SWN II: The Curse of the Nekomata (Game over!)

[Starbuck]

Hey guys, just checking in.

I'll be catching up shortly.

[Starbuck]

Catch Up to Page 9

First off, <3 to MME! Been awhile!!!

I can gladly say that I don't have a post restriction.

On Parama

Vote: Kyle99

Only lynch I would support from the get-go based on policy. Because kyle will active-lurk the hell out of this game and then newbclaim to cover it up. I don't feel like RVSing today.

Why Kyle and not DeathNote?

On Kairyuu

vote: Parama

Policy lynching is, in and of itself, scummy.

FoS: RayFrost

Same reason.

So how is this not one in the same? You are voting Parama and FOSing Ray because you don't like policy lynches. So how is that not, in and of itself, policy?

On MafiaSSK and tubby

So SSK is only speaking in French and tubby is only speaking in Portugese. I use Firefox at home and IE at work. I will be installing that add-on kyle linked and going back to read over everything they said.

On Nul

What's with the no lynch vote?

On Anon

Anon's first post in the game is his non random vote on Parama.

I wanted to find out who would at least try to isolate him and tell me their impressions but since 4 people are already asking without even doing the effort, I guess some explanation and igmeoys are guaranteed.

You didn't give the effort. If you gave the effort in the first place, they wouldn't have asked. Quit asking others to do your work for you.

Anon's case on sykedoc is good, but whatever happened to Parama?

On DocPotter

SSK, Tubby. Out of interest are you two in a quick chat of any sort and if so do your Post Restriction still aply?

Ani. Is some mechanism that you can confirm or deny the restrictions? (Besides the obvious getting someone flipped) I'm not fussed what it is, just if there is one.

Fishing much?

On MME

If ani can confirm either of the two having a pr, I don't see the harm in asking him. he's the one that brought it up in the first place.

It's still too early in the game for this. This is definitely fishing.

On ace5993

And wtf with his restriction.

LMAAOA fitsr offf lal i 2tso have a psto restifdpoijsdoin, nadnd seoncd of iall i dnot half tmiee too trnastelate aythung yet btu i wliil two taht twomorrro!1!!!! This ias jstu bsaiellly sasayging im heer>!!>!!>?? o ADN Vote: Parama POLISSEE LINCH LOLLOLOOOLOLOLOLOLL

"LMAO first off i also have a post restriction. and second of all, i don't have time to translate anything yet, but i will do that tomorrow. This is just basically saying I'm here. And Vote: Parama. Policy Lynch. LOL"

On sykedoc

If its absolutely necessary I can give you first day reads. But I've found that often, peoples reads on day 1 lead to villagers getting killed for stupid reasons.

Excuses, excuses.

It will not end well if you crusade against me.

And now you are going to threaten people?

I find it stupid reasoning to vote for someone because their policies do not agree with yours.

And yeah, I can have zero reads. It depends on your definition of a read.
I believe a read is a valid suspicion. I have none to this point. Anything I do have is based off something i do not consider substantial.

If you can't live with that you can try to lynch me but again. It won't end well.

Wow! AtEs and overreactions much?

He's not voting you due to disagreeing with your policies. He's voting for you because you aren't contributing to scumhunting.

The problem here is just about everything is scummy on D1.

Care to elaborate on this please?

LlamaFluff- White Knighting, can go either way.

Provide examples of Llame white knighting.

[Starbuck]

syke, what's with you telling me to "read everything"? I've asked you to elaborate and you refuse.

Also, if you READ the top of my post, that's only to page 9.

[Starbuck]

Page 9 to Page 12

On sykedoc

I may not have something to say on everyone, but in all honesty, can you say that you have a contribution on every person in this game? I really don't. Don't expect me to for awhile.

While this is true, and I can understand it, you didn't have opinions on anyone until that point. That's why you were being questioned.


Pom has a very good point about you in Post 187:

Regarding the bolded: Why must it be pointed out to you? Why can't you look yourself?

The bolding she is referring to is in a post of his that she quoted: "If you show me something substantial and solid, I'm quite likely to vote with you."

It feels like he just admitting to the fact that he will ride coattails.

And his response feels the same to me:

Lol, sorry. I worded that wrong. I mean like I'll look, but if you happen to point out something strong, I'll probably vote with you. That's all that means. You don't need to point it out to me.

