Stars Aligned III - The Tenth Day

[SpyreX]

Jesus game.

I heard no noise. I did not ward.

I've read some of the SA II but haven't played in any.

THAT SAID:

Fate & Ben: This shit stops. Now. FURTHER, if Fate shows up Murdered tonight I swear to everything holy REGARDLESS OF HIS DAMN ALIGNMENT you are dead. Soon.

For 10 pages in though minus that slapfight there's some good things a happenin'. Like a laundry list of towns being all towns BUT THIS CAN WAIT.

Unvote, Vote: AurousVox

This struck me as anti-town (it was later retracted, but was this because Fur didn't want to look anti-town, or because he didn't want to be anti-town?)

Whilst this plea looks pro-town on first glance, it makes me worried that Fur is already planning on going the killer route. By stressing that town can win if they band together, by stressing that no one needs to make a second kill - if he then goes on to become a murderer, he may have dissuaded some people from taking that route, thus increasing his chances. Moreover, finding out who stalked also tells him who his competition could be later in the game.

It is POSSIBLE that he Stalked but didn't want to admit it yet, was caught in Lynch All Liars, appealed to the mod in desperation, and was fortunate that the rules had changed. Admittedly, that is a stretch (besides, in my opinion scum would have more likely said "Oh wait I stalked, whoops wrong thing!"), but it IS possible. In Hito's "confirm" he only mentions that El heard noise, not the fact that Furc didn't hear noise. It looks a little suspect, as does the fact that Furc is constantly affirming how great Hito is - but Hito is otherwise giving me a townie vibe and Furc has actually otherwise had some good pro-town moves:

^All of this is well thought out. Could be a little too well thought out - I'm thinking that this "5/7" would spring to a cultist's mind quicker than it would to a townie. Overall though, I think Furcolow has started the game sided with the town. Whether or not he has intentions of becoming a killer later, I'm not sure...

Lets start this party off with something important: Fur is town. Not because of the confirm business - its just one of those actually playing like a brofessional things I like.

So, the confirm part I can get behind as per MoI's.

But this?

We get a LOT of words that say, all nice and quantified, Fur is a stalker, no wait, he's cult, no wait, I think he's town.

And, of course, no vote - because he thinks he's town BUTTT quantified enough that a wagon jumpin dance party can take place.

F--

[SpyreX]

I haven't had a chance to bro-up because I missed enough time for madness to start spewing all over everything.

Yo yo RC what makes you think either of the chuckleheads are scum?

[SpyreX]

are u trying to get a brolliance with me/rc?
im so up for that
vote: seacore
lets get this pahtay stahted!

I'm makin a list. Checkin it twice.

Not sure how well it works with the murderers so I'm holding onto it.

Spyrex calling me a chucklehead?
Spyrex saying I better not be dead regardless but not calling me town?
Spyrex not calling me town when I am clearly such?

Things aren't sitting right.

I also found something ill post later regards to furcolow.

You're my boy, so trust me when I say you are a chucklehead its only because you are a chucklehead.

AND READ BETWEEN THE LINES SHEESH I'M P SURE BOTH OF YOU ARE TOWN.

No other combination of events makes any sense BUT, as like I said to fur, its not quite ripe for plucking yet.

Yo

[SpyreX]

Well, I'm not willing to vote for Furc at the moment because I do think he's town. So there will be no wagon jumping dance party today. But I'm keeping an eye on him because I think there's a chance that he could have gone/be thinking of going the killer route. Being a killer = being town today. There is no contradiction there.

Ben is probably the scummiest player I've noticed on my first read but I'd rather see him prove his town credentials via him killing Fate than lynching him. Whether we Ressuccitate Fate is another conversation to have later, but IMO Ben can just put up with the insanities :\ there are some that it doesn't matter him having, like Twitchy, for example, if we know he's going to be getting them anyway.

And I'm going to re-read (skipping the cockfight) to get a better sense of the other players tomorrow. I don't feel like placing an RV at this stage in the game when there's already a lot to go on, and I don't want to put a vote down senselessly either.

And the "ohhh 5/7 cult flavor" dancing mechanics?

And NOW a reread?

And saying Ben is the scummiest but because he might kill Fate its not worth a vote?

Come on now.

[SpyreX]

I was gone for a handful of hours and multiple pages. Good god almighty.

I agree with SpyreX though that MANY PEOPLE have reached nigh-100% town status, and that this list should not be made

today

.

After looking at what is going on I am positive this is the right move. On top of the fact the raw madness needs to subside there is *SECRET REASONS* that play a part too.

I'll, just for fucking giggles, I'm going to ONCE AGAIN try to get it through Benmage's thick scull that he's wrong:

Wish me luck.

Just. Stop.

It's not going to happen and I DONT WANT THAT FIGHT AGAIN FFS. We're running into noise pollution already. Be part of the solution.

Baby Spice F--
Plum A++

SPYREX? FRIEND OF MY HEART? WE BOTH LOVE A GOOD VIG KILL, EVEN IF WE HAVE TO LIMIT OURSELVES TO ONLY ONE, NO? BONUS CONFIRMS YOU TOWN. PLEASE REMEMBER THIS AND GET BACK TO ME IN A COUPLE OF DAYS, 'KAY?

Yes ma'aam.

my patented (and highly affordable) Gastro-Intestinal Pro-(or Anti-)Town Detection Device.

Well then I think we're gonna have to get around the table and hash this out while twirling mustaches because apparently gremlins done snuck up ins there.

I just waded through 10 pages of posts, reading through every single one. Took me close to three hours. Out of those posts, how many did I actually want to comment on? 5. Out of 250.

Ohh HELL NO.

There's a lot of noise. Too damn much noise. But 5?

And if one is to assume these are the actual 5 you wanted to post about, SERIOUSLY.

You get a ticket on the short list.

I think it would be a good to make out a Town Approved Insanity list. Agree/Disagree?

Here's what I think are good:
Twitchy
Compulsion

Suicidal

Uhhh.

Sure thats awesome and all if we're not looking at end game but Its way easier to work without causing major issues with Distraction, Paranoid or even mid-late game Denial. Hell even Mutilation is better in the right HEAVILY CONTROLLED circumstances.

Xvart's got a lot of words that don't do a lot for me. At all.

* Hallucination - You always hear Noises each Night regardless of actions taken. This would deny the town information which is always a raw deal. It also makes it so scum can neatly sidestep noise-based inquires.
* Suicidal - You require one less vote to lynch. This is not reflected in vote counts and does not affect Sadism. As TNM said earlier, this could put us in LYLO a day early. It's too late for Benmage not to take it but I don't want anyone else doing it.
* Sadism - You may only place your votes on players who are one or two votes away from a lynch. Scum would love nothing more then to only vote on wagons that are probably sure things. Hell, if I was scum, I'd fake having Sadism even if I didn't take it. We allow Sadism into the game and pretty much all normal vote-based scumhunting goes out the window. I'll be policy lynching anyone who takes Sadism regardless of what the town thinks.
* Denial - Your Insanity Count does not increase tonight, but it will automatically increase by one on each of the following two Nights. This allows people to explain away -1 insanity discrepancies (no man, I just took denial) and +1 insanity discrepancies (no man, took denial two days ago.)
* Mutilation - You always appear Bloody for the purposes of the Investigate action. Again, what TNM said. If you're bloody, this is not an acceptable reason why.

Hallucination is definitely bad.
Suicidal as well.
Denial I think can be worked with.
Mutiliation works if it is known

ahead of time

thats the route its going AND its only done by the techiest of the tech. So, chances are its better to just nuke it but.
Sadism doesn't bother me but I think a lot can be said with words (If I was a Sadist I'd defintely a.) make it known and b.) make it apparent what wagon I would be voting for at all times) but yea I see both sides.

-----

Then, the fun stuff:

1) I'm not going to ignore something that looks like it could come from cult just because I have a town-read on someone. I made it clear that I didn't think he was cult. What's the problem?

2) I just read ~10 pages in one go. It's almost 1am. I am not re-reading until tomorrow.

3) Because he WILL kill Fate if we don't lynch Fate, and that would confirm him as town (as I understand it) - or be exposed as a liar. Since he can't die tonight anyway, I'd rather be cautious and let the guy who CAN confirm himself as town do that, if he is in fact town.

I just want this clear.

You don't see the problem* in going "ohh he's town but he could be cult". Orr, "Ohh he's town but he could go POWERTARD and become a murderer" with one of the handful of reads you've given.

Further, and this hurts the brain enough that I'm laying it down.

1.) You said ben is scum (or, the "scummiest player")
2.) You said there is no way to stop ben from killing fate if we don't lynch fate.
3.) You said the right answer is letting him kill fate to confirm himself as town (by going halfway down the murder route).

Problems with this are simple and beautiful:

1.) You've never even insinuated in the slightest that Fate is scum. So going "well, we cant do anything *shrug*" isn't awesome because of:
2.) THE WAY ONE DEALS WITH STOPPING BEN FROM KILLING FATE ESPECIALLY IF YOU ACTUALLY THOUGHT BEN WAS SCUM WOULD BE IN FACT VOTING AND PERHAPS EVEN LYNCHING HIM.

Jesus.

Super best points when I get my way (AND YOU BENMAGE PAY ATTENTION PLEASE).

If AV IS scum then, for sure I'd stake all the hats on it, BEN AND FATE are both town. 100% sans gotard.

[SpyreX]

I'm saying if I am right and AV gets lynched AND is scum...

DONT KILL FATE DOUBLE PLUS.

Even though YOU SHOULD BE DOING IT EITHER WAY I'M TRYING HERE.

Seriously.

[SpyreX]

Remember we don't get flips on people until their grave is robbed.

WOO FFF ME

Ok, then yes there is no "ohh alas past the point of no return" garbagio. Do NOT do it.

[SpyreX]

God in heaven. So many pages.

THIS POST ACTUALLY NEEDS MOST OF THE WORDS READ BY NOT JUST PEOPLE DIRECTLY INVOLVED.

Wait, why is BenMage now not killing Fate?
Are we seriously going to let him claim a free insanity and not prove his townie-ness by following through on his threat? And we won't know if AV's scum until at least D3; so that's a fair while for all of us to live in doubt... I have no idea why scum would act like BenMage in the first place, but I can't help but think SpyreX is giving him an out. Maybe there is a fetish of Fate already out there, one not created by Benmage, who was actually stalking him. Maybe the cult is now concerned that more than one investigator with res kits will now be watching Fate's back; and would prefer this protective field dissipate. In that case, maybe you'd ask Benmage to commit publicly to NOT kill Fate, and then lead the charge to string him from the nearest tree at the start of Day 2, when Fate's body is found, scattered like sticky red confetti. Playing peacekeeper in this case is kinda suss, if you ask me.

Sorry, Seacore, I just don't see how Benmage's actions make for any sort of rational scum play. Even of the double/triple/quintuple bluff variety.

I'll Vote: SpyreX because I'm still not really sure why he's so sure both Benmage and Fate are town.

Alright, lets preface this with something being brought up that needs to stop: MURDERING PEOPLE IS NOT A GOOD WAY TO SHOW YOU ARE 'TOWN'. IT, IN FACT, LOST THE LAST GAME LEARN FROM MISTAKES.

