California Trilogy - Dantès in Fresno (Game Over!)

[logicticus]

/confirm

[logicticus]

Wow, I cant believe how fast this game blew up.

Initial impressions after the first read through.

Oman had nice contradictory post in the beginning which has been noted. He didnt even contradict an earlier post, but rather an earlier statement in the same post. Nice.

Foolinc did a nice information post that didnt really contain any information. Scum seem to do this to look like they are contributing when in reality they are just typing words.

I have never played with skruffs before, but I am not a fan of throwing the word misrepresentation around. Especially because in my opinion, LML didnt misrepresent once. I find that people that continally harp on people misrepresenting them are just trying to stir things up against that particular person for whatever reason.

VitaminR is giving me some good town vibes at this point.

Thats all, no voting yet.

[logicticus]

Oh also one more thing.

The reason that LML jumped on skruffs to begin with (the no lynch followed by MGM), I think was perfectly explained by sckruffs in a later post when he explained he was mimicing what the mod did.

So I dont find the voting of skruffs to be scummy at all after that explanation.

[logicticus]

Throws up some suspicion on non-Concordet voters, which I don't agree with.

Why don't you agree? I don't understand why any pro-town role would not use a list. The only reason for not using a list is because you are scum and haven't had time to work out with your scum buddies what is the right way to use it to your advantage.

Even if you don't provide a list, you're just saying: I'd be equally happy to lynch anyone.

vote: MGM

, PlaysWithSquirrels, LoudMouthLee, Dragon Phoenix, Skruffs

-JEEP

Nope. I do not see the point in putting down Concordet votes this early. I will do so later "today" when it becomes meaningful. That does not mean that I can't do it because I did not discuss with my assumed scum buddies, and it does not mean that I am willing to lynch anyone. If something is not white it does not mean it is black.

Your scummyness has gone up a notch with this post.

Agree with DP on this one.

Jeep, does that mean in a regular game that all pro town roles should always be voting?

[logicticus]

Oh also one more thing.

The reason that LML jumped on skruffs to begin with (the no lynch followed by MGM), I think was perfectly explained by sckruffs in a later post when he explained he was mimicing what the mod did.

So I dont find the voting of skruffs to be scummy at all after that explanation.

This needs to be explained further. If it was satisfactorily explained, how does it make the people voting me for it reasonable? If you read it, you would see that I did not simply 'mimic the mod'... but let's pretend I did. This was my first post in the game. You think that this equivalent to a random-vote deserves the wagon I've gotten from it?



I will respond to all posts later on tonight, but I appreciate not being quick lynched.

Well, your wagon is really a combination of several things. In the beginning some votes were simply random and then a random bandwagon, happens all the time. There were a couple of people egging that wagon on.

LML's vote was really the only one that was directly because of your first post. The rest of the votes come from your reaction to his vote with accusing him of misrepresenting you.

VitaminR brought up a great point where true misrepresentation comes with intent. And while I dont think it can be proved either way, I dont believe there was any intent of misrepresentation.

[logicticus]

MoS is being metascummy, LmL was (in my opinion) defending him. I'm choosing to make a big deal out of it.

I was attacking him for being metascummy. I questioned the validity of his dicerolls.

God, Adele. Please read those posts again.

Then we do disagree. Not that MoS is weird - we seem to agree there - but on whether dice tags are good or bad. I maintain that they are bad (that is, they might have a place in-game, but not in the random-voting stage). You appear to prefer them to people saying they used random.org - and I personally would rather people switched to saying "arb vote" than maintain any pretence of or (worse) actual randomness in their initial vote.

I dont get this at all, Adele. Whether or not the dice rolls are good are bad are not even germane to this debate. You accused him of defending MoS, he refutes it and then you respond with this meaningless statement.

Jeep, we seem to disagree on a fundamental game principle. Apart from arbitrary votes, I believe every vote should be justified with a reason. With list-votes being applied in a deadline situation, they will lead without a doubt to the death of the person in question - you can't call a vote that decides someone's life arbitrary, so anything beyond the first vote -if it's arbitrary- HAS to have a reason.

