Cyclic Experimentation Set x01 - [Game Over]

[I Am Innocent]

I'm here, guys. I haven't consulted with Vi, yet, so I'll keep this brief.

Too sane for the Furc I know.

vote Saint

[I Am Innocent]

anyway, there's the antitown role isn't nearly as bad as i thought it was.

The cycling mechanic alleviates most of the pain in an endgame situation. You cycle treestump to the guy you dont feel like lynching. He'll be unlynchable. Oh, unlynchable doesn't matter because you refuse to vote for him and it's hard to get votes in endgames. You guys go lynch scum if it's anything but LyLo.

But wouldn't it make it LyLo happen sooner (instead of 2 town vs 1 mafia, you would need 3 town vs 1 mafia since one town would be rendered useless).

I do not see the problem with implosion outting this, as he said, suspicion would have likely come his way as he cast no votes D1.

Consider me in the group that would like to see this thing go bye-bye.

[I Am Innocent]

ok.

Real posts, when i use the term at least, are posts that move you towards your wincon substantially, and make you a readable player. Scum want to be unreadable, and are more likely to post one liners like you are doing.

What are the risks of trying to kill implosion's ability? Is the worst case scenario really a mafia doc saving the guy? A vigilante would miss getting a kill that night, but he wasn't guaranteed to shoot correctly anyhow. While this treestump ability makes us autolose LyLo, so it is the equivalent of an entire player, guaranteed.

I'm thinking maybe we ought to remove implosion's ability from the game. If you're town, please argue for or against that without appeals to fear, mkay?

Reading chronologically here, so my bad if some of these points have already been brought up.

The danger with thing seems to be near endgame. My proposition, everybody who has it states it each day. That person chooses who to send it to and then tells the group before hand. So each day/night, we will know as a group where this thing is. When a vig has someone he/she thinks is scum with the tree stump, they can kill at that time.

So I don't think we benefit from selecting now and letting scum know when it happens. I think over the course of the next few days, let a vig decide when he thinks it is best to dispose of it, with as you said, an anti-town player.

That is my initial thoughts, I'll read on to see what everyone else comes up with.

[I Am Innocent]

[*]If a person with an ability is killed at any point in the game, that ability is removed from gameplay.
[*]Action Resolution follows a simplified Natural Action Resolution, with the Cycling Choice Action appended to the the end of the list. Meaning abilities will be passed after Kills resolve.[/list]

All caught up and think I am starting to understand this better.

I revise my earlier post based on MoI's post and the rules here. No point for the holder of the tree stump to tell who he is sending it to beforehand, and kills during the night phase happen prior to the handoff.

Being that the tree stump is not a really pro-town role, claims on who it was sent to should be made the following day. Of course the lack of voting would also give it away...

[I Am Innocent]

Currently I'm not liking Muh, a couple of posts and no content; I'm also not liking quadz based on his "scumslip" vote on paramas nulltell.

I'm not too keen on the idea of a massclaim early on, however removing anti-town abilities early on could prove beneficial then the scum would be left guessing as to what is in game and where...

Also the spud has a "time limit" of X amount of posts for those who missed it... I would guess that the trigger is around 150~250 posts.

Oh and something about this post just didn't sit well with me...

[I Am Innocent]

I'm also getting town vibes from Parama, even more than usual in this game.

Why do you feel this way? Throwing out that you get town feelings from someone and not explaining seems scummy to me. You're just trying to appear as if you're contributing to town, when you're actually not at all.

Do you think Diddin taking a stance on an early player of interest is scummy?

[I Am Innocent]

Now we can stop voting me and start voting someone who's legitimately scummy. Like, y'know

vote: WrathChild

MOD: Can you confirm that the votecount is 100% correct? There's no one voting ckd yet he has a vote on him, and there's one person voting URoE yet he has two votes on him.

I don't doubt that it's accurate - at the very least, I expected there to be a doublevoting power in this game - but I just want to have it mod-confirmed.

Why is he "legitimately scum?" I'm more suspicious of you. You didn't bother to seek a clarification on your abilities, which you should've done if you were town. Instead, you passed it off to somebody, continuously posted short one-liners, and got that person killed. P.S. He's town! Good job wasting what could've been rather useful. You suspected him of being scum under what notion, exactly? Seems just like your WrathChild vote. Little substance, just accusations of someone being scum.

These lines are causing me to

"Instead, you passed it off to somebody"
"Good job wasting what could've been rather useful."

What was he supposed to do, hold onto it? Not sure where you are going with this...

[I Am Innocent]

With muh flipping town

VOTE: Parama

I'm going to believe muh on that one

Ummmmm... why? What does his alignment have to do with how accurate his (highly-OMGUSy) read was?

I agree with that statement. Factor in how mul had the chance to move the bomb but did not reduces his cred even more in my eyes...

[I Am Innocent]

- If we can find one or two confirmed townies later into the game, we can have them pass it back and forth. Then again, we'd need more than two in case of mafia NK... I digress. See also: role conditions. If the player doesn't say "I'm the Tree Stump" in thread, whether they have it or not, the ability doesn't go into use. I don't think we should get rid of it. At all.
.
.
.

UNVOTE

because my read has since nullified. I'm tempted to vote diddin, as I find him scummy, but I'll wait until I post again to lay a vote alongside my own portion to the scumcase.

If you vote out Diddin D1, doesn't his Dayvig power go away? Doesn't that contradict the above statement about getting rid of a power role?

[I Am Innocent]

FTR, I have played one game each with Diddin, Parama, and Red Coyote, they were all town and I do not see any material differences in playing style. I lean towards town on all three of these.

I am als in a game currently with the crazier half of Saint, which I still do not know his allegiance (5 town vs 1 scum remaining in that game), but he is playing the same crazy way he is here.

EC, Ant, theman are the three who have jumped out at me as the most scummy.

WC seems to be an easy target (Diddin, remember Kiari from our game together?) so I am willing to give this player some more time.

Side note, I agreed with most of quadz's post 240, then some of the players he questions that I totally agreed with the line of questioning (EC, theman) were not in his top 3. A bit suspicious.

Moving my RVS Vote:

unvote
vote: Ethereal Cookie

[I Am Innocent]

My 2 cents...Implosion had no reason to out the power that he did other than in town interest.

Scum would know they would be a target D1/N1 based on trying to get this anti town role out of the game.

Scum would not lie about the power because they know a town would get the role and verify D2 (unless they and the power were DK'd or NK'd).

Scum Implosion would have kept this power quiet and just subtly passed it on N1.

Town Implosion would have brought this up to the group D1.

The biggest problem now though is getting rid of this power. Based on above, I don't want to get rid of this power on a player that is probably a townie. But can we afford to wait, esp if Diddin is NK'd and his power lost to the void (or whatever happens to it)?

I am sure we have some protection role(s), and I would think that they would consider protecting Diddin with a 50% to 75% likelihood.

PS - Still out of state with family for the holidays, can hopefully chip in more after the new year.

[I Am Innocent]

wait, was he scum or town?

ebwop, the mod said he was a townie. I got confused by the town alignment being named after the mod :S

where did the mod say that?

AntB,

Eruci

altered to

Neutral Survivor

, executed by The Judges Day 1.

---

Day One Continues.

oooh I see..."Name, Eruci altered to Survivor"...

I read it as "Name, Mod altered to Survivor".....

Wondering if your confusion with the word Eruci is tied to another team's allegiance...

[I Am Innocent]

Count me in the group that understands why WC is getting so much attention, but would still prefer EC over him.

Obv Diddin should not shoot until said player has had a chance to claim.

[I Am Innocent]

He's posted... pretty much a whole lot of nothing really. His last post may be a chainsaw, but those read null without a flip.

Unless there are some serious objections, I'm gonna go ahead and shoot Helghast. I'll support a lynch of Wrath today instead as Helghast is screaming vigbait to me quite a bit.

Count me as a 2nd who has not seen anything scummy about Helghast. What is the reasoning there?

As for EC, his attack on Parama was all over the place. He attacked him for passing the Bomb off, the alternative was to keep it. I questioned him on this and did not care for the response.

Quite a few people have said EC. If you are not going to switch to EC, my vote is to keep it on the player who has claimed no power (WC) before Helghast.

[I Am Innocent]

My 2 cents...Implosion had no reason to out the power that he did other than in town interest.

Scum would know they would be a target D1/N1 based on trying to get this anti town role out of the game.

Scum would not lie about the power because they know a town would get the role and verify D2 (unless they and the power were DK'd or NK'd).

Scum Implosion would have kept this power quiet and just subtly passed it on N1.

Town Implosion would have brought this up to the group D1.

The biggest problem now though is getting rid of this power. Based on above, I don't want to get rid of this power on a player that is probably a townie. But can we afford to wait, esp if Diddin is NK'd and his power lost to the void (or whatever happens to it)?

I am sure we have some protection role(s), and I would think that they would consider protecting Diddin with a 50% to 75% likelihood.

- Going to have to say that I disagree with a the bulk of this post. How can you come to a 100% conclusion that scum!implosion or town!implosion would or wouldn't do without a shred of doubt? Your post isn't exactly convincing. It's hardly even worth two cents. any!implosion had every reason to out this ability if he ever intended on using it. The Tree Stump has to declare being the Tree Stump in order for it to go into effect; certainly, it eliminates a vote, but it's D1 for crying out loud. either!implosion could steer to his own motives with this ability, it's really not all that indicative of his alignment. The mod did say the abilities were given at random. I digress, I'm of the opinion that either!implosion would out this ability to use it and have a free pass D1 whilst also getting a massive amount of heat on and off of him. Not to say this isn't all noteworthy, but your speech to confirm implosion's townieness looks purely scum motivated to look entirely too town. Especially with the obvtips to protect the vigpower, an obviously pro-town and highly desired ability.

FoS

!~

Okay, let me rephrase, if I was scum, I would keep quiet on this unless/until I was up for lynch. Considering there were 25 people to start D1, that means randomly we are all at 4% likely to get lynched....which is not very likely at all.

This is how I catch scum, by thinking what I would and wouldn't do in a situation if I were scum.

Here are a couple of lines I had objections with above:
1) "Your post isn't exactly convincing. It's hardly even worth two cents." First sentence is entirely okay, your opinion and all. But the 2nd sentence, why the attack? Scum like to do this to discredit players. Noted.

2) "any!implosion had every reason to out this ability if he ever intended on using it." Every reason? I just gave a reason why it does not benefit Scum Implosion to come out, which is that any daykilling powers would be very tempting to kill him. Do you disagree with this? It appears so as you even admit later a player outting this power would get "a massive amount of heat on" him. Why the contradiction?

3) "The Tree Stump has to declare being the Tree Stump in order for it to go into effect; certainly, it eliminates a vote, but it's D1 for crying out loud." Yes, which is more of a reason not to declare it. There was a 96% random chance that Implosion was not going to be the lynch today...why bring it up at all? I wouldn't if I was scum. Are you saying scum chkflip would outted the tree stump power?

4) "Not to say this isn't all noteworthy, but your speech to confirm implosion's townieness looks purely scum motivated to look entirely too town." So are you saying my "speech" was pro-town? Before you said it wasn't worth 2 cents? Please clarify which one it is.

5) "Especially with the obvtips to protect the vigpower, an obviously pro-town and highly desired ability." Well considering one player already said that "No doc is going to protect you...if a doc would protect you he is an idiot" it didn't feel so obvious to me. And notice I did not say 100% protection, this puts doubt in the mafia's head. 'Do I want to risk trying to get the dayvig power out of the game at 25% - 50% no protection or do I want to ensure my NK?' See, there is a difference.

- IAI fluffs some "pro-town" opinion-vomit 373 with some added attention to EC on top of a claim tip that reads more scum than town to me,

especially

after diddin's 398 insisting for no more claims D1. Obviously we have strong contradicting opinions here. I agree that more claiming shouldn't happen unless the player claiming deems it necessary.

For someone who just FOS'd me, you sure do think I say alot of pro-town stuff in my posts.

Here's a hint buddy, Post 373 comes before Post 398. But next time I'll check my crystal ball before I post.

"Obviously we have strong contradicting opinions here. I agree that more claiming shouldn't happen unless the player claiming deems it necessary." I am curious, can you provide a situation when a player about to be killed might deem it not necessary to claim??? I mean there must be situations since we have "strong contradicting opinions here."

In post 400, IAI completely overrides the aforementioned opinion for claims.

He's posted... pretty much a whole lot of nothing really. His last post may be a chainsaw, but those read null without a flip.

Unless there are some serious objections, I'm gonna go ahead and shoot Helghast. I'll support a lynch of Wrath today instead as Helghast is screaming vigbait to me quite a bit.

Count me as a 2nd who has not seen anything scummy about Helghast. What is the reasoning there?

As for EC, his attack on Parama was all over the place. He attacked him for passing the Bomb off, the alternative was to keep it. I questioned him on this and did not care for the response.

Quite a few people have said EC. If you are not going to switch to EC, my vote is to keep it on the player who has claimed no power (WC) before Helghast.

"In post 400, IAI completely overrides the aforementioned opinion for claims." Where did I do that? Did I say to kill a target without allowing a chance to claim? No I did not. Please explain what you meant here.

- Further deflects attetion to EC, "not getting" Helghast (basically the same reason he's against WC vigbait) and now provides minimal reason to vig EC intead. Not looking too town to me. At all.

Have you read the thread, or just "back to page 13"? Because there was alot going on with Parama/EC earlier in the game.

I'll put my reasons for EC in another post. I already mentioned the back and forth with Parama that just seemed off. It really is the most bizarre thing I have seen today.

As for WC, I admit his birthday non vote on Diddin was scummy and something I plan to keep an eye on. Hence why I'd push him before Helghast. But as Diddin can attest in a prior game about my scumhunting tactics, the first thing or two that draws a ton of heat usually leads to scum going after easy targets. Hence why I am looking at EC (for going after Parama) and those going after WC may need a look too.

As for Helghast, I read his ISO and he really has done nothing. I 100% agree with RC that at this point in the game, unless we are nearing LyLo, there is no reason not to have a vote out there on the player you find most scummy or in need of heat.

[scum IAI trying to look protown]Remember, if we force everyone to take a stance and vote, that means the scum have to do it too. They can't lay low, they have to make choices and we will better be able to figure them out later in the game based on stances and voting patterns.[/scum IAI trying to look protown]

[I Am Innocent]

AntB,

Eruci

altered to

Neutral Survivor

, executed by The Judges Day 1.

3 Posts and less than 90 minutes later (after Eruci vote count and AntB saying he's dead):

mod, I actually can probably figure out the rest of this game without AntBs original alignment, but can we find out what cycling power died with him? I feel like concealing that info gives more advantage to the scum faction than the town one, since they have more info about the available powers than we do.

Very next post, 1 minute after the previous one:

ebwop, the mod said he was a townie. I got confused by the town alignment being named after the mod :S

Just over 7 hours after AntB died, another player mentioning AntB was town:

Alright, AntB was town so I checked who's voted him and it's been CKD and powerrox so I'm gonna read them both in ISO and post my thoughts.

Mod comes in and has opportunity to correct himself, and does not...only clarifies a lack of power by AntB (9 hours after AntB died):

All powers that are eliminated on deaths will be revealed as was done with muh316's death. An absence of mention of lost power, such as in AntB's case, signifies that they were not carrying any ability when they died.

Then comes three posts in a row by ckd, not only questioning the mod which pops did, but other players as well. This was the main difference in my mind and what struck me as more odd than what pops did right after the flip:

AntB,

Eruci

altered to

Neutral Survivor

, executed by The Judges Day 1.

---

Day One Continues.

wait, was he scum or town?

ebwop, the mod said he was a townie. I got confused by the town alignment being named after the mod :S

where did the mod say that?

Alright, AntB was town so I checked who's voted him and it's been CKD and powerrox so I'm gonna read them both in ISO and post my thoughts.

I am missing it..how do you know he is town?

AntB,

Eruci

altered to

Neutral Survivor

, executed by The Judges Day 1.

---

Day One Continues.

oooh I see..."Name, Eruci altered to Survivor"...

I read it as "Name, Mod altered to Survivor".....

In all reality though, Pop's original slip could also be a scum tell and should probably be worth keeping an eye on. Just during my initial read, ckd's jumped out at me more...

[I Am Innocent]

mod, I actually can probably figure out the rest of this game without AntBs original alignment, but can we find out what cycling power died with him? I feel like concealing that info gives more advantage to the scum faction than the town one, since they have more info about the available powers than we do.

Pops, rereading this made me have the following questions:
1) What did you exactly mean that "I actually can probably figure out the rest of this game without AntBs original alignment"
2) What did you exactly mean "I feel like concealing that info gives more advantage to the scum faction than the town one, since they have more info about the available powers than we do."

Thinking about this more from my end:
1) Assuming just 2 factions, scum would know that AntB was not on there team and wouldn't care about this information which you did not. As a townie / Eruci, had the mod not told me AntB's alignment, I would have wanted to know that. But this was not the case with you.

2) I am also wondering if it is more beneficial to scum to know lost power roles than town. Like a cop or doctor role....us losing them and not knowing about them does not hurt the town imo, but that knowledge could help the scum decide whether or not to try to take out a player with the dayvig or not.

[I Am Innocent]

Sincere apology to all for my lack of posts recently. I had a large open game that just ended that took up a bit of my time recently, and another newbie game that is in a critical stage right now that requires a reread.

I see the deadline is either next Wednesday or Thursday. I will try to catch up in the next couple of days and will promise not to sign on to any new games until I reestablish myself here.

@ Mod, you list the deadline as Wednesday January 13th. The 13th is a Thursday, so which is it?

[I Am Innocent]

I think what happened here was he read it as 'The Mod altered AntB to Neutral Survivor' since Eruci is the mod name in this game. I'm more suspicious of pops' reaction in that situation.

That's the same misread I made. I just didn't explain it in as much detail because I'm not as paranoid.

So does this mean you find CKD suspicious?

I like MOI's Post 476, particularly his arguments against Pops.

@MOD – Please confirm that Mafia members are prohibited from trying to pass a Cycling Power to a player they will use their Factional kill on.

@Pops

– I’ll be addressing your responses that started at 445 but as I addressed above a large part of your arguments about Diddin as scum eliminating the abilities I think are invalid. In 1040 when NoPoint as scum was passed the Vig power he was prevented from passing it to either myself or LMP (the Factional and Vig shots that night). I don’t see anything in Mod’s rules the demonstrate this process had changed. If I am correct in my thoughts than any argument that follows the line that 'we lynch Diddin if we think he is scum because he'll just pass the ability to a dead player' are invalid.

