ZOMBIES! - Zombies take over for the win!!!

[elvis_knits]

Holla!

I probably can't read this until tomorrow, but I will be getting up to speed shortly. Feel free to give me a tl;dr to help me along the way if you can think of anything important I need ot know.

[elvis_knits]

Okay, cool, I didn't know there was a weird setup.

[elvis_knits]

Wait, it doesn't look like there's anything to understand about the setup...

[elvis_knits]

GAH... my other games are all crackin right now and I haven't had time to look at this today. I will atleast start looking at stuff tonight or by tomorrow morning. I notice McGriddle is high in votes. I just had an experience with McGriddle as scum. I will look at him ASAP.

[elvis_knits]

I started reading, got through only about 6-7 pages. The good thing is there doesn't seem to be too many wall posts, so it's not a bad read. I'm still letting it sink in and not sure what I think as an overall picture (also since I haven't read too much yet). I also looked up the cases on McGriddle and Tate, and they both seem to be lynch-worthy. Reckoner, less so.

So... I know this post isn't super-helpful but I just wanted to let you know I am on my way.

[elvis_knits]

I have totally seen McGriddle play the dumb newb card before. And it was LIES!

unvote; vote McGriddle

[elvis_knits]

I have totally seen McGriddle play the dumb newb card before. And it was LIES!

unvote; vote McGriddle

If this game's not ongoing, I'd totally like a link.

It is ongoing. If you can find it for yourself, that would be cool I suppose...

[elvis_knits]

e_k: do you have town meta on him as well? The fact that he acted like he does in this game in some other game and turned out to be scum doesn't mean he doesn't act that way always.

I've never seen him as town. But if he's like this as town also he's dead weight. So he's scum or dead weight.

[elvis_knits]

I just really don't believe that claim. McGriddle said twice he doesn't mind being the lynch today and was pretty fatalistic about the whole thing, not like a cop panicking and begging us not to kill him. Now all the sudden "I'm the cop...lol, oops."

Check it out:

Fair enough, I wouldn't mind being the lynch today, I know I have bad play in this game, and if it came to a lylo situation and I was still alive I know I would be the killed person. So if you guys decide to lynch me I am with it.

it looks like there is no exit plan for me so I am accepting my fate.

I suppose we should be careful and not lynch a possible cop, but I really, really don't believe McGriddle.

[elvis_knits]

^Exactly why I voted for him. For a cop to go "Okay, lynch me" is either ridiculously anti-town, or just plain dumb, and I don't think McG's that dumb.

I don't think dumb is even a possible explanation. It is simply unnatural for anyone, ESPECIALLY if they are newbish, to not care if they are being lynch if they are a cop. Newb power roles freak out more than anyone.

[elvis_knits]

Hey McGriddle, have you ever heard of a doctor? A cop usually gets a doc protect and thus doesn't die until the doc has been killed.

[elvis_knits]

Hey McGriddle, have you ever heard of a doctor? A cop usually gets a doc protect and thus doesn't die until the doc has been killed.

I dont know that there IS a doctor. And if there is, and he protects me, do you think that will be enough to keep me from being lynched the next day?

WEll, there's probably a doc. But scum won't know if there is a doc either. They have to take a chance of not having a kill go through if they target you. Chances are they won't do it. Especially if they think they can lynch you.

You might not get lynched if you started to be helpful and hunt scum. Otherwise, yeah you'd probably get lynched.

[elvis_knits]

Oh good question

[elvis_knits]

I mean, I will feel like a dumbass if McGriddle really is a cop... but I really think his behavior does not fit.

Also, it sounds like we think there is Cult, but also a SK or a mafia? In that case, mafia might have a cop or rolecop to help them find the cult. In which case, McGriddle could really be a cop and also be scum.

[elvis_knits]

Who did I personally attack?

[elvis_knits]

GRIDDLE, please anser this question:

McG, what kind of investigation results will you get?

[elvis_knits]

Good

[elvis_knits]

I don't see how McGriddle was obviously town fakeclaiming cop. Maybe it's just my other experience with him, but I didn't think he was obvtown for making a move that I find blatantly scummy. I don't see how iLord and kmd recognized a "town fakeclaiming cop" either, but it's probably because I have a different experience of the player. And I really don't think it's a good idea in general to let fake claimers live because there much more likely to be scum.

I have to do a bit more reading to see who I think is scummy at this point.

[elvis_knits]

PIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

<3

I have been a horrible procrastinator in this game and haven't read much yet although I replaced in at the end of the last day. So I really don't know what to tell you in terms of recap (except that mcGriddle fakeclaimed cop and we lynched him and he flipped town ). But the excitement of your entrance is giving me a boost and I think I might atcually get my ass in gear now.

