The Dark Goma Mafia: Massacre of the Cloth (Game Over)

[chamber]

Still on page 37. I should be caught up by the end of the weekend.

[chamber]

More or less caught up. Still haven't read the last couple pages of day 1. To help confirm Sprye's theory I do not have an 'xr' ending, and I am not active(though my ability certainly feels somewhat active).

My reads from scummiest to townest:

dramonic
Papa Zito
milkshake
Sajin
SerialClergyman
Plum
stark
KaleiÐoscøpe
Kise
SocioPath
tubby216
Rosso Carne
LlamaFluff
VP Baltar
Battle Mage
Vaya
Benmage
vollkan
SpyreX
DrippingGoofball
Snow_Bunny

Exact placement of names in the middle is approximate.

Vote dramonic

It took several days of free time to get threw this game so if I seem to have forgotten something obvious in the process please say so.

[chamber]

Seriously though, I'm bemoaning the lack of bunnywagon momentum.

Bunny is town.

[chamber]

I hate to be mr pokey but DGB did you catch my question about your role?

Yea, I'm seeing minimal downside to the SB lynch.

Lynching a townie with a 1 shot cop ability is minimal?

[chamber]

Well, you can't have role information that she's innocent because she's a miller, so your read is as good as anyones.

As for the 1-shot cop ability, we only have her word for that, it's not a confirming role and when everyone is a power ability, lynching someone else will only lose us a different ability.

I don't know about everyone in this game but my ability is <<< a 1 shot cop. You are right though it is just my read vs any other persons read, but if a majority thought she was scum shed be dead. So how about you stop running around asking for her to be lynched and I'll stop running around screaming shes town?

[chamber]

Spyrex I'm going to ignore your question for now.

Chamber seems to know SB's alignment. He just shot up thirty stories on my scum list.

<3

[chamber]

unvote, vote: chamber

Gah. Yes DGB he's obvscum, but can't he wait until tomorrow? Derailing the BunnyWagon even more is

I'm happy.

[chamber]

[quote="VP Baltar"]Chamber, what are your thoughts ona benmage lynch? (God, I hate when people make me campaign this hard to lynch scum)[/quote]

[quote="chamber"]
My reads from scummiest to townest:

dramonic
Papa Zito
milkshake
Sajin
SerialClergyman
Plum
stark
KaleiÐoscøpe
Kise
SocioPath
tubby216
Rosso Carne
LlamaFluff
VP Baltar
Battle Mage
Vaya

Benmage

vollkan
SpyreX
DrippingGoofball
Snow_Bunny
[/quote]

[chamber]

I still want to know where that list came from.

Well see, I'm third party and need to get dramonic, Papa Zito, milkshake, Sajin and SerialClergyman killed to win. Everyone else was just random.org'ed

[chamber]

He asked for your opinion, not a relative ranking.

And yet I hope it would be easy to infer from his position on the list that I'd be against his lynch anytime soon.

[chamber]

btw I plan on full claiming by the end of the day so don't end it before I can. I think its the best way to play this role.

[chamber]

Lets not talk about fullclaiming and if you're going to do it, just do it.

Unvote, Vote: Benmage

I'd rather the day progress without the info, but at the same time want to get it out there before night. So don't hammer till I've claimed is all I'm asking for.

[chamber]

w/e I'm getting more attention than I wanted from this so I'll just go ahead and claim now. I'm the flurry. My ability is to control the weather. Unless someone wants to come forward as having being effected by the snow all this appears to do is prove what I've done in the night (look at the flurries present in the thread name and the morning scene). My options are snow, rain, cloudy, and sunny. Assuming no one comes forward as having been effected by the snow I'll follow the towns direction on which weather to use which night. And as I previously stated this is described as a passive ability.

[chamber]

He is not asking that you think he is town or scum. Everyone gets that.

He (and others) want to know: WHY?

