Double-Dip Mafia, Game Over

[kunkstar7]

ohai. Answer to Elli: played with Furry when I first joined the site.

I commend Elli for going out on a limb and considering nk speculation. I don't think scum would make an entirely random kill so at least one of the scumgroup must have played/modded with Furry and had a reason to kill him. This lowers our lynch pool for at least one scum to a group of players who have interacted with Furry in previous games.

Whatsup with the smalls wagon? Legit or just randomwagongo?

[kunkstar7]

ohai. Answer to Elli: played with Furry when I first joined the site.

I commend Elli for going out on a limb and considering nk speculation

. I don't think scum would make an entirely random kill so at least one of the scumgroup must have played/modded with Furry and had a reason to kill him. This lowers our lynch pool for at least one scum to a group of players who have interacted with Furry in previous games.

Whatsup with the smalls wagon? Legit or just randomwagongo?

So why do you think Furry was killed?

Second paragraph sounds fake. Scum would say something like this, to appease the person asking about the kill. Rest is wifom speculation of what scum may NOT have done. Doesn't consider what other options scum may have taken.

Bold emits "HAI KAN I JOIN WAGON PLZ?" Basically asking permission to get on a wagon. Doesn't address any suspicions, events, nor votes.

Unvote Unvote Vote: Kunkstar

Btw, who is scum to you?

Because yes scum is going to go "N0 KILL RANDOM NUMBER GENERATOR GO". Scum have every reason to make a kill that will be most advantageous to them. They don't decide what is most advantageous by just picking a random player, they pick someone they know what their play is like. The only situation where the scum haven't played/modded with Furry is if they read a random game with Furry in it but didn't play themselves. The problem with that is it is hard to judge a player's impact externally, so they would go for a player that they had played with and felt the impact of their play personally.

GD Low Key what does it take for you to answer Ran's #71? You didn't explain where the town read started to begin with so there is no connection whatsoever.

Ran and Amrun are town. Amrun is Amrun. I like Ran's content so far.

Tons of vote changes from Empking seems sketch. Count of 6 separate players without any logical explanation for any of the changes.

[kunkstar7]

Game opened June 24th. My last post before game start was the 23rd. My next four posts on site were on the 26th at:
12:35
12:49 (this game)
12:52
12:57

So unless I'm deliberately avoiding all games and modding commitments, the other logical conclusion for my absence was I have RL commitments I needed to attend to.

Still waiting on your answer as well.

[kunkstar7]

I think it's very weird that he hasn't voted at all. Not scummy-weird, just 'why would you sign up for this game and then not exercise your right to vote?'-weird. His activity so far is wretched, I think we're in a 'shape up or ship out' scenario here.

I also think you made a very good point about his "Whatsup with the smalls wagon? Legit or just randomwagongo?" post that he has pointedly failed to address. And I don't like the way he attacks Empking for making tons of unexplained vote changes, but says nothing about Hiraki doing the same.

Hiraki's vote changes were nowhere near the same level as Empking. Like I said Empking managed to vote 6 separate players without any reason for vote changes. Notably though Empking has moved away from this style in recent posts.

To be honest, my smalls comment was legitimate interest in whether people were serious or not considering we were partly in RVS since people had random votes and I couldn't find anything that explained a legit version of the wagon. If anything that comment leaned more to distrust of the large wagon rather than attempting to join it.

Thoughts on Image, WLC, Elli, and Pom?

Pom: Not particularly thrilled here, the fact that she took an RVS vote and made it serious with only the word "scummmmmy." is sketch. The fact that she mentions two posts later that she has no one better to vote is sad too.

Vote: Pomegranate.

Elli's play here reminds me of his play when he seems disinterested, and likely town.

WLC: Tunnelling on Amrun ineffectively here, not much else. Most of his Amrun stuff is based on early content such as a p-edit on like page 2? Picks on her not providing reasoning when there clearly have been worse culprits of that.

I am uncertain on imaginality. Early on I had a weird gut feeling about him, but have been trying to largely ignore it due to its lack of grounding in actual content.

RedCoyote joins my list of townreads.

Vote: Crazy.

His insistence on tearing down Ellibereth based solely on the Furry question is really meh to me especially considering that I supported Elli in it and he never called me out along with Elli.

Question to Hiraki wagoners: To what extent is his early apparent mixup with scumreads a part of the reason you are voting Hiraki?

[kunkstar7]

Wait wait wait. All that quote striping to say that well he fucked up his counting of scumreads on smallswagon so lets call it "cog-dis" and apply that to the rest of his play and call it scum? I might (truthfully I am) be generalizing the whole thing a bit too much but it makes my point. This here is why I wanted to know the full extent of that mistake in the case on Hiraki. I actually originally glossed over the iam/Hiraki stuff because to me it was like Hiraki had made an honest mistake so it didn't need to be pushed further. If it revealed that Hiraki was scum after the fact for other reasons, then okay, but I think by ascribing the word "cog-dis" to the original reason you found then ascribing it to the case as a whole doesn't make much sense.

That being said, it was Iam's case and I wouldn't mind seeing it fleshed out maybe to see it better; Hiraki's defense was terrible on it though which goes a long way for me

So in the case that you are wrong about Hiraki, we got the person to place blame on because they made the case on Hiraki not you. That's cool.