[elvis_knits]

^^ this. tate i believe the rule you should play to win applies to you, and you sir are not playing to win.

unvote, vote tate

This does not sound like you actually think tate is/was scum. It seems like you are hiding behind a gameplay philosophy as a reason to vote someone, not actual saying you think he is scum.

I also ISOed you and found that the only people you've voted this game are mcG, cooldog and tate. Who are all VI's. Well, you voted evilsnail too, but that is a bandwagon that makes no sense to me.

vote wolframnheart

[elvis_knits]

I have been feeling guilty about ignoring this game. And I love Pie. I haven't seen him play a game in a long time. So it makes me excited.

While I agree that all three of McG, cooldog, and tate, have been scummy in some way or another, it does not seem like you are looking very critically at people, but are taking the easy road (by voting VI's), and going with the flow of things. It does not seem like you are really scum hunting becuase you're picking ALL easy targets.

[elvis_knits]

iLord, it seems like you are saying that tate was scummy for refusing to participate. That is a valid reason. It's basically why active lurking is scummy.

But wolfy said that he was voting tate for "not playing to win" WHICH HAS NO BEARING ON HIS ALLIGNMENT.

[elvis_knits]

Yos, who is scum now?

[elvis_knits]

In fact, I'm feeling all cavalier. I'll go for the quad post and

Vote: Cooldog

. Subject to change if something interesting happens in the reread. Again: at this point I would also be down to wagon manho or Yos, so if anyone would rather do that let me know and I'll join in the fun.

I would probably wagon any of those people. The current people like abr and evilsnail don't interest me, but those do.

[elvis_knits]

When I read the little of this game I read, I thought Yos's early "jokes" came off a little forced. He tried to get support for some wagon (cooldog?) by quoting himself and being like "I agree with Yosarian2" and "Yos makes a really good point there." Which seemed weird to be becuase hardly anyone else was joking around, they were all talking about the sample PM thing which Yos studiously ignored. Jokes>content=scummy

Let's wagon him!

vote Yos

[elvis_knits]

Do I ave to unvote?

unvote; vote yos

[elvis_knits]

When I read the little of this game I read, I thought Yos's early "jokes" came off a little forced. He tried to get support for some wagon (cooldog?) by quoting himself and being like "I agree with Yosarian2" and "Yos makes a really good point there." Which seemed weird to be becuase hardly anyone else was joking around, they were all talking about the sample PM thing which Yos studiously ignored. Jokes>content=scummy

...jokes are scummy?

Not what I said. Jokes aren't scummy. Jokes without content elsewhere are scummy. Jokey, randomish votes when people seem to be making serious votes = scumym.

Yes, I was joking. I was also trying to start off the game doing something weird in order to try and get some kind of reaction out of Cooldog, because having played with him in the past, I've found him hard to read; last time I played with him .

I call BS. Check page 2. You moved your vote after people thought your jokes were weird, and unvoted CoolDog before he even posted. THat's not going to get any reaction from him is it?

[elvis_knits]

I'm also having a hard time getting a handle on Starbuck. She lurked through most of yesterday on the pretense of "people are being mean to each other on the internet," and then today posted fairly uninformatively and then went all gung-ho on the lurkers. Under normal circumstances I would find this scummy, but I realize it could just be a Starbuck meta. Anyone played with her before?

I've played with her probably 3-4 times. First few times we had knock-down-drag-out fights (both of us town). She always seems scummy to me. However, pressuring her doesn't seem to help me read her. We just piss each other off and fight to the death. So I've been trying to find a gentler approach since the other one wasn't working. I'm not sure I really know how to read her yet... but I will say that her meta is that she gets lynched a lot.

Also she definitely has a thing about "people being mean to each other on the internet" and says that in all games. This isn't something new that she's using as an excuse.

[elvis_knits]

Hmm, I don't know if I've ever seen her go off on lurkers before. Not that I can recall? I'll look at her posts more in depth in a moment to see if I have any other comments to make about her.

[elvis_knits]

Ok so I had time to go over what I missed and again am sorry about the lack of posting, I might have to modify my Sig and put it as "Iffy playtime late friday to late monday" but hopefully not.

Anyways. Looking at manho I can see people's problem with him. He does dig himself into holes for one, and posts like these:

i think i've missed pie's case on me?

Are just Lawls and *facepalm*s

Pie has posted her case/reason to vote him already:

Why isn't manho dead yet? Literally half the content he's posted has been some variation on "Tate quoted the role PM!!!!!!," which a) happened early on page 1, and b) was originally brought up by someone else (Zazie). That's both forced AND a form of active lurking.

Not sure how he missed that. Problem is that with the votes going on manho I can't help but wonder about some of the votes on him, especially when I see this:

Read over what I missed. Thinking manho is the scummiest, but not by much over Yos and Pie.

