Kingmaker II-Game Over

[Mastermind of Sin]

SV, Fritz, mnowax2, VR

[Mastermind of Sin]

Not really, Kscope.

[Mastermind of Sin]

There is a specific reason, but your response could give me a possible clue towards your alignment, so I want to see what you say without any prodding in a specific direction.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Ok Yos, you passed the test. Cavane's post that you quoted as being weird seems to qualify under the "Person C" argument that you were having earlier. I just wanted to make sure you were consistent with finding posts like that scummy.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Gotta love the effort you people are putting into the game...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Indeed, LoL

[Mastermind of Sin]

Says the person who has made about two posts with reasoning this entire game day.

Of your 12 posts today, TS, 6 of them have been you impatiently asking for the execution to happen already. 2 of the remaining 6 posts were you blindly following other peoples' votes without any reasoning of your own. And only 2 of those lone 4 actually contained reasoning relevant to the game. And we're not even talking about good reasoning, either. They contained at least an attempt at reasoning, perhaps more in some cases. You're not one to talk about needing swifter executions. If everyone in the game acted like you, TS, the King would have no information as to who might actually be scum, because there'd be no good reasoning behind the votes made each day.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I would like to suggest Toaster Strudel for execution.

[Mastermind of Sin]

And this is the kind of attitude that is going to lose us the game.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Well said, Yos

[Mastermind of Sin]

I've got to admit that as much as I'd like a well thought out, reasoned and analysed execution, I also just want an execution. We've all had plenty of time to say everything we want.

Indeed. I also want an execution. However, the fact that NOW is the right time to be calling for an execution doesn't cover the fact that Toaster Strudel has been impatient all day, calling for one 5 OTHER times throughout the day.

That

sort of behavior is unacceptable. Just because an execution is needed now does not excuse him from his earlier actions when it was unappropriate to call for an execution.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Thesp, it's not a bad reason unless you don't think the person is scum.

This is wrong. This is a rationalizing justification for lynching someone despite not thinking they are the ideal lynch. If you think they're the ideal lynch, you wouldn't need this argument.

This post has no relevance to proving that it's a bad reason.

While you

might

be able to make a case that it's not a good or bad reason, I think the fact that you're trying to justify an argument with a reason that doesn't necessarily progress the argument, but looks good, disturbs me. It's a dangerous rationalization used to progress a bad agenda.

In english, please? Can you reference

which

argument and

which

reason you are referring to, and

why

it doesn't progress said argument? I can't tell what you are talking about.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Thanks.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Why? Would you like to actually contribute something to the game, mnowax?

[Mastermind of Sin]

ROFL...I'm...speechless...lmfao

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yup, I just wanted to make sure what you were referring to.

I agree that Spectrumvoid is worth lynching. However, so is Fritzler. I don't see why it's a bad reason to use the amount of information gained from lynching them as a deciding factor to choose between them.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Why are you completely ignoring the point?

[Mastermind of Sin]

:goodposting by Cavane and RafK:

[Mastermind of Sin]

Nobody said lynch

only

for information. I don't understand why you seem to think that how much information is derived from a lynch should not be part of the consideration. As I said, it's not the only factor, but it's not an invalid one, either.

No, it's still a crap reason. If Fritzler is lynched, I think we still gain a lot of information. "Lynchign for information" is a rationalization - we'll get info either way. I'm a little surprised there aren't more people calling to get serious pressure on Fritzler - if he's really equally as scummy as spectrumvoid, we could put some pressure on him and get more information from him. Heck, I think we're getting information on him right now in this discussion.

Indeed we are. The more this conversation continues, the more information we get regarding Fritzler. However, this does not change the fact that at the time I made my original statement, there was little information to be gained from a Fritzler lynch, since there had not been much discussion of him.

[Mastermind of Sin]

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"]If there is more evidence against Y, but X gives more leads towards other players if turning up scum, then I still think it's a bad idea.[/quote]

If there is approximately the same evidence against Y and X, but X gives more leads towards finding scum in the future, which would you prefer to execute first?

[Mastermind of Sin]

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"][quote="Mastermind of Sin"][quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"]If there is more evidence against Y, but X gives more leads towards other players if turning up scum, then I still think it's a bad idea.[/quote]If there is approximately the same evidence against Y and X, but X gives more leads towards finding scum in the future, which would you prefer to execute first?[/quote]I think that the chance that the evidence against X and Y would be almost the same is nihil, so the comparisation is really irrelevant there.[/quote]

I believe that SV and Fritzler are nearly equal in scumminess, so it's not irrelevant. I cannot decide which one is scummier, so I chose SV for more information.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Can someone check who needs to be prodded and request for prods? I'm at work or I'd do it.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I don't really see what's wrong with my kingship. Also, I don't understand why you're jumping to conclusions about my request for claims.

Damn, I didn't think his kingship was

that

scummy until he made this post...

[Mastermind of Sin]

YARR!

[Mastermind of Sin]

That's 2. 19 more to go!

[Mastermind of Sin]

People clearly don't appreciate CES's sacrifice. There are not enough "YARR!"s.

[Mastermind of Sin]

If I had been selected King, someone would be dead already.

This is clearly why you were not selected.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Just a note, if you intend to do a voting analysis, you will have to read my posts in order to create a representation of votes from me, if you care. Just felt it was my duty to remind you since I decided to play that way.

[Mastermind of Sin]

VitR, you're barking down the wrong path. It's not whether someone does one of those things, it's that someone does one or more of those things

consistently

, forming a pattern of behavior that you can pick up on to determine they are probably scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mod, can you prod Friztler and Mnowax?

I don't think I've seen them post in a while, and at least one of them is probably scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

...And the game dies....

[Mastermind of Sin]

Has he even posted today?

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm starting to become ambivalent towards this game. That's bad.

[Mastermind of Sin]

For what reason?