Together with the backpeddeling:
Vote: Jeep

This looks terrible IMO. This looks like MGM trying to justify a vote on a bandwagon thats just getting started. I just dont think this disagreement garners a vote. And then throwing in the backpeddeling just for kicks. Nice.

I agree with Mgm that if one is going to use the list they must be prepared to answer (if not preemptivly post) on every person in there. For example, why Person Y is after no lynch.

I beleive with Jeep completely that scum are the primary group with reason not to use the list, its like lurking but with votes. They vote enough to get by and don't have to let us know what they think about each player.

Mgm and DP found some good stuff together on jeep, but I'm not going to jump on the wagon just yet. It frankly doesn't look like there is enough there.

lots of agreement there. Dont go out on that limb any further...

vote mgm

his post I liked least

Votes/Unvotes not appearing at the bottom of the post are not counted. Tags removed. - Mod

[logicticus]

Jeep, we seem to disagree on a fundamental game principle. Apart from arbitrary votes, I believe every vote should be justified with a reason. With list-votes being applied in a deadline situation, they will lead without a doubt to the death of the person in question - you can't call a vote that decides someone's life arbitrary, so anything beyond the first vote -if it's arbitrary- HAS to have a reason.

Together with the backpeddeling:
Vote: Jeep

This looks terrible IMO. This looks like MGM trying to justify a vote on a bandwagon thats just getting started. I just dont think this disagreement garners a vote. And then throwing in the backpeddeling just for kicks. Nice.

How is justifying a vote a bad thing? How is voting jeep a bad thing? He said: “As for listing a reason for every person on it, I don't do that when I vote a single person, why would I do it for a list?” which means there’s no way to discern a difference between his actions and his intentions (see paragraph two of this post). The backpeddeling wasn’t just for kicks. It was scummy as hell and contrary to jeep’s accusations, they can actually be backed up with quotes – quotes that aren’t cut into pieces and leave out crucial parts of the sentence.

Its not justifying a vote in my opinion. This was justifying jumping on that bandwagon at an early time.

I felt you just threw in the backpeddeling because the person above you mentioned it first and you wanted to agree further on reasons for voting jeep.

If you feel I have cherrypicked quotes, I apologize. I always make an effort to not just use quotes out of context for that reason.

Votes/Unvotes not appearing at the bottom of the post are not counted. Tags removed. - Mod

I believe that was directed at me.

vote mgm

[logicticus]

Scruffs decides that, since Thesp is a good player, we should "Yay Thesp!" because he "has a lot to bring?"

What would happen if Thesp was scum, Scruffs?

Is there any immediate reason to assume Thesp is scum, because if there isn't I don't see the problem here.

I just dont understand if skruffs had no read on Thesp why he didnt say so. Why throw out the "Yay Thesp!." Its perplexing, but I dont think its scummy.

MGM, why is there only a problem with the statement if Thesp is scum? Regardless of his alignment, its a useless statement. And what would the problem be if Thesp comes up scum? Would you assume that Thesp is scum if skruffs come up or not?

[logicticus]

Okay...my big look at everyone in order of player list:
[snip]
Adele
[snip]
Cogito Ergo Sum
[snip]
Cubsfan4ever
[snip]
I'll do the rest later.

Seriously? 3 of 19? Thats terrible. Why play this up as your big post and then just putter out after three?

Are you trying to look like you are doing analysis or what? You were already on my short list, but you are moving on up nicely.

[logicticus]

Okay...my big look at everyone in order of player list:
[snip]
Adele
[snip]
Cogito Ergo Sum
[snip]
Cubsfan4ever
[snip]
I'll do the rest later.

Seriously? 3 of 19? Thats terrible. Why play this up as your big post and then just putter out after three?

Are you trying to look like you are doing analysis or what? You were already on my short list, but you are moving on up nicely.

What part of "I'll do the rest later" don't you understand? All this post proves, is that Oman actually has a private life that occasionally needs his attention. You're moving up nicely on my list too.

See tallys post for reasons why that was scummy. Also, maybe the reason he hadnt posted in 72 hours isnt a busy personal life, but scum trying to stay out of the radar.