Vote: Manho

No real reasoning why he thinks manho is scummiest, and over Yos and Pie? Pie was the one telling people to vote manho, so if bv310 has some doubt over Pie why vote her way? Now true Ani voted before Bv310 and didn't give a reason other then "sure"
but Bv310 has stated he read over it, but is not posting any type of "why I think manho is scum" thoughts and is following someone that apparently he thinks is just slightly scummy under the person he is voting, which does not seem to make much sense to me.

unvote, vote Bv310

Not really a fan of wolf saying he thinks manho is scummy but he thinks some of the votes on manho are scummier.

[elvis_knits]

Manho, who is scum?

[elvis_knits]

but why would a townie refer to his own role pm? i doesn't make sence.

I don't even know what to say to this. Are you asking me why a townie would read his own role PM?

a townie will read his own role pm, but they don't need to read every wordin the pm, and they probably won't. for example, i open the pm, see the word townie bolded in the first line, and then close it. the last line of the pm is always the same in almost every game, regarding your own alignment. so it didn't make much sence for a townie to read his own role pm word-by-word, and remember the word "zombie lord" so hard and then use it in his first post.

Honestly, I did the same thing as manho is describing. But there's no reason to expect everyone to do the same. And it's a really bad reason to vote a person. It's way too subjective.

Manho, I still want you to make a scum list and tell us who you think is scum. I get better reads on a person when they are scum hunting rather than just responding to attacks. I see you are voting iLord. That doesn't make much sense to me.

[elvis_knits]

Maybe Yos died protecting somebody?

vote CryMeARiver

Peer pressured into a hammer? Boo.

[elvis_knits]

bottom line is, though, the zombies didn't gain a member last night either way.

How do we know that?

[elvis_knits]

Actually, I've never seen a cultist who could recruit anything BUT vanilla.

[elvis_knits]

Can we please stop calling him PIG? It's too oinkerific. His name is PIE for short.

[elvis_knits]

Reckoner's CMAR vote makes me dislike mine...

unvote; vote diamondillium

I've played with him before and he's usually much more on-point than this game. And his reason for voting manho seemed like the wrong reason to vote manho.

Hey, sorry for not posting for a while. I'm ok with a lurker lynch. Unvote, Vote: Manho .

Manho wasn't really lynched just for being a luker. It was his faulty logic with the sample PM stuff, and his failure to do anything else all game. The fact that diamond doesn't get this but votes manho anyway makes me think dianmond was just being opportunistic and getting onto whatever wagon was going.

[elvis_knits]

I find it odd that Elvis (who was the sudden force behind the bv wagon) just backed off it.

I never voted BV... you must be thinking of someone else.

[elvis_knits]

Also, I'm largely ambivalent on bv since I mislynched him another game where he played for crap and flipped town.

[elvis_knits]

He's dead but ongoing. However, I think someone said he always plays like this.

This is not to say he won't be scum sometimes, or that I think he should get a free pass. I'd just rather spend my time going after a person who might actually have some readable scumtells, and if flips scum will yield info.

[elvis_knits]

I believe Evilsnail. If this is a gambit then he's dying next. Scum don't usually do the 1-for-1, so I doubt evilsnail is gambitting.

Also, kmd flipped deputy, iirc. Evilsnail claiming sheriff fits with that flavor. Cop doesn't. And Reck claimed cop. Also, worst case scenario if reck is actually the cop is we get two confirmed town in bv and oddin.

unvote; vote reckoner

[elvis_knits]

Dude, evilsnail is claiming that you targetted kmd (who died) N1, and you're saying you targetted bv.

There's a problem there.

Not only does the info not match, but he's saying you targetted the guy who died.

[elvis_knits]

I'm here to make everyone's day!!!

OMG you made my day!

[elvis_knits]

Okay, maybe I am just slow here, but where does it say that when cult tries to recruit a PR, the PR dies?

Do we know we only have a cult? Do we have a mafia also? Maybe the mafia is doing the killing and the cult has been recruiting each night? Or maybe it's an SK or VIG doing the killing. How did we get into this assumption that the kills have resulted from recruitment attempts?

The other times I have played cult games, I have never seen a mechanic where the cult tries to recruit and if it's a PR, the PR dies. So, if there's some precedent for this, I haven't ever seen it.

[elvis_knits]

Dammit. Okay.

Moving on...

[elvis_knits]

I went back and read reckoner's reaction to McGriddle claiming cop. Reck asked how McGriddle's investigation results would be given to him.

Reck... if you're the cop, why would you ask that of McGriddle? Did you think there might be another cop in the game?

[elvis_knits]

EK, what is your weekday schedule say between site time Noon to 6pm? Not asking for extremely specific details, look more for something like, "I'm a stay at home mom" or "I have a full time job" or "I'm free all day usually."

