teams?

You said you have a post on the way.

Also, I was saying I'd rather wait for Peabody's RESPONSE than just rush it. Y'know, holding off to see if he has a good explanation or not.

[RayFrost]

But either way, your vote was on him, too, so I won't feel that bad. I voted him because he crossed me. You, on the other hand, why, you're just opportunistic scum.

And where do you get the idea that I'm scum, again? It seems to match that you'd find me scum for no real reason... and saying you got rid of peabody

because he crossed you

shows a very mafia-esque mindset... kill all those that oppose you.

[RayFrost]

I know, right, it makes me feel like REAL Mafia, y'know? And I like that word, Mafia-esque. Are you some kind of a poet, RayFrost?

I'm not a poet, though it'd be fun if I was.

cuz then I'd be able to do:

<insert poetic speech of awesomeness here>

[RayFrost]

lol. I'm pretty confident that peabody will turn up scum; however, if he doesn't, I'm even more confident that I'll be able to discern who is with a confirmed alignment and some past interactions. it'll work out, RayFrost, town will win.

Hmmm... what if he turns up SK?

[RayFrost]

Do you suspect Peabody to be SK?

It's a possibility.


re the ql:

>.> not my fault it got jumped so quickly by others. as it is, it was a legitimate fail on peabody's part that, depending on his flip, can be called a scum fail, sk fail, or town fail. I'm leaning more likely scum/sk fail.

[RayFrost]

Seven votes in less than nine hours resulting in a lynch,

without

letting him claim is a very scummy wagon. If he flips scum, score, the wagon is still scummy though.

I personally would have preferred the claim as well... I didn't know the VC, though. =/

[RayFrost]

I'm tired of Day 1. It's tl;dr

Unvote. Vote: Peabody.

RAWR! GO HAMMAR GO!

The scummiest vote in the wagon (imo) is this one.

He did it purely because

he is tired of Day 1

.

Also, he didn't even read D1, so yeah... ummm... yeah...

[RayFrost]

Konowa:

you asking me & chibo or just chibo?

[RayFrost]

Chibo. Apologies for not making it clear.

While you are here though Ray, what are your opinions on Chibo thus far?

slight scummy read on him...

Some of his mid-early posts felt a little like he was buddying up to me by agreeing with my opinions and stuff. cuz of that, I can't really argue that his cases themselves are scummy, just the fact he finds stuff suspicious that I find suspicious... mostly after I've stated my suspicions.

[RayFrost]

gah, white screen killed me and I dped by accident.

mod, mind deleting one of those for me?

Done.

[RayFrost]

Oh my... I say I find him scummy and then... he finds me scummy...

I have a taste of OMGUSoup. Should that taste be in my mouth?

I called Peabody out on Ate a few times as well, why not at least get

everything

I called peabody out on in that post

Also, I did want a claim. I was not expecting a Quick Lynch.

Also, I believe konowa asked what the scummiest vote was... oh, wait, you agreed with me on that...

so... I can apply the trying to determine what the scummiest vote was argument on you... thta pretty much makes it null/hypocritical there...

[RayFrost]

Didn't read any of this page when I made my post, mafiascum went down for a couple mins when I was scouring through the votes on Peabody and it made me take a while to do my post.

Do you mind refreshing on what things I was agreeing with you on Ray? It's not a big deal or anything, I'm just curious. Agreeing isn't technically a bad thing, I mean if I thought the same thing and you had said it first, then I'm agreeing with you, no sense in writing out the exact same thoughts. Almost the entire Peabody wagon was everyone agreeing with each other, Pomegranate even specifically quoted you and saying he agreed with you here:
http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 11#1878311

Also, with my last post, I don't know about the whole following your opinion holds since I found your post/vote one of the scummier ones in the Peabody ordeal.

Biggest thing that pops into my head is the looker situation scenario stuff.


Also:

Hi CanadianBovine!!!

why don't you say why you found Almaster's vote to be the scummiest?

Also, why not weigh in with why you voted for peabody?

[RayFrost]

FoS: chibosempai

for finding me suspicious only after konowa started questioning the stuff and not really having much in the way of suspicion (reaching). Scummy enough for a FoS but not a vote in of itself just yet.