That's not anywhere in the rules of this game. I'll be rather upset if it's an "invisible" rule.

Why, maybe it is a scenario the mod overlooked? Wouldn't a ruling in that fashion be protown, so why be upset?

Lurking is a weak scumtell and generally a promise not to be readable for the rest of the game. I will target a lurker if I don't find someone significantly scummier in the town. (They have to be significantly scummier, to overrule the other reason for lynching lurkers, that they tend not to be readable for the entire game).

My philosophy on lurkers is that 1) they are easy targets for scum to go after and 2) if they are town and lurking, chances are they are usually disinterested and will be replaced. So attacking lurkers early on in the game, like D1, seems either counter-productive, or scummy.

We'll disagree then. I think connecting players before actually identifying them as scum is massively difficult and take no stock in it.

You disagree with me too then. Not saying that the game is in the bag with this technique, but even randomly lynching people we will stumble on a scum or two along the way. At that point, you have CONFIRMED INNOCENTS of anyone who passed a power to them, or got a power passed from them. This could be huge at endgame, and to take "no stock" in it feels scummy.

You should go hang out with chkflip and read past games and wikis so you two can skip reading rules and lose games. You had pages and pages to clarify this point, and now your mistake has wasted a lot of time and energy.

The first sentence I find very scummy. Trying to discredit other players is a favorite tell I use to catch scum.

Side note, I agreed with most of quadz's post 240, then some of the players he questions that I totally agreed with the line of questioning (EC, theman) were not in his top 3. A bit suspicious.

I didn't have anything else to say about my top 3 than what I had already said. Not much else to it.[/area]

Does this mean the expanded Top X list of yours would have included these players that you questioned in 240?

diddin, IAI's catch on ckd is not a good catch. I think that's a completely understandable misunderstanding.

That is to still be determined. Let's just say I will be watching both he and Pops a little closer now.

chkflip: post 417 is a pretty solid post. Town points for that one.

Reading IAI's response post, perhaps it's not as strong as I first thought. Well done, IAI.

Thanks for the reminder. I went back and saw chkflip did post since my rebuttal to him, but said nothing about my response. Just voted for Pops on Page 19. A quick ISO shows nothing since either, just a counter argument to MOI.

Still catching up, will hopefully finish up tonight.

[I Am Innocent]

The reason I was emphasizing the uselessness of connections without scumflips is because we'll have tons of connection info off cycles,

but we have a treestump ability that makes it harder for us to get that first scumflip

. MoI wants to leave the treestump ability around so we can get even more connection info. To me, that's like going out to buy more sugar when you have 3 bags of sugar for your lemonade and no lemons. (the sugar being the connection info we'll get anyway, the lemons being that first scumflip that gets easier once the treestump ability is removed from the game).
(For the sake of wordcount, I'll leave you to read my old posts if you want an explanation of how the treestump makes it hard to lynch scum)

What does the treestump ability have to do with nailing a scum?

I still have 9 pages to read, and I assume you can find your old post faster than me...

@I AM If CKDs slip jumped @ you more then why are you not voting him? EC is scummier?

At the time yes, but as I am catching up on my reading and gathering my notes, I think I found some scummier players. My vote will likely switch once I am officially caught up.

assuming that implosion is telling the truth he's unkillable therefore Diddin's kill would not work.

Not so. I believe that implosion has declared unlynchable, not unkillable.

Yeah yeah yeah. So I missed it. He clarified it. Why are you making it out into a big deal? And why are you not worried about CHK and I AM who supposedly missed it as well?

I missed that? I'm curious to see where. I'll admit I played along into whoever said that the Tree Stump ability had to declare in thread, but I never was under the impression he was unkillable, only unlynchable and voteless like he said.

As for EC, the fact that he hasn't voted for anyone but Parama all game is a little off-putting. He's been updating his justification for that vote and while I feel that his justifications are largely wrong I get it at least shows that he's trying. Thing is, it could be trying to find scum, or it could be trying to look like he's scumhunting. I wouldn't oppose his vigging and would probably support his lynch. I realise that this probably amounts to fence sitting on EC, but there are others I'm more interested in and would rather commit myself to those than take a cast iron stance on EC.

Caught my eye a bit...

Vote Powerrox93

Other scum reads at the moment: Nero Cain. diddin. Less so, themanhimself and EC.

Esp since this is about where I would expect a scum to put his scum teammate on. In the Less so pile.

I also think that Diddin should examined a bit closer because essentially he limited his Vig targets to only myself and Helghast, he refused to kill EC. It seems to be a safe-scum play to limit the vig targets as he did. While he made it appear that we had a choice, it was win-win for Diddin IF he is scum.

QFT

Lastly, powerrox is just incredibly anti-town. He's very clearly our resident VI, and so I will UNVOTE: and...

VOTE: powerrox.

I am in favor of removing VI's and anti-town players early, because I'd rather get rid of them while we still can (as in, when we're not in lylo or a similar situation.)

To me, VI is really misguided town, which is setting off alarm bells telling me you'd like to take care of easy mislynches first.

QFT

I hate to be the guy that says this, but we've had

three

townie deaths today..... maybe a no lynch wouldn't be such a bad idea?

scummy

Saturday I will be fully here though! <3

As I am catching up here on Saturday night, I will make sure I am on the lookout.

Do you have a post-restriction for retarded jpegs making retarded points or is that just your normal vernacular?

hey asshat...I am caught up, I need to reread given the new information...why arent you doing that???!?!? of course, you probably missed that too didnt you...you know what I am tired of...you saying shit that isnt true, then backtracking when you are called out for it...at first I thought is a mistake...but you have done it 2-3 times now

unvote, vote Nero Cain.

you have done absolutely NOTHING protown in the game...you bitch that I havent put forth any content, but you have done JACK SHIT....not to mention, I bet you havent checked my other current games to see if (i dont know) actually didnt have time to post earlier this week...

you are not scum hunting only coasting by

^^^^^way to defensive for a townie.

QFT

My mind has actually been changed on Powerrox.

That was quick. Just a few votes can do that to a man I guess...

What page are you on now and what are your current scum reads?

Whatever page it was that you posted this. Will have scum reads in a minute. My notes have 6 leading candidates.

I still don't understand this phrase, "easy target", that I've heard all across mafiascum. What does it mean?

Easy Targets to me are either 1) the players who cannot express themselves effectively. Saint, who I am in my 2nd game with him now, is a good example of that. 2) People that aren't around to defend themselves.

Aren't scum easier to attack than other players? So then wouldn't being an easy target be correlated with being scummy? So why would it ever be used as an argument, ever?

How are scum, unless they out themselves as scum, easier to attack than other players (sorry to answer your question with a question, but I really have no idea how you came up with that one)? Until I understand that, I can't answer the other two questions here.

PS - Note to self, not thrilled with Darla's catch up post and votes to date.

[I Am Innocent]

Top 6 Scum Suspects, in no particular order: Pops, Chkflip, CKD, EC/nahmmen, TMH, q21.

[I Am Innocent]

unvote
Vote: themanhimself

Only suspect of mine with more than 1 vote currently.

[I Am Innocent]

I still have 9 pages to read, and I assume you can find your old post faster than me...

Ctrl F and posts by user can get you far.

Yeah I am aware, and if I didn't feel like reading through another 4 pages of iso after my 11 pages total of catchup the last day or so, I would have done so.

Anyhow, the treestump ability prevents scum from being lynched and prevents townies (who tend to vote for scum more than scum do) from voting). If we want to lynch a treestump player, we're put off a day. Or wagons on scum might not gain the steam they deserve because a townie doesn't have a vote.

The ability basically damages day game, which is all VTs have.

1) Prevents scum from being lynched - I say it pushes it off one day. I also say there are more than 1 scum likely. You can still find them. Weak argument
2) Prevents town from voting - Well if a town player has the tree stump, it also prevent said town player from being lynched, so theoretically the mafia that day have a better chance of being lynched ratio wise. And early in the game, I don't think one townie vote is going to stop a scum wagon that often. Weak Argument

The worst argument for the tree stump is how it pushes up LyLo one day. We can get rid of it now (or could have with the dayvig), but I am of the mindset to keep it now. I like the scum matching thing and the more of that we have, the more valuable it is than the possibility we may push up LyLo one day. (Multiple Confirmed Innocents > Add 1 day to LyLO imo).

@ attacks
They should have valid scumtells that are reasons to attack them. Because they're scum.

It's that easy huh. Can you list the players in this game that have valid scumtells and tell me what those scumtells are?

@IAI: How about you post your own content instead of just QFTing posts you agree with?

Reasons for my QFT
1) I was 11 pages behind and most of the topics of discussion where already discussed. Note I did add a few items, look at how q21 responded to EC, nobody mentioned that.
2) In a big game like this, the QFT let's me go back and ISO myself to make sure I am not forgetting something I earlier suspected. Never played in a game this big that I did alot of/any rereads.
3) I am taking a stance by saying where I stand on issues. Stances are good for town, bad for scum.

@IAI: How about you post your own content instead of just QFTing posts you agree with?

I also already said I didn't want to force another claim. I already had two popular candidates for vigging who claimed (I believe WC and Helghast had both claimed at the time. Feel free to correct me) no power. I did not want to risk outing a powerful town PR. I don't know how many times I've explained it.

You explained it, but like others have said, it seemed very opportunistic. Esp now that we know that one of those was town. The other feels town to me now, so it would be beneficial to scum to use that as an excuse to ensure an extra town death.

The first thing I saw is that three town aligned players are dead, and it might be useful to know if they died holding abilities. In fact, from my quick skim of the first 6 pages, I saw that muh died because of an ability that he was given, so now I am assuming that abilities are not revealed. I hope we haven't lost anything useful. I guess

Second player on my suspect list to ask this question. Noted.

[I Am Innocent]

So you have a town read on powerrox?

No, more of a null read at this point.

CHK's bandwagon is scummy as hell.

I agree. I'd switch my vote in a heart beat for that wagon.

I should probably just replace out, but screw that.

I've seen you at endgame, so I'd prefer you not.

that's cool.

Ummm, can you or Parama explain to this guy what is going on?

[I Am Innocent]

SC why you doublevotin'

Ahh, so based on historical votes, we figured SC's vote counts double?

[I Am Innocent]

/Claim secret doublevoter


I can prove it, by the next WC their should a vote on saint and one less on TMH

Does this power cycle?

[I Am Innocent]

I am curious to know about this bus driving ability. Does it just switch two powers like TMH is suggesting, or do all powers get randomly distributed?

Also @ everyone that pushed for a lynch of Powerox with his ability, do you still think that was a pro-town move?

Everyone that voted for him or pushed his lynch after he claimed is high on my suspect list.

I also would like to hear the multiple reasons TMH said he had for wanting that role out of the game?

As MOI said, now that is out of the game, there is no reason not to answer that.

[I Am Innocent]

All powers in this game cycle except the scum nightkill.

His power is antitown, it's more useful for endgame quickhammering than it is for letting townies get more say in the lynch, since it's more about exposing who's scum than having enough voting power to take the player down.

Feel oh so free to hammer this guy.

TMH is the winner, but here is your runner up. Two posts after the claim, the first post being mine where I ask if it Cycles.

TMH has a very pro town role, and I agree that he probably kept it to buy himself some time. He is the lynch tomorrow.

This is my vote today:

vote popsofctown

[I Am Innocent]

Magnaofillusion’s Guide to How to Handle Cycling Powers

–

What to do Day 2 (after the first Night)

–

If you had a Cycling Power that you pasted on N1 claim so in your first post. DO NOT say who you passed it to or what the power was.

Exceptions

–

Diddin should claim who he passed the Dayvig Power to and explain why.
Implosion should claim who he passed the Treestump Power to and explain why.

If you had a Cycling Power that gave you a result that provides positive information for Town (a Cop Guilty, a Hider target that didn’t cause you to die) you should also claim your Power and the result so the information isn’t possibly lost. Note for this purpose I don’t consider Cop Innocent results or Player X went nowhere results as positive information.

If you received a Cycling Power after N1 (or after any Night)

– Say nothing about that.

Exceptions

–

If you received the Dayvig or Treestump Powers they are going to be self-evident so claim you received them to confirm Diddin / Implosion’s story.

What do to Day 3 (after the second Night and every successive Night)

–

If you passed a Cycling Power N1 and did not reveal who you passed it to Day 2 do so in your first post of Day 3. Said play should be confirming they passed an ability N2 and thus confirm your story.

If you had a Cycling Power that you passed on N2 claim so in your first post. DO NOT say who you passed it to or what the power was.

If you received a Cycling Power after N2

– Say nothing.

The same exceptions apply and new ones may develop as the game progresses.

Lather, rinse, repeat and establish links for endgame

I agree with this.

I did not have a power D1, so I passed on nothing.

[I Am Innocent]

@StrangerCoug: Pass the virus to me,

I want to look at it

. I can give it right back if you like. I can't explain why, sorry.

Underlined seems shady. If I was scum, I'd probably want to know what this reoccurring virus was all about too.

For the record, if someone gets the virus, and we somehow never see it again, that person is scum. The virus should be used as a lynch. Scum could pass it betwixt themselves perpetually and have it never go off until the day ends, (well that was my concern, and something I'd like to check when I get it)(I had another more secretive concern but I realized it doesn't matter. Oh well).

First of all, why would you announce that in the thread, the strategy for scum to pass it back and forth. FOS.

Second of all, it does matter. This oh I have a secret reason, oh wait nevermind it doesn't matter isn't going to fly. You got it passed to you, I want to know why you wanted it.

We need to pick someone scummy to give the virus to, and tell that person they'll eat it and like it. If they refuse we give the virus to someone else, and then lynch the person who refused to eat the virus, since that person would eat the virus if they realized refusing to do so would only cause us to waste a lynch on them. This process isn't nearly as good as a real daykill, unfortunately, but it's better than killing a lurker just-because.

Viralvote:DarlaBlueEyes

Ah, Day 2's easy target. I am not biting. D1 it was Helghast and Powerox. How about we go after the people who pushed Powerox's lynch, like you?

@Parama suicide: Let's not let Parama touch the virus. As confident as Parama is that he has the entire game read perfectly, I don't have that confidence in him and I doubt everyone else does.

So instead let's give it to more people that haven't seen the virus and know what it does. Not Pro-town.

Question, do you really think Parama was going to self-suicide?

[I Am Innocent]

I already claimed to have had the Firewall/Doc ability and passed it on the towniest player - therefore I am not claiming who I gave it to because then the scumboni will know who our doc is.

If you had a Cycling Power that you pasted on N1 claim so in your first post.

DO NOT say who you passed it to or what the power was

.

Reading Fail.

[I Am Innocent]

I do. You'll never know unless you let me do it, right?

Nah scum Parama isn't going to do it, and town Parama is a crazy player, but not suicidal. No chance imo.

[I Am Innocent]

Here is what I have to date.

LynchMePls
RedCoyote
themanhimself - D1, Busdriver Ability, passed it along to Diddin.
Lateralus22

[

TheLonging

]

WrathChild
curiouskarmadog
quadz08
Nero Cain
DarlaBlueEyes

[

Narsis

]

q21
diddin - D1 Dayvig, power taken by themanhimself
popsofctown - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Bunnylover

[

SnakePlissken

]

[

danGR

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
I Am Innocent - D1 Nothing
StrangerCoug

[

UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

]

- D1 Nothing
Parama - D1 Nothing
Implosion - D1 Treestump, passed it to curiouskarmadog
nhammen

[

EtherealCookie

]

Saint

Dead Players:

muh316 - D1 Watcher (died with him)
AntB - D1 Nothing
Helghast - D1 Nothing
Powerrox93 - D1 Double Voter (died with him
MagnaOfIllusion - D1 Nothing
chkflip - D1 Ability Remover (died with him)

[I Am Innocent]

I'm not going to risk it.

I caused StrangerCoug to have the virus. The daykill is protown, as is pseudolynching with the virus so I selected the player

I felt most likely to survive the night

but who still had a town feel.

My original choice though,

was MoI, with similar logic

.

These two do not line up, but nice try.

I spent so much time combing through his posts during my decisionmaking process and so little with Coug's smaller opportunity that I mistakenly thought I had passed my ability to MoI, sending it to the void. When Coug claimed he had the ability, I was very confused, and I wanted to see if it was the same virus Parama started the game with. If it was, it implied a bus driver.

I felt really stupid when just a few minutes later I remembered considering StrangerCoug as an option, and then subsequently decided that posting volume is correlated with nightkillability and that I should target Coug instead of MoI.

Crazy how that memory getting jogged just at the right time works so nicely, huh?

How about you get back to the part where you tell us why you got to cause StrangerCougar to get the virus? What did the mod tell you the reason was that you were picked for it?

@saying that explaining how to misuse the ability as scum is suspicious: What the heck? I had to give StrangerCoug a reason to pass back and forth with me, and since people like you exist and make me claim things that dont need claiming, justify my actions. That's why I revealed that info. Any scum who can't figure out that strategy on their own is braindead.

So it is okay to tell scum strategy because they probably aren't braindead. No, doesn't work that way.

Further more, if I AM scum, already know the strategy! If I were scum I would have shared it last night with all my partners in case they get infected, since everyone suspected the virus might come back. The fact you pointed out antitown behavior but didn't realize that it doesn't make sense in any way for actually showing me to be scum makes me suspect you know that I'm town.

Ah, the OMGUS FOS. Yeah I've been riding you a while, figured this was coming.

Giving the scum pro scum ideas is bad for town and should never be done. You did it which implies you either didn't realize that, or you did but don't care. If you don't care, it probably means you are scum.

Did you ever think that the scum would not be able to hide the virus unless they started the day with the virus??? You could have made the suggestion to use the virus as a 2nd lynch without ever bringing up the back and forth between scum. If the bomb disappeared, or someone mysteriously died, we track the recipients.

SC, who did you pass it to? Pops, okay.

Pops, who did you pass it to?

Lather, Rinse, Repeat until you find the scum.

[I Am Innocent]

TMH is scum. Remind me again how directing a vig power to yourself is protown? Also, he passed me his ability. It's pretty much a "busdriver" ability that I can only imagine mafia would have.

Vote: themanhimself

Also posting townreads and the like is NOT a scumtell like you seem to think. You obviously haven't realized that Parama does stuff like this regardless of alignment.

For implosion.

[I Am Innocent]

As of Post 949.