I work at home and frequently procrastinate with mafia. It varies when I'm online. I've been scaling back my games lately.

[elvis_knits]

EK, what is your weekday schedule say between site time Noon to 6pm? Not asking for extremely specific details, look more for something like, "I'm a stay at home mom" or "I have a full time job" or "I'm free all day usually."

I work at home and frequently procrastinate with mafia. It varies when I'm online. I've been scaling back my games lately.

Ok, tyvm btw, let's take a look back at Mar. 9th, a Tuesday, and review what you said...

I started reading, got through only about 6-7 pages. The good thing is there doesn't seem to be too many wall posts, so it's not a bad read. I'm still letting it sink in and not sure what I think as an overall picture (also since I haven't read too much yet). I also looked up the cases on McGriddle and Tate, and they both seem to be lynch-worthy. Reckoner, less so.

So... I know this post isn't super-helpful but I just wanted to let you know I am on my way.

Five hours later, had you foregone your work for the day and finished reading the remaining 22 pages of the thread when you put now confirmed townie McG at L-1 or did you feel some scummy drive to push a mislynch to the edge of its completion before becoming completely informed by an entire read of the thread? It seems a little unlike you to want to rush a day and to put someone on the fryer for no more than newb card meta and I find it a little scummy.

I have totally seen McGriddle play the dumb newb card before. And it was LIES!

unvote; vote McGriddle

I thought McGriddle was scum because he fake claimed cop and I have seen him be entirely ridiculous as scum before. The game I played with him got abandoned, so I can link you to it now:

http://www.mafiascum.net/forum/viewtopi ... 95&start=0

In that game he made a number of similar moves, fake claiming and telling us changing stories. In the game I'm linking you to, he tried to claim a role, then claim another role, then say he's not sure what role he has, and can't find out since he deletes role pm's immediately upon reading them so that nobody can hack into his account and read them.

So, his play here seemed eerily similar to me, and his claim looked fake. So I voted him without reading the entire game. Also, I seem to remember a deadline looming. But I didn't seem much reason to draw that kind of thing out anyway. Fake claims usually mean scum. I'm not going to let that slide when the odds are high that a fake claimer is scum.

[elvis_knits]

I agree. Do you agree that it is scummy to push the lynch of a dumb townie as opposed to looking for scum?

You'd have to be scum to know that said dumb player is dumb townie.

I get the feeling that is exactly the case with your end of D1 nostradamus-like prophecy of McG's alignment. I think it is scummy that you took the time to make a self-proclaimed first time of "building a case to show the dead townie was giving off town reads." I think as town, you, in particular, would do a simple "*shrug*, I was wrong" and get back to the business of scumhunting. Even at your prophetic announcement, you still expressed you were still okay with lynching the dumb townie.

Can you remind me of what your case that manho was scum was all about on D1?

I don't know how anyone got a townie feel from McG either, but I wasn't sure if I am biased because of what I've seen of him.

[elvis_knits]

Your defense of iLord is noted, EK.

I was actually agreeing with you.

[elvis_knits]

Gotcha, I think I focused on the 2nd half of your statement and the fact that you were on that wagon. Your agreement is noted.

I want to go back and look because I think more than one person said similar things as iLord, that they thought it was obv McG was town.

I didn't like that at the time but haven't gone after it because I don't know how biased I am about McG.

[elvis_knits]

I suppose we should be careful and not lynch a possible cop, but I really, really don't believe McGriddle.

Can you please explain why you didn't remove your McG vote while calling for caution against lynching him as a claimed cop?

Because I really didn't think he was a cop.

[elvis_knits]

I wanted to see if his cop results matched mine as far as what the mod said.

Did you think there could be 2 cops?

[elvis_knits]

The whole thing that bothers me about Reck's and evil's claims is that it took evil so many times of posting to get it correct. Reck claimed on the spot, no problem.

It's basically right now just evil saying "OMG! Reck lied!" and that's it. There's no other evidence other than that.

I thought he just had the one typo when explaining for a second or third time. I didn't think there was such a problem with the claim. I think he was trying not claim his role, only the info, which resulted in the claim coming out slower. School me if I am wrong.

Evil's claimed role is a little out of the ordinary -- he says he targets somebody and finds out who they targetted on the previous night (I think). This is sort of like a delayed tracker, which is a little weird. But his reasoning that the sheriff questions people seems to work flavor-wise for me. Seem possible.

One of the reasons I believe Evilsnail is because he didn't have to claim info on reck. If he's scum, it would be much safer to just keep his head down and play the game... but he stuck his neck out to get reck lynched. And if Reck is town we lynch evilsnail next. What kind of a scum does that? Evilsnail wasn't even suspected as far as I remember. Why sacrifice yourself?