This is hardly "grasping at straws"

[logicticus]

Just looked at Omans posts.

he had 43 posts between posts in this game. Hardly somebody who is too busy to post here. Looks more and more like lurking scum who couldnt think of things to say about 16 other players.

[logicticus]

I know its really poor form for a third post in a row, but I had to vote omans replacement.

unvote, vote IH

, mgm

[logicticus]

Yeah IH isnt doing anything to alleviate my vote which was based on his predecessor.

Cubs has been somewhat lurking in plain site. Early on he disparaged the semi wagon on skruffs, but since then not much that I can tell.

Skruffs, are you really advocating a name claim this early or am I misreading that?

[logicticus]

Adele,

So you are voting for DP because he seems to have slipped up indicting that there are two families. So my question is, do you believe that DP has some sort of role that gives him information that there are 2 families?

Typically in a 2 family game, the families are ignorant of each other. Its not until they see a death of the other family that they realize they are not alone.

[logicticus]

Thats true, but even if you see your faction is underpowered, why jump to the conclusion that there is a second family and not an sk or even a cult?

[logicticus]

wrote:
Pssshhhht
^^^^The sound of a hole being poked in a case.

Not at all. If you were part of a 3-player mafia, wouldn't you expect there to be another mafia? I definitely would. (I still don't agree with the case though.)

Why would you immediately suspect another mafia group and not another device to even out the odds?

Adele, can you please answer my previous question.

[logicticus]

updating my voting:

vote IH/oman,

mgm, cubs, [adele, foolinc], [everyone not mentioned], no lynch, battle mage, logicticus

[logicticus]

Ill tell you what. Since BMs claim, I have not been happy with his posts.

[logicticus]

well, not enough time, but i am moving xyzzy up and cubs down.

unvote
vote IH/oman,

mgm, xyzzy, [adele, foolinc], [everyone not mentioned], no lynch, logicticus

[logicticus]

BM, the dual did happen look above.

[logicticus]

That is particularly damning for MGM. He is the only voter on Cubsfan who had a chance AFTER Mith posted duel results to change their vote FROM cubsfan to someone else.

I wasn't the only one. Foolinc changed his vote after the duel results and between my question about the duel and the end of the day was about 30 minutes. Obviously not enough time to get an alternative lynch going - at least not one that wasn't LML.

Thats not true at all. If you would have moved up xyzzy ahead of cubs the lynch would have been different.

Foolinc and myself did just that after the duel because we didnt think cubs was scum and xyzzy was close to being ahead of him the voting.

Although in light of this daykill it turns out xyzzy was town too.

But all in all, I agree it makes you look bad mgm not changing the vote when you had the chance.

[logicticus]

Great post by Zindy in 689. I just want to ask a few more questions of MGM regarding his actions after the dual.

The reason I didn't unvote was easy: bad timing. With all the things I was doing during that period, the time between cubs answering my question and the actual lynch was too short to confidently unvote.

LML's claim I was the only voter with a chance to unvote after the duel is faulty regardless, each one of those voters had the chance to do it. I just happened to be the one posting. Who said the others weren't watching the thread?

I have a lot of problems with this post.

First of all, why was the question (Why did you choose LML?) so important that you needed to know the answer to be confident enough to move cubs down in your voting? What answers could he have given to keep him up there? Nearly everyone agrees that after the results of the dual, that both LML and cubs were most likely townie.

And then you try to throw some suspicion on other people who were watching the thread but allowed time to expire rather than move xyzzy over cubs. Thats all unprovable either way, so I dont think it should even be used as evidence for or against.

Sweet. Daykill! *hi-fives dayvig*

Vote: Skruffs

I hate so much about this post.

I can see a real dayvig taking out xyzzy though, as a result of a desire to avoid the deadline rush that plagued Day 1. If you kill him early, then the town has all the time in the world to find a new lynch candidate.

You sound about 100% certain that you knew xyzzy was townie. This is an extremely scummy post.

Dont know why IH is attacking LML. I feel LML is the most likely to be town at this point and there is no reason to be going after him with such vigor.