[Mastermind of Sin]

<3 PJ

Bad Zindie. Pushing King PJ around = a kitten dies in Darfur.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Indeed.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos is right, RafK needs to step back and take another look at this particular crusade. It's rather silly.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I have a suggestion to tweak it. Anyone who does not comply with the assignment faces execution. Trust me, I've done this before, and I should've done that.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos's analysis is going to be fun. Mine, not so much. They're lurker/replacements -_-

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm back from MoS-Faire, it was awesome! Analysis tonight, hopefully.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Toaster Strudel/Nightson/Vikingfan:

Vikingfan (4 posts):

He only made posts in September '06, so there's not much to garner

from his contributions. He did make one contribution about not

considering people very cleared just based on their executions, as

evidenced by his experience as scum in the Endgame of KM 1.

He was suspicious of pablito and felt PJ was protown.

Conclusion: Not much to gain from this, but he seems genuine from

what I can tell. (+1 townieness)

Nightson (22 posts):

Rightly suspicious of pablito and phoebus, though he may have been

just picked the easy targets. Protected cardb0ardb0x.

Says that pablito's posts seem strange and not protown, in response

to Ameliaslay calling his reasons flimsy. Asks why being confusing

makes a person protown.

Votes Twomz but can't remember exactly why, due to the crash.

Says MBL is wrong town, Glork is town, PJ is town, has doubts about

pablito

Has a problem with the Yos execution. Votes MBL for saying that

Glork shouldn't try to execute someone the town doesn't agree is

scum, says the post is full of logical fallacies.

Conclusion: Outside of lurking, his posts seem solid and thoughtful.

I'm not finding them scummy. (+1 townieness)

Toaster Strudel (69 posts):

Says PJ and MoS are town. Agrees with Yos' arguments.

Votes DragonsofSummer (aka VitaminR) in agreement with Yos

Says something about LL being masons with Glork, which doesn't make

sense given that there are only scum and townies in the game. Later

clarifies where this came from, quoting LL's post. Votes LL when it

is pointed out that there can't be masons.

Makes about 17 posts Feb 9 - Mar 10, nearly all of which were

one-liners asking for something to happen or praising the mod for

setting a deadline. (-3 townieness)

4 more useless posts on the next day, copies CES' votes for no reason

(CES had no reason, either) (-1 townieness)

Asks why Mnowax is giving Shanba a bad vibe. (+1 townieness)

Votes smashy for no reason. (-1 townieness)

Votes mnowax for no reason. (-1 townieness)

3 more useless posts wanting an execution. (-1 townieness)

Agrees with PJ about mnowax2 (then BM). Thinks RafK/mnowax are town.

(-1 townieness)

Compares my behavior to Bad Idea II, thinks Yos is town, votes myself

and SV. (-1 townieness, why SV?)

Attacks me for explaining my pre-planned playstyle (which was

evidenced by my first post, so this make no sense).

Agrees with Thesp's opening posts.

Votes Der Hammer, SV, VitaminR, and mnowax (apparently in agreement

with Thesp and then PJx3, respectively) (-1 townieness for no

reasoning)

Another 14 mostly useless posts, suddenly wants a Fritzler or SV

execution. (-2 townieness, what happened to VitR? Why Fritz?)

Links a bunch of Fritzler's posts with a little explanation, votes

Fritzler.

Thinks Mnowax2 might be scum for defending SV. (+1 townieness)

Conclusion: I have a lot of questions for TS:
1) Why did you just follow CES's votes (which had no reason) and give

no reason of your own?
2) Why did you vote Smashy without reason?
3) Why did you say that you think mnowax gives bad vibes naturally,

not as scum, and then later vote him without an explanation?
4) Why did you later think mnowax was town again? (these were about

mnowax1).
5) How does my behavior compare to Bad Idea II?
6) Why did you vote SV without giving any reason for it?
7) What reason did you have for voting DH, SV, VitR, and mnowax2?
8) Why was Fritzler one of your preferred lynches, and why did you

not want VitR to be lynched, even though you voted for him?
9) Why is Fritz wanting to kill me evidence of his scumminess, when

you want to kill me as well?

Adding together all 3 of them, -8 townieness. Pending responses to

my questions, I would say Ts is probably scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Notepad sucks. I was fixing it and accidentally hit submit. Try this instead:

Toaster Strudel/Nightson/Vikingfan:

Vikingfan (4 posts):

He only made posts in September '06, so there's not much to garner from his contributions. He did make one contribution about not considering people very cleared just based on their executions, as evidenced by his experience as scum in the Endgame of KM 1.

He was suspicious of pablito and felt PJ was protown.

Conclusion: Not much to gain from this, but he seems genuine from what I can tell. (+1 townieness)

Nightson (22 posts):

Rightly suspicious of pablito and phoebus, though he may have been just picked the easy targets. Protected cardb0ardb0x.

Says that pablito's posts seem strange and not protown, in response to Ameliaslay calling his reasons flimsy. Asks why being confusing makes a person protown.

Votes Twomz but can't remember exactly why, due to the crash.

Says MBL is wrong town, Glork is town, PJ is town, has doubts about pablito

Has a problem with the Yos execution. Votes MBL for saying that Glork shouldn't try to execute someone the town doesn't agree is scum, says the post is full of logical fallacies.

Conclusion: Outside of lurking, his posts seem solid and thoughtful. I'm not finding them scummy. (+1 townieness)

Toaster Strudel (69 posts):

Says PJ and MoS are town. Agrees with Yos' arguments.

Votes DragonsofSummer (aka VitaminR) in agreement with Yos

Says something about LL being masons with Glork, which doesn't make sense given that there are only scum and townies in the game. Later clarifies where this came from, quoting LL's post. Votes LL when it is pointed out that there can't be masons.

Makes about 17 posts Feb 9 - Mar 10, nearly all of which were one-liners asking for something to happen or praising the mod for setting a deadline. (-3 townieness)

4 more useless posts on the next day, copies CES' votes for no reason (CES had no reason, either) (-1 townieness)

Asks why Mnowax is giving Shanba a bad vibe. (+1 townieness)

Votes smashy for no reason. (-1 townieness)

Votes mnowax for no reason. (-1 townieness)

3 more useless posts wanting an execution. (-1 townieness)

Agrees with PJ about mnowax2 (then BM). Thinks RafK/mnowax are town. (-1 townieness)

Compares my behavior to Bad Idea II, thinks Yos is town, votes myself and SV. (-1 townieness, why SV?)

