MtG: Parallel Universe Mafia (Tar's subgame): Game Over

[Sajin]

<10> If no one has reached majority by deadline, the person with the most votes will be lynched. If there is a tie, each player in the tie will send me a haiku. Whichever one is more amusing will be spared the rope.

Fatties are green cards....
Counterspells are blue you know....
Why do you have red?

[Sajin]

/confirm btw

[Sajin]

Vote: Benmage

he confirmed before I even got my role PM.

"To probe the wonders of the multiverse, to gaze upon worlds unspoiled by blade or spell . . . it's enough to make one weep for the possibilities denied."

[Sajin]

I like my vote. Not to mention his lover may be scum (albeit in another thread) although his lover could be town.

Questions:
Can you talk to your lover?
Do you know what subgame they are in?
How many people are in your QT?

How then do you expect to get over to the other game?

If others can move me?? I don't know the mechanics....or once a faction wins in this game and the subgames merge. I don't affect you guys win conditions.

Please state everything you know about "subgames merging".

[Sajin]

DDD, if you are reading this please post if your neutral scum or town. Thanks.

[Sajin]

Blame Benmage not me DDD. (and hey, I have been lovers with you, DDD)

So Benmage do you have any other useful abilities other than your QT?

[Sajin]

Benmage- Really? Nothing. You want to move across the planes yet and have nothing to give except indentured servitude?

And I agree with DDD, Zazier is scum.

[Sajin]

What was the name of your enchantment? And the artifact?

I would also be interested in hearing your fake claim. One less hiding card for scum to use.

And its fine, we can wait for the mod.

[Sajin]

Mod may I quote other sub game?

If not, may I reference post numbers?

Both are permitted. Your last post, however, is Jackassery (Attempting to Use Structure of Role PM for Advantage). - Tar

[Sajin]

@Zazier- Ah but your method wastes 2 of towns lynches 1 of each sub game. Unless whoever could transport them across the planes was giving up a double vig it would be better to dispose of them that way. Disagree?

[Sajin]

I am at work but Baru is the timeshifted/planar chaos version of another card which is the sister of another card which as I recall is Phage the Untouchable (this is off memory, I need to research more at home)

I forget if its phage that is the version of DDD's claim or not. Someone else clarify?

[Sajin]

unvote; vote Pyromaniac

READ THE GAME.

The proposition is to test them. If they are not removed from the game, then we lynch. Lynching them is wasteful of towns resources if we have a cheaper (resource wise) method of testing alignments. So tell me why you as town would want to use up a lynch here?

[Sajin]

You have not explained why you think they are cult and how they will win in one day and why that is a better use of resources. That is a lot of assumptions sir.

[Sajin]

That was him whole reason for claiming. Fine. Let me revise my sentiment. We should not give him a free ticket to endgame.

I agree. However, your previous statements bothered me a lot.

[Sajin]

Benmage are you sure you are lovers with DDD? Could your win condition be to join him but your lover be someone else?

[Sajin]

Okay, thought about it a bunch. Here's what I think it all boils down to:

In order for the town to win, we must destroy all other factions.

Third parties are a different faction.

vote: Debonair Danny DiPietro

@Papa Zito- According to their claim thy are removed from the game upon joining each other. Therefore if they are in the same game and have not been removed then we lynch. Agreed?

[Sajin]

Abilities may cause a player to change subgames (this can cause subgames to have more players than they started in), though players cannot be changed into a subgame that has ended. Factions with factional kills may kill one player each {period} in any subgame one of their members is in, but factions with factional communication (i.e, Mafia) may communicate with all other members of their faction outside the thread regardless of alignment.

This is from the signups. Mafia can talk across the subgames.

Pyro wanting to simply remove scum from our thread does not facilitate a win overall. Especially as it is hinted that some factions may not get removed from the totality of the game when 1 subgame ends ( I would have to find that quote, I know its there somewhere). In fact I suspect that the mafia winning one subgame would have adverse if not catastrophic effects on other subgames.

Also- In to trade-Malthusis is lurking! *Snicker*

[Sajin]

Wow and I simulposted that. Sheesh.

[Sajin]

So.....whats the artifact that represents your win condition? Crucible of worlds?

[Sajin]

Abilities may cause a player to change subgames (this can cause subgames to have more players than they started in), though players cannot be changed into a subgame that has ended. Factions with factional kills may kill one player each {period} in any subgame one of their members is in, but factions with factional communication (i.e, Mafia) may communicate with all other members of their faction outside the thread regardless of alignment.