Added to this: Why do you want to post a list and not provide reasons? Taking a stance without reason is scummy.

unvote; Vote: Chamber

I don't do reasons in regards to alignments except in extreme circumstances. Especially with regards to whom I find scummy.

[chamber]

Can someone direct me to where the case on benmage has been posted?

Never mind Benmage. He may be totally illogical, but he's town.

qft.

Also, lets lynch dramonic.

[chamber]

chamber's left field call to lynch dramonic is further indicaction that chamber is scum.

vote: chamber

Why is this more relevent now than 16 pages ago.

[chamber]

vote papa zito

I'd still prefer dramonic but I can compromise.

[chamber]

Also:

@Plum: Do you know that your partner is town?

No, I am not certain of that. I'm pretty sure that that's the case, but there is no confirmation. However, there is no possible way that that player's Night 1 results could have been lied about; the info came straight from the Mod.

At least now I don't need to throw 3 scum reads out the window. As I understand it, its your partners ability, but you both get results? Is that correct?

[chamber]

Also:

@Plum: Do you know that your partner is town?

No, I am not certain of that. I'm pretty sure that that's the case, but there is no confirmation. However, there is no possible way that that player's Night 1 results could have been lied about; the info came straight from the Mod.

At least now I don't need to throw 3 scum reads out the window. As I understand it, its your partners ability, but you both get results? Is that correct?

Not quite. Amend that too "it was my partner who used the ability Night 1 and we both got the results" and you have it.

My partner does not know I'm Town. We have compared flavor and it both matches up one to the other and matches up to other flavor revealed in the thread.

Three scum reads? How does this keep you from tossing them out the window, though?

I need Elmo to post ASAP. I have reason to suspect SP may be lying about the nature of his Roleblock ability, but coincidence happens so I'm planning to reserve judgment for a bit.

I had scum reads on tubby milkshake and yourself(before the entire cross confirm thing). Now If I choose to believe it I only need to throw out two of them (hint: not you).

[chamber]

Hello Elmo.

Are you planning to eventually vote and come clean, or will you keep WIFOMing until we decide to lynch you?

^scum^

[chamber]

Ohhai. Rereading last night was enlightening.

I need

everyone's

views on dramonic plz.

TIA

Still think hes scum.

[chamber]

Vp, claim your ability while you are around.

Ok, so why not see if milk can heal kise tonight unroleblocked?

Milk was unrolblocked last night as far as we know. Hence why people are attributing a kill to him.

[chamber]

First, some housekeeping:

NPC, The Giver, Strangled Pre Game

"Strangle" = mafia kill

26.) populartajo, The Rodent Tamer, With the Council, Throat slit Night 1
15.) DrippingGoofball, The Cloner, With the Council, Throat slit Night 2
22.) vollkan, The Consumer, With the Council, Strangled Night 2

"Throat slit" = sk kill

---

how the hell do you know that?

Obviously only the mafia and sk "know" it, but its the logical conclusion to draw given that the giver was pregame killed by "strangled". I thought of this myself but I was hoping milkshake would be the one to point it out openly.


Sarnathed but no reason to waste a perfectly good post.

[chamber]

post

[chamber]

Unvote, vote chamber

I'm 100% fine with this.

I dont even get what his PR is,

unless its like some VT useless thing

...i'm baffled by him but is play is worthy enough of a lynch. Though we just policy-lynched us into our own doom like 2 games ago....then again a scum died at night...

2am=rant

unvote vote chamber

Some VT useless thing that proves its a VT usless thing, or at very least that I'm changing the weather and no one is saying its effecting them.

[chamber]

Love Spy's long post. If you sold 'kick down the door cards' that I could buy, Spy, I'd buy like 10. Then every time a game was stalling and I was sitting there rolling my eyes I could just use one and have you kick down the door, run up to every player in the game screaming, 'MAN OR MOUSE??? ARE YOU MAN OR MOUSE???' and kicking people who blink till they hurt.