Attacks me for explaining my pre-planned playstyle (which was evidenced by my first post, so this make no sense).

Agrees with Thesp's opening posts.

Votes Der Hammer, SV, VitaminR, and mnowax (apparently in agreement with Thesp and then PJx3, respectively) (-1 townieness for no reasoning)

Another 14 mostly useless posts, suddenly wants a Fritzler or SV execution. (-2 townieness, what happened to VitR? Why Fritz?)

Links a bunch of Fritzler's posts with a little explanation, votes Fritzler.

Thinks Mnowax2 might be scum for defending SV. (+1 townieness)

Conclusion: I have a lot of questions for TS:
1) Why did you just follow CES's votes (which had no reason) and give no reason of your own?
2) Why did you vote Smashy without reason?
3) Why did you say that you think mnowax gives bad vibes naturally, not as scum, and then later vote him without an explanation?
4) Why did you later think mnowax was town again? (these were about mnowax1).
5) How does my behavior compare to Bad Idea II?
6) Why did you vote SV without giving any reason for it?
7) What reason did you have for voting DH, SV, VitR, and mnowax2?
8) Why was Fritzler one of your preferred lynches, and why did you not want VitR to be lynched, even though you voted for him?
9) Why is Fritz wanting to kill me evidence of his scumminess, when you want to kill me as well?

Adding together all 3 of them, -8 townieness. Pending responses to my questions, I would say Ts is probably scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

mnowax, instead of being completely useless, how about you actually do your assignment?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Wow, this is sad.

Players that need prodding:

Cavane, ThAdmiral, Toaster Strudel, VitaminR, Yosarian2

Players whose last post was Sunday June 24th:

Fritzler, Ksc0pe, Lowell, RafK, Thesp, Zindaras

These players should probably be prodded if they do not post today or tomorrow.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Aye, now I have to answer MoS's questions... so many.

(1) Why did you just follow CES's votes (which had no reason) and give no reason of your own?
(2) Why did you vote Smashy without reason?
(7) What reason did you have for voting DH, SV, VitR, and mnowax2?
(4) Why did you later think mnowax was town again? (these were about mnowax1).
(6) Why did you vote SV without giving any reason for it?
(8)Why was Fritzler one of your preferred lynches, and why did you not want VitR to be lynched, even though you voted for him?

The answers are already in the the posts where I voted and expressed my opinions. For example, for (7), I was agreeing with PJ's analysis, and I clearly stated that. And I've also explained why I think Fritzler is scum quite clearly http://mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 679#644679 - so you and everybody can go and read my posts, it's all there.

Your questions are worded in a way to make it look like there is scum happenin' - but a lot of players might interpret things differently.

(3) Why did you say that you think mnowax gives bad vibes naturally, not as scum, and then later vote him without an explanation? That was a bit of metagaming, I was in a game with him I think at the time, and he was scummy as hell. And I think he was town.
(5) How does my behavior compare to Bad Idea II? - I didn't play that game, but DrippingGoofball tells me that the two games have different concepts, and you were Godfather, and it's not an idea to use that game to metagame you.
(9) Why is Fritz wanting to kill me evidence of his scumminess, when you want to kill me as well? I want to kill you? - It's not evidence of scumminess or not, since your alignment is unknown, but I wanted to record the fact that he ONCE posted that he wanted to kill you. Might be useful later.

There is a lot wrong with this post, and I'm highly unsatisfied with TS's answers, but I'm going to sleep now, so I'll try to answer tonight sometime.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Do you deny that you copied CES's reasonless votes without providing reason of your own?

Okay.

Vote: Zindaras, Lowell

They should probably die.

Unassailable logic.

Vote: Zindaras, Lowell

Do you deny that you voted Smashy without providing a reason for it?

vote: Smashy

and I'll vote Yos too if he takes too long making up his mind!

Do you deny that you voted SV without giving any reason of your own?

Considering how painfully long it is to lynch someone in this game, zombies are extremely annoying. They undo all of yesterday's work, krrrap!!!

I think Yos is town. MoS's overwhelming eagerness reminds me of his behavior in Bad Idea Mafia II where he was the Godfather.

And I'll support PJ's campaign. I want to test PJ, really.

vote: MoS, SV

OMG PJ is a genius too. I am sorry but I must defer to brains that are so much more sophisticated and better irrigated than the bean-sized, oxygen-starved bit of grey matter tightly housed in my thick skull.

vote: Der Hammer

- secret handshake with Thesp, I will never wash hands again.

vote: spectrumvoid
vote: VitaminR
vote: mnowax

Love you PJ.

Do you deny that the above post shows you voting DH, SV, VitR, and mnowax without reason of your own?

If anything, the answer found in the thread is that you DO have actions to explain, despite your own denial.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Also, why did it take King PJ asking you to analyze 2 people, and then you messing up who you were supposed to analyze for you to get around to actually giving evidence to support your Fritzler suspicion?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Your questions are worded in a way to make it look like there is scum happenin' - but a lot of players might interpret things differently.

The questions are indeed slighltly loaded questions. That's because you've done something scummy that you need to answer for, so of course the questions are biased.

(3) Why did you say that you think mnowax gives bad vibes naturally, not as scum, and then later vote him without an explanation? That was a bit of metagaming, I was in a game with him I think at the time, and he was scummy as hell. And I think he was town.

This explains why you thought mnowax could be town. This does

not

explain why you later voted for him after saying you thought he was town.

(5) How does my behavior compare to Bad Idea II? - I didn't play that game, but DrippingGoofball tells me that the two games have different concepts, and you were Godfather, and it's not an idea to use that game to metagame you.

Huh? This answer makes no sense to me. Are you saying you were wrong or right in comparing me to Bad Idea II?

(9) Why is Fritz wanting to kill me evidence of his scumminess, when you want to kill me as well? I want to kill you? - It's not evidence of scumminess or not, since your alignment is unknown, but I wanted to record the fact that he ONCE posted that he wanted to kill you. Might be useful later.