Especially not now. Especially not N0. Especially not after saying you're gonna go through with it after being told that is a baaad idea. Good god Plum posted the correct path to murdering and I even quoted it there is no excuse for ignoring it.

Now, as to why both of them are town. Lets play follow the thought processes:

Benmage goes "I've got beef with Fate. I'm going to stalk him N0. I heard no noise which means Fate didn't stalk me. The reason for this is because he CANT stalk me, hence scum"

There is method to that madness. Further, it makes no sense as a scum move because he would be outed right quick. So, this has to be a town move.

However, Fate goes "Stalking N0 is retarded. I am not retarded. Thus, I didn't stalk you."

and then explodes into rage

at having to try and explain this point.

WHICH IS TRUE. AND JUSTIFIED.

As scum there'd be some hate but, ultimately, not a lot of worry. Fate

is

worried.

As for giving Ben an out? YES I AM. He's already done an F-- job in picking suicidal. Going through with this is bonkers madness and HE REALLY SHOULD THINK OTHERWISE.

Hokay, onto topic two: Fur.

I can't believe we have to go through this but:

If, however, there is a technical error but no ambiguity, I will accept the action as-is. An example would be someone who submitted the Night Action

1. I am very welcoming to our hydra brethren, but I do insist that you declare to me who is in the hydra before the beginning of the game; if you do add someone else, please tell me!

/reserve spot.
Might be in hydraaa.

OHHAI

So, lets use a different example to tie into this: If I get too busy swimming in my millions of space dollars for a game and decide N2 to hydra with Mecha Godzilla the mod isn't going to ask if someone shot death lasers at SpyreX reaaallly meant Mecha SpyreX because ITS THE SAME DAMN PERSON. DGB = Drip = El Gooski.

This, ON TOP OF the initial clarification my god. I really need to go through and look and see if anyone is actually pushing play because there IS scum on this wagon.

Now, Fur, take a step back and stop feeding this fire.

WHY AM I WROTH WITH THIS THOUGH REALLY?

The above is dominating everything. Everything. And its bad.

Like I said above, I've never played with any of you. I can't read any of you well enough to form much of an opinion yet, and most of those 250 posts were by Fate, Benmage and Furcolow, the very players I mentioned. I'm still forming my opinions on the others. Also, I made that post at 3 AM, after a solid 3 hours reading. Not the optimal conditions to read the metas of other players.

I said absolutely ZERO about meta. Because meta is stupid.

However, that doesn't change that you said "I want to comment on 5 posts" and that is a cop out. Meta has nothing to do with it. Good lord this game has more going on that most in the early pages and FIVE posts?

No.

The finale though:

To be clear; I believe that Benmage IS lying but I'd rather be wrong about him being scum and have him confirmed by killing Fate, than to try to lynch someone who can confirm themselves as town.

The reasons that I think he is lying are: He seemed eager to lynch Fate and/or not shoot Fate, which makes me think he didn't stalk Fate. He has the chance to confirm himself as town and yet would rather lynch the guy than get that confirmation. It smells off. Add to that this hypocritical idea that Benmage has that Fate wouldn't craft his fetish if he was cult, and I'm not really sure where he's coming from at all.

Oorrrr you want chucklehead to kill Fate doing some of the work for you.

BECAUSE NO OTHER WORLD DOES "OHH HE CLAIMED A STALK BETTER NOT LYNCH THE GUY I THINK IS SCUM" make sense.

Good LORD I need the skinny on whatever is going on with Seacore because YOU GUYS NEED TO GET ABOARD THE MURDER TRAIN.

I MEAN YOU ARE VOTING FOR MOI FFS

[SpyreX]

This is for SpyreX too. As far as I can tell, the original vote was because of:

(a) Weakness of reads
I am not superhuman; I can't make awesomereads on 10+ pages of posts, after 15+ hours of working, at midnight. My initial post was poor, yes. I have since moved on and given a plethora of reads. If you don't agree with them, that's not my problem

(b) Unstable read on Furc
I've actually fought with you (MoI) against his lynch and disproved your mistaken assumptions, thereby planting myself firmly behind TOWN FURC, so I fail to see how you can still hold this as a valid argument. On the matter of conflicting reads, I'm actually pretty surprised that SpyreX doesn't understand that I argue myself into the wall from my behaviour in a certain Graveyard QT we're in together.

(c) Not voting for Benmage
If I was concerned with making myself appear townie, I would have voted for Benmage a long time ago. However, I'd rather be PROVED WRONG about him, and thereby let town have a CONFIRMED TOWNIE than trying to push for a lynch to stroke my ego and/or appear town. Do you honestly think that lynching Ben is the solution to my suspicions in this SPECIFIC instance? Of course, ordinarily, if you find someone scummy, you'd vote for them - but if they are the ONLY person in the town who can prove that they are town (at night), why the hell would you want to lynch them?!

@SpyreX's #547
Actually no. Now that Fate has made his offer of the Occult Book test, there's no longer any reason for Benmage to kill Fate, and this is something that I acknowledged before your post. Read plz kthx.

The pitcher is up. He throws it fast. CRACK its sailing to the outfield.

AV is in place to grab it. He reaches his glove up.

NO. The point goes sailing over his head. RUNNERS IN GAME OVER.

A.) How many of these reads aren't prefaced with some kinda garbage. (Pro-tip: You say HITO might go murderer but are A-OK with Ben's kill fate plan because he might be lying?)

B.) Its not "unstable". Its "Ohh snap he's town but could be MURDERER CULT EXTRODINARE ohh wait the mod clearly made that not be the case lets just go back to town."

C.)

If I was concerned with making myself appear townie, I would have voted for Benmage a long time ago

HAHAHAHA no.
No. How in the hell does that work?

Of course, ordinarily, if you find someone scummy, you'd vote for them

Not ordinarily. Always. And forever. ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY ARE GOING TO KILL.

Unless, you want that kill to happen.

This is gonna be real clear since you're all about omg read page and opt to leave out Ben's nested "I'm going to kill Fate" post RIGHT ABOVE THIS ONE.

Before this day ends Ben is either going to a.) say he's not going to kill fate or b.) get lynched.

[SpyreX]

OHH HELLS NO

Lets go down that list, for real (pro points for not putting me on there bazing).

MoI - scummy (since changed)
Furc - town
Fate - town
Benmage - scummy
Lost Butterfly - scummy
Totallynotmafia - town
Bowser - scummy? (asked for clarification)
Hito - town (the murder comment was a joke, wasn't that obvious?)
Andrius - scummy

1.) Scummy, yea. Again this is on the back of "others pointed it out"
2.) Town AFTER Percy. With the preface of "Ohh man I WIFOMED MY WIFOM"
3.) You DO say, without an amazing amount of equivocation, that Fate is town. You then proceed to want him shot in the face. Bravo!
4.) You say you think Ben is lying but want him to take the shot.
5.) You say you like Lost Butterfly's early posts (3 of them) but think they're scum for a laundry list of reasons. Why in the hell do you mention the first three posts if this is the dealio?
6.) This one is cut and dry.
7.) Yea, you did. In the "ohh is this metaaaa?" sense.
8.) Yea, totally a joke. Not like you pulled that exact same song and dance about fur, rite?
9.) Hell no you didn't say "scummy". You said "I don't like" that's one of those quantifications that are so awesome.

This also begs if you're gonna show me all your fatreads why didn't you mention: Me, Furpants, Reaper.

MOST of what I said in my first post leant him being town/murderer, because they're the same thing at this point. There are no murderers, there are only townies - who MAY become murderers. And there was one offhand comment about him potentially being cult. Since then that's settled onto Town, and I've been very vocal about it. I didn't realise that reads had to be concrete from the very start, Mr. SpyreX, sir.

Ohh HELLS NO.

See, this is the crux of it. Stalking N0? That's not town. It flat out isn't. This isn't a matter of debate. If there's 5 deaths tonight are you gonna go "OHH SNAP EVERYONE KILLIN PEOPLE COME FORWARD FOR YOUR CONFIRMED TOWN HATS!" No.

Because they wont. Because they're trying to kill people. In the bad way.

Um. You think it's suspect that I didn't vote. You think it's suspect that I didn't vote for Benmage. What would have solved both of those problems? Why, by golly, voting Benmage.

:headdesk: :headdesk:

No. Its REAL suspect when you go "Fate's town. Benmage is scummy. Yea, go ahead and kill him Ben so you can be AWESOME TOWND".

Yea, if you had went "Benmage is scummy, Vote:" We wouldn't be having this talk but in that world made of cheese and flowers you'd be town sooo.

Herpaderpa, THAT IS THE WHOLE POINT. I've been saying that I *do* want the kill to be attempted, to get a CLEAR TOWNIE. Is that not worth not lynching someone today?

AND ITS NOT A CLEAR TOWNIE AND KILLING SOMEONE YOU THINK IS TOWN ISNT USEFUL OR GOOD IN ANY FASHION MY GODDDD

Unless, REALLY, you're trying to straightface go "Ohh, Ben? The n0 stalker that took suicidial? Said he was going to kill regardless of the overall wishes? No way he'd kill again!"

Luckily, Fate claims to have gone for the Occult Book, and I'm under the impression that THAT is the strategy that we're going to use (i.e. Benmage WON'T kill OR get lynched because we can clear him ANOTHER way).

If Benmage says he is going to kill Fate tonight, would you try to have him lynched instead?

AND RIGHT ABOVE THE FIRST POST THAT STARTED THIS BEN VERY CLEARLY SAID HE THINKS FATE IS LYING AND (THUS) IS GOING TO SHOOT.

Yes GOD I SAID THAT EXACTLY WHAAAAAAAA

:explode:

Ok, deep breaths.

This is the dealio and maybe someone else can look at this rosetta stone straight faced and go "ohh yea makes total sense bro"

1.) AV thinks Ben is scummy.
2.) AV thinks Fur is town.
3.) AV thinks Fate is town.

-) AV thinks Fur (note, not Ben who claimed the Stalk) is setting up to be a murderer.
-) AV thinks Ben (note, the guy who is scummy) should kill Fate (note, the guy who is town) to prove his town powers.

I need this thought process explained to me in such a way that isn't ACTUALLY "Well, lets be sure to put some pressure on the 'confirmed' but back off when it wont and let Ben do some dirty work for us before he gets lynched for said dirty work"

[SpyreX]

I'll deal with you tomorrow thread.

FFF

[SpyreX]

Every time I sit down this thread crushes my will.

Actually, I had formulated a plan for keeping him alive via resuscitation whilst still testing the validity of the kill even in the event of scumFate. AFAIK Fate would still receive the death PM and then the "revival" PM and so we could test the stalk claim AND keep Fate alive; if he's town, he tells the truth, and if he's scum and says he received no PM, we can test Benmage for blood. Did you skim over that bit?

... is this how this works?

If so, maybe MAAAYBBE I'll need to readjust.

That doesn't change that this:

Well, we probably have more than one Res. Kit and we can prevent the kill even if he tries. vOv

So, why do you want to lynch the person who can confirm that they are not affiliated with the cult?

Still bothers me. Why waste the Res Kits on a bad action?

What is the larger dealio with Stalks? I mean all this talk of stalk = town = profit suuree

isn't

seems like a bad idea and come wagon time if another stalk claim comes through?

