Mini 730 - Hard Nights in the City - OVER!

[insanepenguin02]

/confirm

[insanepenguin02]

There's nothing like completely skipping the RVS and getting right into the game!

[insanepenguin02]

Penguin comments, but doesn't contribute to serious or non serious discussion, is that suspicious?

I was just surprised that things got hot and heated so quickly. I'm used to things starting slowly with a little bit of fun random voting. But I see that the methods shown by this group thus far has done a fine job of stimulating discussion therefore - no problem here!

[insanepenguin02]

The implication is from nameless is that gera is on the mafia side, to which gera respons something about 'us'. This is wifom as surely no mafia would imply that they are mafia. Or, would they? =P

Current serious level:-25%

Everything in this post is WIFOM - The use of 'us' is WIFOM, the 'or would they' is WIFOM, etc. But I see you are joking....or are you!

[insanepenguin02]

Calling "Random Voting" a stage is wrong. You may start with, but there is no distinct phase, seriousness and arguments just slowly build from there.

Come on, it is an unofficial phase.

Here's a question for whoever feels like answering it: If I now changed my vote to Megatheory, would that be suspicious and why?

I'll answer. Not really. It would put him at two votes. And you would need some sort of explanation as you and mega haven't really interacted at all just yet.

[insanepenguin02]

And FYI -

Vote: canadianbovine

BLAME CANADA!!!!

[insanepenguin02]

I would just say that talk is most of the time a benefit to the town. But scum can be opportunistic and add to the suspicion of innocent townies, which can stem from too much discussion or fingerpointing from an uneducated town.

Also I would agree that voting is the backbone of the game - how people react to a vote or building wagon on them can be the greatest tell as to what they are.

[insanepenguin02]

Now that I have some time to analyze and post, I figured I would give my assessment of how the game is going to this point. Enjoy! lol

First off, I

Unvote

because I now feel ready to make some real decisions as this game as picked up and we are getting down to business with some REAL good discussion happening so far.

Secondly, in my analysis of each person playing, I will use this scale:
1 = Definitely Scum.................5 = Neutral...........10 = Definitely Town

Atronach: 7 (Noob Town)

1) Seemed worried about the amount of "needless/useless" discussion between don and mega and doesn't think that it is relevant to the discussion. But no other thought on it? Do you think it is scummy or do you find it completely useless with no meaning?
2) You stated that you think too much time is being spent discussing and not finding scum. How would you prefer to look for scum? In my opinion, we find out the most info by voting and discussing.
3) I will completely agree with a comment that you have made though as after I did a complete read-through, I had the same feeling:

I also think it's possible that the two of them are deliberately derailing the game, too- I'm just not as sure about Mega.

4) One more question: Why did you say that you should FOS Plum and not Vote? And one more question (lol): You also state that you find more people more suspicious than Plum (or the other lurkers). Why?

canadianbovine: 4 (Lurking, little discussion Scum)

1) Bold move - 2nd post from canadian was a vote against chaos for not having a reason. I agree, it was suspicious but a vote? Why did you vote instead of FOS?
2) What do you think of chaos' reasoning behind his vote for mega?
3) This is the only part of the game thus far that you have contributed to. I would like your thoughts on more than this issue. You bring up people not starting discussion but you yourself haven't started much conversation. Please respond to some of the happening thus far as it will benefit us all.
4) Post more info.

chaosomega: 3

1) 4 posts thus far and only one with content.
2) Your vote with no reasoning presented was EXTREMELY suspicious! And then how do you follow it up?

Who says I don't have an explanation for it?
And Juls, you haven't voted yet. Why?

