Open 909 | A Newbie Game | Game Over

[humaneatingmonkey]

I piss and shit all over the place.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Where is the plane in your eyes heading, KayJayQueue? Is there a specific date that the drawing is alluding to?

[humaneatingmonkey]

I was off but I got the month right.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I want to put StraightFlush to E-1 for picking up a soft claim on mason and then deciding to escalate it to public awareness without any prompt. That feels like a kiting technique to fish out actual masons. And it's my first actual read of the game because everything else before that post was straight-up junk.

[humaneatingmonkey]

jacksonvirgo feels a little off to me tho

ditto. i assume he should be feeling uncomfortable about extending rvs as an experienced town player. so that makes me feel a bit hmm. meanwhile, there's more value to extending rvs as scum because you get to endear yourself to people without being alignment indicative.

[humaneatingmonkey]

unless ydrasse fixed core issues with her playstyle, i lean towards her being town. as scum, her playfulness drains to zero.

[humaneatingmonkey]

if i end up being mason, that's not to say ydrasse is my mason buddy.

[humaneatingmonkey]

ydrasse is totally not my mason buddy, just so everybody knows, and this is not a breadcrumb.

[humaneatingmonkey]

fuck

[humaneatingmonkey]

just the games we had together and previous conversations we had

[humaneatingmonkey]

StraightFlush, what was DragonEater afraid of?

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm super confused about your read on my slot, straightflush. can you tell me more about the story of how you read my slot?

[humaneatingmonkey]

can you tell me which posts he started to begin to read like scum and what was the pressure he was responding to, and what posts were him lashing out?

[humaneatingmonkey]

i read the thread, and i understand, but i want to hear this from straightflush as it will help us read his slot better.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Hi let me catch up

He’s back! Let’s gooo

The legend lives!

I will live blog any thoughts that come up as I'm reading so sorry if my opinions change as I'm posting

town ez gg

[humaneatingmonkey]

skitter being V/LA on weekends is obviously cowardice so scumpoints for that

[humaneatingmonkey]

I’ll give you some advice. Put your backbone behind everything. Exaggerating if you need to. Fake it all until you make it.

Saying it’s vanity, showing the weakness behind the read makes it meaningless

why is jacksonvirgo giving my slot advice instead of just treating my like caught scum? sus

[humaneatingmonkey]

meanwhile you were scumreading him!

it reads to me as if you're scum and you're watching poor dragoneater misplay as town, and wanted to help him - thus this is the result

[humaneatingmonkey]

I'll jump all the guns I want to jump

[humaneatingmonkey]

Can I have one of the guns? I wanna be a vigilante

have mine, I'm skilled in all kinds of things. I'm something of a Jack-Of-All-Trades myself.

[humaneatingmonkey]

that's a total cop out

[humaneatingmonkey]

i have nothing indicative on skitter

[humaneatingmonkey]

she's very good at "solving" as scum, but it's visually the same as if she was town

[humaneatingmonkey]

can you tell me which posts he started to begin to read like scum and what was the pressure he was responding to, and what posts were him lashing out?

582 was the first obviously hostile post, starting an argument with Jackson. More telling, however, is 587, where he says he's "voting the only person he feels comfortable voting". He then exchanges a couple more nothingburger posts before retiring for the night. The next morning he comes out swinging with a Jackson vote at 680, refusing to elaborate further. He also says "finally, a wagon" when there is no semblance of a Jackson wagon at the time, suggesting he thinks more people will support him than actually will because he's just that much smarter than everyone else. From there he begins arguing with Ketchup and positing that he is simply bad at making reads, and starts mansplaining all over the place. The Jackson vote strikes me as petty and the continued arguments with new people strike me as desperate. KayJay then probes Dragon about his behavior and insists in 692 that his views are not just shaped by ketchup's opinions of him, saying that there are other examples, but refusing to cover those other examples in any more depth. By 761 he seems to have cooled off and reaffirms his vote on Skitter, but just a few minutes later he sheeps Ydrasse's vote using evidence that already existed well before he had any inkling of suspicion about me, which is shallow and reads like kowtowing for towncred to accelerate the decline of the wagon on him. I also read his sub-out as petty but apparently we're supposed to avoid talking about that (unrealistic) so I'll leave it there.

i keep thinking about what your pov implies on your read on Dragon. it seems as if you feel negative about the way he's playing, less so you think he's playing to win as scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I think HEM/Skitter/Ydra has a weird dynamic going on and I can’t place what it is and why I don’t like it

you can start by quoting posts which highlight a "dynamic"

[humaneatingmonkey]

I literally just said I can’t place it, obviously I’ll start looking when I find the time and energy

i want you to succeed in articulating it

[humaneatingmonkey]

purplemango's last post is really off, in that the reads feel like they have not been filtered through an uninformed perspective. there's a lack of confusion that is expected from noob town.

[humaneatingmonkey]

im so
v a l i d a t e d

ketchup and kjq wont be scum scumreading me and then agreeing to something i just said. i don't think that's within the range of possibilities. one of them has to be town.

[humaneatingmonkey]

unless they just pulled a 200iq move to pocketing me. i don't want to underestimate anyone, but I'm going to gamble on them not doing that

[humaneatingmonkey]

purplemango's last post is really off, in that the reads feel like they have not been filtered through an uninformed perspective. there's a lack of confusion that is expected from noob town.

Why? I did play in the past, also before the site
I don't think its so weird that i know things

i think it's the clarity in which you can determine that someone is town from very slim information - particularly about me. For example, you do not have shared any POV that I may be scum wherein even I can read DragonEater and think "the hell is this guy doing". That you could conclude that DE is town by play, and I would make sense as town too makes me think you do not have the point of view that I could be scum too. (Because you know who the scum are.)

[humaneatingmonkey]

I literally just said I can’t place it, obviously I’ll start looking when I find the time and energy

i want you to succeed in articulating it

I didn’t check back posts, but I slept on this feeling and I think it’s coming from the fact you are all experienced and you/skitter seem to be pretty connected and I’m like not at all connecting with you. I’m experienced too and this separation doesn’t feel right, it feels off. I’ve at least narrowed the feeling to you and skitter.

I know that we aren’t inherently a good matchup for whatever reason. Something about how we both play makes me need to switch up a bit or I don’t play very well (referencing the frenemies game) so I’m hoping it’s that same thing here.

I'm confused because skitter has not even referenced to me yet in this whole game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

HEM, you specifically

weird she scumreads me, and then scumreads my scumread

[humaneatingmonkey]

i am dragon

[humaneatingmonkey]

lots of talk about the link between skitter, ydra, and hem (now purple?) - no one has properly articulated the phenomenon.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Okay, so what's the theory? That SF is town, and so there's one scum in our set?

