Alphabet Mafia (Gamer Over, Joy Up!)

[Kairyuu]

/sigh

So it's going to be like this again is it? I've got lab shortly, and homework to do after that, but I should be able to catch up tonight.

[Kairyuu]

School is a lot more time intensive this semester than I expected. If I haven't managed to catch up by Tuesday night, I'm going to request replacement.

[Kairyuu]

Let's see if I can't make some progress on actually reading this game now.

[Kairyuu]

Alrighty. Let's see if I can get something that resembles a decent post up.

Early play is a whole lot of nothing. gandalf-wagon and TL counter-wagon are mostly pointless fluff. However, Mafuyu's actions look fairly interesting.

@Mafuyu: Why were you "trying to catch gandalf in a LaL situation?" Besides the fact that LaL is mostly crap in itself, the way that you acted seemed a lot like you were looking for an excuse to throw LaL at gandalf. The fact that all of the abilities are related to your letter makes it fairly obvious that the post/vote ability is common to ALL players and related to eveyone's letter. That you were trying to "catch him in a lie" even knowing this implies that you were more concerned about getting him to garner suspicion rather than trying to figure out his algnment.

Oh hey, apparently Inhim noticed the same thing on the next page. Fun.

Cool, BC is obvtown again. Good to know.

GODDAMN IT, BENMAGE IS IN THIS GAME? CAN WE POLICY-SOMETHING HIM SO HE DOESN'T MAKE MY EYES BLEED THIS TIME?

Mysterio annoys me, but I'm not sure if that makes him scum.

OY! MYSTERIO! STFU!

BENMAGE TOO!

Am I going to regret being in this game? I mean seriously, I'm a fairly agreeable person. It takes a fair amount of shit to set me off, and I'm already beginning to get irritated by page 7. If the rest of the game is like this . . .

I take back what I said about Mafuyu before. She's town. I'd still like an explanation though.

Friend is tunnelling really hard on TL for reasons I can't really see. I've seen nothing notable from TL at this point that would make me think he's scum, so I'm hesitant to call Friend town, but I've seen relatively few obsessive tunnels by scum in my experience, so it's at least a slight town-tell.

Oh, so Friend was town. Good to know that the meta still applies.

Theory: If Friend's killer = town, then Benmage = dead. Therefore, Friend's killer = scum. (Or, in other words, I agee with Fate)

The whole "Friend will be avenged RAGE" thing is beginning to look bad. I'm looking at you, gandalf.

Exe is town.

As of now I'm at the top of page 15. I'll continue tomorrow after classes.

[Kairyuu]

You had little to no content in the first 14 pages aside from random shouting about something I don't remember. I've no read on you yet. Given that I think the first 14 pages were like, the first few hours, I'm pretty sure I've not even SEEN many of the players post yet. You'll get your turn tomorrow when I continue/finish reading.

[Kairyuu]

Fuck it. I'm not going to bother catching up any more. If someone wants to recap what happened between page 15 and the point I started reading up they can feel free. Otherwise I'm just going to pretend that those pages never happened and move on.

[Kairyuu]

@Inhim: I've at least skimmed everything from 53 to now.

@DGB: By which you mean he's claimed watcher, yes? I'll do an iso.

[Kairyuu]

I don't care there so many VIs and inexperienced players in this game I really wouldn't mind being free of the effort it would require to win here.

@Mysterio: DOOOO IT. I DON'T CARE IF HE'S 100% CONFIRMED TOWN (hint: he's not). SHOOOOT HIM.

@Benmage: Have you ever stopped to think that maybe the fact that the 80+% of mafiascum that consider YOU a VI are correct instead of it being the other way around? Face it, you are not NEARLY as good as you think you are. In fact, you're one of the most consistantly BAD players I've ever had the displeasure of playing with multiple times. I mean hell, even bad players can be fun to play with, but you GO OUT OF YOUR WAY to be a pompous ASS to anyone who disagrees with you, and refuse to be even the SLIGHTEST bit agreeable. Why else do you think that over half of the GAME in CEBM wanted you dead EVEN WHEN YOU WERE ALMOST DEFINITELY TOWN?

Preview edit: Awww. Oh well. I seem to have seen a number of people calling TL scum, so I suppose the shot is acceptable.