"I have a problem. I NEED Benmage to carry out his kill tonight otherwise he drowns us in WIFOM stew. Do not want. On the other hand, am very much leaning Town on Fate. HALP."

There is no WIFOM. There is no stew.

Benmage, period, can not be left to endgame unless its a flat sweep. That's just how it is.

----

I can't believe that I am saying this, but I think letting the kill go through would be good for the town,

even if Fate is town.

This early in the game a confirmed non-cultist would be very beneficial to the town, as it is one less person that is possibly scum (yes I realize that was very repetitive). After that, I think we should put BenMage on Grave Robbing duty, which there is a limit to the number that you can do in one night, last game it was 2. If anything BenMage should be warded tonight to prevent the scum from killing our possible confirmed town.

No. NO.

Hmmm... Furcolow not playing with the town's best interest in mind, nor caring about town opinions. Also scheming his own plan. Furc - you should be our gravrobber, then you get the added bonus of getting to nine insanities faster to double stalk, and your grave robbing will tell you when you find any other murderers (pending you are the only one to rob grave) so you know who to target next.

Alright, have I missed something amazing? Because, if not, after a few things are cleared up, ohhh snap. Because I'm pretty sure the idea is Fur is the right bro for brobbing because

he is pretty clearly town and isn't already prepping down failure road.

My plan gets rid of the stupid half of a very LOUD combination of people, saves Fate's life, and we've still got our Res kit. However, the Cult may still try to kill Fate (I'd rather Fate than a number of other people, though. sorry Fate ); that we don't really have any 'confirmed townies' (something I'd be willing to forgo to get Benmage out of the way, and free Fate up to scumhunt without worrying about some idiot killing him that night based on a childish vendetta).

Still though, I think there's a better plan out there.

<3

I'll admit I had some worries reaper (which I'll get to) but they're gone now. GOD.

---

Now, ASIDE FROM ALL THAT.

Will someone please, please,

please

explain to me what in the hell this Seacore business is about? I'm flat missing it.

[SpyreX]

If that's how it works I'm fumbling through something but isn't there the potential to, sans failure, clear whole swaths of people?

[SpyreX]

Follow me here because I have to be missing something:

Pick 6-7 people to stalk within groups of 2-3 (to prevent wards). Everyone else gets rez kits.

The next night they all take their shots on rez'd targets.

Assuming no one goes murderer, which would be a BAD idea if it went that way, the next day we should have 5-6 at minimum town.

[SpyreX]

Well I'm taking AV's word for it that he was the first to make a wall post about Furcolow being town, but now that I remember it I think that wishy washy post was why SpyreX was voting him in the FIRST PLACE, so .....

Except, of course, it was Hit who detailed the mod side of it before he did.
And, of course, my first post says Fur is town regardless of confirmation-gate.

I'm still nuts busy and I'll try to detail out what I was thinking and why before I sleep but madness.

[SpyreX]

Ninja:
Hmm, can you expand on the idea of "groups of 2-3"? It might solve some of the problems above but I'm not sure I follow what you mean.

2-3 narrows it so they can't just go OHH I DID X but keeps the "ohh noes they were warded" to a 33% (I'd say three) and creates segments in further days.

[SpyreX]

I'm going to try this again because unless I've missed the response which I don't think I have:

WHAT IS THE CASE/DEAL ON SEACORE THANKS IN ADVANCE.

Additionally AV what's the deal with "I was totally the first to say Fur was town" being absolutely full of lies?

OTHER EXCITING NEWS:

Ha it would be funny if he meant to post that in the scum QT.

Unvote, Vote: Fate

If those were one post MAYBE I could dig. Why that two minute pause to throw out a failure of a vote?

Dumb case is dumb. Fate is annoying and overly sure of himself; sadly, there's no town win condition to do with thread aesthetics. I've run out of useful questions for SpyreX, though, so it's not fair to hold my vote there.

Out of those tingling my scumdar and not already dogpiled,

I choose Bowser. SSBF's recent post summed up the mystery wrapped in not-paying-attention flavor he's giving out, so I have a question: Hey Bowser, what's your opinion of rewq?

Italics wants a friend to explain why its there.

[SpyreX]

Because there's no point throwing more questions at people who are already being interrogated adequately. I'm looking for people who are ducking attention.

Questions and votes aren't lovers. They can and do exist without each other. Much like how I asked you this!

And this!

Out of those tingling my scumdar and not already dogpiled, I choose Bowser.

Soooo you're pretty clearly saying one of the huge wagons is someone you think is scum.

I'm sure missing words that back that up.

[SpyreX]

SpyreX: I'd like to know why you've only attacked AurorusVox, but not people whose interactions concerning the Furc/Ben/Fate clusterfuck have been worse IMO (for example, MagnaofIllusion, xvart--other than a throwaway sentence--kunkstar, Baby Spice, rewq, us when Lost Butterfly had voted Furcolow).

Also, what do you think of Trilobite? Because I think Furpants is looking miles better than Trilobite in their exchange...and yet you only seem to mind Furpants.

I've haven't got there because a.) I still have a hate-on for AV despite all you tsk, tskers. b.) you'll notice I'm holding a whole MESS of things closer to the vest than I would normally due to the madness of the setup.

BUT, before I really address this:

How caught up is this post, because I'll let you hit the retry button.

Especially on this:

I now have a slight town read on AurorusVox after ISO reading him. His big oopsies seem to be that he wasn't willing to instantly clear Furcolow, being wishy-washy on Benmage, and perhaps trying to take too much credit for clearing Furc.

Because if somehow you got THAT being what I'm getting at then I may, in fact, explode.

[SpyreX]

Ok, I'm tired and have to sleep.

But I'm not seeing at ALL how:

Out of those tingling my scumdar

and not already dogpiled

, I choose Bowser.

=

I'm also saying that I think there are other,

non-wagonned people

I think might be scum.

[SpyreX]

Ok, this is cool and all in a mini or a game at normal speeds but I swear to god these wagons don't make any sense AND I CANT FIGURE OUT WHERE THEY ARE COMING FROM.

[SpyreX]

It'd be a nice change of pace.

[SpyreX]

THANK YOU

Unvote, Vote: RC

Yo yo AV-sama did you address this:

"Except, of course, it was Hit who detailed the mod side of it before he did.
And, of course, my first post says Fur is town regardless of confirmation-gate."

in the madness times?

And back to furpants:

Group A = People I think are probably scum
Group B = People I think are probably town
Groups A + B are exclusive.

Group 1 = People who are dogpiled
Group 2 = People who are not dogpiled
Groups 1 + 2 are exclusive, but both can co-exist with A or B.

That's all well and good HOWEVER that wasn't what I was saying. If you think someone being wagoned is scum and someone not being wagoned is scum why, every time thus far, is it the dude with no wagon thats getting a teehee vote?

[SpyreX]

@Fur:

Because the kill flavors are different and that makes no sense. None. Zero.

And, now that things are getting settled still cool with lowballs at wagons that aren't going anywhere or are you going to come out and say which person actually wagoned is scum?

Also. Spyrex, meet me at Camera 3.

...Spy. Yo. Buddy. So your first post was a vote on AV. As the game progressed, it seemed to me to be a pretty stale vote you weren't really justified. So I figured, well, I'll bring it up in thread, and either I'll see some sexy new justifications for voting AV or you'll put your vote somewhere else. Win/win.

You didn't respond to that post but mentioned your continued hate-on for AV despite the tsk,tsk'ers. Well, okay, it's easy to miss a point in this monster game, so I'll re-quote it.

You didn't respond to that one, either. But you did move your vote...to RC. The last thing you said about RC was:

While I was talking to others I was including you. That AV vote is still justified and I'm more than a little surprised that you, of all parties involved, isn't a bit more eye raised at his whole "I was first to say Fur is town!" business.

And, the last thing I SAID about RC was asking for what was going on with this wagon. Which Seacore and Trig brought me up to speed - Trig's detailing the dodge, dodge, jab was more of a kicker but.

[SpyreX]

Yes, the flavours are different; but he can claim his murder was rezzed away - as, in fact, we're already planning to allow him to do.

What's this we?

Its still a bad plan but I've been a bit distracted and it should be clear its a bad plan. Benmage and Fate are town FROM WHAT HAPPENED TODAY. We don't need this "ohh but lets have him get a murdering to stop the wifom that isn't even there" business.

And, if Ben is Cult faking a stalk claiming suicidial and preppin down murder avenue... thats not even 2scum4scum. That's just insane.

[SpyreX]

I was about to give you the raised eye but I see ODDLY ENOUGH IN THIS GAME posts are climbing all over each other.

[SpyreX]

Fate isn't scum. I'd bank hard on that.

[SpyreX]

What, exactly, did RC say in there that proves xvart is scum?

GO GO

[SpyreX]

Cliff's notes: xvart compiled the list of noises/wards, and he waited forever to add his.

And RC waited even MORE time to say something about it after he's half way up los ropos.

Et Tu, Gooski?

[SpyreX]

WELL, see, I can see a few reasons for doing that but I think letting him answer is a better answer than not.

However, go reread the last handful of RC ISO and get back to me if you can still 'understand'.

And you're still pushing on Fatescum which is F--

[SpyreX]

OF COURSE IT WOULD BE YOU SCREWING IT UP.

WHY AM I NOT SURPRISED.

[SpyreX]

AAAANNNDD TNM comes in with failure lowball questions huzzah.

[SpyreX]

Are you FOR REALS saying plum is scum or is that LEFTOVER LOVE?

Because, I sure thought it was the latter.

I'm still waiting for AV's SHOCKING REVELATION that he stole my thunder which I was working on. Because, in a perfect world, many things will become clear with an RC scum flip.

[SpyreX]

SPYREX'S VOTE STILL ON AUROUSTOWN IS PARTICULARLY DISCONCERTING.

BAD FATE

And I didn't say anything because I thought it was obvious? Timing being what it is. She is a heartbreaker, that's true.

[SpyreX]

ACTUALLY

I have a decent town read on VV. Especially after taking a hardstance on not wanting insanities known.

[SpyreX]

HAHA you were?

Ohh god that means I'm in stellar form then.

I was actually gonna yell about still not wanting to unfold the townS D1 and us talking about that but

[SpyreX]

SpyreX meet me at camera 3

What ties between AV and Reaper do you see?

SERIOUS QUESTION.

As much as I'd like to give you a serious answer this game makes my eyes bleed and every time I go Ohh I'll go back and reread something I see walls that make me white out and punch things.

SO, the only AV - Reaper I see is a tinfoil AV - Reaper - El Gooski chain of love with him coming in and ruining where I was going.

Of course, that is all conjecture based on an RC flip and part of the townreadsTM document coming upon the gamemorrow.

[SpyreX]

As an aside RC calling Fate a sheep is awesome.

[SpyreX]

Baaaaaaaaaaa (Fate, SpyreX, AurorusVox, kunkstar).

[SpyreX]

Good lord Furc I love you man.

This is the wrong tree again though. Get back to good trees.

[SpyreX]

FATTEEE

No. Come on now. He's not cult and you know it.

IF AFTER EVERYTHING SAID YOU BECOME THE DEAD WELL.

[SpyreX]

Plummmm </3

I need more than what you're givin me in regards to me.

And WHY ARE WE BACK HERE AGAIN ABOUT BENMAGE AND FATE.