[humaneatingmonkey]

noone have any good reasoning

okay, so kjq you and jackson have been parrotting a "something" that no one has any good reasoning for?

[humaneatingmonkey]

it makes me suspicious how this idea that no one has articulated, and no one has any good reasoning for, has been a ghost that multiple people have parrotted for multiple pages now.

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: purplemango i realized im not voting them

[humaneatingmonkey]

yes i have kjq. i have a bind on both you and ketchup. one of you has to be town.

[humaneatingmonkey]

for the rest, it's day 1 and really not much has happened that is alignment-indicative. the most alignment-indicative stuff has been the bind on two of you. apart from that I'm just getting a baseline for everybody. i have ideas that are not alignment indicative for now, but would be if the game opens up.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i want to vote you

[humaneatingmonkey]

i was not assured by your answer

[humaneatingmonkey]

cool theory bro. but it's wrong. i just got bored waiting for dann's vc that i had to do it myself.

[humaneatingmonkey]

that’s just not really true tho, we‘ve given lots of reasons against you

okay, list the reasons.

[humaneatingmonkey]

and what if i did

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm not desperate. you're desperate. by your own account, the idea that there's a theme that connects us is immediately undermined by the admittance that it's based on nothing reasonable. it's just a thing that everybody parrotted until everybody thought was true.

[humaneatingmonkey]

and what if i did

did you?

i meant i didn't. sorry. I'll rephrase.

how would you handle the possibility that i didn't pay attention to the VCs or where my vote was until Dann added a "VC" post and then didn't update it to have the VCs?

[humaneatingmonkey]

are we all talking about the same stuff? I'm talking about how there's talk of a theme that connects ydrasse, skitter, and i. it's been repeatedly talked about yet all three that i've spoken to about it had very shoddy reasons about it. it would even be helpful for me if you guys can point out a theme because then it will help me read ydrasse and skitter better. but until you guys can articulate that intuition, then i want you to shut it down because you're beginning to lay ideas on top of it as if it's something substantial that helps read the game. it doesn't. and if you want to prove me wrong, let's talk about that.

if we're talking about Dragon stuff, then that's a different topic. I'm sorry I can't illuminate further where my predecessor's head was at. Frankly i have my own appraisal but it's really poor taste to be assuming where his head was at because I'm not him. It's gonna annoy me a little that my performance is a little overlooked in favor of my predecessor's, but i can live with that.

[humaneatingmonkey]

idk what to say about not having any opinion on skitter. my bar for alignment-indicative is much higher, i guess. i like that we agreed on impressions i also had and sometimes we sound alike, but that's really a poor basis for reading alignment. does anybody want me to comment on any specific skitter post? that will be helpful, thank you.

[humaneatingmonkey]

what's the rush? we have a whole week.

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's not gonna be helped by both of you spamming the thread and leaving a heap of homework for people who aren't able to be present at every moment. let people react. we need to hear from everyone.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i dont mean to sound mean or kill joy. please enjoy the game. but also, there's value in slowing down. i can also spam as much as i want (i call it spam, because that's what i call posting multiple times per day) but it really is a week left and the other people I'm thinking about are newbies who will be overwhelmed with the amount of content they need to chew on. i don't want things to be buried and i want to give the initiative to people who aren't often here. I'm thinking: how will this person react to this? how will this person try and find scum from this gamestate? that's very valuable if i want to get info on their slot. but it won't be as valuable if they won't be able to react because the moment has passed, or can hide among the multiple posts here. please understand my point of view.

[humaneatingmonkey]

and think about it. do i, as scum, want the gamestate to slow down where I'm the top scum pick for most of the wagon? is that really my agenda here? maybe I'm town who wants the thread to be a little more parsable for other newbies. not everybody has the same energy.

for example, i have half the mind that purple's post was that way because he was overwhelmed with the amount of stuff he needed to respond on and he skipped a bunch of stuff. now, i can't eliminate that possibility if the game won't slow down and he won't be given the chance to take initiative. you see where I'm going with this?

[humaneatingmonkey]

The beauty of forums is that you can quote whatever post you want, whenever you want

JV, you can't really be unaware how being slung with multiple posts of stuff you need to read can be hurtful to gamestate, can you? are you disputing this?

[humaneatingmonkey]

sentence is weird. i'm top scum pick for most of the people here. i mean to say top wagon. yes i think that's accurate. the past pages have been about dragon or me being scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

no one feels that way. sometimes it's just like this. imagine if they weren't posting and you guys have been. it's just gonna be 10 pages of just your back and forth, and you wouldn't feel that the others haven't been posting as much. now you have info on how the game feels in your absence.

[humaneatingmonkey]

in an hour, SF will be prodded and he will need to post game-advancing content. what he chooses to post and focus on will be info-rich. same with ydrasse, zach, skitter should their timers run out. and even if their timers run out, eventually they will be showing up to this thread. and if it's slow, they will be forced to take initiative on what they want to do in this game and it will be info-rich. that's why slowing down the game is the right play for now, especially since we have a lot of time. from my pov, as long as i talk to both of you i am talking to at least one town so if i want more chance to catch scum, i want to hear less from you and more from other slots. also, i feel as if you did listen to me yesterday when i explained how slowing down the game will help town. thank you so much.

[humaneatingmonkey]

what's pinging me about jackson is that he's not scumhunting

[humaneatingmonkey]

im afraid if we do focus on purplemango, there wouldn't be space to give pressure to slots i want to get pressured because it seems purplemango is an easy elimination. there's a consensus that he's acting sus. what i really want is to pressure jackson more. I'm not sure how, as town, is he playing in a way that's trying to find scum. that's not what I'm seeing at all. even his ketchup push feels forced.

[humaneatingmonkey]

jackson can you like give me an insight into where your head is at this game

[humaneatingmonkey]

i kinda feel like you're trying to have fun, keeping it cool, and checking out ketchup's slot but i don't really feel as if you believe that. especially after your advice on dragon where I'm trying to see if you would do that on ketchup but it's missing pizzaz.

[humaneatingmonkey]

my review of KJQ's case is that i townread it very much so, especially in the circumstance that she did it in the game, but also... and i don't want to discourage it... but it seems very confbiased to purple as scum and less evaluative on what town!purple would look like.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i don't feel as if i've been stuck up, nor do i think ydrasse has been stuck up. anybody really feel this way about us?

yeah i laughed when i left skitter out of there, too.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i also don't feel like i've contributed jack shit. i think i've made a lot of impact in this game since i arrived, and i have made my reads known to all. anybody else feeling this way about me?

[humaneatingmonkey]

Short answer: yes

what's so stuck up about us? is it just in comparison to jackson who has been l i v e and f u n?