Finally, regarding the skruffs claim situation. I dont know why skruffs felt like he needed to put out there that he was roleblocked, because if he wasnt, he certainly wouldnt have told us anything about his nightaction.

As for his idea that it allows the town to know there is a potential mafia roleblocker out there (How do you know a townie roleblocker didnt target you? You came under plenty of fire yesterday), I just dont know how it helps the town to know there is a mafia roleblocker lurking around.

Your escalated the argument and making assumptions doesnt help, but its consistent with your D1 actions at least.

Vote MGM

, CES, [IH, skruffs], [the rest], LML, logicticus

[logicticus]

For those who dont want to play the game, the first letters (minus the s and confirm) spell:

Eugenie Townie.

Eugénie Danglars — The daughter of Danglars engaged to Albert de Morcerf but who would rather stay unwed. She is presented as a lesbian, and the connotations at this and her running away with another girl were considered scandalous.

[logicticus]

I feel something's off with Logi's posts and I have minor suspicion towards him.

I don't like it when people say something like they have a tough time getting reads on people.

I feel that not only is it an excuse to be noncommital, but it also alerts the scum as to who is confused about the game so that they know who they don't need to kill. Basically I don't like preemptive excusing their noncomittalness with something not very useful to the town.

Just to be clear those are seperate thoughts right? I have not expressed having a tough time getting reads on people.

[logicticus]

I can see a real dayvig taking out xyzzy though, as a result of a desire to avoid the deadline rush that plagued Day 1. If you kill him early, then the town has all the time in the world to find a new lynch candidate.

You sound about 100% certain that you knew xyzzy was townie. This is an extremely scummy post.

I'm unsure how you gathered that? You first of all seem to be assuming that CES made the kill. Even if it would have killed scum, it's not like the day would have seemed to have ended either way.
PHAIL.

I dont see where I am making the assumption that CES made the kill. Let me break it down for ya.

He is saying that a real dayvig (which i find to be odd terminology, how does he know it wasnt a real dayvig? why does it need to be qualified?) would want to take out xyzzy out early to avoid the deadline rush.

Aside from the terminology, i find this logic lacking. If anything, taking out xyzzy is more likely to lead to a deadline rush. He was second in the voting after cubs and it wouldnt have taken much to get him lynched before the deadline. In the couple posts before his death, people were already lining up to lynch him. Now that he is dead, we are starting without a lead candidate which will prolong the day.

I don't like how Logictus deciphered the posts in around 8 minutes.

Not sure what this means.

[logicticus]

oh that.

because its terribly time consuming to sort by his posts, write down the first letter of the posts until it makes sense and then wikipedia it.

that must take at least 15 minutes.

[logicticus]

He is saying that a real dayvig (which i find to be odd terminology, how does he know it wasnt a real dayvig? why does it need to be qualified?) would want to take out xyzzy out early to avoid the deadline rush.

Aside from the terminology, i find this logic lacking. If anything, taking out xyzzy is more likely to lead to a deadline rush. He was second in the voting after cubs and it wouldnt have taken much to get him lynched before the deadline. In the couple posts before his death, people were already lining up to lynch him. Now that he is dead, we are starting without a lead candidate which will prolong the day.

1.You completely ignore the discussion at the time, that it could have been an SK, daykilling SK, or Poisoner/delayed kill.

2.This doesn't lead to him knowing Xyzzy would come up townie

1) I did not ignore the discussion around the possibilities, its irrelevent. IF he is hypothesizing, why does he need to use the word "real?" He could have just as easily said "I can see a dayvig taking out xyzzy though..."

The sentence still makes sense, the sentence still hypothesizes what a dayvig would have done. By using the term "real dayvig" it implies knowledge of how the kill was actually performed (in reality). In my opinion, the implication would look something like this:

"Xyzzy wasnt killed by a dayvig, but I can see a real dayvig taking out xyzzy..."

So, what this has to do about the discussion about modes of kills, I dont know.

2) True this doesnt address how he would know xyzzy would know he is town, but there is just something in his tone that leads me to believe that. At the very least, the tone seems to indicate indifference because MGM knows xyzzy isnt part of his group.