Ah, I see. Ok.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I don't see why VitR would think to do that. He has his own assignment on purpose, it's not his problem that you messed up.

Thank you for finally explaining yourself. At least now we get the bigger picture. When you voted Smashy, it was under Yos2 as King, so it couldn't have been due to the impatience of his reign, but it's clear you don't remember what it was.

Who do you think is scum right now, and why?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Cavane/Der Hammer/Vaughn:

Vaughn (8 posts):

defends self from PJ putting him on the list based on his first post (+1 townieness)

pointed out PJ's "convenient" post about being scum last game (+1 townieness)

calls pablito town, but bad town.

Conclusion: Lazy, but town

Der Hammer (21 posts):

Repeatedly says that he'll post but doesn't (-1 townieness)

votes LuckayLuck for voting DH on someone else's opinions

Thinks LL is a better kill than SV

votes mnowax for not saying anything

unvotes mnowax and points out how MoS is "dictacting" executions

Agrees with Smashy and MoS executions, opposes VitR and SV executions. (-1 townieness)

Conclusion: Looks scummier than Vaughn, for sure. Doesn't seem to want to say much about SV, and doesn't want SV executed.

Cavane (17 posts):

Good opening posting with responses to a lot of people (+1 townieness)

disagrees that lynching for information is a bad reason

doesn't like TS lurking in plain sight (+1 townieness)

Doesn't understand VitR trying to find scum from the SV wagon, since there were so many people

Conclusion: A lot of contribution, good posts, solid opinions

+2 townieness

I had bad feelings about Der Hammer, but he's somewhat naturally scummy, I guess. I would MUCH rather execute Toaster Strudel than Cavane.

[Mastermind of Sin]

MNOWAX YOU HAVE AN ASSIGNMENT FROM THE KING. DO IT OR FACE EXECUTION

I would like everyone to take notice of how mnowax has acted differently this time, choosing to actively lurk without any contribution rather than flailing around with bad arguments.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'm very tempted to break my own rule and place a vote (*gasp*) on mnowax out of sheer annoyance.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I am overjoyed by the frequency of voting with deadline looming.

[Mastermind of Sin]

OMG it's BMQ...

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK, I'm sorry.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I finally got back from Thespival...12-hour train ride -_-

[Mastermind of Sin]

Leaving tomorrow for the weekend

[Mastermind of Sin]

I told you it was a spider bite...hope it gets better

[Mastermind of Sin]

My first suggestion is don't execute Thesp (I forget if he's on the LoE). My second suggestion is...iunno...I'll come up with something eventually.

[Mastermind of Sin]

ThAdmiral, perhaps you could complete your assignment today, to make up for missing out yesterday?

This kingship is going to be interesting.

[Mastermind of Sin]

PJ is scum. Execute him. PJ complained and whined about being king and used the apathy of the town to wait until deadline to execute, where he could easily just make a decision without much reasoning behind it.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I disagree with Kscope. 5-6 useful things in a week is bad.

[Mastermind of Sin]

2/3 of the game not posting content is more than enough to justify what Yos2 did. I agree with many of RafK's points against Yos2, but I feel that you are going out of your way to make it seem that everything Yos2 has done was a vicious lie, deviously thought up to screw the town over. You're reaching, Kscope.

[Mastermind of Sin]

You know what, I'm really getting sick of this game, getting sick of having the same stupid BS arguments thrown at me over and over again, and I don't feel like playing this game for another 11 months, which we might at the rate we've been going at. So don't expect me to take the whole month to make a decision here. If anyone has any useful suggestions about who I should execute, and can make a good case for why, I'll be glad to listen.

That's AWESOME.

I'll find you someone to kill. It's not petroleumjelly, though. Probably MoS.

:fail: You're not going to gain anything from this. You're about the only person besides mnowax who continually says I'm scum. Everyone else has either said I was town or attacked me and then gave up the attack. As a result, there isn't much information to be had from my execution, especially since I'm not scum.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Also, PJ, I think it was pretty obvious given the past few days that your assignment wasn't going to be completed by everyone, so that gave you the chance to "wait" for everyone to finish, having to execute someone at deadline. I do, however, concede the fact that your execution wasn't out of the blue, although I did not agree that VitR/Phoebus was scum, obviously.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Well done. You've convinced me that you are not the play for today.

[Mastermind of Sin]

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 462#597462

That is the beginning of Thesp's case against me and my responses.

Thesp, you should know better than to think I'm scum just because I look scummy. After all the D1 protown MoS lynches at Thespival, I'd have thought you'd notice a trend...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I like it how RafK just ignored the fact that pj accused him of possibly purposefully "not understanding", which is as good as calling him scum anyways.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I <3 Cavane's more than TS's. Cavane notes that he takes certain sides with certain issues, which is an important clarification. TS said he believes PJ, which is a blanket agreement with PJ's side in all the issues under discussion regarding him.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Thesp, we'll see who's right when your suspects come up dead. I think you'll be surprised.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Have I not specifically said that I thought Thesp was town? I thought I'd made that clear already, as LONG time ago.

As for my statement, I'm not particularly saying that he's wrong about all of them. However, despite slight gut instincts that I have felt against Cavane, his play has been quite protown, and I *know* my own alignment, so that's 2/3 of the people already. And Thesp voted for Der Hammer, who

isn't even in the game

. In fact, Der Hammer was

replaced by

Cavane

...

[Mastermind of Sin]

I believe PJ.

Blanket acceptance of everything PJ has said in his defense.

PJ's point that if he had stated his intentions to execute VR, it would have shut the game down while he was away, I think is valid. But Raf also has a valid point that it spread discussion out and took the focus

off

VR. Whether or not this was an intentional tactic on PJ's part, is the question here. I can definately see a scum PJ employing such a move, but I can also see town PJ trying to encourage discussion. Overall, however, it's a bad mark against him in that a townie was executed, and while I had PJ pegged as town, I'm definitely going to rethink my position.