[RayFrost]

1. I am the vigilante, and the

SK can not forgo his night kill

. He had to have chosen someone.

emphasis mine.

Oh my, seems like you made a slip, chibo. How would you know he/she can't unless you were the SK, hmmm? Oh, wait... you couldn't!!!

vote: ChiboSempai

let's lynch this SK and his fakeclaiming ass.

Also:

chibo really seems to be repeating the same points over and over without actually responding much to the points given (or trying to twist them to match up with him being the vig... which I doubt he is).

[RayFrost]

The wiki says the SK can't normally forgo the night kill, but I'm asking the mod if he can choose not to just to make sure.

1. if you check the mafia discussion place, you'll be able to note that there is an entire thread devoted to when a SK should kill.

2. All killing roles (except for the ones that explicitly say they can't and that is an integral part of their role) are able to forego a kill.

3. For a SK, this is suboptimal play, and it is common for SKs to claim vig in order to avoid suspicion.

4. SK will kill every night in order to reach endgame faster,

but

this is not required and would be evidence against you anyway (considering you did the kill last night...)

Conclusion: Chibo is the SK who killed looker.

If there

is

a vig, they should not CC and they should continue to be stfuing about their role.

Earlier chibo posts about possible vig = role fishing, more evidence.

chibo is sk, kthnxbai.

[RayFrost]

There's the suspicion on Alamaster as well, quickly ending the lynch yesterday and quickly jumped onto me as well after CB said he was the Tracker compared to someone like J-Fox.

Believe me on this, why else would RayFrost push for this right now so strongly?

Give me one more day to prove that I'm vigilante and not SK.

RayFrost, explain yourself.

You have no way of "proving" it bar a cop investigation. You've contradicted yourself in your posts, and I hardly think this is "strongly" pushing a lynch.

It's me saying I think you are obv SK, and I am thus voting appropriately.

[RayFrost]

Point out every contradiction I have made. It's because of your flat out conclusion in your last post #500 where you are false.

Does anyone have hard evidence where I am SK and not Vig? No. They just assume I am lying through my role claim.

I want to know from the Mod if the SK is able to choose to not kill one night if they wish not to.

Again, let me further prove to you guys that I am on the town side, a vigilante. Let's find two people we suspect of scum or SK, and take them both out. Whatever it takes. The town is already at a pretty fair disadvantage.

ummm... you claim to not be the SK yet know "the sk must kill every night" is a pretty big one.

and the konowa one I pointed out earlier. pro-town player would want to get suspicions out as soon as possible without needing to be pressured for it... also note: I was supicious of you AT THE START OF THE DAY with valid reasons. The fact I'm actually sticking to my guns is hardly a surprise, considering your claim being a common sk claim AND the fact you said the sk much nk every time they can, which shows more knowledge than a vig would have, even if you try to cover it up now.

also:

your "suspicions" haven't been stated with reasoning, and the most recent stuff is pretty much OMGUS/deflection.

Continue with your attempts to throw suspicion onto me, and I will continue to show how your suspicions are desperate flailing in an attempt to save your hide.

[RayFrost]

The Serial Killer is a lone killer without allegiance. The Serial Killer kills once per night, and his goal is to be the sole survivor. Frequently they are not allowed by the Game Moderator to forgo their night kill.

That is why I'm brining up the whole SK kill every night thing. I want to know from the mod if that is the case from this game, and if so - what happens if the SK never sends their kill request?

Show whatever you want about me, say all of your suspicions. I have nothing to hide, I am the vigilante, not the SK.

quotes go in lower case and have a " " around what is in the equals sign.

eh, the wiki is really outdated then.

no request sent is generally a no action, but eh...

I already showed and said.

[RayFrost]

sry, most forums im at that quote code works, il keep it in mind

but yea, considering iv been told to referrence the wiki by a bunch of players as it is lol, cant blame me for following the wiki entry for SK

The wiki is good for the following:

learning what terms mean (lylo, l-1, NL, OMGUS, etc)

imo, not much else is all that useful.