As for the breadcrumbing his role. I dont see why a townie would feel a need to breadcrumb it that clearly.

@VitR - Really, putting 4 out of 9 needed votes on MGM really makes you feel this uneasy?

[logicticus]

At this point? No.

But I think its just as likely that scum would breadcrumb vanilla townie (the most common of scum claims) early on so they have a fall back when they get under pressure.

[logicticus]

yeah that was all sarcasm because someone challenged that it could be done in 8 minutes

[logicticus]

thank you thesp

either IH is unaware of the filter posts by user function or the wikipedia function

[logicticus]

Now, perhaps I'm a little slower than that, but to read MGM's post (almost exclusively), ignore all other posts, look at his posts in the filter, and find the correct name on wikipedia, with their posts 8 minutes apart is just not innocent to me.

qft, actually. That does seem hella unlikely.

did you happen to see the post where thesp did it in 4 minutes or did you skim right past it?

[logicticus]

I didn't know Dantes was in the game when I started, but I am pretty sure he's in there now. As for trust, no matter how much I'd like to see it happen, I don't think the town as a whole is trusting me: officially or not.

I may be contesting this and I may not.

Nobody answer for him.

Why do you think Dantes is in the game or not?

I feel unsure about Logictus and MGM's claim, but I think I still support it.

NOTICE-Adele is right, they are circumstantial
Some factors that are based off of it for me.
1.Connection speed
2.Logictus knowing which letters to omit(which ties in two three)
3.Assuming he searched for what I would have (eugene) Which comes up with this list http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugene
4.Me having switched to google instead of Wikipedia.

i cant believe i have to defend this...

I have a great connection speed, see the end of game show marathon in the Mishmash forum for evidence of that.

2) MGM TOLD WHICH LETTER TO OMIT!!!

3) once i had eugenie townie spelled out and the next 3 letters didnt look like the would form a word i stopped.

4) I went to wikipedia, looked up Count of Monte Cristo and searched for "eugenie"

5) Now some may notice that in wikipedia Eugenie has an accento on the first e so a match case wouldnt work, but I am using firefox which searches after each character you enter, so after entering "eug" it found it.

6) I copied it and put it here.

This is the last time I will respond to questions around this. I cant believe people would actually think that I worked with MGM ahead of time to make sure I was the one that cleared him. Seriously, think about the ridiculousness of that idea.

[logicticus]

It disturbs me over the last couple of pages how much Skruffs is interrogating people who are voting him while he has such few votes.

I understand when you are close to being lynched (esp day 1 bandwagon), but when you arent even a leading suspect in most peoples eyes it just looks scummy to make people validate their votes on you constantly.

[logicticus]

Mgm's play has been HIGHLY scummy this past day. I'm really confused why he'd give up his breadcrumb to his role, but not his password. It's like getting your meal supersized and getting a diet pop because you're watching your weight. The two moves don't match up. I'm also not a fan of the whole Doctor discussion. If we have a doctor, we want to protect him/her as much as possible and this type of discussion won't help do that.

I dont see why the password is even relevent. Why breadcrumb that at all? It doesnt help his claim in any way in my opinion by having his password.

[logicticus]

Foolinc, the point is that you slipped up on the specifics of your secret word/password, so you must therefore not have one, in case you didn't understand what DP was implying.

Closer to a slip than a scumtell.

Your reaction to it was notable though

FoS

Actually, I do have one, but since a word could be easily faked, I don't know how I can make you believe it.

Then why do you find it so suspicious that MGM didnt reveal his word?

[logicticus]

Yeah that PBPA seems to miss complete details of this game and it was pretty funny to see xyzzy at the top of MBLs list. Although why no lynch is preferred after reading through D1 is beyond me.

holy crap that was fast. 31-39 easy skim. foolinc is the elephant in the room and way too many people are ignoring it, even as some vote it

Unless there is a huge revelation, foolinc is about to be lynched, so I dont think that too many people are ignoring it.

I do agree with your assessment that there has been lots of wasteful talking from dice rolls to football, but that always happens.