Given the worrying nature of my ability, I'm wondering how to use it tonight. I'm prepared to a) not use it, b) use it on one of a few targets or c) use it on an agreed upon target. Possible people could be chamber or milk, given they both are dicey and both seem to have active abilities. tubby as well perhaps, but he could be hiding and therefore I'd miss.

As for my top 3 scumteam, if I was a vig I'd shoot half of the people in the game, but my top three at the moment are probably:

1. tubby
2. Sajin
3. stark

It's not particularly congruous with stark being so anti-tubby, but I think individually they're my top.

For the record, and I beleive I already said this but maybe wasn`t clear: My ability is passive even though I make a choice each night.

[chamber]

Chamber, need your top 3 lynch list.

Also, explain how your ability can be passive when it is power based and you make a choice each night.

If I had a standard role I wouldn`t have claimed when I did. Perhaps because I don't target?

[chamber]

Yeah, chamber, you're intentionally ignoring me now and I don't like it. Who are your top three scum suspects. I'm not even asking you for a frakking reason.

tbh spyre demanding that we all post lists in the way he did pissed me off so I felt like being obstinate for a while but I've calmed down since, I'll get one together eventually. I'm confused atm cause all my reads based on play more or less contradict the cross clearing claims.

[chamber]

ignore the different claims just state off gut suspicion who you dislike/think is scummy...

How would that info be remotely useful?

[chamber]

Since this thread died I figure I'll soapbox on WHY chamber's reaction bothers me ohh soo much and delve a bit deeper into the specifics of what I did. (hint, lists need to be made).

Information asymmetry is, ultimately, the scums greatest tool. Information once it gets out and can be parsed is always a scary idea - and by nature scum HAVE to deliver false information at key points or will be busted.

So, what does this have to do with whats going on? Fairly simple. It should be easy for town to give an unordered list (thats why I didn't ask 1/2/3 because that adds a level) of players they find scummy. On the flipside, it becomes a bit harder for scum - at heart it is a ruse BUT they know they will have to do it or be called out.

So, what do you do as scum when someone says "Posts lists or die asap."

You bluster. You buy time. You try to use the method to counteract the idea.

So, yea, I'm really thinkin this be the way to go although we'll see when the cards get layed out a bit more.

The inherent flaw with posting in an abrasive way hoping that scum will use it as a scapegoat is that scum only use it as a scapegoat because sometimes townies genuinely react like scum imitate.

[chamber]

And yet, after all of this talk, no list from chamber. It's not that hard, and I'd hardly say I have been abrasive about it. I've asked quite nicely actually. The reason why this data collection in particular is important is that it will allow us to see the general mood of the town and then select from the scummiest looking targets OVERALL instead of everyone having their own personal preferences and talking past one another.

No way any town member should struggle, have to reread or get "tripped up" by a simple question like this. I don't care if you want to conform or not.

I don't think you've been abrasive at all. At this point the only reason I haven't posted a top 3 is because I don't know who my top 3 are. Still trying to sort that out.

[chamber]

And yet, after all of this talk, no list from chamber. It's not that hard, and I'd hardly say I have been abrasive about it. I've asked quite nicely actually. The reason why this data collection in particular is important is that it will allow us to see the general mood of the town and then select from the scummiest looking targets OVERALL instead of everyone having their own personal preferences and talking past one another.

No way any town member should struggle, have to reread or get "tripped up" by a simple question like this. I don't care if you want to conform or not.

I don't think you've been abrasive at all. At this point the only reason I haven't posted a top 3 is because I don't know who my top 3 are. Still trying to sort that out.

Can you pick a top 2? Top 1 even? Then fill in the rest as you go along?

I've got like a top 7 with nearly no internal ordering.

[chamber]

Are there any of your seven suspects that you would not want lynched over others, chamber?

Atm not so much. There has to be info out there to help me decide which are better though so let me have another day please.

[chamber]

I had the time to do some iso reading since my last post and am going to go with

milkshake
sajin
papazito

Thats an unordered list. I also don't have huge confidence in it but w/e.