I like this post better, because I *don't* think he's waffling. I think he's being specific in which arguments he agrees with, which is better. In TS's case, he could've said "I believe PJ.", but then later he might've said "Well, I believed he was town, but I didn't *necessarily* agree with that particular point", if perhaps PJ came up scum at some time. I feel that TS's statement could've allowed more wiggle room, whereas Cavane's clearly states what he agrees with, so that he can't say he meant something else later.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I agree that the one sentence you pointed out of the entire post is him not taking a decisive stance, but I don't have a problem with it, because it seems to me that the end of his post implies that he will be doing some sort of reread/analysis in the near future, upon which he will update us on his overall position. Of course, should he not do this...*shrug* I'd be forced to agree with you for once .

[Mastermind of Sin]

he'll always be a good lynch candidate.

[Mastermind of Sin]

PJ, where have I said that someone shouldn't hang "today"? The only time I remember saying that was about bird1111 back on like Day 3 or something, after the crash last fall.

[Mastermind of Sin]

You didn't explicitly say it, but I certainly read this:

Well done. You've convinced me that you are not the play for today.

To include an asterisk of "but maybe tomorrow", especially since your posts immediatley before that were unambiguously calling for my death.

sorry, that's not what I meant. If that was true I'd still be pressing you, because I'd think you were suspicious even if I thought there was a better target today.

[Mastermind of Sin]

He's following up on your accusation of him being wishy-washy about PJ's alignment by doing an analysis whereupon he can then conclude his official position, duh.

[Mastermind of Sin]

He's following up on your accusation of him being wishy-washy about PJ's alignment by doing an analysis whereupon he can then conclude his official position, duh.

Your condescension is unbecoming.

Actually, I think it was rather fitting, considering this post:

I agree that the one sentence you pointed out of the entire post is him not taking a decisive stance, but I don't have a problem with it, because it seems to me that the end of his post implies that he will be doing some sort of reread/analysis in the near future, upon which he will update us on his overall position. Of course, should he not do this...*shrug* I'd be forced to agree with you for once .

Considering that you were getting on *MY* case about the fact that you disagreed with *MY* post that Cavane's post felt protown, and that you were arguing with *ME* for quite some time, I would've thought that it was obvious "why all the attention on PJ". I assumed that since you were trying to argue that what I'd said is wrong (and I believe scummy to boot), you would've actually read my response posts. So, I think the condescension was deserving at the least.

[Mastermind of Sin]

sorry.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Thesp, when you have determined that the time has passed where either the helpful reaction has come or you believe it's never going to happen, I would appreciate it if you elaborated on WHY you believed the attention on PJ was not obvious and what sort of reaction you were fishing for.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Kscope, you don't have to convince Yos that he's PJ's scumbuddy, but you DO need to convince the rest of us, so posting your case that links the two of them would still be beneficial to the town.

[Mastermind of Sin]

And what if you die tonight, Kscope? Do you not feel that Yos2 is scum strongly enough to tell us why, on the offchance that you turn up dead? Your death would not condemn Yos2, because if you didn't give us any reasoning, scum could kill you to set him up. I'd rather you explain yourself now, than give scum a chance to fuck us over.

[Mastermind of Sin]

MoS, if the scum were into that kind of tactic, they could have killed me on any number of occasions.

I'm more worried of the possibility of a scum KScope talking up his anti-Yosness to become king when Yos executes a townie than a town KScope being "silenced" before he can make his case on Yos tbh.

The difference is that you generally explain yourself. KScope is refusing to explain himself on the grounds that it won't convince the current king, but the king isn't the only one that matters.

[Mastermind of Sin]

mnowax, why do you want kscope dead?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Mnowax, why should you survive? What can you bring to the town to make us want to keep you in the game? What can you do to assist us in finding scum?

I wouldn't mind if Kscope is executed. At the very least, it gives us the alignment of one side of this big Yos2, Kscope, RafK, etc. debate, so perhaps we can get some insight on the alignment of some other people.

[Mastermind of Sin]

EBWOP: He is not anywhere near my preferred execution, but I don't think it would be a horrible execution to have. I don't particularly feel that Kscope is more scum than town or vice versa, mostly because I've forgotten what read I had on him, and this entire argument with Yos2 has become annoying and repetitive.

[Mastermind of Sin]

we can start by executing you, scum.

Do you honestly think I'm going to stop asking you questions just because you threaten me? It's not like the Kingmaker will be stupid enough to make you King. I'm not particularly worried about being executed, unless Thesp becomes King. If it gets to the point where I am executed at this point in the game, we probably don't have a chance to win anymore, so w/e.

[Mastermind of Sin]

10 bucks says he names me.

[Mastermind of Sin]

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"][quote="Mastermind of Sin"]And what if you die tonight, Kscope? Do you not feel that Yos2 is scum strongly enough to tell us why, on the offchance that you turn up dead? Your death would not condemn Yos2, because if you didn't give us any reasoning, scum could kill you to set him up. I'd rather you explain yourself now, than give scum a chance to fuck us over.[/quote]I've made an analysis of PJ and Yos2 in where I think they are scummy. In my future posts, I've further eleborated on this. So no, there's no rush.

And to be honest, I don't think I would die the upcoming night, since there are about 2 people the majority of the people think they are town. I'm not going to name those, as I would be suggesting the assassins then, but I honestly don't think i would get murdered.[quote="RafK"]I'm more worried of the possibility of a scum KScope talking up his anti-Yosness to become king when Yos executes a townie than a town KScope being "silenced" before he can make his case on Yos tbh.[/quote]On that note: what do you think of Yos2?[quote="Mastermind of Sin"]KScope is refusing to explain himself on the grounds that it won't convince the current king, but the king isn't the only one that matters.[/quote]I'm not refusing, I simply have other priority's. I'm not going to waste an hour of my time when it has no use yet. There's plenty of time tomorrow to do so.[/quote]

Ahem.

[quote="KaleiÐoscøpe"]Oh, Yos, please. If you are insinuating that I was unwilling to contribute, you were wrong. I have answered questions directly asked from you before you started with your russian roulette. It was you who was lacking any sign of attempting to gather information concerning the execution.

I've answered what was directed at me and have eleborated my suspicions if people would like to hear so (aside from yours and PJ, because you two getting executed today are, as you stated, nihil).