[humaneatingmonkey]

hemmington this is not worth it imo

what makes you say?

[humaneatingmonkey]

because i think you've raised the narrative that we're stuck up, and so it's obviously going to be in comparison to how you've been playing - another experienced player. i also think you've had much influence in enabling the extended rvs, and the multiposting. to the point that when i did raise the concern about it, it felt like you rebuffed it by saying it's an excuse to not contribute to the thread. really, what I'm trying to get to the bottom of is how much influence you've had in the game and how much of that influence is anti-town if you really squint your eyes.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'll lay off it now. i want to put it out there as to not get lost in the ether. because when you explained where your head is at, it feels as if you agree that the way things were going weren't really very pro-town and it was contradictory to the gamestate that you were encouraging. and it seems as if you agree, because you want to rectify it.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i don't feel as if ydrasse's comments have segmented the game further. what i feel has segmented the game is you actually segmenting the game by giving an us vs them narrative about what's fun and what isn't fun, newbies vs experienced, one side of town vs other side of town. you've done this plenty of times. I'm not asking for perfectly optimal, nor i think anyone is.

[humaneatingmonkey]

do you really care about the answer, JV? because if what I'm doing right now is telling you about what i think about the gamestate then i don't know what this is.

[humaneatingmonkey]

bro... everything out of my mouth has been about what i think about the gamestate... this feels like a question just for optics...

[humaneatingmonkey]

my idea about the gamestate has been very clear and I've articulated much about it that i really feel that this question is all redundant and silly. if you feel the need to push me because i didn't answer your question or something and that makes me scum, go ahead and do it.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Fine. I'll quote my shit.

[humaneatingmonkey]

purposefully dodging your questions

for what it's worth, this isn't what I'm making it out to be. the theme that connects us have yet to be put into words but have been repeatedly referred to, and when asked people about it, the answers were unsubstantial. jackson said it was how connected we were, but when pressed that we didn't even refer to each other, he said used the wrong words. later he has said that it was that we were playing with a stick up our butt. ketchup said no one had any good reasons about it. you were the only one who pointed out that it was that we were the three in the wagon and it was only that, but not before i pushed for the answer "ad nauseum". this is dangerous practice because you were already building theories on top of it without even articulating what the connection was.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Spoiler: What I felt about the RVS and StraightFlush's reaction to Dragon's post

I want to put StraightFlush to E-1 for picking up a soft claim on mason and then deciding to escalate it to public awareness without any prompt. That feels like a kiting technique to fish out actual masons. And it's my first actual read of the game because everything else before that post was straight-up junk.

Spoiler: What I felt about JV's role in RVS

jacksonvirgo feels a little off to me tho

ditto. i assume he should be feeling uncomfortable about extending rvs as an experienced town player. so that makes me feel a bit hmm. meanwhile, there's more value to extending rvs as scum because you get to endear yourself to people without being alignment indicative.

unless ydrasse fixed core issues with her playstyle, i lean towards her being town. as scum, her playfulness drains to zero.

Spoiler: What I feel about JV's interaction with Dragon

I’ll give you some advice. Put your backbone behind everything. Exaggerating if you need to. Fake it all until you make it.

Saying it’s vanity, showing the weakness behind the read makes it meaningless

why is jacksonvirgo giving my slot advice instead of just treating my like caught scum? sus

meanwhile you were scumreading him!

it reads to me as if you're scum and you're watching poor dragoneater misplay as town, and wanted to help him - thus this is the result

Spoiler: What I did to get a better read on StraightFlush's slot

can you tell me which posts he started to begin to read like scum and what was the pressure he was responding to, and what posts were him lashing out?

582 was the first obviously hostile post, starting an argument with Jackson. More telling, however, is 587, where he says he's "voting the only person he feels comfortable voting". He then exchanges a couple more nothingburger posts before retiring for the night. The next morning he comes out swinging with a Jackson vote at 680, refusing to elaborate further. He also says "finally, a wagon" when there is no semblance of a Jackson wagon at the time, suggesting he thinks more people will support him than actually will because he's just that much smarter than everyone else. From there he begins arguing with Ketchup and positing that he is simply bad at making reads, and starts mansplaining all over the place. The Jackson vote strikes me as petty and the continued arguments with new people strike me as desperate. KayJay then probes Dragon about his behavior and insists in 692 that his views are not just shaped by ketchup's opinions of him, saying that there are other examples, but refusing to cover those other examples in any more depth. By 761 he seems to have cooled off and reaffirms his vote on Skitter, but just a few minutes later he sheeps Ydrasse's vote using evidence that already existed well before he had any inkling of suspicion about me, which is shallow and reads like kowtowing for towncred to accelerate the decline of the wagon on him. I also read his sub-out as petty but apparently we're supposed to avoid talking about that (unrealistic) so I'll leave it there.

i keep thinking about what your pov implies on your read on Dragon. it seems as if you feel negative about the way he's playing, less so you think he's playing to win as scum.

Spoiler: What I felt about purplemango's catch-up post

purplemango's last post is really off, in that the reads feel like they have not been filtered through an uninformed perspective. there's a lack of confusion that is expected from noob town.

Spoiler: How I feel about ketchup and KJQ

im so
v a l i d a t e d

ketchup and kjq wont be scum scumreading me and then agreeing to something i just said. i don't think that's within the range of possibilities. one of them has to be town.

unless they just pulled a 200iq move to pocketing me. i don't want to underestimate anyone, but I'm going to gamble on them not doing that

Spoiler: What I feel about Purplemango's catch-up post, part 2

purplemango's last post is really off, in that the reads feel like they have not been filtered through an uninformed perspective. there's a lack of confusion that is expected from noob town.

Why? I did play in the past, also before the site
I don't think its so weird that i know things

i think it's the clarity in which you can determine that someone is town from very slim information - particularly about me. For example, you do not have shared any POV that I may be scum wherein even I can read DragonEater and think "the hell is this guy doing". That you could conclude that DE is town by play, and I would make sense as town too makes me think you do not have the point of view that I could be scum too. (Because you know who the scum are.)

Spoiler: What I feel about people referring to a skitter/ydra/hem connection

lots of talk about the link between skitter, ydra, and hem (now purple?) - no one has properly articulated the phenomenon.

Spoiler: When asked about what I think about the rest

for the rest, it's day 1 and really not much has happened that is alignment-indicative. the most alignment-indicative stuff has been the bind on two of you. apart from that I'm just getting a baseline for everybody. i have ideas that are not alignment indicative for now, but would be if the game opens up.