[chamber]

Last time he made an actual LoS was on page 20 =_=;

Then tell me, when was the last time i made an LoS anywhere else on site?

I'm only in 3 games atm, and the other 2 are moving reasonably SLOWLY. Here, we had a spell of several pages per day, and when you lose touch in a mafia game which isnt slowing down, it isnt easy to catch up.

BM

I'm in 9 games and I still manage to keep up <<

Your time for mafia != his time for mafia.

[chamber]

His arguement is terrible though. If his two other games are going real slow he ought to focus on the one that's moving fast =_=

His argument is fine. Whether he is actually stretched for time or not aside, its much easier to keep up in a slow game than a fast game. He is therefore able to post in them much easier than this game that he may not have the time to keep up with atm.

[chamber]

I think VP should just post everything, and his method of tabulation. All the raw data is in the thread anyway.

[chamber]

I think VP should just post everything, and his method of tabulation. All the raw data is in the thread anyway.

i think thats a lil rude,,

you never ask a magician to reveal his tricks

The second he's confirmed town I'll trust him to be secretive, until then I like transparency.

[chamber]

Huh. That is interesting looking at it all in one place.

Kise coming up goose eggs is awesome? And confusing?

Seeing Sajin be the number one secondary wagon also seems really smoof.

smoof?

[chamber]

ITT we find out that spyre is Benmages dad.

Unvote Vote Sajin

[chamber]

That presentation is somewhat confusing. For example, VP and Vaya are fairly low, but more people want them dead that Llama or SP

I was going to get pissy about this too until I read vp's post and he straightup says it himself. I think the more interesting thing here is what results would have been given if he only showed the top suspects. He certainly would have been left off, maybe sajin as well.

[chamber]

Letting the list control you is a bad idea, was just used to get a feel for how the town was. Both are viable we can choose which to follow.

[chamber]

On a completely unrelated matter:

Chamber I noticed you were pretty pro-lynching me yesterday, yet you listened to my demand yesterday and made it rain. I'm curious as of why you'd go along with what your ex no.1 lynch says.

You were the only one to request anything before night and I am pretty damn sure my ability does nothing anyway.

[chamber]

Benmage, can you please start playing better.

[chamber]

Benmage, can you please start playing better.

explain where i've been poor

If you had less posts than you do I'd qoute all of them to be funny, but instead I'll keep it to the most recent example and say "Please answer his question"

[chamber]

Why is Sajin still alive?

[chamber]

Then you admit that the gender issue is null? And therefore your voting me for lurking when you yourself have been lurking far far more?

If that is indeed vote worthy to you: Do you consider yourself scummy?

The gender issue is null, I still had reason to think that you are scum before your claim, and still have reason afterwords.

[chamber]

@Chamber- Excellent. Share with the class? Before and after please.

If I am going to be misslynched today I am going to make damn sure everyone on my wagon is accountable.

Cases are scummy

[chamber]

Ugh, I believe Sajin.

I'm also dubious about picking the guy with the most suspicion to vote. It seems to me that there's little accountability for any of the people on the wagon who voted because it was cool and everyone else was doing it.

If noone has any objections, I plan to touch milkshake tonight. I'm also open to another touch or not touching anyone, at the discretion of people I think are prob-town.

Touch me, I'm worried these zombies are some sort of cult and want to be in on the fun if they are.

[chamber]

I like all of the talk about SC touching people. We're all friends here... But if I touch chamber, I get to change the weather, whereas if I touch milk and he's a SK I get to slay someone. I'm so into that.

And zombies = coolest club ever. We meet up on Wednesdays after work and practise dancing Thriller.

For the nth time: My ability is passive.

[chamber]

Stark - you're more than welcome to, but it specifically says active in my role PM. Also, what result are you hoping to get? Whatever power I get, if Sajin is telling the truth, is likely to be vague and unrevelatory anyway.