Why didn't you give your explanation then? You didn't have it yet? You wanted to keep us in the dark? Not very pro-town behavior there IMO. And then why did you point out Juls not voting yet? Do you think that by voting yourself (for no reason at that point) was better than somebody not voting at all?
3) In your last post (your reasoning behind Mega's vote), you say that there really isn't much to go on. So why did you vote instead of FOS? What do you think of don, the other end of the mega issue?
4) I agree with some points that you made against Mega such as: him looking suspicious after his "don't self vote" post, "convincing" don that self-voting is bad, and that he should be pressured.
5) In a way, I am feeling that you may be scum, aligned with Mega just due to your suspicioius behavior and vote on your scum-buddy Mega for no reason for a couple days.
6) Post more - it should only benefit you as the only things that you posted thus far have been heavily weighted towards suspicious behaviors. For now:

FOS:chaos

.

danchaofan: 7

1) Perhaps a little quick to pull the vote trigger on ger due to his WIFOM post. And then you follow it with your own "WIFOM" post about if mafia would do this or not. do you still find this suspicious? If so, why haven't you discussed it much more since voting? If not, why haven't you unvoted?
2) You said that you wanted mega's answer about his "pushing points early" but never posted any of your own thoughts on it. So what do you think about mega?
3) I like your "calling out" of Juls. I understand it was a joke but think that it is slowly becoming a valid point as she hasn't done much to change that perception yet.
4) Not too much of a scum vibe from you at this point but I would like to get some more analysis on the game from you. What do you think about what is going on? What is your reaction to having votes on you?

don_johnson: 3

1) First off, the self-vote which has been a good spark of discussion and has brought up the point about self-pointing (if it has one). It sure was ballsy to start off that way. I have to say that at first, I saw it as just something stupid and meaningless to get the game started for you, especially since you did unvote shortly after. But as time goes on, that feeling has changed....
2) THIS IS ALL THAT YOU HAVE TALKED ABOUT!!!! WHY?!?!?!
3) If I had to take a stance on you right now, I would say that you and mega agreed at the start of this game to throw a pointless conversation out there right off the bat so that you two scum buddies could really spin the heads of the townies. If this is true, it will be very interesting to see how it progresses. If this is false, you have mega to blame (and yourself a little) for really putting a bull's eye on you, in my eyes.
4) Please post something about another aspect of this game soon or I we will have no other info to work off of to get a fair picture of who you are. If you are town, I would get out of the arguement ASAP. Especially since the door was opened for you to finish but you didn't.

FOS: don_johnson

- post something more!

geraintm: 5

1) First, are you still in the game? I know that I need to wait until Monday for this answer and I am fine with that. But your last post hinted at you getting replaced so I just want to clarify.
2) I believe that you have only posted real-life info thus far with no game content. That all equals absolutely no read at this time. When you get back, please post ASAP with some game content, if you are still in the game...

Juls: 7

1) I want to know why you chose not even to throw a joke vote out there?

And Juls, you haven't voted yet. Why?

Because nothing has compelled me to vote yet. I was thinking about throwing a joke vote out there but conversation got underway. I don't think don_johnson is scummy for self voting and I dont thing megatheory is scummy for making a huge deal out of it. I am watching and reading and when I get ready to place a vote I will do so.

A vote of some kind would have been nice. You seemed to have gone against what you were saying. You said that votes spark discussion but then you say that you decided not to vote....
2) I thought that you were kind of skimming along but then you followed up with a great, analytical post (though against ME, lol), which makes me think that you have what is best for the town in your objectives. And the fact that you didn't want to partake in the "pointless" debate of self-voting, etc. and would rather see these analytical posts has me see you much more townie as a result.
3) What do you think of geraintm exactly? Do you think that he doesn't understand WIFOM? Or do you think it is a play? What is your opinion on the matter?
4) Thanks for posting my posts for me! (That was sarcastic) I have to say that I have been remaining active, giving my thoughts on what was going on at that time and trying to get a feel for the other people in the game. That gave me the needed info to make this sort of analysis. How do you feel about my amount of contributions in this post?
5) Lastly, I have to agree with you about don_johnson and mega being a "forced arguement". Do you therefore think that they are both scum? If we all find that they are not in this forced arguement, who (if any of them) would you still think is scum or suspicious?