Spoiler: What I feel about the rate of posts and how it affects our ability to find scum

i dont mean to sound mean or kill joy. please enjoy the game. but also, there's value in slowing down. i can also spam as much as i want (i call it spam, because that's what i call posting multiple times per day) but it really is a week left and the other people I'm thinking about are newbies who will be overwhelmed with the amount of content they need to chew on. i don't want things to be buried and i want to give the initiative to people who aren't often here. I'm thinking: how will this person react to this? how will this person try and find scum from this gamestate? that's very valuable if i want to get info on their slot. but it won't be as valuable if they won't be able to react because the moment has passed, or can hide among the multiple posts here. please understand my point of view.

and think about it. do i, as scum, want the gamestate to slow down where I'm the top scum pick for most of the wagon? is that really my agenda here? maybe I'm town who wants the thread to be a little more parsable for other newbies. not everybody has the same energy.

for example, i have half the mind that purple's post was that way because he was overwhelmed with the amount of stuff he needed to respond on and he skipped a bunch of stuff. now, i can't eliminate that possibility if the game won't slow down and he won't be given the chance to take initiative. you see where I'm going with this?

in an hour, SF will be prodded and he will need to post game-advancing content. what he chooses to post and focus on will be info-rich. same with ydrasse, zach, skitter should their timers run out. and even if their timers run out, eventually they will be showing up to this thread. and if it's slow, they will be forced to take initiative on what they want to do in this game and it will be info-rich. that's why slowing down the game is the right play for now, especially since we have a lot of time. from my pov, as long as i talk to both of you i am talking to at least one town so if i want more chance to catch scum, i want to hear less from you and more from other slots. also, i feel as if you did listen to me yesterday when i explained how slowing down the game will help town. thank you so much.

Spoiler: How I feel about JV's influence on the game and what I think about his play

what's pinging me about jackson is that he's not scumhunting

im afraid if we do focus on purplemango, there wouldn't be space to give pressure to slots i want to get pressured because it seems purplemango is an easy elimination. there's a consensus that he's acting sus. what i really want is to pressure jackson more. I'm not sure how, as town, is he playing in a way that's trying to find scum. that's not what I'm seeing at all. even his ketchup push feels forced.

i kinda feel like you're trying to have fun, keeping it cool, and checking out ketchup's slot but i don't really feel as if you believe that. especially after your advice on dragon where I'm trying to see if you would do that on ketchup but it's missing pizzaz.

my review of KJQ's case is that i townread it very much so, especially in the circumstance that she did it in the game, but also... and i don't want to discourage it... but it seems very confbiased to purple as scum and less evaluative on what town!purple would look like.

because i think you've raised the narrative that we're stuck up, and so it's obviously going to be in comparison to how you've been playing - another experienced player. i also think you've had much influence in enabling the extended rvs, and the multiposting. to the point that when i did raise the concern about it, it felt like you rebuffed it by saying it's an excuse to not contribute to the thread. really, what I'm trying to get to the bottom of is how much influence you've had in the game and how much of that influence is anti-town if you really squint your eyes.

i'll lay off it now. i want to put it out there as to not get lost in the ether. because when you explained where your head is at, it feels as if you agree that the way things were going weren't really very pro-town and it was contradictory to the gamestate that you were encouraging. and it seems as if you agree, because you want to rectify it.

i don't feel as if ydrasse's comments have segmented the game further. what i feel has segmented the game is you actually segmenting the game by giving an us vs them narrative about what's fun and what isn't fun, newbies vs experienced, one side of town vs other side of town. you've done this plenty of times. I'm not asking for perfectly optimal, nor i think anyone is.

bro... everything out of my mouth has been about what i think about the gamestate... this feels like a question just for optics...

[humaneatingmonkey]

I referenced the pages where your combined dynamic pinged hard before I explicitly said anything about the wagon and I’m glad I waited because in that time, you three did it again, further proving my point.

The thought being articulated is what I wanted

[humaneatingmonkey]

Post 865 is "What I feel about Ydrasse's slot"

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm disputing that you could be strategic in any way

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm not*

i will be making grammatical mistakes this whole game. the language isn't my first.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm sorry, i meant the opposite

[humaneatingmonkey]

my lim pool is {JacksonVirgo, Purplemango, zachheus}

[humaneatingmonkey]

zachheus being there is really stretching it, but he has sat on his skitter read for a long time now without ever developing it. one must assume that it's a strong read if he isn't looking anywhere else - but #930 and #1360 betrays this assumption. so I'm calculating a good probability that he's probably faking the read.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i say betray because the posts i quoted still displays trust towards reads made by someone he scumreads without suspicion that it could be tainted

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: JacksonVirgo

Snivy's probably gonna get hammered but I want to join him for the record.

[humaneatingmonkey]

it really isn't his fault he repped into a slot with a hammer threat. i mean, if you really want to know how he would play the game, you'd give him space and time to play the game (like, we have ~4 days left).

[humaneatingmonkey]

i think skitter/snivy might be town, yeah. i think jv is scum. so obviously, i will be voting jv and i will be discouraging a skitter/snivy elimination.

[humaneatingmonkey]

if snivy is scum, i don't imagine him to be digging a deeper hole for himself. that's playing against condition.

[humaneatingmonkey]

he would have had time to be briefed by a partner, or would have had the time to read the thread (note the significant delay between his subbing in and posting). he would have had known the basic thing to do to defuse the pressure on his slot. that's not what he did. he immediately voted for who he thought was scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

and what is he purposely doing? as scum, and as town.

[humaneatingmonkey]

be aware that other players are smart too, and no one is really dumb.

[humaneatingmonkey]

if you think skitter/snivy is scum, then why are you saying that I'm TMI'd that he'll flip town? if you think he's town, just don't vote him lmao

[humaneatingmonkey]

yeah i'm kinda willing to defend snivy's entrance that it's towny. i just did actually. you think it's scum, doesn't mean i do too.

[humaneatingmonkey]

guys, i figure out a basic theory of mind behind what a person might do as scum and what a person might do as town. if both makes sense, it's NAI. if only one make sense, then that's alignment-indicative. either as town or scum. it's not a point system based on liking and disliking someone's post because based on my previous experience, that makes me inaccurate.

snivy's entrance doesn't make sense to me from a scum POV. so i think it's towny. you could do this exercise yourself and argue with me over the merit of why it would make sense for snivy to do what he did as scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I want to use meta to explain my position so badly right now. But I already know exactly how quickly it would be dismissed.

I've been dismissed this whole game, yet I find it relevant and necessary to speak my mind anyway. I suggest you do it anyway.

[humaneatingmonkey]

you should focus on getting a read on the mysterious deity instead of being hammer-happy

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's 2/8 scum, but it's also 6/8 town btw

i think if we can't get a read on him through posts, then it's better we flip him. either way, i think it's probable he's scum

[humaneatingmonkey]

it really isn't. a townread over getting a slot to claim when it yields low info/probably scum is better for game in the long run.