Plus milkshake sounds like he'd make a better zombie, and that's totally high on the list.

SC- You never revealed (unless I missed it) what you got from VP Baltar. Want to share?

For what purpose?

I'm seriously on to your cult. You better recruit me to shut me up.

[chamber]

Stark - you're more than welcome to, but it specifically says active in my role PM. Also, what result are you hoping to get? Whatever power I get, if Sajin is telling the truth, is likely to be vague and unrevelatory anyway.

Plus milkshake sounds like he'd make a better zombie, and that's totally high on the list.

SC- You never revealed (unless I missed it) what you got from VP Baltar. Want to share?

For what purpose?

Hmm, I'm not sure if I can ask the Mod about another player's power.

Obv it's your choice for who to target.

In terms of the Active vs. ???,

as I understand it, Sajin

is

making a choice every night. That sounds active enough to me.

I also find it interesting to contrast Spyrex's power type and Sajin's. Just a thought..

Regarding VP, at the begining of the day, you made it sound like the information you got from him was really kind of important. I was wondering why this took a backseat.

Me and spyre both claim to make choices each night, yet I'm passive and hes special. It's clearly not a factor in determining what's active.

[chamber]

I still think Sajin is a good lynch today. His night actions are a bit too convenient and benmage even said nothing happened to him last night even though he was targeted.

Plus, look at Sajin's iso. He starts the game off actually trying, which is easier to do as scum when nobody knows anything, but then as the days go on he gently drifts into the background and cheers on from the sidelines. It's not even consistent with what he says his own play is (ie say nothing until under pressure). Early on he was saying plenty. D2 forward, not so much.

[chamber]

care to come clean dram? Want to make changes to your claim?

Hmm? My claim is 100% legitimate.

The converters are not responsible for the death of the giver.

To be clear you admit to being a converter?

[chamber]

Unvote Vote Dramonic

Happy my ability to read peoples play isn't defective, sad my ability to judge claims is.

[chamber]

vote milkshake

[chamber]

Unvote vote tubby

[chamber]

Unvote vote tubby

why or are you doing you dense routine agian?

I never pretend to be dense.

[chamber]

I'd like the massclaim to finish before we end the day

unvote

[chamber]

If we don't go threw with this mass claim, I swear I'll make the weather slightly unpleasant tomorrow. Don't think I wont!!

[chamber]

BM, bm, VP, Llama and Kise have yet to claim.

Let's hear it.

SLIGHTLY UNPLEASANT WEATHER!!!

[chamber]

Popcorn it, someone go, then they choose next, ect.

[chamber]

Or you can go. That's also an idea.

[chamber]

Someone vig him please.

[chamber]

didnt stark claim cult cop..but never said anything about a guilty on you right?

correct apparantly i a so cult he forgot to investigate me.

starks claim post

Before I claim, I need to know if anyone has drugs.

No drugs here. You plan on waiting for everyone in the game to answer this before you claim?

That's obv not realistic

----------------------

Vote Tubby216

for following me from game to game.

and cicero check agian you followed me here,,lol

vote:benmage

for not posting

No. You are just such a good stalker you can anticipate my movements.

actually i thought i would be able to hide out here. apartantly you are a good seeker

I'm about 80% that this is not tubby breadcrumbing, or atleast not for what he claimed to be. I think this is him trying to find me.

I am The Seeker = Cult-Cop

The converters are not responsible for the death of the giver.

I also have reason to believe that this is true. In my PM, it says that in my research, I've found out about The Cult of the Goma, who tried to destroy the Goma a while ago. Now I believe that the Cult is back, and may be responsible for the death of the Giver.

------

I've done iso reads of KK, dramonic and tubby. In all three, I've found tubby to be at odds with dramonic and KK, who both flipped Converter. With this in mind, as well as tubby's consistant non-town play, I believe that tubby is a member, if not the leader, of the Cult of the Goma.

Regarding the drugs-

I know that the cult brainwashes their victims. My power is to detect if someone's mind has been altered.