LynchMePls - D1 Nothing
RedCoyote
themanhimself - D1, Busdriver Ability, passed it along to Diddin.
Lateralus22

[

TheLonging

]

WrathChild - D1 Nothing
curiouskarmadog
quadz08 - D1, Hibernate Ability, passed it along.
Nero Cain
DarlaBlueEyes

[

Narsis

]

- D1, Firewall Ability, passed it along.
q21
diddin - D1 Dayvig, power taken by themanhimself
popsofctown - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Bunnylover

[

SnakePlissken

]

[

danGR

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
I Am Innocent - D1 Nothing
StrangerCoug

[

UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

]

- D1 Nothing
Parama - D1 Nothing
Implosion - D1 Treestump, passed it to curiouskarmadog
nhammen

[

EtherealCookie

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Saint - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.

Dead Players:

muh316 - D1 Watcher (died with him)
AntB - D1 Nothing
Helghast - D1 Nothing
Powerrox93 - D1 Double Voter (died with him
MagnaOfIllusion - D1 Nothing
chkflip - D1 Ability Remover (died with him)

[I Am Innocent]

Five players still need to chime in on their D1 power or lack of power. Please do so ASAP.

Also, I did not see any mention from MOI's post about what to do with players who passed an ability onto a player who died. Is this something we should discuss D2 so we can easily track roles still in the game/not in the void? I am leaning towards yes but I want to make sure I am not missing anything.

[I Am Innocent]

I can not perform a night action, and I actually don't have to pass this ability to anyone else.

Yet someone passed it to you N1?

Does it have any restrictions such as mafia passing it to other mafia?

1) I thought their was only 1 VT in this game (got confused with a game I recently joined which only has 1 VT role).

I looked at your profile and there are way to many threads. So a game like this would have roughly how many pages currently???

2) Since MoI died and it showed he possessed no abilities, I thought he passed his ability to me, since in my mind, after reading my new role pm, you could pass your VTness.

Bottom line is I forgot that the cycle is Abilities -> Kills -> Cycle Abilities.

So then why would chkflp not have passed his power in your mind, yet rather died with it?

I actually have one more reason I thought this, but this would be outting the power I had last night. The reason I haven't just outed out is because I feel if I had thought about it, my first line of thinking is wrong.

Yeah please do not out the power. You hint at a role today though, and you should not be killed without a chance to claim.

[I Am Innocent]

Skimming through the first page of that game, it looks like the rules say there are

at least one vanilla townie in the game

. A little different from "with a game I recently joined which

only has 1 VT role

".

#3 makes sense, though the wording seems off "then I must have thought that..." Did you forget your original thinking?

[I Am Innocent]

PS - What the heck does this mean? "you could pass your VTness."

[I Am Innocent]

posting from phone again but I am all for the virusing of bunny it makes no sense at all and the story keeps changing. granted I am the biggest wagon here, and all so maybe people don't really put as much stock in what i have to say but, I say kill that mother-frakker for lying to us, yo.

@bunny which is it DID you or DID you not receive a PM stating that you got a power cycled to you from MoI. Either way you have lied one too many times for my taste.

vote bunny

but I'd like the virus to go to him more. quicker death.

You really seem to jump on the biggest wagon each time don't you? Anything original you would like to add to the table?

[I Am Innocent]

Yea, TMH sending the day vig to himself is BAD!!!
He's tomorrow's lynch.

Yes, can I recommend no one send him a townie power role tomorrow. The Tree Stump if CKD survives the day may be worth sending to him. Not sure of any other really bad roles, but they may be worth it too.

[I Am Innocent]

I too was oonfused D1 about the vanilla role. Why he thought he got it from MOI though is the strange part. Also his inconsistency about another game (only 1 VT role when the research I did said at least 1 VT role) keeps him suspicious in my book.

Bunnylover, why did you never address that? Did I miss something later in the game about there only being 1 VT role?

[I Am Innocent]

Wrath-his and Bunny were the ones that finished off powerrox. Quick hammers are scummy.

Esp when there was no chance for any discussion about why we should consider keeping that power in the game.

Also remember TMH was the next leading wagon. If discussion went on to leave Powerox for another day, TMH was likely to go.

[I Am Innocent]

I already claimed to have had the Firewall/Doc ability and passed it on the towniest player - therefore I am not claiming who I gave it to because

then the scumboni will know who our doc is

.

She should not claim who she protected Saint based on the underlined.

What she should answer is why she did not protect MOI (without giving hints to who she passed the Firewall too)? He was the most obv town imo and a great target for a scum kill.

*************************************

@ everybody. Should we discuss what might have been sent to the void/aka, roles that were sent to MOI/chkflp? Will a lack of this discussion hurt us later? Thoughts?

I asked this already and nobody commented.

[I Am Innocent]

Im not sure what you're saying about the virus, but to the best of my understanding, i think the person who has most recently read a "you got the potato" pm will explode if the timer goes off during a pass.

Trying to figure out why you are even bringing this up if we 1) tell a person to hold the virus until they explode or 2) pass it between two scummy players. The only reason I can think of is that you are sending this out as a warning to a potential scummate. FOS.

Bunnylover, are you refusing to hold the bomb if the group thinks you are the best choice to blow up? Would it matter if we say you will be the dayvig if you do not?

[I Am Innocent]

As of Post 1054.

Players Alive with a Role D1:

themanhimself - D1, Busdriver Ability, passed it along to Diddin.
quadz08 - D1, Hibernate Ability, passed it along.
DarlaBlueEyes

[

Narsis

]

- D1, Firewall Ability, passed it along.
diddin - D1 Dayvig, power taken by themanhimself
popsofctown - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Bunnylover

[

SnakePlissken

]

[

danGR

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Implosion - D1 Treestump, passed it to curiouskarmadog
nhammen

[

EtherealCookie

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Saint - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.

Players Alive with no Role D1:

LynchMePls
Lateralus22

[

TheLonging

]

WrathChild
curiouskarmadog
Nero Cain
I Am Innocent
StrangerCoug

[

UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

]

Parama

Players Alive, still unknown about any Roles:

RedCoyote
q21

Dead Players:

muh316 - D1 Watcher (died with him)
AntB - D1 Nothing
Helghast - D1 Nothing
Powerrox93 - D1 Double Voter (died with him)
MagnaOfIllusion - D1 Nothing
chkflip - D1 Ability Remover (died with him)

[I Am Innocent]

@ mod, was it possible for any player to start the game D1 with more than one cycling power? Or did you limit it to at most, 1 cycling power per player?

@RC, q21, please in your next post say whether you had an ability D1 or not, and if so did you pass it along.

@ everybody. Should we discuss what might have been sent to the void/aka, roles that were sent to MOI/chkflp? Will a lack of this discussion hurt us later? Thoughts?

I asked this already and nobody commented.

I'm having trouble deciding either way. While there may be useful town roles in there, there may also be useful scum roles in there.

@The discussion: MoI had no abilities, so no ability went to the void. Chk ability that went to the void was the ability Remover. Their is nothing to discuss on that subject. If any abilities were sent to them, I think the mod would have informed us like he did with Chk ability.

I was actually wondering this last night. If scum sent an ability to the void, there are some implications here. Although, I think that the mod will probably return abilities sent to the void by scum quicker than other abilities, but I'm not sure whether that type of setup speculation is useful.

Here were the posts that I found that people answered my question.

A good point is brought up that roles sent to the void may not be permanently lost. So I think SC is right that maybe we should not say what roles were sent to the void quite yet. But I still think it is in the group's best interest to find out if a player sent it to MOI or Chkflp last night. Otherwise we leave a loophole that the scum could use later in the game.

*******************

@ Anyone who passed a role last night, please say if you sent it to
1) MOI
2) Chkflp
3) Someone else

[I Am Innocent]

The other good targets IMO (note that Furcolow's views are not my own and I haven't pressed my views on Furcolow) are:
*nhammen (rep. EtherealCookie)
*popsofctown
*Bunnylover
roughly in order of preference. I've wanted those first two to die, like, all game and no time is too soon.

QFT

[I Am Innocent]

Don't worry, I think there's a better consensus for that.

Agreed.

[I Am Innocent]

Diddin: I missed an earlier response you had on me where you FOS me.
1) My vote is on Parama.
2) The only reason TMH isn't getting my vote is because he holds a very powerful role in my opinon.

1) Why did you sent the virus to Saint then?

[I Am Innocent]

Wow, DBE sent me the virus, in spite of never having indicated suspicion of me, iirc

Lynch this scum.

I sent the virus to someone who I thought was scummy, but if town, wouldn't send it right back to the best of my guessing. And he's holding an antitown role so there's that.

I was gonna be mysterious but that would jack the post count. I chose diddin

So you think TMH is not scum?

[I Am Innocent]

You know if Diddin indeed has the Bus Driver Ability, that he cannot be scum teammates with TMH, right?

[I Am Innocent]

IAI’s 872 confuses me. Why is that quote scummy, exactly?

Though WC and Bunnylover followed suit with the hammering votes, this was the first post after the Powerox claim pushing for a lynch, where the correct action imo was to have a discussion first.

[I Am Innocent]

If you are in reality town, you should have given your ability to the most antitown player you could and then shot them.

This is a good strategy, but not workable. The virus has to go off before the dayvig can work.

Yes, but did he know that N1 when the decision had to be made?

[I Am Innocent]

if it has to tick to work, CKD is gonna have to be the one to bite the bullet. Or diddin. Whichever ability is more antitown. Prolly treestump

And if we get rid of TMH tomorrow and he is scum, you just killed a confirmed townie, or a chance to catch scum teammates***

***If they are teammates, CKD will not be able to send the treestump to TMH, and when someone else ends up with it, we have 2 scum.

As for the bus driver, if we know TMH is the kill D3 (he is my choice), then send that as well back to him.

Bunnylover, WC, and Darla are probably the best three choices for the bomb right now.

I do not advocate Diddin or Saint. My gut tells me people would love to have Saint (or should I say Vi) out of this game.

If I am right about pops being scum, quadz is a possible teammate. Something to keep an eye on.

[I Am Innocent]

IAI - Diddin did state in thread if I remember correctly.

Yes that was the criteria for D1, but a bomb every day to activate the vig was not something I expected, or would have N1. Did you?

[I Am Innocent]

Well, let's say that we decide to wait and lynch theman. Okay. Worst case scenario.

Darla gets stuck with the Virus and flips town.
theman shoots WC and flips town.
We lynch Saint and he flips town.
Then two more town deaths at night. That's five more townies dead.

I can almost hear sotty saying "appeal to fear" here.

I'm not saying this will all happen if we don't go after diddin now, but I am saying we shouldn't spare diddin if we think he's scum just because we want to get a town confirmation from lynching theman tomorrow. We're already on a bad footing. That said, if a majority of the town thinks diddin is honestly not a good lynch, then that's a completely different story. I'll build a case against him with pleasure.

Well my read on Diddin is more null than anything. And my guess is with TMH, or should I call him the MIA TMH, who is almost certainly to be killed D3, I would rather my null read be kept for a day, esp if we know Diddin cannot be TMH's teammate.

If the group as a whole thinks Diddin is scum and there are no other solid candidates, than yes, he should be the lynch/target.

[I Am Innocent]

The problem with lynching diddin is that if TMH passed the bus driving ability to diddin and TMH is mafia, isn't diddin confirmed town?

That's rather the point. If diddin is mafia, then TMH is confirmed town, and both of them have been scummy. If we lynch diddin today, we can clear TMH now AND remove the ability busdriver, whereas we want to wait until tomorrow to lynch TMH, since he has the dayvig. I'll go over both of them in ISO soon and see if one reeeeally stands out, but assuming they're about the same, I think that diddin should be the lynch today. It gives us more info, faster, which is reeeeeeally important right now.

Something is wrong here. TMH didn't claim to pass anything to Diddin. TMH's BD ability seems like it would override alignment restrictions. I'd like the BD ability removed from this game, but I don't think TMH has claimed who he sent it to yet.

diddin said that he received it. And quadz, I'm pretty damn sure tmh is mafia, and I'm pretty damn sure that 90% of the town is pretty damn sure that tmh is mafia, which makes a diddin lynch a mislynch. Bus driving seems like it would be a standard ability - but I'd suspect that actually using the ability could bypass passing restrictions.

Yes and three people have now pushed the Diddin lynch which is really pinging my scumdar. Quadz, Bunnylover, and RC

[I Am Innocent]

Well it appears that we have come to an agreement on who should hold the bomb between 3 people.
Myself (although I disagree on this lol).
Saint (Pefectly fine with this).
DBE (Not really seeing a reason not to keep the virus on him/her).
Other then these three people, no one name is mentioned.
We need to keep the virus between these three people.
If for some reason another person gets the virus, the previous owner should either be day kill by the vig or lynch as their is only two reason why you wouldn't keep the bomb on these three.

I think we either nail it down to 1) one candidate and ask for a claim or 2) pass it between two known suspicious vanilla players.

For #1, I stick by WrathChild, Darla, or BunnyLover. I do not stick by Diddin or Saint. There are a few more I would be okay with that I do not see gathering another steam, and a few others that I have strong town reads of but do not see being selected either.

For #2, BunnyLover has claimed Vanilla and Darla has offered to suicide which crumbs of Vanilla. They would probably be my suggestion.

I also do not suggest handing the potato to Saint. He very well could have a role, so no point to pass it there unless we go with #1 and he is the pick.

[I Am Innocent]

EBWOP: "another" should have read as "enough"

[I Am Innocent]

The other good targets IMO (note that Furcolow's views are not my own and I haven't pressed my views on Furcolow) are:
*nhammen (rep. EtherealCookie)
*popsofctown
*Bunnylover
roughly in order of preference. I've wanted those first two to die, like, all game and no time is too soon.

QFT

Don't worry, I think there's a better consensus for that.

Agreed.

So are those your four best targets for the virus? Also, why are you just agreeing instead of adding your own comments.

I got the virus and passed it to Darla, as she seems to be scummy, and more people agree about Darla than Wrath. I'd prefer if it was passed between Darla and Wrath, but I'd like to hear other peoples' ideas.

See Post 1155 for my strategy today. If you want my top scum read, it is TMH then Pops. TMH does not make sense as I want the Dayvig power to stay in the game, and Pops does not seem to be a target in most players eyes. So I gave an alternative.

Also I agree with Posts for a few reasons which I already explained earlier in the game:

@IAI: How about you post your own content instead of just QFTing posts you agree with?

Reasons for my QFT
1) I was 11 pages behind and most of the topics of discussion where already discussed. Note I did add a few items, look at how q21 responded to EC, nobody mentioned that.
2) In a big game like this, the QFT let's me go back and ISO myself to make sure I am not forgetting something I earlier suspected. Never played in a game this big that I did alot of/any rereads.
3) I am taking a stance by saying where I stand on issues. Stances are good for town, bad for scum.

Though I am no longer behind on my reading, #2 and #3 still apply.

The cycling of the ability I got works totally differently than the redirection.

Here's how it works: I pick two people. Let's call them A and B. When I use my power, any powers A would pass off instead get passed off to B. So last night, when tmh had the power, I was A and he was B.

I can then pass off the power as usual.

You can pass it off without using it though, correct? If so, that is what you are planning on doing tonight, correct?

[I Am Innocent]

DBE we don't want to know who you passed the power to.

We want to know who you protected with your powers last night

.

UNDERLINED IS NOT NEEDED TO BE KNOWN AND CAN ONLY HURT TOWN

. SECOND TIME YOU PUSHED A SCUMMY AGENDA HERE, THIS TIME AFTER I ALREADY EXPLAINED IT!

unvote Pops
Vote Bunnylover

Give the virus to Bunnylover and this time hold it. If the flip is town, I'll take the blame.

[I Am Innocent]

I can almost hear sotty saying "appeal to fear" here.

I'll let theory arguments and outguessing the Mod go on for a little while when it's of no real consequence to the game, but when you want to test these little schemes over the course of two days (we couldn't lynch diddin yesterday because he had a Vig power, now we can't lynch him because lynching someone else could "confirm" him (which is totally misleading, btw)) and put the town in peril, I'm going to put my foot down.

Scum want mislynches. Scum do not want confirmed townies. If TMH is scum, and Diddin is not, like I suspect, than my guess is scum will know that TMH is going tomorrow and

will want Diddin out while they still have a chance

.

Make sense?

[I Am Innocent]

Im confused as to why knowing who a doctor protected, who no longer has that ability, is scummy?
And I'm more then sure people asked who he protected.

Read below.

I already claimed to have had the Firewall/Doc ability and passed it on the towniest player - therefore I am not claiming who I gave it to because then the scumboni will know who our doc is.

Darla hints that she passed the Doc ability to the towniest player she knows. Also hints that she doesn't want to say who she protected because then the scum will know who our doc is. One in the same???

Saint pressed Darla on who she protected, I told Saint to back off to protect the identity of our doc.

You ignored all that, or skimmed over it, either of which you did is scummy.

[I Am Innocent]

Wow what a scummy post.

IAmInnocent, quit planning out the game based on people who have not flipped.

No I am utilizing our best tool, which is what you argued with MOI about as well. Eliminating possible scum pairings. You were against it early, and now you want to get rid of people connected to TMH when we all know TMH is going tomorrow. Scummy.

You don't know the alignments of living player.

Only a scum would know that I don't know the alignment of living players. Thanks for confirming me town.

Yes you can read people, you can try as best you can, but in the end most of the game is WIFOM, and it's difficult to ever read very far above random chances.

So let's just get out the dart board and throw away huh? Don't think so.

Speaking of random chances, one way to reduce that is through eliminating scum pairings, which you continue to try to avoid at all costs.

Unless you have some kind of godlike scumhunting record and I've still not heard of it,

Well my signature contains my W/L record on this site, so I do okay scumhunting. I also do much better at town reads, and knowing when to get rid of questionable dead weight and who to trust at end game.

you're wasting time when you discuss reads contingent on your other reads.

No, I am putting out there sound strategy. Like I did when I suggested CKD pass the treestump to TMH and we be done with TMH & the Treestump D3. We get knowledge, knowledge is good.

As for reads on other reads, are you referring to quadz being linked to you. Well it has something I have noticed for a bit, and if I go tonight, I want that on public record, so if/when you die and flip scum, there should be a trail back to him.

I mean good gosh, when I take physics tests my teachers tell me reuse known information given in the problem rather than depend on derived information, and that's with MATH. This is PSYCHOLOGY. Geez laweez. I swear I facepalm every other post you make. Maybe something like 2/3. It's ridiculous. You just think things are easy when they're not, they're really not, they're very hard. The game is hard it's all hard.

No idea what any of this is suppose to bring to the table, except that you are trying to discredit me. Noted.

BTW, where do I say things are easy? How do you know what I think? Or is that just trying to slander me as Saint would say?