Megatheory: 3.5

1) You voted for danchao for one reason (voting for somebody based on their thoughts on a possible lurking player) and later unvoted for another reason (danchao's reaction to votes). I have a couple questions here: IF that is the reason you voted for him, what do you still think of the issue, both about geraint being MIA and about danchao's initial vote on him? And then also, what impressed you so much about danchao's "reaction to the votes" on him that caused you to unvote?
2) Why are you SO intent on having don_johnson see the concept of self-voting your way? I would assume that you have already read what I have to say about don_johnson so you should know that I am eyeing the two of you as being possible scum buddies with a plan to spin the townies' heads with a pointless arguement. So why so much between the two of you????
3) What I find really interesting here is that you were also then quick to say that you were NOT pushing, voting, etc. for don_johnson. Why, you don't want your scum buddy to get votes on him? (That was mean, I'm sorry )
4) BUT you are fielding other people's questions, giving some analysis on other people, etc. so I don't think that you are as scummy as somebody like don. You seem to be attempting to get out info from others that would be pro-town but more analysis on what YOU think about others would be very insightful in my eyes.
5) However, posts like these make me really start to settle on the fact that you truly are scum:

Why are you implying that I'm scum? Do you find me suspicious? If so, why?

Why would you want to bring this up? So that you can get another's opinion and make yourself less scummy? Interesting....
AND, when asked if you would want to drop the arguement with don_johnson:

I'd love to, really, I would. But you are using such weird logic in this discussion. You are unwilling to recognize any risk to yourself, and you keep turning it back on me, like I will be lynched regardless of the fact that I'm not pushing you, nor did I find you suspicous before. You're certainly getting there, though.

All in all, I want to say:

Vote: megatheory

.

Nameless: 7.5

1) What was your plan behind stating you wish geraintm was mafia due to him being gone over the weekends?
2) Why is your vote still on danchao? Your reasoning initially was because of his reaction to geraintm being gone. What is it now?
3) I think that you have given some good insight into the game with such things as: analysis on mega, mafia/town sensitivity to votes, unnecessary votes, etc. At this point, there isn't much that I read from you (other than the top two points) that would suggest anything but town. However, please post more analysis on others in the game. If you had to, who would you choose as being the most townie and the most scummy thus far??

Plum: 8

1) Very insightful post by you on your thoughts on the game. Though it was hard to follow, I get a good feeling that you are wanting the best for the town.
2) Why is it obvious that geraintm's question was that he didn't understand what the WIFOM was for? I don't follow. Why couldn't it be that he didn't understand what WIFOM stands for?
3) Other than mega, who you voted for for good reasons IMO, who would you vote for if you could? Porkens? Who do you think is appearing t he most townie thus far?

Porkens: 4.5

1) PLEASE post more. You have 5 posts but little content. If you are town, this is bad play. If you are scum, this is a tell IMO.
2) why do you feel that mega suggested that he and don_johnson are town? What was there specifically in mega's post that brought this to your attention and made you think to bring it up to everyone? What do you now think of them and their arguement?
3) Why were you so hellbent for a little bit on lynching Nameless? And why wouldn't you want him to answer?! No matter the result of that lynching, we would have been working off of NO info and that makes it seem very scummy IMO. You seemed very certain but now, without any info about it, you changed your vote. Why? Was the first vote random, as you would almost suggest in your last post? This is so confusing....
4) I am patiently waiting for your additional thoughts because you really need them to come soon so that others don't start getting an uneasy feeling about your play so far....

Overall

So I hope this all makes sense as this has taken FOREVER!!!! I would like to know everyone's thoughts here. I have a few FOS's out and one new vote.

[insanepenguin02]

you are willingly hopping onto a bandwagon with two players you find scummier than the person you are trying to lynch. you rate both chaosomega and me as scummier than megatheory(co:3,dj:3, mt:3.5). yet you vote for megatheory. please explain your rationale behind this vote.

Thanks for focusing elsewhere.

