Good vs Evil, Law vs Chaos Reboot - Game Over, Good wins

[Shadoweh]

We have five god damn pages of real discussion, why the fuck are people initiating the RVS again. Go download the files and read you lazy assholes.

##Vote: ManiacalLemon

for pretending that statement was anything close to his idea and not answering any of the pre-crash questions asked of him.

[Shadoweh]

Lemon I think you'll find that is neither funny or likely to stop people from voting you.
The other Shadow: The old Day 1 is linked in the third mod post. Not hard to find.
If I see the word RVS one more time I'm gonna put a cap in someone's posterior.

Mod - In fairness, I hadn't put the link in until Shadow's post motivated me to do so.

[Shadoweh]

I was waiting for xvart to post to see if I still thought they were scummy. I didn't realize his slot was the one restarting up the RVS. >_> Foxace who's scum?

[Shadoweh]

Awh Mhork, you're town aren't you? I can tell. <^_^>

[Shadoweh]

He sure is there! I don't have a read either way.

[Shadoweh]

1) As a rule of thumb I'm always wary of people who don't read the sign-up thread. You can't tell who's

bussing

voting you again, Other Shadow? Your vote is made of fail.
2) Votes for Mhork would be shitty and you should not do them.
3) ML disappeared during this land of spam and Norman generating a magical wagon for being annoying. Almost like scum is lurking, watching the town tear itself apart..

[Shadoweh]

I couldn't hear you over the sound of you pushing policy lynches. And probably still being scum. I just started viewing this thread now, as in you voting me.

If I have something to say I'll say it. My lynch target isn't here to respond to and I don't feel like adding another page of spam like certain Foxes.

[Shadoweh]

Shadoweh – so in regards to your second and third points –

2. Why exactly are you so strongly defending Mhork when he doesn’t have any significant votes ATM?

We had this talk in another game. I don't like seeing strong town reads getting needled early. (I was close enough to being town, it counts. :p ) He sounds like the silly Mhork that got himself run up in another game because he overreacts to everything when he's town.

3. Your point here sounded better when ML made it at Post 126. Why are you parroting the person you look to be softly inferring is scum?

It is almost like I did that on purpose to point out the irony of him lurking himself or something.

Thinking on it that thing I said about Fox is stupid. My other scum read right now is Zdenek. His voting reasons don't feel right. Bringing up voting alliances is just something people do here, it's not indicative of alignment. His points on Mhork I disagree with, people babbling the same thing five times is a good reason to suspect a wagon of being scummy. I don't agree with Mhork about Kondi so far, but I don't think his persual is scum-intended.

[Shadoweh]

Norman, you have just contributed a literal four pages of noise. Stop.

AVox's buddying isn't the only reason that I'm voting him, and while it's true that suggesting an alliance isn't scummy, buddying can be. Someone disagreeing with you is not a scumtell. I do not think that someone who over reacts as town is unlikely to do it as scum, I don't agree with your meta argument that he's town at all. Finally, I disagree with your take on wagons for a couple of reasons, scum are reasonably likely to try to stay off of wagons early on day one and to avoid being accused of sheeping scum will also often try to avoid it.

The points about AVox I would honestly be more comfortable he refute himself, but what other reasons are you voting him for? The alliances and buddying is the only thing you've brought up. The points about Mhork I disagree, he's more reasonable when every little thing isn't surprising him.

Lemons: Besides your best chance at living through today who's scum?

[Shadoweh]

MoI: I have actually, he was scum in the first Newbie 1180 we played together. Unfortunately Tigers ate everything after Day 1 so you can't see exactly how British he is. (Or that he's scum. O_o DarthYoshi is his partner). I've read him as town since Post #164. He sounds downright goofy in it and the language is the same he used in NY 147 Vanillaside. (which does not exist -_-) Basically as town he's not careful with his language.

Sigh. Rereading the old thread I actually had these same concerns about Lemon just being an easy target. I supose for a scum he'd be pretty committed to pissing people off, and he has actually put down an original vote now. I will entertain the idea that he's the same class as Norman right now. Obviously Bards. Only bards could be this useless.