GOOD LORD

[SpyreX]

No. You aren't.

HOWEVER KILLING FATE IS RETARDED AND WE COVERED THIS TOO.

[SpyreX]

I absolutely disagree.

[SpyreX]

And you can't have your cake and eat it too. Either you think I am cult, in which all your points about me waiting to kill you is null. Or you stop this fucking dicking around, and maybe I won't kill you tonight, but will choose a different target to stalk/kill.

You're done. After all the "ohh get extra bad insanities" and all the other crap the fact you'd throw this out here I'm done.

FATEEEE he's still not cult though and you know it and I'm more than a little surprised in that unhappy way you'd try to push it as that. BUT

Unvote, Vote: Benmage

[SpyreX]

et Plummen:

My problem with you here is that you're not giving me enough in regard to you. I mean, I know your feelings about sheeping as Town. It usually doesn't include you sheeping in this way.

Your AV attack rubbed me ze wrong way. Actually now that I think about it I find it reminds me vaguely of your attack on Rhinox in the earlier stages of /Invitational Pick Your Poison 5 . . . I never understood that one, and I was your scumbuddy. With daytalk. It feels . . . forced. This is admittedly colored a bit more now with my current Townread on AV, and I know the temptation of tunnelling in a game so huge it's hard to get a grip on, but compared to a lot of stuff in the thread I'd expect you to see that the arguments you had on AV were no better and in my humble worse than plenty of other scumhunting avenues - but no, you continue to harp on AV being all 'I think Furc is Town but I'm keeping in mind that he could go Murderer and some things he's said have rubbed me the wrong way so I'll keep an eye on him but am uninterested in voting him'. When there are people whose contradictory attitudes in this arena (like the numerous people who made awkward or no transitions between 'Furc is lying scum' to 'Furc is basically confirmed Town' or awkwardly agree with neither and may be trying to subtly discredit Furc OR the people who're all 'let's lynch this guy who's probably not Cult but might go Murderer and anyway what's better than a Day 1 lynch of a true Townie who's playing somewhat anti-Town' *cough*Seacore*cough*) are clearly as questionable, you harp on this one guy no one else sees a case on. It's the early business I can't put out of my head right now.

DONT YOU DARE META THIS YOUNG LADY

AV's "Furc is trying to go murderer" business when you consider other factors *cough*Benmage*cough* is a larf - and every step of the way he went back and forth on it until it was crystal clear that it wasn't happening AND THEN he had the gall to

say

lie and say he was the first to see Furc was cleared.

THIS HASNT WENT AWAY, but no one else wants to pay attention to it now and we're 65+ damn pages in and FFFF.

And, I thought it was pretty clear from everything I've been hinting at but Seacore was a patsy for scum pushes and I STILL NEVER EVER EVER got that "why Seacore is scum" because *shock* he's still one of my better reads and it sure aint scum.

Sounds just like me when I was scum (directed at you when you were my scumbuddy, but that's peripheral - it just hurts on a gut level - feels like taking extreme care to lampshade your reads while still leaving the possibility of jumping on RC later wide open. Nice job not getting to those worries on RC and jumping on the wagon with no thoughts of your own.

This all makes me doubt the premise that I'm dealing with Town-SpyreX. In a game with this much noise I'm not seeing everything, and I may well be wrong. But I have doubts.

When he finally came down hard and fast on Fate I went "OHH SNAP, there's that RC I know". But, then we saw what came after. And before.

[SpyreX]

SpyreX, I did not meta you, so don't fake-accuse me or dismiss me as having done so. The bad feelings about your play are there regardless. The tunneling on AV when there were plenty of other players questionable in comparable ways (If you like Seacore, fine, but as far as I can recall we had multiple players acting badly around the Furc issue - MoI continuously trying to discredit Furc, Baby Spice dancing around early with FOSes and such, then going back on his vote out of too-scummy-to-be-scum in a highly weird and counterintuitive fashion, multiple others) . . . and you tunnel on AV almost exclusively at first?

(You did start this out saying it was the same as X so don't you start with me missy. )

That's the thing though.

The only thing about MoI that bothers me in that exchange is the fact he started Fur hate

before

anything happened. He's been consistent with it aside from that enough that while I'm not stoked to the rafters I have a hard time seeing the pieces fall into place.

Baby Spice doesn't bother me about the Furc things NEAR as much as some of the other pieces.

But, the one that stands out? AV, now and forever.

-----

I want to make sure I've got this straight hit because while you're awesomeo I'm having a major disconnect:

Why would Fate run up the bus and then abandon it? Further, considering Ben's amazing attitude this game a Fate-ran bus doesn't do any good because Ben's made it abundantly clear that he's killing Fate regardless. If anything, in a Fate-scum scenario here I'd say RC is town.

However, I STILL think Fate is town. I really don't like/get the Ben-cult motif because that's not happening but, very clearly, ben's made it abundantly clear he's taking the kill and if he doesn't he's prepping to do this business all over again tomorrow.

THATS why Ben dies. He's playing both sides with it every step of the way.

----

But SpyreX is on Benmage? SpyreX is on Benmage?

YES I AM AND DONT BE SURPRISED ABOUT IT

[SpyreX]

CD2

Username:SpyreX

Did you Hear Noise? Yes

Did you Ward? If so, who? No

Did you gain Insanities, and if so, which ones and from what actions? No

List all of the insanities you currently have: None

Did you

successfully

resuscitate? If so, who? No

Were you murdered? No

Did you Commune or Investigate? If so, who, and what result? (Note that these are both poor N1 choices.)No

Twitch? No

I think seacore fate and spyrex may have suggested it....potentially others...also those who wanted me to delay the murder path. So I think it was suggested, regardless I did it.

No.

I, in fact, voted for you after you went from "Ohh what not kill Fate and get more insanities?" to "If I don't kill fate I'm stalking someone else".

Which is retarded. And we're gonna get this dance again and again.

----

No cult kill last night? So it's likely that someone res'd successfully? Or cult wifom with aspirations of collecting successful res town points?

Thoughts on LB: potential murderer, or cultist?

Maaaybe I'm jaded still but I really don't like this. The first part is f---. but, the LB business:

Unless I'm wrong, again, couldn't a whole mess of things cause a town N1 insanity?

Why the jump to OHH SNAP OBVIOUSLY EVILLLL?

and why are people agreeing with it?

---

That said, in the soontimes I'm gonna finish and give the full awesome list of awesome

[SpyreX]

I thought res gave both sides a ding if successful. My bad. So, commune/fetish as "town" or an n0-n1 stalk for 'town' or cult.

Fair enough.

NOW, that doesn't change the new song and dance you're pulling about insanity = stalk = murderer versus yesterday which is tech. OR the fact you didn't even poke at me at calling out the ohh nokill or wifom in said post.

1) Do you think dispatching one or both of Fate and RC is a good idea today?
2) If yes, who do you think we should dispatch?
3) If no, do you never want to dispatch them or just not today?

Yes, RC for sure - because Fate is town in all scenarios. I don't even see robbing for the books making sense versus just leaving him there.

[SpyreX]

Town (TM):
Furcolow
Hitorogoshi
Seacore
Trilobite
VasudeVa
Wraith

Town:
Kunkstar7
MoI
nopoint (via SSBF)
Plum
Triglav (TM if RC is cult)
VP Baltar
Wickedestjr
xvart

Scum:
AV
El Goosuki

Remainder via scum-town reads:
totallynotmafia
Manho (this is ridiculous at this point)
Feysal
Baby Spice
Nicodemus (this goes way up if LB cult)
Furpants_Tom
Andrius

Needs to die real soon (hint: this would be a great 'vig'):
Benmage

Important Things Version 1:
Town TM is town, fo sho. Those reads I'm absolutely confident in.
Town 2 probably has a slippery bugger. Maaaybe 2.
The remainder is heavy scum slanted.
The scum we'll talk about now.

AV:

Sans everything I've talked about before there's more than enough of this business that drives me nuts:

Looking back at the noise/ward list, there's 5 players who claim to have made noise-making actions to four different players. There are 13 players who claim to have heard noise. 13 players, less 4 noise making targeted players, leaves nine unaccounted-for noises. I figure this could be explained by:
(a) some cult not fake-claiming ward on their craft fetish target
(b) some cult claiming to have heard noise when they didn't
(c) some wannabe murderers on the loose

What do people think the likeliest reasons are? I say reasons, because it has to be a combination of at least 2 of the above...and I think it could be a combination of all three =_="

No cult kill last night? So it's likely that someone res'd successfully? Or cult wifom with aspirations of collecting successful res town points?

Thoughts on LB: potential murderer, or cultist?

In this game of noise this kind of business isn't awesome to begin with.

However, when you add that these are absolutely low-ball noanswer questions I'm more than a little peeked. Especially the "ohh cult didn't kill for the wifom wifom wifom" mantra like we got with benmage when there is no wifom and even with all the issues I have with keeping this setup straight the idea of not killing makes no sense. none. Even a failed kill is throwin insanities out.

But, that mantra does bring up the new deal that WHILE THERE WAS A POINT I WAS DOUBTING MYSELF I am calling teaparty on:

Didn't we say Occulting N1 was no good yesterday? IMO, Occulting N1 is a risky move that is probably not going to yield results (as it doesn't catch cult til N2). The best town explanation for that insanity is if he was given a fetish. But of course there's also the chance LB was a murderer.

(c) some wannabe murderers on the loose

Didn't we say Occulting N1 was no good yesterday? IMO, Occulting N1 is a risky move that is probably not going to yield results (as it doesn't catch cult til N2). The best town explanation for that insanity is if he was given a fetish. But of course there's also the chance LB was a murderer.
If he got an insanity, it is likelier that he was either cult or that he was planning on going the murder route (I think this for reasons that I have explained above). In that case the insanity was from stalking (=planning on going murderer) or it was from performing the ritual (=cult). So what song and dance am I doing?

Considering I still get twitches in my brain after the repeated arguments of "ohh snap benmage is town town town even if he's scummy because he's A HERO USING HIS TOWN ONLY KILLING PEOPLE POWERS" has all of a sudden turned to filthy murderers I'm calling BS. One side or the other take your pick (hint: it was the Benmage side because having Ben come out and kill Fate before failuregate was all cult upside).

BUT, no, he doesn't get the vote.

El Goosuki:

Has done nothing useful. At all. 0%.

Which isn't enough but Seacore was tech enough to do the dance right and call out:

During Day 1, El Goosuki posted this.

El Goosuki sends all his/her love to hitogoroshi for his guide to Investigators and baby Cthulhu picnic picture.

During N1, El Goosuki claims to have ignored this much loved guide and wasted a night action.
Vote: El Goosuki

Unvote, Vote: El Goosuki

And when I'm right here maybe the light can be seen assuming I'm not dead come morning on AV.

-----

OTHER THINGS:

Plum, et al:

While I'm down with not lynching Ben because he's not cult I'm more than a little baffled at all of you (but ESPECIALLY you since we talked about this earlier) aren't saying its time for the first ACTUAL useful murder to happen. It's early but how are you not on the pain-train?

Which, of course, is of special interest considering while you CAN say Wraith 'wasn't scumhunting' he sure oozes town to me in that special Fate-way in wanting Benmage dead to rights once he said he was taking his ball and doing what he wants with it.

