SMITE Role Madness Mafia (OVER AT LAST!)

[mastin2]

Also yeah I'm posting nothing but fluff.

Didn't say you were, at least not intentionally. I meant the area of the game where you were predominantly fluffposting, though.

That

made me feel like doing this.

[mastin2]

It doesn't automatically win at LyLo. My plan was to create a scenario where I was online along with someone I felt strongly was scum, somehow derp into self-voting, get them to hammer, ask them 2 or 3 of their scum members, which would create multiple consecutive scum lynches.

This seems like the least thought-out plan I've ever seen.

Actually, while TSO might find the comparison a bit offensive, I actually find his stated plan to not only be plausible, but also highly mastinesque.

Imagine it was me with his claimed role.
Imagine me making the same type of post.
Does it still fit?

...My point exactly.
Pretty sure right now that TSO's town.

[mastin2]

claiming unlynchable/unkillable will only make people want to lynch you or kill you.
i speak from experience

So do I.
I also speak from experience when I say said claims are exponentially (save for AP) more likely to be from TOWN.

[mastin2]

But even apart from the point I mentioned about him not knowing whether he still has it (or would still have it at LyLo), I also doubt any town player is really silly enough to think that (a) that would definitely work, and (b) that scum wouldn't have ways to demolish town in lylo even if it did work (see, for example, if Pumbaa was still alive and the scum team could perform two kills a night).

Mastin.
I'm Mastin.
I'm the MASTER of making plans that sound good but only work when I'm actually scum.

I know how town can be silly better than

anyone

else.

Sorry to you and TamCho, but I'm fighting a TSO (re)lynch now because he is town.

[mastin2]

Claim makes no sense whatsoever.

Which is precisely why it's true!

Trust me.

If TSO is scum, he either lucked out to an

exponentially

huge degree, or is an absolute master, ab.so.lute.

master

. of faking town-didn't-think-this-through.

Or, far, far, FAR more likely?

He is ACTUALLY town.

[mastin2]

I also find it to be highly mastinesque!
Like, seriously.

I know!

Also, like seriously, you saying this *after* he's been lynched[1] is not really useful in any way.

Well maybe if you guys hadn't lynched him, I could have said it BEFORE he was lynched, just like I could have said Ank was town BEFORE he was lynched, though in this case, it's not entirely useless. I might be wrong, but I kinda expect that by the time I'm caught up, I'll see the mod has come in, and TSO has been lynched, but the day's not over because his role is real and in effect...yet people are trying to RE-lynch him anyway.

Like, your push on Espeonage is fantastically more useful. What you think of Heartless, ooba, Skybird, and theaceofspades would also be fantastically more useful.

Sky's probably town, the others not so much.

[mastin2]

If you have something actually fucking useful, THEN YOU SHOULD JUST SHUT THE FUCK UP ABOUT IT AND NOT RESPOND.

You're not very well acquainted with how my brain works. People talk to me, I'm gonna respond even when I REALLY shouldn't. You'd be amazed how often it actually works out in my favor, though. Very frequently, scum are absolutely clueless in spite of how blatant I can be, and sometimes town I'm trying to communicate to are lucky enough to pick up on it, so we can synchronize. (Best example, Xeno, where BROseidon was fighting me until he caught on that I was a mason--the scum never had a clue I was; I was nightkilled because I was a strong player who was accurately scumreading them, not because they saw through it.)

[mastin2]

Good luck trying to lynch me.

Vote: TSO

Don't see anything in the mod post saying this can't happen - could be a simple vote reset power [Chronos and all] - worth trying out.

Fuckit.
I'll sheep Magua.

VOTE: ooba.

[mastin2]

Much of ooba's posting is how I feel I would post as scum.

Dammit, Magua, you're stealing my thunder.

Like...the TSO vote was just so...

bad

.

[mastin2]

By the way, mastin, when you get around to it, could you talk a little about your Espeonage read and where it's coming from?
Is it just the fact that he's not (or wasn't and kind of still isn't) playing the game?

Sort

-of? I just...took a look at him and thought, "he's just not really town".
And I voted.

You really set your expectations too high of me if you expected more.

What is the difference between town-didn't-think-this-through and scum-didn't-think-this-through?

Scum-didn't-think-this-through is virtually nonexistent?

I mean, pretty much the closest thing I can so much as THINK of as being scum not thinking things through is beastcharizard claiming the same fakeclaim his flipped scumbuddy did in Sabotage. (Haha, yeah, go ahead and laugh, I didn't lynch him for it. In my defense, I lynched Ceph, though, and he was more threatening scum.)