This is a case of I did warn you ahead of time and you have decided that one game must be the sole deciding factor that I am scum despite this being my normal voice at this point.

I have tried as of late to remain somewhat the same from game to game regardless of my role, this makes it harder to meta me. If you absolutely have to look at the games, at least take this into consideration.

What evidence do you have IN THIS GAME that says I am scum?
You can prove me scum in a game I've already finished but that has no bearing on this game as the sample size is extremely small.

This seems a bit overdefensive to me. Why are you so afraid of your meta?

I think everyone's goal is to remain the same from game to game regardless of role. Unfortunately, most people do not based on if they are scum or town. That's how people who play together a lot are able to tell almost automatically if that person is scum or town.

You are jumping down his throat for evidence in this game that says you are scum when he already gave it to you.

If people wagon too fast I will not get a chance to say my role and you'll lose a power role.

Admission of a PR? This early in the game? Why would you do such a thing?

I like how you avoid that I fence sat in plenty of other games. Its just a bad habit, its not a scumtell.

I don't like this assumption.

The softclaim has a lot to do with the fact that I don't care if I die.

You don't care? Dude, you've been whining about how you shouldn't be killed for like 5 pages at this point.

You're far scummier than Kairyuu. You're clearly manipulating the fact that nothing besides a single game of mine supports you. Your claims are weak.

Why don't you disprove them? Show where you did the same thing as town, rather than ranting and raving.
Claiming they are weak, without backup, is scummy.

Some are on my wiki. I'm sure you knew that since you clearly dug through my game history anyway.

This is a horrid assumption to make.

Also just because someone thinks you're scummy doesn't mean its OMGUS.

You've had a vote on me for awhile, it wasn't until just now that I decided to vote you.

"An OMGUS vote means a player vote another player simply because that player voted him - a vote back. "

"OMGUS stands for "Oh My God, You Suck (for voting for me)!". it is sometimes used as a shorthand to indicate that you are voting for someone primarily because they voted for you. "

So out of the other 23 people (excluding yourself and Anon), there's ABSOLUTELY NO ONE ELSE that you find scummy? You are just going to attack the person that's attacking you and vote them. My dear, that's THE DEFINITION of OMGUS.




Ad hom like

3) Would you like me to give you my role so you two can look like idiots?

Also continuing threats like

Do not attempt to use this against me as it doesn't apply to my D1 tactics specifically.

Post 199


And berating such as

Post 209, Post 210


Along with AtE such as

I'm going to put this game in big flashing lights on my meta so nobody can pull this crap on me again once it's over.

I explained my reaction to five votes OVER AND OVER. You just don't care to listen.

WILL NOT HELP YOUR CASE

While Anon's case is a nice addition, you have done more than your fair share of scummy things IN THIS GAME.

So, how about you stop all this overemotional whatever the hell you have going on and actually scumhunt? There's like 5 pages of you whining and overreacting about being hammered when you only have 5 votes in a day when it takes 13 to lynch.

On DeathNote

Meta wagons suck, yes, but this is not a meta wagon. Syk gained votes because of his attempt to active lurk. He stated early on that he had no reads yet and thus Llama pressured him to actually scum hunt. After a brief debate he finally posted a LoS, not a simply "Such-and-such is scummy" but a List of Suspicion! Thats when pressure rose and the meta case was brought up. Now he spams three posts at a time looking like scum caught on L-1 when he is still has at least 8 more votes to go.

He definitely has a point here about syke.

On SaintKerrigan

The guy is way too quiet for me. He has 5 total posts in the game.

The first is joke voting RayFrost.

The second is QFTing a question asked by wolf.

The third is telling us he's having a hard time getting his head around the game and that he doesn't have a post restriction. He also answers a question about PRs and posts an opinion on sykedoc:

I don't think it's odd that Sykedoc doesn't have much on people yet. It's early in Day 1 for a large game, and personally I don't have that much in the way of reads yet myself. Maybe other people are getting reads out of this, but I don't find it odd that some people haven't found much of anything yet.

It almost feels like buddying.


The fourth is unvoting his joke vote on RayFrost and voting DocPotter because "I don't like how he unvoted when some heat came his way."