This is from the signups. Mafia can talk across the subgames.

Pyro wanting to simply remove scum from our thread does not facilitate a win overall. Especially as it is hinted that some factions may not get removed from the totality of the game when 1 subgame ends ( I would have to find that quote, I know its there somewhere). In fact I suspect that the mafia winning one subgame would have adverse if not catastrophic effects on other subgames.

Also- In to trade-Malthusis is lurking! *Snicker*

I know this. However we could deal with the scum better in a subgame we were winning.

Interesting. I think the above quote of pyros indicates inside info.

confirm: vote Pyro

[Sajin]

Budja whats your opinion on Pyro?

[Sajin]

Forbinlight's gamers

I'm gonna regret this, but here this is me helping.

Papa Zito

doesn't look like he has the town win condition when he describes his win condition eliminating all non town elements....Look at our sample townie role on page one.

Although destroy seems a little different, he did use factions. Null or slightly scummy perhaps.


@Mufasa- what are your thoughts on Pyro? In fact I would like all of the kamigawa plane to answer.

[Sajin]

@DDD- I need to know your fake claim so I can figure out what will likely be scum. Please post it.

@Spyrex, thats a dangerous assumption to make.

[Sajin]

@Jammer- Are you familiar with MTG lore?

[Sajin]

Pyromaniac is the only person who's advocating a lynch.

I don't even have my vote on him. I have already said I don't want him lynched. I don't believe his claim. And I don't like how everyone else does under little to no evidence.
@malthusis I know that would probably never happen. But if one side was in lylo and we were 1 scum - 7 townies then just maybe we should trade the towniest person on ourside to the scummiest person on theirs.

You were throwing mud in the waters to setup a future ML possibly by randomly theorizing he was cult. Just because you were not voting him does not mean that you were not attempting to persuade a possible ML.

[Sajin]

unvote

http://magiccards.info/autocard.php?car ... e%20Boreal|

Unrecruitable mafia? uncrecruitable cult?

[Sajin]

I would not put it past tar to put a mafia recruiter in this game. Regardless I can see why you suspected cult recruitment sort of. Hmm.

Last question: What is your printed rarity?

[Sajin]

Magic the Gathering: Parallel Universe Mafia (Subgame 2: SSK's Setup)

In a place as large as the Blind Eternities, many different worlds can become entwined in a single destiny.

For instance, take the three planes that you now find yourselves in. Each is self-contained... but, as the planeswalkers know, there are ways to traverse the Blind Eternities... and the events of other planes can affect your own.

Especially when you're dealing with people - or other creatures - whose ambitions of conquest are not limited to a single world...

Jammer and Spyrex please respond to the above quote which is the flavor text from MafiaSSK's game. Thanks.

Thanks for the info pyro. Although I don't think your cleared by any means I think the likelihood of you being scum can be proven when a recruiter type role flips. Who do you think is scum besides the claimed neutrals?

[Sajin]

I'm with Kairyuu on this one. I don't think his claim helps him at all. He's extremely lacking on the details...the "unrecruitable" part can't be proven at all. If it looks like a fakeclaim, it probably is a fake claim.

I still want to hear more from ChaosOmega besides dropping in with an opportunistic vote. Also, would be nice to hear more from Malt.

My role name is strong-minded townie. Also, this is not a mind screw game, tar is not in the game.

So your a strong minded townie and an unrecruitable townie?

2 role names makes no sense. I smell something....

vote Pyro

[Sajin]

(By the way, this also tells me that if SpyreX is town he probably doesn't have a role that affects the other subgames in any way.)

This is exactly what I was trying to say to jammer and spyrex. Thanks.

[Sajin]

@Boxman I would appreciate commentary from you anyways.

[Sajin]

Disliking this.
Pyro explained it well. Role names can be different than actual role. Strong-minded townie, unrecruitable townie, interpreted the same.

Look at the phrasing he used when he claimed his name as well.

[Sajin]

Thank you for the clarification that all characters are of mythic rarity. That helps.

I was told I needed to rephrase my question to Benmage: What is the name of your faction/group? (I was told you can answer but you better check anyways).

@Seraphim- Tar just said that all characters were mythic rare. Lets keep the structure questions reasonable please.