[humaneatingmonkey]

information farming in the early pages is better than trying to minimize risk from not flipping PR

[humaneatingmonkey]

in a 2v3 lim or lose, there will be 4 flipped slots. maximizing the info we get from these slots will help us find scum better even if we don't get scum in the first days. if the town slots that remain on 2v3 are low-yield, low-activity players who scum can pounce on to manipulate everyone else into following their narrative - we lose. The day 1 2/7 probability on flipping vt vs forcing a 1/8 possibility isn't the only factor in the game. who we eliminate when and what information it yields for us matter more. and I'm sure scum already have info on who the pr is because even i think i know who the prs are. if we eliminate purplemango now, we have more information on the slot than we would if we let them coast through the game. I've seen enough from them to make me feel as if they really can't stay in the game longer.

[humaneatingmonkey]

plus, probability isn't the only factor in deciding what is the best elimination. if i think there's an alignment indicative reason to believe snivy can be town more than i think there's any alignment indicative reason to believe purplemango can be town, then i would want to keep snivy more than purplemango.

[humaneatingmonkey]

contrary to popular belief i think JV's town stock became higher after snivy's entrance, but only enough to make me think he's a day 1 keeper.

[humaneatingmonkey]

so they borrowed a few of mine and tried to hide it by being vague.

i thought you had JV as top townread?

[humaneatingmonkey]

my explanation would be that you're buddies, but let's not get ahead of ourselves

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: purplemango

zoom

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's just that... i don't think you're really trying to look for scum, man. it's not the quality of your thoughts, it's what you choose to do every time you're on.

[humaneatingmonkey]

like, just answer for me: who do you think would flip scum the most out of the current players right now?

[humaneatingmonkey]

timeline of events:
snivy's entrance -> hem's vote -> jv's reaction

[humaneatingmonkey]

it wasn't after jv's reaction that i had reasonable doubt that jv could also be town

[humaneatingmonkey]

than who I think is scum

nah dude, it's straight up who you think is scum.

why do you think it feels difficult for you to have thoughts on who the scum is? how many games have you had?

[humaneatingmonkey]

how were you able to mask yourself as scum in your previous games? i assume you've done some fake scumhunting?
what are the other things that you use to indicate scum?

[humaneatingmonkey]

I do trying to find other things that can indicate scum so its pretty interesting

i was referring to this, buddy. what other things than meta do you have in mind?

and how do you organize things and use it in your previous games as scum? how did you try and escape detection?

[humaneatingmonkey]

not gonna stop a snivy elimination, but i still think purple is the best elimination and i think i have the numbers anyway.

hem, snivy, jv, ydrasse, ketchup if it's also in his solve, kjq if she wants an elimination, and a forced hammer.

[humaneatingmonkey]

not being able to place zachh in any wagon is +scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i think snivy flips town and mango isn't the only person i want to solve

[humaneatingmonkey]

this is my pool for the record:

purplemango > zach > jacksonvirgo > ydrasse/snivy
not in the pool/there might be one scum here if my first two elims are bad: kjq, ketchup, straightflush

[humaneatingmonkey]

i really don't townread that

[humaneatingmonkey]

zach's pop-in and vote and fake hammer

as much as you guys are rushing it, it's still 2 days and a half days

[humaneatingmonkey]

ah i misread that. i thought he thought it was E-1 and "oopsed". either way, he should be leaning scum on purple based on his posts unless something changes - so the statement that he couldn't find anyone else to vote other than snivy who he finds towny is a bit sus.

[humaneatingmonkey]

or maybe he's scum who wants to sheep a wrong read by town and gravitated towards voting on the biggest, easiest wagon even though it doesn't make sense for his reads.

we'll see.

[humaneatingmonkey]

this is the easiest wagon as any I've seen. you see any counterwagons? Are any of the concerns of the dissent being taken seriously? exactly.

[humaneatingmonkey]

yeah, and it's just me making the effort. skitter/snivy's wagon is the top wagon for how many days now without a real counterwagon, meanwhile slots that could be low hanging fruits are being recruited into joining it. that should be alarm bells but either you two are scum or are too tunneled to see that

[humaneatingmonkey]

yeah of course

[humaneatingmonkey]

this is my pool for the record:

purplemango > zach > jacksonvirgo > ydrasse/snivy
not in the pool/there might be one scum here if my first two elims are bad: kjq, ketchup, straightflush

i literally updated it

[humaneatingmonkey]

why are you beginning to make fun of my reads now?

might be implies at least one

[humaneatingmonkey]

this doesnt seem like you scumread me, more than you are just discrediting me

[humaneatingmonkey]

and im telling you now what i mean, you don't have to take over my semantics

[humaneatingmonkey]

after, im always just a spare tire around this site so games can keep moving

[humaneatingmonkey]

resistance

Spoiler: the vc since 3 days ago:

VC 1.15

Jolene

skitter30 [4]:

KayJayQueue, zachheus, ketchup777, JacksonVirgo

Purplemango [3]:

humaneatingmonkey, Ydrasse, skitter30

KayJayQueue [1]:

StraightFlush

Not Voting [1]:

Purplemango

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-04-07 17:08:16).

Mod Notes:

Searching for a replacement for skitter30.

VC 1.16

Test Drive

skitter30 [3]:

KayJayQueue, zachheus, JacksonVirgo

Purplemango [2]:

humaneatingmonkey, skitter30

KayJayQueue [1]:

StraightFlush

Not Voting [3]:

Purplemango, ketchup777, Ydrasse

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-04-07 17:08:16).

Mod Notes:

Searching for a replacement for skitter30.

VC 1.17

Roxanne

camelCasedSnivy [3]:

KayJayQueue, zachheus, JacksonVirgo

Purplemango [2]:

humaneatingmonkey, camelCasedSnivy

KayJayQueue [1]:

StraightFlush

ketchup777 [1]:

ketchup777

Not Voting [2]:

Purplemango, Ydrasse

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-04-07 17:08:16).

Mod Notes:

camelCasedSnivy replaces skitter30.

VC 1.18

To Zanarkand

camelCasedSnivy [3]:

KayJayQueue, ketchup777, StraightFlush

JacksonVirgo [2]:

camelCasedSnivy, humaneatingmonkey

StraightFlush [1]:

JacksonVirgo

Not Voting [3]:

Purplemango, Ydrasse, zachheus

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-04-08 05:08:16).

