Datisi's University [dead/spec PT]

[Dannflor]

oof

[Dannflor]

yeah that was sad

good shot by andres

[Dannflor]

thanks for the consolation (

I’ve never been guiltied like that before tbh I didn’t know what to do

[Dannflor]

remind me not to roll scum in any games with fireisredsir

[Dannflor]

Spoiler:

is the landmine the thing i had to nicely argue against n2

[Dannflor]

yeah i agree it’s much easier to have accurate reads as a spectator

in thread you have to deal with actual relationships the inherent manipulation that comes with them

but i still find it impressive how accurate you’ve been about my agenda and what i was trying to do in thread

[Dannflor]

datisi your last post in the scum pt is fucking heartbreaking lol

[Dannflor]

i have become predictable

[Dannflor]

in hindsight my only option was to take the 1v1 but i thought i could get away with that on tone

alas

[Dannflor]

tbf

scum did a risky thing and got punished for it

We could have power too

[Dannflor]

i love to wake up to 10 notifications from a game in which i am flipped scum

[Dannflor]

Spoiler:

that’s nice of norwegian to think i am very skilled and smart and laid traps and didn’t just fly by the seat of my pants

[Dannflor]

hi GL

[Dannflor]

i think it's wild you got eliminated here

[Dannflor]

tbf i feel like i catered a not-insignificant amount of my posting specifically towards pocketing you

[Dannflor]

people go on auto pilot after a certain point in large games i think

[Dannflor]

yeah idk how easy it is to tell the difference between what happened and two power wolves leading the game

[Dannflor]

I guess maybe we would’ve distanced more as scum buddies?

[Dannflor]

it's datisi's fault probably

[Dannflor]

stown power role points

[Dannflor]

datisi will be blamed for this

[Dannflor]

fire on the mountain when

[Dannflor]

weird role datisi

[Dannflor]

Spoiler:

datisi setups and scum slips

name a more iconic duo

[Dannflor]

Spoiler: Correct answer

Oh, it's mr wheme park claiming to be the same flavour dannflor fakeclaimed

Spoiler:

im malding

very funny that you noticed that but no one in game nor any of my scum team mates did )))

[Dannflor]

Spoiler:

the same scum team also didn’t notice which fake claim i used despite me explicitly stating it multiple times in the scum pt so

[Dannflor]

Spoiler:

yeah this game is over :/

[Dannflor]

this game died huh

[Dannflor]

sad scum noises

[Dannflor]

I think games with a lot of mechanics demand more from scumplay than just "be townier than the lowest common denominator." I think, for instance, even though I was generally town read my play here simply wasn't that great considering the environment I was in. A better scum player than me actively plays to not get checked and therefore does not die with all the banked SPR. A better scum player than me uses my town cred more effectively to either out investigatives or push miselims that disrupt the building town core. At the very least, I could have anticipated the odds of getting mechanically guiltied at some point and played to give my scum team a ton of town cred if I did flip - which was something I recognized I should be doing by the second day but didn't have the know-how to effectively pull it off.

So, I mean, yeah you can argue the way this played out was unlucky for the scum team or that the setup swung heavily in town's favor due to the nature of how the night actions played out. But based on what I can see of the setup now I don't think this was actually unbalanced or anything. I think we, the scum team, just failed to effectively play to our outs, and combined with the way the setup swung it just looks like we suddenly got crushed. But like, me getting guiltied by Andres doesn't matter if I'm better at distancing, hitting Enchant doesn't matter if the two scummiest slots even before mass claim are scum.

[Dannflor]

Interesting that you'd go in that direction, Dannflor, given I'd say you were the practical reason I couldn't get any eliminations through on day 1. And eliminating scum on day 1 is a core facet of my town strategy

I mean, I do think I played well D1 in terms of playing to a scum agenda. And night killing you N1 was I think the objectively best kill due to your excellent reads. And, to be clear, I'm not like fishing for compliments on my scum game by being down on myself here. I just am very critical because I'm very competitive and I think this loss was avoidable if I play D2 and onwards differently.

If you have one player who's carrying the team and you also choose to give all your powers to that player, and then that player gets investigated, I don't think town winning is an unreasonable outcome there

And while you can complain this was unlucky and it probably was, it also should just be like expected to happen. Like, the fact that I held all the powers and then didn't especially play around a possible guilty made the impact of an "unlucky" event like the guilty much higher than it would've been.

If you put an elite scum player like LLD, Flavor Leaf, MariaR, RC, etc. in my place here on D2 then scum wins a lot more of the time, because they just have a better understanding of how to do that.

Anyway, this is just my own self reflection and trying not to plateau by blaming this game on dumb luck or the setup. The setup actually looks quite balanced. I think I just don't really have enough experience playing with and around mech as scum and that ended up contributing to what is looking like a loss.

[Dannflor]

i think scum get a lot more agency than individual townies in most games

I would expect an elite town player to win about 75% of their games

I would expect an elite scum player to win close to 100%

[Dannflor]

it's possible my sample size is limited as i tend to only look at this site

but northsidegal, who won paragon and is widely regarded as one of the best town players ever on this site, has a 70% winrate as town over 50 games

radiantcowbells, who i don't think anyone would dispute as an excellent scum player, played nearly 30 scum games over a 2 year period and lost 1 game

i am talking about the very very upper echelon of players but these numbers have certainly been proven possible

[Dannflor]

that's fair

I can't really compare a sample size of 50 to thousands

I would suspect that a chat mafia format lends itself to higher variance, but I couldn't say by how much

[Dannflor]

I don’t think most townies realize scum had to bank SPR on a specific person