MtG: Parallel Universe Mafia (SSK's Subgame): Game OVER!

[Boxman]

/confirmed

[Boxman]

Hey, SSK, just so you know...

Mod:

(and everyone else) I will be V/LA from August 2nd until August 8th.

I will have my laptop with me, but may not be able to post while I am away.

[Boxman]

Ah,okay, I see.

[Boxman]

We could probably get the game rolling right now and replace Mr. Big if he doesn't post soon, like with Mastin in Tar's game.

[Boxman]

No, it doesn't. Tar's subgame started without Mastin, who still hasn't confirmed. I understand that different mods handle things in different ways, but I see no reason why we can't start.

[Boxman]

Finally!

Anyway, it seems like the other 2 games have already ended the RV stage for us, so yeah.

Anyway, about Benmage/DDD. I'm willing to let them slide until tonight and let the Game-Switcher figure it out.

Anyway, to the players who want to ignore the other games: the three games are irreversibly linked, even more so now that we are talking about them. There's no point in trying to completely ignore them.

[Boxman]

Fine, fine, RV stage.

Vote: Zwet

For doing stuff I guess.

[Boxman]

Haha, me too. You have no clue how much stuff I've wanted to point out but haven't been able to.

[Boxman]

@Seraphim: Everything I had wanted to point out had already been answered by the time this game began. Ah, the joys of starting out last.

[Boxman]

Anyway, hurrah for being scummy in the other game.

Anyway, my opinions on a couple of players in Tar's subgame...

Benmage: Let him fulfill his win con. I don't see a reason to deny him it. If he doesn't leave the game, lynch him.

Pyro: I agree that the way he changed his claim is weird, but I wouldn't look into it too much. Unrecruitable townie is simply a more common name than Strong-minded Townie, and I've seen people claim the name of a role very similar to theirs over the role's actual name.

Others: Either haven't posted much(i.e. Mastin, Veerus) or I think haven't been suspicious(Seraphim, Sajin).

Will post about FL's subgame in a minute.

[Boxman]

And now for some stuff from FL's subgame...

DDD: see Benmage above.

Porkens: What is with the "Vig shoot Mufasa" thing? I looked through his posts and

every

one of them except his confirmation post has that in it. Seriously, what?

Jammer/SpyreX: Both seem to be adverse to the idea of paying attention to the other subgames. Not sure what's up here.

Popo Zita: Mentions some nonsense about not letting the lovers win because townies "have to eliminate all other factions." As even the sample role showed, you don't have to eliminate, but rather all other factions have to be removed, which the lovers stated would happen. Big screwup here, although a mistaken townie isn't impossible.

There. That's the stuff I've noticed.

[Boxman]

@Mastin: Twisting Porkens's words? How else is one supposed to take this:

If I were vig, I'd shoot Mufasa.

Yes, it is slightly different, but it implies that the vig should shoot Mufasa.

[Boxman]

Oh, wow.

He even warned someone else about it already. >:(

[Boxman]

I think we might have a parallel universe mod lynch mechanic. Since Tar is conventionally lynched, maybe he made himself a role that can only be lynched through another subgame.

Interesting idea. I don't know if it would work, but it's interesting none the less.

@Chenhsi: Traditionally, in a Tar game, you can vote for anyone but a lynch on anyone not in the game won't work. I don't see how lynching someone in another subgame would work.

[Boxman]

It's definitely possible. I don't think they'd necessarily do it, but it's a possibility.

@chenhsi: Glad to see you know that won't work anymore.

@qwints: I also read it like that.

Also, I wouldn't discount the possibility that the scumteam in our game may have an effect on other games; our scumteam may have a member in one of the other towns and vice versa.

[Boxman]

^To be fair to Zakeri, in Tar games, most non-town players tend to have safe claims.

Also, in Tar games, trying to lynch someone outside the game would result in a no lynch. I assume this would go for SSK and FL too. For examples, look for Mod Screw Mafia in the Marathon Days board.