So far, you still have simply refused to eleborate on your LoE, even when asked numerous times. I'm sorry to say, but I see no reason for a townie not to do so.[/quote]

Emphasis mine.

[Mastermind of Sin]

nvm.

[Mastermind of Sin]

yea I know. I misread it. Hush. =P

[Mastermind of Sin]

The funny thing is the people who are communicating i think are the most scummy.

My Top two, Funny enough, is Yos and MoS. K-scope, while is a good information lynch, doesn't seem like scum to me. You want my opinion? The link between Yos and K-scope is stupid. It is simply WIFOM that scum like Yos has brought to the game. He's using it as a tactic to disguise that he himself is scum.

If you don't think Kscope is scum, why were you so excited to see that he might be executed?

[Mastermind of Sin]

I strongly oppose an execution of any player not named "Cavane".

His posts reek of scumminess. His most recent post epitomizes this - he's hedging his bets allover the place, and throwing around suspicion like it's candy. His reaction to the PJ wishy-washiness earlier is exactly how I would expect scum to react - treating the symptom instead of the underlying problem.

Cavane should die.

I am not named "Cavane". What happened?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Heh. Not entirely sure I buy that explanation, but it's a good recovery at the very least. I wouldn't be opposed to a Cavane execution either, but that's because I wouldn't be opposed to just about anyone's execution these days.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos2's post make me very suspicious of Kscope. I hadn't really thought of it that way before, but there is a difference between RafK and Kscope's attacks on Yos2. I'd like to see what RafK has to say about this.

[Mastermind of Sin]

The funny thing is the people who are communicating i think are the most scummy.

My Top two, Funny enough, is Yos and MoS. K-scope, while is a good information lynch, doesn't seem like scum to me. You want my opinion? The link between Yos and K-scope is stupid. It is simply WIFOM that scum like Yos has brought to the game. He's using it as a tactic to disguise that he himself is scum.

If you don't think Kscope is scum, why were you so excited to see that he might be executed?

I was only happy cause it isn't me. Read my crappy posts man!

Try reading *my* posts. You still haven't answered the questions I posed to you about this topic. As a protown, player, you should not be worrying about your own survival unless there is actually a benefit to the town in keeping you alive. Since there are not any roles to be lost in this game, I *still* want you to explain why it is more important to keep you alive rather than Kscope. Do you believe that you have contributed more to the game discussion than he has?

[Mastermind of Sin]

My point is, if you don't feel that Kscope is likely to be scum, you shouldn't prefer his execution to your own. Sure, he *might* be scum, but so could anyone else. Are you saying that you would prefer that anyone else in the game be executed instead of yourself?

[Mastermind of Sin]

We should execute one of Mnowax/Fritzler, then

My internet is screwy, don't expect much in the way of posting until we get new internet soon.

[Mastermind of Sin]

The way I see it, Fritzler and Mnowax are likely to get executed before the end of the game. They could actually be scum, so it's not like we shouldn't execute them. If Yos2 is scum and knows they are protown, then mnowax's logic actually sorta works. Yos2 *not* executing one of them just sets up a mislynch further on down the road. If Yos2 is town, then him executing one of them now is no different from them being executed later, except for the fact that it happens now rather than later, when it might be more critical to find scum instead of being distracted by overly scummy players who aren't being helpful and could still be scum.

The only think I don't like about this is that one of Yos2, PJ, RafK, and Kscope aren't dying. While I don't feel they are all scum, I would like to shed *some* light on the arguments involving them, so as to be able to better discern the alignments of the other players. Of those 4, Kscope would give out the best information, as well as being the most likely to be scum of the players on his side of the argument.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Bird would be a good execution a day or two from now.

If only I had noticed that Ksc0pe was Bird -_-. Although that was a bad call on my part to begin with, allowing Bird to live past that day.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I anyone else here amused that mnowax accuses me of making "few votes"? He's clearly not really paying attention to me and just wants to get me killed. The accusation that I have attacked people with little or no evidence has me laughing hysterically.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I think TS, ThAdmiral, and Cavane are good executions for today, in no particular order. Fritzler comes after those three right now.

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK, what do you think about Cavane?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos2's post make me very suspicious of Kscope. I hadn't really thought of it that way before, but there is a difference between RafK and Kscope's attacks on Yos2. I'd like to see what RafK has to say about this.

It's a shame that RafK ignored this post, but it's a little too late now that we know Ksc0pe's alignment.

[Mastermind of Sin]

mnowax wouldn't have the balls (or the chance) to bus me, because I'd bus him a hell of a lot faster than he could bus me.

[Mastermind of Sin]

You feel insulted because you're called a scumbag? WTF are you on? Are you one of those kids that has emotional trauma or something?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yea, I'm surprised I'm still alive. The analysis checks out, minus the part where I'm more likely to be scum, but I can live with that.

I would like Lowell and Yos2 to comment on Cavane, please.

RafK commenting on mnowax, lowell, and TS would be nice.

ThAdmiral, can you give your thoughts on Yos2 and PJ?

Cavane, what do you think of RafK, Yos2, and myself?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos2, could you go into more depth on Cavane's actions? I feel it's unlikely that you are scum because of yesterday, but your answer seemed very non-specific. It leaves you open to both suspecting him and not voting him at your leisure.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Hey MoS is directing the king to check me out. Sweet.

Is there a reason I can't vote for MoS? Really, I forget.

:not helpful:

[Mastermind of Sin]

Great apathy, people! Let's keep it up!

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK is not helping very much. Do we even have an LoE yet? I think most players in the game are posting more than he is...

[Mastermind of Sin]

*sigh*

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yos2, who do you trust to be the most protown at this point?

[Mastermind of Sin]

Well, I hope you get better. We still have two weeks left, so we'll wait.

[Mastermind of Sin]

*bump*

[Mastermind of Sin]

WTF, when did I get on the block? That's coming out of nowhere...