Oh, and...

respond to my case against you that I have laid out since the start of the day

[RayFrost]

You mean post 446? I already explained that.

"since the start of the day" meaning the entirety of the case up to this point, not just the first post I made this day...

[RayFrost]

ummm... you claim to not be the SK yet know "the sk must kill every night" is a pretty big one.

and the konowa one I pointed out earlier. pro-town player would want to get suspicions out as soon as possible without needing to be pressured for it... also note: I was supicious of you AT THE START OF THE DAY with valid reasons. The fact I'm actually sticking to my guns is hardly a surprise, considering your claim being a common sk claim AND the fact you said the sk much nk every time they can, which shows more knowledge than a vig would have, even if you try to cover it up now.

also:

your "suspicions" haven't been stated with reasoning, and the most recent stuff is pretty much OMGUS/deflection.

Continue with your attempts to throw suspicion onto me, and I will continue to show how your suspicions are desperate flailing in an attempt to save your hide.

[RayFrost]

Hmm, this argument between Ray and Chibo appears to be getting nowhere. It's just them arguing the semantics of an SK in general, not just in this game, with Chibo continually re-iterating over and over that he is the Vig and he can "prove it" by killing (this despite both SK's and Vig's being able to kill anyway, so the ability to kill doesn't prove anything about your alignment). Chibo's already asked about this game, so we'll get an answer (if the mod wants to answer that particular question soon) and leave it at that, there isn't really any need to discuss issues that only really matter out the game in-game.

Ray, I'm not too sure I like your reasoning for voting Chibo, seems a little like you're jumping all over a fairly minor reason to try and justify a quicklynch ("Lets lynch this SK and his fakeclaiming ass"), why are you so keen to end the day so early, again?

It would probably be a bad idea to have today being completely about Chibo, hence, may I request we all post our 2nd biggest suspect (or biggest if it isn't Chibo), so we have something more to go into Day 3 with than just this? I'll say Almaster personally, as I've already stated, I found his reasoning for ending Day 1 early poor and illogical, and I'm very suspicious of him for it, as I think he's just BSing us with his attempted justification of it.

I feel like chibo is BSing.

Currently, Almaster

is

suspicious for the hammer, but I don't think that's reason enough to find him lynch-worthy.

I'm not pushing for a quick lynch so much as I am determined to have a chibo lynch, since I think he's sk. This doesn't mean I want chibo lynched immediately, just that he's my preference.

I want the chibo lynch, but I don't want a quick lynch. The two are not mutually inclusive.

Would you mind summarizing your case on almaster, so I get the full extent of it?

I'm comfortable with pome & zach. I have some issues with canadianbovine having posted very little content D1 and suddenly appearing D2 and pushing for a chibo lynch.

FoS: CB

[RayFrost]

Ray if you don't want a quick lynch then unvote me to allow more time for this Day. I'm only one vote away from being lynched, it only takes 5 and I'm at 4.

Next post coming in a sec with info on other suspicious people and the mods response.

Ah, so you are at L-1.

unvote

FoS: Chibo

[RayFrost]

Before I got a chance to post he outed one of the alternatives to me being the SK.

This is of course, exactly what I had happened.

Why would he say it first and say not gonna buy it? He wants people to think ahead of time that this is false so when I had to say it (since Alamaster knew it was the truth) people would already discredit it. So how could Alamaster know that was the truth? Perhaps he was the roleblocker. Even further, he used the term roleblocked, implying to being targeted by the roleblocker and not targeted from the jailer. Just a thought on that one. This leaves a chance that Alamaster is the Mafia roleblocker, in which case there is no Mafia tracker.

Do you mean "planned" in the bolded instead of happened? If so, why did you plan this out, exactly...?

Also, post just after the quoted one...

ummm... you found me suspicious cuz I voted you?

and how does me unvoting change said suspicions so easily?

[RayFrost]

I think Alamaster and Chibo are both good choices for lynches.

I think the only reason I'm wary on Chibo is because of the way the Peabody lynch turned out, but it's probably likely that I shouldn't be.

Why don't you just lynch me and make Chibo kill himself? That way you get rid of both of us at the same time. If Chibo is actually town he'll do it because the alternative is wasting a town lynch.