AND SPEAKING OF PAIN TRAIN

It might be time to think about culling some doom via useful and planned murders.

There has to be a way to do it right and I may need some help planning it out.

Dissolve: RC

[SpyreX]

ITT, SpyreX still has a hard-on of hate for me. I'll do this in a way you might understand:

POTENTIAL FOR WIFOM EXISTS. TO OUTRIGHT IGNORE THAT IS STUPID. I AM CAPABLE OF CONSIDERING MULTIPLE IDEAS AT ONCE. IT IS NOT HARD.

Better?

So, SpyreX, how comes when El G was doing nothing yesterday it wasn't worth a vote, but because Seacore says something, it suddenly is? If that's the only difference, why did you make the comment about 0%? Oh...and didn't multiple people tell me the 0% contribution argument was no good when I voted El G yesterday? So...are you trying to NOT look like you're bandwaggoning the vote? Trying to make it look like you have more than a baa to go on? Since, y'know, Plum called you out on that yesterday?

THE POTENTIAL FOR ALIENS TO EAT US ALL EXISTS LETS TALK ABOUT THAT SOME

I.e. in this world where its important enough to wifom wifom wifom in a setup where nokilling

is a very bad idea

what purpose does it serve other than to play prep for going "ohh no rezzers no way you're totally cult using that wifom extravaganza but, alas, it wont work because my wifom hat is made out of pure strawberries".

And the fact you think I voted because of doing 0% in a game where manho is still around that batting average is getting lower and lower.

Tech points for throwing Plum's name in there.

Super tech points for not even pretending to comment on the switch from Benmage wants to kill fate? TOWN GUYS YO PROMISE to LOOK AT THESE FILTHY MURDERERS.

---

As for Wraith.

This is why he's town:

THE BOLDED PART IS IMPORTANT. AS YOU CAN SEE, BENMAGE HAS NO INTENTION OF PLAYING FOR THE TOWN, AND INTENDS TO MURDER PEOPLE. HAPPY?

Because THAT is the straw that broke the camels back. And it was an important straw because it was the defining one that made it clear that Ben needs to go.

Now, IF IF Fate was cult maybe the argument could be made, but I'd eat a million hats if Fate was cult.

---

And, seriously:

Maybe so, I haven't played a game with him. But I do know something about ambit claims, and I know they work welll when applied early and forcefully. Especially when the other party is predisposed to be unreasonble, escalating measures and logic allow them to engage multiple defence mechanisms and erode your support. I'm guessing we've missed this opportunity in BenMage's case.

Perhaps more importantly, people's reluctance to use their votes as strategic pressure is something I'm finding a bit bewildering.

This after the d1 pigeonhole votes until RC and the 180 from "Ben killing is awesome" to "Ben is a plague" is a whoooooonellly of a switch.

[SpyreX]

Oh poor SpyreX, I stated that you were falsely claiming to use that as an excuse to mask your baaaaaaa after Seacore's vote. I don't really think you're voting him for that reason. I even go on to say that if Seacore's reason is the only thing that's making you want to vote El G, why didn't you just say that in the first place? Why mention 0% contribution at all? Baaa.

Keep on keepin on.

Remember yesterday when I was leading to something and you came in and went LOOK I CAN HAS QUEsTIONS and it was nothing and screwed up where i was going because Gooski is doing nothing?

Remember that?

Yea.

0% is important. The 0%'ers need to go. However,

in addition to that

, the special kind of flower that while managing to do nothing still manages to not keep it straight with the nothing their doing is scum. And for lynching.

Oh poor SpyreX once again, I believe you'll find that I've always stated that I felt Benmage was cult. I argued to make Benmage follow through on his kill of Fate to PROVE that he couldn't do it. I.e. to prove that he wasn't in fact town. If he had managed to kill Fate, I'd have had egg all over my face but it would have been the egg of a confirmed townie at least. But, I realised as the day drew on that such plans were futile due to a few reasons that we discussed, and swiftly dispatched of the plan.

Yea, you sure said you thought he was cult but hey why not kill because then you're awesome town.

NOW, however, its "THE MURDERERS IN THE NIGHT" not "Ohh scumbag claims he can kill Fate? Go for it"

(Hint: this is because you know Ben is not cult and him killing Fate who is also not cult is win-win like I said before)

AND LOOK AT ME AVOIDING OMG PLUM SAID SHEEP SO I SAY SHEEP THAT MAKES ME COOL AGAIN BECAUSE FFFFF

MAYBE THATS SOME KINDA NEW WIFOM

[SpyreX]

Remember yesterday when you claimed all right to ask El G questions and made it really explicit that you were working on something with regards to El G and/or I read your mind to figure as much?

Remember that?

No?

Neither do I.

No, not all right. But, when I'm trying to get a response ESPECIALLY about the whole "Ohh yea I totally dig RC" but not mentioning his jumping suspicions and you go "OHH WAIT BABYSPICE IM ASKING THE QUESTIONS NOW MR" (and then ask no questions) its awesome.

I remember that.

No, I said "hey why not kill because OH WAIT YOU CAN'T CULTBAG"

I had resurrecting Fate as part of the plan until the mod said you didn't receive attempted-kill flavour before being resurrected. Once that was made clear, I dropped the plan.

Yea, Ben was your CULT NUMBER ONE NO VOTE GETTING WINNER.

The fact you're able to straight face go "OHh yea I totally KNEW he was cult and thats why I did everything in my power to never, ever vote him D1" is awesome. Its doubly awesome when he's shouting from the rafters murderer-in-training and sure as hell not cult.

Of course, again, I'm not surprised there wasn't a vote on the claimed stalk for being pro town awesome hats because that kinda fits with the motif.

...you are sheeping as far as I can see. I'm not just copying Plum here, because the point I'm making is that SOMEONE CALLED YOU OUT ON IT. It's pretty important to mention that you'd been called out on it once already if you're blatantly just trying to get away with doing it again. It's kind of the whole point.

I'm NOT sheeping. GOD.

If I was I wouldn't have asked OVER AND OVER for one of you reallly tech wagoneers D1 to explain Seacore who is oozing town.

In fact between said lines Plum said the issue is that I wasn't leading sheep. Not that AGREEING IS A BAD THING BECAUSE JESUS MY HEAD.

Of course, if you're gonna sit on a Ben wagon and ignore WHY I'm 'sheeping' this well kudos.

Because, this is the extent of what you've said about gooski today:

For future reference, I can get on board with an El G lynch, but I'd prefer a Ben lynch.

And its time to lay that down after all your indignant well I never garbage:

Am I scum? Am I a murderer? Am I just a tunneling sheep robot town?

What is it? Because, its time to lay it out.

[SpyreX]

SORRY PLUM I keep getting distracted by something.

Lets make it happen. Help me make sure I don't miss something gigantic in the setup dancing.

---

@AV;

You are going "ALL YOU DID IS SHEEP" but I most certainly didn't baa on that retarded Seacore wagon.

IF I'm SHEEPING WHY AM I 'SELECTIVE' IN IT?

IS IT PERHAPS BECAUSE I AM NOT IN FACT SHEEPING

JESUS

THANKS FOR THE WAFFLIEST WAFFLES IN WAFFLETOWN I WAS HUNGRY THOUGH.

*explode*

[SpyreX]

And Seacore's "El G" isn't a 'case'.

Its not one of those things for being picked apart and argued about.

Going "Ohh yea the three of us who said we read hit's list and said it was awesome opted to disregard that to waste an action."

Which is los garbagios.

[SpyreX]

2. Sure, we can plan out some Murders. I'd say we start with someone we're decently comfortable with; he/she popcorns to someone he's comfortable with, we get about - four? five? no more, as you-ll see below - players together. If you're chosen you have to play, I think - and there's the tricky part, making sure everyone is okay enough with this that there'll be sufficient pressure to follow through. Then each player in turn posts three players they're interested in Stalking. Then everyone who has Forensic Tools is ordered to use them on the pool of potential Stalkees. This will make it harder for Cult to successfully use Resuscitation against the eventual Murders. When Night comes, Stalkers stalk one player from their list, chosen at random (hopefully this will minimize chances of too many overlapping Stalk/Murder actions while keeping Cult from knowing who will be targeted and whether they can combat it with Ward while also ensuring decent chances that there are as many extra Murders as chosen players and we can start clearing.

Wouldn't putting the tools in require a huge amount of coordination? And, just to make sure I have it right, they'd have to use it on the night of the stalks?

This is a more refined version of what I was thinking about earlier. However, when I was thinking about it before AND now unless I'm missing something good there are two major concerns that could screw it up that I see:

1.) The worst case scenario (all kills go through on town) sets up for a bad, bad world. Not only is the cult way closer, BUT I'll freely admit if I was picked and I saw every directed murder go through I'd be really, really tempted to jump ship and go murderer (especially if there was any non-sanctioned murders) because at that point its a screw sandwich.

2.) The flipside (and I'm pretty sure considering when I was fumbling earlier no one really talked about it here it was being talked about ELSEWHERE) is that they "waste" some wards to setup a cluster of people being alive and that both putting the killer AND the target in a position of severe doubt.

The minor concern (people not feeling 'pressured' to follow through with the plan) is easy enough. Los ropos por favor.

But, I need some help with the above. There HAS to be a way to utilize the murdering on both sides (dead jerks + 'clear' town) but I can't get it. I've been toying with the flipside (two people that I feel really confident about targeting a small group until they're all dead but that still has ward issues) HELP.

Am curious why ElG apparently didn't read my guide. The idea behind posting a picture in the thread and making it stupidly obvious that a guide is here is so we can avoid the WIFOM game of "oh, I just didn't notice x". This would appear at first glance to be one of those, but do scum really get a large benefit by lying about an investigate? Or is this more likely to be a legit mistake? I'll need to think on it.

But, that's the crux. She DID. And then didn't?

Random thought for everyone: let's say you knew you were the target of Benmage's stalk. What would be your reaction?

I wouldn't be surprised. I'd be pissed because its a continuation of the failure that was yesterday. However, even if he went through with it there'd be some good to shake out in the "well we get a confirmed town right (I AM TALKING ABOUT YOU AV) if SpyreX dies" so.

Maybe you and Seacore are scum together ^^
Or maybe you only sheep scum for bussing.
Or maybe you sheep erratically to defend against the accusations of sheeping.

---

Or maybe you're selective in it because you're town and you only like sheeping when you see a good case.

I don't think I've ever said sheeping was a scumtell...I said that you seemed to try to hide the fact that you were voting without adding anything. Oh - kind of like what you did with RC! Which was pointed out! Which --- you've tried to avoid being accused of!! Dun dun dunn.

---

I also asked you a couple of direct questions. Answers plox.

Ding ding we have a winner. Still playing it both sides is awesome though. "I'm just saying you're sheeping not that its scummy because its IMPORTANT business to talk about it if it means nothing but I don't think your scum unless I do"

And, Jesus H if by "sheep" you mean "Someone puts together a case you agree with so you vote it" meaning "You put in no thought when you put your vote" I swear to everything holy.

And, what questions? I'll go through and answer the 'questions' I didn't:

How was I supposed to know that you were planning it when you kept quiet about it?