And now, for

A Brief History of

Time

SSK's Subgame

Zwet: Maybe focusing a little too much on the bastard mod aspect of Tar games. Seems neutral to me.

Zakeri: Considers it a scumtell to hunt scum in other games. Not sure what's up with that. Slightly scummy read here, but its nothing too big.

qwints: Has commented that he assumed that there were multiple scumteams. Since I assumed this as well, I can't comment. Also, post more plz.

chenhsi: Trying to lynch someone in the other game? Most of us were pretty positive it wouldn't work, and you decided to test it anyway. I have a slightly scummy read here.

Head_Honcho: what (Read: Do something relevant plz)

Starbuck: Tried to stop us from starting before Mr. Big got here. Trying to stall the game before Day 1 began? Perhaps. Fairly neutral read here, maybe slightly scummy.

Sudai: Has posted his suspicions and tried to get us to talk. Slightly town read.

Percy/semioldguy/sideney: Need to post more.

Mr. Big: Needs replacement.

[Boxman]

@Chenhsi: Maybe it was just me. Still, I was pretty sure several of us thought you were suspicious because of that.

@Starbuck: Scum that have night talk only are typically allowed to talk during confirmations. Scum might try to lengthen the confirmation stage in order to get more time to talk in. This is also where the "last-to-confirm" scumtell comes from.

[Boxman]

@Sudai: Tar typically has 2 sections of his graveyard: 1 for dead people and 1 for those modkilled/left the game. I assume that this is a similar mechanic.

[Boxman]

Also: I have no problem saying my expansion. I doubt there's any way to guess roles/characters from the expansion. I'll wait until others say what they think first.

[Boxman]

I don't think Kinetic is still in the game. There's always a chance he could be revived, but it would make no sense for a reviver, no matter what alignment, to revive an SK.

[Boxman]

Uh, I didn't.

What do people think of claiming what expansion your card is from?

[Boxman]

^I think those expansions are the only ones from the Weatherlight Saga, our subgame.

I have no problem revealing that I am from one of those expansions.

[Boxman]

@FL's game: Okay, that wasn't as bad as before. But seriously guys, stop talking about role PM setup and stuff.

[Boxman]

I would not be surprised if there's at least 1 scumteam that has a member in another town at the start. I could definitely see it happening.

[Boxman]

Uh, okay, I think that puts Zwet at L-2. Don't give him another vote until he either claims or refuses to claim, guys.

[Boxman]

What luck. One of them's in this game.

Anyway, bulletproof isn't exactly the best claim in the world. You have a name?

[Boxman]

^Err, well, in the other subgame anyway. >.>

[Boxman]

^Uh, Mufasa isn't in this game, Starbuck. His vote doesn't count.

[Boxman]

...Did you just hammer? Seriously?

[Boxman]

I had actually forgotten my vote was there until you mentioned it, but by then he'd already made me suspicious of him, so my vote stood.

[Boxman]

Oh, also, whoot, you've got some 'splaining to do...

[Boxman]

That was before the whole "only hammer" and "bulletproof claim" things.

[Boxman]

I do not like that quickhammer on Zwet, Whoot. Especially when you say Vanilla when he was quite clearly claiming Bulletproof.

Until you speak a little more in your defense, I'm going to

Vote: Whoot1234

[Boxman]

Yes, but they aren't quite the same - a bulletproof is not quite the policy lynch that VT is. To be fair, VT probably isn't a very good policy lynch anyway.

[Boxman]

Anyway, it looks like whoot's at L-3 - with 10 alive, it should be 6 to lynch.

Anyway, I'd still like a claim from him.

Also, I honestly didn't have time to see the card Starbuck posted before whoot laid down the hammer - it was barely 40 minutes later. I don't believe I was on at that time.

[Boxman]

@slicey: The reasons I never took it off?

1. His "hammer only" policy seemed a very anti-town idea, and having no clue of Zwet's meta beyond a few games, it seemed like a good place to keep my vote.