To be honest, the third vote made on mega was made as I was making my near hour and a half post (watching fball too) so I thought that I was going to be vote 3. However, I am very comfortable with my vote on mega as his reaction and possible lynching will tell me much more about my other feelings and analyses that I didn't post of as well as the more general analysis that I posted.
I guess that that doesn't really affect me much (joining a forming wagon) as long as I am comfortable in my reasoning with my vote. I will VERY rarely vote unless I have very sound reasoning to vote.

I hope that answers your questions.

[insanepenguin02]

While I won't be quite as sarcastic about it as DonJ was about it, it

was

nice for you to put forth some decentish analysis and ask some relevent-seeming questions.

thank you.

Nameless makes a good point about Juls as well. Canadianbovine is yet another poster who needs to put forth some real substance. So Juls has voted Penguin for a post of little substance even though she's posted with little substance; Penguin expresses strong suspicions of ChaosOmega for lack of substance despite his previous general lack of substantial contribution.

Those who live in glass houses people, is all I'm saying. Hypocrisy is straight-up anti-town.

you are willingly hopping onto a bandwagon with two players you find scummier than the person you are trying to lynch. you rate both chaosomega and me as scummier than megatheory(co:3,dj:3, mt:3.5). yet you vote for megatheory. please explain your rationale behind this vote.

This right here.

I can completely understand that I didn't post much beforehand. I'm sorry. But as the game has only been going for a few days now, I don't think that it is too much to go off of just yet. Notice that my actual vote was for MUCH more than activity. I brought activity and post content up but that is what I have to work with so far. Once people post more (like I did), the more analysis will be able to form and the better the reads (ir the 1-10 rating) will be.

[insanepenguin02]

@ Penguin's #84: Large contribution, but quite a few questions rather than hard analysis and some points/assumptions are bad/wrong. Getting a nulltell overall. In response to the questions directed at me:
- See the second paragraph of this post.
- I hadn't felt the need to place a serious vote yet, but there hasn't been any pressing reason (such as a sudden bandwagon) to unvote either.
- I'm as yet undecided on who the most scummy is (kind of hard to tell between scummy/newbie yet in some cases ... Juls, Atronach and Mega anyway, although I'm not liking the actual bandwagon on Mega), and saying who the most townie is would generally benefit the scum's choice of nightkill.

Well, at least somebody is asking plenty of questions then. The more answers from questions, the more analysis I can get, so maybe in the future (after more info), I can give you some "hard"er analysis.

Please inform me how some of my points and assumptions are bad/wrong. As far as I know, nobody other than mafia (or time traveler) would be able to tell me if my ASSUMPTIONS are wrong. For that statement, I have an eerie feeling.....

FOS: Nameless

....

Thank you for your answers. I agree, it may be hard to tell between noob and mafia (or power role) just yet. Why don't you like the wagon on mega?

[insanepenguin02]

And EBWOP - Nameless, please let me know about the bad assumptions/points as that is the sole reason for your FOS

[insanepenguin02]

still waiting on insanepenguin to answer why he wrote this:

I don't think that you are as scummy as somebody like don.

but did this:

All in all, I want to say: Vote: megatheory.

unvote, vote:insanepenguin02

i understand rl delays, but your initial answer did not suffice and i don't feel that this should just be swept under the rug. it is suggestive that ip knows my alignment. only scum know alignments of other players.

Well in all actuality, I really wanted to get some reaction out of mega. As he has not responded much since, I have been left without the additional info (reaction) that I wanted. I do think that you, don, have been scummier than mega overall, HOWEVER I wanted to see some more specific reaction out of mega, thus the vote. If you want me to vote for you, I have absolutely no problem with that but for now, until I get more from mega, my vote stands.

[insanepenguin02]

5) [there is no five question] i ask you, IP, why you took your vote off me who you said was a lurking scum, and put it on the bandwagon, on someone who you haven't conprehended as the most scummy in your previous post?

unvote, FOS insanepenguin

. Theres your FOS.

For one, thank you for your answers. As you said, it is a lot of work - well, I believe you called it "digging myself a hole" which I don't agree with - to post some analysis, ask everyone some relevant questions to get some general info from everyone (or reactions) and then listen/respond to everyone's answers. Thanks for giving me time to answer yours.