[Sajin]

Actually Seraphim, I am not sure how familiar with magic cards you are but several cards have a comma in the title.
For instance: http://magiccards.info/ts/en/83.html
http://magiccards.info/fut/en/46.html

Notice how the actual card name has a surtitle?

[Sajin]

@Seraphim- Please respond to the last post directed at you.


@Yos- I seem to recall you saying something along the lines of "If someone claims neutral the right move is to lynch them, always" from the last game we played together. Why is your opinion now different?

[Sajin]

I even warned him about it. Sigh.

[Sajin]

Other game threads. I request you do not enter night until we come out of it (Its more information for you to get reads on) Thanks.

[Sajin]

Based on what I know about Yos, I think he's scum in FL's game.

A statement with no supporting evidence!

[Sajin]

Magic the Gathering: Parallel Universe Mafia (Subgame 2: SSK's Setup)

In a place as large as the Blind Eternities, many different worlds can become entwined in a single destiny.

For instance, take the three planes that you now find yourselves in. Each is self-contained... but, as the planeswalkers know, there are ways to traverse the Blind Eternities... and the events of other planes can affect your own.

Especially when you're dealing with people - or other creatures - whose ambitions of conquest are not limited to a single world...

Since planeswalkers are such a HUGE flavor reason in the books it stands to reason that they are the ones that can cross planes. Yes planes, MafiaSSK in his flavor text even refers to these games as the "three planes that you now find youselves in". Crossing the games refers to "planeswalking" most likely.

Many planeswalkers that were found in the books were printed up as creature cards (the planeswalker type was not introduced until lorwyn which is after all 3 planes we are in Dominaria, Weatherlight, Kamigawa). If I had to hazard a guess about the setup, I would assume all roles are a creature card and in fact a legendary creature card (true so far for all claims and fake claims). The ones that can cross the planes are likely roles of cards based on planeswalkers from the books.

[Sajin]

Papa, did you read my flavor text at all that I quoted?

[Sajin]

Well only our game had night actions...so I doubt someone over there pulled (to their game)

Someone from our game swaped (because Benmage and DDD left the game from this plane, not their plane). Someone from our game pulled.

Since I doubt DDD was capable of swaping, that leaves Budja for the likely cause of the swap (although it could of been someone acting on 2 targets as well)

Someone pulled. Hmm.

[Sajin]

vote Chaos Omega

for having incredibly low amounts of content and only centered on a couple of things.

I still want to hear from Budja.

[Sajin]

Seraphim was likely a vigilante of some sort. http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... eid=109752

I can't think of a better legendary card that represented pure destruction better than the task mage.

Assuming he was a vigilante and had a kill, add together the SK's kill (that went "missing" according to flavor) and the mafia kill for a potential 3 kills a night.

What do we have that can deal with 3 kills a night?

Protip: Ass Whuppin' is in fact an Magic: the Gathering card (from Unhinged). It might prove enlightening. - Tar

[Sajin]

Seraphim was likely a vigilante of some sort. http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... eid=109752

I can't think of a better legendary card that represented pure destruction better than the task mage.

Assuming he was a vigilante and had a kill, add together the SK's kill (that went "missing" according to flavor) and the mafia kill for a potential 3 kills a night.

What do we have that can deal with 3 kills a night?

Protip: Ass Whuppin' is in fact an Magic: the Gathering card (from Unhinged). It might prove enlightening. - Tar

He could cross game vig? Damn.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... seid=74329

Now I need to read Unhinged again.

[Sajin]

Is Tar always so helpful in his games?

Seraphim and Kinetic are dead and won't be revived (Seraphim's a survivor), so there's no harm done.....

How close have you been reading the game so far?

[Sajin]

@Sociopath: Either you do not have the town win condition or you need to read it again. The fact that your role apparently says kamigawa in it does not tie you to that plane. Also role names do not equal faction name (except for Nikol Bolas because he is just THAT badass)

[Sajin]

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... seid=74644

Interesting.

He changed his stance on neutrals this game (ussually its kill on sight). I called him out on it and what does he flip? Neutral. Go figure.

[Sajin]

Kairyuu, who is scum?

[Sajin]

prods please Tar

[Sajin]

Vino, who is scum?

[Sajin]

Kairyuu, who is scum?

The ones who are trying to kill us. I dunno. I'm at a loss for reads right now. On an iso reread Pyro looks more like a townie getting backed into a corner than scum, but that's pretty much it. I could see a Chaos or Vino wagon, but only for lurking, which I too am guilty of, so I'm not going there.