The use of a drug called Cava looks the same to me IE false positive upon investigation.

Atleast up to Night 2, Plum is not cult. The rest of my targets are dead.

Stark's results reveal

Results:

Night 1: Kscope- "no result"
Night 2: Plum- "no result"
Night 3: Papa Zito- I didn't receive a PM. Mod clarified that this was because PZ died before my investigation was processed.

The way he worded it it sounds like he can only get results on non-cultleaders as they need to have had their mind altered. Given that it makes perfect sense that he wouldn't cop the person he thought to be the CL.

[chamber]

Wait a minute... If we are 16 players, and if there's only 15 votes, and if we have a double voter, don't that mean that two players have lost their votes?

Hence what i've been trying to deduce.

How about you claim?

[chamber]

Vote tubby

[chamber]

Spyrex: BM isn't going to claim today.

He's realized that today's lynch is tubby, so there's nothing the town can do to threaten him into claiming.

[chamber]

Your claim has a bunch of inconsistencies.

[chamber]

that was hammer yes??

yes

[chamber]

So I forgot to send in a night action, oops.

[chamber]

Vote BattleMage

[chamber]

I take it you chose to throw a potion my way last night Spyre?

[chamber]

I gained a one shot ability that supports the templating bunny got. This of course only means she didn't lie about the ability, but I trust her. I'll willing to say which ability I got but I think its anti-town to do so.

[chamber]

This lynch feels disproportionately easy to me...

[chamber]

I don't have any strong scum reads atm. I've been neglecting giving this game a reread. What I can say however is that this wagon is far too easy given the person its on, and the others in the game. I'm worried the people voting him are voting in a group for a reason. IE a cult. But a cult also seems so ridiculous at this point.

[chamber]

This is not a new case on Elmo. It's been building for quite some time.

I don't believe all 6 of the people on him have openly found him suspect recently, but I haven't reread this thread in a long time, mostly do to its massive length, so I could be wrong. A quick iso+search only shows 3 of them having made any recent(or even remotely old) points against elmo, I didn't check for points against rosso though. This still leaves 3 seemingly voting him out of the blue today.

I haven't found any of the stated reasons for suspecting him to be valid(lol we can't have 2 vote manipulators) And I personally haven't seen much come from him to convince me hes scum. Also this normally would make me happy but there is quite the absence of the case being presented against him. Although I endorse this I find it odd that people that normally condemn such things are on the wagon(In truth condemn might be too strong a word here, but the fact remains that I don't know of anyone that's active with my outlook on cases).


I think I've convinced myself of a stark lynch. The way I see it hes either Cult himself, or is the sk and made up a fake role.

[chamber]

I think I've convinced myself of a stark lynch. The way I see it hes either Cult himself, or is the sk and made up a fake role.

I blocked stark. There were still 2 kills.

Thanks for point this out. Sigh. I need to do more thinking. I want everyone to hold off on the elmo lynch at anyrate.

[chamber]

That kill is interesting given that I had a 1-shot doc from spyre and used it on socio last night...

[chamber]

...

Was it a full doc or another half one?

Full as far as I know, I didn't ask but it also wasn't qualified by any limiters. I guess if the scum have an rb the fact that I had a 1-shot something was in the open. I also guess that it may have only negated a single kill. Something happened though.

[chamber]

I'm extremely against an SB lynch. Out of the Scum list Spyre posted she would be my last choice. Im going out for dinner now though so I can't research who my first choice would be quite yet.

[chamber]

I'm extremely against an SB lynch. Out of the Scum list Spyre posted she would be my last choice. Im going out for dinner now though so I can't research who my first choice would be quite yet.

So what did you do to the weather again?

made it cloudy.

[chamber]

I'm extremely against an SB lynch. Out of the Scum list Spyre posted she would be my last choice. Im going out for dinner now though so I can't research who my first choice would be quite yet.

So what did you do to the weather again?

made it cloudy.