I took my vote off of you because 1) it was started as a random vote with no meaning and 2) if you can tell in my analysis, I didn't weigh too heavily on the lurking aspect of people since we were only a few days into the game - I pointed out people that hadn't posted much but only told them to post more.

And I'm sorry but at this point in the game, I don't trust everyone in this game enough to tell my deepest analysis, therefore don't plan on posting that info.

[insanepenguin02]

Well in all actuality, I really wanted to get some reaction out of mega. As he has not responded much since, I have been left without the additional info (reaction) that I wanted. I do think that you, don, have been scummier than mega overall, HOWEVER I wanted to see some more specific reaction out of mega, thus the vote. If you want me to vote for you, I have absolutely no problem with that but for now, until I get more from mega, my vote stands.

this is the easy answer. it still does not explain your scoring system. if you wanted to pressure mega, you would not have listed him as your third place scum candidate.

No, apparently YOU would have but I did not.

[insanepenguin02]

less about knowing alignments, yes. if he is scum then he knows alignments. it is peculiar voting which draws my attention. normally one would vote for the person most likely to be scum. but ip is voting for the player with the third place rating. why? it could lend itself to ip knowing i am town and jumping a bandwagon. it could lend itself to mega being ip's scumbuddy. it could lenditself to chaos being his scumbuddy(not voting, but scoring high so that if chaos is lynched later, he can point to his original post and say, "see i thought so."). it could lend itself to me being his scumbuddy for the same reasons. in any scenario i can think of to describie why he is voting the way he is, however, there is a clear parralel. that being that in every scenario, he is scum. so unless he can explain why he is voting that way i have no alternative but to begin campaigning for his lynch.

I think that this post right here shows that nobody really knows anything at this point and are just trying to dig for info for their own and for the group's good. What if this, what if that? We don't know and that is why I asked so many questions and enjoy sparking discussion!

And if it apparently so clear to you that I am a certain role in the game, why would I make such a "peculiar" vote in your opinion? IMO that wouldn't be a very smart move for me to make. And see, I didn't vote for the one that I saw "most scummy" though am getting a pretty good reaction out of you. Why is that?

[insanepenguin02]

Wow - I have played in much more fun games than here! My bad for trying to get discussion going through asking questions, offering some analysis, and trying to get opinions out there. IT DEFINITELY GOT OPINIONS OUT THERE! So from now on it is a MAFIA

LAW

that I vote for who I think is the scummiest right off the bat and not offer any other explanations than that?!

Here you go:

Unvote

-

Vote: Chaos

with an

FOS: don and mega

Chaos has been the last one to jump my bandwagon and I saw him as being slightly scummy earlier, hence my vote for him

being the scummiest player in my opinion

at this point.

I have been known for playing the game a little different than what all of the "mafia pros" play it as I don't really care about what I

should

do. Look at my past games for evidence to that. But I would have to say that in this game in particular, you guys have completely over-reacted. How?

1) I made my vote for my own reasons, in the long-term benefit of the town, against mega. He never responded until just now so I didn't get the info that I wanted out of him and then that gave everyone time to pick that vote apart.
2) Also, at the time of my vote (writing my long post), mega was at 2 votes (I thought mine would be 3rd but during my post, somebody else also voted mega, putting him to 4 instead). But still, that is a developing wagon and he was still VERY far from being lynched (half-way). IMO, that is not very scary, especially at the start of the game.
3) To say that I have a "well-founded case" is COMPLETELY over-reaction! I gave some very initial analysis and asked questions to let everyone find more out about everyone else. To say that I had hard evidence and that all of my "rankings" and thoughts were in concrete is absurd.

But I digress...

[insanepenguin02]

This game is moving along at a pretty good pace, I see. Me being all the way to L-1 all of a sudden is quite interesting, especially for the lack of any good reason by most of you. If you guys don't want me to offer my thoughts on the game, that is absolutely fine. I will not waste my time making long posts in order to offer some of my own thoughts on the game and specific players if this is how it is going to be contrived. I will gladly just float along as many others do, making posts when I need to.