[Kairyuu]

I didn't say that my opinion of you had anything to do with your alignment. It doesn't. You are one of only three people I have encountered on this site that I actively dislike. You are rude and completely full of yourself. Not to mention that you're objectively bad at mafia. You call anyone who attacks you stupid or a VI, and you go after people because you don't like the way they play instead of because you think they're being legitimately scummy. I don't know what you're like in person, so I cannot speak for that, but as a player I have no respect for you at all.

[Kairyuu]

Simple solution: Stop playing in such a way that makes it painful to read your posts. Learn to actually THINK when you play instead of just flailing around and calling people stupid. If you could do that, you wouldn't piss me off like you do. Have you really never noticed that you're pretty much the ONLY person on on the ENTIRE SITE that I can't keep my composure around? You are one of only THREE PEOPLE I've EVER dealt with on this site that cause me to react this way. The other two were Lamont_Cranston, who vanished a while ago, and millar13, who at least TRIED to take my advice and stop acting like an idiot. Hell, I get along perfectly fine with people who the majority of the site seems to hate playing with. People like Mastin and zwet, who at one time or another were hated by the majority of the site I have always considered FUN to play with because they are capable of LISTENING TO REASON. It's not difficult to get me to like you, or at least to be able to put up with you. I don't understand why you seem to find it so hard to do.

[Kairyuu]

Its give and take..i'll lay off the incivility if you don't call me town and ask for me to be vig'd/lynched in the same breath.

The fact that I was already frothing at the mouth due to your play after only the first 14 pages of me not even BEING there yet makes me doubt this will happen, but I'm willing to give it a shot. I will avoid personal attacks against you if you put some decent effort into your play. I don't care if you're abrasive, as long as it's actually apparent that your motivations are that of scumhunting as opposed to "this guy is spamming, let's lynch him" or "I think this one is a VI, therefore death." I'm not even saying you have to be ACCURATE. Just make me see what the people who you say like playing with you supposedly see, and you'll probably have me off your back for good (in an "I hate Benmage" sense. I still intend to get you lynched if you're scum).

[Kairyuu]

@Reck: I'm super lurking? In case you hadn't noticed, a certain other game is taking up all of my time at the moment. This game is moving slowly in comparison, and nothing much is happening.

@DGB: I've gone over Chrono's iso, and I don't really see anything directly scummy other than the fact that he seemed to coast for much of the game. Can you elaborate on your case?

[Kairyuu]

@DGB: I've gone over Chrono's iso, and I don't really see anything directly scummy other than the fact that he seemed to coast for much of the game. Can you elaborate on your case?

If you iso'd him, scum, how could you have missed that he FAKE claimed WATCHER, and when I insisted we lynch him for being a SCUM WATCHER, and the wagon progressed, he changed his claim to JOAT??? He had this whole story about being W, and that he was a W-atcher, then he scratched that, and had a completely different story.

Plus, he FAKE claimed WATCHER with minimal pressure, he was not near being lynched at the time. He was being wagoned, but he still had ways to go.

What he does have is the power to whisper players sweet nothings through the mod.

He's scum.

The problem is the progression of events. You proposed a Chrono-lynch out of nowhere, and decided that he was scum based on nothing but his initial watcher claim. The fact that he switched his claim to JoaT was nothing but fuel on what I feel was an overexaggerated fire in the first place. Your suspicion doesn't look genuine.

So, to simplify:
You voted Chrono out of nowhere D1 with no explanation.
Chrono claimed watcher at some point D2.
You decided that the claim made him 100% scum for reasons I'm not seeing.*
He switches his claim to JoaT, and PROVES one of his abilities, and your opinion of him doesn't change in the least.

*: Claiming when under a small amount of pressure is not a scumtell. It's a noobtell that is often CALLED a scumtell, but doesn't actually yield scum at a rate better than random chance.

So from what I'm seeing, you've based your entire frenzy on the fact that he claimed watcher in the first place. You can't even ARGUE that the JoaT switch had anything to do with you deciding that you wanted him dead, because you were already attacking him wildly before that happened.

I'll ask again. What is your CASE against Chrono? I want something more than "he claimed watcher so he must be scum."