Ohh, I don't know, maybe going "Hmm, why is SpyreX asking for a specific answer from El Gooski?" instead of feeding it in. Which leads to this:

How is that not sheeping? You didn't even follow up with your epic plan to entrap El G, you just started shouting that you had one. What was it? Why can't you do it now?

I'm not addressing the sheeping part because good lord. As for the 'trap':

ElG says RC clearly laid out xvart being scum because he compiled the list and didn't add his or, more precisely 'waited forever' (Which, of course, doesn't become a telling point until after critical mass has been reached and the initial response was 'so what'.) AND, and this is important, cited the alphabetical list and "B-X are far away from each other and that's because they're scum together"

So, I said go read the ISO and come back because I wanted to see if El G would address 1.) the fact that it was alphabetical and that theory was raw madness, 2.) the fact that in Reapers "when I die /wrists" he doesn't even mention EITHER xvart or babyspice and 3.) how much everything changed as a function of being run up.

Of COURSE, #2 was a huge one. That 'smoking gun' on xvart was a last ditch save self effort and should, if ISO-read be a giant flag and not a ohh look TOWN YO.

Unless you're trying to save a partner.

And, of course, you come in and not only screw that up ONCE but lead RC in the "is this what you mean *nudge nudge*. And when it pisses me off say "ITS MY SHOW WITH LOTS OF QUESTIONS OHH WAIT THATS THE ONLY ONE"

So, it was done for then.

But, that's not the question you actually want answered mr coy:

You said if El G is scum, then I definitely am. What makes you think this?

Hint 1: RC is scum.

Hint 2: El G is scum.

Hint 3:

SO, the only AV - Reaper I see is a tinfoil AV - Reaper - El Gooski chain of love with him coming in and ruining where I was going.

Spyrex and AV need to exit the vortex of tunnelling. You're both ceasing to contribute meaningfully to the thread and we don't need that. What do you think of MoI and the case I spent my entire Saturday afternoon working on?

I'm intrigued and like I said watching MoI come out swinging from the gates really raises an eye but I've got a hard time stomaching it being cult.

On the flipside, what about my newsletter. Its not TUNNELING its just that no one else SEES IT and I haven't seen anyone with a hammer to club me with some kind of powertownTM I could be missing.

I mean:

The pathetic answer to that question is "embarassing stupidity x 3."

-DGB

[SpyreX]

@SpyreX - Agreeing with people is not suspicious. What is suspicious is that you were actively trying to avoid accusations of sheeping by putting that 0% comment which had no bearing on your vote. You were padding out the sheeping because you'd been called out on it. You can continue to misinterpret me if you want.

Ohhhh so you're just making stuff up I get it now.

Has done nothing useful. At all. 0%.

Which isn't enough [to warrant a vote over other nothings] but Seacore was tech enough to do the dance right and call out:

So, saying ElG has been doing nothing BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY IN ADDITION TO DOING NOTHING (which others have done) has managed to ACTIVELY GO BACKWARDS is avoiding the sheep by saying directly that Seacore pointed it out before I could.

Awesome.

----

Except that 25% decrease goes into the next day phase and will present another chance for cult to get corpse dust when we dispatch Fate later anyway.

While the uncertainty of the flip hangs over the town for yet another day.

There's really no reason not to dispatch him now.

In fact, should multiple people die, this argument can be used to keep him from flipping for days. I'm not a fan of that.

See, that's the thing.

I see absolutely no uncertainty in that flip. None, zero, zip.

So I'll be THAT GUY and say why bother with it? Not today, not later, not ever.

Its not worth the book or the robbing dance. Unless someone actually thinks there's a chance for a scum flip there in which case lets talk about how space monkeys that is.

[SpyreX]

2) We'll just keep having more and more bodies to grave rob, so we might as well get it over with. If we dispatch him today we'll have 4 bodies. Tomorrow we'll have at least three plus fate if we wait..

Did I miss something?

[SpyreX]

God in heaven I keep forgetting about the LYNCH body needing summer lovin'.

Someday, someday.

[SpyreX]

Check sig. I'll try to get on but not sure how much it'll be.

HOWEVER:

1 and 2 aren’t true and furthermore are scum-tells. I’m far from the only person who has been abrasive in this game. And I did in purposely. I’m rather tired of getting killed very early in Large games when I am Town.

Antagonizing those players who are weak enough to rise to the bait was specifically designed to lower my NK threshold.

You may not like it but it certain isn’t indicative at all that I’m Cult.

What in the name of everything holy is this?

"I'm scummy on PURPOSE, yo" is garbage. In THIS setup with no PR's I have no words.

Ohh look ElG leaps after THIS?

Yeeehaw

[SpyreX]

Spare me. You’ve made a career here of being obtuse and annoying as a tactic to limit your perceived obv-Town status.

I, what?

On top of that being so awesomely wrong I can't even fathom it the "YEA YOU TOO" defense is awesome.

But, lets make this clearer since I wouldn't want to be obtuse or anything like that:

The "I am being scummy on purpose" defense is bad in most situations - namely, when Jojo the hypercharger death machine does it so that he keeps his "sweet ass role".

In this setup? It is terrible. Because, ultimately, it amounts to "I don't want to be NK'd so I'm gonna get lynched instead!"

There was no SHOCKING REVELATIONS involved. Nothing. Just self-preservation which is tech.

Now, in addition to that, it doesn't even make sense - coming out the gates at Fur? That is stirring up controversy?

Going OMG PLUM ISNT OBV-TOWN (hint: not actually saying she's scum) is helpful?

Not so much.

-----

On other notes ElG needs to go.

Wrath is still town and Plummen you need to look at the company you are keeping.

@Wicked,

I'm down with kunk BUT I'd prefer others today by a margin.

[SpyreX]

Back, will catchup in detail but MoI's /proddodge AND Feysal's wasted vote are both awesome.

[SpyreX]

The scum wasted vote?

Yea, thats fine.

[SpyreX]

Fateeee what in the hell.

What I'm missing is where did the ElG wagon go? I'm seeing nothing changed there at all and while MoI is awesome and kunk is fine what the hell happened on that end.

[SpyreX]

Isn't he dispatched? GUYSSS

@VP:

Watching the amount of awesome (i.e. none) from ElG and that wagon dissipate is MORE than a little troubling.

[SpyreX]

Ohh hay what

Unvote, Vote: MoI

[SpyreX]

A is fine.

*checks the MoI wagon as of that post* No, actually, I don't think I do, thanks.

Que?

I didn't say anything about ohh SNAP get on MoI. I said:

Wraith - 3 (Plum, manho, AurorusVox)

THIS was the company you were keeping.

THIS isn't a function of MoI/ElG/Kunk (ALL of which are better wagons regardless of the fact Wraith is town).

So, I'm missing the "look at where you are" / "Ohh, the MoI wagon means I'm being awesome".

Unless you're talking about the wagon NOW versus when I said that in which case...what?

If ElG is scum, I'd doubt they actually did something that useless; it might be cover for all sorts of things, including cover for acting stupid and making scummy Night Action choices later in the game and excusing it with stupidity.

Of course. I didn't even think this needed to be brought up.

[SpyreX]

CD3

Username:SpyreX

Did you Hear Noise? Yes

Did you Ward? If so, who? No

Did you gain Insanities, and if so, which ones and from what actions? Twitchy - Commune, Taboo (Books) - BEING KILLED YO

List all of the insanities you currently have:Thats them

Did you

successfully

resuscitate? If so, who? Nope

Were you murdered? Yep

Did you Commune or Investigate? If so, who, and what result? AV - strictly does not have more.

Twitch? *twitch*

Ohh its good to see THIS coming out of the gate.

Whomever actually rezzed me speak up so we can cut to the important bits of lynching ElG.

Unvote, Vote: ElG

[SpyreX]

OR, get this, Benmage is, like he's always been, going for murderer and making stuff up.

And I've already said I don't want to lynch El Goosuki, it's too easy for cult if they are indeed just a lazy hydra, somebody should murder them instead.

MIND YOU, until whomever saved my ass comes out I know I'm gonna be dancing the dance of sugar plum fairies but I want to make sure we're clear:

Ben says I'm cult because I didn't die.
ElG says I'm confirmed cult.
TNM says ElG is a bad lynch because they're being "lazy". (Hint: both things that have happened that shouldn't have caused insanities OHH GEE WHAT DOES THAT MEAN).

AND AND I'm pretty sure there's more votes on me than on ElG.

These things are awesome.

[SpyreX]

And the chances of that actually happening?

And this means you're more confident BM is either a full blooded murderer (which makes NO sense considering he claimed and I corroborated the kill attempt on me) OR MORE LIKELY TO BE CULT THAN THE LAZIEST HYDRA IN EXISTENCE.

[SpyreX]

El G should probably not be the lynch today. Instead, we should commission somebody to murder them. All three should be absolutely ashamed of their play, but I think they're less likely scum at this point.

Ok, I need serious reasons for this (not to pick on you who is still town BUT THIS GENERAL SENTIMENT GOOD LORD):

Three players. Who have ALL POSTED ON SITE DURING THE NIGHT TIMES I AM PRETTY SURE.

Who, two for two, have managed to accrue insanities without DOING anything. I mean, jesus, it does take balls of steel as scum to go "Ohh, they said there's no reason to cower? DONE. Commune night 1 is a bad idea so sayith the post I commented on? DONE."

Fool me once, shame on me.
Fool me twice....

OHH GOD THE KNIVES HELP

H
E
L
P

[SpyreX]

Killing furc at this juncture would be damn near the worst thing that could happen. Team "OHH NOES HES NOT A TEAM PLAYER" (note for the over-achievers I'd love to see a comparison of that group and who HASNT VOTED FOR ELG BECAUSE MY GOD talk about a scum-klaxon).

That said: Furc, this please lynch xvart business is not good. Please see ElG and do God's work.

What am I making up? I'm bloody. You're bloody. I tried to kill you. I'm going to launder tonight. When Am I gonna be murderer? D20?

Noone is claiming rezz on you.

Why has SpyreX not be strung up yet?

I'm waiting for whomever to go ahead and do it.

I'm not sure how to beat how stupid this is in your head though. You realize if I was cult AND got protected by cult when you said you killed me I'd just have said no, right? Not "yep, I had an attempt that matches up but there hasn't been a rez yet".

OHH NO WIFOM SHUT UP.

Come to grips and get on ElG.

[SpyreX]

I missed whoever said what the first time around about SpyreX but assuming that we get in the last (?) claim and it doesn't come out in the wash, yes well bottle of WIFOM back at you mate string up the gallows please.

I want a full apology when whomever the hell rezzed me comes clean.

I also want to know whats the dealio with the order of your list.

[SpyreX]

So why doesn't a brother get a ?.

What happened to change your opinion on Wraith from scum ex machina to ?.

What is it that's got you in a dither with NP (I know what sure has my cackles raised but).

[SpyreX]

Ohh yea Xvart I've got 2 not 1 insanities (THANKS BEN)

Is Xvarts the full insanity list? That seems way, way low.

[SpyreX]

Re: Brother - Because I feel low odds that your rescuer will come at the last moment, Rapunzel. Never had a Townread on you this game which is close to a scumtell for you, protip.

Re: Wraith - Maybe he didn't deserve a ? but I haven't had time for reevaluation of him since Day 3; at least I've had new and scummy feelings on you and NPAU and xvart and ElG since the new Day dawned. Kinda like BS.