The fifth is welcoming me and Reck.


I smell active lurking.

On DocPotter

His quick hop off the syke wagon in Post 262 is rather odd.

[Starbuck]

Page 12 to Page CAUGHT UP, YAY!

Hi to EVERYONE! /LOVE

On Nul

Another one, like SaintKerrigan, but this guy only has 6 posts.

The first is a post (with messed up bold tags) for a no lynch.

The second is asking why people are typing in different languages.


WTH with his third post, Post 276?

vote: docpotter

for all the reasons stated before hand


i gues this is what you call jumping on a wagon

His fourth:

well all the reasons for voting docpotter was already stated
am i suppose to say

vote: docpotter
because he votes and then unvotes despite still believing the person he voted is a scum?

I really don't want to waste people's time by saying the same thing but in different words.

It's opportunistic (at least for me) coming from you.


The fifth seems to me like he's defending his active lurking.

I don't care if people think I'm lazy, I just want to lynch the scum.

This bothers me.

But then, in his sixth and last post (so far), he says:

Just ignore my post, I just realised it was completely off-topic.

Umm, what?

That last post was on Weds.

On sykedoc

Why did you respond to everything in my first catch up post, even if it wasn't directed at you? You just added a bunch of fluff for no reason, other than I think you just wanted to look cool.

On Nul

What's with the no lynch vote?

You sure there's nothing else to question concerning Nul?

Can you quit being so goddamn impatient and let me catch up? That'd be greatly appreciated.

On Anon

Anon's case on sykedoc is good, but whatever happened to Parama?

Good how?

Good that it shows a similarity between what you have already done as scum.

If ani can confirm either of the two having a pr, I don't see the harm in asking him. he's the one that brought it up in the first place.

It's still too early in the game for this. This is definitely fishing.

Not...
really...
Its too early in the game to try and sort of B-Mod mod actions in a B-Mod game? No...

Huh?

On sykedoc

If its absolutely necessary I can give you first day reads. But I've found that often, peoples reads on day 1 lead to villagers getting killed for stupid reasons.

Excuses, excuses.

You can prove this is an excuse rather than how I think?

It was an excuse because you didn't have reads on ANYONE at that point. You just kept giving excuses about not scumhunting.

I fix: He wasn't voting for you due to disagreeing with your policies. He was voting for you because you weren't contributing to scumhunting. He isn't voting for you anymore, so I might have to ask him if that is still the case rather than making assumptions.

WTF? Dude, make some sense please.

LlamaFluff- White Knighting, can go either way.

Provide examples of Llame white knighting.

I honestly need to provide examples of white knighting? It's not clear as day? Its not a scummy thing, but it CAN be.

Yes, I would like you to provide examples. You stated it, and I want you to show us where he was white knighting. Saying something and not backing it up is scummy.

EBWOP: If you need me to provide an example for White Knighting, you really haven't read the thread.

I have read the thread. I didn't feel he was white knighting, so if you can kindly point out where he did so, I (and probably everyone else) would greatly appreciate it.

and I'm saying, until you've read all of the pages, those thoughts aren't complete thoughts. If you're looking for tl;dr, then ask but you aren't. I'm saying a lot of this can be explained had you caught all the way up. I just think its redundant to ask things that have been answered or are in the text to begin with. Please just catch up and reconsider the questions.

Obviously, you have never played with me before. I post my thoughts as I catch up. You telling me to read everything as response to any of my questions is scummy. Why don't you just respond instead of going out of your way to be nasty?

[Starbuck]

mod, please note my sig

V/LA noted.

MafiaSSK and Nul are prodded.

Can you include SaintKerrigan on that please?

[Starbuck]

Part 1

Clearly you are only interested in jumping down my throat and posting a few thoughts on others. I am less interested in responding to some of what you are saying since it is blatently obvious.

I love your assumptions.

I also love how you feel that my questions mean nothing.

1) If you can not find a point where Llama is leading the town, you haven't read the thread. It's VERY clear in the first 5 pages. Again, I see no reason to bring this up constantly as I said it isn't necessarily a scummy action.

I asked you to clarify and provide examples of where this happened. You refuse to point out where he did these things. Why do you keep refusing?