[elvis_knits]

I found this twilight approval of the McG lynch highly uncharacteristic of you. Just doesn't seem to be your usual style.

Good

I don't care

Pushing McG on D1 for newb card meta, Yos(another dead now confirmed townie) for jokes on D2. Seems suspicious to me.

When I read the little of this game I read, I thought Yos's early "jokes" came off a little forced. He tried to get support for some wagon (cooldog?) by quoting himself and being like "I agree with Yosarian2" and "Yos makes a really good point there." Which seemed weird to be becuase hardly anyone else was joking around, they were all talking about the sample PM thing which Yos studiously ignored. Jokes>content=scummy

Let's wagon him!

vote Yos

So you think that I pushed for Yos's lynch all day and then tried to recruit him? Like pre-bussed Yos and then tried ot make him my buddy?

[elvis_knits]

I have info that says xReck is scum. I won't reveal what this is yet, but xReck needs to claim in his next post.

xReck is lying. He targetted Kmd Night 1. That is the info I have. I was hoping to catch him in a lie by getting him to claim.

Vote: xReckonerx

I never said I had the results yesterday either. I'll elaborate, if necessary, but I'd prefer to say as little as possible about the details of my ability.

Okay, fine. My ability allows me to determine who a player targetted the night before. That's why I don't have a useful N1 result and why I only found today that xReck targetted Kmd N2.

(This is the typo post... but when read in relation to everything else and what he is claiming his ability is, it's obvious that he is claiming he found out N2 that reck targetted kmd N1. )

[elvis_knits]

I sense someone getting a little defensive. I'm not one of the one's who has been pushing for the death of now confirmed townies since D1 of this game, you are. I am trying to figure out the whys of such behavior from more than one person in this game.

Sly, you just replaced in, so saying you haven't been pushing dead townies... it would be impossible for you to have done so since you weren't here. It doesn't mean you've done something awesome while the rest of us have been sucking.

Plus, you're throwing garbage at me. Your arguments against me seem to be:

1)My approval of the McG lynch was "out of character" (BS WIFOM)
2)I attacked people who flipped town (like nobody else has done that? If the cult hasn't even recruited anyone yet, the cult is probably really tiny, so our odds of hitting town are high).

I do have one more thing to ask of you on this topic though...

Do you have some inside information on the night actions of the zombies that lead to your asking of this?

Maybe Yos died protecting somebody?

No. And stop fishing.

[elvis_knits]

Not only defensive, also a little nasty.

O RLY?

F U with your "voting for a now confirmed townie"

That's so misleading.

It makes it sound like Yos was confirmed townie yesterday, which he was not.

People vote for people who flip town all the time and it doesn't make them scum.

I have some news for you Mr. Sly.

Defensiveness is not a scum tell. When you attack a person, they have to defend themselves. When your attacks are consistently WIFOM crap, it might get a little annoying.

Also, I am sick to death of your stupid noting.

You know what I'm noting about you? Your refusal to tell me why a scum evilsnail would sacrifice himself to get reckoner lynched.

YOUR DEFENSE OF RECKONER IS NOTED.

[elvis_knits]

You absolutely were forced to claim in that game. Because everyone was claiming.

[elvis_knits]

Completely different situation

[elvis_knits]

I really resent you bringing this up when we can't discuss it. But I completely disagree with you.

[elvis_knits]

I think kmd had some good ideas. Specifically his suspicions on diamondilium and RECKONER.

[elvis_knits]

I think his late day epiphany was the most telling.

You mean iLord.

Maybe. I told you I agree with you that the way he knew McG was town makes no sense.

However, I ISOed him and he had a number of good points against diamondillium that made me like him slightly.

[elvis_knits]

REckoner - did you breadcrumb your results at all?

[elvis_knits]

I would be down with lynching bv, EK or Oddin also.

This is so stupid.

Your BBF Reck says he investigated bv and oddin innocent. IF YOU BELIEVE RECKONER IS TOWN YOU SHOULDN'T WANT TO LYNCH BV OR ODDIN!

[elvis_knits]

So you're just going to assume that reckoner IS a cop but his results are useless.

That makes so much sense.

[elvis_knits]

In a regular game of mafia, are a cop's results on an investigation immune GodFather usually useless?

You don't even know if the zombielords are immune.

[elvis_knits]

hey now

[elvis_knits]

Spyrex is here?!

:SQUEEEEE:

However, I was kinda suss of diamonilium :/

Spyrex's contributions are already 1000 times better than diamond though, and I like the reck vote. So, spyrex is only on probation at this point.

[elvis_knits]

In any case, Sly, don't leave me here with all these monsters. By the way, Sly & Pie, do you think there is a ZL on my wagon? How many? Who are your top picks?