You better hope this is some amazing scum move because when I get cleared of being some kind of f-- scum we're gonna have some serious words.

A taste:

You've got 'new' scummy feelings on me since today began? Is this less 'scummy' feelings and more benmage's attempt on my life? Your case is, pretty much, I'm not town enough?

Your other reads with 'new' scummy feelings happen to include the other two really being talked about by the sane (ElG) and the slightly off (xvart).

But, the biggest one, the BIGGEST one is the fact you're rolling with I'm not town enough over 'I cowered'.

But, we'll wait. Until its time.

Feysal had done an accurate evaluation of something not likely but possible to have happened. NPAU responded by voting him, accusing him of only thinking that because he didn't Rez Wicked and was scum. Because Feysal's evaluation was reasonable and clearly so, this feels super-defensive, like maybe it came from someone who himself didn't Rez Wicked and wouldn't dream of rocking the boat by suggesting even the slightest possibility of Wicked not being cleared. Feels horribly off.

Thats a drop in the bucket compared to his avoiding the ElG wagon.

[SpyreX]

No, seriously, he actually asked WHY ElG is being lynched over other people.

[SpyreX]

Drop in the bucket compared to your play with the MoI wagon as well. Weird as all get out. In any case, that's all good and well on NPAU. Complementary cases/scumtells on one player are good not bad, so thanks for bringing that to my attention as well.

What, wanting ElG the hydra that can't read or as we know now can't perform night actions with three heads active during night lynched over MoI until he /wrists in such a spectacular fashion that he had to go?

Yep, I went from a scum to a scum. My bad.

[SpyreX]

So it was furpants? Jesus world.

On the plus side the simple way this slopped out makes Ice p town.

This post filled me with all sorts of weird and scummy.

What?

He went "I was scummy on purpose to make sure I dont get NK'd".

That is retarded in the best of circumstances (see super cop). In this one, its flat out scummy. Which it was.

Spy has been soo useless in this game and that is simply not TownSpy nope! This is reminiscient of scumSpy from /invitational 11 where he tunneled on me for like 5 day phases or something. And his case is 'Oh, he's useless'. That sounds awfully familiar, no?

Spy has done like, 2 things in this game.
1. Tunnel El G
2. Distance with AV(which is looks so faked it hurts. Absolutely nothing useful came out from that argument. )

That's it. That's the sum total of Spy's contributions. And maybe AV scum too~

In the meantime ElG is too scummy for scum. I do not see scum playing that card for extra fetishes or whatever. El G is for stalking though. ElG actually smells like the counter-wagon. Not sure what you're sniffing hito but counterwagons happen on obvscum, not Spyscum.

I'm not even sure where to begin here.

Those are the 2 things you'd say I've done this game? Jesus I've probably spent more words arguing with BENMAGE about his ongoing madness than talking about ElG (which, really, should be almost 0 words because jesus).

Not that it matters because I'm pretty sure you lept onto the idiocy quick enough that you're on the short list of knives but.

And 2scum4scum.

And I'm scum WITH AV? WOOOO

Yep. Well played.

Spy, I love you buddy. You just got the wrong role PM this game.

You're my bro too but good lord I want to strangle you so much it hurts right now.

I'll try again and if the answer is a buzzword I may explode:

Assume I'm cult.

Like I said yesterday I absolutely wouldn't be surprised if I was your stalk target (realistically, it was about a 75% chance in my head that it was one of Wraith or I). So, I would have had to mention this fact and have someone rez me.

NOW, at that point theres really three options:

1.) Have a buddy claim they rezzed me (Good)
2.) Deny your stalk and make you out to be a liar face (Ok)
3.) ??? Rainbow dance party (Bad)

You're saying I went with three. Moreso, you can't give me ANY GOOD REASON why I would go with three. (I could see a couple for 1 not happening but 2? Really?)

On the flipside Assume I'm town.

Again, I'm not surprised if I was your stalk. I said so.

I get killed and rezzed and have no idea WHO did it and am waiting for it to come out.

It doesn't happen putting me at rainbow dance party.

Let us continue:

Absolutely. What cult comes out and says "I cowered"...Its a WIFOM sandwhich sure...but what is he aiming at a Day or 2 max to live by, whereas there really was no immediate threat on his life.

Nope.

This is the easy mislynch. This is the wagon protecting the scum buddy SpyreX.

Remember all the yelling about how your killing Fate et all even with the upside (proving you are town) was a bad use of actions?

ElG is actively doing worse.

You're giving a pass to a three-headed hyrda that mysteriously didn't manage to even get in ANY actions after choosing a worthless one N1.

The ONLY argument (which is retarded) is 2scum4scum and well.

[SpyreX]

Yeah. The only reason not to lynch ElG is that there are (amazingly) other players who qualify for the lynch analogously (xvart).

Did I miss something more than wanting to kill fur that would make them analogous?

Because while that's fairly functionally retarded at least its

functional

.

[SpyreX]

I actually think that xvart's case is scummier, if anything. ElG's first goof didn't even explain away an insanity. xvart's "goof" did, and it's more likely to get a pass in spite of being really anti-town.

The difference is xvart COULD have been told to pull the trigger and if it didn't happen be screwed. It gets a pass because while its bad it at least makes sense.

Cower? Hell no.

[SpyreX]

I will rob both them thar graves sure.

----

Do NOT go through with this kill.

Seriously why is this even being brought up. We're not at a point where kills can be for anything but real serious business. And there's no way there's real serious business on Furc (or Ben as much as I'd love it at this point).

Maybe I'm getting triple snuk'd and its cult claiming a stalk hoping they don't get called on it but runnin strong

I really doubt that is the case

.

----

I KNOW I need to get away from this but I can't. I just can't:

xvart: scum right here. Why stalk 99.99% confirmed town? To mask other means of gaining insanities. If he felt this strongly, why not do it D1? <-- answer this please, xvart :\

El G: oh god, El G, what the hell? Willing to put L-1 vote down, wary that day hasn't lasted very long and we might have a rushed hammer before the night action chart is put into action.

Note, the xvart line can be changed from "why stalk 99.99% confirmed town" to "why cower" AND ITS THE SAME THING.

----

You are forgetting the part where you could have told a Cult buddy to rez you and then decided not to have them claim when the heat came almost immediately after the stalk claim came forward.

Sure? But that would be just a different more retarded path towards #3 and if I'm gonna do that why the jesus would I fight it.

I considered it, but figured my course of action was better in the long run because it would alleviate my personal suspicions and I could just ignore him and his antics the rest of the game. However, his early hammer and grave rob planning shenanigans yesterday solidified it in my mind that he was a liability. Who knows, if he hadn't hammered early we might have got a check in post from the three stooges and they might have realized that night was about to come and we would be in a whole different boat today.

Here's a deal:
If El Goosuki flips some insanity count other than what they claim I'll go through with my kill.
If Furculow does not start behaving in a more town like manner I'll use my judgment and go through with the kill or not.

So, if someone out there with a rez kit wants to spare Furcolow then he/she might want to consider it, just in case.

xvart.

"He is a liability" IS NOT A REASON TO TAKE THIS SHOT JESUS H.

NOT NOW. MAYBE, MAYBE IF SOME CULT START JOINING THEIR DARK LORD BUT NOT NOW CHRIST.

----

From the original post:“Effect: You protect your target against one of either Murder or The Ritual.”
Doesn’t say Greater Ritual. Therefore the only way for Iecerint to have received that message from the mod would be if Greater Ritual occurred.

Which itself doesn’t necessarily rule out Fur using the rez kit, but****** It certainly rules out the excuse that Fur used a rez kit and that’s why he died.

FFF If you hadn't TRIED TO KILL ME I'd be paranoid but instead I'll accept you're just being insane:

Ok, follow me here:

Vi posted a full list of possible perturbations you can expect from your Night Result PM here.

Specifically, you would receive either of the following message if you choose Resuscitate:

Resuscitate Success wrote:Your action: Resuscitate: Percy
Result: Success - You have saved Percy from death. As a side effect, you have become Bloody and thus lost your Resuscitation Kit.

Resuscitate wrote:Your action: Resuscitate: Percy
Result: Failure - You did not save Percy from death.

Side Effects: Your target hears Noise. Any Resuscitate action targeting you tonight will fail, and the player who targeted you will not be notified of the failure. If you successfully protect them, you become Bloody, and your target both becomes Bloody and gains an Insanity when the killing action (Murder or the Ritual) resolves.
Notes: If more killing actions target the player than there are players Resuscitating them, then the kill is not prevented, though you still become Bloody when the killing action resolves. If you save your target from death, they will be notified that they were saved, but not by whom.

Greater Ritual: If two thirds (rounding up) of the Cultists target the same player, the Ritual counts as an extra kill for the purpose of Resuscitate. If the Cultists use Corpse Dust, the Ritual counts as an extra kill for the purposes of Resuscitate, and the Corpse Dust is consumed. These two effects are cumulative.

Ice is not bloody.
The Greater Ritual is "multiple kills" in essence. (and not a different thing good lord).

Thus, the only way Ice could not be bloody AND have targeted FT AND FT could have died is if the Resuscitate action itself failed.

The only method in which it could have failed IS IF FT attempted to Rez someone else.

(If I'm missing a piece let me know)

If not, this means all you awesomes going "OHH MAYBE HE REZZED OR MAYBE HE DIDNT" better change your tune. Of course it'll be "WELL HE REZZED BUT MAYBE IT WASNT SPYREX" but at least its a new catchy beat.

This insanity continues:

I was still processing. I looked at FurTom's iso and SpyreX's.

It appears as if Fur only asks Spy 1 question--what he thinks of xvart.

Spy never answers this, and barely contributes for the remainder or the day. Meanwhile Fur is very active for the remainder of the day.

I find it incredibly unlikely that Tom rezzed SpyreX, and I repeat again I would much rather lynch him who is much more likely to flip cult.

Fur and I have had WAY more interaction than that. I'm a little surprised (but not a lot) that he rezzed me BUT jesus by looking at ISO did you mean a page of it?

(And no, I never answered it because it was answered in the before times and I got a little distracted by MoI)

If El G isn't bloody....then he didn't participate in the ritual, and this cower isnt a fakeclaim but this lynch is a huge policy lynch/mislynch.

This really does it.

Take a step back. Breathe.

Because you're forgetting how everything works in this AWESOME PURSUIT OF JUSTICE.

Its Fate 2.0 and its making me more than a little wroth.

[SpyreX]

Is there a reason we're announcing our other actions?

I'm missing it fo sho.

[SpyreX]

I've got no problems with it but I'm missing the point if its not a function of about to get lynched / the early day stuff.

I DO think we need to make sure we are keeping some people ready for knife time and occult time.

[SpyreX]

Real quick because I NEED TO MAKE SURE I AM RIGHT:

My post above regarding rez. Correct yes/no?

[SpyreX]

I'm not sure, Spyrex.

I think Tom's death, happening despite Iec's resus attempt, could have occured because
a) Someone tried to murder Tom, Iec stopped that, and the ritual got through
b) A greater ritual was performed, so Iec was insufficient to stop it
c) Tom resus'd someone (maybe you) and thus he was unable to be resus'd himself

I've yet to see evidence that all three are not possible. But I could be wrong.