And at this time, the only thing that I will claim is that I am town. Anything other than that, power role or vanilla, will be for a later time if I get back to L-1 with good reasoning (if you guys give me the time to respond before hammering, that is).

Lastly,

Unvote

. Porkens, saying that you honestly don't care who we lynch is EXTREMELY scummy. It at least is not pro-town.

Vote: Porkens

[insanepenguin02]

Why? It was on the start of page 2, we were still in the random voting stage. Would my vote have been less suspicious if I would have tacked on a hokey bullshit random reason?


You voted for canadianbovine on page 2. I'm assuming since you don't want to look like a hypocrite, that you had a lot to go on when you made that vote. So I'm curious as to your well-founded case on him after only 40 posts.

Me a hypocrite? If I read the above statements correctly, you state that you yourself made a vote in page 2 for a random vote and then you attack me for voting for canadian on page 2????? Um...can we say random vote much????? Even look at what I said when I voted - "Blame Canada" ???? Look at your own judgments when suggesting that somebody else is hypocritical....

Oh, and making a ranking system to place a vote on the player you ranked as 3rd scummiest looks extremely suspicious, I don't care how you justify it.

So even though I suggested that I thought mega was scummy, I can't put a vote on him? If you noticed in my "analysis", I also state that the only thing don_johnson had posted on was the conversation between himself and mega and that I needed more info from him. I also needed more info from you, the next scummiest in my post. So then I place my vote on the next scummiest, who I felt comfortable with as a nice scum vote at the time until I could get more info on the few players that I initially labeled as scum.

How people react to votes is an interesting concept in the game.

[insanepenguin02]

And apparently we have all forgotten about a possible scum connection between don and mega? I would like to hear more on this as I still have a feeling that there is a connection there.

[insanepenguin02]

And at this time, the only thing that I will claim is that I am town. Anything other than that, power role or vanilla, will be for a later time if I get back to L-1 with good reasoning (if you guys give me the time to respond before hammering, that is).

So basically you won't claim until you get some kind of attack you like?

Thanks for nothing.

I'd still like to hear some comments from you about something other than voting for your third scummiest player. IMO that's the weakest reason against you.

P.S. Playing the pissed-off townie card isn't going to help you here.

Huh? None of that seemed to make sense to me....

I will claim when I need to in order to protect my role.

You welcome?

Comments from me? I think I have said plenty in the game outside of my "vote for the third scummiest player" arguement that is actually getting quite old and pointless the more it gets brought up. Can I say....still scum? And are you commenting on me or others when you say "IMO that's the weakest reason against you"?

PPS Huh? Pissed off townie? Is that a role?

[insanepenguin02]

And I should just say this - to those of you who are town, I would strongly suggest noting the players that are pushing these points against me the most as they will likely be the ones that end up scum at the end of the game. They know who they are and know that everyone else is town and therefore will gladly want to bring up anything that could be taken as scummy about someone else and beat it to death if it means no suspicion or discussion occurs about them during that time.

Just a thought.

[insanepenguin02]

Wow - I have played in much more fun games than here!

really? why is this not fun?

And sorry, it is still fun.

[insanepenguin02]

You guys are so retarded. I am very close to just hammering myself. But as a tracker, I want to be able to help the town out. Happy now that my "terrible post" has no forced a town power role to claim?

@ Nameless - Thank you for recognizing that this wagon is getting REALLY f-ing retarded!! 100% guaranteed that every scum is on the wagon as of right now and if not lynched today, I will be able to track one of them and hopefully catch one in the act. Or if you decide to lynch me now, good luck! The way this game has gone, I would expect scum to win very quickly.

@ ger - So you say that D-1 lynches should pretty much be random and then you hope on the wagon on me? Honestly guys, you should look yourselves in the mirror and ask who the real hypocrites are...

Dumba$$e$....