On the other hand I also recall the problems Zdenek is talking about with AVox. And agreeing with them. And thinking Zdenek was town. <_< Rereading is your friend!

##Unvote
##Vote: AVox

Cut: Norman stop posting.

[Shadoweh]

lol wtf was totally gonna vote pine too until 338. If I voted him it wouldn't really work for me now would it...

I'll stick to my second best choice

VOTE: Tammy

Are you scum? >_>

[Shadoweh]

No please, keep the disagreement, someone around here needs to have some common fucking sense.
I fell asleep in the middle of replying to MoI earlier. To keep it brief, the amount of posts you have is not as important as when you have them. Dropping off in activity when you're under suspicion is scummy, but I've come to the conclusion that Lemon isn't really posting less so much as other people are posting way too much. I still want him to expand his suspicions, the attacks on Norman are too easy and it seems like he forgot he thought Fox was scum.

Speaking of posting way too much, these last few pages. Jackal's post is the epitome of lazy bandwagon hopping. brizingre1 should explain what exactly Norman is guilty of that's scummy, not just anti-town. Haze should explain what exactly about 338 makes voting Pine such a bad idea.

Pine's overreactions to being voted are pretty scummy. Kudos for the rant in #461 trying to reason with the misguided idiots as if they aren't scum to you when your vote says otherwise.

Tammy: As long as I can save the innocent townies from multi-classing into bard it is worth every moment. ^_^/

[Shadoweh]

Prod times don't mean anything. 16 hours is a really long time. (And 48 hours is more then half a game day where I'm from. <_< ) And considering everyone forgot he exists in favor of LYNCH ME LYNCH ME it's not as crazy a concept as you make it out to be.

Foxace's posts remind me of the newbie from EM I played with who was under suspicion for wanting to hammer someone early. It's only scummy to you because you're holding him to your own standards. Actually the person who was doing that was the scum IC. Why are you pushing people for what constructively is just bad or different play then what you're used to?

[Shadoweh]

Nope, 16 hours is NOTHING. Look up the page. The site you are playing on is Mafiascum.net. It's not EM, Smashboards or whatever other place you are from. Site norms here are what apply.
Your stance is scummy. Especially given you have played in games here on MS before.

And in those games the scum were the people posting as infrequently as possible and the town posted as often as possible when they were here, with the exception of people who were outright replaced. He's not getting lynched today from the looks of it so the argument is a moot point.

Also .. you didn't answer my Mina-Alt question.

Confirm or deny

!

I'm flattered you would mistake me for Mina, but Shadoweh is Shadoweh and no one else. ^_^/

honestly is it so hard to believe I'm not an alt apparently I'm Mist Beauty too

Documentation of the CoolDog wagon:

[Shadoweh]

I wonder how many other people look at this thread, see a page filled with Norman and look away. <_<

Why would a Bard have the ability to detect alignment? The only classes that have alignment detection are Clerics and Paladins. I really want to hate the claim. Thinking about how the setup works though, It's not really possible to fakeclaim Lawful or Chaotic alignment detecting without making yourself caught scum. Because we haven't mass-claimed alignments, scum would have a 50-50 shot of getting it wrong every time. There was no reason to out yourself like that if you're telling the truth Pine, there are two huge wagons and neither of them are on you. :/

I was hoping Pine had said someone on the alignment claims, but he didn't post in the old thread and none of his current posts reference it either.

This is clearly mod bias. Bards can't possibly be the most useful class, it's illegal.

[Shadoweh]

He's softclaimed everything though

has he like hardclaimed anything yet

becaus only hardclaims count

[Shadoweh]

Shadoweh's 627 is just babbling, since she doesn't take into account the possibility of scum having alignment cops.

That's an interesting theory. This game is proposed as two seperate town and scum teams playing in one thread. Why would the scum team have an alignment cop? It doesn't aid their win condition.

[Shadoweh]

These are all really silly lynches. I'm not sure how to feel about Fox honestly after pulling the same stunt as Norman, but I still believe scum do not want to attract attention and shouldn't want to make themselves wagons. Norman, what do you think of the AurousVox pirate following your happy train for no reason?