2) You are spending an awful lot of time on me while you seem to give the larger wagon on DocPotter

On DocPotter
His quick hop off the syke wagon in Post 262 is rather odd.

I have 3 votes, and you spend two entire posts cramming the already posted points down everyone's throats, but you give less than 15 words to the bigger wagon. Why is that?

You only seem to care to incriminate me and you don't seem to contribute much to the other cases aside from Nul.

What's with the deflection onto other people?

It's also not my fault that you feel the need to be Mr. CENTER OF ATTENTION. I find you scummy. I find your actions and reactions over the top, and I also dislike your refusal to answer questions and your repeated discrediting of anything I have to say.

I love how you state that I only concern myself with Nul. Also DocPotter, did one thing which was make a scummy unvote. That wagon, right now, feels very opportunistic. I need to go back and read Doc in iso, but that one move does not automatically label him scum for me.

[Starbuck]

Part 2

Are you saying that if there is a valid case against someone and I believe you have a point in voting for them that I can't agree and vote with you? Because you make this sound as if agreeing is an error.

Agreeing is not an error.

You can agree, but you must find your own case as well, and not ride the coattails of anyone else.

I don't like this assumption.

You don't like it because it doesn't help you rail on me. I've fence-sat similarly in other games, like I said its a bad habit.

I don't like you PURPOSELY misrepresenting me and assuming what I mean. Do me a favor and stop this.

I told why I found him scummy. I stated my reasons quite clearly and if you missed them you need to go back and check again. I didn't vote for Llama because he had a valid point. Anon's point is based on one thing and I do not like the way he is twisting a small amount of information in a desperate attempt to wagon me. I find this scummy. Sue me.

But you have done the same thing you are accusing him of. So I don't understand how you can vote him when you are doing the same exact thing.

Or here's something else. Why have YOU BARELY COMMENTED on the DocPotter wagon? Kinda hypocritical given the fact that you are all over my ass about that very thing.

How is the second one AtE? I see the first one but the second one was a response to the same question being asked to me continuously. I have a right to be frustrated if I keep getting asked the same question and I'm continually forced to answer it.

Maybe if you just answered the question straight up and not been a jerk that wouldn't have happened?

The "You just won't listen to me" feels whiny to me, thus why it's listed under AtE.

And he hasn't pointed them out. Which is what I've been asking him to do. If he wants to make a case against me it needs to at least have some grounding in this game. Post what you want, but until he has something on me in THIS GAME, the meta is just meta and nothing more.

I agree with you on this point, but I will point out that he did point out similarities between things you've done in THIS GAME to things you did in the game that you were an SK. So your point that he didn't use anything in THIS game is null to me because if it hadn't been for THIS game, he wouldn't have been able to see similarities in your playstyle.

ITS HARD TO SCUMHUNT WHEN EVERYONE IS ASKING YOU QUESTIONS ALL DAY LONG. Don't go on making a two page post accusing me of this and that and expect me to ignore it and scumhunt, especially when you directly ask me questions in the post. I've been attempting to as now everyone is not asking me all questions all the time, but you're just bringing it back. Not only that but you're saying what everyone else already said.

Do you ever stop with the AtE?

Woe is you! Answering questions is part of the game, if you can't deal with this, you need to find a new game to play that isn't mafia.

You can do some scumhunting along with answering questions. It's called playing the game!

Also allow me to point out how the rest of your post is still about me.

Well, duh! The whole game thus far has REVOLVED AROUND YOU.

But I don't like how you put your own words in where I spoke.

You seem to have an obsession with commenting on everything I have to say, even if it doesn't concern you.

You are clearly intent on forming a case on me. You don't seem to care about the others.

This is just reaching now.

I reposted Saint and Nul's posts to show just how non-contributory they both have been.

And with DocPotter, yes it's an odd way to back off a wagon, but that one action does not make him autoscum.

[Starbuck]

Part 3

While you're at it, was the bold line really necessary? I highly doubt it was.

It seems like you have a hard to discerning sarcasm. I really just wanted to see what your reaction would be, and you gave me exactly what I was looking for.

Can you quit being so goddamn impatient and let me catch up? That'd be greatly appreciated.