Mod Notes:

VC 1.19

Flowers

camelCasedSnivy [3]:

KayJayQueue, ketchup777, StraightFlush

JacksonVirgo [1]:

camelCasedSnivy

StraightFlush [1]:

JacksonVirgo

Purplemango [1]:

humaneatingmonkey

Not Voting [3]:

Purplemango, Ydrasse, zachheus

With 9 alive, it takes 5 to eliminate. Day 1 ends in (expired on 2024-04-08 05:08:16).

Mod Notes:

being the top wagon for multiple days isn't what resistance looks like. this is the gamestate being locked at one direction.

[humaneatingmonkey]

well i know im not scum, so you could appreciate my pov that I'm the only one to seem to want a viable counterwagon

[humaneatingmonkey]

the gamestate has locked. there is no resistance. you guys are going to eliminate a town wagon just because you guys are tunneled. everyone else is letting you do this except me.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i've been there. that's called being tunneled.

[humaneatingmonkey]

being disagreed with and someone getting your way immediately feels like it's scum being against you, but you will read this game once it's done and realize your intuition is often wrong.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i know how to appear town, and i understand this isn't how you do it.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i've just been around, kjq. i know what a town flips looks like moments before disaster

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's not like i haven't told you that snivy's entrance was +town and the gamestate indicates +town. I'm trying to explain my confidence, and you're just mocking me.

[humaneatingmonkey]

why do you mock me, kjq? what have i done to deserve this treatment?

[humaneatingmonkey]

where have i treated you like an idiot? all this time i have tried to reach out to you with my reasons and I've never been personal. it is not my fault that i have played more games than you, and i cannot ignore the patterns I've picked up playing the game. you can only corroborate the truth in that by asking other experienced players.

from your question, purple's play leans scum, and the way he's playing positions him as a low-hanging fruit in eliminate-or-lose if he's town. we get more out of his flip than him staying in the game.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i would rather have snivy playing in day 2 and not having the excuse that he just subbed in to have a clearer read of his play. i do not think mango's play will drastically change the next day.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i will not stop you from pursuing snivy, if that's what you think. but i will pursue purplemango because i still can. both are viable options and i am trying to steer the game in a state where i think yields the best info after day 1. having two strong wagons than a locked one wagon with people around it seemingly indifferent about snivy's flip (even indicating that it might be town) is a way better gamestate. i will also be telling you what i think about our gamestate and how i think about snivy will be flipping.

[humaneatingmonkey]

hard pass on the hypoclaiming. it gives scum information on who the vts/non-cops are if they see a vt claiming inno on the scum. this will eliminate some options. if they shot ydrasse, they might be desperate for info.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Not Voting [1]: Purplemango

theories on purplemango's non-vote towards the end of the day?

[humaneatingmonkey]

if we massclaim, we will give the last scum two successful shots for N2 and N3 - ensuring survivability to 2v1 without any PRs left. especially if the majority chooses to eliminate outside of snivy's wagon because that will include me, and I'm town. it's clear i don't have influence where the vote is going this game, so just caution yourselves into not throwing a very good position. a lot of games have been lost because they eliminated scum day 1 and it turns out to be a well-positioned bus.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm going to sleep and share my thoughts upon waking up, but I'm once again going to insist that there was no resistance to skitter/snivy's. like, objectively there was not resistance to snivy's wagon. so this implies:
a. scum either had no power to change that wagon and didn't attempt
b. scum attempted to but eventually backpedaled
c. bussed all along

suppose i can convince you that i won't get caught defending a doomed scum buddy and risk being the number one wagon-of-interest for the rest of the game, but i understand you don't really think much highly of me. smart people with above average IQ (they would be if they're playing here) will pretty much play to win, and they're very capable of convincing you that they're your friends.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Ydrasse has commented about the so-called resistance, so just listen to the dead town if you're worried that you're getting corrupted info from me.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i've seen some arguments recently that snivy is town due to the resistance against the wagon but there's only two wolves so i am kind of curious where people things these points of resistance are if they're making that argument

like i would probably identify myself as one if someone wants to put that to the test but like, hem is definitely one too and that is three people including snivy. i don't think that this resistance is like... hm. i don't think that's a compelling argument to me for this game to be analyzed atm because there's a majority of townies if snivy is a wolf who could push this through etc

this has just been on my mind idk the relevance but i would rather post it than let it fester in my brain

so where did you think these points of resistance are if it's true that there was resistance?

[humaneatingmonkey]

and so did i. her reads being way off and her eventually being town should tick you off that there's a whole side of this game that you're probably disagreeing to - and in effect, dismissing.

[humaneatingmonkey]

just because we were wrong about our read that snivy was town, doesn't mean our read that resistance is a bad adjective to what was happening to snivy's wagon.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i skipped that, yes, because i'm more interested right now to tell you that there was no resistance.

i will respond to this once i wake up, but the thread being limp about snivy's elimination is a common pattern in my previous games before a town flip - but it was also a common pattern for busses. i can cite games if you want.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I'm not discounting anything. Please don't take mafia personally. I will distance from your thread once you realize I'm just playing a game, and so are you.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i want to use the space we have to eliminate purplemango's slot. he was "on-wagon" in spirit, but didn't commit - which is even scummier. the next on-wagon elimination in the similar theme is zach. only then do i want to touch ketchup or straightflush as their involvement in the game yields so much more information, and i expect that it will yield much more if they get to stay in the game with us.

[humaneatingmonkey]

in any case, scum will be forced to kill outside of mango and zach. that will solve two of KayJayQueue, ketchup777, JacksonVirgo, humaneatingmonkey, StraightFlush. who they kill will be super indicative.

suppose one out of mango and zach turns out to be PR. then we will "flip" them town during dayplay without massclaiming. only then i think should we cannibalize among each other.

if both turns out to be pr in this day phase, then i have not decided who it is between kjq, ketchup, jv, and straightflush. and i won't say so i can get more info out of the NK if ever i survive to ELo.

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: purplemango

[humaneatingmonkey]

i really dislike how kjq talks about me in that it borders on commentary about me as a person. i will not engage with her further in the game as long as this is the trend to keep the peace. she can push me however she wants.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i also think ydrasse's kill was a pr hunt instead of a low-info kill. i don't know how relevant that is to solving scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

The game will be stagnant as long as there's no hammer threat, and I am not interested in forcing StraightFlush to claim today much less eliminating him. I think we should go through Purplemango and Zach first. But if this is where all three of you want this day to go, then you need to find someone else willing to go with your direction.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Find it between zachheus and Purplemango.

[humaneatingmonkey]

like, just answer for me: who do you think would flip scum the most out of the current players right now?