Just run through night by night all your weather actions for me.

From memory so there may be an error:

n1 snow
n2 light rain
n3 sunny
n4 No action cause I frogot
n5 No action again, I suck at this remembering thing Also got a one shot from spyre at this point
n6 cloudy + one shot doc used on socio

[chamber]

I really do not see why I am being pressured when I was the counter wagon to a scum wagon that most of the dead scum were all on. So I am unlikely mafia.

Additionally I was roleblocked so not the SK.

So I fail to see how I am likely at all.


Spyrex, your logic is faulty. I am scummy because I did not say anything and now I am scummy because I did not say what you wished to hear. I recieved no PM about a potion so how can I claim anything? You yourself were in BM's bastard game and so was our mod. Perhaps the mod took a note from that game with Vi's power. Alternatively perhaps it granted something passive.

I think Kise is likely scum here.

After that I think VP Baltar. There is no reason that sociopath should not have been protected. Especially considering the floundering VP did with his claim of not protecting.


Chamber is town. Llama is town. Spyrex is town but using bad logic. Vaya is town.

Kise or VP Baltar is the SK

Stark is number 3 on my list and is likely mafia.

I have no qualms hammering Kise.


Spyrex your numbers are off. 4 mafia dead, 1 3rd party dead. 24 people. I figure 1 sk 1 mafia left at most for 7 total. 8 would be 1/3 scum.

(And now that Legacy is done I can devote more time here if needed. Those 8 hour days were soaking up my time on MS)

8 isn't completely out of the question given that (nearly)every player has a useful ability and that one of those wasn't strictly scum as far as we know. I hope its 1 and 1 left, bu I'd rather play like its 2 and 1 left.

Vote Kise.

I'm happy with this vote.

[chamber]

I think sajin is todays lynch, thoughts?

[chamber]

I only know as much as the rest of you. I got no pm on the matter.

[chamber]

yeah I don't know why I haven't been posting more than I have. Anyway, I'd far rather we lynch sajin before SB if its all the same to you.

Unvote vote Sajin

[chamber]

Sajin voters, its not happening. Seriously.

We've basically proven why he is town. Vote ScumBunny

In case I die, my moneys on VP if one of you three is scum. I know I'm not and have a town read on SB.

[chamber]

Can everyone reclaim there roles and targts by night for me? I'll start.
The Flurry, control weather.
n1 snow
n2 light rain
n3 sunny
n4 No action cause I frogot
n5 No action again, I suck at this remembering thing Also got a one shot from spyre at this point
n6 cloudy + one shot doc used on socio
n7 sunny
n8 light rain

[chamber]

I can protect anyone including myself, but not two nights in a row. My targets were:

n1:Volkan
n2:Plum
n3:Papa Zito
n4:myself
n5: Spyrex
n6: myself
n7:Spyrex
n8: myself

This is the way I look at it right now, given evidence in the thread Sajin is probably town unless he bussed the hell out of his partners. Chamber I was fairly certain was town before, but that's out the window now. He's my top pick for the strangler.

Llama is probably scum given the fact that he's not dead. Why would the scum have targeted anyone else every single night since his claim? There was nothing preventing them from killing a doc for most of the game and yet they don't do it? It doesn't make any sense.

Unfortunately, I don't know what Sajin and I can do to win the game at this point since we're going to get screwed on the NK. If we lynch chamber, Llama takes one of us out and wins. If we lynch Llama, Chamber kills me and wins.

What in-thread evidence exactly? I know I'm town so just play along for a little bit.

[chamber]

regarding Sajin?

yes

[chamber]

Well, we talked about this fairly extensively yesterday, but there was a competing wagon on him when scum was being lynched (dramonic, iirc) and he was RB'd on a night there was a strangulation.

Do you think it is likely he is scum, and if so please explain why because I don't really see it.

If hes town that means you and llama are the SK and Mafia. This likely means the sk and mafia both had a half doc, and the town had no doctor at all, this troubles me.