[Kairyuu]

Again, there is a disconnect between what you're saying now and what you initially decided he had to die for. Why was he scum for CLAIMING WATCHER IN THE FIRST PLACE? THAT is what you attacked him for initially (leaving aside the vote out of nowhere D1 that I also want an explanation for). As of right now I don't CARE about the switch between a watcher claim and a JoaT claim. That is not the issue at hand. The ONLY way that you can get away with using that as the basis for your case NOW is if you can provide some reason why you were attacking him IN THE FIRST PLACE.

Last chance DGB. Let's pretend that nothing has happened since your original attack on Chrono D2, and he has only recently claimed WATCHER, with no mention of JoaT powers. WHAT IS YOUR CASE AGAINST HIM?

[Kairyuu]

For the record, I

do

see Chrono as somewhat scummy for the sudden switch when wagoned, but I'm far more interested in the way DGB is trying to erase her past actions and reasoning in the face of that switch. It's like she KNOWS that nothing she said previously carried any weight and wants to focus on the fact that there's finally a legitimate reason to suspect Chrono. I think they both may be scum, though I strongly doubt they're on the same team.

[Kairyuu]

. . . OY! PEOPLE! NO LYNCHING CHRONO UNTIL I'VE FINISHED QUESTIONING DGB!

[Kairyuu]

Oh hai there.

@DGB: Please note that I did NOT defend Chrono. In fact, I found him fairly scummy, as an iso of me will tell you. I was far more concerned with getting an explanation for your behavior towards him, which I've since determined the reason for.

[Kairyuu]

Oh hai there.

@DGB: Please note that I did NOT defend Chrono. In fact, I found him fairly scummy, as an iso of me will tell you. I was far more concerned with getting an explanation for your behavior towards him, which I've since determined the reason for.

Nope. Just iso'd you. You defended Chrono. LOTS.

Never once did I call him town. Never once did I say we shouldn't lynch him. He was my preference for a lynch, but I wanted to finish questioning you FIRST so that if I was right, and you were scum and killed me, you wouldn't be able to slip through the cracks.

Moving on, let's just assume for a second that you're right about me defending Chrono. The EXACT same argument can be used to say that you and TheLonging are scum together "100%." Hypocrisy does not suit you. You know you're town, so even if you think what you're saying is true, you KNOW it's not a valid scumtell, since it's something you did yourself in regards to TL.

[Kairyuu]

I wasn't even AROUND until Chrono went under pressure. I made it VERY clear that I supported the Chrono lynch. That I didn't put a vote down meand NOTHING, since it was ALSO obvious that I was questioning YOU and didn't want the lynch to go through until I was finished.

I've explained myself sufficiently. I don't intend to rehash the point further.

@Mysterio: If you intend to shoot me, say it in thread first so that I can at least claim.

[Kairyuu]

vote: Ellibereth

Simple enough.

[Kairyuu]

Can we vig Elli instead of lynching her?

Also an option.

[Kairyuu]

Am I being wagoned now?

I could pull an Elli and rave about my super-secret-totally-awesome night action that I want to be able to use, but I'm not going to bother.

If the wagon gets large I'll claim. Otherwise, I'd just advise against foolishness.

[Kairyuu]

Oh, noowwwwwwwwwww you show up. How timely. You're like a genie, voting you is like rubbing the bottle 3 times.

Or I was, you know, actually online. You'll note that I'm posting in my other games as well if you'd bother to check.

[Kairyuu]

You town?

Me?

Yup.

[Kairyuu]

Convinec me. Your obstruction of the Chronopie lynch is a major chunk of rust on your medal.

I already told you I'm done arguing about that. I didn't obstruct any lynch, Questioning you was just a higher priority. It has since become a non-issue. Move on.

At the moment I have no solid reads on anyone, so I'd probably be sheeping you if not for the fact that you're voting me.

[Kairyuu]

At the moment I have no solid reads on anyone, so I'd probably be sheeping you if not for the fact that you're voting me.

Wanna lynch BC? Iso me and check out my most recent vote analysis. Note the error that xRECK shouldn't be in blue.

Based on your analysis, either Inhim or MPR should be the one getting lynched, yes? 75+% is larger than 50%. That said, a BC lynch would also be supported by said analysis.

[Kairyuu]

At the moment I have no solid reads on anyone, so I'd probably be sheeping you if not for the fact that you're voting me.