So would you rather me lynch myself, wait for a scum that may not be on the wagon just yet to hammer, have a random person hammer, or should we keep the tracker around for future benefits? I will check back in in a few hours to see what you want...

[insanepenguin02]

unvote

can't say i necessarily believe you, but this warrants discussion. everything you've done since coming under pressure has reeked of desperation. a "tracker" claim seems par for the course.

I would have to argue that I have been reeking of "desperation". I haven't begged to stay or done anything remotely close. Actually what this is is me just posting as myself purely just not giving much of a damn if I stay or if I go. But as a townie role, I would recommend that my character stay if you want more info on who may or may not be townie. I am perfectly open to any of the possibilities that I posted earlier.

I'll be checking back later.

[insanepenguin02]

In fact, I don't think this a bad idea at all. Look at it this way: IP investigates someone in secret tonight. If he gets lucky and finds scum, we can lynch them. (Needless to say if turns out to have been lying we can take that as suitable proof that IP is not to be trusted). If he finds town, that doesn't mean that we haven't learned something valuable. If he gets lynched or targeted later and turns out to have really been a tracker, then we'll have a confirmed townie or two.

I think having me investigate somebody this first night is a great idea. Then I can try to prove that I am who I say I am.

To all - I agree that I made some major mistakes at the start of this game. In the words of others, I was digging myself a hole. I will get to answering as many questions as I can in the next day or so.

As of right now,

Unvote

to get a clearer idea of where scum lies.

[insanepenguin02]

to penguin, how do you hope to prove you are a tracker if given a night to survive?

Well it would be a difficult thing to do in one night (especially the first night) but if I were to get a result that could lead to mafia being found, then that could prove that my info was correct. It was just an idea but I see that it could be a hard thing to 100% prove in one night.

[insanepenguin02]

Yeah, IP's not even trying to be helpful now. Given that he did put the effort into his series of questions and answers earlier I'm not inclined to believe he's an angsty townie. He dies comes deadline if nothing else major comes up.

Atronach, stop and think about that plan for two seconds. Tracker not equal cop. If IP is a tracker and targeted scum, the scum will just claim a powerrole. Or IP could target a powerrole, and they'll be forced to claim, so we're not going to know which from IP alone. Or IP could target a vanilla townie. Or IP could be scum and claim to have targeted a vanilla townie. Do you see where I'm going with this?

[Sarcasm]Oh, Pengion is admitting he made mistakes! Well, that's okay then. No, no, don't bother trying to explain them or providing any analysis you were asked for. We'll just believe you because you claimed and you are sorry.[/Sarcasm]

Nameless, sorry that I have been a little less active here in the last few days but weather in Iowa has been INSANE if you have noticed. I will still be glad to helpful to the town but I won't be making the mistake again of putting out a long post with numerous questions because that will take forever to try to answer all of the returning questions that result.

What I am hoping for is to track the person that visits the house of whoever dies N-1. Then it should be fairly obvious that they are scum. But that will take some luck...

Like I said before, I am trying to get answers out there as quickly as I can. Patience is a virtue.

[insanepenguin02]

IP: any flavor on tracker?

I am not fully understanding, sorry. Do you mean was there any additional info given to me in regarding my role in my message from Mod? I don't want to state any of that in case it is OK.

Mod: Can I state if there was any storyline info in my role message?

[insanepenguin02]

ip: please give us your opinion on nameless.

I have to say that the way he has been virtually unswayed by an uncountered tracker claim, has acted with quite a bit of sarcasm for some reason, has been focusing on very small sidenotes himself (such as me mentioning the weather - sorry you don't know my situation ), and his unclear arguements (such as the various WIFOM comments).

[insanepenguin02]

Unvote

The deadline is less than a week away. We need to decide

right now

if we're going to lynch penguin or not. I strongly suggest we table all other issues until we come to a consensus on this, or we will probably wind up slapping together a poorly informed lynch or even wind up no-lynching, and if either of those things happen, we have virtually no chance of winning. We've already put this off for too long.

Throwing around suspicion and discussing side issues can wait. We need to focus on this. Now.