2. On another site I play on, Bulletproof is a common scum claim. Having played no previous games here with Bulletproofs, I assumed the same. I probably would've unvoted if I had seen Starbuck's card post in time. Bah.

[Boxman]

Oh, you're right. I looked at the vote count and it has 10 names.

Mod: You've still got Percy in the vote count.

Thanks.

[Boxman]

....A miller claim?

Do you at least have a card name?

[Boxman]

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/ ... rseid=5106

That's Crovax the Cursed. Not sure if it really fits - but it exists at least.

Thoughts?

[Boxman]

^I doubt that it's that easy to find mafia. After all, the only CONFIRMED mafiat we've seen was Percy, who was Metallic Sliver, a brownish-gray card. I doubt card color is really an indicator here.

[Boxman]

^I doubt that it's that easy to find mafia. After all, the only CONFIRMED mafiat we've seen was Percy, who was Metallic Sliver, a brownish-gray card. I doubt card color is really an indicator here.

That's not brownish-gray, it's an Artifact card.

Ah. I don't play Magic, so I didn't know. Thanks for the clarification.

Now that all of this information has come to light, I'm fairly sure that whoot is scum. My vote stays.

[Boxman]

it specifys i am miller right after the information about my card. what reason would I have to claim miller if I wasnt? I believe that the scum in this game consist of slivers and there is a sliver overlord or queen as mufasa mentioned..

Miller is a fairly common scum fakeclaim, I believe. It's used mostly because a cop can't disprove it, I think.

Also, the sliver thing is a bit of a stretch. Just from reading up on the Weatherlight Saga, I'd think Volrath and his goons would be mafia, especially with the Metallic Sliver's flavor text.

[Boxman]

I agree with whoot's final statement - we should wait for FL's night to finish up before lynching.

And by "special" he means any other abilities you may have besides Miller.

[Boxman]

^No, we haven't. Every flipped creature so far has come from their respective blocks, or, in our case, the Weatherlight Saga, aside from perhaps Nicol Bolas, but his card was reprinted in Time Spiral, anyway.

[Boxman]

^On the lovers, Baru comes directly from Time Spiral, while Asuza is from Champions of Kamigawa.

[Boxman]

^Interesting. Sort of a weird card to make a VT, but whatever.

I'm more interesting in the fact that no one changed towns this time - so far, it looks like Tar's game has a switcher and a puller, we have a pusher, and FL's game has nothing for whatever reason, unless they didn't use their abilities last night.

Curiouser and curiouser...

[Boxman]

Yeah, I expect they just didn't use their abilities last night. That's the most logical explanation. Still, it's interesting, to say the least.

[Boxman]

We're waiting for anyone else to get here. They're all gone for some reason.

[Boxman]

The mod is probably going to count it anyway.

[Boxman]

Zakeri was already voting for you, for one.
Sudai was ready to vote you but didn't want another quicklynch.

Can't speak for Head_Honcho, who hasn't really said anything on the issue, or Shotty, who just replaced in.

[Boxman]

A Punisher is a role that punishes people for claiming, usually with a kill. For an example, see Tar's role in Mind Screw 3 or Nat's role in Mind Screw 2.

The second question depends on the mod or game in question. In Mind Screw 3, Tar had a miller who, I believe, knew that he was a miller. It might be different in this game, I don't know.

[Boxman]

Heh.

Anyway, I can't believe that he was really a miller. Bah. :/

[Boxman]

@qwints: I will be severely pissed if someone vigs me for that.

[Boxman]

Huh. Weird. Not even a transfer.

[Boxman]

I honestly can't figure out what's going on - we had 1 kill on night 1, along with a push. Tonight, we have no kills? I can only think this means that that team wanted to kill in Tar's or fl's game, but Tar's game had no kills either.

There could be any number of things going on. We probably won't know until more people die.

[Boxman]

Agreed.

Sudai, why didn't you do any analysis of Head_Honcho or Chenhsi in your post? Are you going to cover them later?

[Boxman]

Also, at qwints.

How do you KNOW I'm scum?

