Metabalance

mathcam · Post Post #7 (isolation #0) » Mon Oct 06, 2003 3:58 am

I definitely think every player should have a non-negligible shot at winning, but I think that's about as far as it goes in my book. Exactly in your terms, I think there's a natural metabalancing that the game designer doesn't even have control over. If you get a role that's hard to win with, then you've exceeded all expectations by wining with it. I'll take serial killer any time any one wants to hand it to me. I know that I'll have a hard time winning, but I know that if I win, it'll count for more.

How can you really measure someone's ability at mafia? Certainly not wins/losses. Certainly not how long you can last in any particular game. Any of these can be artifically lowered or decreased without actual talent in the game. The "perfect" measuring tool is the nebulous and very hard to define "How well has the person played with what (s)he was given?" The best we can calculate this is essentially something to the extent of "What is the relationship between the expected number of times this player should win compared to the actual number of times (s)he did win?" This leads to my example before. In this scoring system, you don't lose a lot for not winning with a serial killer, but you gain a lot if you do win. That's why I don't mind playing one.

I realize that not everyone thinks about the game (or games in general) this way, and I definitely agree that you should play to win every game, not to maximize your overall performance, but I don't think my above interpretation of how to play affects this at all.

Cam

mathcam · Post Post #9 (isolation #1) » Mon Oct 06, 2003 4:42 am

Not at all impossible...just severely handicapped relative to the mafia. Almost always, whatever the mafia's chances are of winning a particular game, the Sk's chances are significantly smaller.

Cam

mathcam · Post Post #11 (isolation #2) » Mon Oct 06, 2003 6:32 am

There was a huge thread about this on the old board. I think Captain Blicero was thinking about running his Texas Mafia game again, but with all new players. I'd be really interested in seeing that happen. Cap'n? Thoughts?

Cam

mathcam · Post Post #15 (isolation #3) » Mon Oct 06, 2003 10:40 am

I often give serial killers an immunity to the first time their killed at night, and in Quantum Mafia, also provided them with a "safe" role claim...i.e. a role that fit other pro-town roles and was not taken by anyone else.

Shadyforce wrote:Maybe a game that has been permanently deleted.

Say, for example, CaptainBlicero's Texas mafia game?

Cam

mathcam · Post Post #19 (isolation #4) » Mon Oct 06, 2003 12:34 pm

I love Serial Killer roles. For some reason, they almost alwas make it to the endgame in my games, and then die the night before they could have won.

Hmm, I think I

was

one of those in your Mafia 11, and then died the night before they could have wone.

And I agree that if we could make the logistics work, it would be really fun. I even think it would be fun if all the players could watch the games happening at the same time. Day one would be interesting..."Well that claim makes sense...in the other game, Bob claimed that same role....they wouldn't both be lying, would they?" "Sure he would. Bob claimed that role

because

it was claimed in the other game. He thought it would be a safe claim," etc.

Cam