Pooky isnt looking too good in my eyes lately. Lots of posts lacking content.

[logicticus]

LML and/or Talitha,

You guys seem to be the ones most in favor of an IH lynch. Whats the case?

I know day 1 IH was really high on the list (mostly due to his predecessor though), what do you have against him?

[logicticus]

sorry guys i havent had the time lately to give this game a reread that it deserves

and right now i am forced to play my post enough words not to get replaced card

i promise this is the only time i use it though

[logicticus]

All right, time for me to chime in on all the happenings this day.

First as to IH's claim. I dont think it looks good that we have had 5 people die who have been classified as innocents and all of them have a name. Granted, we dont know if they were just townies or had powers, but one of them (mgm) claimed generic townie before his death and he had a name. So, I am not sure how much I buy the claim and that compounded with earlier actions (mostly from oman) make me feel good about putting IH high on the list.

Now the second line of convo has been around Mr. Grey

I still think it's the Mod as the SK. Could it be for people who fall into 2 categories:

a) People who have a secret word...
and...
b) People who fail to utter their secret word?

Interesting, can I can some people to chime in on whether or not they have used their secret word? I can say that I have not to this point.

I think Tally sums up my thoughts on the Grey issue nicely with this quote:

How can Mr Grey's inclusion in a condorcet list be a mistake on the mod's part? The players make the lists, right? I'm not even sure when Mr Grey first popped up, but I assume a PLAYER included him, and Mr Grey, conscientious mod that he is, simply followed the player's wishes.

What I find disturbing about you, Tally, is not that you think he may have done so 'out of courtesy' of the players, but the fact that you're not even interested in seeing if he could be an SK. If you're a protown player, your job is to eliminate all threats to the town. A possible threat has emerged, and you're gunning down that possibility as a mere "distraction." That kind of attitude stirkes me as patently scummy.

I disagree with this. I think the point that we disagree on is that you feel Mr. Grey is a threat while many of the rest of us just dont see a case for it. At this time, I think its a waste to go lynching Mr Grey. Maybe if any evidence comes up that he could be anti town, I will go back to this. But at this point the only evidence being used is the fact he came up on a condorcet list. Thats not evidence in my opinion.

Finally, on to the most interesting discussion of all. LML and the word lace. I'll start with my opinion....the more I read and review the more I dont like it.

I think it was very clever of Lee to bury it the way he did. I didnt think of it a second time because it does make sense and cubs does need to be ripped into. But then capitalizing along with xyzzy later makes that stand out and could be a scum action for sure.

Lee claims he was capitalizing for emphasis, and as IH stated later, I can understand capitalizing lace, but why xyzzy? The emphasis isnt needed there.

Do you think a one shot role like that, even if it was mine (which it is not) would be a scum or an SK with only one shot? And if I were scum, do you really think I would have "used my kill on xyzzy"? He was surely yesterday's lynch if he were alive.

Wake up Pooky. You're better than this,

Dont like this quote appealing to Pookys gamesmanship. Pretty scummy imo.

Heres my theory. I think LML is scum of some sort and with his killing ability making it easier for us to pick him out he has some sort of immunity. This is what allowed the duel to turn out the way it did. This would balance the fact that his killing method is more difficult. Maybe he can only be lynched and not killed in any other way, who knows.

LML, why are you pushing for Tally so hard? Do y ou have a post laying out the case against her?

[logicticus]

Question: why would LMLscum have daykilled someone who was likely to be lynched anyway? Considering how easy it was to spot the XYZZY and LACE, don't you think he'd have saved the ability for a more useful time/person?

I think it's possible but not likely that he's an anti-town killing faction. I'll let you work out the alternatives in your noggins.

Can anyone who thinks MoS/Banani isn't scum please explain why? Can MoS/Banani's replacement please step up to the plate and tell us their opinion of Thesp's, Talitha's, IH's, DP's behavior?

Yeah I meant to bring that up and its also why I quoted that part.

Thats the best argument in my opinion about why LML did not kill xyzzy. He was going to be killed that day most likely.

[logicticus]

Tamuz, I see what you are doing with the beginning of your list, but why do you list all the active players in alphabbetical order?