Wanna lynch BC? Iso me and check out my most recent vote analysis. Note the error that xRECK shouldn't be in blue.

Based on your analysis, either Inhim or MPR should be the one getting lynched, yes? 75+% is larger than 50%. That said, a BC lynch would also be supported by said analysis.

Her analysis is skewed >.>

The exact same type of analysis caught my ENTIRE scumteam before (Kinetic's WoT mini ages ago), so I'm inclined to trust it.

@DGB: I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say here:

Indeed, but InHim is more compromised than MPR. For priorities.

Can you rephrase?

[Kairyuu]

My scumbuddies were Elvis_Knits, who lurks as scum, and Empking, who ALWAYS lurks. At the point where she replaced in and made her analysis they had both posted almost nothing.

That said, I'll take a look at your iso.

[Kairyuu]

My scumbuddies were Elvis_Knits, who lurks as scum, and Empking, who ALWAYS lurks. At the point where she replaced in and made her analysis they had both posted almost nothing.

Touche. I feel bad for you.

I can't really call it a win due to the fact that it was one of the games I was replaced in when I mass-flaked around that time, but cyberbob pulled off a win for the scumteam (we killed DGB the night after she made the analysis posts).

That said, I see nothing in your iso that convinces me that you're town (though, tbqh, I don't get a scum read off of the iso either). That you were absent D2 is fairly irrelevant. Based solely on DGB's analysis I would be WILLING to lynch you, but Inhim and MPR look like better lynches, at least until DGB elaborates on the post I asked about.

[Kairyuu]

Life moves on?

Pretty much this. We've got such a huge margin of error right now that even if DGB is wrong there's no reason not to follow where her analysis leads.

[Kairyuu]

I'll wait for DGB to explain what she meant, and then I'll likely hop on the wagon as well.

[Kairyuu]

@DGB: I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to say here:

Indeed, but InHim is more compromised than MPR. For priorities.

Can you rephrase?

There is more bad stuff on InHim than MPR, so InHim should go first, and MPR second, if that's what we want to do.

Right, so why BC?

[Kairyuu]

BC shows up on the radar too, and the fakeclaim is horribly scummy. Now he's bulletproof, which is convenient to explain continued survival as a previously fakeclaimed doctor,

but clearly the jig was up since there was no attempt on his life.

I'd be delighted to lynch InHim too, but I think BC needs to go first.

Scumslip! I love it DGB! How do you know there was no attempt on my life!


Also:

My favorite part about all of dgb's vote analysis is that she automatically assumes we believe that she is town.

Hint: It's because manho investigated her as innocent. She's allowed to assume that.

@DGB: Works for me.

vote: BloodCovenant

[Kairyuu]

DGB is town. Trying to call her scum even when she's CONFIRMED makes you look even WORSE.

[Kairyuu]

@BC: Based on the fact that all kills are accounted for one the ONE night that there've been kills, I'd say it's a fairly decent assumption to make. Also, what Mafuyu said.

[Kairyuu]

@BC:

Night 1
Mass-roleblock (no kills)

Night 2
3 dead (you could not have been targetted)

Night 3
Mass-roleblock (no kills)

You're flailing wildly right now. It would probably help if the crap you were spewing was at least physically possible.

[Kairyuu]

DGB

I'M NOT ON THE REDSCUM LIST

. WTF.

Scumslip, everyone???

Pffffffft

Like we're buddies, and my buddy is pointing this out???

METH IS BAD FOR YOU

Please for the love of God, if Reck is red-scum, kill DGB no questions asked.

No.

[Kairyuu]

Yo, when i flip town. Inhim, Kai, Liam, DGB. That order.

Hey, a list! Thanks, sir.

I agree with both Kai and Liam. Kai first, imo. Not meeeeeeee.

Wonderful plan. I encourage you to try it.

[Kairyuu]

Yo, when i flip town. Inhim, Kai, Liam, DGB. That order.

Hey, a list! Thanks, sir.

I agree with both Kai and Liam. Kai first, imo. Not meeeeeeee.

Wonderful plan. I encourage you to try it.

Would this rougher, more jaded Kai like to explain his plan?

And, to note, I don't condone your lynch first overall. I was using what BC gave me..