I still think penguin is scum. Tracker is an easy role to fake and is the next logical choice for scum given the dead NPC cop and backup cop in the opening flavor. I think penguin is by far the best lynch for today, but I'm willing to compromise under the following conditions:

-Penguin can only get off the hook if he finds a player who targeted a dead player.
-If that player is lynched and comes up scum, penguin should be lynched unless he finds another player who targeted a dead player.
-This continues until penguin does not find a scum or three scum are dead. At that point, penguin is lynched.
-We guarantee that penguin does not survive until endgame.

This is pretty elaborate and is probably half-baked. I'm trying to prevent the town from developing stupid townie syndrome and letting penguin live based on some WIFOM bullshit or something like that. If any of you can think of a better test for penguin, I'd love to hear it.

I'm sure this should go without saying, but just in case: DO NOT CLAIM A POWERROLE AND SUGGEST THAT PENGUIN TARGET YOU TONIGHT.

Wow, quite the conditions there, mega. Now why would you want me lynched if I fail to find a second scum after I find one (theoretically) and he comes up scum? If I can get that lucky to track a mafia member night one, state that in day two, and it comes out correct, why would you want me lynched right away???? Wouldn't a pro-town member want to only lynch SCUM?? If I were to die, wouldn't you want the mafia to take me out so the town doesn't waste a lynch on one of their own?

This list of conditions in INCREDIBLY scummy IMO. Other thoughts by anybody?

[insanepenguin02]

EBWOP = Sorry, I didn't initially see that there were comments on this afterwards.

[insanepenguin02]

And to explain the tracker a little bit:

I can send in the name of somebody that I want to track or follow during the night phase. I don't believe that I will hear any specifics as to their role NOR will I hear what happened. I will just track somebody's movements. If it happens to be a townie with no night actions, I will probably be told that this person stayed home all night. I would get the same result if I target a mafia member that does not make the hit. If I track somebody that has a night action, it will tell me where they went. If I track somebody that visits the person killed during the night, it would be a good tell that they are mafia making the hit. If I track somebody that visits a person NOT killed, it would be a good tell that they are somebody like the doctor or another pro-town power role.

So there is a lot of chance, I guess. IMO, not the easiest thing to claim if I were actually scum. For the good of the town, I shouldn't have posted what I did earlier by asking so many questions and looking suspicious in so many of your eyes' because then I could have lived a few more days and given the town some very good info, I would imagine. But now I am targeted by fellow townies (I would assume) who want me lynched EVEN AFTER A POSSIBLE GOOD TRACK IN NIGHT ONE and obviously would be targeted by the mafia due to being a power role.

[insanepenguin02]

don - You have an intriguing case building. Looking back over nameless's posts, I can see where that "vibe" you are getting is coming from.

*Take the handout from don_johnson , folds it up, and puts it in the right, back pants pocket*

[insanepenguin02]

Sorry, I am picking up my prod.

PT conferences were tonight and far too much other stuff right now. I will read up and post soon.

[insanepenguin02]

With my reasons before and the fact that nameless is starting to read scummy, I am going to

Vote Nameless

.

don, thanks for the flier

[insanepenguin02]

Well, here is my info from night one tracking. I tracked Megatheory and he didn't go anywhere.

Sidenote - We know that we have mafia and a serial killer as the beheading is sure to be a sk murder.

[insanepenguin02]

To agree here, my tracker info does not at all clear mega of any wrong-doing. It would prove that he is 100% not the sk but he could still be mafia, just didn't make the hit. He also probably wouldn't be a town powerrole as he didn't leave his house, which a doctor, watcher, and some others may have. The fact that he didnt leave his house though narrows the chances down to probably mafia or vanilla townie.

I have to say that I am suspicious of Juls wanting to lynch right away either don or mega.

[insanepenguin02]

In order to get the game going, I

Vote don

.

[insanepenguin02]

Nice job, town! SOrry that I completely sucked in the game!!! I completely confess to not following the game AT ALL and making retarded moves (or no moves). lol