[mastin2]

Why was the TSO vote bad?

Because he wasn't voting TSO to test things; ooba was voting TSO to LYNCH him.

Also, I take it back.
There are two cases I know of scum not thinking things through.
One was Amrun in mykonian's series of games about mikeburnfire's flash tutorial. (Forget the name.) In the third one, she claimed a role that couldn't exist.
The other was a mafia traitor in Walking Dead...claiming cop results impossible, a fact discovered after the claim had caused the lynch of a scumbuddy in bussing-gone-wrong, giving the town two scum.

Countless times, the nature of scum contradictions in their role are not like that. Countless times, if you see town who have made play like TSO's it is town, and not once have I seen it come from scum, because the above two are vastly different than what TSO did.

[mastin2]

Here.
Have read up to date.
Have...literally nothing to add.

That's a very bad thing, yaknow.

[mastin2]

i lied. stopped caring since team mafia started

That late, huh?

Your dedication is admirable.

[mastin2]

I'm conftown.

You claim your actions now or die.

Prove it.

I'm vouching for him.
Do as he says.

VOTE: Otolia.
Extra incentive. You're the lead wagon for a reason.

[mastin2]

VOTE: otolia
Scum stalling to get help from buddies.

(Basically, this. Magua stole my thunder again.)

[mastin2]

Don't bullshit me into believing my slot did terrible things he had to atone otherwise I wouldn't have had to replace in and you could all continue this game with my presence.

The only thing that kept votes off of your slot was that it was getting replaced.

And imagine that, the moment your slot is filled, you've got votes, 'cause people have been holding back waiting for YOU for, what? Two weeks?

Yeah. Word of advice, don't tick us off.

[mastin2]

"Guiz everyone in my neighborhood is 10000000% town" gives me the paranoid heebie-jeebies that somebody (mastin) is pulling the wool over the eyes of the others (Drixx, ZZZX).

OR, I have VERY good reason for this and so do they.

Several things, especially the flip from "AP was town you guiz even if third party" to "Hah we lynched scum D1 stupid scum" really, really, *really* rustles my jimmies.

I did no such thing. My stance has always been that AP was a mislynch.
When I accidentally said we had two scum dead, know what I was referring to?
Drawn On Arrival.
I said immediately.
Fucking IMMEDIATELY.
AFTER.
I.
POSTED.
"Whoops. Wrong game."
In Drawn On Arrival, at the time I had posted that, this game and that game were in the SAME DAY PHASE and I got THIS GAME confused with THAT GAME, and said as much in here.

And once I realized I had done so.
Immediately.
fucking.
corrected.
it.

To say that, no, my stance had not changed; it was still exactly the fucking same and that I had misspoken accidentally.

Also also, lingering doubts that TiphaineDeath did roleblock mastin performing the kill N1.

I have proof that failed. Proof that I am holding to myself for ~reasons~. But proof, 100%, that TD did not successfully roleblock me.

Town (S->W): FourTrouble ---> ZeL1nK ---> vezokpiraka ------------------> Drixx ---> ZZZX -------------------> mastin2 ---> Metal Sonic -------------> Imperium -> Skybird -> Otolia -> TSO
Scum (S->W): Ooba ------> Heartless ---> TheWayItEnds -------------> mnemonic device ---> Espeonage

This is pretty sheepable, though. I mean, TSO's town, period, Otolia's probably misplaced in the town half, and my order in the scum section would likely be rearranged, but is pretty similar to what I'm thinking.

[mastin2]

@mastin:

How come you didn't cop TSO N2?

BECAUSE.
I.
WASN'T.
ON.
THE.
FUCKING.
SITE.
THE.
ENTIRETY.
OF.
THE.
FUCKING.
NIGHT.

And prior to night, I did not know we were entering night. I did not fucking know I would be gone four fucking days. It blindsided me. I. fucking. FLAKED. from a game. FLAKED. GOT REPLACED. In a fucking game. Because. I. was. fucking. not. around.

If I had known we were near night. (I did not. I had no clue we were close, easily a verifiable fact especially since I basically never pay attention to deadlines, which many players can vouch for as being true.)
If I had known I wouldn't be around. (I did not. I had no fucking clue I'd ge bone for four fucking days.)
Damn right I would have asked the mod if I could submit in advance, which he told me D3 that I could do.
But I didn't.
And I was gone that entire time. Easily verifiable by doing your fucking homework.