Unless I'm misreading it a) and b) would have Iec bloodied.

Which he said he isn't.

[SpyreX]

At some stage, assuming we actually get some runs on the board, I will stalk and murder him, or at the very least, give somebody else permission to do so. This will be a protown act in my opinion.
However, that time is not now.

A good and wise man.

Although, PERSONALLY, if one of the wonder twins had to go first I'd go Ben but.

[SpyreX]

So in a standard game how do you eliminate liabilities?

You lynch them. Or you have a vig shoot them when shooting them doesn't start the tipping point of doom. Good lord man.

Because maybe a Cult buddy thought they could justify rezzing you and when the yammer jammer yellow hammer came out with Benmages claim it became too risky to claim it. But I'll take a look back at Furpants ISO to see if what you say adds up about him talking about you.

But... that's exactly what would have happened?

Check D1 if you're curious about ISO. We did talk more than HAY YOU LIKE XVART YES NO.

[SpyreX]

Well its not really a 'possibility' unless you want to say its .5 (start with 1 then chicken out).

[SpyreX]

Why? We've already let Benmage get away with doing exactly that. It's not a leap to assume we'd do it again.

No. The difference is Benmage did try to kill me (or someone else did and ??? and ??) on a night when there was a cult kill.

Congrats on the engagement, btw.

yo spy what happened to you last night

New reference inbound, stay tuned...

Last night? Nothin. Getting the someone tried to kill you I went "BENMAGEEEE" before I even checked the thread. And, THERE, I was greeted with madness that is continuing.

On the plus side it DID help kick me in gear. Attempted murder is better than caffeine.

And if there were some dead cults you KNOW I'd be all for the purge. Just not as it sits.

----

So, again. Killing Furc is terrible. IF, IF this spastic xvart business has to go through at least make it be on someone useful. Jesus I AM A BETTER CHOICE THAN FURC THANKS TO TODAY.

And Furc's 3148 is coming out on the side of trying and lets keep with that. Although STOP TRYING TO LYNCH PEOPLE YOU THINK ARE TOWN.

And that does make nico a great target if you really want to have xvart prove himself.

I swear to God though furc better not be the dead in the morning via murder.

[SpyreX]

If its that certain (which I dont get) then its for lynching not elaborate plans.

If it requires elaborate plans dont do them NOW on "a distraction". Do them on scum.

(No problem. I've made a lot of mistakes in my life, but getting married was the one thing I did right enough to cancel it all out. )

[SpyreX]

I also agree that we could test xvart with the elab-o-plan on scummy candidates, BUT, can't scum mess with it by warding their buddies (i.e. if we come to a consensus about who to stalk)? Otherwise we're relying on xvart picking who to stalk himself (and look how that turned out)

This is like a microcosm of the grand idea I was batting around that I kept running into this with.

Realistically, if you put a group of 4 out and say "KILL ONE" and, hopefully, there's more than one scum in the set then you're locking down a whole mess of actions.

Yup, that's why my vote's on xvart atm, and I'd happily see him go today.

I dig, but ElG HAS to go. Now. The chance of this being a town lynch is minimal (at WORST I'm betting on murderer).

[SpyreX]

CD4

Username: SpyreX

Did you Hear Noise? Nope

Did you Ward? If so, who? Nope

Did you gain Insanities, and if so, which ones and from what actions? Solist (Rob FT), Obsession (Rob ElG)

List all of the insanities you currently have: Twitchy, Taboo (Books), Solist, Obsession

Did you

successfully

resuscitate? If so, who? Nope

Were you murdered? Nope

Did you Commune or Investigate? If so, who, and what result? Nope

Are you bloody?Yep

Twitch? *twitch*

I got Success on FT, Failure on ElG

I'm also apparently greeted by a power wagon. So, lets go ahead and get it all nice and neat. In theory you'd get books and a forensic kit. In practice you're going to get nothing because if ElG got warded you sure as hell can guarantee I'm gonna get warded.

Watching these power cases come out of the woodwork WILL be helpful though. Allow me to go ahead and give you a pro-tip for killing here in the near future.

No, I agree that MoI's statement was extremely scummy. The fact that you knew that and said that but kept your vote on ElG for unvoting because of this is not an intuitive thought process, in my humble opinion. You used it as a bolster for your ElG case because . . . ? You didn't state that ElG was maybe bussing (in which case it would be a stronger tell on MoI anyway). If you'd argued that ElG was still scummier on the previous merits, maybe I'd have bought it. But the fact that you tried to turn something which was clearly flat out scummy into an excuse to keep your voe on ElG makes relatively little sense.

Unless you were bussing ElG. Cheers, mate.

My vote staying on ElG had nothing to do with MoI. The simple fact that ElG jumped AWAY from that was a testament to ElG's f-- (and, potentially, a link that apparently was disproven).

I didn't need to 'bolster' anything on ElG and soon when the deaths start really happening and ElG actually FLIPS SCUM I will be vindicated. (additionally, considering you've been going Ohh gee gosh I think SpyreX is scum since D1? this is super awesome).

It'll be a fun game (hint: a fun game for hit) to parse out how many different awesome people I'm scum with due to events.

Before I die give me another chance to give a quick rundown. Then, set me free.

[SpyreX]

Vote:Andrius Unvote
Vote:AurorusVox Unvote
Vote:Baby Spice Unvote
Vote:Benmage Unvote
Vote:Feysal Unvote
Vote:hitorogoshi Unvote
Vote:Iecerint Unvote
Vote:kunkstar7 Unvote
Vote:Nicodemus Unvote
Vote:nopointinactingup Unvote
Vote:Plum Unvote
Vote:totallynotmafia Unvote
Vote:Triglav Unvote
Vote:Trilobite Unvote
Vote:VasudeVa Unvote
Vote:VP Baltar Unvote
Vote:Wraith Unvote
Vote:xvart Unvote
Vote:Wraith Unvote
Vote:xvart Unvote

Vote: Benmage. Unvote.
Vote: Hito. Unvote.
Vote Benmage. Unvote
Vote: Hito. Unvote

Alright, since this is how its going down today lets get this out there:

Team Chumbawumba:
Benmage
Xvart

Town (TM):
Hitorogoshi
VP Baltar
Seacore
Trilobite
Wraith
Iceerint

Remainder (In descending order):
AV
Triglav
VV
Feysal
Andrius
kunkstar7
(Team Nothing): Baby Spice/Nico/nopoint/tnm
Plum

So, heed the following things when you get my flip in like 4 days:

Team Chumbawumba needs to get put on permanent grave detail asap. They've got a proven track record now of bad decisions and all of the "Me, murder? NEVER" can eat it - but, as it sits, do not DO NOT DOOO NOOT murder/lynch them. The fact I've got to SAY that says something for the state of affairs but hey.

Team Town? Yea, they're town. I'm supremely confident in that.

Of the remainder? Team Nothing has 2 scum in it at least. Of the remainder? Yea, start watching there when the murders happen.

AV almost is TOWN but I still cant shake my irritation.

Plum, if there was a chance in hell anyone would listen to me, would be a good lynch. AS IT SITS once you see me flip with 4 insanities and start going "Ohh shit, maybe he WAS telling the truth" don't be afraid to be a broseph and take the knife up in my memory.

Speaking of knives, that time is coming soon when you better get them sharpened and actually try to hit real targets. Its probably for the best I'm dying now because the temptation to go murderer is becoming SERIOUS BUSINESS (and, the fact I've looked at it and really thought about it last night but didn't because there'd be no chance of it happening for ME not in general).

So, get everyone to do the little dance, get the post up, lynch me and then be SUPER SURPRISED tomorrow when you dont get to rob any graves but Furc's and then, once you get my damn flip, come back and repost this and go "ohhhh".

[SpyreX]

STILL BROS SPY :'(

We'll be bros if you screw the crazy cap back on the pills tomorrow and fix the madness that's prevalent. This is one of those fffff situations where my lynch makes SENSE and while I know its a bad call the only hope is that once I DO flip you actually pay attention to the words I've been saying.

And Ben I still want to strangle even if we're homeys.

[SpyreX]

I don't want to go through this another day. It hurtses us.

However, in my rage I must have missed whats happenin on that front? Its got delicious people on it and Andy is on the kill list soo

[SpyreX]

God ben you're SO CLOSE.

But, just dont get caught mouth agape after I go. Remember my list, and be damn sure that the top list is going the way of the dodo.

And if I wasn't dead man walking I'd probably muster up MORE energy but, seriously, not another day. Not another day of the same twirling.

[SpyreX]

I want the record to show both the volume and rapidity of words in defense by Plum versus other far more important words.

Remember this after the death takes me.

[SpyreX]

Everyone hates me because I had the awesome combination of a poor start + getting ressed by a dead man yesterday + not getting a clean graverob last night.

MIND YOU, I kind of understand iton face value but there's a whole lot of people going SCUM SCUM SCUM which means that I'm in that tech place where I need to die so this doesn't happen EVERY DAY.

Additionally, and you'll be able to do this:

1.) I am NOT going to flip for a while. Its too valuable to not (see DGB).
2.) When I, in fact, die and show the right number of insanities TAKE A MINUTE and weigh what I've said under the assumption I'm town so it can be used.
3.) Kill someone for me. You'll know who.

[SpyreX]

One last time, I want this clear:

If, come later (IT SHOULD BE TOMORROW BUT I KNOW BETTER) everything I've said is pish poshed because 'ohh gee shucks he might be scum' I will rage so hard in the dead chat I will format Percy's computer with the power of my mind.

I am a POWERFUL WIZARD, even in death.

[SpyreX]

Sneak preview. My top 3 stalkers/killers are Seacore/Hito/VPB. (So I might amend the rob graving plan or even rob grave twice myself if need be, we mislynched too much, its time to start killing)

Are you saying you think those three:

1.) are stalkers/killers now.
2.) are who you are going to stalk/kill.
3.) need to be stalked/killed.

(regardless of your answer "confirmed" or not you better unscrew your madness bulb and replace it with a functional one)

[SpyreX]

Touche'.

I thought of that right after I posted.

We're still ok then.

[SpyreX]

Come on now hit you know better but I'm just a zombie waiting for release.

[SpyreX]

Ohhh THATS not the part I'm talking about. You need to hammer it out.

However, tying it down TOO HARD (X stalks Y) is just inviting the cult to manipulate all the night actions just rite.

And you know that you silly goose.

[SpyreX]

Just making sure it hadn't jumped the shark somewhere.

I've said my piece and am fairly quietly waiting for death soo

[SpyreX]

Now's the time to do it at least.

Just HEED MA WORDS SOME PLEASE MURDER DEATH MACHINE

[SpyreX]

This one actually ended. Well I never.

Yea, once I looked over the murder plan the only negative would be people actually attempting murderer... which you hussies never did. Why I never.

As you can tell from the great american novel that is the QT I saw that early and really went "I think we're gonna be boned."

And we were!

Town played a good game AND did a great job controlling the setup. Kudos all the way around.

[SpyreX]

And I want the record to show that my cult wanted me dead from the very beginning. Hmmph

[SpyreX]

Sometimes you've just gotta focus the natural love a LITTLE stronger and then get people devoured when you get lynched because some jerk *cough* stalked you and you KNEW it was gonna happen but nooo