Surely you must have some preference...

[logicticus]

Foolinc has looked a lot better today. Although its always suspicious when a claimed doc doesnt get nightkilled, but its not off the wall. I didnt like his actions early on and his post listing possible roles in the very beginning reeks of scum trying to act helpful.

I actually agree with Tallys suspects at this point. As for her play, I havent gotten a scum vibe from her this game. I dont understand her desperation recently when she said if she goes, IH and LML need to go next. Shes barely next on the chopping block with a lot of people who still havent voted.

CES looks better today, but he was high on my suspect list yesterday for what I thought was a scum slip up and there he remains.


I really had glorkspar going after Grey so hard. There is no evidence grey is a killer and if we lynch him it will likely have the same effect as a no lynch.

Vote LML

, [CES, IH], [the rest], Pooky, logicticus

[logicticus]

Whats the case against tally?

Yeah, but there are questions regarding the duel that question the validity of the outcome.

What does the duel do?
Why did Cubs think he was the count?


In the end I just think the lace xyzzy is far too incriminating

[logicticus]

Still no case against tally?

Also I noticed nobody answered my question about whether or not they used their word. Answer it or not, but can I get any thoughts about whether or not using it has an impact in the game?

[logicticus]

Interesting end of the day.

I dotn believe that lml had an investigate ability at all. SK + 1 immunity + "Disguises" = too overpowered.

Plus upon reading up on his character, there is nothing to indictate anything about disguises, so I dont buy that part.

As for who he claims to have killed, I dont see why he would lie about that....but if he didnt kill xyzzy that has to be one of the wildest coincidences ever.

I think the top 2 on my list right now are ces and ih.

[logicticus]

Why did he self hammer?

I think he was just frustrated and wanted to end the day. He knew there was no way he was gonna talk his way out of it and just wanted to be done with it. I think you guys are overanalyzing the situation.

Now the question about why he said some of those things he did at the end are an entirely different matter.


I am with Pooky on not liking CES' "You guys got lucky" comment. It seperates us from him, us being the majority of the players. Even if I was 100% certain that LML was town and was completely against lynching him and defended him the whole way to no avail and he came up town, I would say "We got lucky." not "You guys got lucky." So I dont buy that defense.

vote CES

[logicticus]

Yeah, I dont get what IH is saying.

But what foolinc said does make sense. But whether or not the LACE thing was correct doesnt matter, it was applying the pressure from it that really made LML crack.

[logicticus]

Blah, another replacement.

Well, good luck seteal, but I think you are the best lynch today through no fault of your own, just the fault of your predecessor.

[logicticus]

I was hoping we put this Mr. Grey thing behind us. The only piece of evidence is that Grey can be put in our lists...thats it! There is nothing else pointing to him being a killer at all.

So unless something comes up that points to him, I think lynching him will just result in a no lynch and a waste of time.

[logicticus]

Moved up Pooky and logicticus because of LACE 2.0 situation.

Theres a situation?

[logicticus]

See, this is the point by which I should have gone back and examined Logicticus more closely. Unfortunately, I haven't, and so I'm telling you this so that I have another post with over 25 words. Yay me.

You and everyone whos voting me.

Other than gut feelings, Im not sure what im guilty of. Unless I just breezed past someones post with a case against me, did I?

[logicticus]

Right now my vote is based pretty much entirely on your vote on Setael/CES, or, more specifically, the nonsense case behind it. I've been meaning to go back and look at your play on previous days, but I'm kind of lazy.

CES has been in my top list since the beginning, if you think his one comment is the one reason that I am voting him, you are wrong.

[logicticus]

so you admit you are just being lazy then?

but its not just you, there is so little conversation going on right now it disgusts me.

we have to lynch in less than 5 days and i dont know where half the town stands and those that i do, i dont know enough about it seems.

what can we do to get more posting from everyone?

[logicticus]

so you admit you are just being lazy then?

but its not just you, there is so little conversation going on right now it disgusts me.

we have to lynch in less than 5 days and i dont know where half the town stands and those that i do, i dont know enough about it seems.

what can we do to get more posting from everyone?