So with no clue deadline was near. And no clue I wouldn't be around during the night. I missed my fucking night action.
Damn fucking right that had I had the CHOICE, I would have submitted an investigation.
But I can't exactly go, on D3, asking the mod, "hey, I was V/LA the whole night phase and thus couldn't submit a night action, could I get a cop result on TSO right now?", now, can I?
So the investigation was lost.

Now as for why I didn't cop TSO LAST night, that's a whole different matter entirely.
Bluntly, it's shit like this from you that made me investigate you.

[mastin2]

Proof, btw, now that Drawn On Arrival is actually over:

Uh.
Whoops.
Wrong game.
Two dead scum and a dead SK in less than three days.
So slightly less can-trust-me, but seriously, that's still good enough to be can-trust-me-for-a-day figures.

Message was posted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:28 am, referring to 6547/6549 that were posted two minutes prior.

This is the end of DoA's D3. Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:06 pm.
This is the beginning of DoA's D3. Mon Mar 09, 2015 12:42 pm.
On DoA's D3, we had flipped ika (scum), Flubber (scum), and Shaft (scum), two from lynch and one from a nightkill.

Check near where post 6552 was this game. Sooner or later, you'll find something that shows you it's from D3.
(Worth mentioning: that game, I had a role very, very, VERY similar to my role this game: that game, I had an automatic self-watch...conditional on me not using my track ability. So I could track a player, but if I did, then I couldn't self-watch. This game, I have what is effectively an automatic track...conditional on me not copping the person who would otherwise be tracked. So I can cop a person, but if I do, I sacrifice tracking them.)

I simply got the games confused.

[mastin2]

In fact, I just did the checking myself: Tuesday the 10th at 2+ in the morning? The day I posted the message?
Was the first day I was back from my four-day V/LA. It was, therefore, the beginning of D3 in this game for me.

Tuesday the 10th, at that same time, was also the beginning of D3 for me in Drawn on Arrival.
Both games had, simultaneously, had their games go into night two (DOA mighta been a BIT sooner), and emerge on day three, during my absence.

(Fun fact: I no-actioned in THAT game's N2 as well, producing a helpful self-watch result that identified Honey Bee as our motivator.)

[mastin2]

What I do care about is who you (and, perhaps by extension, ZZZX and Drixx) think are scum.

I don't have any reads that I'd call scumreads. To call my reads scumreads would be to imply a strength that isn't there. I can

maybe

give an approximate order to my reads, but it's not going to be definitive and not exactly a scumlist. As far as I know, ZX is entirely lost in the game and thus, worse than I am reads-wise. Drixx is sorta similar, bad with keeping up with the game and not with many reads, but I think he's there--ask him; he's not hiding anything in the neighborhood readswise. (I forbade it. Talking about reads is a PUBLIC activity, not a private one. We reserve private talks for role stuff, which only very slightly goes into my reads, via my cop. Me having submitted my cop already, I want to keep it a secret, but given the lack of strength behind my reads, I don't even have a readslist, neither public nor private.)

Otolia (either sheeping me or pressuring Otolia, doesn't really matter).

Otolia I just think is scum. His pattern of replacing in is highly, I dunno, Titusey in execution? That is, he comes in, plays the clueless card, starts innocently asking about pressure on every major wagon, sheeps one where he buddies a pusher of it, and asks useless "helpful" questions that lead nowhere. (That's basically what Titus does when replacing in as scum near-100% of the time.)

Or who you think is town besides your neighborhood and me.

Equally sad state to my scumreads.

How come Drixx and ZZZX aren't voting?

Ask them. They'll do what I ask, but they're not my slaves, contrary to what you may have assumed. They're individual players with individual stances.

I assume you all are actually doing stuff in your neighborhood.

Sort

-of. See also, roles, not reads. Reads are for the thread and any neighborhood claiming to have discussed reads in their own neighborhood is AUTOMATICALLY suspect as far as I'm concerned.

[mastin2]

Also, while I share the sentiment of 2 scum in the Ceph neighborhood, I would NOT put it past dram for it to be three.

[mastin2]

mastin, look, no offense, but it's D4. 350 pages. You can't *not* have scumreads. I mean, you even mention a scumread on Otolia in the next line.

...A read which is too weak to warrant being called by that name. I'm voting Otolia because Otolia's the closest thing I have to a proper scumread, but I'm not optimistic. If everyone had a 50% baseline chance of being scum, Otolia would maybe be 52%.