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK, I don't know why Thesp was so single-mindedly going after me. I fail to see how Thesp was "on the right track", though, since the people he went after as most likely scum in his book at both still alive (myself and Cavane). I don't see any reason for you to be thinking of executing me right now. You presented no reason to think I was scum. You repeatedly said I was town, but suddenly because Yos2 executed scum I must be scum? Not only are you still considering Yos2 a target, you haven't explained how I am connected to Yos2 being scum and myself being town. On top of that, if Thesp was killed by mafia because he was on to them, why isn't Cavane on your list? You have neatly avoided any attention of Cavane, shrugging it off to the side whenever possible.

As far as I can tell, Thesp didn't like my attitude. I couldn't see a logical reason for him to think I was scum, because I believe that I've played enough games with him that he would know better. Perhaps we've been in less than I thought, though.

I am very, very tempted to actually cast a vote at this point, but I'm going to stick to my plan. I wish it was possible for RafK to execute himself, because I think his double standards on myself and Yos just exposed him as scum.

I no longer think Fritz should be lynched today.

I would like an execution of Cavane, who I believe is RafK's scumbuddy.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I bring you the only thing RafK has said to Cavane all day.

RafK, what do you think about Cavane?

Very under the radar.

The last time RafK talked about Cavane was Jul 30th.

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK, I was responding to this post, where you said, and I quote:

I would execute MoS for being the guy whom I thought was town at least in part because I thought Yos was scum, so turnabout is fair play. This is probably my most "logical" execution choice. Also, Thesp had it in for him and

Thesp seems to have been on the right track

(and got killed; I always feel that scum do kill people who are threats, and then say it's WIFOM to say that... I know that as scum, I certainly make a habit of trying to nightkill people who are on to me, if I have that luxury available).

Nice try making it look like I blew a simple question out of the water. I was responding to the statements that came before the question.

My answer to your question was in the second paragraph. Thesp completely read me wrong, and I don't know how he did it, but he did.

[Mastermind of Sin]

We have a deadline in two days. RafK needs to narrow down his list from four people. I don't want him to just suddenly pick one of them on Friday and kill them without further responses.

[Mastermind of Sin]

My question to you was "why was Thesp wrong about you?" (not "why was Thesp on the right track?" or whatever else you seemed to be talking about there) which was effectively the same question I asked ThAdmiral, but phrased differently.

It boils down to "what have you done that shows you're town?".

My answer to your question was in the second paragraph. Thesp completely read me wrong, and I don't know how he did it, but he did.

Try again. Or it really will be you.

Otherwise it's going to be Fritzler- I've come to the conclusion that he's reverse-psychologying (and it has kind of been working), and honestly if I'm going to make a choice on the basis of who has done the least pro-town stuff, he's definitely up there (so is ThAdmiral, but as I said, I think ThAdmiral has a reprieve from me on the day purely because I previously had him as scum due to interaction with Yos).

Again, I ask. If Yos2 being scum made me look more protown, how is the opposite true? You have yet to actually lay out a case for me to be scum. I have put forward my arguments against Thesp multiple times, go back and read them. If you seriously think I am the most likely scum of the people alive, I can't wait for you to get executed tomorrow, because that's a load of bullshit. Even your scumbuddy says I shouldn't be executed.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I've been very frank about my opinions and I've been proactive in hunting after scum. I haven't hesitated to question any kings that exhibited scummy behavior, and I have been thorough in defending myself, attempting to answer any questions that were put to me. I have kept to my beliefs despite times when there was an overwhelming amount of peer pressure to do one thing or another. I did what I felt was right regardless of what people told me to do.

As a side note, why is mnowax still alive, and why is he not on RafK's execution list? DeadRikimaru was a very suspicious king, and his replacements haven't done any better.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Now, why don't you answer the questions I've asked you, Mr. Scum? Stop avoiding legitimate concerns just because you're the goddamn king and get to make the execution. It's not protown to sit around and ignore other people's concerns just so that you can run the show how you want to.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Goddamnit. Why am I not dead or king yet? Slow is not going to be the way to go. We need some pace in this game. I'm not saying we should have a quick-hammer, but No more than 2 weeks length to the day.

[Mastermind of Sin]

OMG so many scum

I had no chance as kingmaker. I just wanted to be king .

Look at my choices, though:

Fritzler - hero
Lowell (rep. cardb0ardb0x) - lurker
Mastermind of Sin - kingmaker
mnowax (rep. Battle Mage/Smashy/Dead Rikimaru) - probably scum and useless besides that
King petroleumjelly - second choice behind Yos2, who died, I didn't trust him much, but I didn't think we were at LYLO either
ThAdmiral (replacing Olio/StallingChamp/ChannelDelibird) - useless
theopor_COD (rep. Cavane/Der Hammer/Vaughn) - probably scum
Toaster Strudel (rep. Nightson / Vikingfan) - useless

I had no one to make king, they kept killing my kings and defaulting to my second choices.

I JUST WANTED TO BE KING!

It sucks that I suspected all the people that *were* scum, but I didn't think we had so many scum left after Scopey died, so I didn't even think of linking them all together. The town was executing scum every third day or so, can't really expect them to do much better than that. *shrug*

Good job, scum, I guess...

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yea, I was flabbergasted that DR was king. I don't know why he didn't die after that kingship

[Mastermind of Sin]

I wanted to make you king, too! :'(

[Mastermind of Sin]

Shanba > BM

[Mastermind of Sin]

By the way, I think KM 1 and KM 2 show that we need to work on the setup a bit. Just sayin'.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Hero can't become King, I thought...

[Mastermind of Sin]

WHat aan exhausting game.
MOS - why the PJ fetish?

PJ was my second choice just because he was the only competent choice I had.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yea, there was no point in voting in this setup. Still don't understand why Thesp thought I was scum, though. :/

[Mastermind of Sin]

^^QFT

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yea. I think we can all agree that mnowax didn't deserve this win.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Yea. We have an uninformed minority vs. an informed minority, basically, since only the king really matters.

[Mastermind of Sin]

^^QFT

[Mastermind of Sin]

I wasn't quite lurking, but I was pretty useless. Like I said earlier in the game, Kingmaker type games aren't for me.

Votes don't make a difference. The multiple voting thing is also ridiculous, how can you really tell that someone is scummy or not, when they vote for 3 people at a time?