Go find me one scum, ok. One. Kill that scum. Convince me and enough other people he's scum and get him lynched,

Ah so the loss of all these town are my fault. Nice try, go check my record. I was pushing TMH, not Powerox. I never pushed Helghast. I said I think DBE is being targeted as the easy guinea pig today.

You want scum dead. Take the bomb and hold it. Convinced yet?

or go steal a dayvig power from someone cause you can do that in this game,

Another bizarro line. What does any of that have to do with me? I do not have dayvig, so all I can do is voice my opinion. Which I have been doing, but I can't force people to vote my way.

or ask someone to PM you some of their old games because that seems to work in this game too. Then when that scum is dead, the mod will post a death scene. The death scene is like a cop investigation. Except you investigate living people. And the guy will be dead. And then when he's dead, we'll know he's scum. Then you can look at how what someone's alignment affects another. Cause you'll know what that alignment is. Because the mod will tell you. Until the mod tells you your guess is about as good as spelling a Wheel of Fortune sentence with only the F in "of" revealed. Which I mean if you think you're really good at it that's cool. It's just like William Tell I'll tell you you're good at it until you try to shoot an apple off my head with your skills or screw up my mafia game with your skills because this game is getting really screwed up with all this rabbit trail nonsense about what the tmh-xor-diddin scumteam will cycle, kill, want to vote, want to unvote, discuss in the QT, or who they'll ask to senior prom.
als;kjdfasjd;aldjka

More gibberish. The only thing I read on this is that you do not sound confident that TMH is scum. Is that the case? Also, do you think he is going to be killed tomorrow? If so, do you still think it is wise to take out CKD or Diddin today?

[I Am Innocent]

The reason I didn't answer those was because they seem rhetorical.
In any game, when a doctor get outted out, everyone ask who they protected.
Why is this game any difference?

Could it be the whole cycling of the ability thing? Don't you think there is a strong chance someone is going to send the ability to the player they protect. For 2 reasons, 1) they obv think that player is town & 2) no worries that the power will end up in the void as the player is protected.

You asking for it is scummy. I went back and reread and you are right, it is not definite that the two players are one in the same. But still in a game like this, that is a scummy question that I previously asked to not be answered.

So did you ignore my request, or not read over it?

[I Am Innocent]

I agree with LMP. Darla's whole "I'll eat the virus for queen and country" bit is completely anti-town. If she's town then she should be scumhunting, not agreeing to die. Her consistent refusal to answer the simple question "top 3 scum picks and why" is further proof that she's done no scumhunting this game.

Have you answered my questions from the beginning of the day? You said to MOI that there were reasons to get rid of the double voter. Well it is out of the game now so I want to know said reasons.

[I Am Innocent]

She never at any point intended to eat the virus.


Yes, IAmInnocent, I'm not sure that tmh is scum. You shouldn't be either. It's a duuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh thing.

Please provide your Top 3 scum suspects in order of scuminess.

[I Am Innocent]

CKD, assuming both you and TMH make it to the end of D2, are you going to send the Tree Stump to him N2?

@ everyone else, please do not send any pro town power roles to TMH. No excuses on his death tomorrow.

@ everyone else, is it more important to get rid of the bus ability tomorrow, or is it better to confirm that it is a standard ability?***

***Seems like the debate is that maybe this is an ability that can be passed between scum. I don't see why any night abilities would be so, esp this. Otherwise they would just pass it back and forth and steal abilities without ever telling us about the bus driving ability even existing.

Does not make sense and I think the doubt that TMH is trying to put in our heads is to take down a current suspicious townie (but future confirmed townie) with him now.

[I Am Innocent]

because I believe I can figure out the dominant strategy for this game without any help.

What have you come up with?

[I Am Innocent]

Why are you guys so sure we will have a daykill tomorrow?

This is actually a decent point. More below.

Why are you guys so sure we will have a daykill tomorrow?

I couldn't agree more with this. I was told I have an unknown limited quantity of kills left. I have a feeling tmh might not be willing to eat the virus and with no virus, no daykill. There even may be no virus tomorrow.

I'm giving tmh the Redirector ability tomorrow.

Coyote is acting scummier with every new post. He's misrepping the situation like crazy.

Here's what I say: Whether he is scum or town, we aren't lynching tmh today. So if I'm lynched, it's just an extra mislynch for us! As such, there is no way I'm willing to be lynched or killed today.

Here is what we know:
Treestump - CKD
Bus Driver - Diddin
DayVig - TMH

Options
1) We can send both Treestump and Bus Driver to TMH tomorrow, but if we do not have the dayvig and we do not have the virus/or he refuses to hold the virus, we cannot kill him until D4 (and he will have the ability to steal another power N3).

2) We can send just the Treestump to him and if no dayvig / virus, we cannot kill him until D4. Here he would not be able to mess with night abilities since no Bus Driver.

3) We can send just the Bus Driver to him and we can always lynch him if need be.

I still lean towards #2 because my guess is that the dayvig will still be in play with the amount of people we should start D3 with unless it is removed from the game. That would require TMH being killed prior to passing it. Since I think he is scum, I am going to guess that isn't going to happen.

Other benefits of #2, if I am wrong, then TMH who would be unkillable D3 would not be able to mess with the Bus Driver Abilities N3. Also a 3rd person could verify the Bus Driver ability and let us know if it is standard or not.

Summary/my suggestion: CKD sends the tree stump to TMH. Diddin sends the Bus Driver to somebody else.

Thoughts/counter suggestions?

[I Am Innocent]

Alright, just got a PM that my power is active, I think diddin is the best kill. I'll take votes for 24 hours. If you want me to go with my gut and bear the responsibility, vote my gut.

My vote is on either BunnyLover or Pops

Count that as a 1/2 each, whatever.

Also, nobody should be shot until a claim request has been made.

PS - Another reason BunnyLover is a good option (claimed vanilla already).

[I Am Innocent]

ALSO: I passed my power to MoI last night. Sorry it took so long for me to say so.

Anyone else pass a power to MOI or Chkflp?

TMH: shoot diddin, Parama, Nero, or Saint. Those are my votes.

These are your top 4 suspects (not named TMH)?

4 town reads for me...

[I Am Innocent]

Are you saying "more worthy lynch candidate" from your perspective, or theirs? Give me an example of what exactly you're referring to, please.

I am saying all four people you want to see vigged are town reads for me. Not one scummy player like bunnylover or Wrath Child, who hammered Powerox very shortly after he claimed a role (who was the competing lynch again....oh yeah, TMH)? Or how about Pops, who gave the green light to bunnylover / wrath child instead of discussing pros / cons for keeping the role in the game. These are a couple to name a few.

Are these town reads for you?

[I Am Innocent]

Daykill: Parama

whoops

Where was the claim request? I told you to ask for one before shooting! Esp since DBE all but breadcrumbed that she passed the Doctor role to Parama.

Obv scum. I still want to wait until D3 to take you out, as I want the Treestump out of the game.

CKD, pass the tree stump to TMH tomorrow.

For anyone adamant about lynching TMH today, you obv think he is scum too so my say is to focus on the three players that helped push Powerox (and in essence save TMH D1).

BunnyLover
Wrath Child
Pops.

If anyone but one of these three players gets lynched, I am breaking my own rule and replacing out. I did not want Helghast shot, I voted for TMH over Powerox, I said DBE was being used as the easy target today, and said I had a town read on Parama, who is also a very solid endgame player. Give me some credit and let's please target just one of these three players D2.

[I Am Innocent]

Vi, you have read up to page 20, and you are recommending lynches and protections from lynches based on that? No, it does not work that way buddy. Catch up and then you can start making some recommendations.

Regarding my active lurking, please read post 642 to see why.

Then read pages 29-57 and see if my participation and play is still active lurking.

************************

Nice OMGUS Bunnylover. Noted.

Scummy things you have done off the top of my head:
You hammered Powerox before giving the group a chance to discuss the matter. In effect saving TMH who was the 2nd leading vote getter.
The crazy bit where you claimed you had MOI's ability from yesterday.
You outted Parama when I told the group to leave it/DBE well alone on who she protected.

You have no case on me yet you suspect me for there being no case on me. I have had one vote the entire game, a RVS vote. I do not need street cred, so your argument is weak. Once again, nice OMGUS.

[I Am Innocent]

Oh yeah, you lied saying your other game had one vanilla townie, where it really said at least one vanilla townie.

[I Am Innocent]

I like the fact that you point out that you haven't voted. Aren't votes the most powerful tool townies have? Don't they lead to VC analysis? Wouldn't scum want to be left off of VC analysis? (credit goes to MoI for teaching me these things in Secret Invasion Mafia).

Vote I am Innocent

A quick scan through IAI's ISO show's 5 votes made throughout the course of the game. Given how easy it is to check this out I don't like how happily you seemed to have jumped on it. You obviously misread something by IAI if you thought he said he hadn't voted. I'd expect a townie to check that out first, I'd expect a scum to jump on it in eagerness to press another point against your chosen target.

Yeah, I said I have

had

one vote the entire game, not

made

one vote the entire game. Very scummy move indeed by Bunnylover.

[I Am Innocent]

Vi, you have read up to page 20, and you are recommending lynches and protections from lynches based on that? No, it does not work that way buddy. Catch up and then you can start making some recommendations.

Oh, but yes it does work that way.

I skipped ahead just for you, and I'm willing to buy some temporary leave due to other games, but from December 22 all the way to January 6 (two weeks)? And you were literally incapable of posting anything convincing until then?

And perhaps more pressingly... you're casting doubt on ALL of my reads because YOU don't feel your description was accurate? No, please, enlighten me. Tell me how I'm wrong on the others.

And while you're here... I distinctly remember reading recently that you wanted Saint (read, ME) out of the game. Yet if I'm not mistaken, you said this slot was a Town read both before and after that statement. Really?

I was away from the 23rd to the 30th visiting my parents. I had some computer access, though I try not to hog the computer at their house. Also, my family hosted a New Years Party. Lastly, I typically do not play in more than 1-2 games at a time, but when Kunkstar invited me I felt honored so I picked up an unusual 3rd game for myself.

The other two games were in critical stages around my "actively lurking" moments. I promised rereads in both of those other two games. RC and Furc can back me up by telling you how I was at the end game of Zach's mountainous game, and though I didn't reread all 50 pages of that game, I did spend time rereading keep points of that game.

As of right now, this is my only open game. That is why the activity level is so different.

********************

As for wanting you and Furc out of the game, I have been adamant about keeping this slot in the game. The only thing I ever did against that slot was my RVS vote when I joked that Furc seemed way under control for his initial post.

Please shoe me this mysterious post where I attacked your slot? I think you may be mistaking me for BunnyLover, where I called him out for trying to get you/Vi out of this game? That was in defense of your position, not attack...

[I Am Innocent]

My gut tells me

people

would love to have Saint (or should I say Vi) out of this game.

That's not the word I saw before. I'm sorry v.v

No apologies necessary.

My earlier point is that while I am happy to finally get to play with the great Vi, and recognize that you are a benefit to the team if you are indeed town, you don't seem quite up to speed. Hence why I don't like you guiding lynches, etc. I have no problem with you pointing out scummy things you come across, but to list Scummiest to Towniest players based on Page 14 or Page 20 just seems like a distraction when we are on page 58. Esp since alot may have changed, like TMH making a record amount of scummy moves D2. Just my 2 cents.

[I Am Innocent]

We are at 17 living players with 6 scum. That means when a player hits 3 votes (town votes) they can be hammered by scum (theoretically). I'm not saying that will happen because of the challenge of that level of coordination, but just that it is possible.

This is certainly not LyLo, so why are you acting like we need to be afraid of a pile on? If scum quickly did so, they would out themselves, so the whole "level of coordination" thing is just an excuse. Let's find out why you are acting so bizarrely?

If we mislynch and we see two kills like last night we are down to 14 town versus 6 scum, lynch at eight. Hot potatoe blows up town (13 vs. 6, lynch at 7), Day mis-Kill (12 vs. 6, Lynch at 7) BAM we're in LyLo.

Do you really think there is one scum team that gets two kills? If not, as townies are eliminated, doesn't that increase the chance that these kills will hit each other? More appeal to fear here, wondering why still...

I think we don't have a chance of removing the Hot Potatoe, but the Day-Kill has been a liability, is in the hands of a scummy player, and needs to go for our own good.

We simply can not afford to lose 4 townies a day/night.

UNVOTE, VOTE: TMH

Ahhh, here it is, after some more appeal to fear ("We simply cannot afford to lose 4 townies a day/night)". Let us kill TMH. Before we have a chance to rid ourselves of the tree stump. Yeah that is pro town.

If TMH is scum, doesn't that mean that the day vig is likely to end up in a townies hands D3? If TMH is scum, doesn't that validate Diddin, CKD, and whoever TMH sends the ability to as "not scum teammates of TMH"?

So why kill him now? You make it sound like the main reason is to rid ourselves of the day vig ability. Do you think that ability is more detrimental to us late in the game as the tree stump??? Couldn't the day vig hold off LyLo longer in a townie's hands? Your whole argument stinks.

[I Am Innocent]

I like the fact that you point out that you haven't voted. Aren't votes the most powerful tool townies have? Don't they lead to VC analysis? Wouldn't scum want to be left off of VC analysis? (credit goes to MoI for teaching me these things in Secret Invasion Mafia).

Vote I am Innocent

A quick scan through IAI's ISO show's 5 votes made throughout the course of the game. Given how easy it is to check this out I don't like how happily you seemed to have jumped on it. You obviously misread something by IAI if you thought he said he hadn't voted. I'd expect a townie to check that out first, I'd expect a scum to jump on it in eagerness to press another point against your chosen target.

Yeah, I said I have

had

one vote the entire game, not

made

one vote the entire game. Very scummy move indeed by Bunnylover.

Then my apologize.

I have had one vote the entire game, a RVS vote.

This to me does not read as you are explaining. I think its the part of the RVS vote that threw me to my conclusion (like your only vote has been your RVS vote).

Please list your top 4 scummiest players.

What do you think of Wrath Child's last post?

[I Am Innocent]

Ok. We should lynch TMH today because if he is scum, he could just pass the dayvig ability to the player his team is going to nightkill, sending it to "the void."

What if I told you items could be recollected from the void. Would that change your mind?

[I Am Innocent]

^^Yes please.

For once I agree with LMH.

I'm certain TMH is the right choice tonight. I putting my vote in on him and probably keeping it there unless anything major comes up.

@IAI: We proven ourselves either incapable of nailing scum with our Day-Kills or too heavily influence by scum to trust we get positive results. We are ZERO for FOUR with Daykills. I don't think we can remove the hot potatoe, but we can remove the Day-Kill. TMH has acted scummily beyond a doubt and I think the reason the majority of the players aren't voting him already is because he holds the Day-Kill ability.

If you are so worried about the treestump why do you not want to vote CKD?
If you are so sure TMH is scum (I re-read your ISO), why do you not want to lynch TMH?
If we aren't sure the DayVig has any more charges, why give a scummy player a hallpass?

CKD cannot be lynched.

Lynching TMH would kill the Dayvig, which probably kills the chance to get rid of the Tree Stump.

Because the DayVig may still have more charges, and it is a chance I am willing to take. Plus all this wanting TMH dead is making me wonder if CKD and TMH are scummates, and people are bussing TMH to try to protect CKD, who has been asked to pass the tree stump to TMH. So leaving him alive for one more day has strategical purposes as well.

So why no mention of the treestump other than asking me why I am not voting someone who has it but cannot be lynched because of it?

PS - I love your original reason for wanting to get rid of TMH today is that we have to get the dayvig out of the game ASAP, then you use it later as a counter argument that "If we aren't sure the DayVig has any more charges, why give a scummy player a hallpass". So do you want him lynched because he is scummy or because of the day vig being a detriment?

[I Am Innocent]

Ok. We should lynch TMH today because if he is scum, he could just pass the dayvig ability to the player his team is going to nightkill, sending it to "the void."

unvote, Vote: themanhimself

That's a self-defeating argument considering that you're in possession of an ability that utterly nullifies that point

Good point.

TMH and Diddin, does the Bus Driver ability allow you to send someones power to anybody, or does it have to be yourself?

[I Am Innocent]

When I said vote CKD, I meant for his vigging today.

From early on D2, my strategy was to let TMH live to D3. I was not ready for the day vig to leave the game, and am still not.

Since TMH was going to live to D3 and I am very confident he will flip scum, that allows us to 1) send scummy abilities to him D3 and have them off'd and 2) confirm anyone who sends an ability to him as "not being TMH's teammate".

You sound like you think he is as scummy as I do, so why the rush? You are okay leaving the tree stump in the game then, huh?

You still have not answered that

.

[I Am Innocent]

Please list your top 4 scummiest players.

What do you think of Wrath Child's last post?

1) TMH.
2) Saint.
3) Was Parama.
4) I am Innocent.

My town reads are Pops and SC if that matters any.

Town reads with this many players is not a bad thing to put out there.

Can you replace Parama with a 4th suspect, he is dead BTW.

~Quote tags fixed.

[I Am Innocent]

The catch is that we have to rely on cooperation by the Bus Driver and the Mafia to make all this ability passing plan to work. I would rather just nail scum now.

I see the merrit of your plan, but think too much can go wrong at night.

Who are your top 4 suspects?

[I Am Innocent]

Mod, can you fix my tags in Post 1452 when you have a chance.

[I Am Innocent]

Ok. We should lynch TMH today because if he is scum, he could just pass the dayvig ability to the player his team is going to nightkill, sending it to "the void."

unvote, Vote: themanhimself

That's a self-defeating argument considering that you're in possession of an ability that utterly nullifies that point

Good point.

TMH and Diddin, does the Bus Driver ability allow you to send someones power to anybody, or does it have to be yourself?

This is true. Now if we don't lynch tmh I'll take the dayvig ability back to save it from the void if that's ok with everyone.

If you take the dayvig ability back but are targeted, doesn't the ability get lost from the game? Wouldn't that be worse than going to the void?

Either send it to a random player or leave it with TMH. That would be my suggestion.

[I Am Innocent]

[rant]If only we had a doctor alive and not outted, we could announce who we were sending the dayvig to and that secret doctor could protect said player...[/rant]

[I Am Innocent]

Frankly, I'm considering the benefits of just lynching tmh today. It would get us started with our first mafia hit (if he's town I may quit this site), which could help raise morale, it could clear diddin (or at least clear him from one mafia faction if it's multiball), and the daykill is so variable that the more I think about it, the less I want it here. I mean, it's caused two miskills already. The only argument I've heard against that is that it gains information... so what, people are talking all the time, that should be plenty of information, and information is not worth miskills.