So.... do you think he's scum, or are you just trying to discredit him?

Also how is this not consistent with normal Sarc play?

Ok the weekend is coming up, and I just finished a big history paper that was due today, so I should start my review of the last day or so relatively soon.

im thinking more and more that he is scum. i need to go reread some of his parts for sure, but i have no problem listing him second

vote seteal/ces

, sarc

[logicticus]

Blah, another replacement.

Well, good luck seteal, but I think you are the best lynch today through no fault of your own, just the fault of your predecessor.

I really didn't like this post. It's a gut thing/I don't like how he voted CES, and then auto decides that Seteal is the best lynch for the day. I feel like he said this, just because Pooky had mentioned it, and there really wasn't to much opposition to it, so he automatically voted Seteal, and said that she was the best lynch.

Closer to a hunch I guess.

so because someone is a replacement they should automatically get a reprieve? You couldnt possibly believe that.

[logicticus]

so because someone is a replacement they should automatically get a reprieve? You couldnt possibly believe that.

The problem with this response is it automatically disregards everything I say, by misinterpreting it.

I really didn't like this post. It's a gut thing/I don't like how he voted CES, and then auto decides that Seteal is the best lynch for the day. I feel like he said this, just because Pooky had mentioned it, and there really wasn't to much opposition to it, so he automatically voted Seteal, and said that she was the best lynch.

Closer to a hunch I guess.

Now if you'll read closer, Logictus, the meat of my argument is the argument against CES, which you applied to Setael, instead of someone else (as Pooky even seems to have dropped it), because you proclaimed they were obviously the best lynch.

In fact, I don't think her replacing in has anything to do with my argument at all.

What? I dont get how we are reading the same thing...and you wrote it.

I voted CES and said he was who I thought was the best lynch for the day. CES leaves and Setael replaces. So of course I shifted my focus there. Like it or not, Setael has to deal with what CES did. So of course I "auto decided" Setael was the best play for the day just as I thought CES was.

I really dont get what you are trying to say by "the meat of my argument is the argument against CES, which you applied to Setael, instead of someone else"

I dont know who else I should be applying it to.

[logicticus]

i dont think its that scummy for zindy to no lynch because then we go to the list.

but it is scummy to not take a stand like gaspar said, so i will do as much

unvote
vote ces/setael

, sarc, mbl, tally, [the rest], no lynch, logicticus

[logicticus]

No, Logic -- if there is no winner from the condorcet method, then my understanding is that we no-lynch:

If a single option beats every other option in these pairings, that option is the Condorcet winner, and is lynched. If there is no Condorcet winner (or if "no lynch" is the Condorcet winner), no one is lynched.

Zindaras' failure to choose a player to vote had, until my shift back to MBL, resulted in

no Condorcet winner

, meaning that we *WOULD* have no-lynched.

Oh I didnt realize that...now this makes zindys action look terrible.

[logicticus]

Hi, Zindy.

Please help me make Logicticus dead for being dirty, dirty scum.

Your friend,
Sarc.

Also, I'm writing something here for reasons that clearly have nothing to do with passing 25 words.

so have you reviewed me yet or are you just being lazy still a week later?

ill guess with needing the 25 word post you are still being lazy.

[logicticus]

alright heres my complete list

vote Seteal/Cogito Ergo Sum

, Sarcastro, MrBuddyLee, Talitha, [IH, Zindaras], [Gaspar, Tamuz, DP], [Foolinc, Pooky], no lynch, logicticus

[logicticus]

well, terrible choice.

i didnt want to claim, but i am a mason and should i survive the day my mason buddy can vouch for me tomorrow

i hope somebody out there is reading this and can change their vote


btw- if i do die please review and notice there was no case against me. this is one lazy town

[logicticus]

well, thanks to this last second shit, i dont have a chance of survival.

i would say go town, but with the laziness and terrible play that has been demonstrated thus far, it wont take much for the scum to take the victory

[logicticus]

Yeah lovers are tough.

I still maintain that a lazy town is the main reason I had to out myself, but the scum did a great job this game.