[Boxman]

Uh, wait, you had those 2 options, and you went for the less likely one? And likely just outed yourself to the mafia?

[Boxman]

@People in other games: Stop lynching so fast.

[Boxman]

Did Pyromaniac just daykill Mufasa in Tar's game?

[Boxman]

Oh, lol, never mind. He just admitted to not having daykill powers.

[Boxman]

Okay, we have to get some discussion going.

Okay, Head_Honcho. He's gone MIA since the 24th.

MOD: Can we get a prod/replace on Head_Honcho?

He has yet to be on either of the two lynching wagons, and actually seemed to suspect anyone who was. He's only given out two votes in the course of the game, both seemingly for few reasons.

I'm willing to

Vote: Head_Honcho

until I get a valid explanation.

Done

[Boxman]

@Sudai: I had thought that Zwet was getting scummier and was potentially ready to put my vote on, but noticed the vote count and saw my vote was already on it, so I left it there. That's all.

@Head_Honcho: I suppose I phrased that badly. I wanted to see if you would show back up or not. Now that you have, I'm willing to

unvote

. I've got my eye on you, though.

[Boxman]

@Shotty: Okay, what? Why on Earth did you just vote me? No reasons or anything?

[Boxman]

@Tar's Game: Qwints has role info that EITHER I am non-town OR I was not targeted for a kill night 1. Also, whoot was a miller - he can't know my alignment.

[Boxman]

This game is moving slowly. I think Honcho is the most suspicious at this point. Everyone else looks pretty town to me.

Vote: Head_Honcho

[Boxman]

Nothing has really arisen since my earlier vote - it's just that you look more suspicious than everyone else, who I have town vibes off of.

If you have another question I missed, quote it or something.

[Boxman]

Okay, here.

Honcho spent the first few days of the game making meaningless, useless posts (ISO 1, 2). In his next post, he decides immediately to start ignoring the other two games(ISO 3).

In ISO 9, he says that he didn't see anything particularly bad about Zwet and notes that he thinks Whoot is likely "noob scum." He also says he felt Zwet should have fakeclaimed. Possibly true, but still worth noting.

In his next couple of posts(ISO 11, 12, 13, 15), he tries to cast suspicion on Starbuck for not posting much on Day 1. As an afterthought(ISO 14, 16), he mentions qwints and whoot.

In the following posts(ISO 17, 18), he talks a little about whoot. In the next post(ISO 19), he immediately says whoot is a bad lynch for the day.

And in ISO 21, he says that whoot had no connections. He did. You tried to say that he was town immediately before his lynch, only because of a few comments from Percy.

In ISO 22, I honestly have no clue what Honcho is doing - dropping an attack because "no one called her on it?" He also attacks Slicey for "defending Starbuck based on meta?" And then votes him for possibly the weakest scumtell in the book, imo.

ISO 23 and 24 are weird, too. He comes out immediately with "I don't think there are any more traditional mafia in this game." Also, despite Percy being scum making him think that whoot was town(and correctly so), he says that the exact same thing should not apply to me. What? It almost sounds like he's trying to set up a later mislynch.

The rest of his posts are essentially just useless asking of Slicey questions.

Am I the only one who noticed, upon reread, that Honcho appears to be tunneling on Starbuck and Slicey? And that he "thought both of the two lynches were townies?"

There's my voting explanation(complete with ISO notation! ).

[Boxman]

It's probably because I accused him of tunneling last page, Starbuck.

Also,

Vote: Head_Honcho

.

And I'd like answers from qwints as well.

[Boxman]

Curiouser and curiouser.

You just made a prime target out of yourself... I'd like to know what's up with your game-swapping, investigative role, although I think I have a pretty good idea...

[Boxman]

Hey, guys, let's pick up the pace.

If you were waiting for FL's night to end, their game just ended. We could use some activity here.

[Boxman]

Prodded. I don't think Starbuck is a good lynch. Didn't Slicey say he semi-cleared her through meta?

[Boxman]

Uh, what? 2 Bulletproofs? Seriously?

Can we see a card, please?