I'm just amused at the attention I'm getting. First DGB says I'm "definitely scum with Chrono" and now you're agreeing with BC about my lynch even though his list is pretty much just all people who are voting him, and includes you. If he flips town I will be surprised, but if it happens I intend to give absolutely no credibility to a list comprised solely of his attackers.

[Kairyuu]

Yeah, but you've been super-lurky, which is why I have my suspicions.

I've been doing essentially the same thing in all of my games. College is busier than expected.

[Kairyuu]

Why is it that people seem to think lynching the cop confirmed innocent is a good idea? You're like the third or fourth person to pull something like that in the last 48 hours.

[Kairyuu]

Wonderful, another wasted Night . . .

Based on DGB's wagon analysis, we should be lynching Inhim.

vote: Inhim

[Kairyuu]

Wonderful, another wasted Night . . .

Based on DGB's wagon analysis, we should be lynching Inhim.

vote: Inhim

You're not playing very well. If you want to lynch me, you ought to at least let me Quicken this next Night and then do it.

I disagree with the first sentence, but I agree with the rest.

unvote
vote: MPR

[Kairyuu]

Oh. That explains the CML hate.

unvote
vote: CallMeLiam

[Kairyuu]

@DGB: Still? I thought you'd have given up on this "lynch Kairyuu" foolishness by now.

[Kairyuu]

11 alive. 1 scum from each team remaining. Massclaim is most certainly called for.

I propose popcorn starting with whoever.

DGB goes last. I will brook no argument regarding that.

[Kairyuu]

Gandalf was the one shot ressurector. Maybe. Friend is confirmed ani is. I'll accept that your not the GF atm.

I don't like triglav much but I don't think he's scum.

I do think reck is scummy and I am fine with his lynch.

Loose noose that's a name I forogt was in this game. Any reason he is? I'm on my phone.

gandalf isn't the ressurector. That was pacman.

[Kairyuu]

So what was gandalf again?

He claimed A on like D1, but I'm not sure if he's claimed a role.

[Kairyuu]

WAIT
DO YOU REALIZE MAFUYU ROLECLAIMED JAILKEEPER
AND THAT SOCIO WAS TEH ROLEBLOCKER
Either there is danger of RB's paradox, or Mafuyu is saying BS. What do you think?

Vote: Mafuyu.

Roleblocker Paradox? You're aware that there are multiple precedents that can be used in any situation where two roleblocking roles interact.

[Kairyuu]

Oh good. I'm up. I'm C, Rolecop. DGB is my only living investigation at the moment. I assume that scum killed my N4, and Mysterio killed my N5, which is unfortunate, but it is what it is.

N1: Global Roleblock
N2: DGB - L, Watcher
N3: Global Roleblock
N4: manho - V, Cop
N5: SocioPath - K, Roleblocker

My talking ability is Converse, and my investigation is Check.

Triglav is up next.

[Kairyuu]

Interesting.

I've never seen a town rolecop either, but I'm sure it's possible.
I have, however, seen both town and mafia watcher.

The name was blue in the result PM.

[Kairyuu]

I investigated manho because he was a claimed cop and I had nothing better to go on. Given that my investigations include a color, I assume that said color corresponds to alignment, or that if he was scum he would have at least shown up as Mafia Cop or something.

[Kairyuu]

@Benmage: I take no orders from you. As I explained, I am a ROLECOP, but in my result PMs the name, letter, and role are colored in the same way as they are in the first post. So far, all of my results have been in blue, which I am ASSUMING corresponds to the town alignment. It is POSSIBLE that all of my results are just universally blue, but I doubt it. I've no intention of sacrificing myself for the sake of hammering someone I'm unconvinced is scum.

My role is powerful enough to practically ensure a town win if used in conjunction with others. If I can get 2-3 more Nights worth of results then the number of conf-town players will be high enough that I can sacrifice myself in this manner and wait on a definite win. However, now is not the Day to do so.

vote: Mafuyu

On a related note, "forcing scummyperson A to hammer the supersaint" NEVER hits scum. Almost every time this situation comes up, the person who is supposed to hammer refuses to do so. The ONLY way that said person will hammer is because they are TOWN and CONVINCED that the supersaint is lying and/or scum. A scum will never obey the call to hammer, and a townie who is not utterly convinced that the supersaint is town will ALSO refuse to hammer. If you guys want Mafuyu-scum dead then she needs to be lynched directly. She won't hammer.