I'm sorry I assumed when you wrote a

Catch Up

post, that you would have

Caught Up

Don't bother telling me you said you only caught up to that point. I saw that. I'm just wondering why you caught up halfway and then posted questions concerning things answered later in the thread. That's why it's not catching up until you're caught up. I just don't really feel like answering questions that have been discussed already when it's your job to read up to make sure it hasn't been asked.

Wow, can you stop with being a jerk? If I haven't told you already, you should go refresh on the Mafiascum Forum Rules and Guidelines. You're starting to coast the edges.

For the record, I stated what PAGE NUMBER that I was caught up to. I would have finished catching up, but I had to take off for awhile. You know because I have a life OFF OF THE INTERNET.


And finally, after like four times of me asking, you finally provide the examples of Llama white knighting. Was it so hard?

It isn't scummy. Don't tell me you're caught up (but only halfway) and then ask me questions discussed two pages after where you stopped. I don't think this is efficient. It wastes valuable time when you could simply go and finish reading before asking. Its really like if someone with a working watch asks you for the time. I'd tell them to look at their watch because it's right there. Same goes for you. The posts are right there, I requested you to look at them because you were asking me for something that was there in front of you.

All you kept repeating was "read everything". You didn't point me to a post. You didn't answer the question. You took the jerk way of the situation.

1) You spent a little time on nul, but you spent two walls of text yelling at me and asking questions.

Exactly how much time did you want me to spend on his 5 game posts?

2) This doesn't seem to be an original case. This is a Frankenstein case comprised of points from many other people. I don't feel that any of the points you raised in those two walls of text were your own. I feel you were repeating points to make yourself look like you had a better case.

Again, examples, or your accusation is null.

3) You don't seem to bat an eye when something has already been discussed and dealt with. You actually continue on with it (such as the white knighting bit) despite the fact that its either obvious, or not relevant.

The only reason why I continued on is because you refused to provide an example of him white knighting. Had you, when I first asked, provided the example, it wouldn't have gone this far. It's your constant refusal to answer a request that got you this far. Not me asking.

4)You play 20 questions and then ask why I'm not doing something else. If you want me doing something else stop asking questions.

In mafia, you SHOULD be able to multi-task. People ask you questions, you ask people questions. People scumhunt, you scumhunt. If this is too much for you, again, maybe you need to find another game that you can handle.

Vote: sykedoc

[Starbuck]

This is very quickly becoming the Starbuck/sykedoc show.

Any interjections are MORE than welcome.

[Starbuck]

I'm going to guess that sykedoc didn't even read anything of what I wrote, even though I took the time to reply to him.

I still think that the DocPotter wagon is opportunistic due to the fact that it's based on one action and many people jumped very quickly.

[Starbuck]

Mod: Please replace me.

Im way too addicted to WoW. lol.

/hi5 for WoW players

[Starbuck]

I dislike Starbuck’s case on skyedoc. Basically, everything in it is a nulltell or a pretty weak scumtell (particularly: AtE, overreaction, lack of reads d1, defensiveness, PR softclaim, emotions of all kinds). He makes one good point, that skye hasn’t said much about the dp wagon – although this was more by way of a counter-counter-attack, and feels very much like an afterthought that fitted.
A large portion of Starbuck’s posts are about the kind of things that people often think are scumtells, but actually don’t fit well into a coherent picture of scum (basically, all of the above plus rolefishing-by-asking-people-to-claim [starbuck’s first post]). For me, this makes him likely scum.

What about my case SPECIFICALLY don't you like? Do you care to provide specific examples?

What's with your defense of sykedoc when he has already committed so many scummy actions?

[Starbuck]

Richard, why the sudden switch to a post restriction?

[Starbuck]

The one thing that concerns me is that sykedoc has been pushing the lynch on DocPotter, but isn't even voting for him. He's voting for Anon.

He even went as far as, when questioned by me, to deflect the conversation onto DocPotter.



He's got an OMGUS vote riding on Anon, and is pushing along the lynch of someone who he obviously finds suspicious, but isn't willing to vote for?

[Starbuck]

It feels to me that you are defending sykedoc by helping him discredit my case.

[Starbuck]

I still believe he's scummy, but I believe there is a smarter scum, and I'd rather get rid of a smarter scum who I believe will do more damage if left alive.