If you have no scumreads now, when do you think you will ever get any?

When I get them. I can't give you a better answer than that.

I really need more from you here than "lolanyonecanbescum"

What I

can

do is share my feelings on players. Why I haven't done that, though, is that it's all circlejerking that can be summarized in that single line: "I don't really know, one way or the other."

[mastin2]

Is anyone at all lynchable today?

Otolia and ooba spring to mind.

Which, y'know, is where I've been voting.

[mastin2]

Heartless (7):

MnemonicDevice

,

Magua

,

Otolia

, Zelink, Skybird, Metal Sonic, Vezokpiraka
Otolia (2): Imperium, Mastin2
twie (2): TSO, Ooba
Ooba (1): Espeonage
vezokpiraka (1): Heartless
Not Voting: Fourtrouble, Drixx, ZZZX, TWIE

Btw, justsayin'.
If Heartless is town, then there be scum on the wagon. I'm not touching Sonic or Vezok, either. Skybird would take some convincing, Zelink some HEAVY convincing, butyeah. There you go.
Meanwhile, the Otolia wagon is great, and the other wagons are meh, with a small dosage of maybe-scummy, maybe-distancing, probably-not-driven-by-town.

[mastin2]

If everyone had a 50% baseline chance of being scum, Otolia would maybe be 52%.

(For what it's worth, Antihero's a 50.5% or so.

Dead

on the null, except ever so much the slightest on the wrong side of it.)

[mastin2]

Mastin. I want you to vote Heartless.

Sorry. I'm not joining that wagon. Won't stop it, but not joining it. If it has enough support to go through, it'll go through without my help; if not, then it doesn't. Simple as that for me. You can appeal to Drixx or ZX, though. I'm not stopping them from voting. I just, personally, want to not be on this wagon.

I want you to put the bees on Ooba.

I already put bees on someone today. ooba was one of the candidates, but I will of course not be revealing if I did or did not put bees on him.

[mastin2]

Also in all seriousness
Very serious
The very fucking next game I'm in with you
Where you talk about what a scumhunting god you are
I am going to link this post over and over and over

I said I was a scumhunting god as a pun and a 'crumb. I never seriously thought my reads were ~AMAZING~ this game; quite the opposite, I'm well aware of how much they have not been. (I never say I'm a scumhunting god seriously. Ever. It is, 100%, a joke. It may be a joke with subtext meaning, in this case having served as a 'crumb of my role, but it is never meant to be taken at face value of me being arrogant enough to think I've got the game locked down. Not even in postgame if I nailed the entire scumteam will I say it seriously; I'll say it as a joke and then go on to explain all the flaws in my play that made it not so.)

[mastin2]

Also, my read on Otolia:

Otolia I just think is scum. His pattern of replacing in is highly, I dunno, Titusey in execution? That is, he comes in, plays the clueless card, starts innocently asking about pressure on every major wagon, sheeps one where he buddies a pusher of it, and asks useless "helpful" questions that lead nowhere. (That's basically what Titus does when replacing in as scum near-100% of the time.)

(But in this case, 'think is scum' does not translate into a scumread. It translates into being my best guess at scum, albeit by a mere 2%. It's a

weak

read, with weak reasoning, so barely worthy of being called a read. I tend not to call something a read until I've got at least 60%.)

[mastin2]

mastin, do you read Heartless' mass-vote-removing as town or scum

I put no read on it.
As scum, it's a "hahahahahaHAHAHA, FUCK YOU TOWN!" gesture.
As town, it's a "hahahahahaHA! FUCK YOU, MAGUA!" gesture.

I mean, there's technically a difference between the two but it's so minute as to be basically indistinguishable at this time.

You are currently saying that you're willing to vote Otolia-who-you-think-is-52%-likely-to-be-scum, but not Heartless-who-you-think-is-50%-likely-to-be-scum, want to make sure I have that right.

Yep! Keep in mind that this isn't the normal system I use, where I start at 0% and climb up. (In that system, 40% scum is significant.)
...Okay. This needs clarification.
There are two systems.
One is the 0%-as-baseline. You can go into "negative" percentages for scum as how sure they are to be town. 10% town is -10% scum.
This is the system I generally use. It's the system I used when saying my AP read.