[Kairyuu]

Mafuyu, you realize that I have literally flipped town?

I think that's the point. The fact that you're cleared means she is convinced that Taz is the scum-balance to your role. Which means Mafuyu is definitely town. . .

[Kairyuu]

Investigated gandalf. Result: A, Commuter. Result was in blue. This means it's Reck and someone else. Friend is clear and ani is clear. This leaves Benmage, pacman, and triglav. I see very little point in giving triglav's ability to scum, so I'll write him off as confirmed, but pacman and Benmage could both easily be scum with their roles. Regardless, Reck is scum.

vote: Reck

[Kairyuu]

Kairyuu, don't be stupid. I believe we can figure out who is scum based on claims alone,

and it's not me

, though I know my claim is weaker compared to others. Remove the vote, and let's talk about this for a little while.

Let me rephrase.

There are 2 scum left. I know that I'm town. Friend and ani are conf-town, and I have what amounts to an innocent result on gandalf. In addition to that, triglav's role would be utterly pointless in the hands of scum, so I'm counting him as confirmed. From there, that leaves two scum in the group consisting of you, pacman, and Benmage. Assuming the worst case scenerio (no crosskills and no Nights where the two scum kill the same person) we're still one mislynch outside of pseudo-lylo, and 2 mislynches outside of a prisoner's dilemma, so from my perspective we have a 100% chance of winning, because if it isn't you, it's both of them.

The game is won. My vote stays.

@Triglav: Because I thought it was gandalf and Reck, and I would have no way of getting a result off of Reck unless he blatantly lied about his role, which I had no intention of banking on. I was pretty much working under the assumption that pacman and Benmage were town, so I hoped to be able to open the Day with a nice shiny guilty-equivalent result to share.

Also, assuming pacman is scum, he's probably not just a 1-shot reviver. My guess would be Mafia JoaT or something of the like, with the revive being in there as a way to garner town cred, or as a pseudo-safeclaim.

[Kairyuu]

@Reck: Did you really just agree with Benmage that his role would be broken if given to scum? Have you SEEN some of the scumflips? Hint:

Voteblocker: I didn't see any 1-shot modifier, so I assume it was usable each Night, but even if it wasn't a voteblock on a townie on the Night before lylo lets that team force a No lynch in lylo, resulting in a definite scum win.

Mafia Princess: As long as 2 or more scum are alive in lylo, a Mafia Princess can CLAIM SCUM and get lynched and scum still have a confirmed win. Let's assume a 4-3 lylo:
Day X: 4-3
Mafia Princess lynched
Night X: 4-2
Townie killed, extra Night
Night X+1: 3-2
Townie killed
Day X+2: 2-2
Scum win.

This occurs for all situations where the Mafia princess has at least one partner left alive come lylo.

In addition to that, we have the inheritor role. If that had outlived either of the above, it could have been a second attempt at whichever one the scumteam considered more important. Hell, if used in conjunction with the Mafia Princess, it could even turn a 5-3 mylo into a confirmed scum win:
Day X: 5-3
princess lynched, inheritor becomes princess
Night X: 5-2
townie killed, extra Night
Night X+1: 4-2
townie killed
Day X+2: 3-2
inheritor lynched
Night X+2: 3-1
townie killed, extra Night
Night X+3: 2-1
townie killed
Night Day+4: 1-1
Scum win.

And that's just the flips that stuck out to me.

Preview edit: Heh. You're not lynching me. The game is broken. It's 2 of you, pacman, and Benmage. At this point I'm leaning you and Benmage, but either way I'm NOT letting you insert a chance for scum to win into a broken game. Not happening. You die, end of story.

[Kairyuu]

@Reck: Did I say I was confirmed? Nope. I'm pretty sure I've been speaking from my own perspective this whole time. The broken game scenerio hinges on people not being stupid and lynching me. If you're town, then I'm wrong, but it doesn't matter. That doesn't change the fact that if we lynch you, pacman, and Benmage we will be looking at two scum dead out of the two scum remaining in the game.

Upon further investigation (reading pacman's post) you may very well be town. pacman just made an argument so scummy that it broke my scumdar, and considering I really want to believe that Benmage is scum so I can lynch him, that leaves Reck-town.