How does this make sense? You BELIEVE he's scummy and you see that the wagon is in his favor, but you aren't voting for him?

[Starbuck]

Yes, you should.

I still feel this DocPotter wagon is opportunistic. My vote will be staying where it is.

[Starbuck]

I still believe he's scummy, but I believe there is a smarter scum, and I'd rather get rid of a smarter scum who I believe will do more damage if left alive.

How does this make sense? You BELIEVE he's scummy and you see that the wagon is in his favor, but you aren't voting for him?

This.

unvote, vote: sykedoc

RF, he is now voting for DocPotter, but only after I posted this.

[Starbuck]

Specially the part where I said I DID read more than your serial killer game?

Wasn't that the basis of his entire "case" on you? The fact that you only "read" one game of his?

[Starbuck]

Like I said: I don't see my vote on Anon going anywhere.

I still believe he's scummy but there doesn't seem to be anybody who agrees.

Umm...What?

Didn't it already move somewhere new? Or did you just forget?

[Starbuck]

You act

after

things become issues but not before, which is scummy.

This.

[Starbuck]

Those lame meta cases are still going?
D:

Nope. At least not for me, I'm voting for sykedoc due to all the scummy things he has done in THIS game. The meta is a good reference, but it's not why my vote is there.

[Starbuck]

The case on Syke is not meta.

It's where the case started. I understand that the case on syke isn't purely meta anymore, heck, how could it be?, but the initial case started with meta arguments.

But the case now is about his reactions, actions, and things that have happened in this game and not out of it.

[Starbuck]

Posting to check in. Will be catching up in the morrow.

[Starbuck]

Reply to Fishythefish

Catch Up to Page 9

On sykedoc

If its absolutely necessary I can give you first day reads. But I've found that often, peoples reads on day 1 lead to villagers getting killed for stupid reasons.

Excuses, excuses.

Many players have only weak reads on day 1. At best, its a very weak scumtell. The phrase "excuses, excuses" implies to me that syke has done something blatantly scummy, and is now flailing around trying to explain it - just not the case.

This was at the point where he was being asked by multiple people to give his reads, and he kept making excuses (as implied by "excuses, excuses") as to why he could not post them.

So why did you completely miscontrue what I said? Blatant misrepresentation is scummy.

Llama had been blatantly leading the town.

And while I saw this, I wanted him to provide specific examples. Saying that someone is doing something and not backing it up with real evidence is scummy, whether you find that person scummy or not. Syke was the one that posted that Llama had been white knighting. While I felt that he was leading the town, I did not feel he was white knighting. So I asked Syke to elaborate on where he felt Llama was whiteknighting and he kept refusing to provide evidence of his accusation.

Nothing wrong with a good coattail. His clarification is clearly saying that while he will look for good scumtells day 1, if other people find them he will vote with them - not a particularly scummy attitude. It feels to me just like he knows he isn't very good at d1 scumhunting.

Everything is wrong with coattailing. You just stated here that you have no problem with letting someone have a free ride through the game as long as they are coattailing on a good case. So you don't feel that people should provide their own case before jumping on a bandwagon?

I like how you avoid that I fence sat in plenty of other games. Its just a bad habit, its not a scumtell.

I don't like this assumption.

What? What kind of response is that? What assumption? Why not question him further as to where he fence sat? If you are taking into account the meta attacks on him (which are that he fence sat as scum, once), why do you dismiss his very relevant meta defense?

Because there was no further questioning to do. sykedoc's original quote here was based towards Anon. I didn't like the assumption that sykedoc thought that Anon didn't read any of his other games. He has no way of knowing what Anon did as per reading other games. It had nothing to do with whether or not he fence sat.

Ad hom like

3) Would you like me to give you my role so you two can look like idiots?

Ad hom is the practise of attacking a player to weaken his/her arguments, while ignoring the validity of the arguments themselves. Using the word "idiots" does not constitute an ad hom.

You need to brush up on your definition of ad hom because you are wrong.

From Ad hominem,

Argumentum ad Hominem (or "Attack against the Man") is a attack on the person, rather than on their arguments. It brings in irrelevant personal information or arguments about the opponent, in an attempt to distract either the opponent or the audience. This often happens in mafia games. Instead of attacking an accuser's arguments, someone will attack the accuser instead. Note that while sometimes the player's personality/playstyle does come into account during a game, this logical fallacy is more about attacking features that may not have anything directly to do with game performance. Thus, lurking is an assailable behavior; being European is likely not.