It is not the system I'm using with my statements right now.
The system I'm using with my statements right now is the 50%-baseline system: below 50% is town and above is scum, in this case. 25% scum in this system is equivalent to 50% town (-50% scum) in the 0-as-baseline system. 75% scum is equivalent to 50% scum in the 0-as-baseline system.
So when I say that Otolia is 52% likely to be scum.
What I'm really saying is that I'm 4% sure he's scum.
When I say Heartless is 50.5% scum.
I'm saying I'm 1% sure they're scum.

And that's enough of a difference for me to push Otolia over Heartless, but not enough of one where I'll fight the wagon on Heartless. Players themselves come into this, too. Losing Heartless as town is a loss because I respect Anti. Losing Otolia as town will make me not shed a single tear. So bias does play a part.

[mastin2]

A little.
It's about .25 of the .5%.
But Sabotage is a mental reminder that it does happen.

[mastin2]

While scum hunting\effort seems miles apart from what I expected the 'mastin' brand to deliver - she has the role she says he has. I also think that N1 kill might be targeted towards this slot.

If I were the N1 nightkill target, I'd know--that redirect/block immunity I have, wouldn't have it if the scum tried to kill me last night, at least as far as I know. (There is ONE, very very specific, case where it's possible, but not exactly probable given what I know.)

As for the hunting, sometimes, I just have dry spots. Some games, I can instantly get a grip and hunt the scum to extinction, a-la the just-completed Drawn On Arrival, where I was 4.5-for-5 on lynches (the .5 being Marquis was a SK, not mafia and the game would've ended a day sooner had the town sheeped me there) along with suspicion on the third parties of the game (4nxi3ty and Aeronaut) having only missed one (who was null), and other games, I get Sabotage syndrome. (Sabotage, rather than Tales, because Tales was circlejerking with rage; Sabotage is circlejerking with apathy. ) By which, I mean, I get reads but haven't the slightest clue where to go with them, they're not great, they're shown not to be great, and while my presence is a net gain to the town, it's only

just

.

This game is most definitely the latter. I'm not absolutely worthless. My role is strong, and it will continue to be strong the more I get to clear people. (The scum can't kill me or stop me.) Aside from my role, I'm mildly helpful. But I'm still PRACTICALLY worthless, with very little value. I do apologize for it, but as Magua is so quick to point out, I am most definitively not a scumhunting god. Sometimes it clicks, sometimes it doesn't, and when it doesn't, I'm just your average player with average skills.

...That being said, Otolia being scum is the best I've got, and were I to exert any level of confidence in any push whatsoever, it'd be there, with the hope that Otolia's scum and that can be my Ceph-in-Sabo contribution to the game. (One dead scum to my credit.)

[mastin2]

Wait I thought mastin was a cop?

It's both. I may not be a scumhunting god(dess) by play, but I certainly am by role.

I literally just re read day 1 and was feeling good about my heartless ooba otalia scumteam too.

This may have merit.

To be honest, I don't think we're getting ooba lynched without a guilty; too many defenders. The name that to me has the least amount of merit is Heartless so I don't want that lynch. So that's one of the reasons I'm pushing Otolia.

[mastin2]

that redirect/block immunity I have, wouldn't have it if the scum tried to kill me

N1

*Corrected.

[mastin2]

Hey, mastin. If your reads are all as weak as you say they are, then sheep me instead of voting your 52%.

Because sheeping you is part of the 50.5%.

How other players perceive a player, contrary to popular belief, does in fact influence my reads. Your perception that Heartless is scum, therefore, contributes slightly to tipping the scale towards scum. Similar to how Imperium's perception on TSO did the same for me...but not enough for me to sheep.

[mastin2]

Hey, guys. I realize that I should technically be posting tonight, but I'm just so dead tired that I'm going to wait until tomorrow. (Sorry.) I

should

have the time tomorrow (at least two hours if I'm doing my math right), so that should be plenty. For reference, I'm back here.

[mastin2]

You're literally, and I stress this, literally voting a null-read over someone who knew what they were doing was antitown, did it

anyways

, and then disappeared from the thread thereafter while still being active elsewhere on the site.

...Which was a null action, albeit an anti-town one.

Anti-town actions, while anti-town, are by themselves entirely null. That's why they're called anti-town, rather than scummy or just-scum actions. And if it was a scummy or just-scum action, I'd say so, but contrary to what you think (since I'm sure YOU think the actions are scummy or just-scum), for me it's just anti-town.

[mastin2]

mastin is all "I ain't paying attention to this game, but let me throw out a vote on a vague not-even-really-a-scumread and then wander off" which I don't like.