[Shadoweh]

Trekker is a townie. He wouldn't have compassion for another townie if he weren't.

Therefore YOU are confirmed scum according to what trekker said.

Or he could just be using you as an excuse to vote whoever. P sure this isn't true.

[Shadoweh]

You aren't.

##Unvote
##Vote: Foxace

List of scumreads = mediocre. The majority of them are people who at different points wanted you lynched. I'm willing to believe this is refuge in audacity seeing how well it worked for Norman. Basically the only wagon right now I think has a chance of being scum.

[Shadoweh]

Are Magua and hito the same person? That's the impression I got from earlier.
Zdenek is trying to rebuild my scum read on him again.

[Shadoweh]

The biggest consensus is on Foxace. I'm honestly not sure if I'm okay with this lynch since AVox and JackalIamscummy just flopped onto it for no reason, but if I jump off every wagon I find suspicious nothing will get done. If there's a push to throw Jackal out the door I will sheep to that like you're an Innocent Child Vanillizer.

[Shadoweh]

A hydra of Feysal and mith.

Amusing. Now how about you explain what the point was to confuse CooLDoG about who your heads were?

His signature has changed at least five times since the game started. :V Most of them impossible because one of the 'heads' is already in the game. I'm pretty sure he's just making fun of people at this point.

kondi: The more 'flops' though the less likely the person is on one of the scumteams, isn't it? Multiball is confusing. :s

[Shadoweh]

Because they haven't sniffed enough glue to actually think it's a good idea.

Pine

does not

get town cred for that botched claim, and I think we've all agreed that it was the worst, most unprovoked claim in the history of serious claims. I don't know enough about Pine's town play, but I would support his lynch right now as the one day one lynch with merit behind it, where offing that 'power' doesn't really hurt us if somehow that was a true claim. As it stands, I think Norman's just full of hot air and mocking everyone in this game at this point.

This argument is horrible. You're seriously suggesting that a Day 1 cop lynch is the best day to do it, because there's no harm to the town if the cop happens to be real and he just happened to be lynched before he could get any results? We all haven't agreed with you, by the way. Why is it fake?

MoI: Reread the original pages. I liked his early content during the alignment argument.

[Shadoweh]

So I see there's still no Jackal wagon. Or anything but Norman (lol) and Tammy (LOL). If I have time before deadline I'll read back but on a skim the last page looked like more of Zdenek trying really hard to lynch someone obvtown for looking for answers. Still not impressed.

[Shadoweh]

Shadoweh - If you want a Jackal wagon, why are you voting Foxace? This doesn't make sense to me.

Besides how Foxace is prod dodging, there doesn't seem to be interest in the wagon. If this Foxace wagon dissolved right now it would be highly likely to fall on two people I am certain should not be lynched ever, nevermind Day 1.

[Shadoweh]

I'm back. It turns out modding is alot more intensive then I thought. >_> I am surprised this day isn't over. Equally surprised that there's another hueg wagon. You know if I'd been paying attention when the Zdenek wagon started I probably would have supported it then. This back and forth with Tammy feels wasteful however, and it's hard to tell how much of the wagon on Zdenek is because he's losing the argument. A long examination hasn't turned me up many posts from the voters I disapprove of though. It seems like a town driven wagon.

I actually feel the people picking sides on this are scummier then the arguers themselves, it seems like they're capitalizing on the hard work of others. Zar is the worst example of this right now as Zdenek Jr. Jackal's latest posts have been very appeasey, but I'm weak to what seems like honest earnesty. I'm not sure if that's a real word but it sounds good to me right now

Tammy: Stop feeding the trolls. You're overreacting and turning this argument into an emotional thing where people will vote against your attckers out of a sense of wanting to help you from the big bad mans.

[Shadoweh]

A quick skim says this day is off to a horrible start. Let me try to reconstruct things.
"Do you think the doctor should out themselves?"
"What, why would we want the doctor to out themselves?"
"OMG COOLDOG WANTS THE DOC TO OUT THEMSELVES"
##Vote CoolDoG
##Vote CoolDoG
##Vote CoolDoG

This is incredibly stupid. CooLDoG hasn't stopped being town from yesterday.