@pacman:

This is what I thought.
However, what makes me hesitate is that, in case we do mislynch a town today, if Kai is scum he can perfectly damn us, by setting a fake scum result on a townie and letting the whole fate of this game to "who would you believe?".
Even if Kai is town, in case we do lynch town today and he gets scum results, the game can also degenerate into a "who would you believe?" set by the other scum. Both scenarios together, we get a fine masterpiece of WIFOM.
Furthermore, if we do lynch Kai here and he flips scum, we would receive ever more WIFOM, as the person he claimed was scum might STILL be scum, so we would be screwed.
That's what makes me feel uneasy on not lynching Kai. If we decide as such, we should be 100% sure we're lynching scum, else the situation might be truly troublesome.

This right here is such a huge stretch that it's actually funny. You're saying that you should lynch the claimed cop, who is ABILITY CONFIRMED (aka exactly as confirmed as you are, for the record) just because regardless of my alignment, if I come up with a guilty result tomorrow you'll have to decide whether or not I'm scum.

In other words, you want to lynch me now because if you lynch me now you won't have to deal with my result tomorrow. This SCREAMS scum that's afraid that I'll 1-1 him tomorrow. Hell, this right here is enough for me to change my vote.

unvote
vote: pacman

No. What you say here is a very big lie.

I'd love to see a reason for this accusation.

Hint: We do have 2 scum teams.

I don't even know what you're trying to tell me here. Do you think I'm unaware of this fact?

Hint2: The game is already way too imbalanced in favor of town - check the pro-Town flips

How are the town flips thus far relevant AT ALL to the fact Benmage's role as scum would NOT be broken? I said NOTHING about the balance of the game, and I don't understand why you're bringing it up at all, let alone trying to use it as a point against me.

Hint3: Too many pro-Town cops. Worse than that, one pro-Town sane Cop. That and a sane role cop would be totally pushing it.

Let me direct you to Cross Edge Bastard Mod. The pro-town investigative roles included: A role that saw what race killed each of the players who died, a role that could only successfully hammer people who were of a different faction (this was me), a basic cop that could only investigate males, a role that could track/watch at the same time and would continue doing so until he changed the target, and a role that would BROADCAST the use of any ability of the target to the entire town (for example, X used the Mafia kill ability would be posted by the mod), and if I remember correctly there was at least 1-2 ultimate abilities and/or haunt abilities that would cause some sort of investigation. dramonic loves his investigative roles, and 2 cops and a watcher is not at all a stretch comparitively (cross edge was 24 players, this was 25).

I'm still trying to find out stuff there, but I'm tempted to believe Reck is town (mostly a gut vibe), and that therefore the scum would be Kai on one side and Benmage on the other. If after my reread I'm not 100% sure, I will vote Kairyuu.

Bolded mine. So why is there an accusation of me making some sort of "big lie" when you provide absolutely NOTHING that can be construed in ANY WAY to be a lie on my part? Everything I said was logically reasoned out and OBJECTIVELY factual. Methinks you're just throwing around buzzwords. I'm happy with my vote.

[Kairyuu]

I thought pacman was confirmed town?

Since when? He's ability confirmed as having had a 1-shot revive, which he used on you. That's it. My gut is saying scum JoaT.

[Kairyuu]

We are also requesting clarification from Kairyuu as to why a rolecop would be getting alignment info. We'd like to know all pertinent info from your role PM without getting yourself modkilled.

I don't know why I get alignment info, or whether I actually DO get alignment info. As I said, since my results have the letter and rolename colored I have been assuming that the fact it is blue means it corresponds to a town alignment. I may, of course, be wrong about this, since I've obviously not seen any other colors but blue, but until I see one of my blue results flip scum I'm keeping the assumption.

As for the rest, I don't know what exactly you're looking for. I've already said that I'm C, my talk ability is Converse, and my investigation is Check.

I could get behind a Benmage lynch, though I'd prefer pacman. I'll refrain from changing my vote until you're done questioning me though.

[Kairyuu]

I'd be fine with taz coming back in ani's slot. Better than a modkill at least.

[Kairyuu]

Oh, and the mod letter PR is really annoying. At several different points I was having major difficulties determining who was even in the game. I propose that it be changed to exclude the playerlist, rules, and votecounts.