Uh.
I explicitly AM paying attention to the game.

I just don't have much of anything to contribute off of what's IN it.

"There's 350+ pages of content."
Yeah, 350+ pages of 'content'.
I'd say if you're being extra-generous, 10% of that 'content' is actually useful. Page number != content amount. Content amount = content amount. And we've had, explicitly, literally page after page of fluff.

Most of what people talk about does nothing, whatsoever, to influence me in any way.

[mastin2]

ITS ANTITOWN ACTIONS BEING DONE BY TELLTALEHEART AND ANTIHERO.

Yes. I'm aware. But it's anti-town, not scummy, not scum, because I can see the town mindset behind it.

I can see the scum mindset equally as strongly, mind you. It was a null action, not a town one. But I can see them doing it as town. Just because they're Antihero and TTH doesn't mean they're going to use their role in the most pro-town manner; it is fully possible for players like them to use their role in an anti-town manner. Heck, you could argue that my usage of my role is so sub-optimal it's anti-town, and yet, I know that there was a town mindset driving it (because, y'know, I'm town), and that's more or less where my stance is coming from.

Could they be scum, yes.
Could they be town, yes.
Is either more likely to me, no, not really.
I just don't want to be on a wagon like that, just like I didn't want to be on a TSO wagon. I'm not going to fight the lynch. You can push it through without me resisting it. But I'm not going to contribute to it.

[mastin2]

Ok. So is Otolia being lynched in the next three days?

Potentially?

Yes.

[mastin2]

mastin, i would suggest the cop on vezok unless your cop can go through rolestopping skullduggery

A rolestop would in fact stop it. But if vezok rolestopped my target, then I'd lynch vezok. His rolestop should be on a proven or near-proven town force, like Magua, FT's slot, MS (debatable, but that's the near-proven bit), or on ZX or on Drixx, since they're good protects. My target's none of the above.

What Heartless did clearly benefits scum much more than it benefits town no matter which votes he annuled.

True.
Thus, anti-town. (Because in this case, anti-town is also pro-scum, rather than just anti-everything.)

That does not, in any way, make them more likely to be scum.

Literally, how do you see this happening. Like, who do you see voting for him and why are they going to switch? You're not *pushing* for Otolia's lynch.

Deadline.

I mean, I'm not pushing hard, but I am in fact pushing, albeit weakly, for Otolia's lynch.

[mastin2]

So.
I went into night knowing my investigation was 90% likely to be worthless.
Today makes it 100%.

Yesterday, I had bees on Imperium, soyeah. As if I needed to say it, they're order-aligned. (I did not receive a message that I was roleblocked, though, so presumably my protection against being blocked overrided their passive. It's...complicated.)

What I find interesting, though, is that vezok has bees on him. Drixx does, too, but I know the cause of that one, yet I don't have an explanation for why vezok has bees on him. I didn't target him. Neither ZX nor Drixx targeted him. TSO apparently can't target. The only person who had bees on them that leaves is Magua, but I got the impression if Magua had an ability, he'd have claimed it by now. Yet the mod made it quite explicit that my cop action (which was clearly successful) keeps bees from spreading, so it can't be Imperium's passive reflecting onto vezok. I'm kinda at a loss to explain it.

Also, I can confirm ZX and Drixx tomorrow. I'm also taking cop suggestions.

tl;dr, as normal, I, ZX, TSO, and Magua have bees; Drixx does too but I know why. What I DON'T know is why vezok has them. Imperium does NOT have bees on them, though.

VOTE: Otolia.
In the meantime.

[mastin2]

town:
Magua
Ollie
Ooba
Zelink
Mastin2
Metal Sonic
Mnemonic
Otolia
These players will not be lynched throughout the course of the game unless mastin claims what makes ZZZX and Drixxx actual confirmed town. Lynch order is likely Skybird to TSO to Espeonage to ZZZX to Drixx to vezok to TWIE. If Drixx and ZZZX confirm themselves, they get into the town block and push Otolia and Mnemonic near the end. If they just kind of confirm themselves, they make it to the end of the lynch list.

As I said. I can claim what makes ZX and Drixx conftown tomorrow. (To some extent, you're gonna need to trust me when I say not to lynch someone, though, because something ~magical~ happens tomorrow under set circumstances.) TSO is also town. I also really don't get why Otolia is in the townlist, nor do I think mnemonic is unlynchable-tier town.