##Vote: AVox

[Shadoweh]

Tammy: I'm not sure what you're asking me in post 1271. By driving I meant the people who started the wagons seemed earnest, and the people carefully coralling the sides seemed bad for picking sides on a town vs town fight.

Fucking coward scumbags killed MoI.

+1 Gloating tell.

Question is, why were there not two kills?

Doctor should keep quiet because could have been a prevented crosskill (though statistically less likely)

I want everyone to state whether they think the Doc should keep quiet or out his protect.

And that means EVERYONE

Obviously as the doctor I would not want you to talk about me protecting Tammy last night. <--- This is a blatant lie. Or is it?

All of the above statements have a few things in common. They draw attention away from looking at the wagon, they take focus away from the kill itself and they invite people to openly Wifom about the night results. There is only one.. er two teams this benefits, and it isn't mine. Then you place your carefully laid candy out and jump on the first easy mark to go 'why would you do this'? You really expect to get away with this, don't you?

PS: Your word is great and all but SOPA told me not to trust pirates.

[Shadoweh]

> Where is Shadowehs

In hell. Also known as employment. It's 5 am. I'll be back to post tomorrow. Zar = scum.

I would replace out but I don't hate Seacore that much.

[Shadoweh]

I passed out and had this weird dream where I replaced in as a hydra with Faraday and OH SHI-

Not sure if scum covering past idiot's blatant mislynching tactics or town figuring out common sense. Faraday is impossible to see as anything but town, apparently. At least he told me his secret scumtells when we modded Fantasy Camp together.

I just realized that Pine working the way he says he does makes him as much of a threat to the Chaotic mafia as the Lawful one. Checking up, the last mention Zdenek made of Pine was:

I'm mean, I'm town, Pine's town, there's scum on the wagon, but that's FoxAce, so who cares.

And his opinion of MoI:

Pine was somewhat scummy for sucking up to MoI, and then apparently being unavailable to post. He got several people to mention they they felt he was scummy, but not a lot of votes. He noticed this and claimed Chaotic-Lawful cop. I would not support a Pine lynch today.

I've also think that MoI is scum. Roughly, the reasons are that his attacks on me are either based on him not reading the thread or him willfully misrepresenting my posts. He has created a ridiculously high standard for what he will accept as a scum-tell, but thinks that attacking Tammy is scummy because to him she is obviously town, and his reasons for thinking that Tammy is town are not nearly strong enough for that sort of stance to make any sense, MoI's attacks on me are not the only ones that have been born out of a misrepresentation, see for instance his first vote on Briz since the game restarted.

MoS is also very likely scum because he is content to snipe from the sidelines.

I think that the three of them

- MoI
- Tammy
- MoS

make for a very likely scum team. I believe that MoI, being aware of his reputation for bussing has decided to instead defend his scum-buddy Tammy in this game. Tammy has stated in the thread that she thinks that sniping from the side-lines is scummy, but she fails to ever take a strong stance on MoS. Finally MoS jumped to MoI's defense when Feysal presented his case on MoI. There are a few other notable interactions between them: Tammy fence-sitting on MoI in 455, and MoI telling MoS to stop trying to bait suspicion,

@Mastin: We were only granted a 24 hour extension. As I type, we've only got 31 hours left. It's time to make a decision. As to why Zdenek, read MoI's case. I find it thoroughly convincing.

MoI's scum and his case was based on a failure to read the thread.

His stance on MoI as an investigation target being wrong makes no sense. He himself thought MoI was scummy going into the nightphase. He also thought Pine was town. It doesn't make sense to me for a townie to forget that they thought someone was scummy, and not understand why someone else would find them scummy enough to investigate. The change would make sense from someone making up his feelings as he's going along and sensing a weakness in the 'fake cop'.

I'll also point out that if Pine were fakeclaiming scum that was going to claim roleblocked he could have chosen

anyone

to lie about, there are a mass of scummy people to be suspicious of. Definitely someone more palpable then MoI.