No the other argument is that we will probably have no chance at getting rid of the Treestump.

The virus may get unleashed everyday. With or without a day vig. I suggest we keep the dayvig for one more day and get rid of TMH and the Treestump once and for all D3.

My suggestion on handling the virus each day it remains in the game is to have everybody place a vote. Once everybody places a vote (without taking anyone pass L-2), the person with the majority takes the virus and holds it until they die. If they refuse to hold it (indicating scum), they automatically become the choice for the lynch, and we go ahead and lynch that player right then and there and do not use the virus that day. Virus problem averted.***

***D3 would be the one exception if we want to out TMH and Treestump with the Dayvig, we would need to come up with a 2nd alternative.

[I Am Innocent]

7 People have not voted. One is being replaced. One cannot because of the Tree stump.

@5 other players. Please vote.

@ CKD, where would your vote be currently?

[I Am Innocent]

All fair enough, but was it

scummy

that TMH (or diddin before him) suggested a Democratic Day Dos Dayvig?
For that matter, since TMH shot the way you wanted him to, what do you get from that?

What I found scummy was both players made it sound like we were going to vote democratically on it and how to use it, but in the end it seemed like both players made critical decisions on it themselves.

Diddin - in the end he decided to only consider two outted vanilla players, and nobody else. This was under the pretense of not outting more power roles. When the person with the power made that decision, it became un-Democratic IMO.

TMH - Says he is going to do it democratically, than gives us

only

24 hours to make a pick, than makes a pick that did not feel like a majority to me,

and kills him without asking for a claim, which I specifically told him to do so

. He got rid of a strong power role that I hinted was probably with Parama, based on all that DBE said. Very scummy indeed.

What Diddin did at least had some pro-town motives to it, but in the end if he is scum could have boxed a kill on two known players who were not his teammates. If Diddin or nhammen flip scum, I will be targeting the other one, as I specifically asked during that time about EC/nhammen, and Diddin told me no. The honest truth though is that I am getting a townie feel from both of these players lately, but it is still noted.

TMH's moves were obv scummy. He told us how long we had before he made a decision, made the decision before the 24 hours were up, and made it on a player with a likely strong power role without giving that player a chance to claim. #1 suspect and he will die D3.

[I Am Innocent]

An open question to everyone: how valuable do you consider the dayvig to actually be? Would you be willing to try the following or some version of it:
We give diddin a list of a few people, and he randomly busdrives the dayvig to one of them(so that in case he's scum, he can't use it elsewhere, and to minimize chances of dayvig winding up in the void). ckd passes the stump to tmh. Either shoot him or organize a group of people to spam during times that he isn't online.

Actually, that might be a decent way to control the virus kill... pass it to someone then spam while they're sleeping... it's devious yet could work.

I consider the day vig very valuable while the tree stump is still out there.

Not sure we need a list of a few people, would prefer it just be random or we give a list of a few people

not

to send it to.

100% think CKD sends the stump to TMH.

The spamming doesn't seem to work, as the 75 post count seems to not start until the person reads their PM. That is why it was so hard for it to work today. If TMH doesn't agree to hold the virus, he automatically becomes the day vig D3. If next most suspicious person does not agree to hold the virus, they become the lynch D3.

[I Am Innocent]

WrathChild:

Parama, The man himself, Diddin, Lateralus22, popsofclown, powerrox93, I am Innocent

(7)

EC:

RedCoyote, Saint, curiouskarmadog, I Am Innocent

(4)

Helghast:

Lateralus22, pops

(2)

Nero Cain:

chkflip

(1)

Narsis:

Saint

(1)

Current hit list for didden, note there

may be some errors so please point them out.

I've got your name there if you've expressed some interest in the vig candidate even if they weren't your first choice but you were willing to compromise but haven't got your name next to someone unless I thought you said exactly that you would be cool with switching to them.

Yet Helghast, who was under EC at this moment, was the hit. Could it be because of the following three posts, which were made prior to this vote count by Lat? (I say yes):

I fail to see what's scummy about EC at all... if someone can post a case I'll consider it.

I'd be more willing to lynch Wrath... Helghast seems to be more of a vigbait player.

However I don't want to have ANOTHER claim and risk outing powerful roles. I've already forced one claim and really don't want to make someone else claim.

He's posted... pretty much a whole lot of nothing really. His last post may be a chainsaw, but those read null without a flip.

Unless there are some serious objections, I'm gonna go ahead and shoot Helghast. I'll support a lynch of Wrath today instead as Helghast is screaming vigbait to me quite a bit.

Count me as a 2nd who has not seen anything scummy about Helghast. What is the reasoning there?

As for EC, his attack on Parama was all over the place. He attacked him for passing the Bomb off, the alternative was to keep it. I questioned him on this and did not care for the response.

Quite a few people have said EC. If you are not going to switch to EC, my vote is to keep it on the player who has claimed no power (WC) before Helghast.

You realize I'm talking about themanhimself in the first paragraph, right?

I'm not shooting EC. Helghast has already claimed no power as well.

So regarding the below, I believe Lat's (later) vote counts were swayed by the fact the person holding the day vig said EC was off limits. (Post one, why is EC scummy, Post two, I don't want to out any more power roles, Post three, I am not shooting EC) Agree?

You're ignoring a few key points here.

1) If Lat's vigvote counts were correct, the choices diddin made

were indeed

between the top two vote-getters. That they happened to be claimed Vanillas was a pleasant and desirable side effect.

[I Am Innocent]

You're ignoring a few key points here.

2) TMH only said he wanted to demo-kill... once, IIRC. Then LMP got in his face and called him scummy for even suggesting it, saying that it would say more if he shot someone and took the consequences. So that's what he did. Incidentally, Doctor being a "strong power role" only seems to apply in this game where there's only one, maybe two people talking sense at a time.

Well he may have only used the word democratically once, but below are five posts where he mentions the group voting on what we should do. So I'll say it was five times not one.

As for the peer pressure of LMP, please, that is no excuse. For you to even make that an excuse for "town" TMH is absurd. For all "town" TMH knows, LMP is scum trying to rush things, so I do not buy that for one instance.

Seems like a good idea to me. I had the power to change the cycle of night choices for N1. For example, I could tell the mod to send diddin's power to someone else regardless of who diddin tried to send it to. I sent the day-vig ability to myself and the person who got my redirect power knows who they are probably figured out why I sent it to them. I'm all for using my power democratically

Why wouldn't I take it? Diddin could very well have decided to send it to scum or dumb town who would just vig whomever they felt like and hit someone wrong, this way I know it's in safe hands and that it can be used as a second lynch. However, I'm not gonna stall like diddin did. I have to wait for the virus to be activated in order to use so 48 hours after it's activated, I'm day-vigging whoever has the most votes. I'm only going to count one vote from each person and bolding helps. Nor am I going to narrow it down. Whoever has the most votes (excepting me of course) gets vigged.

I don't know whether diddin is scum and that argument could be used for any use of the abilty. It's an anti-town ability so I sent it to someone that I suspect to be scum so if I day-vig him or we lynch him it's two birds with one stone. I sent the day-vig ability to myself because I'm the only confirmed town that I know of. If voting for the ability is pointless then vote for me to use it however I want and if that's the majority at my deadline then that's what I'll do.

@WC- It varies

Alright, just got a PM that my power is active, I think diddin is the best kill. I'll take votes for 24 hours. If you want me to go with my gut and bear the responsibility, vote my gut.

Note it is no longer 48 hours, but 24.

I think pops has been fairly helpful, though if he has the most votes in 24 hours I won't hesitate, the other three I can see easily.

C'mon guys, don't wuss out, I'm playing in like four games right now and this one is hands down my favorite. I don't like that sentiment coming from parama because it sounds to me like he's scum who knows that he's caught. Implosion and pops haven't been major suspects so I don't necessarily see that coming from them. I'll do the game a three fold favor right now

Daykill: Parama

1) He doesn't want to be here
2) This will give us new info to go off of
3) he's scum
Most people seem fine with him dying in some fashion or another anyway

Daykill: Parama

whoops

This last post is less than 10.5 hours after he starts his 24 hour deadline

.

Saint, I no longer have a town read on your slot. Your defense of TMH is completely absurd. His taking of the power role was scummy, his killing a player 13.5 hours prior to saying he would without asking for a claim is even scummier. TMH will die D3. And your defense of him is really throwing me for a loop.

*******************

I got the virus and passed it to diddin, I think he's extremely scummy and I've brought it up before. One thing I want to mention is that from my interpretation of the redirector role PM, it's not a standard ability. I'm only bringing this up because if diddin survives and passes the ability, he'll probably try to pass it to scum to clear one or the other (assuming he's scum, which I am).

Need to double check, doesn't Diddin say later that it is a standard ability?

Also a reminder to self to double check everybody's suggestions for the D2 vig kill.

[I Am Innocent]

quadz, why no revote?

TMH, care to vote?

[I Am Innocent]

What's more interesting is that you and IAI are trying to paint Parama as a shot that nobody wanted when that's not the case.
Historical revisionism or honest mistake? I report, you decide.

No, what I am painting is that Player X did the following scummy things:
1) Stole the dayvig ability which eliminated a pairing we could have had with Diddin. Anti MOI Plan. And against what TMH said earlier D1 was a sound strategy***
2) Said he was going to give the group 48 hours to make a decision, then 24 hours, then made a kill at 10.5 hours when almost half the people did not chime in.
3) He killed a player without asking for a claim. A player you and I both thought and mentioned in the thread prior to the kill had the Doctor ability. Don't you think scum want pro town power roles out of this game so it eliminates pairings/confirmed townies + it eliminates power that helps town. Guess what, the Doctor role is now completely useless as DBE and Parama, the two holders of it are both dead, and the power is now gone from the game. If that is not scum motivation, then I don't know what is!

Yes I wanted to go back and check how may people listed Parama. I also wanted to see how many people did not get a chance to speak up, which was close to half by your chart.

***Contradiction alert!

This is actually your strategy from post #67, I just applied it to the dayvig role. It's a lot less reckless than pushing a scum to use his killing ability. Besides, this way it almost certainly ends up in town hands tomorrow. If diddin is scum as a lot of people believe then he can't pass it to a scumbuddy so it has to go to town. If diddin is town then it ends up in the hands of someone the town largely believes to be innocent.

@ TMH, why again did you steal the dayvig when you said this back on page 10?

[I Am Innocent]

I want everyone on record on the following two questions before we get to N2.

1) If TMH survives to D3, and assuming the day vig makes it to D3, should TMH be killed D3 (either voluntarily by holding the virus, or forced through the day vig)?

2) If TMH survives D2, should CKD pass the tree stump to TMH N2?

My answers
1) yes
2) yes

[I Am Innocent]

I find IAI's #1578's doctor comments scummy

@IAI

what is the point in dwelling on the past with this?

Not dwelling, just pointing out scum motivation that TMH had.

Parama's kill ensured the end of the Doctor power role, and all links from players having the Doctor are now dead and we have 0 leads on the scum from that role. Scum 1, Town 0.

I find IAI's #1578's doctor comments scummy

@IAI

what is the point in dwelling on the past with this?

I want everyone on record on the following two questions before we get to N2.

1) If TMH survives to D3, and assuming the day vig makes it to D3, should TMH be killed D3 (either voluntarily by holding the virus, or forced through the day vig)?

2) If TMH survives D2, should CKD pass the tree stump to TMH N2?

My answers
1) yes
2) yes

1) not if we decide he is town, which I feel he is
2) leave it for WIFOM

why are you fishing, here, IAI? this information is scummily motivated... hard.

FOS: IAI

Are you referring to my questions? If not, please clarify.

I'll answer assuming you are referring to my 2 questions. I think CKD should pass the Tree Stump to TMH tomorrow. I want it on record what the group thinks so there is no loophole here.

I don't want D3 to come and CKD to say, 'I did not pass it to TMH because I wasn't sure he was going to be the day kill D3', or 'I thought we were worried about the dayvig ending up in the void'.

By getting everyone on record, (and the clear majority thinks he should pass it to TMH assuming TMH is notlynched today,) CKD loses those loopholes. He has to send it to TMH or otherwise we know they are likely scum partners.

PS - And then we can circle back and see who was pushing the hardest for a TMH lynch D2 to try to save one teammate at the hands of bussing the other.

[I Am Innocent]

Q: What is a "cycling choice" and when should I submit it?

A: A cycling choice is the person you wish to send your ability to.

If you have more than one ability

, each ability must be sent to separate players. It is suggested that you submit your cycling choice at the same time you submit your action, but not required. It is required to submit your choice before the current Night ends, otherwise your choices become randomized.

Underlined for Dripping Goofball.

[I Am Innocent]

Players Alive with a Role D1:

themanhimself - D1, Busdriver Ability, passed it along to Diddin, D2 Dayvig.
quadz08 - D1, Hibernate Ability, passed it to MOI/void.
diddin - D1 Dayvig, power taken by themanhimself
popsofctown - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Bunnylover

[

SnakePlissken

]

[

danGR

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Implosion - D1 Treestump, passed it to curiouskarmadog
nhammen

[

EtherealCookie

]

- D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
Saint - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.
q21 - D1 Had a Power, passed it along.

Players Alive with no Role D1:

LynchMePls
DrippingGoofball

[

Lateralus22

]

[

TheLonging

]

WrathChild
Curiouskarmadog – Tree Stump D2
Nero Cain
I Am Innocent
StrangerCoug

[

UnofficialRulerOfEveryone

]

RedCoyote

Dead Players:

muh316 - D1 Watcher (died with him D1)
AntB - D1 Nothing
Helghast - D1 Nothing
Powerrox93 - D1 Double Voter (died with him D1)
MagnaOfIllusion - D1 Nothing
chkflip - D1 Ability Remover (died with him N1)
DarlaBlueEyes

[

Narsis

]

- D1, Doctor Ability, passed it to Parama N1.
Parama – D1 Nothing, D2 Doctor Ability (died with him D2)

***Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:
Treestump: Implosion D1 -> Curiouskarmadog D2
Bus Driver: themanhimself -> diddin
?: popsofctown -> ?
?: Bunnylover -> ?
?: nhammen -> ?
?: Saint -> ?
?: q21 -> ?

***First post Day 3 these players from D1 should reveal who they passed them to N1. The players that received them should confirm that too.

[I Am Innocent]

How many times did we agree I was shooting people with a lot of votes (hint: not EC)? How many times did I say I didn't want someone else to claim and potentially out a stronger power role? It's like I'm talking to someone and whenever I make a point they stick their fingers in their ear and go LALALALALALA YOU'RE WRONG YOU'RE WRONG

How many time? Never. We never agreed that you were shooting people with alot of votes. You actually never mentioned votes when limiting who you wanted shot. Ever. The first time you mentioned that you weren't going to shoot anyone outside Helghast or WC (ISO 20) they were on 3 and 2 votes respectively, EC was on... also 2. When you said it again (ISO 29) the only change in that situation was that Helghast had gotten 1 more vote.

Also, totally agree with you here. Diddin is full of scum, unfortunately we're gonna want the dayvig ability so we can't lynch him today. I'm all for it tomorrow though.

Interesting post. Is this a message to a teammate that Diddin was off limits D1? That he was going to be able to steal the the dayvig N1? Noted.

[I Am Innocent]

How many times did we agree I was shooting people with a lot of votes (hint: not EC)? How many times did I say I didn't want someone else to claim and potentially out a stronger power role? It's like I'm talking to someone and whenever I make a point they stick their fingers in their ear and go LALALALALALA YOU'RE WRONG YOU'RE WRONG

How many time? Never. We never agreed that you were shooting people with alot of votes. You actually never mentioned votes when limiting who you wanted shot. Ever. The first time you mentioned that you weren't going to shoot anyone outside Helghast or WC (ISO 20) they were on 3 and 2 votes respectively, EC was on... also 2. When you said it again (ISO 29) the only change in that situation was that Helghast had gotten 1 more vote.

Also, totally agree with you here. Diddin is full of scum, unfortunately we're gonna want the dayvig ability so we can't lynch him today. I'm all for it tomorrow though.

Interesting post. Is this a message to a teammate that Diddin was off limits D1? That he was going to be able to steal the the dayvig N1? Noted.

Finished my earlier analysis by rereading TMH. The best possible match for a teammate I could come up with was q21. His 2nd post after the TMH post above included a call for "MOAR POWERROX VOTES PLEASE!"

The very next post by q21 was D2 where he votes, guess who, Diddin.

q21's Iso post 2 also looks like some early coaching for TMH:

"This seems like your advocating, essentially, a no lynch Day 1. Which is scummy. This view is, however, ameliorated by the fact that from your later posts it seems that you were genuinely unaware that a majority vote on implosion will supposedly lead to a no lynch. I do not like that you're still voting implosion, though, (essentially voting no lynch)."

Oh, and to factor in an earlier post that I and later Vi noticed, guess where the scum is on the list for q21, right on the "less so" category:

"Vote Powerrox93

Other scum reads at the moment: Nero Cain. diddin. Less so, themanhimself and EC."

Okay, I admit, initially I thought q21 was scummy because I thought EC was the likely scum teammate. Wrong person, right idea. Still I have town reads on everyone outside of TMH now on this list.

Pops would be my 2nd guess for a TMH teammate.

unvote BunnyLover
vote: q21

[I Am Innocent]

*IAI - Why not vote quadz? Regardless of what you think of tmh's alignment, wouldn't you rather lynch someone who has been scummy on his own than based on tenuous connections?

That was what I was doing with my vote on Bunnylover. But that wagon emptied except for me.

Everyone outside of you and Pops seems to think TMH is scum. There has to be a fair amount of town in that group that believe that way. It got me to thinking, if we are right, and I am fairly confident that we are, who could be his partners? Who does not seem to be on his scumteam? Well I told the group who I thought is or might be on his scumteam. I do not think Diddin, WC, nor your slot is (and know that I am not) based on the conversations TMH put forward. Everyone else is still up in the air.

With that said, I would like to see a q21 wagon get going. If that does not, at least I got this concern on record for when TMH does flip.

PS - Quadz I have been going back and forth on today. Based on the TMH connections (doubting WC is his teammate), I would actually push for quadz over WC at the deadline now. (Hint to Quadz, hop on the q21 bandwagon.)

PPS - "We're going to need" that tomorrow. Not Town is going to need it, we are. Message sent....and now read loud and clear by this poster.

And Diddin can die tomorrow. IOW, lay off Diddin for now, I need his dayvig and then we can attack his "easy target" slot tomorrow.