[kunkstar7]

@RedCoyote: Not particularly unfortunately due to the breakdown of the answers from people:

Haven't:

Amrun
Crazy
Pomegranate
iamausername
RedCoyote
Ranmaru

Didn't answer:

Hiraki
Ameliaslay
Low Key
Empking
smalls
Weyounslastclone

Has:

Ellibereth
Kunkstar7

Like I mentioned before I have a townish read on Elli (and obviously myself), so unless one of the non-answerers actually has, this avenue of attack is kind of moot because right now I'm not willing to lynch someone I have a townish read on due to NK speculation rather than someone that I find scummy by ingame play. In hindsight I wish the original question had been posed as "Who knew Furry?" to get a broader sense of who knows Furry from being on site.

@Ranmaru: I am confused by your intent with Post #408. Did you intend to defend Hiraki by pointing out an issue with Iam's push on Hiraki's mistake in counting? Specifically where do you stand on Hiraki?

[kunkstar7]

@KunkStar: No, I am null on Hiraki. (Though LK made a good point about the RVS thing) I didn't see the scumminess of it, so I am trying to figure it out. Why did you think it was a defense?

Because it looks like a counter to the 2/3 deal. Considering that it required you to research the wagon and find those quotes on his reads, you put effort into it, so logical conclusion to putting effort into creating a counter is that you are defending Hiraki.

[kunkstar7]

What question?

The "who played with furry" question. (assuming this was directed at me.)

[kunkstar7]

@KunkStar: No, I am null on Hiraki. (Though LK made a good point about the RVS thing) I didn't see the scumminess of it, so I am trying to figure it out. Why did you think it was a defense?

Because it looks like a counter to the 2/3 deal. Considering that it required you to research the wagon and find those quotes on his reads, you put effort into it, so logical conclusion to putting effort into creating a counter is that you are defending Hiraki.

How exactly does it look like a counter to you?

Because you were showing where Hiraki's scumreads were coming from in your perspective and how they had nothing to do with the smallswagon, so Hiraki did have the legitimate reads beforehand, and the messing up of numbers was really just messing up of the numbers.

[kunkstar7]

@kunkstar - Can you answer my question from earlier?

Also, kunkstar, can you explain why me voting Imaginality but not you would be indicative of me being scum? I mean, I could understand scum might be hypocritical in regards to their own scum-partners, but how is me being hypocritical in favor of you scummy from your own perspective, since you should know yourself to be town.

Its inconsistency in application. You call out Elli, fine (from your perspective, I disagree with the call out but that isn't the point here). You call out imaginality, meh because its slightly attached to Elli so I can see it, but I still think reaching somewhat. But you completely ignore my part in it, which was more pronounced than imaginalities. So its selectively using a tell in this case to tunnel on Elli, and if you truly believed that there was substance, you would focus on any player that did the same.

[kunkstar7]

Unvote; Vote:Hiraki.

Tomorrow is Crazy though.

[kunkstar7]

I did the same thing.
and smalls is really really town.
Now I think you're town to for whatever reason.
Show me why please?

So you are saying that you see WLC as town but nothing to show for it? Tis pretty sketch if you ask me, especially in concert with the last sentence. This will be important when we see WLC's flip. I actually think it'll reflect more scummily on Elli if WLC is a mislynch.

@Empking: WTF is that RC vote? Absolutely no precedent in your ISO.

Vote: Pom; Vote: Crazy.

Still need to reflect on interactions between flipped players and these two, but they are still my stronger scumreads.

[kunkstar7]

Like I said, empking has no precedent or reasoning for voting RC and on day 2 he should have at least something to say by now. Plus lulzvote on a townread of mine doesnt sit well with me.

[kunkstar7]

Yeah and Amrun was null on RC the day before. Her being a town read is no excuse.

What? I meant that RC was a townread from Day 1. So Empking voting RC with NO reasoning or prior mention of RC being scummy is bad compared to Amrun being null on RC then seeing a flip and thinking that RC's position on a mislynchwagon was bad (and stating so, which is giving a reason for her vote on RC), then voting RC. That's a demonstrable logical path to a vote on RC.

[kunkstar7]

Kunk, was your hammering Hira similar to me reasoning or your own or vut.

My hammer was pretty much this: "I wanted the day to end and for there to be flips out." Hiraki was null enough for it to be worth his flip since my preferred wagons weren't currently viable.

[kunkstar7]

I unvoted RC and voted Pom earlier because Pom was being scummy too and yay bandwagons, but after Pom was replaced by DGB, I see no reason to keep my vote there and plenty of reasons to vote for RedCoyote.

This confuses me. You had two scumreads, WLC and RC, one of which was a viable wagon (WLC), yet you were willing to sheep the other viable wagon as well without any really strong read on it? I say without any really strong reason because you seemed to have dropped off of the Pom/DGB wagon as soon as DGB showed up, without saying if DGB has really swung your opinion on that slot with her entry.

[kunkstar7]

That makes sense, just wanted reasonings for dropping the pomwagon when DGB showed up. Shows your read on that slot better.

[kunkstar7]

Unvote; Vote: Weyounslastclone.