Statistically, yes, there are probably scum on your wagon, but none of the players jump out as me as a good lynch. Of those, I would be most willing to lynch Suave and EK.

I've started growing basil by my back door so that I can put fresh basil on my turkey sandwiches. Fresh basil from your own garden is just so much more flavorful than store-bought.

---

Spyrex - I agree with your assessment of Wolf's discussion of modkills. Recently, people I have seen asking for, or dancing around the suggestion of modkills have been scum. I'm thinking of SirDanilot in Kingmaker (he was SK). Also thinking of Sly in a certain game we're both dead in, but still ongoing.

[elvis_knits]

Zombies eat BBBBRRRAAAAIIINNNSSSSS, Sly, not sandwiches. Get with the program!

The fact that you are pushing for modkills again... does that mean you always do that or that you're scum again?

[elvis_knits]

Sly, how are you going to feel when Reck flips ZL?

[elvis_knits]

Sly, how are you going to feel when Reck flips ZL?

How did you feel when McG, manho and Yos all flipped town? Oh wait, I already know the answer to that, closer to your wincon.

[elvis_knits]

Can I get a TLDR on why we haven't lynched reckoner?

[elvis_knits]

Can I get a TLDR on why we haven't lynched reckoner?

We're lynching him tomorrow. Gives us more info and has no significant drawback.

More info if he's town... but what are the chances of that?

Look... he's a zombielord for crying out loud. There seems to be speculation that there is more than once zombielord out there... but we really don't know what we're dealing with and who has the power to recruit and whatnot. In a cult game, where the fuckers multiply, we need to lynch scum ASAP.

What are the possibilities where reck is town?
1)ES is scum
2)Scum busdriver

If ES is scum, let's find out now so that we know to lynch him tomorrow.

And I think a scum busdriver is extremely unlikely. I mean... zombie cult recruiter busdriver?? WTF. Probably not.

So let's lynch reckoner and dance on his grave.

[elvis_knits]

Look... he's a zombielord for crying out loud.

Do you have some kind of proof that the rest of us don't? Because this has not been proven.

No, I have no proof, but ES does. ES claims that Reck targetted KMD (the NK) N1. Since we know that PR's die when a recruit attempt is made, it seems most likely that KMD died while trying to be recruited. Now, that doesn't mean other roles might not also target kmd for whatever reason. BUT Reck does not admit targetting KMD. Which means either KMD or ES is lying.

[elvis_knits]

I don't understand why we are putting off lynching one of them. We have to deal with the situation. I think the facts speak VERY strongly that ES is truthful and Reck is a zombielord. But even if the opposite is true... we need to find out ASAP.

[elvis_knits]

But Reck claimed who he targeted BEFORE ES came out with his target. You don't think ES could have been waiting so that he could purposely contradict Reck?

I guess he could, but if so, I want to find out now so we lynch ES tomorrow. If ES is scum, he would know that he would go next, and it would make his play sort of DUMB. So I doubt it.

BUT... If you were ES, and you had info that Reck targetted the NK N1, would you have done it differently?

I mean, ES could have just claimed his info that he knows Reck targetted KMD n1. But I think forcing Reck to claim first and see if he admits it makes it stronger. Because if reck claims that he targetted kmd, which matches what ES knows, he might be more willing to believe that reck has a good explanation for why he targetted kmd. But the fact that he lied about his target lets ES know that Reck is scum fo sho!

[elvis_knits]

As I said, I never said I couldn't be wrong about Reck, but I'm not willing to lynch a claimed cop. I'm sure as all hell if Reck is lynched and he flips scum that I'll be fucked, but we don't have any thing else other than "he said, she said" as evidence.

But in a normal game, when somebody claims info that another player is scum... what do you do?

Do you just say "we don't know who is lying so let's lynch somebody else"??

I always lynch the person that there is a guilty on.

[elvis_knits]

Starbuck... I don't think he screwed up trying to tell us how he found out. I think he made one typo about the nights that should have been obvious since he already had explained that his role finds out info from the previous night.

I will admit that the role ES is claiming is a bit unusual. However, I have played farside games before and she is a creative mod, so I won't rule it out. One game she had an inventor and we were all saying "well, the inventor must be town because I've never seen a scum inventor." And the inventor was town that game. But then the next game she made a scum inventor ON PURPOSE.

In fact, in Dollhouse mini, one of the roles I got in that game allowed me to target a player and find out all previous roles/actions any player had had. And farside was in that game, so it might have given her the idea. Although, maybe not, because I'm not sure if this game had already started or not by the time we saw that in dollhouse.

[elvis_knits]

But in a normal game, when somebody claims info that another player is scum... what do you do?

Do you just say "we don't know who is lying so let's lynch somebody else"??