I'm sure about this one. Two scum. Bank on it.

[I Am Innocent]

I think you missed what I was saying there.

Rather than gamble on TMH's alignment AND associative tells - which tbqh I've never put a lot of stock in - why not go with someone who is independently scummy? It seems like a more sure bet.

I hear you, and the honest truth is that TMH is the only person I feel is a sure bet. After that I I'd probably rank Pops, who I seem to be in a boat by myself.

After that I got a list of about 7 players I have gone back and forth on. None of whom I feel is a sure bet.

So I got two choices. Like you said, I could take a player in that group like WC or quadz (who have both independently at times looked scummy to me) that has some votes and hop on. Something just doesn't feel right about that to me. So I am choosing option #2, pick someone (q21) that I think is a teammate of the person I feel is a sure bet (TMH), and who also happens to be in a group of 7 players. That feels right to me. If it doesn't pick up steam, I will not let a no lynch happen, but as of right now, that is my best guess for scum that is not in the off limits category for D2.

That's my logic. Hopefully that answers your question.

Question back at you, are you having trouble looking at my analysis on q21 seriously because of your belief that TMH is innocent?

[I Am Innocent]

You can't be sure TMH is mafia unless you are mafia.

Nice try scum. Read Newbie 1033 for fun sometime...

Newbie 1033, Post from me D1:

...

Truth be told, I am as certain that veridis is scum

as I have been about any I played with outside of games where I was a cop or a cop investigation was made by another player...

Final roles:

Alive: (5/9)

Hold My Life*

Eternal_Phantom

earlyworm

I Am Innocent

(SE)

Nachomamma8

(IC)

Dead: (4/9)

Charlie, Vanilla Townie,

lynched Day One

Timmer, Vanilla townie,

shot night One

veridis, Mafia Goon,

lynched Day Two

Runner

Kanashimi Sean Regan

, Mafia Goon,

lynched Day Three
[/b][/spoiler]

[I Am Innocent]

you shouldnt ever be over 50% sure of a mafia read, ever

Never???

Not even in LyLo, 2 Townie vs 1 Scum. You know you are town. 2 other players..... 1 has to be mafia....I guess at this point one should only be exactly 50% sure with both reads.

Never say never scum. What's wrong, am I getting too close for comfort on the q21/TMH connection? You seem to be trying hard to discredit me, I am glad this is all on record.

[I Am Innocent]

So. IAI, I've debunked one entirely associative case on me (which was first mentioned by you) so you're bringing another?

Is this your defense?

How about starting with who do you think TMH's scum partners are, assuming he is scum of course?

[I Am Innocent]

I didn't think about that, ok, whatever. My point is, you shouldn't put too much faith in the human component of scumhunting. Finding scum once doesn't refute that, at all.

Diddin, want to tell him about the game where I called Derby Bolts scum by page 3/4? Yep scum.

So does finding scum twice refute that?

Oh wait, there was the game where I was all over Doctor D1, he was scum.

Another game where I played with Deer and we nailed another scum D1.

How about 4 times, in 7 games as townie? Now do I get some cred?

[I Am Innocent]

Consider this

FOS Quadz

as an L-1 vote. Next FOS/Vote should call for a claim.

I am thinking at this point if there is a claim, that quadz should not say what the ability is. The person who passed the role could verify that the claim does exist. At this point we go with further discussion as needed.

[I Am Innocent]

curiouskarmadog (1) -

StrangerCoug

Mod

, is this an error or is this vote valid?

To the best of my knowledge that is correct. Format of VoteCount is Votee (Number of Votes) - Voter(s) .

ckd, do you or do you not have the Tree Stump ability?

Implosion can verify this, but I believe that the role prohibits the player 1) from being lynched and 2) from voting. A vote on the TreeStump player seems valid, and the fact that Implosion verified that he passed it to CKD and CKD admitted he received it makes me think the answer to your question is yes (and that the vote is valid).

[I Am Innocent]

Important message, everybody please read.

I pre-wrote this message, and asked my wife to post it after D3 started knowing I would not be around at 7pm EST. She knows to check to make sure I am still alive before posting this, so

if she posted this mistakenly while I was killed, please delete this message Mod

.

I have information on the Void from N1/D2, but I do not want to discuss that until everyone discloses the following below.

If anyone else has information on the Void, please do not say anything!

When I speak about my information later, if I bring up something that is incorrect, you can call me out on it, but no point on outting yourself at this time for obvious reasons, which is the same reason I did not out myself D2 about my inside information regarding the Void.

Questions for everyone:

If you had a cycling ability Day 1, please tell who you sent it to N1.

If you had a cycling ability Day 2, please tell the group how many abilities you had and confirm that you passed it/them along.

If you had a cycling ability Day 2 and you sent it to someone who died N2 (assuming there are some), please disclose that as well.

The owner of the TreeStump and Bussing Ability should come forward. CKD and Diddin should confirm this is who they sent it to.

Diddin should confirm whether he used the Bussing Ability for the Day Vig N2.

Things we should not discuss:

The actual abilities we had prior days or have today. This includes people from Day 1. (Exception the TreeStump/Bus Ability.)

If you had an ability Day 2, do not tell the group who you sent the ability to Day 3. (Exception the TreeStump/Bus Ability.)

[I Am Innocent]

fuck, I missed getting my night choice in to pass.....asking mod what happened to it cause I dont have it.

It ended up with me. You knew how important this was to send to TMH, if he is scum, I am calling you out as his teammate...

[I Am Innocent]

I had 2 abilities last night. Will tell D3 who I sent them to.

[I Am Innocent]

fuck, I missed getting my night choice in to pass.....asking mod what happened to it cause I dont have it.

I have to check if there was even something that I could pass on, how can I tell?

Check your PM from when you replaced in. Does it say that you have any special abilities? No need to say what those special abilities are right now, just whether you had one (or more) or not.

[I Am Innocent]

IAI, could we get a confirmation vote from you? If the treestump got randomly sent to the void then we wouldn't really know who had it. I think it's unlikely that you're lying for several reasons, but never hurts to double check

Good Point.

vote: themanhimself

[I Am Innocent]

Q: What is a "cycling choice" and when should I submit it?

A: A cycling choice is the person you wish to send your ability to. If you have more than one ability, each ability must be sent to separate players. It is suggested that you submit your cycling choice at the same time you submit your action, but not required. It is required to submit your choice before the current Night ends, otherwise your choices become randomized.

Last sentence is for TMH. It would not end up in the void, only randomized.

[I Am Innocent]

If you had a cycling ability Day 1, please tell who you sent it to N1.

Passed it to EC not knowing it was nhamman, but would have done the same thing

Any ability D2?

[I Am Innocent]

fuck, I missed getting my night choice in to pass.....asking mod what happened to it cause I dont have it.

I have to check if there was even something that I could pass on, how can I tell?

Check your PM from when you replaced in. Does it say that you have any special abilities? No need to say what those special abilities are right now, just whether you had one (or more) or not.

Where does vanilla fit in there?

You are claiming vanilla?

[I Am Innocent]

EBWOP, Claiming vanilla D2? Like when you first joined the game???

[I Am Innocent]

Well I'm assuming diddin probably tried to steal the day-vig for himself and so if he got killed it would have gone to the void

Is that why you guys killed him?

As for the void, I'll talk more about that once everyone chimes in.

[I Am Innocent]

***

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent (“Randomly” Sent?)
Day Vig: diddin -> themanhimself (stole the ability) -> RedCoyote (Void)
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball??? ->
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen
?: nhammen -> ?
?: Saint -> q21
?: q21 -> ?
Hibernate Ability: quadz08 -> MOI (Void)

Night 2 Actions

I Am Innocent: two power roles D2 passed along
Implosion: had two power roles D2 passed along
themanhimself: Passed DayVig to RC/Void

Curiouskarmadog Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2

DrippingGoofball: Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2 / or to be Vanilla D2???

popsofctown: Vanilla Town D2
Saint: Vanilla Town D2

Bunnylover ?
nhammen ?
q21 ?
LynchMePls ?
WrathChild ?
Nero Cain ?
StrangerCoug ?

[I Am Innocent]

MagnaofIllusion,

Eruci

, shotgunned Day 1.

chkflip,

Eruci

, purged Day 1.

diddin,

Eruci

, shotgunned Night 2.

RedCoyote,

Daevori

, purged Night 2.

Shotgunning is for sure a scum team.

Though it is not confirmed that purging is town, it sure looks it from the two choices of people that were killed so far.

Agree with Implosion that we likely have one scum team.

[I Am Innocent]

Well I'm assuming diddin probably tried to steal the day-vig for himself and so if he got killed it would have gone to the void

Is that why you guys killed him?

***

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent (“Randomly” Sent?)
Day Vig: diddin -> themanhimself (stole the ability) -> RedCoyote (Void)

So are you postulating multi-ball here?

How do you figure?

[I Am Innocent]

MagnaofIllusion,

Eruci

, shotgunned Day 1.

chkflip,

Eruci

, purged Day 1.

diddin,

Eruci

, shotgunned Night 2.

RedCoyote,

Daevori

, purged Night 2.

Shotgunning is for sure a scum team.

Though it is not confirmed that purging is town, it sure looks it from the two choices of people that were killed so far.

Agree with Implosion that we likely have one scum team.

I don't see how this fits in with the posts I just quoted.

Diddin all but confirmed in the thread that he was going to steal the day vig from you. Now some suggested that he pass it to someone else, and not steal it for himself, but you knew you were never going to get a chance to pass it off yourself.

So you wake up D3, see a scummate dead, and say "heck I'll pretend I sent it to him/RC". Not buying it.

[I Am Innocent]

TMH, RC, CKD, what maybe 2 or 3 more. We still got a chance people.

TMH, if the group says that you should hold the virus (assuming it is back in play), will you do so?

[I Am Innocent]

You are claiming vanilla?

Nope.

So you are claiming you had 1 role, and you did not pass it on?

Please be specific. This vagueness is anti-town.

[I Am Innocent]

I thought it was obvious. Yes, I had a role but did not pass it on. However, I did kill RedCoyote, who scored high in the scumputer.

Pops, did you shoot chkflp N1?

[I Am Innocent]

I thought it was obvious. Yes, I had a role but did not pass it on. However, I did kill RedCoyote, who scored high in the scumputer.

So you knew enough to know you had a role and you used it, you did not know enough to know you had to pass it on? Is this correct?

[I Am Innocent]

Are there any players we can eliminate from the scum pool with rolebased information?

Long answer, RC is the only confirmed scum, and he had no abilities D1 or D2 and we cannot verify if he had one D3 as of yet.

Short answer. No.

[I Am Innocent]

I thought it was obvious. Yes, I had a role but did not pass it on. However, I did kill RedCoyote, who scored high in the scumputer.

So you knew enough to know you had a role and you used it, you did not know enough to know you had to pass it on? Is this correct?

Embarrassingly enough, yes. The formatting is too fancy for this old lady.

Well I suspect Pops will confirm that he shot chkflp N1, which means the SK is a revolving ability and we only have 1 scum team.

If that is the case, good shot last night!

[I Am Innocent]

Questions for everyone:

If you had a cycling ability Day 2, please tell the group how many abilities you had and confirm that you passed it/them along.

If you had a cycling ability Day 2 and you sent it to someone who died N2 (assuming there are some), please disclose that as well.

Nero, please answer the above questions.

[I Am Innocent]

Well, you are the only play-confirmed townie to me, because no player is no involved with scumhunting as to watch for the deadline and proxy posts to their significant others.

Thanks for the vote of confidence, and though I am not sure my towniness should be based on just that one post, I do have a funny PM that I can't wait to share with everyone after the game ends that my wife sent to the Mod....(Bless her heart for the effort, but boy she almost botched something up real bad! When I went off on her a bit, she asked me if anyone ever got divorced over Mafiascum!!! )

[I Am Innocent]

Questions for everyone:

If you had a cycling ability Day 2, please tell the group how many abilities you had and confirm that you passed it/them along.

If you had a cycling ability Day 2 and you sent it to someone who died N2 (assuming there are some), please disclose that as well.

Nero, please answer the above questions.

I've had no abilities at all this game.

For future reference, please only comment on abilities from prior days and not current ones. By doing this you give info to the bad guys.

[I Am Innocent]

So why are you not voting?

Nero Cain 30 + 40 + 30 = 100
TMH 30 + 40 + 30 = 100
q21 30 + 20 + 30 = 80
pops 30 + 20 + 30 = 80


What's your hurry?

I'd go TMH first, then q21, then pops, then Nero. Had a fairly Town Read on Nero this game.

If TMH flips scum, CKD (lack of passing the treestump) and q21 (the points I brought up D2) have the biggest connections with him.

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent (“Randomly” Sent?)
Day Vig: diddin -> themanhimself (stole the ability) -> RedCoyote (Void)
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> randomly assigned?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen ->
?: nhammen -> Implosion ->
?: Saint -> q21
?: q21 -> ?
Hibernate Ability: quadz08 -> MOI (Void)

Night 2 Actions

I Am Innocent: two power roles D2 passed along
Implosion: had two power roles D2 passed along
nhammen: had one power role D2 passed along
themanhimself: Passed DayVig to RC/Void

Curiouskarmadog Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2

DrippingGoofball: Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2 / or to be Vanilla D2???

popsofctown: Vanilla Town D2
Saint: Vanilla Town D2
Nero Cain: Vanilla Town D2

Bunnylover ?
q21 ?
LynchMePls ?
WrathChild ?

[I Am Innocent]

Based on what Implosion said, I am guessing q21 sent his role to implosion.

Which should bring up the question, how did IAI get two power roles D2.

I was given a power N1 called the Void Collector Ability, where I could choose one power from the void and bring it back to the game. I had to pass this last night and I did.

At the end of N1, there was only 1 power in the Void, the Hibernate ability. I collected it and passed it along as well. So it is back in play.

The player who has the void collector ability will know if the Dayvig was in the Void, and if it was it looks like it was that player's only choice to take last night.

If they come forward without the Dayvig, we know TMH is lying and can kill him on the spot. But then risk losing the Void Collector Ability N3.

If that person has the Dayvig from the void, TMH could be telling the truth or could have sent it to Diddin and is covering by saying he sent it to RC. I personally do not get WHY he would choose RC over other players, so I think TMH is the lynch, the player with the void collector ability remains quiet, and we move to D4 and I send the treestump to CKD if TMH flips scum.

Thoughts?

[I Am Innocent]

Ok. We should lynch TMH today because if he is scum, he could just pass the dayvig ability to the player his team is going to nightkill, sending it to "the void."

What if I told you items could be recollected from the void. Would that change your mind?

Breadcrumbing ftw?

[I Am Innocent]

The dayvig is either still in play, due to diddin, or was sent to the void, where it can be collected.

@IAI you can collect items from the void on the same night they are sent there?

Yes, it apparently is the last step in the Night process because I got the ability that was sent to MOI N1 from Quadz.

[I Am Innocent]

No, RC died before receiving the dayvig (if tmh is telling the truth), so the dayvig went to the void.

Are you certain about this order of action resolution?

Absolutely. Here are the three things that happen to an ability at night:

1) If a player dies at night, the ability they had that prior day dies with them and is removed from the game.
2) If a player survives the night, and they send the ability to another player who survives the night, that other player will end up with the ability.
3) If a player survives the night, and they send the ability to another player who dies that night, that ability ends up in the Void

This assumes no BusDriving ability is affecting it, which could have happened N2 and probably did based on the fact Diddin said he would use it for the dayvig.

[I Am Innocent]

Order of resolution is in the first post, and talking about the void appears later.

Based on what Implosion said, I am guessing q21 sent his role to implosion.

Which should bring up the question, how did IAI get two power roles D2.

I was given a power N1 called the Void Collector Ability, where I could choose one power from the void and bring it back to the game. I had to pass this last night and I did.

At the end of N1, there was only 1 power in the Void, the Hibernate ability. I collected it and passed it along as well. So it is back in play.

The player who has the void collector ability will know if the Dayvig was in the Void, and if it was it looks like it was that player's only choice to take last night.

If they come forward without the Dayvig, we know TMH is lying and can kill him on the spot. But then risk losing the Void Collector Ability N3.

If that person has the Dayvig from the void, TMH could be telling the truth or could have sent it to Diddin and is covering by saying he sent it to RC. I personally do not get WHY he would choose RC over other players, so I think TMH is the lynch, the player with the void collector ability remains quiet, and we move to D4 and I send the treestump to CKD if TMH flips scum.

Thoughts?

So, you use this ability on the same night you receive it? And can retrieve abilities the same night they are sent to the void? Is this ability standard? It seems to be used AFTER cycling. This is odd, to say the least. Especially given that the mod has stated that it goes Non-kill abilities, kills, cycling. Aaaand you confirmed that while writing this post.

Yes, I received it N1 and was told I could choose one ability from the void. There was only one in the list. I was told despite their only being one choice, I still had to go through the process and select that choice.

It is a standard ability because I was told I had to send my two abilities to different players N2. Two players should know that I am telling the truth, the one with the Hibernate and the one with the Void Collector. Either will back me up D4 I am sure.

[I Am Innocent]

Read that Saint, and good followup point by nhammen. Still not sure I buy it.

[I Am Innocent]

RedCoyote was all chummy with pops. It's almost embarrassing. I don't think these two are scumpals.

RedCoyote was going against TMH quite rabidly. Could be a great big Greyhound

. Toot! Toot! Splat.

RedCoyote did not dare speak Nero Cain's name. They are scumpalz 4 shure.

I called this D2. I said that if TMH and CKD are scummates, scum would probably try to bus TMH to protect CKD, knowing CKD would not be able to send the tree stump to TMH as we commanded him to do.

Could also be why RC was asking "Do you really have the tree stump". He needed to know to bus TMH. And since you get the abilities at the end of the night, he probably wouldn't have known for sure that CKD had it.

If I survive the night, I will be passing the tree stump back to CKD if TMH flips town based on the above.

TMH has to be the lynch today.

A few people have not chimed in yet, so the virus still could be in play, but with the bus driver gone and the dayvig possibly with the void collector, I think we forego the virus/dayvig today and just lynch TMH once everyone has chimed in.

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent (“Randomly” Sent?)
Day Vig:

diddin

-> themanhimself (stole the ability) ->

RedCoyote

/Void (Not verified)
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent ->
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> randomly assigned?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen ->
?: nhammen -> Implosion ->
?: q21 -> Implosion ->
?: Saint -> q21 ->

Night 2 Actions

I Am Innocent: two power roles D2 passed along
Implosion: had two power roles D2 passed along
nhammen: had one power role D2 passed along
q21: had one power role D2 passed along
themanhimself: Passed DayVig to RC/Void

Curiouskarmadog Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2
DrippingGoofball: Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2

popsofctown: Vanilla Town D2
Saint: Vanilla Town D2
Nero Cain: Vanilla Town D2
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D2
Bunnylover: Vanilla Town D2

LynchMePls ?