But otherwise I can follow this.

[mastin2]

town:

Mnemonic
Otolia

huh?

(Also, stuff like this makes me not want to lynch TWIE. Justsaying.)

[mastin2]

So I want vezok to claim his action last night before I say anything else.

[mastin2]

And the bees thing for zzzx wasn't a really strong reason.

Trust in the mastin. I'll say that there's more for me to claim, something that was done besides my worthless investigation. I'm just not claiming it

yet

because I'm trying to make sense of things right now and I need the full info out there. Vezok's target among them.

[mastin2]

P-Edit: Ahh ... Mastin has more. Mastin ... care to share in the neighborhood? I'll check after I brush and floss and such. Curiosity is killing the Drixx.

The more I have is the same that you have.
You know, the ~stuff~ we both know about but are holding back from claiming? That stuff.

[mastin2]

Mastin has made quite possibly the worst night choices in the history of mafia

Actually it's my DAY actions. Night actions are the RESULT of my day actions.

The ~plan~ we have in our group is good. It had beautiful setup, so that part was NOT bad; it was actually quite excellent.
It's just that after the setup, every chance I've had to go on the offensive has gone horribly, horribly wrong.
So I'm asking for suggestions on who to cop, now. I want at least two or three candidates, and then and only then will I set my bees upon them.

Also, since vezok claimed, I'll reveal this tidbit of info:
Last night, I wasn't redirect/block immune...I was better. Anything targeting me would be reflected back onto the target.
I was able to share this ability with Drixx.

"Huh. So you're a cop/tracker hybrid, that is redirect/block/kill immune, except you can turn that into a reflector, and share it with another?"
Yep!

How many times do I have to say that I'm a scumhunting god before the message gets through to you that I got an absolutely broken role? The

idea

was that scum would try to break our little masonry and backfire back onto themselves. I'm asking the mod about one or two things, though. This is a piece of info that I hesitate to share since it could theoretically catch scum, but with the vezok-has-bees result, I think that either scum have been caught (vezok) or scum just cleared him, and I think we can figure out which, but I'm not able to sort through this mess right now in my head.

[mastin2]

'Whys this person in the 'conf town' list?' is usually a scum tell in my experience - especially when it seems like town can just win through PoE.

Except I did the same thing, for the same two people. That makes his concern automatically valid.

[mastin2]

By the way, in case you aren't 100 clear mastin, you're now blocked until tomorrow because of that so whatever information you're next going to have is going to come D7 at the earliest

No.
The mod did not tell me I am blocked.
Like I said. I had an ability reflector on me last night. Meaning that the passive failed to trigger correctly. dramonic did not tell me I was blocked, thus I am not.

Also, Drixx got my power mixed up; he thought it was a watch not a track.

[mastin2]

Can you cop anyone with bees? Anyone who has ever given bees?

If they have bees on them, I can. If they don't, I can't.

I also targeted metal sonic n2 which is why mastin originally saw bees on metal. It's my belief that vezok claiming rolestop on metal n2 is what led to mod error and removal of bees from metal.

Not possible--I gave bees to TSO D2, not you. You, I gave bees to D3.

[mastin2]

With vezok's having bees accounted for via Magua, and their cross-targeting, I'm willing to trust he's more likely town than not.

I still think TSO was telling the truth, thus, is a bad lynch.

Magua is my cop result.
Ollie/FT's basically conftown, as is ooba, for their actions.
ZX and Drixx I will continue to vouch for.
And Metal Sonic continues to not be probable scum.

Who does that leave?
Skybird, Otolia/Ace, TWIE, Zelink, mnemonic/farside, and Espeonage.
Of them, TWIE is who I least see scum in, and Zelink's not far behind--I also trust the townread there.

So my lynch/vigpool is Skybird, Otolia/Ace, mnemonic/farside, and Espeonage.
It's also my cop pool. If you don't give me instructions to the contrary, within 48 hours I'm going to place bees on one of them.

[mastin2]

Also, if you can investigate anyone with bees on them, I'm trying to figure out if it would be beneficial for us also to target someone today and give them bees.

Won't work. ME creating bees is a day action. Bees SPREADING is a night action. That is, day actions do NOT spread bees; night actions do. Meaning that if a player had, for instance, a daycop and they had bees on them, the bees would not spread to the daycopped player.

Did you see us claim the night one no kill and still think we could be scum?

10% chance, yes.