He already said he will

not

shoot himself.

re J-Fox:

I meant that as it is "let's lynch him." This does not say "let's lynch him right now!" or "let's end the day immediately!" or anything similar. My words there are -as is- without -implication-.

[RayFrost]

Hi, I'm back.

Scumlist:
(From scummiest to least scummy)
AlmasterGM
ChiboSempai
RayFrost
Haylen
canadianbovine
Konowa
J-Fox
Zachrulez

Would you mind explaining why you put each person where they are, not

just

Almaster and Chibo? It's kinda hard to see weaknesses/strengths in logic when the logic isn't given...

[RayFrost]

Almaster, who do you think are the scum/sk?

re Pome:

eeeeh... =/

I'm enthusiastic when I think there has been obv scum/sk caught. Would you prefer I had no enthusiasm? That usually leads to no posting for me... >.>

[RayFrost]

re Pome:

eeeeh... =/

I'm enthusiastic when I think there has been obv scum/sk caught. Would you prefer I had no enthusiasm? That usually leads to no posting for me... >.>

Calm down, I'm not that suspicious of you, and I'm pretty suspicious of Chibo. I'm just not sure who to vote for, Almaster or Chibo.

This is calm O.o Me not calm is me excited, for the most part.

Anyway, I was just explaining. I figure it is best to explain things for future reference rather than let people (possibly) make incorrect assumptions. Assumptions that are wrong are harmful to town.

The jailkeeper shouldn't target Chibo tonight. That'd complete defeat the purpose of, y'know, having him not "vig" tonight, since he'd be RBed out of doing it... subtle SK move, imo. I think my vote is currently still on him, so I'm keeping with that.

[RayFrost]

also to ray: you unvoted but FOS'd Chibo.

oh, okay.

He's not at L-1, then.

vote: ChiboSempai

if you are RBed due to jailing, you will not visit anybody, so the tracker being on you would have no value, since you'd be sitting in your house all night... basically. It'd be smarter if the tracker chose other targets.

The more you try to do this, chibo, the more I feel like you are scum/sk.

If you are RBed via jailing and are scum... you'd be doing this to seem town ("let's keep the PR alive" pro town mentality... seemingly) and have an excuse for when you don't turn up dead.

If you are scum, you are doing it this way for a forced NK that will "confirm" you are vig.

If you are vig, you aren't doing very well, tbh, and I highly doubt you are.

[RayFrost]

Everyone on my wagon. And that's not JUST because they're on my wagon.

orly?

Then do tell.

[RayFrost]

PR claim from Chibo...agree with post 586...people thinking my "lurking" is scummy...I've explained this...Ray trying to lead the possible PR's in post 579 (scummy)...J-Fox appears to have forgotten im in the game...I'm tired now, going to bed. Night night all.

Haylen, I know you've got the interpretive disorder, so...

I recommend you reread my post 579 if you still feel it was "leading the PRs" so that you can see I was responding to Chibo trying to lead the PRs and saying how that makes no sense and the plan put forth fails...

[RayFrost]

unvote

I agree that the vig (Assuming chibo-scum) should shoot chibo tonight if he''s still alive. It'd be a better option. Because of this, I intend to vote Almaster (unless somebody gets really scummy really fast or he becomes really townish really fast).

My intention will be followed through later in the game day.

[RayFrost]

Vote: AlmasterGM

L-1.

The whole self-hammering BS is anti-town

at best

. Not to mention the other problems.

[RayFrost]

where's haylen?

[RayFrost]

i'd like to point out that my response from mod didnt say that Chibo didnt go anywhere.

it just said that my attempt to track was unsucessful. didnt mention Chibo at all


which leads me to believe i was jailed

hmmm...

Mod would the jail count for last night, even though konowa was killed?

Yes, it would. If a player is killed, any night action they attempted that night still takes place.

also take into account that you could have been RBed...

[RayFrost]

vote: chibo sempai

you're scum or the sk.

I'm wondering why he didn't mention vig, only scum or SK.

well... three PRs for town, two have flipped, leaving one PR slot left, no?