I was sure I answered this already, sorry

I don't have anyone that I scumread clearly, I'd rather not vote for you, zach, jackson, and ketchup (for now, at least)

And even though snivy feels towny, it makes more sense to me that he's scum than the others
Not sure where to go from here, maybe I'll try reading things again

This question is a bit weird to me because it feels more like a logical matter with calculations and such than who I think is scum, but I hope It's work for you

this reveals where purplemango's inclinations are despite being voteless. it feels relevant to me that he has chosen not to vote instead.

[humaneatingmonkey]

who would join me on a zach wagon?

i will

[humaneatingmonkey]

VOTE: zach

[humaneatingmonkey]

This will sound very fatalistic and reading this will be a whiplash. I will sound closed-minded throughout the rest of this day. I have done some reading over the night phase and I have decided where I want to take this day, but I will wait for everybody to do their thing.

This is the gamestate from my POV:

Let's assume JV hits the deck tonight.

If KJQ is town, and I am part of the final day, then this game is lost for town. KJQ's final vote will be locked on me and scum will hammer.

If KJQ is scum, and her team decided to hardbus on D1 then this game is lost for town. Our final day's vote will be locked to anyone other than her. Even I don't imagine myself taking the risk to vote her over StraightFlush or zach.

If StraightFlush or zach is town, and since both seem to townread me over each other, then there is a chance to win the game for town.

Now, I understand what this all sounds like. I understand that going after KJQ has a big chance of everyone turning against me because she has 1.) pushed for skitter despite being given off-ramps, 2.) acted very townie. Nevertheless, even if KJQ is town then I should never be in the final day because it results in game loss for town. So I'm willing to take the space we have today to clear her slot for the still-very-possible chance of a hardbus.

I will force the town to choose between me or her. No hard feelings.

VOTE: KayJayQueue

If this elimination doesn't result in town win, then I think the night kill never comes from zach - especially after JV rules them out as the final scum. I think he'll go for JV, a claimed tracker who will totally target him. This is potentially StraightFlush. But hopefully, the game ends here. Unless I'm the one eliminated - which I'm okay with.

[humaneatingmonkey]

yeah i was nuts thanks for tracking kjq

[humaneatingmonkey]

I think you’re massively discounting Kay as a player in that post as well, do you genuinely feel Kay is the type to slap down a vote immediately in elo just cuz? That feels awfully rude to assume.

To be honest, I made that post prior to the day and had gathered from the previous days that Kay was very antagonistic towards me and made a good guess on what an ELo with her would look like. I made a play on what I think would be the best shot at winning the game. Frankly, I still think it's true. It's not a comment on Kay as a player, but I have to work with what I have.

[humaneatingmonkey]

HEM do you think this night kill comes from anybody that understood the gamestate? I don’t think my personal reads has anything to do with it as a clear is still a clear and can almost be a game decider.

I sure think it's not the best play, but I have no idea what angle our scum is shooting from. If I have to assume that scum had a reasonable thought process, I think it's a calculation on politics - as in vote decisions on Day 3 and Day 4. It could be they had a pool on who you would target and was confident you would clear someone they'd be comfortable being cleared, and that your vote would be favorable to them today more than Purple. It could also be an "wow I would never make this kill" play.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I'm super scared of an ELo with me in it. I don't think it's unreasonable for me to think that based on how the game unfolded between Kay and I that I would probably be voted off.

[humaneatingmonkey]

thank you

not kidding, i was in a massive crisis over the night. in my head, this is an instaloss if i don't advocate for my own elimination before ELo. being cleared is a massive morale booster.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I think people are smart in general too, and I don't really think the kill was a goof. scum is someone who thought that keeping you here with a cleared slot is more valuable than killing you overnight. this is someone confident they wouldn't be checked, or desperate enough that this was their only play they had.

[humaneatingmonkey]

JV, you should know that the scum I'm theorizing does not describe zach. Scum is between StrangeFlush and KJQ.

It

will

be massively discounting of Kay as a player if we assume that a hardbus is impossible. I've won many games where I hardbussed my partner day 1, almost zealously. I'm sure you also have. Kay does seem to be a very competent player, so I'm definitely not eliminating that. If Kay was scum, she has played the game hard-pocketing you and hard-bussing skitter. You have telegraphed that you will be checking zach last night, so they must be comfortable with a pool of {KJQ, StrangeFlush, HEM}. In this pool, who wins?

If StrangeFlush made the kill then he had a stroke of genius that it will lead to Kay.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I really really don't want to assume that zach goofed and killed Purple because he goofed. I'm not sure zach is a goof. He doesn't sound like a goof. He doesn't act like a goof.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i would have hammered ketchup too. there was no way i would have thought that ketchup was town after the counterclaim.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Purple keeps the claim going cuz it's a pr-trade to "keep them safe" so you can survive this elim because of a PR claim but also retract it later after you kill purple so you're not at risk of getting cc'd.

i would have simply thought that ketchup was scum because he was counterclaimed. i can see your logic here, but it's just one in an explanation of many.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Scum will always know their team composition, no?
Ketchup wouldn't have claimed that Purple was innocent if they were vanilla - unless Purple was FN.

I think scum would have had the information on what the setup was on Night 2. Like I said, I don't want to assume anyone was a goof.

Flush/Kay/Zach, would you please answer me: Would you have known that Purple was sure to be FN based on Ketchup's vanilla flip?

[humaneatingmonkey]

it's a coin flip for me, really. i want to determine who gets the most value out of a {KJQ, StraightFlush, HEM} pool, but it really isn't that obvious.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I think I’m good enough to solo a game without knowing what town is working with which could’ve lost here game day 2

No, the theory is that your team felt that it was the best move. Unfortuntaely, it's entirely possible that you had a day 1 early soft bus that developed into a hard bus when skitter/snivy became too much of a liability and you had a very good position. and if you're staking on a metaread that you wouldn't be confident, then i'd say it felt as if you were pretty confident on skitter/snivy's wagon. entirely possible.

P-edit: Your geometry is off because I'm town, so it's really just between the two of you.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I really think Kay is town here

i think this day is just really determining if zach can be ruled out, because if we can line up SF and KJQ in any order then we win.

[humaneatingmonkey]

UNVOTE:

I'm just gonna do this here because I have not decided yet.

[humaneatingmonkey]

JV, can you please spend more time with me here? I don't want zach hammering because I want to spend more time with him too. Let's take a breather and let things cool off. Sleep it off for three more days at least.

[humaneatingmonkey]

took a shower before bed after a long day of work. still, i can see both as possible. and i have not decided on ruling out zach. I'm going to articulate all my points for or against each slot and treat this as ELo where I can bounce off a confirmed town. can we do that JV? i think that's the best way to play this.

[humaneatingmonkey]

newbies aren't goof. i played a lot of newbies. i don't think I've ever seen a newbie goof. it was often an obvious kill choice, but not a goof.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i'm willing to dismiss the doctor idea entirely, as it's really obvious to anyone that Purple was FN

I'm re-reading the thread now as we speak.