When Day 4 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 2
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day 3 or not.

[I Am Innocent]

I don't see how you can associate CKD not sending in an action with TMH's guilty. That really just doesn't make sense to me .

#1 CKD was ordered to send his ability to TMH and agreed to do so
#2 Scum cannot send standard abilities to their teammates
#3

The only loophole

left if CKD and TMH are scum teammates is to not send it to anybody and say you forgot to send it, though it was stressed over and over again in the thread.
#4 CKD said he forgot to send it.

Still not make sense to you

at all

?

PS - Factor in we know (if TMH is scum) that RC was ready to bus him that day. Which makes me wonder if scum was worried about #2...

[I Am Innocent]

@Mod, if scum do not send in their choice on who to pass the ability to, does the randomized pool consists of all players or all players excluding that scum's teammates?

[I Am Innocent]

Whoops, just noticed I left StrangerCoug off my list above. Just waiting on him and LynchMePls to chime in.

[I Am Innocent]

#4 CKD said he forgot to send it.

hoping to get to this game today...

saw this and it popped out as super scummy.

is that what I said?...or is it that I havent been on the site until sunday

and I MISSED getting in my choice

? being the good little scum hunter you want everyone to believe you are, I assume you checked to see if I was lying??? no? OOOOhhh, you rather misrepresent me and lie...

Yet you posted

6 minutes

after the mod opened up the thread??? Doesn't work that way bud, sorry.

[I Am Innocent]

#4 CKD said he forgot to send it.

hoping to get to this game today...

saw this and it popped out as super scummy.

is that what I said?...or is it that I havent been on the site until sunday

and I MISSED getting in my choice

? being the good little scum hunter you want everyone to believe you are, I assume you checked to see if I was lying??? no? OOOOhhh, you rather misrepresent me and lie...

Yet you posted

6 minutes

after the mod opened up the thread??? Doesn't work that way bud, sorry.

and 40 minutes after deadline what is your point? and I notice how you scooted around the point that you lied...I didnt say I forgot...i said I missed...for I did...and I also noticed how you didnt mention that you meta-ed my current games to see if yes, i indeed was around until last night.

anyway....need to catch up....


so if tmh flips town, why are you giving me the treestump? am I still scum either way?...bullshit and a scum bag.

1) My point is that you "conveniently" showed up right as the Day started. You were MIA the whole night, and came back with your "alibi" right after the day started. I don't buy the coincidence that your timing of coming back from being LA/V was that close to the Day 3 starting.

2) Your defensiveness and weak attacks that I "lied" are well noted. Are you saying you remembered that you needed to do cycle your ability, but that you had 0 time to get online to do it??? Do you admit that it was critical to send your ability to TMH???

3) I meta'd your current games after you weakly attacked my scumhunting abilities. And yes I noticed how conveniently your time off the site paralled the night in this game where you "needed" to be MIA to avoid sending an ability to your teammate.

4) My earlier post had a typo, if TMH flips scum, yes I will be gunning for you hard. A few have brought up good points, if you are likely scum does it behoove us to take you off the lynch list D4 by giving you the treestump. I'll have to think hard.

So yes, if TMH flips town, my whole argument gets thrown by the wayside. But the parallel between you, TMH, and RC seems to real to me.

My Top 3 right now
TMH
CKD
q21

Nero Cain feels like the easy target today, the DBE/Powerox/Helghast of prior days.

Would like to see everyone's Top 3 suspects please. Also please chime in if I should or should not send the TreeStump to the next scummiest player after TMH, being that TMH is the likely lynch today.

[I Am Innocent]

I called this D2. I said that if TMH and CKD are scummates, scum would probably try to bus TMH to protect CKD, knowing CKD would not be able to send the tree stump to TMH as we commanded him to do.

Could also be why RC was asking "Do you really have the tree stump". He needed to know to bus TMH. And since you get the abilities at the end of the night, he probably wouldn't have known for sure that CKD had it.

There is an error in your chain of logic. RC was scum. If TMH and CKD are scum together, then RC is scum with TMH and CKD. >>> there would be no need for RC to confirm the tree stump with CKD in-thread.

Yes my theory assumes two things:
1) They got their abilities after night talk ended
2) There is no day talk

*****************

Still waiting on StrangerCoug and LynchMe.

*****************

Thanks Mod for answering my question.

Whether CKD sent it to me intentionally, or randomly, we are not teammates (unless you believe Diddin redirected that ability, which we know he wouldn't have because he wanted TMH to get it).

[I Am Innocent]

I'm not sure I follow you on the Nero is the easy target point, given that none of your top three are pushing for Nero at the moment. Do you also suspect Saint or DBE?

Assuming DBE is DrippingGoofball? If so, I do not suspect that slot at all, but am curious about Pops question to DG, and would like to see an answer to that.

Saint I am leaning scum at the moment.

If TMH flips scum, do not send the stump to CKD - or whoever else is next scummiest - because we would like to be able to lynch that person. Taking the nest scummiest player off the list of those we can lynch seems counterproductive.

Yeah that is the dilemna. I do want it on record so nobody else will send any pro-town abilities to that person and maybe the SK can off them that night (N4). We need to get rid of this thing before the endgame.

I am leaning against passing it to CKD N3 because I am confident when TMH flips that CKD will be the best choice D4 for a lynch (or SK N3).

I will look over everybody's top 3 and will pick someone that many people agree is fairly scummy and get it on public record D3.

[I Am Innocent]

It was so critical to yesterdays plan that it IS NOT something that is acceptable just to "Forget".

We didn't lynch Obvscum because people wanted to get rid of an ability instead of scum. Now look what happened.

Very fair point, and as one of the people that pushed that strategy, I deserve some grief for that.

On the flip side, one of the big sticking points was to have TMH with the Treestump today hoping the dayvig would off him and the ability, and so far there is no sign of the Virus which probably means the dayvig is useless today which means it is a VERY GOOD thing that TMH does not have the Treestump, otherwise we would have no way of killing him today. But we do, as he can be lynched. And hopefully have a lead to the next scum when he flips scum.

One side point, the Bus Driver ability is gone, so there will be no switch-a-roos go forward with the Treestump (outside of someone missing the chance to pass it along), so we are better off saying before the day ends where we are sending it to. Two fold reasons why:

1) We can make sure no pro-town abilities end up with that player, hence creating an opportunity to off it with dayvig/purge ability in the future.

2) We can continue to use it to track people. A scummy person should have it tomorrow. That way we continue to eliminate scum pairs as long as it does remain in the game.

[I Am Innocent]

I did not see the reference to DBE as a scum slip by q21.

I still think the two biggest scumtells by q21 are links to TMH (or possible nhammen).

TMH telling q21 that Diddin was not the lynch D1, that "we're" going to need the dayvig. Diddin survives, D2 TMH has the dayvig.

q21's first set of suspects is one I have seen scum do, have a large list, and include a teammate in the "less so" group. That less so group had TMH, and EC/nhammen.

I still think TMH goes first and that is where my vote would be if I had one.

[I Am Innocent]

Vi, you pushed the quadz lynch hard yesterday. You are now pushing Nero which I got a town read on. Your list of reads are almost a complete opposite of mine. You are defending CKD and TMH, my two biggest scum reads. You have a strong reputation, and I think pretty highly of myself, so I just can't see how two smart townies could be so far off this far into the game.

******

Furc, no I do not. TMH made a calculated move. He took the Dayvig, knowing scum would control it and that he would be safe. He had a strong wagon D1, and was a likely target D2. He killed Parama after it was breadcrumbed to death that he was the doctor. Everything was very calculated and played very well actually for someone trying to stay in the game.

And now factor in the Treestump avoided ending up in his lap....too many strange things surrounding this one player to all be coincidence.

[I Am Innocent]

Look at q21's ISO post 5.

Votes Powerox (confirmed innocent)

Then suspects
Nero Cain (I suspect is town)
Diddin (confirmed innocent)

"Less so"
TMH
EC

My guess is that q21 is scum, and the one link is TMH. Meaning Nero and EC/nhammen are probably town.

It starts with TMH though.

[I Am Innocent]

[*]Once the majority required for a Lynch is reached, votes are locked in place and cannot be rescinded. The same policy applies to No Lynches as well. Discussion during twilight, the period of time before the mod scene is posted, is acceptable.

Mod scene not posted, so I am good to talk (I think).

Going to pass the TreeStump to q21. I do not think any other pro-town abilitilities should be passed to him (my opinion).

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent (“Randomly” Sent?)
Day Vig:

diddin

-> themanhimself (stole the ability) ->

RedCoyote

/Void (Not verified)
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent ->
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> randomly assigned?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen ->
?: nhammen -> Implosion ->
?: q21 -> Implosion ->
?: Saint -> q21 ->

Night 2 Actions

I Am Innocent: two power roles D2 passed along
Implosion: had two power roles D2 passed along
nhammen: had one power role D2 passed along
q21: had one power role D2 passed along
themanhimself: Passed DayVig to RC/Void

Curiouskarmadog Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2
DrippingGoofball: Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2 - 2 Power Roles???

popsofctown: Vanilla Town D2
Saint: Vanilla Town D2
Nero Cain: Vanilla Town D2
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D2
Bunnylover: Vanilla Town D2
LynchMePls: Vanilla Town D2

When Day 4 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 2
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day 3 or not.

[I Am Innocent]

town need to be very careful with their voting, seriously guys

As a matter of fact, how about we just start this day with FOS's. No votes until we get some discussion going.

FOS CKD

[I Am Innocent]

As I said, I had two abilities on night two. I passed one to IAI, and one to popsofctown.

Just to be clear and provide some encouragement, since i have a minute online:

Everyone post who you sent the abilities that you HAD NIGHT TWO (that is, the abilities that you claimed yesterday, but didn't say who you sent them to).

DO NOT claim what those abilities were

. We will eventually, but DO NOT YET say whether or not you had any abilities yesterday. Failure to comply today may or may not result in a policy lynch.

I already said I had the Void Collector and picked the one item in the Void to choose from, which was the Hibernate ability D2.

I sent these to Implosion/StrangerCougar, I guess at this point I won't say which was which based on the underlined above (or were you referring to abilities not yet revealed?).

At some point I would like the player with Void Collector ability to verify what I said D3. Also would like that player, at some point, to clarify whether they retrieved the Dayvig from the Void or not that day (it should have been the only option).

[I Am Innocent]

The one exception to Implosion's post is the Treestump ability.

I did indeed have that D3 and sent it to q21 N3.

q21 is my other biggest FOS at the moment based on the TMH flip.

q21, please confirm you got the Treestump and prove it with a vote. Thanks.

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent -> q21
Day Vig:

diddin

->

themanhimself

(stole the ability) -> (Unknown) -> ?
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent -> Implosion/StrangerCoug ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent -> Implosion/StrangerCoug ->
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> randomly assigned? -> ?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> I Am Innocent ->
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> popsofctown ->
?: Saint -> q21 -> ?

Night 2 Actions

I Am Innocent: two power roles D2 passed along to Implosion/StrangerCoug
Implosion: had two power roles D2 passed along to I Am Innocent/popsofctown
nhammen: had one power role D2 passed along
q21: had one power role D2 passed along

Curiouskarmadog Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2
DrippingGoofball: Claims to not have sent Power Role from D2 - 2 Power Roles???

popsofctown: Vanilla Town D2
Saint: Vanilla Town D2
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D2
Bunnylover: Vanilla Town D2
LynchMePls: Vanilla Town D2
StrangerCoug: Vanilla Town D2?

When Day 4 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 2
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day 3 or not.

[I Am Innocent]

Questions I have entering D4:

1) What happened to the Dayvig, was it in the void? (Void Collector should be able to confirm)

2) StrangerCoug, your one post D3 was vague. Did you have any powers DAY TWO that you could have passed along? I think I am reading that as a No, that you only had the Virus Ability to start D2.

3) Dripping Goofball, please say how many powers did you have N2? Was it one or two? Plain English please.

4) Pops, did you shoot Ckflip N1?

5) nahmmen and q21, who did you pass the abilities to N2?

Once #5 is answered, I think we are okay to each say how many abilities we had D3 that we could pass along N3.

[I Am Innocent]

LynchMePls, there was a Hibernate Ability out there as well, so please do not say any more at this time.

I need an answer to this question ASAP, Pops, did you Purge ChkFlp N1 or not.

I'd rather we keep the discussion on power roles to a minimum at this point. I think 2 players have already said too much IMO.

[I Am Innocent]

Quick check on who has claimed Night 2 passes. This is partially based on I Am Innocent's post, so correct me if there are any errors.

Bunnylover → Nobody
curiouskarmadog → Nobody
DrippingGoofball → Nobody
I Am Innocent → implosion and StrangerCoug
implosion → I Am Innocent and popsofctown
LynchMePls → Nobody
nhammen → Saint
popsofctown → Nobody
q21 → implosion
Saint → Nobody
StrangerCoug → Nobody
WrathChild → Nobody

That's everybody, so I'll tell you I had an ability Night 3.

DGBall and CKD (treestump) had abilities but said they did not pass them on. Which means they were randomized. CKD's ended up with me.

DGBall's ended up with someone else, my guess is LynchMePls, but that still needs to be hashed out. (Not yet though.)

Anyone want to take credit (bad choice of word?) for the Nero Cain Purge N3?

PS - I had two abilities D3, both were passed on. So that validated CKD's random(?) pass to me and Implosion's pass to me as well.

[I Am Innocent]

3) Dripping Goofball, please say how many powers did you have N2? Was it one or two? Plain English please.

Two.

Please look back at your PM from D2 and tell us if both powers needed to be cycled N2.

I stopped the missing scum kill. IAI knows how.

I had an ability last night.

Once we know who you protected, we have two confirmed townies for the scumputer.

LynchMePls, there was a Hibernate Ability out there as well, so please do not say any more at this time.

Besides, who said that he protected anyone? He said IAI knows how he may have saved someone, and IAI says there may be another way.

Yes this is very odd considering LynchMePls's ability he is referencing was one that Pops/DGBall most likely had prior.

[I Am Innocent]

Who has passed an ability to RC and TMH?
If I believe no one passed any ability to TMH, but I'm not sure on RC.

No one passed an ability to TMH.

TMH said he passed one to RC, which had to be a lie based on the fact they were scum teammates. RC claimed Vanilla both D1 and D2.

Yes this is very odd considering LynchMePls's ability he is referencing was one that Pops/DGBall most likely had prior.

You really have no idea what I'm talking about?

I am pretty sure I know exactly what you are talking about.

But listen to me. Shotgunning a player with Hibernate though would be a save, so there are other possibilities.

LMP has

GOT

to be town.

Not ready to go this far, but there are definitely better lynches today than him.

[I Am Innocent]

It's in play. Let's decide who we want to dayvig, AND who we want to lynch.

It doesn't work like that.
The dayvig ability requires the Virus. I don't see a Virus around. The dayvig ability, if it is in the game, is presently useless.

But more importantly, consider the following.
...

I had the Void Collector ability N1. I said I passed it to either Implosion or StrangerCoug N2. Definitely not WC. So that still leaves the following possibilities:

1) WC got the Void Collector N3 and saw nothing in there, signaling the dayvig was already picked up the prior night.
2) Implosion or StrangerCoug collected the Dayvig N2, and passed it to WC last night
3) Diddin used the BusDriver Ability N2 and gave it to WC N2 (and for some reason WC never brought it up).

There are lots of explanations, no need to jump down WC's throat quite yet. I actually believe him that the dayvig is in someone's hands here. Now whether we get to use that with an MIA Virus is another question.

Obv if/swhen the dayvig is fired up, that player should come forward and zap q21/treestump IMO.

[I Am Innocent]

Saint/Vi, you are wrong on being impossible time wise.

I got the ability N1, probably more like Dawn of D2. I was told that I had one choice, the one quadz passed to MOI N1.

So 1 & 2 are definitely possibilities.

*********

I think the best three lynch candidates today are CKD, Saint, or Pops. The latter two have been pushing easy lynches throughout this game, and now they are pushing WC. I said Nero was the easy target D3, and DBE was D2, well now I say it is WC is the easy one D4. I am not for that lynch at all.

*********

One last person that bears watching is DGball. He said his power cycles. WE REALLY NEED TO FIND OUT WHO HAD THE ABILITY D3. If no one comes forward, either scum had it and is keeping quiet, or DGball is an SK or part of a 2nd scum team.

If no one comes forward and DGBall is telling the truth, well then D4 should mean town has it, and they should shoot q21/treestump.

*************

Everyone please officially claim if you Purged Nero Cain or not last night.

I did not Purge Nero Cain Night 3

[I Am Innocent]

Lol, Pops, we finally agree!

WC I am a little less upset about. The Day Vig ability is one that if used, appears to be needed to be declared in the thread.

The person that had the Void Collector Ability must have collected it the previous night/dawn, and that means whoever has the void collector ability now had no choices, as both TMH and Nero were Vanilla when they died.

************

Saint/vi, I am actually leaning that way as well. I think DGB is an SK and we have another scum team of probably about 5 players (now 3) or so.

That is why I think everyone needs to go on record today saying if they Purged Nero N3. Then if we do the same thing N4, and both nights nobody claims, we know we either have an SK or two scum teams, as town did not have it for 2 straight days.

********************

IAI, SC, Saint,, and WC have all claimed not to have purged Nero Cain

Pops, why no answer?

********************

WC, does the dayvig hint that it needs be activated first before using? With no sign of the virus, it is very odd.

[I Am Innocent]

If I had to guess right now, my remaining suspects for the scum team would be CKD, q21, and either Pops/Saint.

I also suspect that DGB is possibly an SK.

DGB, who said the purge ability cycles, should prove to the group whether he is telling the truth by having a town come forward either today or tomorrow.

I think the best kill today is CKD, and will vote him once we 1) know more about the dayvig and if it is going to be activated and 2) everyone states whether they purged Nero Cain N3 or not.

[I Am Innocent]

Pops, why no answer?

I did answer.

I just looked and can't find it. Thanks for wasting my time.

vote: Popsofctown

[I Am Innocent]

The virus

could be

bouncing within the scumteam, ever so silently. But either way, it's clearly not going to explode today, so the dayvig, if it's truly dependent, is useless.