The choice is between CB or chibo, and I've felt chibo was the SK for quite a bit, so...

[RayFrost]

How do we know that the SK is compulsive, it doesnt say it in the OP and I havent been in a game where the SK is compusive.

mod said the SK is compulsive

[RayFrost]

where's haylen?

Ray, I will tell you a little secret: When people ask me to post and keep pressuring me to post, it just takes longer for me to get an actual post up.

That being said, I'm going to try and get up a post this evening. (My time! Not anyone elses...)

I don't think we have a Vig, because there have only been two kills...unless the Vig or SK didn't kill and I've misread something somewhere?

I wasn't asking you to post or pressuring you to.

I was wondering where you were

[RayFrost]

Thus, the safest option is to assume that canadianbovine is the Mafia Tracker. Pomegranate and Serial Killer, please vote him with me asap to get 3 votes on him and push him to L-1. I'll explain why after.

Didn't you just imply that you think the scum & sk are among...

1. me

2. haylen

3. J-fox

4. canadianbovine

Also, doesn't this mean that you are taking pome's VT claim for granted on the assumption that she is, in fact, town?

[RayFrost]

As CanadianBovine said...

it's extremely simple for scum OR SK to fakeclaim VT, and taking claims out of hand is just stupid. Let's look at a highly possible scenario here:

pome is scum and fakeclaims VT to get town into the false dichotomy of chibo or cb (let's assume both are town for simplicity). Town lynches one or the other, they flip their claimed role. Assume SK and one scum die in the night for simplicity The next day, scum wins.

Pome is SK fakeclaiming cuz pome is just an idiot? In this situation, fakeclaiming VT as SK would have little value, imo... so I doubt pome is SK (little WIFOMish, but eh...)

Pome is scum with chibo/cb. Pome fakeclaim VT and pushes for CB lynch over chibo. (assuming CB is scum...) She would thus be bussing her partner to get town points, thus avoiding the SK kill... scum win in this situation too. Pome fakeclaims to protect chibo and lead the torch on the CB lynch, town loses.

In this situation, the chances for town are around 0% survival...

Our biggest (read:

only

) chance is if we lynch scum today, the scum and SK cross kill, and it comes down to 3p lylo.

In essence, town has an almost guaranteed loss. This is really a battle of the SK against the scum more than the town against both. I find the possibility of a pome/chibo scum partner thing to be slightly higher due to the fact chibo took pome's claim out of hand, no speculation, no suspicion... anything really. Pome is also saying she prefers a chibo (claimed vig, easily scum) lynch over a cb lynch (claimed tracker, also easily scum but harder to tell) when she was on for the chibo lynch just as much as the rest of us... the change of heart feels feigned.

[RayFrost]

lol yea its canadianbovine, not canadianbacon lolz

theres a reason its put to L-1 first then ask questions later. its a legit plan that will work for town. i cant say it because if i do the mafia will be able to counter it

I'm just going to point out a flaw in the very obvious plan that I read through very easily without needing to be told it at all...


Bussing. If scum realize your plan as easily as I did, they'll just be able to break your plan with that simple technique...

[RayFrost]

In essence, town has an almost guaranteed loss. This is really a battle of the SK against the scum more than the town against both. I find the possibility of a pome/chibo scum partner thing to be slightly higher due to the fact chibo took pome's claim out of hand, no speculation, no suspicion... anything really. Pome is also saying she prefers a chibo (claimed vig, easily scum) lynch over a cb lynch (claimed tracker, also easily scum but harder to tell) when she was on for the chibo lynch just as much as the rest of us... the change of heart feels feigned.

oh, and despite this... I find risking the chance of lynching PRs in this situation to be bad, which is why I'm not voting for chibo or cb. If somebody does the hammer early and the person hammered flips town/sk... town loses for sure.

Currently, I think I should examine the players other than chibo and cb to get some solid reads on them before coming to a decision with my vote...

[RayFrost]

~bumpin'~

[RayFrost]

1. Pome is female, not male

2. I said "no?" at the end because I didn't remember the set up, and I'm too lazy to check the OP. No conclusions made there except on a "if this is true, then" basis.