The entire dialogue is off to me. I also see that Zdenek has already dropped his Pine vote but is more then happy to keep pushing him as a viable target in case enough minnows eat paint chips and want to go for it. If you really thought he was lying you wouldn't be afraid to lynch him as scum.

##Unvote
##Vote: Zdenek

[Shadoweh]

PS: Tiphaine is Norman and is therefore town. I could not care less if she vomitted liquid bullshit at this point. MoS comes off to me as the new Sane Man so I will be very depressed if he's actually scum. Mr. Molla's posts above mine are worse then lurking. You've stated you're okay with an AV lynch, why? What has MoS done that's scummy besides voting you? Why is Tammy-Zdenek town-town?

[Shadoweh]

It's a terrible drawback. Why do you seem so plushy today?

[Shadoweh]

As scum they wouldn't have suspicions to forget in the first place. :V

Disagreeing with me? FARADAY YOU ARE SO OBVSCUM.

[Shadoweh]

Obviously I'm trying to lure you into a false sense of security so you make an epic scumslip.
Completely unrelated, why do you think there was only one kill last night?

No one else seemed to have noticed Zdenek dropped all his reads, so he must be doing something right.

[Shadoweh]

I'll think about it after he responds. Mhork's quip about how right I am without voting with me was a little weird. I need to sleep now which is totally not me switching computers.

[Shadoweh]

It's a terrible drawback. Why do you seem so plushy today?

What do you mean by plushy?

Why is Zdenek town? He hasn't done anything that bothers you? Who has done something that bothers you and what is it right now?

Cut: Did you just use the word humble?

##Unvote
##Vote: Lord Mhork

This is not a joke. You are 100% buddy scum.

[Shadoweh]

I'm sure an earlier post that includes a vote for him would help you conclude it better. He's not going to be scum with Mhork though.

[Shadoweh]

oh god that post is so adorable. I want to hug you. To pieces. Why are you such a cute little scumbag? :<

[Shadoweh]

*bright puppy eyes* Why me? :<
So cute. Must hug. With knives.

[Shadoweh]

On a completely different note and I am terribly sorry for this but
My computers are locked iin my house as part of a police investigation so I am going to be V/LA for at least 2 Days. I'm likely to be around from other people's computers but for some reason I might not be concentrating on the game. >_> (reposted for informativve purposes)

[Shadoweh]

Excuse me can people eexplain wwhy yyhey aren't voting for Mhork trying to bee adoravle until yoou go away

[Shadoweh]

>_>

So the argument against lynching Mhork so far is that he looks like scum.
Great argument 10/10. Why are the rest of you not wanting to lynch Mhork?

[Shadoweh]

The only peerson to acknowledge you thiinks you look like scum but would rather lynch someone else. >_>
There has been no vote movement. Words are useless, votes are intent.
The lack of acknowledgement is equally as annoying.

I don't expect you to notice the difference. But no one else is pushing you, so the argument that other people are at least being reasonablee sounds morre likee 'at least those people aren't crazy'. I have given

real points

. Let's take this post as an example.

You think this is a game, Shadoweh? You want to know who bothers me? AurorusVox. He's yet to give a real reason why he thinks I'm scummy, yet seems certain I am. How does that work, huh?

PEdit:
I don't see Zdenek-scum nearly as much as I see AurorusVox-scum.

"This guy bothers mee because hee thinks I'm scum! Isn't that a mean thing?" Pro-tip, people' feelings for you don'tt determine their alignment. This isn't a scummy thing he did, this is you trying to garner pity for your vote because he's picking on you.

But I'm not a scumbag, Shadoweh! I mean, I really, really wish I was this game... But I'm not.

Other than that whole 'humble' thing, have I done anything else to trip your sensors?

OH I WISH I WERE A LAWFUL OR CHAOTIC SCUMBAG
THAT IS WHAT I'D REALLY LIKE TO BEEEE
CAUSE IF I WERRE A LAWFUL OR CHAOTICC SCCUMBAG
EVERYONE WOULD BE RIGHT IN LYNCHING MEEE
Why do you 'wish' you were scum, Mhork? Why would you even think to say that?