I always lynch the person that there is a guilty on.

Have no fear - if we're not lynching RECK today, we're definitely doing it tomorrow. Basically what people are saying is that we lose nothing from waiting a day, but if RECK does happen to be actually the cop, then we get an extra investigation.

Yeah, let's give him a chance to recruit tonight.

[/le sigh]

[elvis_knits]

What about Normal Chicken Sandwiches? Are those scummy as well?

Any demonstration of hunger in this particular game is scummy and should warrant a vote.

Buffalo chicken =/= Brains

Continuing to say the sandwich joke is some sort of cult tell or post restriction is stupid. It's also a red herring. There may be some dumbasses that believe you. And we don't need to be increasing paranoia.

Anyway... we need to lynch Reck today. I will settle for nothing less.

[elvis_knits]

Settle, bitch.

Hi

[elvis_knits]

WASSSSSSUP

So Reckoner, tell us about your cult. How many zombie lords are there, and who are they? How pissed are you that kmd and Yos were power roles?

[elvis_knits]

Hey so people who have lurked this whole day like Ani, wolf, and BV, all appear out of nowhere to swing a lynch at Pie.

This is such BS.

CMAR was not the top vote-getter. He did not have to claim. Why did he? And why is he voting reckoner if his claim "confirms" reckoner? This is not adding up for me.

[elvis_knits]

It really sucks doing this on a small phone on vacation. my role pm actually says that i will heal players. i questioned farside aboutthis and he sid that ifthe protected player is attacked by zombies that night, the targeted player will not be attacked. thereforei do not actuall y heal the player. this is where things go wrong.

night 1 i completely forgot about the game. night 2, farside ended the night early while i was sending in my night action. it did not go thru, but he repaid me by assuring me that i was a strong doctor.

no, it never used infected in the role pm, but i still though reck was real and tried to indicate this. i also lurked some because i did not wanna stick out and be a goid nightkill. farside, im on the worst phone, so can i please ask if the tag doesnt work, my vote still goes thru

unvote; vote: pie

DOES ANYONE REALLY BELIEVE THIS GUY IS A DOCTOR WHO HAS MADE NO NIGHT CHOICES???!!!!

OMG.

We need to lynch Reckoner now more than ever because of how hard CMAR is trying to draw the lynch off Reck.

[elvis_knits]

@e_k: Actually, I believe him. For a number of reasons that it will enumerate later.

But for now, you are correct that RECK needs to be lynched.

I find it really hard to believe that a power roles messed up all their night actions so far. I mean, I have seen people play really badly, so I guess it's possible. However, I find it more likely that he is scum who doesn't want to get caught claiming something that can be disproven. The more stuff you claim, the more chance there is to be caught in the lie.

[elvis_knits]

The only person so far who gave his night claim without having to correct it or explain 5 billion times has been Reck.

He's also the only person we have a guilty on.

[elvis_knits]

This Pie wagon sucks.

It makes me think we have a lot of zombie lords in this game.

[elvis_knits]

Sly, I would change to CMAR, but I think it's too late now

[elvis_knits]

I will move to CMAR if you think it helps but I thought we had more chance of getting one or two extra votes on reck than getting like 8 more to move to cmar.

[elvis_knits]

FoS: iLord

for making an accusation against a CLAIMED POWER ROLE!

lol

[elvis_knits]

Okay so ODdin says he would vote cmar.

I would vote cmar.

How many more could we get? I think it's like 30 minutes to deadline.

[elvis_knits]

We could compromise and have ODDin move to CMAR while the rest of us stay on Reck. That way CMAR knows he isn't getting off too easy. It, like, sends a message and shit.

Yeah, Oddin should do this. It would be smart.

[elvis_knits]

hey i don't know what's going on with all this softclaiming nonsense.

[elvis_knits]

Hey guys I'm sorry I missed yesterday, it seemed pretty short. I've been horrible in both my games lately, not keeping up, but I promise to give this some time today. I haven't read everything but a reckoner lynch seems ideal -- he should have been lynched days ago.

[elvis_knits]

I don't know what's happening in this game. SPyrex, who is scum?

[elvis_knits]

Let's start with who didn't want to kill reckoner. That wagon the day we killed Pie instead of Reckoner was very FAIL. LEt's kill everyone on that wagon. Then dance around and be appy because we won.

[elvis_knits]

appy = happy

[elvis_knits]

Wooosh.

Its totally Ani (but you knew that Elvis what with being a recruit and all)

Vote ANi

Nobody would recruit me though. Everybody knows I suck as scum. Woe to anyone who would recruit me.

[elvis_knits]

I still don't understand what Ani is trying to say.

[elvis_knits]

Oh yeah, I forgot how Starbuck just believed Reck for no reason and was probably his strongest supporter.