[Kairyuu]

@Reck:

Why am I so fucking conflicted right now?
I could really dig a pacman lynch, because his post WAS terribad...but that would mean one of Kairyuu & Benmage is town which hurts my head to consider.

Correct. One of Benmage and Kairyuu is town. This being Kairyuu. I still don't understand why this isn't blatantly obvious to you by now. If your hangup is my role, then you're being foolish, because every action I've taken with my role has been blatantly pro-town. If it's with my play I'm curious to hear what exactly I've done that's scummy. Specifically, if it's because I've been considerably less active than normal, you know very well that the exact same scenerio has been happening in all of my games, since you're modding one of them and playing with my pretty much empty playerslot in another. If it's something else I'm all ears.

Holy shit, it IS Pacman & Kairyuu.

So close, but yet so far. How does Benmage's last post mean anything as to his alignment? He is already demonstrated to have a Night action, so even if he IS town (hint: he's not) he would be barred from replacing in if what dram said about taz is any indicator.

[Kairyuu]

Day, Night, whatever. It's still an active abilities, so the choices he made, even though they are pretty much common knowledge COULD be lied about, and allowing him to replace into the slot gives him information that his role should not know with 100% certainty. I wouldn't particularly care, but that's the principle behind it.

[Kairyuu]

1. I've not slept in more than 24 hours, so I'm not sure whether or not I'm just going to decide to pass out after classes or if I'm actually going to get to this.
2. I have a 5 page paper due by 6, so I don't have time to do anything but comment briefly.

@Taz: Why are you voting me exactly? We're lynching either Benmage or pacman. Both are scum, so the order is irrelevant. Just because you're conf-town doesn't mean you don't have to give reasons.

@pacman: Wonderful. Based on your most recent response, you are either blatantly misrepping me or have NO IDEA what the post you called scummy was even ABOUT.

Hint for you this time, Mr. Genius: I said NOTHING about me OR Benmage being confirmed based on the power level of our roles. In fact, it was BENMAGE who claimed that he was conf-town based on his role's power level, and ME who said he WASN'T. Those scenerios were proof that he was full of shit for stating that an ability that could win scum the game in lylo made him conf-town. As for myself, nowhere in that post did I say anything about my alignment at all. The only time I even referenced my own alignment was when you said that two sane town cops would be overpowered, and I pointed to evidence that dram has given town that and a LOT more investigative roles in a game of the same size.

[Kairyuu]

/bah

/pointandlaugh

[Kairyuu]

'grats town. Reck's final catch of gandalf was a wonderful deduction and I give him like 80% of the credit for winning that endgame. I was SURE that if he had gotten lynched that gandalf would have been able to coast to a win based on my 'investigation.'

Then again, no one pointed out the fact that I was the only scum alive on my team for like, 3 Nights, so based on the info that Reck brought forward, I couldn't have investigated gandalf in the first place.

On the topic of my investigations, I really DID get colors in the results for the one Night that I actually managed to get an investigation in (DGB).

@gandalf: You actually played pretty badly (though so did I, so don't think I'm being condescending). It was only my investigation claim that kept you from getting speedlynched after I was dead, or possibly even before. I figured out you were the last scum and played with the purpose of KEEPING YOU ALIVE because that was the best shot at my team winning. If we hadn't both killed DGB that Night and had managed ANY lynch but one of us I would have shot you and won. The real goal in a game like this with so many ways to confirm people is to be one of the obv-town who isn't confirmed so that you can eliminated most/all of the conf-townies and have an excuse for why you're alive in endgame.

@people who were on my wagon: I'm curious about something. I know my play was fairly sub-par due to college starting etc, but I'm curious as to what caused the sudden shift from people saying "Kairyuu should stay alive as long as he's still being useful and giving us results" to being quicklynched in under 24 hours. Also, do you think there was anything I could have done to prevent it?

For the record, this was only the second time I've EVER been lynched as scum if I'm remembering correctly, and the first that I've been lynched as scum based on my own play (the other was Narnia LWW mafia where I replaced as the mafia global roleblocker in lylo with everyone convinced I was scum).

[Kairyuu]

http://www.quicktopic.com/44/H/PUFcN86X76Sd

Crit Mafia QT.