I felt it wasn't worth investing effort in this game, that the daily outcome was a crapshoot.

Picking the same king day several times is a bad idea - putting your eggs in the same basket.

Even then - I think this game's outcome was nearly random.

That's what happens when people aren't trying. Other than the people I chose as kings, I was the only person who was actually participating. The only choice I could've done differently was picking Vitty instead of PJ, but I trusted PJ more than Vitty at that point. After PJ's second time as king, I didn't trust him as a first choice, but he kept killing the people that would actually make a good king. If Fritzler had actually been useful instead of deciding to act like a useless 'tard all game, I might've made him king. I wasn't going to make someone king who was advocating just randomly killing bitches, which applies to you as well, TS.

[Mastermind of Sin]

...which applies to you as well, TS.

Actually, I might have felt more involved in the game if, even for a day, I had a say one way or another.

I made

324 posts

in this game, and I never even became king. I was actually

less

active once I became Kingmaker. The fact that you never had a say is no excuse to lurk and take potshots at people without really trying.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I'd figured out MoS was kingmaker, but only by the night I was killed. A lot of good that did me. =P

PJ was my second choice just because he was the only competent choice I had.

Pro-town >>> competent.

Incompetent possible town <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< competent possible town

Yea, there was no point in voting in this setup. Still don't understand why Thesp thought I was scum, though. :/

Most of your actions were deliberately anti-town, and you looked like you were trying tohide who you were actually suspicious of. I've got to stop confusing sub-optimal play on your part as scummy. (Why obfuscate votes and how you felt? Why ignore everyone when they say it's

not

obvious who you want to swing? You corrected this later on, and looked a lot less scummy for it - I just didn't understand it.)

I completely disagree. I never deliberately acted against the town's best interest. In fact, I was more open in my opinions than most people. Even though I didn't vote, I

very clearly

said phrases such as "I would support a -name- execution", "I want -name- to die", and "-name- is very likely scum". In fact, I did a full analysis on nearly everyone in the game, giving my personal opinion on each individual I covered. That is definitely not anti-town and

definitely

not hiding who I was suspicious of. All of this happened well before you replaced into the game. Not voting changed nothing.

I would've made you king if I didn't think you were going to execute me. You were arguing such an uphill case I didn't think any scum would set themselves up like that.

[Mastermind of Sin]

I would've made you king if I didn't think you were going to execute me. You were arguing such an uphill case I didn't think any scum would set themselves up like that.

Dear MOS,

You are the Kingmaker. A protown player will never actually execute you, since you can claim Kingmaker.

I didn't particularly want to force myself to claim. That seemed silly, because then I'm setting myself up to die. *shrug* Call it selfishness if you want, but I didn't really see a reason to *ask* to be killed.

Incompetent possible town <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< competent possible town

Both Toaster Strudel and whomever replaced Lowell were clearly pro-town, regardless of competency. I also thought TS was fairly competent this game, just frustrated.

Actually, I felt that Lowell had a good chance at being scum, since he was acting very much as he did in Mafia 61, when he was my scumbuddy. TS didn't seem competent at all, I find it hard to think anyone competent who doesn't provide reasons for anything.

Yea, there was no point in voting in this setup. Still don't understand why Thesp thought I was scum, though. :/

Most of your actions were deliberately anti-town, and you looked like you were trying tohide who you were actually suspicious of. I've got to stop confusing sub-optimal play on your part as scummy. (Why obfuscate votes and how you felt? Why ignore everyone when they say it's

not

obvious who you want to swing? You corrected this later on, and looked a lot less scummy for it - I just didn't understand it.)

I completely disagree. I never deliberately acted against the town's best interest. In fact, I was more open in my opinions than most people. Even though I didn't vote, I

very clearly

said phrases such as "I would support a -name- execution", "I want -name- to die", and "-name- is very likely scum". In fact, I did a full analysis on nearly everyone in the game, giving my personal opinion on each individual I covered. That is definitely not anti-town and

definitely

not hiding who I was suspicious of. All of this happened well before you replaced into the game. Not voting changed nothing.

It wasn't clear who you actually wanted dead at so many point in the game -

several people said this a number of times.

I guess I don't see

why it was so important to you not to vote.

Several people did say this. They said it while they were attacking me over and over again. I completely debunked their arguments, and no one attacked me again until you replaced into the game. Not voting was just something I did on a whim, but it's not like it changed anything. Votes don't mean anything in this setup. With an unlimited amount of votes, there is no way to differentiate who you prefer more to be lynched. If we had a concordet voting system, votes *might* mean something, even though we couldn't lynch anyone. As it is, you have to explain all your votes anyways so that people know what your preferences are among the people you voted. I was doing this anyway, without the voting part, since it was unnecessary. I was already explaining my preferences without placing a vote in the first place.

[Mastermind of Sin]

It wasn't. I just said in the beginning that I wasn't going to vote, so I didn't. It wasn't important other than that I wanted to. But it still wasn't necessary for me to vote to get my points across. Not voting was just more my way of protesting the Kingmaker setup anyway.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Because it wasn't until the game had already started that I realized entirely what the game entailed. I didn't think it would be that bad not being able to lynch, and I hadn't read the first game.

As I said, since votes didn't matter, I made a personal promise to myself to never vote the entire game. It shouldn't have been that big of a deal past D1 or D2, since I explained myself fully.

[Mastermind of Sin]

No, I think you don't deserve this win because you were completely worthless the entire game, in BOTH of your roles. Worthless people don't deserve a win, even if they get it. Not playing the game is NOT a valid tactic, and that's what you did. You

purposefully

avoided playing the game, and you even admit to it. I rest my case.

[Mastermind of Sin]

screw you MoS

I demand better picture resolution on that avatar! not knowing the comedic caption beneath that cat is TREASON AGAINST THE STATE AND IS PUNISHABLE BY DEATH.

*points to sig*

[Mastermind of Sin]

RafK, what do you think about Cavane?

:tear:

I tried.

[Mastermind of Sin]

Aha.

This

is how MoS gets such a giant post count. He posts

after

the game is over!

Nah. I just play in like 15 bazillion games at once.