Two Types of Argumentum ad Hominem

* Abusive: An attack on the character or other personal qualities of the opponent. An example: "I'm not going to listen to anything you say because you're stupid."
* Circumstantial: A claim that the person is only arguing a certain way because they stand to gain from it. Someone can only be saying something because they would gain from it, but the argument would continue to be valid whether they stand to gain from them or not. An example: "I'm not going to listen to anything you have to say, because you're only saying that so you can get money."


So the word "idiots" directed towards someone or someones IS ad hom.

I don't think this is reaching in the slightest. Read your own catchup posts - by the end of them, it's quite clear it has changed from a rounded catchup to a case on syke

Because that's what I do. That's how I play when I replace in. As I catch up, I'm doing my scumhunting as well.

[Starbuck]

What happened to all of our players with PRs? They've been rather quiet.

On Sykedoc

I'm not really caring for Fishy's and Bogre's chainsaw defenses of sykedoc. At least Fishy looked through the cases, where Bogre is still assuming that they are all meta based when many were not.

3, I'm not fucking redeeming him for bringing up his meta, I'm -implicating- him. You have either failed to comprehend my post, or are simply blatantly misrepresenting me.

Amished wasn't the only person who saw it this way because I did as well. You came off me to me as defending sykedoc.

You assumed that all of the cases on him were still based on meta when they were not. Why don't you go back and re-read those cases?

On Parama

Parama's "Haha, lynch me- I dare you!" is extremely scummy. Dares like these never end well for town.

This.

On Nul

So...in other words you aren't going to comment on events so far, but you wont "dissapear" because you don't want to be replaced, and in other words you are going to active lurk until end game so you don't get killed off at night?

I think you summed this up right.

On FishytheFish

His "excuses" were that he didn't have any reads. Which isn't a scumtell. Am I missing something here? I see your "excuses, excuses" as exactly an attack on his lack of reads.

I wasn't the only person who was asking him for some type of read. He didn't have to give his opinion on who's town and who's scum, but to give some sort of case on someone rather than not doing anything. And look, he's barely posting again, and swapped off to DocPotter when pressured and that was the last we heard from him.

This is what I see:

Star: rounded catchup post
Star: 2nd catchup post, focussed on SD
SD: "You are clearly intent in forming a case on me. You don't care about others"
Star: that's reaching

My point isn't that your catchup style was wrong, bad or scummy. It's that saying that SD is reaching by accusing you of focusing on him is unfair - for whatver reason, you were extremely focussed on SD by the end of your catchup.

So basically what you are telling me here is to not scumhunt. I felt he was scummy, therefore I formed a case on him. Where did I say that he was reaching because he was accusing me of focusing on him?

I've already said that as I catch up, I also scumhunt. That's Mafia. This now feels that you have an issue with my playstyle. When I replace in, I do the same thing every time. There are people playing this game that could verify this for you. Please let this menial distraction go, so we can catch some scum.

[Starbuck]

But you are in some way trying to link that to the way I catch up when I replace in, I'm not really following, and this back and forth has turned into you basically saying that you don't like how I replace in.

[Starbuck]

Starbuck and Fishy are white (or pink) walling the thread and creating a useless side banter from the past. Create a case and cut down on the words, or drop it and focus on current events. Both of you.

I completely agree with you, which is why I've dropped the issue.

Also, my case is made and it's on sykedoc. The reason for the walls was Fishy trying to derail my case (which is not meta based). She's been chainsaw defending him for awhile now, if people just highlighted her posts to see what she wrote then you would all know this by now.

Why do you think sykedoc is town?

I don't, which is why I created my own case on him and my vote is on him.

[Starbuck]

My bad at calling you a she, I hate when people don't get pronouns right. I think it's the pink that's doing it, lol.

[Starbuck]

Ray, who is our obvscum and why should I be voting them?

[Starbuck]

Nul, how about adding some content?

[Starbuck]

So basically Parama's defense is an OMGUS on Llama? Wtf?

[Starbuck]

Was there any reason for the "goddamn"?