[humaneatingmonkey]

It's entirely possible you chose to keep Jack because you have calculated that he wouldn't target you and he would target zach (or someone else). you would have also calculated that you would win {KJQ, HEM, SF} pool and that you would need his vote to pass through Day 3 to eliminate one of us. You have created a strong bond with him in this game and have both strongly townread each other, so it prevents you from being overwhelmed by SF and I (whereas SF town reads me over you) as you make the case that it could never be you and the next elimination should be SF/HEM. In this reality, Purple was simply one less confirmed town for you to deal with.

[humaneatingmonkey]

You're asking me why you would make a kill like that, and so I'm telling you what I think is a possible decision-making process you had during the night

[humaneatingmonkey]

ABOUT RVS

RVS lasted for 12 whole ass pages for which KJQ, SF, and zach were all present. During this stage, if you're scum who wants to blend in, it's obvious what you have to do: you got to act silly. halfasleep has actively participated in this phase, and so it's reasonable to say that an example has been set for their partner to join in.

among the three, what stood out to me was zach. he felt so out of place and distant.

I feel bad saying this because they’re new but not a super fan of zachs posts. I’ll let them cook though and come back to this after the game advances somewhat as it could just be nerves and not knowing what to do (as either alignment)

OMG I WAS ABOUT TO SAY THAT BUT THEN DECIDED TO HOLD IT BACK FOR A BIT OMG OMG ACTUALLY IN SYNC

I get that because my posts have been awkward forced and stilted af lol I just don't know how to sillypost with completely new people. I wish I had something to cook but the fridge is empty because I haven't been able to make sense of anything that has been said <3

if zach was scum then he wasn't trying to blend in this phase at all... which doesn't make sense to me. this should be the easiest phase for them to establish towncred and blend in. why is he trying to make sense of anything? I'm inclined to just believe that this aligns town for him.

[humaneatingmonkey]

hey you know you see someone do it next thing you know you do it too. monkey see monkey do

[humaneatingmonkey]

Rolecop! We're in B1.

[humaneatingmonkey]

So why are you so worried about getting down to 3?

I feel like throughout this game, there's this barrier we have where you never interpret my words as I have intended.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Like now, where you seem to have another meaning extracted from what I'm saying.

[humaneatingmonkey]

Hey so, you guys wanna skip ahead and do StraightFlush right now?

[humaneatingmonkey]

okay, but would you make an effort with me to fix our rapport? our rapport is terrible because you seem to dislike me a lot.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I would like to know, yes

I told you, she got stuff!

I know she got stuff

Did you know she’s stuffin deez nuts in yo face?

bruh

[humaneatingmonkey]

I hope you know that every time you say that I have been condescending, cliquish, and dismissive - you are making a personal evaluation on who I am as a person. You are making a bad-faith interpretation of how I play. I think I have discussed my positions on thread health only on how it impacts gamesolve, so from my point of view, inherently game-relevant. I also believe that controlling the volume of post helped out in focusing our discussion.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I also don't understand how it's assumed that I think newbies are bad. I played Day 1 by assuming that I'm talking to town by talking to both you and ketchup.

[humaneatingmonkey]

all the pushback I got was peppered with “I know more than you and you’re wrong” so yes, I was extremely frustrated trying to work around that and you didn’t seem to want to consider my perspective at all. And then when it turns out, I was right, I just get a double down on why I must’ve just been bussing instead of just correct with my read.

I hope you do also know that you specifically asked me why I was confident in a read I made, and that question can only be answered by citing my experience.

Have you considered that you have a reverse bias against experienced players because you automatically assume bad-faith and condescension from their behalf?

[humaneatingmonkey]

To me, that’s against the nature of a newbie game. To basically just dictate to new players what’s going to happen and why instead of actually trying to play with them - why did you rep into a newbie game if you wanted to play the way you like, which doesn’t seem very newbie-friendly?

A big chunk - maybe majority - of my games are played with newbies. What do you think playing with newbies look like? Don't you think it's more condescending to newbie players if I ignore the instincts I bring into the game and let all the new players call the shots - in a backwards attempt to cater to them?

[humaneatingmonkey]

I want to put StraightFlush to E-1 for picking up a soft claim on mason and then deciding to escalate it to public awareness without any prompt. That feels like a kiting technique to fish out actual masons. And it's my first actual read of the game because everything else before that post was straight-up junk.

Based

We are in a rolecop setup, as has been well established with purple's flip. There are no masons in a rolecop setup, so for scum!me this would just be pure retard energy that draws unnecessary attention.

Pedit: The duality of man

I picked up on this on my re-read (just now actually) and thought there's actually a good possibility scum!you did this to cite this. I noted how fast you jumped on a reaction. To hear you cite this right now is really a huge coincidence!

[humaneatingmonkey]

I still don’t get the argument that we needed to stop posting (in our minds - playing the game). Did telling us to stop posting and us subsequently capitulating, help you focus day 1? You didn’t catch scum, I did with the help of another loud townie - ketchup. So I’m confused as to why you think you were right to try to shut us up.

you slip in slippery slopes. giving space for others to react is still playing the game, so I'm not asking you to stop playing the game. asking you to give space for others to react is not capitulation. asking you to give space for others to react is not shutting you up. at that point, you were complaining that the game is moving slow meanwhile it was moving at a break neck speed and the volume of posts were too fast. i don't think you were considering that it was getting hard for anyone that isn't you and ketchup to play the game by doing that.

[humaneatingmonkey]

I was making an evaluation on how you were presenting yourself in the game.

yes, you are making an evaluation of me as a person instead of evaluating what i was saying. therefore taking it personal. i understand you don't feel so, but I really felt uncomfortable and i felt offended that you were painting me in such a bad light.

[humaneatingmonkey]

immediately I’m faced with “vote out Kay, she’s probably town but she’s going to make the wrong decision because that’s what I believe is true”.

even this is a very mean interpretation of what the post was. i merely said that you would likely be voting me in ELo. even you have an inkling that i do the same because i'll be voting you on ELo over zach. I don't find that condescending even though you claim that I'll be making a wrong decision. so why can't you extend the same generous good faith interpretation to me? why do you always have to paint me in such a negative light? why do i always have to come from a condescending and dismissive place?

[humaneatingmonkey]

regardless i've re-read the game and i think StraightFlush is the last scum.

[humaneatingmonkey]

i feel the same way about you with regards to thinking that I'm condescending, dismissive, and cliquish. i think we just acknowledge how we feel about each other, and be aware of that if we still live through ELo.

[humaneatingmonkey]

hey why the self-vote