Remind me, were you in favour of a mass ethics claim?

No.

Unvote; Vote: Pine

Here's the deal

If we massclaimed ethical alignment, scum HAD to lie.

Pine's claimed role outs ethical liars.

Pine's claimed role is MEANT to catch scummy players in the lie they HAD to make if we massclaimed ethical alignments.

Pine was NOT in favour of massclaimed ethical alignments.

Pine is a liar and therefore scum.

Wait--that's actually good thinking, AurorusVox.

UNVOTE: AurorusVox

VOTE: Pine

No that thinking is horrible, even with a chaotic/lawful cop it's not work splitting the town in a massclaim. No reason why AVox is no longer scummy to you, you just sheep to his reasoning to go COP HO! /o/

You're not being offended, you're looking for forthright and intelligent looking things to sheep. You aren't hunting, you're defending yourself and showing up just enough that people don't remember your name. I won't forget your name Lord Mhorky, because to me it says BRITISH GOVERNOR SCUM.

[Shadoweh]

-_- I hate everything.

##Unvote
##Vote: AVox

[Shadoweh]

>_> My work schedule isn't affected by your votes.

Nothing mind-blowing has happened in like five days. I can't find the last time AVox posted in the thread and BBmolla hasn't posted anything other then 'I'll get to it later'. None of my town reads are in danger anymore and the last five pages are just town reads arguing with each other so...

And I like the witty banter, but there's already enough non-game related talk in here.

[Shadoweh]

You mean that game where I lynched the obvtown Om for being Om? ...I can't make myself feel guilty about that honestly.

Someone asked why I didn't consider that Bards don't get alignment spells. I did consider it. It doesn't matter. Maybe it petered out because he's telling the truth and the actual scum are too chicken to take responsibility for lynching a cop?

[Shadoweh]

To be honest since you're Norman I've been trying not to read any of your posts.

[Shadoweh]

I don't mean you're like Norman, just that for game purposes you're his slot.

[Shadoweh]

You brought up Vanillaside. The first thing I think about when I think of that game is him. (I think I'm getting games mixed up too.)

No matter how bad Tiphaine's reads are she's not going to stop being town. That's exactly why I'm not paying attention to her, so I stop second guessing.

[Shadoweh]

>___> Have you considered rereading anyways, because that's what you should do as town? Or do you just not care what happens after you die?

[Shadoweh]

Haze: Why? His latest posting hasn't added anything. In fact.

##Unvote
##Vote: BBMolla

Hi Faraday ^_^/ You know if you never let Mena post on that account people are going to figure out what's goin on. O_O

[Shadoweh]

Why is Nacho scum?

I have no idea how many votes I'm at so I'm just going to cut this shit down.
I claim

Lawful Good Cleric.

I have a protect that only works on players that share my alignment. That's why I'm sure Pine is telling the truth about his restriction.

Ooh want to guess who I protected? I claimed it already.

[Shadoweh]

unvote:

You were being serious? I thought you were joking.

That was the point, yeah. Refuge in Audacity only works if people think you're lying.

[Shadoweh]

It depends on how idiotic the town is in lynching obvious town. Why me over BBmolla all of a sudden?

[Shadoweh]

The Lawful QT is very small. :< We uh.. didn't talk much.

I wouldn't say I was undone by my claim. I was assuming I was already dead and less valuable then the roleblocker. The claim was made to be countered and revealed a bunch of people that had no idea how spells worked. And greenknight. I should have claimed chaotic and set a better example, BBmolla's claim made me cry inside.

[Shadoweh]

Yes, assuming we would talk to each other was apparently your first mistake. It doesn't seem either team knew who their power role was until the next night. >_>

Awh, mastin your post makes me all giddy inside. It was hard to be motivated when my scum partners kept replacing out or uhm.. power lurking. Droopy Dooooog! By the time we had CHESSKID it was way too late for me to pull back.

[Shadoweh]

I blame you for ending every sentence with 'Let's lynch BBmolla'. >:<