Because "I'm a goddamn cop, k?" comes off to me as you not really being the cop.

[Starbuck]

Can I interest any of you in a sykedoc lynch?

[Starbuck]

I still find sykedoc more scummy than Parama.

[Starbuck]

And that's all lovely too, but my vote is where it needs to be.

[Starbuck]

Why are you so concerned with deadline? We have time.

[Starbuck]

@syke: If you're going to push the idea of a different lynch while not committing to it yourself (note that your vote is still on Parama as of this typing) you are being hypocritical, and cannot legitimately say that you support anything but a Parama lynch.

This isn't the first time he's done this.

He was pushing for DocPotter earlier today while voting for someone else. He didn't vote DP until pressured.

[Starbuck]

Also, I'm not liking syke's obsession with the deadline when SC has it right in his sig that he will extend deadline on request. I understand that happens if we get replacements, but I think syke's craziness over the deadline is unfounded.

[Starbuck]

I'd support a DeathNote lynch.

[Starbuck]

I am about 10 pages behind. I was V/LA over the weekend, and am trying to catch up on all my games.

[Starbuck]

Can someone catch me up? How did RBT die and why is the lynch on CSL?

[Starbuck]

Why is Syke untouchable, Spyre?

[Starbuck]

Syke seems to have a bad habit of answering questions that aren't directed at him.

[Starbuck]

Vote: FeeFiFoFum

[Starbuck]

I don't mind unvoting and taking the L-1 or hammer death. I am just a VT, and would rather save someone useful.

[Starbuck]

I'm so far behind on this game Rifeka that you have no idea. If I can be of some use and take that L-1 or hammer death over someone who does have their mind in this game, it doesn't bother me at all.

[Starbuck]

Unvote FeeFiFoFum

[Starbuck]

I'll hammer. I have no issue with it. Just have someone put him at L-1.

[Starbuck]

I'm just a VT, Spyre.

I'm not caught up with the game at all, and I don't want to give SC another replacement to find.

[Starbuck]

Vote: FeeFiFoFum

[Starbuck]

So why was it said that the hammer and L-1 or hammer and first vote would die?

[Starbuck]

I've already claimed, but I am just a little Vanilla Townie.

[Starbuck]

It's not reflected on the front page that I've been replaced.

I've had no notice. Although, I was away from my computer for almost the entire weekend.

[Starbuck]

I just looked at SC in ISO and you replaced in today. I'm here and not willing to give up my spot unless SC wants me to.

[Starbuck]

I had no notice that I was getting replaced, and the front page still states I'm here.

[Starbuck]

Because SC, of all people, should know that I don't flake?

[Starbuck]

I apologize I was gone for the weekend. If possible, I'd like to re-replace in.

[Starbuck]

Sorry y'all, when I was told Faraday replaced me, I never put this back on my watched topics.

[Starbuck]

Yes, Rifka, I'm still here, but pretty far behind in reading.

Anyone wanna catch me up?

[Starbuck]

Yes, Rifka, I'm still here, but pretty far behind in reading.

Anyone wanna catch me up?

E eu e que nunca digo nada. Já agora, porque e que estas aqui se não estas a fazer nada?

Can someone translate that? I can't install Babelfish at work.

[Starbuck]

Let's do it then.

Vote: Starbuck

[Starbuck]

Just Kidding

Unvote: Starbuck

[Starbuck]

Last I knew, I wasn't at my 72 hour mark?

But whatever.

[Starbuck]

Rifka and Spyre

[Starbuck]

How do we know that Spyre is telling the truth?

[Starbuck]

You won't be done. I'm just a VT, but if I can save one of our power roles from the lynch. I'm cool with it.

[Starbuck]

What, specifically, is the "how do we know that Spyre" is telling the truth in relation to?

Spy can't be lasht night's killer, btw. He wash RB'ed.

[Starbuck]

You, another person I've suspected, all game confirming anyone does nothing.

[Starbuck]

Is Syke cleared in any way shape or form?

[Starbuck]

Well, good job town on failing to hit mafia with this lynch.

[Starbuck]

Ill believe starbuck is town when the mod posts so. Its too often lynched mafia claim to be town to mess with peoples heads.

I hope all your pro-town folk remember this after my kill scene.