Bolded words are the frustrating ones, because I know you have information you aren't letting on.

This right here. D2 you (Pops) acted like you were responsible for giving StrangerCoug the virus. You would not go into details then and you still won't. I think it is shady, esp since the virus has gone away now that the dayvig is not in a known scum's hand, like it was Day 2 with TMH.

Day 1, Parama, town, starts with the virus. Diddin, town, had the dayvig, so scum would not know they were correlated when the virus was sent to Parama.
Day 2, StrangerCoug, starts with the virus. TMH, scum, had the dayvig.
Day 3, No virus, dayvig was not in the scums hands.
Day 4, No virus, dayvig with WrathChild.

I am wondering if the scum are scared of the dayvig, and have not been releasing the bomb (yes I think scum have that ability....and pops alluded to releasing it D2)

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent -> q21
Day Vig:

diddin

->

themanhimself

(stole the ability) -> ? -> WrathChild
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent -> Implosion/StrangerCoug ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent -> Implosion/StrangerCoug ->
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> LynchMePls (Randomly sent?) -> ?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen -> Saint -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> I Am Innocent -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> popsofctown -> ?
?: Saint -> q21 -> Implosion -> ?
Purge Ability?: ? -> DrippingGoofball -> ? -> ?

Night 3 Actions

LynchMePls: had one power role D3
popsofctown: had one power role D3
Saint: had one power role D3
StrangerCoug: had one power role D3
I Am Innocent: had two power roles D3

nhammen: Vanilla Town D3
Curiouskarmadog: Vanilla Town D3
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D3

Still need Implosion, q21, BunnyLover, DrippingGoofball to confirm how many roles they had D3/N3

When Day 5 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 3
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day/Night 4 or not.

[I Am Innocent]

@ Implosion, q21, BunnyLover, DrippingGoofball, please confirm how many roles you had D3/N3 that you had to pass on.

@ LynchMePls, popsofctown, nhammen, Curiouskarmadog, Implosion, q21, BunnyLover, DrippingGoofball, please say whether you purged Nero Cain or not.

(IAI, SC, Saint, and WC have all claimed not to have purged Nero Cain)

[I Am Innocent]

BunnyLover, what I am saying is that I think the scum team can choose if they want to send the virus out and who it would go to if they do.

It is the only explanation I can come up with for why the virus has stopped showing up....and also based on the below posts from D2 that Pops has refused to elaborate on.

All right, the virus is back in play and I've got it. Who should it go to?

SC says he has the virus.

...@StrangerCoug: Pass the virus to me, I want to look at it. I can give it right back if you like. I can't explain why, sorry.

Implies pops has not seen the virus yet. More of that in the first paragraph of the post below:

For the record, if someone gets the virus, and we somehow never see it again, that person is scum. The virus should be used as a lynch. Scum could pass it betwixt themselves perpetually and have it never go off until the day ends, (well that was my concern, and something I'd like to check when I get it)(I had another more secretive concern but I realized it doesn't matter. Oh well).

We need to pick someone scummy to give the virus to, and tell that person they'll eat it and like it. If they refuse we give the virus to someone else, and then lynch the person who refused to eat the virus, since that person would eat the virus if they realized refusing to do so would only cause us to waste a lynch on them. This process isn't nearly as good as a real daykill, unfortunately, but it's better than killing a lurker just-because.

Viralvote:DarlaBlueEyes

@Parama suicide: Let's not let Parama touch the virus. As confident as Parama is that he has the entire game read perfectly, I don't have that confidence in him and I doubt everyone else does.

In fact, it really might be safest if me and StrangerCoug throw it back and forth. I feel pretty good about his alignment since he didn't hide the potato, and regardless of his read on me he'll at least see that I'm willing to toss back the potato whenever he gives it to me. Even though we could hold someone accountable for the vanishing of the potato, I don't want to see a scum holding a cop ability or a scum who thinks he's just going to die anyhow to hide the potato, or pass the potato to a lurker.

Either of us can pass it to a the target once we have a consensus on who should die.

After calling him out in post 911, Pops returns with the following:

I'm not going to risk it.

I caused StrangerCoug to have the virus

. The daykill is protown, as is pseudolynching with the virus so I selected the player I felt most likely to survive the night but who still had a town feel.

My original choice though, was MoI, with similar logic. I spent so much time combing through his posts during my decisionmaking process and so little with Coug's smaller opportunity that I mistakenly thought I had passed my ability to MoI, sending it to the void. When Coug claimed he had the ability, I was very confused, and I wanted to see if it was the same virus Parama started the game with. If it was, it implied a bus driver.

I felt really stupid when just a few minutes later I remembered considering StrangerCoug as an option, and then subsequently decided that posting volume is correlated with nightkillability and that I should target Coug instead of MoI.


@saying that explaining how to misuse the ability as scum is suspicious: What the heck? I had to give StrangerCoug a reason to pass back and forth with me, and since people like you exist and make me claim things that dont need claiming, justify my actions. That's why I revealed that info. Any scum who can't figure out that strategy on their own is braindead.


Further more, if I AM scum, already know the strategy! If I were scum I would have shared it last night with all my partners in case they get infected, since everyone suspected the virus might come back. The fact you pointed out antitown behavior but didn't realize that it doesn't make sense in any way for actually showing me to be scum makes me suspect you know that I'm town.

@CKD: if that ability doesn't turn out to be Tree Stump you're stupid for claiming.

The whole paragraph above shows that Pops somehow chose SC to start off the day with the bomb.

[I Am Innocent]

The next three dead players need to be the following in some order {CKD, Pops, q21}

If no townies come forward D4 or D5 taking credit for the purge kills, DGBall needs to be added to that list.

My vote stays with Pops for now, but CKD is another (the only other?) wagon I would consider.

[I Am Innocent]

Pops, why no answer?

I did answer.

I just looked and can't find it. Thanks for wasting my time.

vote: Popsofctown

I need an answer to this question ASAP, Pops, did you Purge ChkFlp N1 or not.

Neauxpe.

As my momma always says, Did you really look, or did you just want me to find it for you?

Once again, did you Purge

NERO CAIN N3

or not?

[I Am Innocent]

Since there is some confusion. I'll clarify:

1. I have had no ability for the entirety of the game until today.
2. I have the Day Vig. It is inactive.
3. It is flavored a bot oddly, so I'm gonna double check everything.

So, the Void Collector thought that you would make the best person to hold the Day Vig? What? Question for IAI: if the void collector was in scum hands, could they pass the collected ability to a scum partner?

The Void Collector has the same restriction as other abilities, which for me is that I cannot pass more than 1 ability to the same player each night.

None of the abilities I have gotten have said anything about the scum restriction, but then again I am not scum so that does not surprise me.

But as I said above, it seems standard to me, and if it wasn't standard, scum would just send it back and forth to each other and pass on the collecting anything pro-town from the void, which does not seem to be the purpose of that ability. So my best guess is that it is standard and they cannot pass it back and forth.

*************

Pops, I saw later where you say you have not purged anyone this game, so I will take that as (finally) an answer to my question.

*************

I think Pops needs to disclose everything there is about the Virus creating ability. Like the Purge ability from N2, it has only come up once and not again. Both seem too suspicious to me that nobody has claimed or backed up the stories on these two abilities to this point.

Anyone disagree with Pops disclosing everything about it?

[I Am Innocent]

DGBall, did you have an ability N2 that would send the virus to a player D3?

LynchMe, did you have an ability N3 that would send the virus to a player D4?

For Pops, did you have to send the virus to a player D2, or was that optional?

For DGBall/LynchMe, if the answer above is yes, did you have to send the virus to a player the next day?

[I Am Innocent]

Just so I understand, we believe the Dayvig is out there, but no one is claiming it? Ditto that no one is claiming the purge?

Wrath Child has claimed the Dayvig D4. So far nobody has claimed the purge of Nero Cain N3 (nor chkflp N1)? No sign of the Virus, which I look to you to answer in the prior post of mine...

I do not think it is wise to ask if anyone has the Purge ability currently/to use N4?

[I Am Innocent]

Hurry up pops

WHo did you target with that magnificient ability you passed on to me

QUICK

DGB, that's already been claimed for pages. I targetted Stranger Coug with that ability. I claimed that once Coug said he had become infected with the virus D2.

No, that means I didn't have anything relating to a virus, ever.

At the very least, one of you two are lying.

Pops, was the only ability that you had N1, the one you said you passed to DGBall, the Virus Ability (the optional one that you get to choose who starts the next day with the Virus)?

[I Am Innocent]

@ Everyone, please state in your next post if you think at this point in the game, whether we should mass claim our roles from D1/N1 & D2/N2? And why you feel that way.

[I Am Innocent]

DGB you should have had more than two subroutines I don't know why you're saying you only had two. If you're not lying, the role is changing in some bastardly unfathomable way.

I just checked the PM. That's because it lists abilities "subroutines" that have been REMOVED FROM PLAY. Therefore, they are expected to change. I had double-voter and _____________. Shall I name this ability?

Not yet. Let's see what people have to say.

Didn't the Double-Voter get removed D1 with Powerox???

[I Am Innocent]

IAI has missed my claims of not purging once or twice now

Proof please? Posts with associated Post numbers will be sufficient.

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent -> q21
Day Vig:

diddin

->

themanhimself

(stole the ability) -> StrangerCoug/randomly sent to WC -> WrathChild
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent -> StrangerCoug ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent -> Implosion ->
?: popsofctown -> DrippingGoofball -> LynchMePls (Randomly sent?) -> ?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen -> Saint -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> I Am Innocent -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> popsofctown -> ?
?: Saint -> q21 -> Implosion -> ?
Purge Ability?: ? -> DrippingGoofball -> ? -> ?

Night 3 Actions to pass along

LynchMePls: had one power role D3
popsofctown: had one power role D3
Saint: had one power role D3
StrangerCoug: had one power role D3 (two if you count the dayvig randomly being sent)
I Am Innocent: had two power roles D3
Implosion: had two power roles D3

nhammen: Vanilla Town D3
Curiouskarmadog: Vanilla Town D3
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D3
DrippingGoofball: Vanilla Town D3
q21: Vanilla Town D3
BunnyLover: Vanilla Town D3

When Day 5 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 3
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day/Night 4 or not.

***IAI, SC, Saint, WC, LynchMePls, q21, Implosion, nhammen, popsofctown, BunnyLover, Curiouskarmadog, have all claimed not to have purged Nero Cain
That leaves just DrippingGoofball, who should not have been able to purge as he took credit for the night before...

[I Am Innocent]

I have got ten roles listed above, and now nine people who claimed to have roles D3/N3.

That means either the Purge ability is not real and DGB is a SK or on a 2nd scum team, or the Purge ability is real and scum had it D3/N3 and town has it today.

We should do the claim thing again D5 for whoever gets purged N4, and if nobody comes forward, DGB should be the lynch candidate (unless we just want to lynch him today).

[I Am Innocent]

Didn't the Double-Voter get removed D1 with Powerox???

That's what I had when I replaced in on Day 2.

Did you ever use it?

[I Am Innocent]

Didn't the Double-Voter get removed D1 with Powerox???

That's what I had when I replaced in on Day 2.

Did you ever use it?

I didn't use the double-voter, obv. The other one, yes. Results, no.

And yet the other one was not the purge ability, which you claimed to use N2?

[I Am Innocent]

@ Everyone, please state in your next post if you think at this point in the game, whether we should mass claim our roles from D1/N1 & D2/N2? And why you feel that way.

I've been thinking about this since early game. I'm not totally opposed to it, however one of the abilities I've had over the course of the game would have some possible negative repercussions if fully claimed (probably not, but maybe). Note: it isn't one of the abilities that we've been discussing today. I'd still probably overall be in favor of a d1/d2 massclaim. It could drastically simplify everything.

This is how I feel. I guess if there was an ability that we really were not sure about, I would say err on the side of caution and keep that one quiet.

But other ones, we might as well come out on. Saint/Furc already said he was a roleblocker, so we might as well fill the blanks with that.

The role you sent to me N2 that I passed on N3 is another one that I think we should out. Not sure I should take my information to the grave, you know? What are your thought on this role being outted?

[I Am Innocent]

please explain to me how claiming is scummy

What reason does a town player have to say "hey guys, i'm a power role right now, scum can get rid of it by killing me tonight?" In effect, that's what claiming a power role does.

QFT

The three players with votes currently are the best 3 candidates today. I am curious to see where everyone lines up on these three, as I doubt all 3 are scum...

***********

@Pops and DGB, are you really suggesting that abilities that left with the dead players, like the double voter, were brought back into the game???

[I Am Innocent]

@ Everyone, please state in your next post if you think at this point in the game, whether we should mass claim our roles from D1/N1 & D2/N2? And why you feel that way.

I've been thinking about this since early game. I'm not totally opposed to it, however one of the abilities I've had over the course of the game would have some possible negative repercussions if fully claimed (probably not, but maybe). Note: it isn't one of the abilities that we've been discussing today. I'd still probably overall be in favor of a d1/d2 massclaim. It could drastically simplify everything.

This is how I feel. I guess if there was an ability that we really were not sure about, I would say err on the side of caution and keep that one quiet.

But other ones, we might as well come out on. Saint/Furc already said he was a roleblocker, so we might as well fill the blanks with that.

The role you sent to me N2 that I passed on N3 is another one that I think we should out. Not sure I should take my information to the grave, you know? What are your thought on this role being outted?

EBWOP - FILL IN THE BLANKS means just D1 - D3, we need to continue to keep quiet on where those roles are currently.

[I Am Innocent]

unvote Pops

My new top 2 is CKD & Q21.

I like Saint/Furcs call that DGB is likely an SK or Town Hero. They live for one more day, which makes CKD the lynch today. I am not ready to vote yet.

**********

I was a Tracker N3, and I tracked BunnyLover and got nothing. All my other roles from D3 & earlier have been outted already (Hibernate, Void Collector, Tree Stump)

**********

Understanding what Pops and DGB have been saying,

I am guessing LynchMe, you used that power for the Doctor Ability? Who did you protect N3?

**********

@Pops, DGB, and LynchMe, please list the name of the ability (only one of you have to do that) and the abilities you got to choose from each night. I want to verify the list. (Preferably Pops first, then DGB, then LynchMe)

**********
Implosion, who did you track? I will be updating my chart with this new information.

[I Am Innocent]

Roles that could determine a lack of scum teammates:

Treestump: Implosion -> Curiouskarmadog -> I Am Innocent -> q21
Day Vig:

diddin

->

themanhimself

(stole the ability) -> StrangerCoug/randomly sent to WC -> WrathChild
Void Collector: (nobody D1) -> I Am Innocent -> StrangerCoug ->
Hibernate Ability:

quadz08

->

MOI

/Void/Collected by I Am Innocent -> Implosion ->
?: popsofctown (Virus) -> DrippingGoofball (DoubleVoter)/randomly sent to LynchMe -> LynchMePls -> ?
?: Bunnylover -> nhammen -> Saint -> ?
Tracker: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> I Am Innocent (Bunny) -> ?
?: q21/nhammen -> Implosion -> popsofctown -> ?
Roleblock: Saint (DBE) -> q21 -> Implosion (NC) -> ?
Purge Ability?: ? -> DrippingGoofball -> ? -> ?

Night 3 Actions to pass along

LynchMePls: had one power role D3
popsofctown: had one power role D3
Saint: had one power role D3
StrangerCoug: had one power role D3 (two if you count the dayvig randomly being sent)
I Am Innocent: had two power roles D3
Implosion: had two power roles D3

nhammen: Vanilla Town D3
Curiouskarmadog: Vanilla Town D3
WrathChild: Vanilla Town D3
DrippingGoofball: Vanilla Town D3
q21: Vanilla Town D3
BunnyLover: Vanilla Town D3

When Day 5 happens we should do the following in order:

1) Everyone in their first post state who they sent an ability to Night 3
2) Once

everyone

has completed step #1, then everyone come forward on whether they had a power role Day/Night 4 or not.

***IAI, SC, Saint, WC, LynchMePls, q21, Implosion, nhammen, popsofctown, BunnyLover, Curiouskarmadog, have all claimed not to have purged Nero Cain
That leaves just DrippingGoofball, who should not have been able to purge as he took credit for the night before...

[I Am Innocent]

drip is eruci according to the op
not daevori
rambo, perhaps

Not sure what he is, but as long as it is just "questionable" or scum players getting taken out, he can live in my book. I see a very town player get purged, he is gone. (hint hint, q21/treestump is a very questionable person, hint hint)

[I Am Innocent]

I am guessing LynchMe, you used that power for the Doctor Ability? Who did you protect N3?

YOU!

First of all, thank you. Without knowing the last couple of unnamed Abilities, so far we know that either:

1) I was targeted, you protected me
2) Implosion was targeted, Hibernate protected him
3) Shotgunning team passed
4) Another ability I do not know about had something to do with the miss.

I am going to guess #1 or #2 as most likely. What do we both have in common? We are tied to CKD (Implosion passed the stump to him, I received it after him).

I make that correlation because Diddin died the Night right before TMH was likely to be lynched, which would have confirmed his innocence.

And CKD had to know he was a likely target, esp since I announced that q21 was going to have the treestump and could not be the target today. And his death would confirm two players...

CKD is the choice today, so no worries WC. He has two votes I believe, and LynchMe and I have already both announced our intention to jump on as well.

************

LynchMe, what choices did you have with that ability last night?

[I Am Innocent]

I sincerely apologize for this, but it has been brought to my attention that there was a mod error in DrippingGoofball's final Day / Night Two Ability Message. DrippingGoofball has received a corrected Ability Message for that Night.

Interesting...

I still think Saint/Furc was closest that DGball is an SK/Hero. I am okay leaving him for one day, but would like to suggest the following strategy:

Purge ability (whoever that may be ) is used on q21

q21 probably does not have any abilities based on the fact I gave everyone a heads up I was sending him the treestump N3.

q21, should be roleblocked then.

DGball, should be tracked. If he gets tracked with anyone other than q21, everyone needs to lynch him D5.

With that, I feel comfortable with:

Vote: CuriousKarmaDog

My Top Suspects, pretty much in order:
CKD
q21
Pops/DGBall (tied)
BunnyLover
Saint

Have town reads on everyone else.

[I Am Innocent]

It is interesting, whoever PlsLynchMe passed the role to could use the Watcher (on DGB) instead of the Doctor (on a very townie playeR) N4. Not sure I'd advocate one over the other publicly, let's let the person who has it decide what to do privately to keep the scum in the dark on what they should do.

But good suggestion none-the-less.