[chamber]

@Llama

I would prefer a few questions get answered before any decision is made and I would rather weigh the pros and cons of no lynching in this situation.

You never answered my question nor are you allowing me to get my others asked.

Discussion is the lifeblood of the town and you would be advocating that if you were part of it.

Would it not be better for the scum to kill the SK?

Are you insinuating the SK is kill immune?

Its one scum, one SK. How kills are going down and how the game is still in progress tells us that much. Also yes, with a vig and scum im making a safe assumption that we have a NK immune SK. Therefore also safer for scum not to kill

If you dont see why no lynchins wins out here I will explain it to you, but our chances are dangerously low already to be perfectly frank. I just see relying on good lynch, stopped kill, good lynch as not good (especially low given a theory but will refrain for now).

Anyways, if we are no lynching, and scum isnt going to kill, SK crafts the endgame, and I want to give them as little information as possible. So yes im advocating just shutting down the day.

If the sk is NK Immune then the towns already lost, I'd rather assume otherwise. Please give me a list of your targets by night.

[chamber]

I fully intend to vote no lynch, Id just rather the scum know who each other are so they can cross kill properly.

[chamber]

Heres what has happened

N2 (or was it three, im dead tired but want to post before I go to sleep and forget) when VPB got 'roleblocked' he did get targeted by Spy, although he did not get roleblocked. He most likely just picked up a one shot something and didnt say what it was. NO ONE else had this happen. We had abilities, we had 'nothing' and we had poision that somehow wore off. No explicit results though. Really it was a brilliant move, he was 'killed' so regarded as basically confirmed town, he just was putting another safety knot in his harness. What better way then to confirm yourself as non-strangle then to claim it would of been impossible when it couldnt be proved! Coupled with him being strangle, it made sense to claim (he may of been given this safeclaim, I wouldnt doubt it given that this is all PRs) protection from his own kill. He either guessed my details correctly in the case of self-protect, or infered the restriction (double target rule). Also it makes less sense for town to have anti-SK protection, then it is to have anti-mafia protection.

Chamber is far more obvious. N6 no one died from slit. D7 there was no weather. D7 chamber claimed to of submitted an action. Chamber got RBed submitting the kill.

Now we have an inherant problem. SK likely has figured out scum. So if we no lynch, I dont think we can really win this. Its POSSIBLE, but honestly I doubt it. It would require a block of the SK kill by who I think the SK is, and then hitting a 50-50 protect by me the following night.

Anyways, here is a possibility if people agree that im town, and that VPB is SK. Lynch VPB, my thoughts havent changed since daybreak, so im going to outright say that I may of lied about my target last night. Who knows, maybe I threw away my action predicting this would occur, or saved chamber from poision. I could be unrestricted tonight though for killing, and if I get my protect right, town can win.

So I want mostly Sajin to weigh in since he is most likely town here.

Do we assume that I am town and take a crack at this, or do we no lynch and hope SK has a bad read?

This post confuses me. 1 If you are town then no townies trust it(i.e. me) 2 don't we want the sk to hit mafia tonight? (and vise versa?) I think its the only way we win.

[chamber]

@scum I hope you have a better idea of whats going on than I do.

[chamber]

When the other options were a miller and ??? no. No way.

I mean when the SK and the mafia opt to live together in perfect harmony and not try to kill each other *shrug*.

Snowbunny was still extremely obvious town, but yeah I was lynching Sajin before either of them. Brilliant gambit on their part. This game has taught me to put even less faith in claims.

[chamber]

First, as I wasn't listed any partners, I supposed I was town. Second, the flavor make me think I was town. Third, my power, when I'm investigated I look like a converter, make me believe I was town (well, I still haven't played the first mafia where scum has investigative roles). And fourth, though it wasn't on my pm, the flavor of the first role confirmed my suspicions that The Council was town (the npc found dead was the leader of The Council).

Why she was obvious town.