Gut says you could very well be scum though. Your play thus far is somewhat reminiscent of the WoT large, and it's bothering me, because I can't tell if the change is because of alignment, or because you're becoming a better player.

How is my play at all reminiscent of WoT?

Meta, I have played with you 3 times and every time you have been town. Also, every time you were aggressively trying to scumhunt and were questioning statements made by players. Lurker hunting is not like the kairyuu meta I know....but I can't tell if its because of your college thing or your alignment.

What are your thoughts on Mastin? What are your thoughts on Budja (aware he is not here anymore)?

[Sajin]

@Zwett- What is your role name? (Someone please copy this over to SSKs game)

[Sajin]

What happened to this game?

3 V/LAs.....sigh

Vino- stop fence sitting or you earn my vote.

[Sajin]

I like how I could summarize this whole case into fence sitting. Thanks for writing it all out though.

[Sajin]

Vino your at L-2. My vote would make it L-1 and I don't feel like giving an opportunity to quick hammer. I would like you to claim when SSKs game finishes night.

[Sajin]

Vino, what part about you should claim did you not understand?

[Sajin]

vote: Vino

claim time, Vino.

Hey qwints. What are your thoughts on people here?

[Sajin]

Percy flipped: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... rseid=4617

My thoughts: The first non legendary card to be a role. Thats interesting.

Also the slivers were controlled by Volrath as I recall from MTG books.

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... seid=21328


Although Zwet claimed he had protection from blue ( or something to that effect) and scum dropped artifact. I guess I cannot conclude anything on colors at this time.

[Sajin]

Alright its Zito and Vino- your half hashing is hard to read.

So you have no opinions either? Several reveals and all you got is "confusion"?

Posting while not pushing someone just as you stated you are doing is called something. Its called active lurking.

[Sajin]

What is your card name vino?

[Sajin]

Sigh. I believe it. I see a pattern to these card abilities. Although I wish you would commit instead of fence sitting. Not only is it unhelpful it makes for a boring game.

To note though, there was only 1 kill last night and vino said he did not block anything. Something else stopped or redirected Kinetics kill (Yes I am assuming he had a kill)

unvote; vote veerus

[Sajin]

I provided my reasoning every step of the way. How is that fence sitting exactly?

[Sajin]

Jumping back on and off the wagon, not committing to it.

Thats not fence sitting.

[Sajin]

How is changing your opinions about someone and changing your vote because of that scummy, at all?


Also my abilitiy(s) or lack there of do not match my card well either.

[Sajin]

I have already asked for a prod on everyone (at the time) which included Mastin. Yes, Mastin, lurky is likely scum-Mastin but I think he is partially V/LA.

Whats up with you not voting anyone Veerus? You seem to have opinions that nothing but my vote could bring out. Lets see some action based on those opinions.

[Sajin]

@Malthusis- That is an incredibly scummy reason to add a vote imo. He said his ability does not need 2 targets, did you fully read his posts? Did your scumbuddies just tell you to throw your vote on the stack? (lame magic reference, could not resist)

[Sajin]

would like a replace on Mastin. Its dragging the game

[Sajin]

When does your protect take effect then? As another game would likely not be at night when ours was.....therefore that makes little sense.

[Sajin]

Also, your a doctor and you have no readings on anyone in this game.....talk about serious fence sitting.

[Sajin]

That seems overpowered. We could intentionally slow down this game then and make a PR in another thread unkillable? While we get all the information from deaths in that thread?

[Sajin]

While we are at it, whats your role name vino?

[Sajin]

Seraphim was red. Jaya task mage was red. (his modkill text is blue, and his role name was green)

No good people have been black or blue.

[Sajin]

What bugs me though is that the neutrals claims were red as fake, green as real. White as fake green as real.

[Sajin]

unvote; Vote: Vino

[Sajin]

That was a very abusable role as claimed. The swap thing as Tar described seems more balanced. I wish you would of been more clear vino.

[Sajin]

I did not want to lynch a doctor. The way he described it would of been way too powerful and completely abusable. The way Tar described it in flavor is more balanced as it would only last 1 night. Vino did not explain it well.

[Sajin]

True. But I have rational for each change.

Are you saying you find my opinions scummy?

Or just the fact that my opinions have changed?