[elvis_knits]

HIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIII

What is happening here?

I will figure things out tomorrow and get on this.

But I'm still here.

[elvis_knits]

Sorry for inactivity.

Skimming it looks like people are wanting modkill on Suave. If we think he's scum we should lynch him. Calling for a modkill seems scummy to me.

[elvis_knits]

I haven't had much time for mafia these days. I'm barely posting in my other game either.

I think we should lynch either Spyrex, or Sly. Maybe Starbuck, for her "oh I'm a vig who killed a couple power roles, and I have no bullets left to prove it" shenanigans. It just seems like that is an awfully convenient way to 1)claim vig on people who were probably failed recruits; and 2)make the cult seem larger (if they didn't fail recruit those days, they have more members) to create more panic/hysteria.

I think Suave is a red herring because people were hoping/counting on a modkill.

[elvis_knits]

SLy's latest tirade against Starbuck makes me less suspicious of her. I think he's just picking on easy marks at this point and is trying to rile her up.

Sly, don't be a jerk. Starbuck, try to let it go.

[elvis_knits]

EK, if you had been paying attention, you would know that wolf has pretty much cleared SB.

O rly? Then you're doubly scummy for riling her.

[elvis_knits]

I still think the Pie lynch is the most informative of the game. Reckoner should have died that day, and we know that we had atleast two zombielords on the Pie lynch. I'm quoting not just the final vc, but one three days before... because I find it very interesting that ODDin was on the Pie wagon, starting it with Sly at that point, even though he is voting CMAR by the end of day. In fact, I find it VERY scummy that ODDin didn't jump on either wagon at the end of day. This was a very important pivotal time, and ODDin stayed off the two major wagons, like he wanted to keep his nose clean... but at the same time, it made his vote pointless, which is very unhelpful and scummy.

CMAR (5) animorpherv1, xRECKONERx, Pie_is_good, iLord, Starbuck
xRECKONERx (6) evilsnail, MrSuave , elvis_knits, Albert B. Rampage, spyrex, Grimmy
MrSuave (2) CryMeARiver, Wolframnhart
Pie (2) ODDin, SlySly

final vote count:

CMAR(town) (1) ODDin (?)
xRECKONERx (ZL) (7) evilsnail(town), MrSuave (?), elvis_knits (?), spyrex (?), Grimmy(?), iLord(?), Pie_is_good (town)

Pie (town)(8) Albert B. Rampage (ZL), xRECKONERx (ZL), Starbuck(cleared?), animorpherv1(town), Wolframnhart(cleared?), bv310(town), CryMeARiver(town), SlySly(?)

The whole end of day there was crazy and I remember both sly and ODDin as being very unhelpful. From this and the VC's, I REALLY think the ZL is either Sly or ODDin. I'm willing to lynch either.

[elvis_knits]

I still don't see you willing to lynch your buddy reckoner there.

[elvis_knits]

We could compromise and have ODDin move to CMAR while the rest of us stay on Reck. That way CMAR knows he isn't getting off too easy. It, like, sends a message and shit.

Yeah, Oddin should do this. It would be smart.

Hi, this was a joke.

[elvis_knits]

No, I wasn't voting for reck, because I was of the opinion that we should lynch neither reck nor evils that day and instead wait for another day to see what happens.

I didn't understand this thinking at the time and I still don't.

We have a guilty on somebody and we should "wait and see what happens"???

Why?

[elvis_knits]

I clearly wanted Reck lynched. I clearly didn't want Pie lynched. How did you not understand that? I don't think you really missed that being a joke.

[elvis_knits]

Nothing ODDin has said has changed my mind about him. His refusal to help stop the Pie lynch and help us lynch Reck is a huge red flag to me. And his defense is that he thought I wanted him to vote CMAR and screw us all over? That makes no sense and I can't believe he would even believe that. He's just trying to misdirect from the real problem -- that he didn't want to lynch evil or reck when evil came out with a guilty on reck. That is a scummy pov. Town wants to sort stuff like that out. But scum doesn't. Because even if scum can push through a lynch of evilsnail, when he flips town, it dooms reck. So the scum would rather deal with it later, leaving both alive so they can construct some alternate explanation. Which is what ODDin wanted to do.

Plus the slowness of this lynch makes me think ODDin's recruits don't want to vote him.

vote ODDin

[elvis_knits]

I dont think either of our current targets are the ZL and I think that the ZL and recruits have been dragging out the day in order to either a last minute mislynch or a no lynch due to uncertainty.

But I dont have a solid case on anyone else, but this is why I am not voting and this is where I stand at the moment.

Grimmy

^^^ Is a recruit dragging out the day

[elvis_knits]

I'm not a recruit, that's why this ODDin lynch is not going through quickly.