I'm more inclined to believe chibo is scum than Pome. If chibo flips vig, I'm willing to examine pome after (as well as CB if he doesn't die over the night).

[RayFrost]

1. Pome is female, not male

2. I said "no?" at the end because I didn't remember the set up, and I'm too lazy to check the OP. No conclusions made there except on a "if this is true, then" basis.

I'm more inclined to believe chibo is scum than Pome. If chibo flips vig, I'm willing to examine pome after (as well as CB if he doesn't die over the night).

Sorry Pome

Ray, this really should be a time you're willing to check such simple things as the OP, when the town is in such a critical and precarious position. Your apparent complacency (something that I'd expect a lot more from scum than town considering the scenario) is noted.

I don't often check the OP for things, as scum or town. I work off memory for it. Null tell.

What I won't work off of memory for is building a case on somebody new. If I've built one on them before, I'll use that along with any new evidence, but I do check up on posts for new evidence and new cases.

My "complacency" is one instance in which I say I did not check the OP at that time (and it was a hypothetical situation in of itself, so...).

[RayFrost]

I don't often check the OP for things, as scum or town. I work off memory for it. Null tell.

But since you weren't sure (you put the "no?" at the end of your sentence after all), surely it would have been best, for such a crucial in-game piece of knowledge (if there were only 3 PR's, then we narrow down to 2 suspects for the day, a major breakthrough) to make sure by checking the OP before posting?

Whether or not it's better than what I did is a gimme. I still don't do it. Arguing if it would be superior for me to do as a player in general is great and all, but it doesn't change the fact I don't.

[RayFrost]

I'm starting school tomorrow, J-time, so I'll likely have

limited access

, though I should have time to get on every day, no guarauntees.

[RayFrost]

If you get recruited into the cult, it acts like a mason group for town. The leader dying means no more can be culted. I dunno what'd happen with a scum/sk attempt. I think the leader would die....

re #4 of pome:

Of course, you just stated that you don't think chibo/CB could be the SK with the other scum/town...

Also, of course you would assume that all but one other is scum/sk, since you would take for granted you are town... however, nobody has that same luxury for anybody but themselves. Thus, that'd be a false dichotomy to take for anybody but you.

[RayFrost]

Wild Chibo has fled!

[RayFrost]

what's the vote count?

[RayFrost]

1. pome, what is your reasoning for thinking I'm scum?

2. candian

bacon

, what is your reasoning for thinking I'm scum?

3. How is that more convincing than evidence that others are scum?

[RayFrost]

whatever. its the internet.

rayy im sorry for being on your lynch.

if you check the times, there was a very quick lynch at 3 in the morning?

no problem. I was kinda looking forward to my first scum win oh well...

Anyway, I think some mistakes around the end was CB's (rather obvious) bus and J's lack of involvement around the lynch(es).

[RayFrost]

About RayFrost's lynch:
I feel that I've got a semi-accurate gut.

Eh, haylen had meta on me, chibo was just following a case of illogical thought, CB was bussing, and there was no case on me

I'd say, for you, that your gut may be accurate sometimes, but it really does need to have some support behind it.

[RayFrost]

whatever. its the internet.

rayy im sorry for being on your lynch.

if you check the times, there was a very quick lynch at 3 in the morning?

no problem. I was kinda looking forward to my first scum win oh well...

Anyway, I think some mistakes around the end was CB's (rather obvious) bus and J's lack of involvement around the lynch(es).

which bus?

you mean voting me

wasn't

a bus?

[RayFrost]

ah i didnt read the next post.

what could i of said?

i couldnt of said "no, i'd rather haylen"

what reason did i have?


i would of been lynched. i was going to do something...but 3 in the morning quicklynch?

Hrrrmm... I'd prob have recommended a subtler tact than "

vote: RayFrost

yeah I agree with you guys" as your generic reasoning. >.>"

bussing needs to be pro-active, a sudden & weak push for it won't do all that well. you gotta see what will come next and start the wave that's building up in the background before it gets out. Then you

seem

like a leader even when you aren't. Naturally, I can tell the theory behind it, but I fail at doing it (hence my being lynched )