And I know I got an order result this day, and I haven't been told I was blocked. I wasn't blocked last night, as far as I know I'm not blocked now.

[mastin2]

Mini-V/LA

for tomorrow.

Also,

Mod: V/LA from May 1st-May 3rd.

Going to the Pacific Northwest Teen Square Dance Festival.
(Did catch up, though. Not much to say--haven't put bees on, and am mainly waiting for a vig before I do.)

[mastin2]

Because no one else was blatantly lying about information they knew to not be true.

I did not lie.

When I said that Xombie was town D1, that was me being me and not even knowing everyone in the game was in a neighborhood; I thought it was just us three at the time I said that, and for me in a game where everyone isn't in a neighborhood and yet I am, I treat it as a masonry. (See also: Inu-Yasha, where this worked out VERY well.)

When I realized that everyone was in a neighborhood (something I didn't know when I replaced in), I changed my tune, and began re-wording things, setting up a situation where the

plan

was for me to, come D3 if I was lucky, have investigated both my neighbors and had their alignment revealed to me. (This didn't work only because of a combined misunderstanding of my role and ZX revealing his own role.)

This was what I was broadcasting D1. (So no, I didn't know they were town. In fact, I didn't even really think they were. I just figured that if they weren't scum, the scum would be weirded out, and if they were, then I could find them and explain the above.)
Mind you, contrary to what Drixx claimed, Xombie did NOT claim third party D1.
He didn't even claim it without pressure.
He claimed it under heavy, heavy pressure, D2, where I basically flat-out said that if he didn't claim, I wasn't going to continue defending him.
Also, with Xombie having let me live, as a claimed cop (because I claimed D1), and let ZX live, as a claimed protective, there was strong evidence that he was not scum.

After he claimed third party, I did everything I could to avoid saying Drixx was town, when I knew he wasn't. I didn't start to lie until ffery (I think it was her) caught it and called me out on the difference between ZZZX is 100% town (true), and Drixx is 100% not mafia (what I was firmly under the belief of thanks to our continued survival and seemingly groundbreaking plan), after which (to preserve the integrity of the plan) I may have done so once or twice but otherwise was trying to avoid the subject.

I had a plan. It never could have worked because Drixx was scum lying, but when the plan failed,

I was going to lynch Drixx

. I never said this in the neighborhood (because, duh, I'm not going to tell Drixx about it so he can think of a way around it), but it was fairly obvious. I was well aware that trusting blindly in a third party would be a bad idea--thus why I had that unspoken yet obvious failsafe. He shoots scum, and if he doesn't leave the game, he's lying scum. He doesn't shoot scum, he's lying scum. (The only problem was that in order to get there, I needed a guilty, which I never got. Aside from targeting Esp the night I died.) He was obviously scum the moment he started changing the facts, altering the claim and lying about the timing of it and whatnot...but he only started doing that AFTER I had died.

Also, saying my reads were crap is unfair when I was okay with shooting PV (a null read admittedly, but not a town one), targeted Esp thinking correctly he was scum, and correctly called Otolia scum and advocated for his lynch yet was ignored the entire time. (Yes I townread Bitmap D1, but

everyone

townread Bitmap D1.) And I seem to recall at many points thinking FT (prior to the vigging) might be scum, only to be shot down by Imperium.

No

, my reads were not great. I never seriously thought I was a scumhunting god. That was me, telling a JOKE, and CRUMBING, in a game about...y'know. GODS! That much should be obvious. Fair criticism is fair; I did defend Drixx harder than I should have, but most of my defense was actually spent on ZX, who I had every right to defend. So I'm not going to let you walk over me either; there's a difference between commenting on the weaknesses in my play and bashing it continuously.

[mastin2]

(Also, I'd like to point to another game where NOT lynching the claimed third party was the right decision: 4nxi3ty in Drawn on Arrival claimed survivor. I had a tracker pseudoclear on him that indicated he was at least partially being honest. If we had lynched him, he couldn't have won, and at least one if not two or three or more town players would have died. We didn't. Instead, we continued to scumhunt, and that game became a near-perfect win, for us and with 4nx winning too.)

[mastin2]

Link for the curious.

He claimed here.
We lynched the last scum that day instead of him, PeregrineV.

Two days later after the only mislynch in the game (which, just for the record, I was against), we lynched the backup serial killer.

[mastin2]

Also,

dramonic:

Can you please make our PT public so that they can see where I came from?

(And for that matter, the dead PT, where I point out the timestamp issue.)